Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Bracketology 2012: Duke Finally Steps Up To The No. 1 Line

Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight

Fight Matrix MMA Weekly 5 Oz. of Pain Irish Whip
Quinton Jackson Quinton Jackson Quinton Jackson Quinton Jackson
Chuck Liddell Mauricio Rua Lyoto Machida Dan Henderson
Ryoto Machida Dan Henderson Chuck Liddell Mauricio Rua
Keith Jardine Chuck Liddell Forrest Griffin Ryoto Machida
Dan Henderson Lyoto Machida Mauricio Rua Chuck Liddell
Forrest Griffin Keith Jardine Keith Jardine Forrest Griffin
Mauricio Rua Forrest Griffin Wanderlei Silva Wanderlei Silva
Sokoudjou Wanderlei Silva Sokoudjou Sokoudjou
Ricardo Arona Sokoudjou Vladimir Matyushenko Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
Wanderlei Silva Ricardo Arona
Thiago Silva Rashad Evans

Usually I include Sherdog in these little roundups but they haven't gotten their new rankings out and I just couldn't wait. Next time I think I'll drop MMA Weekly or Irish Whip and replace them with MMA HQ's fan selected picks.

That way I'll have one rankings system done by computer (FightMatrix), one by fan vote MMAHQ, and two by pundits (Sherdog and 5oz of Pain probably not Irish Whip or 411 Mania). I'm also toying with the idea of doing an aggregate of all the rankings but can't quite figure out how to do the points -- should I invert things and make a #1 ranking worth 10 points, #2 worth 9points and so on? Suggestions welcome. I may also include Luke's rankings that he gives to whatever web site that is (Luke help me out here), CBS Sports? Pro Elite?

Anyway it seems pretty clear that the once vaunted MMA Weekly rankings are pretty rank. Are they composed from deep within Takanori Gomi's jock or what? Inside the bowels of zombie PRIDE? What ever it is the fumes are distoring their thinking.

The big question here is who is #2, #3, #4 etc -- after the consensus #1 Rampage Jackson, there's a muddle. The Matrix, which is based on points awarded for past wins, think Liddell's win over Silva puts him right back near the top and everyone seems to agree that he's leapfrogged Keith Jardine.

Machida has definitely risen in the ranks after his impressive showing over Sokoudjou. Hard to argue with that. Also hard not to see Machida as the uncrowned #1 contender in the UFC right now. Of course poster-boy Forrest Griffin is the one getting the title shot -- sometime late this year. I predict Machida will have to work twice as hard as another English speaking fighter would have to to get a title shot.

Dan Henderson's on everyone's list except 5oz, but with his imminent move to claim the 185lb belt, I think he's a waste of space on these lists. Still a top light heavy but will be soon absent from these charts. 5oz is making the right call by dropping Dan.

As I wrote yesterday everyone ranks just one non-UFC fighter in their top 10, but there is no agreement on who that is. The Matrix and MMA Weekly go with Arona, Irish Whip goes with Little Nog and 5oz goes wild and drops Vladdy Matyushenko in the mix. An intriguing choice. Vladdy's been on a tear in the IFL and has always been a top fighter at 205.

5oz also ranks the fast rising Chute Boxe star Thiago Silva at #10 and the Whip has Rashad Evans.

Like I said yesterday this is just total domination of this division by the UFC.

Update [2008-1-4 11:23:49 by Kid Nate]: Dammit, MMA on Tap just posted their top 10s. Main notable news is they DROPPED Vladdy from their top 10. Are barely letting Machida squeak in at #7, and have Arona and Rashad Evans in the top 10. They still see Shogun at #2 and have Liddell and Wanderlei at #3 and #4.

I really need a way to aggregate the best 15 or so pundit rankings plus the computer rankings from Fight Matrix and the fan rankings from MMA HQ. What all blogs and sites should I include on my list?

Comment 11 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
Just for shits 'n giggles...I base my rankings on the resume approach.  Taking into account fighter's history but with more emphasis on the last 18 months than older history.  It helps the ratings be based more on the "here and now."  The following does not include Dan Henderson.  He is going to fight at 185...so I don't consider him a part of the LHW picture at the moment.

My Rankings at LHW

  1. Quinton Jackson - No need for explination here...pretty clear-cut.
  2. Lyoto Machida - Ended '07 with a win over a guy who was considered top 5 by most of the rankings I saw.
  3. Keith Jardine - I can't move Liddell above him considering it was fairly recent that Jardine just plain picked "The Iceman" apart.  Loss to Alexander was bad, but you can make a case for a guy getting caught by a late replacement that he could get practically no tape on.
  4. Chuck Liddell - I feel a little guilty putting Chuck so high considering the resume approach should reveal 2 losses recently followed by a win over a non-top 10 fighter.  But the two losses were to top 3 competition.  So here he sits.
  5. Forrest Griffin - Beating Shogun was huge, big enough to make up for the loss to Jardine.
  6. Mauricio Rua - Looked really bad against Griffin.  Griffin looked much bigger and was in much better shape.
  7. Sokoudjou - Two big wins in '07 followed by looking completely outclassed in his UFC debut.  Does not have much of a resume beyond his '07 results.  Hence sitting at #7.
  8. Thiago Silva - 12-0 and derailed the Houston Alexander train.  Arona is 1-3 in his last 4 and was pretty inactive other than losing to Soko in his last fight and "Lil Nog" was also inactive and got blasted by Soko.  So Silva gets a #8 vote from me.
  9. Vladimir Matyushenko - Vlady is a tough beat for anyone.  Seems like he barely broke a sweat en-route to winning the IFL Light Heavyweight title.
  10. Rashad Evans - Undefeated but flawed.  '08 is his chance to show where he belongs in the division.
Now for the "where is (insert name)"

-no Wanderlei.  Again, the resume based ranking comes into play...3 straight losses and only 1 win since 2005
-no Arona.  Has fought 2 times since '05.  1 win and 1 loss.  Going back a little further and you have 2 losses (albeit against high level fighters) to end '05.  He's on the cusp...but I'd need something recent.
-no "Lil Nog."  Pretty much take a look at Arona...inactivity + losing his only fight in the last year = missing the top 10.

by Brent Brookhouse on Jan 4, 2008 12:12 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
I find it interesting that MMAWeekly would rank Rua #2 when Forrest Griffin is ranked #7 who's on his way to a title fight with Rampage when TUF7 is done.

Did they miss the Griffin RNC on Rua?

Are you down with the sickness?

by MMA Fever on Jan 4, 2008 12:20 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
Oh and Nate...if you aren't exactly an Excel wiz I am.  So if you want to work with me on this we can create a formula to assign points based on ranking and then derive a total value/ranking for each fighter...I'm game

by Brent Brookhouse on Jan 4, 2008 12:21 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
MMA Weekly, Fight Matrix, 5Oz of Pain, Irish Whip, MMAHQ, Sherdog, Luke's Rankings (from whatever site), MMA on Tap...where else?

by Brent Brookhouse on Jan 4, 2008 1:16 PM EST up reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
I do rankings for HDNet, but I'd be happy to provide whatever I have.

by Luke Thomas on Jan 4, 2008 1:31 PM EST up reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
100% correct, dude. For what it's worth - I'd go with what you said in your post about the points vs. rankings. The formula is important but the data is vital.

by Ronnie Liddle on Jan 4, 2008 5:44 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
#1 Q Jackson
#2 C Liddell
#3 W Silva
#4 K Jardine
#5 F Griffin
#6 M Rua
#7 L Machida
#8 R Sokoudjou
#9 R Arona
#10 R Nogueira
#11 T Silva
#12 R Evans
#13 T Ortiz
#14 H Alexander

I think rankings should be fairly linear (Jardine beat Griffin so he ranks above him) but weighted in favor of more recent matches (Liddell lost to Jardine, but since then, he beat the #2 Silva).

Henderson is not listed because he is now a MW.

Wanderlei Silva is still #3 for me, because two of his losses are outside the division, and the third is to #2, Liddell. And those are 3 of the toughest opponents ever to fight. That's why you can lose to all three of them in a row and still be the #3 Light Heavyweight.

Arona and Nogueira present a dilemna because they haven't fought the UFC fighters. I keep them in place (for now) because their recent losses are to top 10 guys, and because I believe they are better than the likes of, say, Rashad Evans.

Machida is awesome but the only top 10 guy he's beaten is Sokoudjou, so he goes no higher than just above him. He must now fight someone higher ranked (I'm rooting for Liddell).

I'd like to see Jardine vs Thiago Silva for #1 contender.

Rua vs Evans makes sense. If Evans wins, the Rua myth is busted and Evans earns his place in the top 10. For Rua, it his opportunity to finally display his brutal style.

Silva vs Ortiz rematch would be huge. If Silva loses this one, he's out of my top 10.

Sokoudjou vs Alexander would be a blast.

by klown on Jan 4, 2008 9:14 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
I have always wondered one thing...

How would MMA rankings work with an ELO system?

ELO is used to rank chess players, and is a very good system for ranking anything when 1v1 matchups occur. MMA is just that.

I'm thinking about trying to program a web application to use an ELO system, computerized, and using ratings of the ELO system to see what kind of rankings would get cranked out.

by Leland Roling on Jan 4, 2008 10:35 PM EST reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
That's a VERY interesting approach. How is that different from Fight Matrix and Sherdog's old systems that assign points for wins and subtract for losses?

My chess rank never got much over 1300 so I'm not a master!

by Kid Nate on Jan 5, 2008 9:01 AM EST up reply actions  

Re: Fun with Rankings: Light Heavyweight
From what it looks like, FightMatrix may very well follow ELO guidelines. There are interesting mathmatical formulas that differ from a standard ELO system, and seem to be more accurate.

I'm definitely going to look into an ELO system though.

by Leland Roling on Jan 9, 2008 3:01 PM EST reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

"I don't want to knock my opponent out. I want to hit him, step away and watch him hurt" - Joe Frazier

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Small
Predicting A Collegiate Wrestler’s Development
Shogun_logo_small
UFC’s Hopes For A Stadium Show In Sao Paulo Appear To Be Dead
Small
The Downfall of Diego Sanchez
Small
The time is right for a superfight, and it doesn't involve Anderson
391807_10150399618817701_750257700_8470850_1424416169_n_small
1 in about 7 billion!  :D

Recent FanPosts

Small
Muay Thai camps in Thailand
Blav_small
OT: Help out my short film
Badr_hari3_small
War Machine explains what happenned and asks for support
Warrior_small
MMA Transaction Wire: February 4-10
Bv_small
BE Trivia Night

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

MMA Rankings

USA Today / SB Nation Consensus MMA Rankings