Point Fighting, Steroids, and Cheating the System
What do point fighting and steroids have in common? More than you might think. Call it a stretch of the imagination if you will, but I consider both to be a lowdown way to cheat the system and achieve victory through the sacrifice of integrity and the warrior spirit that this beautiful sport is meant to represent. I am tired of seeing the warrior mentality of many fighters be replaced by their desire to simply notch a W in the record books. I am tired of seeing athletes, not fighters, step into the cage. But most of all I am weary of fighters do anything but what they are supposed to do; fight.
On February 4th, I was ready. Ready for two of my favorite fighters of all time to step into the cage and prove to the GSP's, the Fitch's, the wrestlefukers, the point sparrer's (?) that you know what, it's damn well possible to throw down without sacrificing technique and skill. That you can get two high level Mixed Martial Artists capable of coming into the cage with their only intention being to finish the other man and if that wasn't possible, leave it all in the cage trying.
I told all my friends about this fight. I showed god knows how many highlight reels, slurred Diaz interviews, Condit death grimaces, and KO/sub finishes to anyone who would pay attention. I sold this fight like I was Dana Fucking White, because for once in quite some time I believed in what was to take place on this night. I am a broke ass college student, and I took $55 out of my grocery money to show this fight at my house (as well as another $30 in alcohol) to make this something special. I promised everyone that this would be the fight that made lifelong MMA fans out of all of them. It was gonna be fight of the year! I mean, what's the worst that could happen? In all honesty the only thing I was scared of was Diaz getting cut open by an elbow and having the fight stopped prematurely. What occurred instead made a small part of my die on the inside. I felt like Forrest Griffin after the Silva fight; unfairly beaten, abused, and never the same.
What I saw was not fighting. It was a gameplan designed to cheat the system. It was taking advantage of the loopholes in our imperfect MMA system that allow for fighters to finangle their way out of the true objective of the sport. Finish your oponent. If you can't do that, at least throw everything and the kitchen sink at him. To be fair, the gameplan in and of itself was not the problem. Stick to the outside, throw leg kicks, don't get caught against the cage, don't get sucked into the phone booth brawl that Diaz thrives in, all these are excellent ways to win a fight. But at NO POINT did it appear that Condit wanted to finish Diaz. And that is where I find fault in his fight. In my opinion? Greg Jackson told Condit hey, no one can finish this guy. So we're simply going to gameplan not to lose. The leg kicks were soft. The combos lacked any real ooomph if you will. And for nearly the entire fight, Condit walked or ran backwards. Cmon son.
In this way point fighting is much like steroids. They are easy to get away with, allow for a significant advantage over someone not up to the same shenanigans, and detract from the courage and testicular fortitude of everyone else. It takes away from hose who would rather accept the insanity and challenges that this sport presents them with with nothing but a never say die attitude and hard nosed approach towards training and fighting. It's cheating, but with an asterisk; just as most people don't suffer consequences for point fighting or fighting not to lose, neither do most fighters who use steroids. Sorry to burst your bubble, but easily 3 out of 4 proffesional Mixed Martial Artists are on some sort of performance enhancing drugs from my personal experience. I've trained at 3 or 4 gyms, and and while that number varies place to place, it is definitely in the majority at the professional level.
Maybe I'm an idealist. Maybe the sport will never reach a point where there are fighters who only make it because they work hard, have talent, and that edge to go into a fight and do the damn thing. Fighters like Fedor, Anderson Silva, Nick Diaz, Chuck Liddell, fighters that know that taking someone down and just controling them isn't fucking fighting. Go for a submission, an elbow like Tito Ortiz, donkey kong gnp like Munoz, something that isn't just stalling so you can win an eventual decision. This sport is about more than squeaking your way by until you get a shot at a belt, then holding onto it for dear life. This sport is about who is the pound for pound baddest man on the planet. And if you can't come out and do something every fight to prove your the bigger, badder dog on the block then get your ass back in the gym until you can.
Diaz should have fought better, he should have adjusted his gameplan accordingly to what Condit was trying to do. I understand not every fight will be fireworks. Some of the most brutal fights I've ever seen were battles of wills that barely involved blows. But this fight had no excuses. Both fighters had the chance to go toe to toe with submissions, strikes, grappling, and willpower that could have determined right then and there who the baddest 170lb fighter in the world was. And Condit backed down. It sounds cliche, but honestly we're not the ones who missed out last Saturday night. It was Carlos Condit. He had the chance to get taken to that dark place deep down every real fighter knows, the place where you get into such deep water you're not sure if you're going to drown. Where you truly have your back against the wall; the place where you get to see what you are really made of. But he would rather get a capital W on a piece of paper somewhere than test himself to the fullest extent humanly possible and a shot at everlasting glory.
Its a daunting task, one that 99.99% of the humans on this earth don't want any part of. But on the other hand, that's what makes Diaz so captivating. Because he's the .01% that will go to that hell anytime, anywhere. So to swagger jack Chael Sonnen, I think Nick Diaz is the true people's champion. And Condit...well Condit is still a hell of a fighter, and I hope he beats GSP. But he's no Michael Bisping. And he's no Natural Born Killer.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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I’m done with this Condit/Diaz shit if ypu can’t appreciate some fine gameplanning from the finest strategist in the sport and near flawless execution by one of the sport’s best fighters then I feel sorry for you. But I’m done with it and as far as I’m concerned on to Sanchez vs. Ellenberger.
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
by MattParker117 on Feb 7, 2012 7:19 PM EST reply actions 10 recs
MMA has grown up and evolved.
Sadly it’s fan-base hasn’t. To them there’s no footwork or head movement you just stand in front of each and swing until one of you go’s down.
War Toughman!!!
At predicting, he is at a K-1 level, Joe.....
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18th pick overall in season 2, those who overlooked me will be very very sorry....or maybe just Krcampbell will....
Yeah I get what you mean and wholeheartedly agree.
When one person’s goal is to actually fight, and the other guy’s goal is to just game the system, the latter will almost always win in MMA. Yeah if you have both guys in there gaming the system then it becomes some kind of meta chess match to see who can abuse the rules better, but that shit drives me nuts. I want to see these guys fight. If that puts me in the JUST BLEED crowd or the “sports entertainment, not real sport” crowd then fuck it; it is what it is.
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I've seen a lot of people complaining that the fight wasn't what they expected
but if you go into the fight fully expecting FOTY then of course your going to be disappointed. I think it’s this kind of thinking thats caused a backlash against Condits plan rather then the fight itself being bad. Don’t buy into the hype next time and you’ll probably enjoy it more.
If those leg kicks were soft
I don’t know what constitutes as hard.
Some guys have absolutely brutal leg kicks
but for the most part, Condit’s kicks were snapped pretty hard. The only person throwing soft kicks in that fight was Nick.
by majesticlamb on Feb 7, 2012 10:45 PM EST up reply actions
Carlos isn’t a real powerful kicker and never has been, at least that I can remember. Those kicks were as hard as I’ve ever seen him throw.
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by Patrick Wyman on Feb 7, 2012 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
You are out of your F****** Mind
The dude tagged Diaz on a number of occasions and threw switch kicks to the face that would have ass-planted any other human being on earth. And since Diaz had won 11 in a row by walking forward, pinning the person against the cage and going to work, it would make sense to formulate a gameplan that would allow one to roll of the cage and center themselves in the Octagon. That’s exactly what Condit did, and all this talk of him point fighting is fucking bullshit. The dude has a 93% finishing ratio so please don’t come here with that shitty argument. Everyone saying that has no clue what they are talking about. NONE
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by Sir Jacob of Ortingham on Feb 7, 2012 9:25 PM EST reply actions
Calm the fuck down
I agree that Condit was smart and had no choice but to circle away from the cage every chance he got, never letting Nick swarm on him against the fence. But turning your back to your opponent and literally running away 4or 5 times, taking hundreds of backward steps, and throwing only a few hard shots( and those flying knees and spinning backfists were HARD) per round, is point fighting.
I wouldnt blame him if he was a 130lb boxer about to fight a guy with an iron chin who is an entire weight class above him, yeah dance around him and throw jabs all night. But condit isnt a weak 130lb kid, is he? Nope, everybody watched the Primetime ,knew Condit’s finishing rate, and didnt get the war they expected.So a lot of people are disappointed and no longer interested in gsp vs condit. Whats so hard to understand about that?
Wow.....just......wow....
The way people have been dealing with the disappointment of this fight has completely blown my mind. I have absolutely no problem with people who expected more action or thought that Diaz won but equating what Condit did to steroids?
If Derek Jeter clubbed a baby seal on earth day while wearing a mink coat and crocodile skin boots while burning tires on an iceberg, the reaction would be "Its OK Derek, you’re a Yankee." -First mammal to wear pants
i knew that would get misconstrued
fighters that consistently point fight are comparable to steroid users because they are trying to game the system. condits track record is the farthest thing from that, which is why it was so dissapointing he backed down from a challenge like this given the fact i thought he had the best chance to finish diaz out of anyone whos ever fought him.
he did what he thought he had to do to win. and i cant fault him for that. but to say this fight was a severe disappointment given the potential both fighters is an understatement. condit had the chance to make history and go down as a legend and a badass. No one will remember this victory. there he was saying its gonna be a dogfight and building the fight up, only to mislead the fans who believed he would be true to his word and try and take out arguably the toughest fighter alive. he did the opposite. he tried to win a decision. that is all. slapping leg kicks and high kicks arent going to do jack shit against any top level fighter. never once did he remotely rock diaz, something most of diaz’s oppenent do (a fact many people are forgetting). aka point fighting.
just a dissapointment, in no way am i writing condit off i hope the killer instinct comes back to whoop gsp’s ass
Nope, everyone correctly spotted you for the simpleton you are (not unlike Nick Diaz).
Apart from the staggering stupidity of the argument – the most obvious holes being, steroids are illegal, hidden and done in secret and their discovery would lead to a suspension; intelligent fighters expect and prepare for a gameplan (point fighting or otherwise) and not just “stand and bang” or some shit; No fighter expects steroid usage from the opponent or prepares for it etc etc. But all this is pointless because your entire post is so laughable (the precise reason why BE needs a “derec” button). Simpletons like you cannot appreciate fight strategy, you need to be watching stupid streetfights where Real Men stand and bang and beat the shit out of each other. MMA is really not your thing so please go away and rid us of your stupidity.
Yeaaaa looking back on my article it could have been put together quite alot better
but i was drunk and disappointed with the fight so it came out a little harsh. i figured id let all the haters say their piece and put this in the rear view mirror. However, you sir, are starting to piss me off.
1. yes, steroids are illegal. yes, you will get punished if you get caught. and yes, a majority of professional mixed martial artists are on steroids and get away with it because of the extremely lax detection and testing methods implemented at the professional and amateur level. hence the comparison to how they are gaming a system that does not properly address these issues, much as the mma judging criteria does not often times properly score bouts. and pretty much all fighters know about the prevalence of performance enhancing drugs in the sport, so I’m assuming you are not involved in any sort of professional or amateur level.
2. I already said carlos had a good game plan. but the way he implemented it was weak. there was an excellent article posted recently on angles at fightsgoneby.blogspot that pointed out the exact strategy carlos should have finished up with. instead of throwing a rabbit punch or leg kick while leaning backwards then running away, he should have ducked away from cage, gotten an angle on diaz, landed a HARD shot or two, then moved out of range, and been willing to get hit once or twice so he in return could actually do some significant damage.
3. call it a personal preference, label me a “just bleed” fan, whatever, but dont tell me condit was trying to finish nick diaz. and that is my main issue with point fighting. a good gameplan should involve breaking down the other fighters weaknesses so you are in a better position to finish him. not simply trying to survive long enough to win a decision. example? jose aldo vs urijah faber. beautiful technique and gameplaning meant to take apart fabers tools to make him easier to finish. while jose couldn’t put him away, he made damn sure he at least tried.
4. mma is indeed my thing. ive trained jiu jitsu under tom cissero in san jose for 3 years. Im a walking MMA encyclopedia thanks to years of lurking and posting on message boards like this one. Ive sacrificed my own money and time to buy PPVs and try and get others interested in this sport. Im good friends with many amateur fighters and started training MMA a few months ago myself. I started the BJJ club at Chico State entirely by myself. Im sure I’ve done more for this sport than you ever have. If you can’t appreciate the necessity of brutality this sport needs to a certain level, then you should go watch football or something, you can have all the tactics you want there.
you don’t like my post? fine. critique all you want. but for the first post you have ever had on your account don’t come on and start calling people simpleton’s…

I'm sure Condit would rather be remembered as a champion, than a badass.
Ahoy-hoy.
Last round pick of the Filipino Reccing Machines
by Sugel Mendoza on Feb 8, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
It's ridiculous.
It’s a vile stupid comparison and frankly the author should take in writing something so fucking stupid. How is the system flawed when Condit out-landed Diaz? This entire piece reeked of the stench of unrealistic expectations and fanboyism.
I'm tired of Diaz's point fighting
He couldn’t finish and undersized Penn…just winging punches – was on the ground but didn’t finish it there either . During the Condit fight – was only content on hitting and chasing didn’t utilize any means of finishig Condit via his blackbelt BJJ and in fact only used a take down in the LAST round in the last minute to get some points to seal the round.
Diaz is safe fighting.
Sorry for the sarcasm.
by friendlyfoe on Feb 7, 2012 10:11 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

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