UFC 143 Results: Dana White Is Right, A Nick Diaz Vs. Carlos Condit Rematch Is The Way To Go
by Nate Wilcox on Feb 6, 2012 11:12 AM EST
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There have been a lot of complaints about Carlos Condit's unanimous decision victory over Nick Diaz at UFC 143's interim welterweight title fight on Saturday. Most notably, Nick Diaz vowed to retire from MMA after the decision was read. Diaz, and many fans, were frustrated with Condit's counter-strike and circle away strategy, but Diaz had no answer for it inside the cage.
UFC president Dana White expressed his hope for a rematch between the two fighters as the best solution:
"I know (Georges. St. Pierre) wanted that Diaz fight bad, but it's not going to be Diaz so he better get angry with Carlos Condit or focus on Carlos Condit or whatever he needs to do. Carlos Condit won this fight. No matter how much Georges and Nick hate each other, Carlos Condit won, and I think the fans are mad at the way Carlos Condit fought. Too f*cking bad. He came in with a game plan and stuck to it and won. You know what's funny man, is that when he said that, I was thinking the same thing. It's crazy, but. I was thinking it after the fight. You know, people are bitching and thinking it was close or whatever, we can do that fight again before GSP comes back. It depends on Carlos too, he's really gotta say, and Nick's gotta say I want to fight him again too."
If White can persuade the volatile Diaz to reconsider retirement, this is the way to go for three reasons:
- It will give Diaz a chance to adjust to Condit's tactics. A truly great fighter would have been able to respond in-cage but I'd like to see what Diaz and his team come up with given a few months to prepare. Diaz' entire flat-footed arm-punching style is a response to his frustration with the way MMA fights are judged on the ground and his serial losses to better wrestlers in the UFC. I look forward to seeing if he can adapt to Condit's game plan and if so, how.
- It will give prevent the division from being entirely on hold while champion GSP recovers from ACL surgery. Sure it means a log jam at the top of the division, but that's fine as the new wave of contenders (Johny Hendricks, Jake Ellenberger, Rory MacDonald, etc) need time to sort themselves out and build up their names with fans.
- It will ease the pressure on GSP to return from surgery prematurely. He'll already be coming back in a title fight after an 18 month layoff and major surgery, the pressure to get back into the Octagon early makes a bad situation worse.
Hopefully Diaz' coach Cesar Gracie can talk him back into the cage for one more go at Condit. What do you think?
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If Carlos doesn't want to engage
I see no reason. We want to see Diaz in a fight, not whatever the hell Saturday was.
by cbrody111 on Feb 6, 2012 11:04 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
if Diaz
had adjusted to Condit spinning out to his right after oh, the 40th time he did it, he could have forced Condit to engage. A lateral step to the right and jab might have worked, maybe a trip leg kick or how about a double leg. I guarantee you if Condit tried the same move for 5 rounds on GSP that GSP would have attempted a variety of counters.
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by Nate Wilcox on Feb 6, 2012 11:09 AM EST up reply actions 19 recs
Diaz failing to adjust to Condits movement
Was one of the most disappointing things to see. If he can’t get people against the cage he’s a lot less effective, and it was clear from the first round how Condit intended to escape that position. I’d have expected Diaz’s corner to also help his counter this.
by YPG on Feb 6, 2012 11:14 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
I’d have expected Diaz’s corner to also help his counter this.
Instead we get “You’re up 3-1. Keep it up”. His brother/cornermen should be getting a lot more credit for the loss than they have thus far.
by BKdroid on Feb 6, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
It's not wonder Diaz get's so high strung
when he’s surrounded by Yes Men prepared to validate his paranoia.
This
I remember thinking “really?” when I heard someone in Diaz corner saying that.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
Cesar Gracie camp seems to truly believe that walking forward alone will win you a fight.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
They may have said that but..
They also told Nick that he had to cut Carlos off when he tried to circle away. Nick didn’t do that.
Why is this such a big deal?
I thought he was up 3-1 as well.
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
Did you lose a Sig bet?
Or are you for real? You’re entitled to your opinion, just like I am. In my opinion that’s crazy talk if you were watching the same fight I was.
by BKdroid on Feb 6, 2012 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Diaz won 49-46 on my scorecard
Which is why when Buffer said 49-46 I was surprised because I figured the judges would have it more like 48-47 Diaz given their general incompetence.
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
This part makes sense
I figured the judges would have it more like 48-47 Diaz given their general incompetence.
But I somehow doubt that’s what you meant.
I had it 49-46 Diaz as well
And thought his corner had it exactly right and I had picked Condit. Everyone at our viewing party was pretty shocked by the decision. Partly because what Condit was doing effectively is usually not seen by the judges.
Look at Condits face as the decision is being read announced by Buffer. He thought he lost too and thought the 49-46 scores were a clear indication of it.
We were not alone in thinking Diaz won.
Not to mention
That Diaz looked completely dominant on the ground. If he’d taken it down a minute and a half earlier he’d have sunk that choke for sure, he had back control and a lock and is a seriously good BJJ player. I even feel that if he had displayed more urgency he could have had it in the time he had. The fact is, Diaz got caught being a point fighter in that one.
I thought Lay N Pray was a stupid insult until I watched Tyrone Woodly fight.
Can’t say he would’ve “sunk that choke for sure” if he tried earlier because Condit wasn’t saved by the bell, if you remember. Condit escaped and reversed the position.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 11:35 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Condit was defending well
but he didn’t escape from Nick’s body triangle back control. He escaped the hail mary armbar attempt.
Don't make bets with Subo. He doesn't honor his agreements.
If actually wanted to get this fight to the ground, he could have, as evidenced by the 5th round. Diaz’s wrestling is bad, but so is Condit’s.
Diaz’s wrestling becomes an issue when discussing his TD defense, or lack thereof. Half the WW division will eat him alive when they get the chance to unless he’s made some significant strides there, or unless he can get to working off of his back hardcore
This.
If you want to batter a guy in close quarters you better have a way to force him there. Diaz was chasing instead of cutting Condit off for the whole fight, his footwork looked bad. And don’t argue that you can’t cut a guy off because it’s in a cage and not a ring, it’s just not true.
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Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
To be fair
It’s really hard to cut a guy off in that giant octagon, especially a guy of condits level. It’s basically just a big open space. Nick would be so much better suited in a ring, I think he’d definately stop gsp if they fought in a ring. We’ve seen strikers not transition well from a ring to the cage and its because of the inability to really corner someone In the octagon. Cro cop comes to mind that was such a huge part of his game.
by bert44 on Feb 6, 2012 1:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
“he’d definately stop gsp if they fought in a ring. " ?!!?!?!
C’mon Maaaaaan……did you just say that with a straight face?
by Snake_Pliskan on Feb 6, 2012 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
I agree that it's much easier to do in a ring.
But it’s definitely possible in a cage. Condit always escaped to Nick’s right and Nick never adjusted and closed that for him.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
In fairness...
while I totally agree that Nick Diaz looked sadly one-dimensional in the later rounds, though arguably would have gone after the takedown with more touch intensity if he thought he was behind, at several points in the fight while Nick was trying to do exactly that, Condit turned and jogged.
That’s not to say that Nick shouldn’t have switched it up and tried to work his footwork more, or even punished the escape with a leg jab, but at that point you have to run after someone to engage…
I'll have to rewatch the fight again to make sure.
But I can’t remember an instance in which he did. He was always chasing and coming at Carlos in a straight line. The points at which Carlos escaped from the fence, he had the space to do it because Nick was coming straight at him leaving the opening on his right.
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
I'm glad that you're back at BE.
There’s just the right amount of provocation in your blogs, not an over-the-top Snowdening.
I totally agree with that assessment. This is very similar to the “laynpray” critique that a lot of ground fighters unfairly (and sometimes fairly) receive. Ultimately the fighters desired the fight to take place in different locations with different spacing. One of the fighters was able to control that spacing, and he won (rather emphatically in my opinion) because of that. My question to you is this. Why do you believe Nick should be given a second chance after refusing to adjust over a five round fight? Welter Weight is an incredibly stacked division. If GSP isn’t ready, Condit stated he was willing to defend his interim title. Let’s move on.
Get off it man.
Condit did engage. Just on his own terms instead of letting Diaz do whatever he wanted. When Diaz wasn’t trying to walk his back into the cage, Carlos got off some slick combos with hard shots. When he was getting backed up, he popped a couple of shots and took an angle.
Slick combos? He missed so many shots, looked scared and dull. Google “Taylor vs Hopkins”. Condit had a game plan all right. Bore the audience into submission! His gameplan made my wine taste sour, and my eyes grow heavy. He turned his back and RAN on four different occasions! Like Stacey King says: ‘…if you’re scared, buy a dog!’ Nick got caught planning for a fight in a phonebooth and ended up in a warehouse. No rematch, thank you. Let “Conjob” er…Condit wait and spare us his “gameplan” until GSP comes back. Condit lost me as a fan, with that boring crap. Leg kicks that had no effect whatsoever, that’s how he outstruck Diaz. Condit doesn’t deserve my PPV dollars, until GSP ends this interim garbage once and for all. As for Diaz, homey, I love ya, but you gotta go down the ladder. Earn that shot, do the work, and come back a little more prepared. No rematch until after GSP wins and Condit doesn’t have so many reasons to fight with that, erm, “strategy” again.
"Real life is faker than wrestling..." Mick Foley
by Mr. Socko on Feb 6, 2012 11:50 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 10 recs
...
go away.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Really? That’s the sum total of your thoughts? Is that you repeating the most uttered phrase in your life? Go away? Really? I will pass on that, but thanks for the suggestion! Have A Nice Day!
"Real life is faker than wrestling..." Mick Foley
by Mr. Socko on Feb 6, 2012 2:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You're right.
Slap yoself.
Ahoy-hoy.
Last round pick of the Filipino Reccing Machines
by Sugel Mendoza on Feb 6, 2012 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
...
go away, like really fast.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
Wow, here’s a suggestion for you: add something, because if you don’t, you are only taking away from the conversation. Don’t bother commenting to me, because you aren’t clever, you aren’t funny, and frankly, son, I’m not going anywhere. So have fun, work on those comments, and then come on back! I’m looking forward to it.
"Real life is faker than wrestling..." Mick Foley
by Mr. Socko on Feb 6, 2012 4:45 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
If all it takes
is one fight not going according to your expectations to turn you off a fighter, good luck enjoying any fight or fighter ever.
...he also sends me messages saying "Prepare your soul, only god and jiu jitsu can save you and god isn’t listening". -Patrick Tenney
by GreyedOut on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
No, I have been watching Condit for a while now. It turns me off to him because he is only going to have these big fights for a while. Watching him up to this point has been a blast, with big action, great fights, even in defeat (see Kampmann fight) and expectations being met when I heard his name on a card. What are my expectations now? They have taken a huge hit. I am not a ‘just bleed’ guy, and have been watching fights darn near all my life, whether it was boxing, kickboxing, or the first UFC on VHS back in the day. Anyone who says they expected this kind of performance from Condit is full of the old dog doo. Everyone expected a war, and got, well, that spectacle we saw Saturday. It wasn’t impressive, on either fighters part, and neither one of them has a prayer against GSP. I LIKE both fighters, and they both made me feel a bit cheated as a fan. I understand all the talk of strategy, and Diaz not being able to adapt before it was too late. That being said, it doesn’t take away from disappointment in the fight, and my now complete lack of faith in both fighters to ever be the undisputed WW Champion.
"Real life is faker than wrestling..." Mick Foley
by Mr. Socko on Feb 6, 2012 1:55 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
I always wanted one of those. They had a much better picture than VHS…c’est la vie…
"Real life is faker than wrestling..." Mick Foley
by Mr. Socko on Feb 6, 2012 3:53 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
my thoughts exactly
condit came in a different fighter. i am a fan of both fighters but condit came to this fight in a form that no one’s seen from him before. yeah, it’s probably the higher percentage strategy but its like how gsp changed after the serra ko. which version is the more exciting fighter?
the fight was so highly anticipated BECAUSE of the type of fighters both guys are known to be. thus, it was a disappointing fight. the point is pretty simple and plain to see but so many people on be get so mad when you say that. condit brought a winning yet boring gameplan. why is that so offensive?
it’s not like condit was countering and defending in a masterful way, which would have been much more entertaining and compelling to see, a la floyd mayweather or even a good machida matchup.
by Elron Hubburd on Feb 8, 2012 5:20 AM EST up reply actions
Why would Diaz train for a fight in a phone booth? Its clearly in a cage. Those Diaz boys are CRAZY.
Like my post? Well, follow me on Twitter anyways. @LenBarson
by LenBarson on Feb 6, 2012 12:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Shut the fuck up.
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Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:10 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I'll leave this here for your review, then.
Obviously, I’ve chosen three examples that support my opinion. But it’s pretty obvious that it wasn’t all scare, dull, and missed shots.
by BKdroid on Feb 6, 2012 12:30 PM EST up reply actions 9 recs
Those bottom two gifs/combos are gorgeous, is there any other fighter who employs a similar combo? I know Aldo does a sick hook to low kick combo and Alves is similar, but I don’t recall ever seeing a hook, low kick, high kick combo executed so well.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 12:33 PM EST up reply actions
Dude’s got sick Muay Thai, doesn’t get enough credit for it
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
I just wish I could find a gif of the flying double knee that came about 2 inches from planting itself in Diaz’s grill. I’d propose that it’s actually Diaz that made the fight boring for the same reason he usually makes fights exciting. He stalked forward slowly and tried to use the cage like a toady holding some poor shmuck in place while Mr. Diaz mollywhops him. Instead of changing things up and closing the distance faster or, God-forbid, adjusting when Condit slid to the side every time space ran out; He just kept slowly walking toward Condit seemingly confused as to why this guy isn’t letting Nick punch him repeatedly.
by BKdroid on Feb 6, 2012 12:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Cerrone
The shot he KOed Siver with was also quite marvelous.
"A belt only covers two inches of your ****and the rest you need to back up on your own." Royce Gracie (allegedly...I just read it somewhere and thought it was cool for my sig!)
by KGNLuc on Feb 6, 2012 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
what those gifs also tell you
Condit had no power in his shots, I mean he kicked Diaz in the face twice, which barely made Diaz head snape back, he was definitly out to win a point battle and not to finish. Nothing wrong with that though, you gotta do what you gotta do
No Power.
Tell that to Hardy and the other 12 people he has laid out.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
Thats almost exactly what you said
what, did you mean by “no power in his shots”, that he doesnt mix his alcoholic drinks very well?
"Your spelling and grammar errors belie a seriously skilled thought process"- therealCatnuts
by justsomehawkeyefan on Feb 6, 2012 1:32 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
he said "Condit had no power in his shots"
not “Condit has no power”.
which I agree with. Condit did not throw like he did in the Hardy fight. I don’t think he threw any full power shots
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend. Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig.
Ok, next time I assume I am talking to 4 year olds
and spell everything out: Condit is not the most powerful guy but he has decent power if he wants to. In his fight with Diaz he was neglecting that power for a stick and move strategy, which is cool, sometimes you have to fight more with your smarts
He hit Diaz pretty hard a few times.
Nick just walked through it like he always does.
The kick that actually landed clean
came at the end of a combo where I don’t think 100% power was really there. It also hit with the foot and not the shin.
by deathbydegrees20 on Feb 6, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
Hitting with your foot can hurt just as much as shin… Ask the dude Stephen Thompson KO’d saturday night.
Yeah, kicking successively on opposite sides will take a bit of power away.
It doesn’t matter that the kick didn’t KO Diaz, it hit him and i’m pretty god damn sure it didn’t feel good.
There's no moral order at all. There's just this: can my violence conquer yours?
by ElliotMatheny on Feb 6, 2012 4:31 PM EST up reply actions
Who the fuck is rec'n this shit!?
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
Ah shit, you're from Mania?
That explains everything…
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 7, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
It's not Carlo's job to stay in front of Nick to get punched in the face
He’s allowed to move out of the way, and it doesn’t have to be forward.
"Complacency is your demise." - Kerry King
Proud member of Trainyard Sleepers, BECW: S2
We're gonna win, you know. Stats lie.
Not engage?
Condit outstruck him. He imposed his gameplan, Diaz couldn’t and didn’t adjust.
"Nothing's ever what it seems. And even if it is, ends justify means." -Matt Good
by KingBrody on Feb 6, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
When you can't get a man to fight back after slapping him in the face, what do you expect?
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
How about learning some footwork and getting the guy where you want him to be?
Also this whole Condit wasn’t fighting BS is getting old. And your sig doesn’t really help me to take you seriously.
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
What do I expect? I would expect the guy to have the fight IQ to adjust. He didn’t. So he lost. End of story. Get over it.
Well it certainly wasn’t based on landing more strikes (or even more significant strikes per FightMetric). It wasn’t based on imposing his will… so…
Maybe on him walking forward?
Btw, if you scored round 3 or 4 for Diaz, congratulations, even the most inane Diaz nuthuggers would disown you for that one.
Rounds 1 and 2 were clearly Nicks
The third could have gone either way. The fourth was Condit’s. The fifth was a tossup until back control by Diaz.
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
by unambig on Feb 6, 2012 4:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The fifth was easily Condit until the back control potentially made the round a draw. There’s no way that back control wins you the round when Condit is clearly winning the exchanges for the first four minutes.
And then God created Saturn ... and he liked it, so he put a ring on it. ... Always a ninja
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The third could not have gone either way. Round 1 was clearly Nick’s. Round 2 could have gone either way, as could round 5.
I don’t see a way round 3 could have been scored for Diaz. At all.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 7, 2012 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
You need an emergency visit to the proctologist...
by I_Mad on Feb 6, 2012 11:15 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 4 recs
He was scared homie...
I don’t see Carlos coming to fight next time…he used to be one of my fav fighters…thank you jackson’s/tri star for ruining Torres and Carlos…
Wow, FUCKING WOW!
Are you serious!? Condit has finished all but 2 fights in his entire career. Everyone thinks "Oh Carlos is a little bitch for not playing right into Nick’s hands and should have just stood in front of him and traded. That is how every other fighter like BJ and Daley lost to him. They keep moving forward and got pushed back into the cage and then were smothered. Carlos and Greg realizing this came up with a gameplan for Carlos to engage on his own term’s not get into a brawl with him. Engage back pedal and side step, that kept the fight in the middle of the ring instead along the edge as to where Diaz is his best. If you are going to just say the Greg ruined Carlos because your boy Diaz failed to change his style up after getting countered for like the 50th time then that’s on him. Calling him scared is plain ignorant on your part.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
by RJshock 305 on Feb 6, 2012 11:42 AM EST up reply actions 8 recs
anyone with a brain would not lose to Diaz
taunting someone? that’s like the standing equivalent of a buttscoot! ‘come into my guard, bro!’
by Rucker on Feb 6, 2012 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
And people gave all kind of shit to Werdum for begging Alistair to follow him to the ground...
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
cbrody111,welcome to mma! Let give you a quick intro-you try to hit the other guy more than he hits you. So when he moves towards you, you punch/kick/knee/elbow/spinning back fist him, then move so that he doesn’t do that to you.
Enjoy the sport!
The sport I fell in love with was two people fighting each other. Not people trying to win the judges’ favor. Diaz hasn’t embraced the “brilliance” of point fighting, and that’s why I’m his fan.
You’re right that this is the sport of MMA now, and it’s a bit disheartening. Thankfully there’s always the undercards where people are more likely to fight instead of play a sport match.
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 12:23 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I hate to break it to you
Throwing a million half-power punches/slaps so you can win rounds is point fighting too.
So going for the finish just means throwing haymakers and power shots?
That’s one of the more ridiculous statements I read today. Diaz is always going for the finish if you debate that I can’t help you, dude
But...
Why would you go for the finish in a 5-round fight against a guy who notoriously CAN’T be finished if you want to win said fight? Wouldn’t you say that would be poor fight IQ?
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yep
then you’d fuck around and possibly gas yourself and end up like Miller against Bendo.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
Or you end up like Werdum
Whoopin said guys ass and looking great while doing it. It’s not like “unfinishable” opponents can only be overcome in an unimpressive fashion.
"A belt only covers two inches of your ****and the rest you need to back up on your own." Royce Gracie (allegedly...I just read it somewhere and thought it was cool for my sig!)
I have no problem with the way Condit fought
It was smart on his part, what bugs me more, was the theatrix before the fight: I am going to stand and bang, it’s gonna be a dog fight and shit like that. The worst part, the reality tv bullshit in the last part of primetime, where Jackson and Condit stood in front of the camera as if it wasn’t there and talked about how Condit has to go for the KO in every round. I hate shit like that
Thank god Hendricks ignored your sentiments
by Hutchy on Feb 6, 2012 1:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah that was a shock and a half.
But kinda sounds like you’re more pissed at MMA than you are at Condit (or Cruz, or Bisping, or whatever fighter you mentioned today). In MMA, there are rules. Points are scored during the duration of the bout in the even that it goes to decision. As a result, you can win on a fight on points if no one gets finished. So, many times, a proper gameplan is to take that into account. Go ahead, keep crucifying fighters for doing so.
Condit was trying to finish that fight more than NIck was...
It’s not his fault those head kicks he landed didn’t knock Nick out.
Condit untypically was fighting like Dominik Cruz and Bisping
Always in motion, not sitting down and loading up on strikes, that’s why his strikes were not as hard as normally. His primary goal was to win by points and not to finish
by feiwongfu on Feb 6, 2012 1:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
How do you know they weren't as hard as normal?
Diaz ain’t exactly an easy guy to KO.
Diaz didn’t finish BJ. Does that mean he was throwing less than 100% punches (he was) and not trying for a finish? If you cannot finish a fight, can’t you score points by sheer volume of strikes? Diaz is just as much a gamer as anyone else. He’s just been fighting people that can be put away.
Do you think they were hard?
They looked a lot weaker than normal. BJ Penn landed less strikes than Condit and is a lot smaller, yet Diaz’ face looked worse after the encounter with BJ than with Condit
Condit's head snapped back a dozen times in the first three rounds
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
I love how the guy who threw
flying knees, spinging backfists, keadkick combos and a lot of power combos is reduced to “point fighting” Like it was a jab and run strategy.
So much butthurt that he didn’t stand infront of Diaz and let himself get cornered. Its BS excuses.
by Bombadilillo on Feb 6, 2012 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yeah but the fancy shit barely landed
he got Diaz with the basics, leg kicks, body punches, jabs, the fancy stuff almost looked like he did it to distract Nick.
by feiwongfu on Feb 6, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
But he didn't STANDANDBANG!!!!!
"Complacency is your demise." - Kerry King
Proud member of Trainyard Sleepers, BECW: S2
We're gonna win, you know. Stats lie.
by duck on Feb 6, 2012 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
STANDANDBANGBROCKLESNARAWEROWRFJS:EIUPSIEOU!!!
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
This is a tough call
Part of me doesn’t want to see a rematch because it just seems like a crying sore loser get his chance to redeem himself without earning it but another part thinks it would be a lot more exciting the second time around and since GSP isn’t ready why the hell not?
Quite frankly, I’d rather see Carlos fight Ellenberger a second time than Diaz just for the fact that Diaz already whined an psychoed himself into getting what he wanted once. He should go fight a wrestler. Dana needs to make him play the game like everyone else. Of course that means he may not want to fight at all. That’s what you get when you have an employee who thinks it’s okay to act like a 5-year-old.
Waterboy at Brock Lesnar's Cruelty-Free Pest Control.
by dribblebib on Feb 6, 2012 12:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
What are you talking about? He wanted a fight with St.Pierre, and he fought Penn and Condit.
by sheikybaby on Feb 6, 2012 12:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
But still
The Diaz brothers are the biggest cry babies in all of mma. A decision loss is still a loss.
Ignoring all your losses, wont make you a better fighter, and that is why the Diaz brother wont ever be champions.
sounds like a little kid:
‘that play didnt go my way, i want a do-over-waaaaaaaaaah!’
im all for condit fighting again, it would be bold but make him money and keep him sharp. its just that, um, like, you know, uh, nick uh, lost. you know?
BECW S2: BUS FEEDERS PICK#73
I disagree, I don’t think Diaz deserves a rematch for the fact that he acted like such a whiny cry baby about it afterwards. If he had said something along the lines of “I lost, but it was close and a rematch would clear up any doubt” then fair enough. But the way he acted, he shouldn’t get a rematch because he should be made to accept defeat like a professional and not throw his toys out of his pram and throw a hissy fit, then get rewarded for it afterwards
Proud veteran of the elite unstoppable predictions juggernaut known as the K1 Level Predictions Team (2011-2011)
by StevenGiles on Feb 6, 2012 11:09 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Diaz's attitude after the fight could help the promotion of a rematch. Along with so
many fighters and fans saying “Diaz won”.
by Scribonius Curio on Feb 6, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Diaz's attitude may be lousy, but he has an argument.
I scored the fight for Diaz, as did many, many others. I think that dislike of Diaz, irrational hatred of Condit’s strategy (he did not run, like, at all) and this weird extreme polarization of the different camp’s perspectives on the internet are clouding the issue for everybody. Even if the actual result was no robbery, which it wasn’t, it was still close enough a rematch wouldn’t be unmerited.
by PlutoCps on Feb 6, 2012 11:20 AM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Well...
(he did not run, like, at all)
Except for the 6 (possibly 7) times Carlos literally turned his back on Diaz and ran away?
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 11:34 AM EST up reply actions 9 recs
guh
So Condit is now faulted for being backed against the cage, striking, ducking out of the way and taking the center of the octagon again so that he doesn’t play into Diaz’s hands.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
No
I’m saying that he ran. Like literally ran. Denying it is bull pucky.
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
this is hilarious
Because a fighter doesn’t want to be backed into the cage, he’s running?
That’s bull plop.
by Body Triangle on Feb 6, 2012 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
No
A fighter that turns his back and literally runs is uh… running.
I’m in no way comparing Condit to Starns, but saying Carlos didn’t run is disingenuous.
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
The fastest way to get back to the center of the cage is to run. Who cares if he was running or walking quickly? He wasn’t running away from Diaz, he was running to the center of the cage to reestablish his position.
Sure thing dude
Say it enough times and maybe it’ll be true.
Carlos had a smart plan (possibly his only plan). He used it and won a match because he knew he couldn’t win a fight. That plan included getting off the cage at all costs, including running. My issue isn’t that he ran, my issue is with people denying that he actually did run several times during the fight.
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
He ran, but he didn’t run away from Diaz… he ran away from the fence. Slight but important difference.
by Shnak on Feb 6, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Exactly, because the fence was going to punch him in the face and body.
by Tacoknight on Feb 6, 2012 12:09 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
No, but Diaz’s game is that he pushes people against a cage and punches them.
So, let me ask you something. If Carlos wants to win a fight with Diaz, and is constantly pushed against the cage, what should he do?
A. Put back on fence and get into wild fire fight, exposing himself to Diaz’s entire standing game.
B. Move off cage and take center of octogon.
All recent opponents of Diaz have taken the A route. All have got lit up in a volume striking game against the cage.
Common sense is going to tell you to take the B route and circle off the cage.
When you go into a fight, do you do whatever you can to make sure you fight your opponents fight? Give me a break
Sheeeeeeeee-it
by Clay Davis on Feb 6, 2012 1:14 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Yes he is a great track star!
What distance does he run again?
that's such a sophmoric analysis
Your issue is that Carlos outworked diaz and the whole fucking fight and you can’t acknowledge it because you disapporove of the speed at which Carlos moved back to the center.
I'm straight. That means I like women.
Trainyard Sleepers: Our Foot Your Ass
I'm not afraid of you, internet.
Just try to learn from Rafa. He is the one from whom you should seek guidance.
by Hardy's in your face on Feb 6, 2012 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
Ok I mixed your remark up with the general public’s definition of “running” as “refusal to engage.”
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
Matt 36 comments in 18 months, almost all of them over the last 2 days Diaz hating, suggest you have a hidden agenda homey.
Right.
You must have read them so carefully. And managed to miss that I’ve pointed out that I was rooting for Diaz because Diaz vs GSP is a more compelling matchup, IMO. As if that was relevant anyway. Homey.
What I AM doing is defending the fact that Condit won the fight, and ultimately wondering why people thought this wasn’t a good fight.
But you can go back to your conspiracy theories if you want.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
True...
I have to admit that you got me there. But I didn’t mean it this literally. Carlos ran for a second or two only to turn back and keep fighting. Fighters do it all the time and I don’t see it as running from the fight. He was just positioning himself somewhere where he thought he could get good offense going and still deny Diaz advantage. (Please note I still scored the fight for Diaz)
I saw more of Carlos's back last night than his face
He ran so many times I think he should switch to track. BTW, I cannot stand the Diaz brothers but I (and my friends) relunctantly gave Diaz the fight 48-47.
Admit it
You were staring at his ass…. homie
Why the hell is being gracious in defeat a prerequisite for a rematch?
People on this site have the strangest priorities. I personally would be interested in a rematch and both guys are free for it…why shouldn’t it happen? Because Diaz isn’t polite enough? That’s ridiculous.
If you want beef then bring the ruckus.
by lowellthehammer on Feb 6, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
" But the way he acted, he shouldn’t get a rematch because he should be made to accept defeat like a professional and not throw his toys out of his pram and throw a hissy fit, then get rewarded for it afterwards."
I am so tired of the sanctimonious bullshit being uttered about how Nick should or shouldn’t respond after a very controversial loss he worked his ass off for in and out of the cage. Give it a rest. No one cares what you think Nick “deserves”.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 12:45 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Nick acted like a child.
Get over it. Your a fan of a guy that fights very well but who also displays some of the most unsportsmanlike conduct MMA has ever seen.
You don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 2:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree
shallow and pedantic
"The greatest enemy will hide in the last place you would ever look." - Revolver
by flyingkneetoface on Feb 6, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
You don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 2:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Nick was robbed and acted accordingly
Who could blame the man?
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
Rematch would be good
Let’s see if Diaz can make adjustments, because he clearly could only do the same old thing on Saturday, rinse, repeat. It worked at times but the majority of the fight it wasn’t working but he didn’t seem to have any sort of gameplan other than walk forward.
Carlos beat him. Why should Nick get a rematch?
You’re penalizing Carlos for winning the fight. They could rematch, let’s say Nick wins a close fight, they’re now 1-1 against each other but Nick gets the fight against GSP and Carlos is left wondering what just happened to a title shot after he did everything Zuffa asked of him. On what earth would that be a fair outcome?
"Complacency is your demise." - Kerry King
Proud member of Trainyard Sleepers, BECW: S2
We're gonna win, you know. Stats lie.
While nobody (especially Dana) wants Kos/GSP3
He should get a shot at Condit before a Diaz rematch. Diaz lost, it wasn’t a razor thin split decision that deserves an instant rematch. If you like, match him up with Hendricks in the meantime to see where he’s at in the division.
"Nothing's ever what it seems. And even if it is, ends justify means." -Matt Good
Kos does not deserve a shot.
Kos and Hendricks and winner takes champ.
by Crazynutts on Feb 6, 2012 2:14 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree with what gspmademegay and StevenGiles said about
Condit’s a champ now, and just because GSP is out doesn’t mean he should be allowed to sit back and wait for him, he should fight again before GSP gets back. But Diaz is in no way deserving of that shot.
He lost the fight, in what I perceived to be a pretty clear decision. Give a new challenger a shot.
And what if Condit gets injured in his next fight and can’t fight GSP in November/December? Why would the UFC jeopardize a huge payday with GSP’s comeback fight in November/December?
Because it's a sport...
…Obviously the UFC want to make money, and Condit/GSP is a big money fight. But I really don’t think Condit should be allowed to sit back for 11 months out of fear of a potential injury.
Condit’s the interim champ now, he should defend the title as Champs do. If he gets injured, he gets injured, these things happen in sport
See, that’s the problem with interim belts… it ties up the two belts together. If Condit gets hurt, GSP can’t fight anyone else. Interim belts are stupid. The UFC needs GSP to fight as soon as possible, and with Condit having a fake belt, it complicates things for nothing.
I completely agree, the interim system is flawed, and the fight should really just have been a #1 contenders match, and had some sort of clause that regardless of the reults of future welterweight fights, the winner should get the next shot. If that were the case Condit could easily sit on the sidelines.
The problem is that’s not the case. Condit, to all intents and purposes, is the champ til GSP returns, in a few months he’ll be the 1 ranked WW fighter by default. He needs to fight once in summer before GSP I think
For all their flaws...
my guess is that interim belts find favour because of the almighty $$. People like to see title fights…
any gsp fight is a huge payday.
BECW S2: BUS FEEDERS PICK#73
by gspmademegay on Feb 6, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
Except...
Except when people want to see a fight. I’m soured on the whole point-fighting thing personally. Seems like others are too.
Yup
Two point fighters go toe to toe? Who will win the decision? Find out in the next boring 25 minute run fight!
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
You two guys suck.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
OTOH...
If we can talk GSP into fighting like he did one-eyed against Shields, and Condit into a repeat, maybe we can find out what counts more in a fight: a long range jab, or a long range leg jab…
If we’re going to go the point-fighting route, I say go all the way.
They could definitely market a rematch
And I think alot of people would want to see it. They fight was extremely close and Diaz was able to take Carlos’s back later in the 5th round. The video clips of Diaz’s discontent over the outcome would set the stage for a compelling rematch. And who knows when George will really be healthy. And it would give the UFC a chance to get the fight they originally wanted anyway.
by Scribonius Curio on Feb 6, 2012 11:13 AM EST reply actions
A rematch would kind of annoy me. I don’t care whether or not Diaz deserves it or if it was a close or controversial fight. My reasoning is simple: I just paid $55 to watch those two fight and ended up not feeling particularly satisfied at the end of the night, irregardless of Condit’s brilliant strategy. I have. I desire to see that fight again when there are other new and interesting challenges for each guy. I would rather see either Diaz or Condit against Kos, Fitch, etc. Lets have some new match ups.
"If I wanted to spend a half hour between two hairy legs I'd go to your mother's house." -Don Frye
by mburtoni on Feb 6, 2012 11:15 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I'd love to see a rematch.
I commented on this somewhere else in BE yesterday, but didn’t think anybody would agree with me. This fight was very frustrating because of our expectations, but it wasn’t bad at all. I really enjoyed it while rewatching it twice even if I disagreed with the decision and thought that Diaz won 3 rounds to 1 (with a draw on the first).
I believe both fighters would do better jobs on a second fight. Diaz could actually, you know, try to adapt to his fucking opponent and Carlos could perfect his strategy so he’d hit hard more consistently, like he did in the fourth.
Still, if Carlos is smart he’ll sit tight and wait for GSP and I wouldn’t blame him at all. A fight with GSP means a lot of money in his pocket and running the risk of losing to Diaz or anybody else doesn’t seem smart to me.
Agreed, it wasn't the war people expected but it was a pretty good fight.
Upon rewatch I scored it for Condit (I had 48-47 Diaz initially). It was a good close fight.
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
Right!
I can understand people complaining about the decision if they scored it for Diaz. I considered the first two rounds tossups, 3 and 4 securely for Condit, and 5 for Diaz (though that was a bit of a tossup as well). As a result, when the judges gave their decision, I would’ve been happy with 48-47 Diaz, 48-47 Condit, and 49-46 Condit. The judges had it both 48-47 Condit and 49-46 Condit. Close fight, and I expected some dissention afterwards.
What I didn’t expect was everyone complaining that it was a horrible fight. Really? I thought it was a pretty darn good fight.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
lets just keep the two guys fighting each other until we get the outcome we actually wanted.
If I was Condit I’d be pretty pissed off if Zuffa came knocking and said “we want a rematch because we expected a different outcome”
by pr0cs on Feb 6, 2012 11:15 AM EST reply actions 28 recs
THIS
lets just keep the two guys fighting each other until we get the outcome we actually wanted.
If I was Condit I’d be pretty pissed off if Zuffa came knocking and said "we want a rematch because we expected a different outcome"
I’m sorry Nick, the guy you were fighting didn’t fight into your gameplan, let’s do it again…
UGH. Although I can’t stand Greg Jackson and some of his fighters, one has to give Jackson props for putting together a masterful strategy to beat Nick Diaz.
No. Just no.
Who cares what Carlos feels? If people want a potential show, and are willing to pay for it, you give it to them. End of story.
It’s not like MMA is the golden standard in sports where everything is prim and proper. People embrace figures like Lesnar, Rousey, Sonnen, Koscheck (yes, they do), but not a potential rematch for Diaz? C’mon.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Because a potential rematch for the title where people feel like one fighter got screwed equates Kimbo being brought back.
It is no less a circus than fast-tracking Brock into a title shot, or Rousey, or giving extra air time and custom-tailored ads to Sonnen. Not at all.
People would pay for this. if not, why would Dana even bring it up. He could give a rat’s ass about your feelings of propriety.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
They would pay a lot for Kimbo too
Thats your criteria. So I don’t know what the problem is.
Except they don't want Kimbo.
They want Diaz vs Condit.
if they wanted Kimbo they would get Kimbo, but Kimbo is done with MMA and pushed the envelope past the nominal freakshow level that the UFC can publicly sustain, so they don’t want him.
I don’t see why you seem so fixated with Kimbo.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
People like me who like Carlos want to see him gets his props for this WIN and get to face a new challenger. Diaz’s output and effectiveness was not worthy of a rematch IMO. I know dana wants to do what fans want but it’s hardly clear at this point that a rematch is the most desired outcome by the fans. It is clear that we all want Diaz to fight again but I dont see how it’s that important that he fights Condit as his next. I suspect the fans would get pretty stoked for Diaz /Koscheck and Condit/ E-berger after he stomps Diego.
I'm straight. That means I like women.
Trainyard Sleepers: Our Foot Your Ass
I'm not afraid of you, internet.
Just try to learn from Rafa. He is the one from whom you should seek guidance.
by Hardy's in your face on Feb 6, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, but that's not how it works. You read Dana's words.
All Diaz has to do now is pick up his dadmn cellphone, call Joe Silva and say “Uh…about the…uh…rematch…uh…yeah…uh…I just wanna get paid.” And then the fight is on. And that’s it.
And screw Carlsos, for the fans will pay for that shit. if we’re willing to put up with all the freakshow factor we get showered often then we should not be surprised with this, or outraged. it’s just the game being played.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Sure ,Dana is indicating that he’s willing to do a re match if both parties want it, but i dont believe the premise that there is a major groundsweel for this rematch. Once it is clear that there is not a huge demand for said fight then he will move on to the matchups that I indicated.
If both parties do want the fight then good bless ’em but i dont think it will sell any better than the 1st one .
I'm straight. That means I like women.
Trainyard Sleepers: Our Foot Your Ass
I'm not afraid of you, internet.
Just try to learn from Rafa. He is the one from whom you should seek guidance.
by Hardy's in your face on Feb 6, 2012 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
if it sells the same, they will be peachy.
And if Condit wins, and he likely will, the stage is set for an even bigger fight.
It’s a no-lose situation for Zuffa. Condit, on the other hand…poor guy just keeps having that carrot dangled in front of his face. I’m starting to think that he’s getting treated worse than Shields ever did at Strikeforce, with the way they keep fucking with the guy.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
better yet
let’s just do thinks STRIKEFORCE style and give the title shot to the guy coming off a loss!
because hey, if diaz/condit was boring you KNOW that diaz/gsp will be a BARN-BURNER!
Agreed.
If I’m Condit, I say FU crybaby sore loser Diaz and FU to everyone who was playing up Diaz/GSP and dismissing me. Possible once in a lifetime opportunity to fight GSP to become undisputed champion of the world (and the money and fame), hell yes!
The fact is that Diaz doesn’t deserve a rematch. He couldn’t adjust to Condit’s game plan, he thought he was winning the fight and let’s be frank, the decision wasn’t very controversial… most people saw it as a UD for Condit… there’s no controversy. Let’s see Diaz prove himself against a few good fighters before getting another title shot of any kind. Him versus Koscheck would be fun.
by Shnak on Feb 6, 2012 11:16 AM EST reply actions 13 recs
This just isn't true.
Rightly or wrongly there’s clearly lots of controversy. Just read the comments here on BE if you doubt it or pop in the post that asks people to list their personal scorecards.
There’s nothing wrong with believing Condit clearly won and not wanting to see a rematch, but it’s not right to make up facts either.
by PlutoCps on Feb 6, 2012 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 13 recs
There’s only lots of controversy because of butthurt Diaz fans… that’s all. Everyone else has no problem with the decision.
If we had to have a rematch every time there was a close decision, all we’d have in the UFC are rematches. Pierce/Koscheck was much closer than Diaz/Condit, and yet nobody is demanding a rematch of that fight. Why not?
Diaz had his chance, he screwed it up. Tough luck, that’s MMA. Train how to properly cut off your opponents when they’re circling away, win a few good fights, and get your rematch with Condit, or get a title shot with GSP after Condit had his.
by Shnak on Feb 6, 2012 11:41 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
So if I agree with you I'm right, if I diisagree I'm delusional?
Good to know. I’m glad to see that you at last can keep perspective and rationally weigh in other people’s opinions and motivations.
Honestly, people like you hurt Condit’s cause as much as the Kalib Starnes crowd hurts Diaz’s.
by PlutoCps on Feb 6, 2012 11:44 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Condit pulled a Starnes
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
by unambig on Feb 6, 2012 3:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Listen dude, we already knew what you were.
but thanks for checking in!
El Santo inspired me to be a submission grappler.
...my knee jerks and kicks a strawman right in the junk. :(
""So if I agree with you I’m right, if I diisagree I’m delusional?""
In this case, yes.
by Empty Thoughts on Feb 6, 2012 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
Also, I’d be fine with a Kos v. Pierce rematch. I actually thought Pierce got robbed, which isn’t the case with Diaz.
Totally agreed. But where’s the outrage for that decision? There’s none. Why? Because nobody cares about Pierce. Why is there outrage with the Condit/Diaz decision? Because many had deluded themselves into thinking Diaz was a great fighter that couldn’t possibly lose to Condit. Well, he did.
by Shnak on Feb 6, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think he is a great fighter and I am not deluded.
Why do you have to even build an argument like that where you just shit all over your valid points with a needless attack?
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
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Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Lol and the anti Diaz crowd is the pure soul of unbiased, logical rationalism, right ? Riiiiight.
by Hutchy on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I was rooting for Diaz in this fight because I think Diaz vs GSP is a more compelling matchup than Condit vs GSP.
But oh well for who I was rooting for, Condit was better.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
They're not just "butthurt Diaz fans"
A travesty is a travesty is a travesty. Nobody argues with a KO.
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
Pat Militich is a butthurt Diaz fan? You learn something new every day on BE!
by sheikybaby on Feb 6, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
“most people saw it as a UD for Condit”
No, no they didn’t. Look at the article at MMAFighting that had a load of actual fighters who scored it for Diaz. Many did.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 12:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 6 recs
Not that it matters...
But a lot fighters are notoriously bad at breaking down/scoring fights. Just sayin. I’m more interested in what the analysts say (there are fighters who are analysts too, but the analyst is the important part).
That said, plenty of analysts are all over the place on this one too. No one wants to admit that this is a fight that could’ve gone either way, but it was.
most of those fighters al shatti
picked were strikeforce people, not a valid argument at all.
My problem with the rematch
My only problem with a rematch is what happens if Diaz wins? Condit va Diaz would be 1-1. Does he get to fight GSP because he happened to win the latest match? Do they need to do a 3rd fight to break the tie before anyone fights GSP?
I’d like a rematch, but don’t think an immidate rematch makes much sense and could just muddy the waters even more.
by carpediem on Feb 6, 2012 11:17 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I guess it depends on how Diaz wins, if he does.
If he wins by KO or submission or dominates Condit I think most people would agree that that trumps a very close fight like the one on Saturday. If Condit wins in any fashion at all, then there’s no problem. The only problem would be if Nick won a very close decision. I don’t mind that risk at all, personally and hey, we could have a new trilogy then.
by PlutoCps on Feb 6, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If Diaz won then he'd actually be 2-0 against Condit because he won the first fight
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
Condit is a tougher test for GSP
he’s got knees from hell, and has good scrambles and sweeps. GSP would’ve just toyed with Diaz. Condit has a better track record with wrestlers than Nick.
Far worse options
Than clarifying a decision that while nowhere near Penn/Edgar I standards, was controversial and piques fan interest.
But is Nick down for it?
by Flashking on Feb 6, 2012 11:20 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Hahaha, this is ridiculous
So in a title fight, the favorite only has to win once, but the underdog has to win twice?
I felt so bad for Edgar after his Penn fight, and now they’re gonna do the same for Diaz. This is insane.
Diaz is more than capable of having some REALLY exciting fights with other guys; let him work his way up the ladder.
by Shaun32887 on Feb 6, 2012 11:21 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
And the Maynard fight as well.
If you want beef then bring the ruckus.
by lowellthehammer on Feb 6, 2012 12:16 PM EST up reply actions
The problem really is when the underdog wins a close disputed decision and there's time to kill before his next fight.
If Condit blew Diaz out of the water we wouldn’t be discussing this. If Georges was healthy we wouldn’t either.
If you want beef then bring the ruckus.
by lowellthehammer on Feb 6, 2012 12:18 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not opposed to either.
If you want beef then bring the ruckus.
by lowellthehammer on Feb 6, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
Although if Diaz's next match isn't for a belt I think he should be the main event.
He’s the kind of guy that should be in five round fights at this point.
If you want beef then bring the ruckus.
by lowellthehammer on Feb 6, 2012 12:50 PM EST up reply actions
Isn't Ellenberger/Condit the (re)match to put on?
Assuming Ellenberger gets by Sanchez? (I think that’s pretty likely).
If they do Diaz/Condit again immediately, the “agenda” is way too evident.
by Steve1717 on Feb 6, 2012 11:22 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I'm for it.
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
No rematch
Nick can fight BJ again if he wants to brawl
Menckenstein:
(noun)
Definition: a traditional doll crafted from the stomach hair of obese, unkempt, typically diabetic men who suck at fighting. This type of doll is commonly crafted in the deep South and seems to be exclusively purchased by fans of the NBA franchise the LA Lakers, who believe the dolls give them the power to be as cool as Celtics fans.
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Starting to the the boring gameplans greg jackson uses most of the time
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
That Jon jones guy is sooooo awful to watch…and Condit with his 2 decisions in 28 victories with 21 finishes in the first round is soooo dreadfully unbearable
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 11:39 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
That was nothing like how Carlos normally fights..
..a fighter can be cautious but c’mon that sucked..
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
by Elitex10x on Feb 6, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
1 fight sucked for you
That’s proof of Jackson making every fighter in his camp.
...he also sends me messages saying "Prepare your soul, only god and jiu jitsu can save you and god isn’t listening". -Patrick Tenney
Diego Sanchez is the main guy from Jackson's you know will always fight
The game plan with Kampmann was to LNP, Diego couldn’t take Martin down and we got fireworks because he went back to his normal plans.
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
There are a ton of Jackson's fighters who are consistently in exciting fights.
And Jon Jones’ striking is boring? What’s your criteria for exciting striking?
Losing doesn't matter HE DELIVERED DUMBSHIT SWINGING FIGHT HAHHAHAH
by UncleMax on Feb 6, 2012 3:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
STANDANDBANG!!!!!!
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The only 4 punches Diego landed all fight
There's no moral order at all. There's just this: can my violence conquer yours?
by ElliotMatheny on Feb 6, 2012 4:33 PM EST up reply actions
Don’t forget Cerrone, dude just wrestle fucks EVERYONE
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 11:40 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
You’re leaving out Leonard Garcia. Dude never engages
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
garcia is just a wild man, never listens to the game plans if he would listen to greg jackson he’d leg kicking from the outside until the time runs out also
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
You kinda sound like you’re drinkin the kool-aid a little there.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
Instead, have Condit fight someone new in another interior fight. Hendricks I guess could be worthy. This would be a chance for someone new to get a shot, and it still stays on target for the interim champ to fight GSP in November.
by Hardcharger on Feb 6, 2012 11:37 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Condit vs Hendricks
and Diaz vs Fitch or Ellenberger or Rory. I think Ellenberger and McDonald have a good chance to beat Diaz and then the whole Diaz train will go down and there’s no need to put him against GSP
All good options.
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by dribblebib on Feb 6, 2012 12:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It would be like Edgar/penn 2 and the only thing that would be accomplished is assuring Diaz of a 2 fight losing streak
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 11:37 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I really don't understand the fuss about the decision
the right guy won. yes it was a tactical fight but this is a sport and it’s not a rule that fighters have to brawl. a second fight with these two would be more of the same, Diaz doesn’t create gameplans and Condit does, I don’t see what the point would be. Love Diaz, don’t really care for Condit and after Saturday night he hasn’t really done anything for me to care more about him. but he won the fight, let’s move on.
I call you, I talk to me - Anderson Silva
I feel teh same way
If you wanna give GSP more time, then at least have Condit fight someone else and not the guy he just beat by UD.
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Totally agree
It’s pretty stupid that you put together a perfect gameplan and execute it masterfully, and as a result they send you back to the drawing board? WTH?
For those complaining about Lil Diaz vs Miller as the main event on Fox 3 ...
Whoop, there it is. Diaz vs Condit 2 would be an amazing main event for Fox 3, and if Diaz can win infront of millions of viewers, helps setup a blockbuster PPV against GSP.
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He doesn’t deserve it. Diaz showed absolutely nothing in this fight that makes him deserve an immediate rematch.
but....the drama....
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by lmaginary Enemy on Feb 6, 2012 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
If Condit has to have a rematch fight before he fights GSP, I’d much rather see him fight Ellenberger again than Diaz again. Ellenberger actually deserves a rematch fight with Condit considering how close their first fight was, and who he’s beat since that first fight. THAT is a rematch that makes sense.
by Shnak on Feb 6, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!
Someone besides me remember that Jake put a hurting on Condit in that fight. He probably would have won if he didnt break his hands punching Carlos so damn hard.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
I thought he flat out killed Condit
And then Condit beat him. God I love that guy.
I’d be happy with Condit/Ellenberger II while GSP recovers, that would be awesome
Ellenberger's not as marketable right now
Even if he trucked Condit, the money match is Diaz or Condit vs GSP, not Ellenberger.
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jake is about as marketable as condit.
they are both on the same scale when it comes to personality.
Condit's been around a bit longer
And has past titles among his accolades. Sure, Ellenberger would become interim champ, but people wouldn’t buy him as a contender for GSP like Diaz or Condit.
I really like Ellenberger as a fighter btw, just don’t like UFC of pushing guys at the wrong time. KO’ing Shields was great, but I see 2012 as the year for Ellenberger to break out with title aspirations coming in 2013. Guy’s still young.
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There is no money in Condit vs GSP
that doesn’t come soley in respect of GSP’s standing. You just had look in Dana’s face after the fight to know that, Diaz – GSP was the big money fight and it’s gone
There's more money in Condit vs GSP, than Ellenberger vs GSP
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I doubt it
all the hardcores watch it anyway and the casuals respond to GSP, I don’t think Condit would attract significantly more casuals than Ellenberger, so I assume the buyrate would be roughly the same
That's the fight to make.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
If Ellenberger beats Sanchez, and GSP can’t come back earlier than November, Condit/Ellenberger is definitely the fight that makes the most sense.
Diego would get his ass beat badly by Diaz, but hey if it shuts the fan boys up im all for it.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
Boo on this idea! Condit won and these continuing instant rematches are getting kinda silly. I would rather Condit defend the title against someone else before he fights GSP than rematch with Diaz. Diaz lost and if he is as good as he thinks he is (and honestly can be most of the time) he should be able to earn another shot. Would this be the case if Condit had lost would they be talking about another shot for Condit instead? Why not have Diaz fight Koscheck or Hendricks or the winner of Sanchez/Ellenberger or what happens if Condit beats GSP? Any of those are ways that Diaz can either still get a chance at GSP or the title. But in the end this is all pointless if Diaz is just going to quit.
by Andrew Zollinger on Feb 6, 2012 11:41 AM EST reply actions
But why Diaz rather than any other contender?
He lost in what was a close, but mostly accepted decision. Not a draw, not a robbery. Sure, don’t shelve Condit to wait for GSP, but give someone new a shot.
Lets see Condit fight someone else. Diaz had his chance and failed. If we gave all athletes with special gifts a second chance we’d only do rematches.
truth. and Condit already went thru the rollercoaster that was the GSP/Diaz/Penn fiasco
give the guy a friggen break
Dana shouldn't fold and give him the rematch.
he acted like a spoiled teen girl who complained when here daddy got her the wrong colored car. Nick was outsmarted and out struck in that fight. Have Diaz fight Kos, and if Jake beats Diego we can get Jake vs Condit 2, the first fight was close and Condit was getting his shit lit up for a while.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
Several times in the article you comment on if Diaz can be talked into a rematch… What about Carlos Condit? Does he not have a say? I doubt Condit wants to do it again. He has NOTHING to gain. He has won his shot at GSP fair and square. There is no reason for him to risk that opportunity giving Diaz rematch. Why not save Diaz the trouble of losing a 2nd fight to the NBK and just give him the shot at GSP over Condit. That’s what this is all about. This rematch talk has nothing to do with a bad decision or highly controversial decision. Check out the fight stats. Diaz was owned and if everyone did not want to see him fight GSP so bad there would be no discussion of a rematch. If it were any other fighter, we would be singing Condits praises for fighting a masterful fight – which he did. MOVE ON. Stop wasting space on Diaz and rematches and start giving Carlos some love. There will not be a rematch – so get over it.
by TREY JACKSON on Feb 6, 2012 11:45 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Similar thaughts…
Nothing to gain by a rematch, except possibly a huge purse based on all the hype it would generate. Problem is, If you have the title, why give it away? No reason to fight Nick again anytime soon. If Nick won, the score would be even and you would need a 3rd match to decide the victor. Great for promotions, shit for Conduit. He will wait for GSP.
BadMFMike
“Nothing to gain by a rematch, except possibly a huge purse based on all the hype it would generate.”
Only way there is a huge purse and hype is based on fan interest, which is a huge reason why to make matches.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 12:54 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
ding ding ding.
If this is the best fight to make for both guys and the UFC in the next few months you have to do it.
Everyone needs to stop making generalizations about “rematches,” “deserving,” and “titles” (interim or regular type). The benefit of the UFC’s matchmaking/system/whatever is that they can look at each situation individually and do what is the best for that particular situation.
Outright dismissing the idea today is crazy.
DW clearly said
“Both” guys would have to say they wanted the rematch. The much bigger payday for CC is to chill out a few extra months and spend the extra time getting ready for the biggest test of his career – GSP. Diaz is now just a stat on Condits resume – he has already moved past Diaz and started to focus on GSP. All you 209ers should do the same.
by TREY JACKSON on Feb 6, 2012 5:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
That's a pretty damn good idea.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 11:59 AM EST up reply actions
Man what the fuck ever!
That fight was really good! Condit had a gameplan and knew not to be fucking stupid and get held up against the cage and allow Diaz to tee-off on him like Penn and Daley did. Whenever Condit got caught up against the cage, Jackson kept yelling for him to “exit”. Condit also landed some beautiful punch, low kick to high kick combos that caught diaz flush to the face at least twice. Diaz just thinks he can just walk everyone down against the cage and let off on them, Condit didn’t allow it and I already know that GSP’s cerebral ass would’ve stuck to a solid gameplan as well. Diaz did have sweet back control in that final round I believe, I would’ve been yelling for Diaz to try and take it to the ground after round 3. And to be perfectly honest, I can see Condit winning all 5 rounds fairly solidly iirc.
Come at me bros!
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by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 11:48 AM EST reply actions
I agree with you 100%
It amazes me how people on here hust expected Carlos to rush in with reckless abandon and attack head on. Because that worked so well for Penn and Daley.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
by RJshock 305 on Feb 6, 2012 11:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
exactly
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions
That's why Nick Diaz
talks so much shit in the fight, he wanted Condit to lose composure and spring forward so he could get swarmed, but Condit didn’t do that which was smart.
I'm a HUGE Diaz fan, but I don't think he deserves a rematch right away.
You saw that he did everything he could to frustrate Condit during that fight, including slapping him in the face, and none of it worked. I think that Diaz needs to fight someone else before he gets another shot at the interim champion. It was a really good fight, but I don’t remember Diaz coming close to wining. I would love to see them fight again, but not right away.
So because the fighter that you wanted to get the win lost he deserves a rematch? Condit had a great gameplan and he stuck to it and won.
"So what we get drunk So what we smoke weed We’re just having fun We don’t care who sees So what we go out That’s how its supposed to be Living young and wild and free."
And if Diaz loses again?
He’ll be buried in a deep division of contenders, who will have a gameplan to follow, when they eventually get matched up with him. Match him up with fighters who’ll engage (or cave to his trash talk)… Diego, i’m looking at you, and let him bypass Condit, and be ready to fight George after the unification bout.
I hate this rematch
It’s basically Dana saying, “GSP wants to fight Diaz so lets make Diaz and Condit fight again so we can try to make that fight happen.” Condit won, he deserves GSP, he has gotten screwed enough times in the last few months.
exactly. he was a WEC champion for godsakes.
WEC can’t get no love, even though alot of the WEC guys are beasts in the UFC
of course GSP wants to fight Diaz
coz we know how this will play out,
now Condit is a completely different puzzle for GSP to sort out
And if Diaz wants to just fight someone who will stand and trade with him go hang out in Kimbo Slice’s backyard
"So what we get drunk So what we smoke weed We’re just having fun We don’t care who sees So what we go out That’s how its supposed to be Living young and wild and free."
by chavez_26 on Feb 6, 2012 11:53 AM EST reply actions 3 recs
Condit needs to keep fighting.
That fight was for the interim belt, not “#1 contender” to wait till GSP gets back. It’s the INTERIM BELT and Condit should have to keep defending it until GSP comes back. Nothing like 2 guys with 2 belts in 1 division WAITING to fight each other. I don’t care if its a rematch but Condit needs to stay active with that belt and just not sit on it.
And if a rematch did happen, I think Diaz make the necessary adjustment to keep Condit from escaping against the fence and takes it.
Just Breed!
by ScoreCardOTN on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Um Huh?
Condit having the interm belt mean’s he is the number one contender. Also your wrong he doesn’t have to defend it as Carwin didn’t defend his. Carlos went through hell trying to get this fight. Let him rest and have it.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
Why even have the interim belt?
Why not just make it number one contender til the champ gets back? Isn’t GSP coming back in late fall at the earliest? Condit should have to defend before then. We don’t need a whole Evans/Jones debacle here with injuries. So Condit sits on the belt, gets injured without fighting. GSP comes back and has to fight some one else. His opponent beats him and the real belt changes hands but in the mean time Condit still has the interim? No. Condit needs to keep defending that belt while he can. If you have a belt, interim or not, and are healthy you should be required to defend that belt. If you just beat someone for “#1 contender” then sure – sit around and wait for the champ. That’s what the difference is between interim champ and #1 contender status.
Just Breed!
by ScoreCardOTN on Feb 6, 2012 1:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I agree, but
That shouldn’t be Diaz. This decision was only controversial in the sense that some people didn’t like it. There are plenty of good fights for Diaz.
Shame he’s a manbaby who quit because he can’t figure out why mean mugging after getting kicked in the face doesn’t score points. Oh and walking forward.
I disagree
This decision was only controversial in the sense that some people didn’t like it.
I believe most people scored it for Diaz. I personally scored it UD or SD for Diaz, and I don’t like Diaz. I was rooting for Condit.
Nick’s problem is that he fights in straight lines and has very little footwork (according to Freddie Roach) Condit used this to his advantage and I see the same happening in the rematch.
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
by MattParker117 on Feb 6, 2012 11:54 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Nick's footwork cost him the fight. He was chasing Condit all night instead of cutting him off.
If he keeps fighting he better correct that cause a lot of guys will use that against him.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Diaz should have been more game.
He should have simply rushed Condit. Used all that great cardio has has and just gone beserk, Diaz was too conservative.
Rushing might have been effective at first but proper footwork is what he would have really needed.
Going forward chasing Condit faster wouldn’t have prevented him from getting away.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
Yup you're right
Diaz certainly has the opportunity to do SOMETHING…
It’s strange there’s no poll option for wanting another Condit fight pre-GSP, but not having it with Diaz. There are other interesting fights out there for both guys, supposing Diaz even comes back.
Anyone else want to see Rory MacDonald take on the elder Diaz now? Because I kind of do.
50 bucks says he will use the same game plan with suplxes added to the mix.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
They really need a better fight for Rory than Che Mills. Makes no sense, other than creating a highlight.
by Hardcharger on Feb 6, 2012 12:05 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
yes. feed Diaz to wrestlers
he can say fuck the world on his back
Do I want to see a rematch? Yes
Is it the right thing to do? No. Diaz lost his chance, and a mulligan(sic) is not fair to Carlos.
I f I were Carlos and this was presented to me, I’d say yes, only with the stipulation that if I lose to Diaz, I get another fight with him before he fights GSP. Can they fit in two more Diaz v Condit matches before GSP comes back?
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“After Diaz wins, he should wait for GSP. It only makes sense.” – Diaz fans pre-fight
“REMATCH!!! Carlos shouldn’t sit around and wait that long.” – Diaz fans post-fight
by William Wilson on Feb 6, 2012 11:58 AM EST reply actions 10 recs
Haha so true. Also, didn’t Condit himself say pre-fight that he would fight again and wouldn’t wait for GSP?
Yup
While Cesar Gracie said he would tell Diaz to wait.
by William Wilson on Feb 6, 2012 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
Im normally not a fan of immediete rematches, but I wouldnt mind seeing condit finish Diaz this time, id love to hear the excuses after that.
by Blow to the back of the head on Feb 6, 2012 12:02 PM EST reply actions
I feel like a rematch would be very similar, but Condit would be able to engage better and land more consistently.
He was noticeably uncomfortable in dealing with Diaz’s style in the opening rounds, but he started to get comfortable and land more as the fight went on. His striking looked very good in the fourth.
by lolumad on Feb 6, 2012 12:03 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
If Ellenberger defeats Diego the rematch between him and Condit for the belt would be spectacular
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by Earl Montclair on Feb 6, 2012 12:07 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Yea I liked the first fight
Condit was real aggressive, even after he got hit he was able to get top position and still attack.
should have fought like that in the nick fight to make it more exciting but meh i know he took a bit of a layoff and just needed the win.
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
You must not know what game planing is huh?
Aggressive fighting leads to you getting your ass thoroughly handed to you by Nick Diaz.
"Dont take anything for granted when your fighting me. If you assume you have an edge here or that your gonna dominate me there, you know you better think again man Cause Im gonna FUCK YOU UP!!!"-Carlos Condit Champion 2011
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
by Elitex10x on Feb 6, 2012 12:13 PM EST reply actions 18 recs
Bj Penn got to rematch Edgar after a close fight, why shouldn’t Diaz get one?
Fuck you, double fingers
- Nick Diaz
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Nope.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
Oh wait you’re right, mixed that up with the Maynard fights.
Ok so yeah, based on that precedent, a rematch wouldn’t be ridiculous.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, but in my mind Penn-Edgar 1 is a much more controversial decision that Diaz-Condit.
I wouldn’t really mind a rematch as it was a close fight too, but there’s other fights I’d like to see both guys in.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions
Ultimately I agree
While I don’t think a Condit vs Diaz rematch would be ridiculous, I don’t think it’s appropriate here either, in my opinion. I’m content to let Condit wait for his earned GSP fight, and Diaz can get another matchup sooner than later.
I just hope Diaz does actually stick around. The WW picture is a lot more interesting with him in it.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
I'd like Condit to take a fight before GSP if GSP comes back in november.
If Ellenberger beats Diego (and I think he will) that’s a rematch I’d like to see. I think Diaz could fight the winner of Kampmann-Alves as afrotikiman suggested, or Koscheck.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
Condit vs Ellenberger would be awesome. That first might everyone realize very quickly that Ellenberger was no joke when no one knew who he was.
I’d rather see Diaz vs Kampmann-Alves. I’m afraid that the Koscheck fight would end up too easily exploiting Diaz’s wrestling holes. But that’s a heck of a clash of personalities.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
Diaz vs Kampmann-Alves would be my first choice too.
Koscheck testing Diaz against wrestling was kind of the point though, it’s been a long time since we saw Diaz with a wrestler. Depending on how he looks against Ellenberger, Diaz-Sanchez 2 isn’t too bad either.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
Well now that you mention it, there’s seemingly endless good possibilities here. And definitely fights that I’m more interested in seeing that Condit vs Diaz… right now, at least. Something tells me that, provided Diaz does stick around, both guys will find themselves in a situation to rematch down the line. And it will be so much better with some time in between.
by Matt Buckley on Feb 6, 2012 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
Because...
it wasn’t a close fight?
by William Wilson on Feb 6, 2012 12:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yep
I don’t think it was that close at all. You could MAYBE give Diaz a round or 2 (I wouldn’t outside of round 5 maybe due to the grappling) but that’s about it imo.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
If you look at the numbers of fightmetric
how can’t you give Diaz the second round, that’s the only round he outstruck Condit and the almost rear naked choke in the 5th was the most significant thing that happend in the whole fight. So it’s a question of who gets the first round and by the numbers this was the closest round. Condit only landed 3 or 4 strikes more than Diaz, but mostly legkicks, while Diaz landed significantly more to the head and by my account harder shots, factor in his aggressiveness and octagon control, I gave Diaz also the first round. With Condit just winning rounds 3 and 4 I gave it to Diaz 48 – 47
With several toss-up rounds, there a few acceptable scores, IMO. Before the judges decision, I would’ve accepted 48-47 Diaz (giving rounds 1, 2, and 5 to Diaz), 48-47 Condit (giving 1, 3, and 4 OR 3, 4, and 5 to Condit), and 49-46 Condit (giving 1, 3, 4, and 5 to Condit).
It was a close fight and you know there were going to be arguments. The only thing that’s got me going here is so many people dogging on Condit for having a winning gameplan. The same old complaints that come up when one guy doesn’t want to brawl.
All in all you are right
Close fight, close decision, I am certainly not saying it was a robbery and I am also not faulting Condit for fighting smart, he had a good gameplan and executed it very well. Nonetheless I’m very sad cause I wanted DIaz – GSP really really really bad
BJ Penn was the long-time champion, he was something like an 8-to-1 favorite and lost a very controversial decision while being sick… none of those apply to Diaz.
nick beat bj soundly
but a healthy bj will whip diaz. i dont think diaz has iron chin, i give lots of credit to the mat in his daley fight, had he fallen on his knees with less of an impact on the mat, he wouldn’t have woken up.
Glad to see everyone took a day to watch the super bowl and came back with a refreshing take on things. O wait, the same whining that went on all night on saturday about the fight, sweet.
Anyway, as to the topic at hand, I think it depends on timing, and how the rest of the division turns out. Regardless of
“deserving a rematch” and off the top of my head, I’d say let them fight again if Condit will be ready to fight more than 3months before GSP.
Maybe do Condit/Ellenberger if he looks good against diego, but I don’t know if that fight is big enough to headline a card, and I can’t think of anything else to besides Diaz if Sanchez wins AND GSP isn’t going to be ready for a while.
Do we now need a rematch after every close title fight?
Condit won. Diaz lost. We move on. Give Diaz another fight sooner than later. Let Condit wait for GSP. We’ll probably get an appropriate Condit vs Diaz rematch in the future anyway. Don’t see a reason for it right now.
This guy knows.
It seems like we’re hearing about immediate rematches pretty often these days, but I don’t get the point. This isn’t Edgar/Maynard or even Shogun/Machida. Diaz just lost a close fight. We don’t need a rematch. I want to see them against new faces.
by Some Guy Named Gabbo on Feb 6, 2012 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
BJ-Frankie I was for the ACTUAL belt, not an INTERIM belt
no rematch please..Condit won, people seriously need to stop crying
Nick’s a girl too for his post-fight reaction “he was running from me”
no, Condit wasn’t allowing him to pressure him against the fence and do damage
flashback to Tito-Machida fight..Tito said the same shit in between rounds..if you can’t adjust/adapt, too bad
imo there’s such hatred because Diaz-GSP was the “money” match people wanted to see
Condit fought a better, smarter fight and deserved to win
if Diaz had taken the UD, i doubt this many people would be crying
You must defeat me to stand a chance.
So they should have a rematch because people are complaining about the fight?
Is MMA a sport or street-fighting. I loved the fight and what Condit did in there. All the people saying he was running the entire time can go f#*$k themselves!
How did he land more strikes if he was “running away” ?
He fought with a great came plan and executed it the way he wanted to.
He wasn’t intimidated or swayed to get into the type of fight that Diaz wanted. If I was Diaz I would be frustrated too, being too stupid to change up your attack after not being able to figure Condit out.
It’s more a flaw in his footwork than his fight IQ. Other than that I agree completely
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
by MattParker117 on Feb 6, 2012 12:39 PM EST up reply actions
I agree
They both have high fight IQs obviously. I just hope that Dana isn’t going to make a rematch just to give Diaz a second chance so that the UFC can get Diaz-GSP.
x
Diaz: I’m going to walk straight at you, back you against the cage and tee off.
Condit: Umm, no. I’m not going to play to your strengths. That’s a terrible idea.
Diaz: You’re a bitch
I really don’t get the running away complaint. Even if you scored the fight according to the Stockton Scoring System of “the guy who looked more jacked up afterward lost”, Condit came out ahead.
I really enjoy watching Nick’s fights, but he couldn’t/wouldn’t adapt this weekend. It was disappointing.
by Some Guy Named Gabbo on Feb 6, 2012 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
So because we figured out that walking forward doesn’t win fights, we want to award his childish, knee jerk behavior by giving him a rematch because his dumbass doesn’t know what footwork means?
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by Krimson on Feb 6, 2012 12:41 PM EST via mobile reply actions 16 recs
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
by MattParker117 on Feb 6, 2012 12:44 PM EST up reply actions
That's not how it is.
If there’s enough buzz about it, and enough people wanna watch it, they’ll feel compelled to make it happen.
I don’t get why fans get so high and mighty about the prospect of these kinds of rematches given that fight-business is also show-business. Who cares if Nick couldn’t adapt? Who cares if Nick is childish? Who cares that the second fight might even turn out worse for Nick?
I assure you that enough people will buy it.
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Dana white wants a certain level of professionalism (Wait a minute…) so giving Nick Diaz a 3rd chance is contradictory. Not to mention he dissed the entire sport, the judges (well…ok) and walked away crying.
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dana is hoping for 2 more PPV's with diaz...
possibly one with GSP, he wants that big pay day. this is also a ploy to convince nick against retirement or go to boxing.
Professionalism according to Dana White:
You know what’s funny man, is that when he said that, I was thinking the same thing. It’s crazy, but. I was thinking it after the fight. You know, people are bitching and thinking it was close or whatever, we can do that fight again before GSP comes back. It depends on Carlos too, he’s really gotta say, and Nick’s gotta say I want to fight him again too."
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You’re not wrong in thinking Diaz shouldn’t get it. The fight wasn’t exactly Machida vs Shogun stuff, but alotta folk deem it to be so, so it is what it is.
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Alright!!!! Diaz needs to fight Shields!!!!!
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 12:42 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Diaz would beat Shields bad.
Diaz vs. Fitch. And I can’t believe I’m saying that.
Read my tweets or whatever - @SSReporters
I don’t think he beats shields bad but it’s a mute point…I really want Alves vs Diaz
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 1:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Shields has shit striking
Diaz would Stockton Slap him to death
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Diaz vs. Alves is a sick fight. Love it
Read my tweets or whatever - @SSReporters
by SSreporters on Feb 6, 2012 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
if daley/diaz 2 happened..
it would be a coin flip, the way i see it, the mat had a big role to play in that fight, had diaz fallen with less impact, daley woulda won. daley has the power to KO diaz any day. and alves has sick MT, if he can find his range, he can take nick’s legs off in less than 2 rds.
Shields needs to go back to MW.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 1:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Aren't they team mates?
The whole Mayhem brawl thing was after the Shields fight.
Funny, I never thought about that.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
Going through all these possible scenarios makes me realize 170 is STACKED! And with GSP injured, it is so interesting and competitive.
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 12:44 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Those are going to be good. 170 is a great division right now.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
Sexyama vs shields ain’t bad either
by Afrotikiman on Feb 6, 2012 1:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Rule #1 of the Nick Diaz Fanclub: Nick Diaz never loses. Even in his losses, there's always an excuse that he didn't actually lose
Or that he was boringly wrestlehumped.
Oh yeah, the UFC clearly wants GSP vs. Diaz because Diaz shittalks and Condit trained with GSP. They’re so desperate for PPV buys and pro-wrestling bullshit storylines and trash-talking that Dana wants to have Diaz and Condit rematch.
Condit can rematch Diaz later after GSP beats Condit and then Condit vs. Diaz can headline UFC on FOX in a five-rounder in 2013.
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Nick should instead stay retired, I think.
I remember him saying that he hated this thing and wanted to leave a good while back, and he was winning then. When asked by Ariel Helwani why he didn’t quit he said that he “didn’t like not having a job.”
Not exactly the best mindset for heading into this thing.
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I think people are misunderstanding Diaz fans
..and the negative reactions to this fight. I count myself as a Diaz fan, and I was rooting for him to win, but I’ve also loved Condit since his WEC days. The thing I was butthurt about was not Diaz losing, but the feeling that I got bait-and-switched on what I expected to be a fight of the decade contender.
To give a recent example of what I mean, if there’s one guy I like more than Nick Diaz at WW, it’s Paul Daley. When they fought, I was all-the-way in the tank for Semtex. I was bummed when he lost (I also thought the stoppage was early) but when the smoke had cleared, I was thrilled to have been part of the fight as a viewer, and I was filled with admiration for what Diaz did.
I don’t think most Nick Diaz fans give too much of a shit about his record, frankly. I personally just like to watch him in compelling fights, and I thought Condit was one of the most compelling fights available in the entire division. When it turned into a chess match, it was a bummer, because it was one of the last fights available between two high-level WWs who don’t usually do chess matches.
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by Dave Strummer on Feb 6, 2012 1:18 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Yep.
It wasn’t exactly the fight anyone expected. And I’m sure that even Condit fans that are happy for his success feel a little shortchanged.
But don’t sweat it, playa, Diaz will be fine.
That’s him at his afterparty the other day.
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He looks like
a little kid being forced to go to a party when he doesn’t want to.
So fucking heartbreaking...
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Garland Greene said it best.
He’s a font of misplaced rage. Name your cliché; Mother held him too much or not enough, last picked at kickball, late night sneaky uncle, whatever. Now he’s so angry moments of levity actually cause him pain; gives him headaches. Happiness, for that gentleman, hurts.
Did you hit him in the bean bag? There’s no shame in attacking a criminal’s bean bag.
+1 for con-air reference not involving a bunny put back in the box
-1 to self for referring to said reference in reference to your reference.
Here is a rule of thumb from Chinese martial arts: Hard strikes soft, soft strikes hard. In other words - use hard weapons (fists, albows, knees, fingertips) on soft targets like muscles, torso, eyes etc. Use soft weapons (palm, sole of the foot) to strike hard targets like the head, elbows and knees, and other bony surfaces.
by Pillow Pants on Feb 6, 2012 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
Great points Monte, but Paul was out out in that first round. McCarthy had to help him to his stool and he sat there looking incoherent for longer than the minute he would have been given to recover in between rounds.
That’s the conventional wisdom, but I think it’s results oriented. Big John let Diaz take a brief nap on his face and eat shots, so he was calling the fight a little loose (something I totally agree with, BTW, given the fighters) but he needs to give Paul the same chance. When he stopped it Paul had his feet up and was not eating unanswered shots AND it was seconds from the bell.
Maybe Paul would have been unable to get up at the bell, and it would have been stopped anyway, or maybe — with the fight still on the line — he would have dragged his ass to his stool and come out for Round 2.
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by Dave Strummer on Feb 6, 2012 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I debated and ultimately voted YUS!
As much as I don’t particularly care to see another five rounds of that, I think a rematch would answer a lot of questions about both guys, and hopefully generate a less contentious result.
I’m not sure I think any of the other available options at WW make a ton of sense right now. Kos off a weak win doesn’t thrill me, Hendricks would be a little early. Ellenberger already has a fight, etc., etc.
If Condit can build and expand on the same game plan (maybe a little more slipping and firing, and a little less of the back turning) and beats Diaz again with it, I think that would be a pretty impressive accomplishment. Similarly, if Nick worked on cutting off those escapes, and mixed in some takedown/sub efforts earlier, I think that would be impressive too.
Either way, I think the winner would come out of it an even more credible GSP contender, which is ultimately the goal of these things.
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by Dave Strummer on Feb 6, 2012 1:07 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Diaz simply doesn't deserve a rematch.
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Let’s just start giving everyone who losses a rematch. Koscheck vs. GSP #9, Cruz vs.Faber #12. Yeah, that’s exciting. If you can’t defeat someone in 5 rounds, what the heck is another 3 or 5 going to do??
i dont wanna see this rematch.
but i can see how much of a crybaby nick diaz and his fans can be, besides dana white is prepared to milk this issue as much as he can, he is really dying for that 800k + ppv to impress his new business partners, and with brock gone, GSP and diaz are his only prayer.
Those are some pretty biased voting choices. How about “No, this fight was conclusive enough and Diaz doesn’t deserve a rematch”.
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I didn't really like the first fight between them.
What’s the point of a rematch. I’d rather see Rory vs Condit.
No, you're not drunk. I am this good-looking.
A lot of folk felt like Diaz got robbed.
They’d gladly pay to see him get the chance to win. Condit, and his nuthuggers, would deem it completely unfair, and they would be absolutely right.
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You don't have to be a Condit nuthugger to deem it completely unfair.
I don’t even like the guy and it’s clearly unfair.
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You are right.
But that’s how their business operates.
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life isn’t fair. If Condit wants to take another fight that can headline a PPV instead of sitting around and twiddling his thumbs for 6 months why on earth wouldn’t he?
Because 170 is stacked and there’s plenty of other people deserving of the fight. Diaz lost fair and square and doesn’t deserve it.
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Again:
Who cares? Brock didn’t deserve his title shot, and neither does Rousey, or at least not in terms of athletic competition, but they got it. Why? because people would pay to see it.
This isn’t even that weird.
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I care. I don’t want to see it. Diaz lost, there are more compelling contenders. Keep it rolling. It’s just my opinion, of course, but it’s up against yours. The fact is that most of the people saying they want to see it are butt-hurt Diaz fans.
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Yes. But you don't matter any more than the people who whined about Brock and his title shot..
And I’d watch it and am a Diaz fan but am not the least bit butthurt. I liked the first one, why wouldn’t I watch the second one?
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I never said I matter more – nor am I trying to convince you otherwise. Diaz lost. Diaz then whined like a child that Condit wouldn’t fight his gameplan. This is the guy who used to bitch that people wrestled in MMA. Congrats on not being butthurt, by the way. You’re the first one I’ve seen.
For the record, I think Diaz-GSP is far more compelling than Condit-GSP.
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I think this madness is more about peole feeling cheated out of a good fight than out of feeling like Diaz was robbed.
Yes, plenty of folk feel like that, but I’m not sure that they are more than those who feel that, while Diaz lost according to the rules, he didn’t get his fair shake in a ‘fight’ because Carlos didn’t ‘fight,’ in their minds—a total lack of understanding of the term fight-sport, but so it goes.
If you look clearly, there’s more people shitting on Carlos for “winning through shennanigans” than for outrightly being awarded a shit decision.
We live in a mad, mad world, mein freund.
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Yes, but those people who feel like Carlos didn’t ‘fight’ are mostly Diaz fans. It’s irrational. In my opinion.
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I don't think they are mostly Diaz fans.
They’re just fans.
I mean, this is from Marloes Coenen’s twitter:
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 1: Nick
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 2: Nick + bonus points for the talking.
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 3: Nick. Condit’s fighting strategy is so f+++cking annoying! I like men who fight like..men. Not ones who dance like Billy Elliot.
That pretty much encapsulates the very sentiment that a lot of people experienced after the fight—there’s no way that all of them are Diaz fans.
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shit, the quote got screwed. My bad.
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 1: Nick
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 2: Nick + bonus points for the talking.
MarloesCoenen @MarloesCoenen
Round 3: Nick. Condit’s fighting strategy is so f+++cking annoying! I like men who fight like..men. Not ones who dance like Billy Elliot.
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Yes, because silly gender stereotyping in tweets lends a world of credibility. I think its very clear, especially using Bloody Elbow as a sample size (read as: one of the, if not the most popular MMA site on the internet) that the majority of people who are not Nick Diaz fans don’t agree with the sentiment that it was, apparently, womenly fighting.
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That being said, this is a never-ending vortex. I respect your opinion too much to carry this on.
I think Nick is a little whiner who will never learn. I don’t really care for Condit one bit, but that’s neither here nor there. This fight shouldn’t happen and I don’t think it will.
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never seen a UD....
contested to the point where people started talking about a immediate rematch, i’ve seen the fight twice, once on mute, scored both times for condit. taunting doesn’t earn you points in the cage, it might in stockton, and that’s what people wanted, a phone booth brawl.
Machida-Shogun, Penn-Edgar.
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by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Carlos would be stupid to take this immediate rematch
Why would he give Diaz a shot at immediate rematch? Do you actually think Diaz would do the same if they would’ve given Diaz the win? You’d be nuts if you believe that. Condit needs to get paid and a GSP fight (win or lose) will be a huge payday. Condit would have alot to lose if he were to take it and then lose, whereas Diaz is making $200k for a loss!
Diaz has to go fight some of the tough guys Condit made it through. Let’s see if he can get through wrestlers and guys that actually have some great multi-dimensional skills other than the bums he’s been fighting over at Strikefarce.
Why would Carlos burn bridges on a money fight when Joe Silva is telling him "Do it"?
It’s a pretty fucked up and unfair position, but he gotta do what his bosses tell him to do.
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Burn bridges?
This is the whole reason they say, “I have to talk to my management.” They don’t say, “I have to see what Joe Silva and DW want me to do.”. By DW bringing it up, it is a complete smack in the face of Condit. I guarantee you DW wouldn’t be bringing it up if Diaz won. Dana is basically giving away his urge to see big payday with GSP vs Diaz. Dana said Carlos would have to really want to and I see no sane reason he’d want to give this dope head another shot when Diaz clearly admitted he got paid too much for the fight.
Hell, if Dana says…we’ll pay you 1/2 million to do the fight…then fine, I guess I could understand him doing it. But, this guy only made $100k because of his win bonus, so don’t act like he’s burning bridges if he doesn’t take this fight. He said he may fight again before GSP, but nothing makes sense to do the rematch when you have other contenders and Diaz hasn’t done anything in the UFC (yes i’m including a weak Penn) to prove he’s worthy at yet another shot for title.
I can assure you that Condit will say "Yes" the moment the fight is offered.
His manager already put it out in a public forum that Condit is willing to defend the title. Why wouldn’t he take the fight with Nick? B/c it is unfair?
If Diaz comes back, he gets his rematch…unless he chooses Koscheck, in which case, okay.
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Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Where's the option for
“No. Condit won convincingly and Nick Diaz is a child.”
by deathbydegrees20 on Feb 6, 2012 1:41 PM EST reply actions 13 recs
In Stupidville.
It's that the world is basically a forced labor camp from which the workers, perfectly innocent, are led forth by lottery, a few each day, to be executed.
I don't think that's just the way I see it. I think that's the way it is. Are there alternative views? Yes. Will any of them stand close scrutiny? No.
by memitim on Feb 6, 2012 2:31 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
it will be the same outcome...
2nd time around, thing is, diaz boys fail to adapt and evolve, having sheilds in their camp all these years, it was pitiful to watch nate get tossed around like a body pillow. the whole of the UFC WW division is aware of nick’s ridiculous boxing skills, and his ability to pressure with volume punches.
i can say this with confidence, no one will play the brawling game with him, even guys like ellenberger knowing what happened to daley, people will always exploit their weaknesses. when someone is so many levels above you, there is no point in trying, its a lost cause. the only WW’s in UFC who can beat nick are one’s who use footwork like carlos, or straight wrestlers.
by carmine99 on Feb 6, 2012 1:44 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
For all the people so loudly bitching against the rematch, 57% already on this little bubble of ours in the internet already voted "YUS."
Kinda laughable, but it only makes me sure of one thing: if anybody can convince Nick to take back his tantrum, the fight is on.
Now bitch on that, playboys!
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Draft #: 69--The magic number.
one reason ppl vote yes is that the implied alternative is no fight at all(just wait for GSP). given the options of fight and no fight 57% is very WEAK!!
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by Hardy's in your face on Feb 6, 2012 3:12 PM EST up reply actions
That's not how stats operate.
57-58 is STRONG. More than half of the people who bothered to vote want that fight bad (“YUS”)—and that is not acounting for the other small number (4%) that want it but assume Diaz is gone, which would set the total amount who do want it over 60%.
That should tell you all you need to know.
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Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Yeah, and apparently I am not the only one that didn't vote because our option wasn't up there
If there was one for “No, Diaz lost his shot and the division is pretty stacked, let Condit fight another contender in the interim and Diaz can work his way back up” I would have bothered to register my opinion.
El Santo inspired me to be a submission grappler.
...my knee jerks and kicks a strawman right in the junk. :(
exactly
the rematch will be the same as saturday night, only easier for Condit. He will start off sooner, and will beat Nick even more convincingly.
Unless Nick would be prepared to gameplan for the rematch to take place mostly on the ground, I don’t see a path to victory for him against Condit. He can make adjustments to cut off the cage more effectively, but I think Condit will adjust as well having a second camp for the same style. Nick’s path to victory in a rematch is takedown and work for submission.
I've been throwing spinning shit since 2008.
Condit would truck him in the rematch.
He’s just more versatile and it showed.
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idk about truck him..
cause I don’t see how you can truck anyone when your gameplan is to avoid the cage and throw leg kicks to wear him down (which didn’t slow him down at all).
He might win a more clear decision, but not truck him. I think Diaz would would adapt and cut him off better or work the ground game more. We’d just have to see if Condit made the better adjustments.
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend. Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig.
I dunno.
All Condit has to do is show up solid. Jeremy Jackson fucked Nick up real bad, and real quick. His chin is no better than back then. I’m sure Carlos got a boost in confidence from 25 minutes with the guy.
But yeah, a more clear decision would likely be how it would end looking like.
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???
That was in 2002 when Nick Diaz was like 19 or 20 years old and new to the sport. He then went on to fuck up Jeremy Jackson. Also, he took like 20 clean shots to the face when he was down before he was done..thats quite a chin.
Condit ain’t koing him with his gameplan of stick and move. Maybe he could catch him if he brawled, but chances are Diaz would win that fight no problem.
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend. Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig.
What I'm saying is that Condit does punch hard, and with a solid gameplan he can put Diaz to sleep.
And he showed that he can hang with the guy, he just elected to do so sporadically and in bursts.
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Draft #: 69--The magic number.
You could tell Condit was uncomfortable with Diaz’s style in the first few rounds. He didn’t like the taunting and constant pressure at all, and almost allowed himself to be bullied.
While Carlos was clearly tentative and afraid to engage at first, he adjusted and started getting more confident, especially in the fourth and fifth. If Diaz comes out fighting the exact same way in the rematch, Carlos will win again, and this time put a stamp on it.
guys are going to throw gameplans at nick...
just for the heck of it, and the fact that he refuses to use one, is it so wrong to even consider a gameplan ? lets face it, his style of fighting isn’t immune to certain attacks, there are obvious holes in his game, it will only improve his game further if he used some strategy, sometimes i think its time for nick to move away from cesar gracie and try other camps.
Nick can gameplan. But he just did so too late.
He should’ve forced the ground fight aspect of the whole thing sooner. But he didn’t, and it cost him.
In a rematch, I see Condit lighting him up way, way worse.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
i wouldn’t really call making small adjustments out of frustration proper gameplanning, its what guys like GSP and condit do, they go in with a purpose, besides did you see diaz’s corner ?
they sucked! only nate and the old guy saying he is winning rds, cesar gracie was nowhere to be seen, he deserves better than that.
So here's a question to everyone who is pissed and says Condit was running all night:
If you were in Condit’s position w/ all his skills and abilities, fighting for the UFC title, etc etc….. how would you approach Diaz?
anyone who is pissed about that is just upset the fight didn't live up to the hype
he had a great gameplan.
You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend. Those with loaded guns, and those who dig. You dig.
No, I completely agree
The absolute perfect gameplan to beat Diaz
What do you do if Diaz wins
Will we need a third ?
I’m not resting until I’m officially Anderson Silva status.- Jon "Bones" Jones
Listen to Diego on Ariel Helwani show right now LIVE
he’s saying some heart felt shit. it might sway my decision from picking ellenber.
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
Ellenberger*
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
yea now the interview is over
Diego was going through some dark times after his head got split open
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
Cesar bringing up greasing, they were pouring water on Condit
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
helwani really wants a rematch..
stirring the pot like no other.
lol I see, bringing up a date and everything, UFC on FOX 3 isn't a bad idea though
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
he also scored the fight for nick...
looks like nick finally stockton slapped some sense into him.
I don't want to hear from Jackson
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
choice words from cesar...
greg jackson is a disgrace, and the judges are incompetent. lolz
I want to see if Dave Herman comes on
He should slice through Stefan
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
looks like peewee won't show
"When you believe in something and you're a good person...things happen" - Junior Dos Santos
I want to like mmafighting
but the comment section makes it seem like it’s becoming Mania 2.
Yeah it's Planet fucking Zargon over there
firsT!@!!! stfu. areial I AM YUR BIGGEST FAN no wait U SUC K
Nick Diaz doesnt deserve a rematch
Im so sick of all these knee jerk rematches, Diaz lost fair and square and if i was Condit id tell him to go fuck himself and wait for GSP like Diaz/Cesar said he would.
This is just a lame attempt by DFW to lineup the more lucrative payday that is GSP vs Diaz and it makes me sick, Give Condit his dues and stop fucking him over everytime Diaz has a rant jesus.
BJ Penn and Shogun Rua fan for life.
Why isn't there an option for
No, but Condit should fight somebody else before GSP.
Now I've switched signature to this one.
by the guy with the big nose on Feb 6, 2012 3:28 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
…..Jesus Wept
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
by MattParker117 on Feb 6, 2012 3:42 PM EST up reply actions
And then shat his pants.
Condit wasn’t scared.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Lame but funny.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
didn't make it
and pretty much don’t agree with it, just though it was funny when I saw it
Now I've switched signature to this one.
by the guy with the big nose on Feb 7, 2012 7:43 AM EST up reply actions
For a guy that was scared
he sure fooled me after planting his shin In Diaz’ face a couple of times.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Feb 6, 2012 4:32 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, so scared that he drilled Diaz with over 150 strikes
There's no moral order at all. There's just this: can my violence conquer yours?
by ElliotMatheny on Feb 6, 2012 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
About the Rematch (Malki Kawa via MMA Fighting)
“At this point, [a rematch] is not something we’re looking to do,” he said. “We’re looking for Georges. People forget, Carlos waited a long time to get this fight. He was moved around, and shuffled around between fights. He won the fight. It doesn’t interest us at all. I think clearly and decisively, he won the fight. Even [UFC president] Dana [White] scored it for him. All of the opinions that matter scored Carlos as winner.”
Don’t blame Condit and his camp in the slightest
Don't follow in my footsteps I walk into walls
I just hope they don't wait for GSP and Condit takes a fight.
BECW season 2 member of the Intellegent Northern English Picking Team.
Draft number: 72.
by Sweet Scientist on Feb 6, 2012 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
He'll take the fight.
They’ll just dangle an even bigger carrot on the poor guy.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
"All of the opinions that matter"
Those are the operative words right there. GG diaz, but you can go play with Kos now and make another easy 200k+.
Rematches need to happen when there is a significant doubt as to the validity of the first match:
Penn vs Edgar 2. Maynard vs Edgar 3. Shogun vs Machida 2.
Diaz vs Condit, MMA robbery of the century
Or when people disagree enough that they'd pay for a second do-over.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
i dont see how diaz succeeds...
in a 2nd try, unless he comes up with a more varied attack, people have figured him out, and will always take his game away from him whether he likes it or not.
Poll selection was weak sauce
No immediate rematch.The fight wasn’t that controversial to warrant one. It was an UD and a solid one at that. Yeah it reminded me of Edgar sticking and moving on BJ Penn which to me just shows it is a valid and tested approach. It was on Nick to adapt to Condit’s game in rds 3 and 4 once Carlos adjusted to Nicks forward movement. Condit had the reach and the cardio to keep his head right with his ring awareness constant. He didn’t allow himself to be cut off and cornered and subsequently pummeled to the body.
Carlos fought a good fight and beat Nick and he earned his shot at GSP. Plus he got a Harley. So good for Condit.
Here is a rule of thumb from Chinese martial arts: Hard strikes soft, soft strikes hard. In other words - use hard weapons (fists, albows, knees, fingertips) on soft targets like muscles, torso, eyes etc. Use soft weapons (palm, sole of the foot) to strike hard targets like the head, elbows and knees, and other bony surfaces.
Why was the poll selection weak sauce?
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
Proud Member of INEPT: 80% More IntellEgent than y'all, WANKERZ.
Draft #: 69--The magic number.
Because there's no option for "No rematch, have Condit fight someone else before GSP."
And then God created Saturn ... and he liked it, so he put a ring on it. ... Always a ninja
SaberCats Examiner | SB Nation Bay Area | Niners Nation | Twitter
in the most subtle way...
the poll was intended to nudge ppl towards a rematch.
I think you summed it up
When you said “A truly great fighter would’ve been able to respond in cage.” Exactly!!!!!!! and Diaz couldn’t do that. Not at all. Even after Condit used basically the same tactic for 5 rounds. Condit won that fight fair and square, and it wasn’t exciting enough according to many people, a rematch isn’t happening anytime soon
I don’t understand why people get so riled up about dana’s hypothetical situations. There’s a very good chance that these comments are going to look as stupid as all the one where everyone got their panties in a bunch over Hendo/Jones. The WW division is in a crazy state of flux and uncertainty, there’s no use in getting this riled up over a hypothetical.
i wish gsp would have walked into that octagon grabbed the mic
and demanded to fight diaz first as a warmup to condit
thats the fight people want to see anyhow
condit can wait with his fake belt
by AnotherBadPrediction on Feb 6, 2012 5:01 PM EST reply actions
did cain do that ?
or any other dominant champ ? you fading GSP with this tune up fight B.S, the way these 2 fought, GSP dont need to be 100% to whip em.
Lame
no one wants to see someone run away to 5 rounds.. besides Diaz doesnt do MMA anymore
a rematch. seriously. are we f*cking crazy? diaz lost. UNANIMOUS decision. you lost dude. get over it. the world isn’t out to get you. you just lost. you want condit? you want GSP? TAKE A NUMBER, like everyone else. and cesar: you have no balls. take some responsibility. train your fighter better. you have some talented guys at your gym but STFU.
I'm also against a rematch
but to vindicate that with “it was a unanimous decision” is weak, we all know the state of judging in MMA, I’m not saying the judges screwed up this time, still the argument in itself is not enough, how many “clear” decisions have we seen, where you just were flabbergasted. Besides the fight was close enough to at least understand the notion of a rematch.
I vote "NO", Diaz doesn't deserve another immediate shot.
Diaz has had more than his chance….and yet Diaz is his own worst enemy. He was supposed to get the title shot right out of the gate but he screwed that up by no-showing the press conferences.
I know I’m in the minority, but I want Condit to rematch either Juggernaut or MacDonald…
"If Tyson Griffin was a girl, I would say he has a badonkadonk." -Joe Rogan
I'm a biggest Diaz fan here
But he has to work his way back up. No matter how close people thought the decision was, the welterweight division is full of contenders (Ellenberger, Hendricks, Rory Mac down the line) that he should have to fight tough fighters and build himself back up.
Personally, I would like to see Condit vs. Hendricks (fresh match up if GSP isn’t ready) and Diaz fight another good welterweight coming off a loss. I would say Rick Story or Mike Pierce if those guys aren’t fighting each other. Unless the UFC wants to give him a fight he could just get an easy win and look good doing it. If that’s the case, I’d give him Ludwig or Hardy, but they really shouldn’t go this route. If we’re going to ignore the winners with winners and losers with losers thing, then give him Thiago Alves.
I'm a Condit fan,
and thought he clearly won, though it was obviously a close fight overall. But I’m not real excited to see him rematch Jake Ellenberger, and no one else really stands out to me. So I’d be down to see this again. I thought Nick looked pretty bad, and could clearly do better, and honestly I LOVE rematches between guys at the height of their power. I know I’m in the minority there, but you can learn a lot by seeing how people approach fighting someone they now know well.
What's this war in the heart of nature? Why does nature vie with itself? The land contend with the sea? Is there an avenging power in nature? Not one power, but two?
by Kwisatz Haderach on Feb 7, 2012 12:23 AM EST reply actions
Absurdity abounds
Setting, winter, 1945, Ardenne forest, France:
defeated German division: wait, before I surrender I think you guys should go back to your position in the forest and we should redo this battle so I have a chance to adjust to your tactics. Just leave Foy and go back, I need a few more months to prepare.
U.S. vistorious division: oh, ok, sure. Pack it up fellas, let’s do this again . They need a little more time, we’ll come at them the EXACT same way in a few months.
Yes, this is as absurd as the suggestion that a rematch is needed because Diaz needs a few more months to prepare. Unbelievable. What the hell Kid Nate? Where you gone?
If I could come back, and do it all over again. I'd ask God to make me a Pittsburgh Steeler - Jack Lambert
The Fight Was Very Close
Regardless of our individual opinions on who should have walked away with the decision, this was a very close fight that could have easily gone either way. I personally had the fight scored for Diaz 1,2,5. The fight metric scores showing Condit outlanding Diaz was heavily skewed by the leg kicks Carlos threw. Nick outlanded Condit in shots to the head and body, had a near submission, and was clearly the aggressor. It was a great fight and would no doubt be a great rematch. I don’t think it makes sense to have Carlos sit for 9 months “maybe more” with the interim title. If he was going to fight again it wouldn’t make sense for him to fight anyone besides Diaz in a rematch. Of course the Condit camp isn’t going to be calling for a rematch, there isn’t much for Carlos to gain and a lot to lose. Why wouldn’t we as fans want to see a great rematch?
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