Video: UFC's Dana White Responds To Call For An MMA Bill Of Rights
by Nate Wilcox on Feb 23, 2012 5:00 PM EST
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Yesterday at Nick Diaz' preliminary hearing in front of the Nevada State Athletic Commission, the Culinary Workers Union Local 226 called on the NSAC to adopt a "Bill Of Rights" for professional Mixed Martial Artists. Their full press release is after the jump.
The Culinary Workers have been trying to organize employees of Station Casinos, owned by the Fertitta Brothers who are the majority owners of the UFC, for a long time. In 2010 the U.S. Government issued a labor law complaint against Station.
It was also the Culinary Workers Union who requested that the FTC investigate Zuffa and the UFC for monopolistic practices after the purchase of Strikeforce. They've also been involved in the opposition to getting MMA sanctioned in New York state. And they've launched a bunch of web sites attacking White and the UFC.
Here are the key bullet points from the Culinary Workers' release outlining what they feel are the exploitative conditions of the modern MMA industry:
- Long-term , exclusivity contracts that bind athletes to a single promoter, in some cases indefinitely. These contracts make it more difficult for athletes to negotiate higher pay and diminish the incentive of smaller promoters to bid for talented fighters
- Limited control over image and likeness rights. Professional mixed-martial arts fighters must frequently forfeit future revenue streams from DVD sales, video games, clothing and other merchandise, even after retirement.
- Lack of financial transparency. Under the federal Muhammad Ali Boxing Reform Act (Ali Act), business promoters are required to make extensive financial disclosures to state athletic commissions. No such requirements govern MMA. As a result, fighters often have to negotiate in the dark and are unsure if they are being compensated fairly.
MMA Fighting's Ariel Helwani spoke to Dana White in Japan and got him to respond to the culinary union. Video of that interview is after the jump. Here's what Dana had to say about the Culinary Workers' and the Muhammad Ali Act:
The Muhammad Ali Act was put in place so that athletic commissions could have more control over sanctioning bodies, corruption, and a list of other things. There is no corruption, there's no sanctioning organizations in MMA. It's a bunch of dorks who have no idea what they're talking about.
The fact that they're spending the culinary workers dues to mess with an MMA organization that brings a lot of money into your state. You guys are old-school gangsters.
So far the Culinary Workers' efforts have been little more than a nuisance for White, Zuffa and the Fertittas, but if their call for a Muhammad Ali Act type of law to be passed covering MMA gain traction, that would dramatically impact the way the UFC does business.
The following is a press release from the Culinary Workers Union:
Culinary Workers Union, Local 226 calls on the Nevada Athletic Commission to adopt a "Bill of Rights" for professional mixed-martial arts athletes
Las Vegas, NV -- Today, the Culinary Workers Union, Local 226 called on the Nevada Athletic Commission to adopt and enforce a "Bill of Rights for Professional Mixed-Martial Artists," as a vital step toward protecting these athletes from abusive business practices and coercive contracts.
"Many athletes who compete in the sport of mixed-martial arts are subject to coercive contracts and exploitative business practices that are not allowed in professional boxing," said Chris Serres, a research analyst with the Culinary Workers Union, Local 226, an affiliate of UNITE HERE. "We call on the Nevada Athletic Commission to take a leadership role and push for the adoption of this `Bill of Rights" in every state where it is currently legal to hold mixed-martial arts events. If adopted and enforced, these ten rights would change the sport's most egregious business practices."
In testimony today before the Nevada Athletic Commission, the Culinary Workers Union, Local 226 outlined the following exploitative business practices in the sport of mixed-martial arts:
· Long-term , exclusivity contracts that bind athletes to a single promoter, in some cases indefinitely. These contracts make it more difficult for athletes to negotiate higher pay and diminish the incentive of smaller promoters to bid for talented fighters
· Limited control over image and likeness rights. Professional mixed-martial arts fighters must frequently forfeit future revenue streams from DVD sales, video games, clothing and other merchandise, even after retirement.
· Lack of financial transparency. Under the federal Muhammad Ali Boxing Reform Act (Ali Act), business promoters are required to make extensive financial disclosures to state athletic commissions. No such requirements govern MMA. As a result, fighters often have to negotiate in the dark and are unsure if they are being compensated fairly.
The "Bill of Rights for Professional Mixed Martial Artists" would grant mixed-martial artists similar protections currently afforded to professional boxers, who are already protected by a boxers' Bill of Rights and the Ali Act. "There is no compelling reason why boxers are protected from exploitation, while mixed-martial arts athletes are not," Serres said.
The Bill of Rights was inspired by conversations the Culinary Workers Union Local 226 has had with more than 50 mixed-martial arts athletes, and their agents, across North America.
The Culinary Union's testimony before the Nevada Athletic Commission is available online: http://www.scribd.com/doc/
A copy of the "Bill of Rights for Professional Mixed Martial Artists" is also available online: http://www.scribd.com/doc/
The Culinary Workers Union Local 226 is Nevada's largest union with 55,000 members. It is an affiliate of UNITE HERE, which represents 250,000 stadium, food service, hotel, airport and gaming workers in North America.
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This shit has always confused me
is the Culinary Workers Union just a name or is it actually a union for Culinary workers? Because why the fuck do they care about what’s going on with the UFC.
It’s actually a union. They believe that the Fertittas have effectively blocked unionization of culinary workers in their casinos in Nevada, and are going after MMA to gain leverage on that front. Seriously.
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Thanks for all the answers everybody
This makes a lot more sense now. It’s kind of fucked up on both sides though but it’s almost like the union is trying to blackmail the Feritatas. “We will fuck with your other business if you don’t let us unionize”.
Almost?
That’s exactly what its like.
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by halitosis on Feb 23, 2012 5:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 6 recs
You're right
I haven’t had my coffee for the day yet and i’m completely out of it right now.
A lot of unions these days are doing far more than they should, why are you putting my union dues(which I have to paid for some jobs) on things that have nothing to do with my job? Why is money go to x,y or z pol that I don’t even support. Why do I have to go on strike and screw up my life when I am fine with the wages or whatever is the issue?
I am free because I choose to be so-Me
It's a sad world
When gangsters are the only ones fighting for worker’s rights. It’s an even sadder world where we don’t appreciate the effort.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 12:43 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
What?
The union is not all about me?
by IronMonkey13 on Feb 24, 2012 2:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
"and are going after MMA to gain leverage on that front."
It boggles my mind how anyone in the leadership of that union would think messing with a COMPLETELY UNRELATED (both in concept and financially) business would give them any sort of leverage against Station Casinos. It’s so dumb it blows my mind. How are the union members not opposing this misuse of their dues? Even if their efforts had a negative effect on Zuffa’s business (which they don’t), the Fertittas are BILLIONAIRE BUSINESSMEN. They run Station Casinos ENTIRELY separate from Zuffa. What happens to one has absolutely nothing to do with the other.
entirely seprate
except the fundamental mission statements of both UFC and Station Casinos is to make the Fertitta Brothers personally as much money as possible.
Other than that. Completely unrelated.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
In terms of pressure against Zuffa, LLC having any influence whatsoever on the way Station Casinos Inc. operates, they are entirely separate.
By completely separate I mean that they don’t share revenue streams, they don’t have any contracts with one another, and they’re involved in completely different industries (one is a sports organization, the other is a gaming company). In the case of the union dispute, the fact they are owned by the same people should be immaterial, form a practical point of view.
Y'know
Always wondered if there’s betting on mma in station casinos
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 12:45 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm pretty sure there's not
I vaguely remember reading somewhere Lorenzo maybe saying that they don’t have MMA betting because they don’t want anyone to get the impression that fights could be fixed because of it.
I'm the best ever. You're the most average in a minute.
by slapjaw ackrite on Feb 24, 2012 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
Mate...
Your right arm and your left arm are seemingly quite independent. But if I armbar your left arm, your whole self has to submit. Get it?
Somebody needs to write a "bill of rights" for the union members
specifically stating that any misuse of union funds for a cause unrelated to the union should come out of the salary, savings, retirement, and pension accounts of all the board members and decision makers of the union. Not the paying members but the people that run the actual union.
"Your majesty, Lord Cro Cop" - Pat Barry
As I understand it (I’m sure someone else could explain it better), they’re a union that’s pissed because the Fertitta casinos don’t have unions for their workers, and they’re attacking the UFC as a way to get at the Fertittas.
I'd rather be trollin'.
Agreed. Unless the government starts paying attention and starts putting into place...
… a lot of the things that the BE fans are calling for. Essentially the things that ensure better employment contracts for fighters.
it's a union that's pissed at Fertitta's
for not letting their casinos unionize.
"I like a man who grins when he fights" - Winston Churchill
"Progress lies not in enhancing what is, but in advancing toward what will be." - Kahlil Gibran
by merryprankster on Feb 23, 2012 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
obviously the culinary union is trying to use mma athletes for their own benefit BUT there are some valid points EVERYONE on the planet (except Dana White) has to admit it’s BS that a fighter has to give up the rights to their own likeness
Agreed
I hate it when people I dislike have a good point.
by discoandherpes on Feb 23, 2012 6:30 PM EST up reply actions
This Culinary Union needs to mind their own business
This isnt their turf. Even if they bring up legit points i still find it wrong how they are going after the ufc. This union going after the fertittas in this way is more unethical in my book than how the ufc treat their fighters.
yup
These people feel so entitled
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by halitosis on Feb 23, 2012 5:24 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I don't think they honestly care about the fighters
That said if the fighters are benefited in the long run, I can’t really bitch too much.
by discoandherpes on Feb 23, 2012 6:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Daily double?
That’s twice I’ve seen it from you Disc&Herp.
The ends may justify the means to some extent, but the fact that this is their means is pretty ridiculous. So once they spend their union money to push this forward, what end benefit comes back to the Culinary Union other than having made Zuffa (and the wider MMA fighter employing world) have to change their standards?
Firm supporter of performance enhancing facial hair - see Fitch v. Hendricks.
"I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault." - Jack Tatum
This won’t change anything about Zuffa. That’s what’s so stupid. And even IF they did get Zuffa to change their business practices, they’ll still have failed to unionize the Station Casinos workers, which is the entire point of all this. They could run Zuffa into the ground and nothing would change at Station.
I think they're trying
To turn it into a game of chicken by threatening the Fertittas’ most potentially lucrative asset. This has nothing to do with the fighters or even the workers they’re trying to unionize. I don’t think they really understand the game they’re trying to play, though – it’s so over-the-top and politically motivated that it doesn’t work as a proxy war.
Proud member of The Voices in Paul Harris' Head, BECW Season 2.
"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
by Patrick Wyman on Feb 23, 2012 6:54 PM EST up reply actions
That's what I figured
I just had to run it by you folks to make sure I was actually reading their stupidity right and not adding my own. I’m just amazed at how blatantly stupid it is. If this creates ripples down the line and at all messes with my MMA, I’mna be more than mildly bent at a few line cooks and bussers.
I figured I was missing something.
Firm supporter of performance enhancing facial hair - see Fitch v. Hendricks.
"I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault." - Jack Tatum
Here's my guess
As to how this got started. Culinary union wants to expand into Fertitta-owned casinos, they don’t want it to happen, and the union hires some low-rent or middle-of-the-road lobbyists, who suggest this course of action. It bears initial dividends (FTC investigation), and then falls flat, having wasted a ton of time and money. Things like this bill of rights are a much more subtle and promising strategy, but it’s too late in the game for this now. Side note – I wouldn’t be too mad at the unionized employees; be mad at the representatives they’ve elected (who aren’t even serving their interests) and the strategists they’ve hired.
Proud member of The Voices in Paul Harris' Head, BECW Season 2.
"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
by Patrick Wyman on Feb 23, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Almost
Station casino employees used to be unionized. Slowly they got weeded out by borderline unethical practices (incentivizing, firing ringleaders etc). At some point the union was enraged and a bitter feud began. Ever wonder why mma is illegal in ny?
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 12:52 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wow
That puts a slightly different spin on things. I wouldn’t want to get drawn into any sort of competition with the Fertittas.
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"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
by Patrick Wyman on Feb 24, 2012 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
I would
You just have to be more competitive. Make it too hard for your enemy to continue. Scorched Earth Policy. Keyser Söze
LETS MUTHERFUKERS!!!!!
by Andy Anderson on Feb 24, 2012 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
Hahaha
As much as I love the Usual Suspects, I’m not sure Keyser Soze translates real well as a business model. You’re probably right, though – to compete with the Fertittas you’d have to be willing to go there.
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"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
by Patrick Wyman on Feb 24, 2012 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
Guys.
Bottom line, we don’t know if the strategy will be ultimately seen as stupid or brilliant. Everything is 20-20 hindsight. CWU thinks it can strongarm the Fertittas into allowing unionisation at Station Casinos if it keeps creating issues on the UFC front. I personally don’t think it is likely to succeed. But who the hell knows? Stranger things have happened, and unions have at times proven to be quite powerful.
That's why I said "potentially"
There’s a ceiling on the performance of Station Casinos, largely because of the facilities themselves and the niche markets to which they cater (locals in Vegas, e.g.). If the UFC continues to expand at anything like its present rate of growth, it’ll blow Station’s revenues out of the water before too long, particularly with the decline in casino profits during the economic downturn.
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"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
by Patrick Wyman on Feb 23, 2012 7:52 PM EST up reply actions
You know, I agree with some of their points, but
the Culinary Union is not doing any good in being an advocate here. Their agenda is so transparent and so totally unrelated to helping MMA fighters it completely undermines anything they might have to say about it.
It’s a shame too, since the forfeiture of likeness rights is legit shady as hell.
This sums it up for me.
They do have a couple good points but their dual stance of opposing MMA in New York and now supposedly standing up for fighter’s rights in Nevada kills everything. It means they have no credibility what so ever on this issue and in fact they should be ashamed of themselves for parading in front of the Nevada State Athletic Commission and using that platform to flat out lie about their true intentions. Acting like they are standing up for fighter’s rights when it’s obvious that is not what they are doing. This Bill of Rights is quite simply a tool to them to hurt the UFC’s business model. Nothing more… helping fighters is not what this is about to them.
Just BE.
True but...
A court or similar entity should not be guessing at the motivations behind the action. They should actually be assessing each action/case on its own merits. Therefore theoretically it shouldn’t matter who brings the action or what their real motivation is. If they have a fair case, it should be heard and judged fairly. So… if the CWU has a reasonably decent argument, there is no reason why a court or similar entity should not consider it. I of course make no statement here about whether the CWU argument is reasonable or not.
I do agree that the lifetime rights deal is absurd
It should be like any other rights deal where it ends when you leave the promotion. EA can’t use Jerry Rice’s name because he played in the NFL at some point.
Are the union rank and file not upset with this?
Shouldn’t the union be spending their money helping out culinary workers and not trying to improve the lives MMA fighters?
GSP is an alien sent here to humiliate our men and mate with our women
Yup.
It drives me crazy when things occur in this world that are this overtly stupid. They’re basically taking the union dues and flushing them down the toilet. Station Casinos won’t unionize, and nothing that happens to Zuffa will do anything to change that. If it’s merely being done out of spite, then that makes more sense, but it’s still pointless.
The most pointless thing
is that the station casino employees are not asking to unionize. So its not like they are getting paid less or treated unfairly… As a person who lives in Vegas I have never seen station casino’s employees picketing or anything. The union just wants more $$$$$ from gaining all those memberships.
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Wait, so those are Culinary Union picketers and not Station employees? Not trying to be a smartass, just don’t have a ton of background knowledge about unions.
Waddoups explained that the union had pretty much “locked up the Strip” with some exceptions, and has turned its attention to the locals market. “If a union is going to have more power economically, they are going to have to be successful with organizing the neighborhood casinos,” he said.
Thats basically what it all comes down to. No more money to be made at the “touristy” casinos so now they are trying to snatch the local favored casinos. Up until the recession they didnt really care about the station casinos but now their income has slowed down they are trying to unionize the 13kish employees that work for stations.
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Yes but it could be a bigger game
Sending a signal to other casinos for example. “try to de-unionise and we will attack your other assets”. I.e. a pre-emptive strike in the broader market
Just to be clear
I am generally anti union. I support the right of companies to choose union or non union labour. But, where a union behaves intelligently and works with management to increase value to the company as well as for workers, I have no problem with unions.
The union is doing this to make more money
If they can pick up Station Casino’s workers, which is something like 10,000+, under the union they will be getting union dues from all those workers. You’re talking about $5,000,000 per year (conservatively) in dues, probably more.
Also I don’t think the Union gives a shit about the MMA fighters since they wouldn’t get anything from them. They aren’t going to set up a fighters union for them, even if they get Station Casino’s workers in the union. Simply they are trying to black male the Fertitas through the UFC to get to the Station Casino employees and turn them into due paying members and it’s complete bullshit.
"Your majesty, Lord Cro Cop" - Pat Barry
Lol at "black male"
Thanks buddy you cheered me up a bit :)
hahah!
I guess that is what I get for having sushi and beer for lunch!
"Your majesty, Lord Cro Cop" - Pat Barry
Sushi? Were you at a Filipino restaurant?
Floyd tells me that Filipinos like to make Sushi…
That would have tied in nicely
I was going to make a comment (in my reply to you) about my amazing grammar mistake and Floyd Mayweather being…. well, a black male….
"Your majesty, Lord Cro Cop" - Pat Barry
The likeness thing is a very legitimate concern
I feel most of the CWU points don’t stand up to closer scrutiny, but something like Fitch being on the outs with Zuffa for refusing to sing over his likeness rights is plain wrong.
...he also sends me messages saying "Prepare your soul, only god and jiu jitsu can save you and god isn’t listening". -Patrick Tenney
It was a brilliant business move in that they actually pulled it off, but it is absolutely crappy for fighters. On the other hand, we’ve all seen how non-UFC video games perform in the marketplace. :)
yeah bro, smiley face for all the fighters not receiving royalties for their likeness useage. UFC is teh bestest, no matter what it does
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
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by The Lethal Haze on Feb 23, 2012 5:52 PM EST up reply actions
You clearly misunderstood. From a pure business standpoint, you want to get the most from your workers with the least amount of investment. To this end, obtaining lifetime likeness rights to a fighter by them merely signing a basic contract is brilliant. From an ethical standpoint, it is wrong and very bad for the fighters. I think it’s terrible that fighters have to sign away their likeness rights, but I respect the business thinking behind it. Zuffa’s ironclad contracts are very well devised, but they’re also absolutely imbalanced. I’m not on one side or the other; the athletes don’t have to be UFC fighters, and the UFC doesn’t have to make ridiculous demands like this. There’s free will to choose on both sides though, you can’t look at the fighters as helpless victims; they are able to read the contract before they sign it.
If the fact that the fighter’s don’t have to fight in the UFC is enough for people like you to dismiss any and all Zuffa malfeasance in contract negotiations, more power to Zuffa. But if you ask me where my loyalties lie, I’ll tell you over and over its with the fighters. Without the fighters, the UFC ain’t nothin but a good idea. I don’t watch the UFC to watch Zuffa business brilliance, I watch it to watch fighters fight.
Zuffa is able to make all those ridiculous demands because there is effectively no opposition to them in the marketplace.
I think the bigger problem is that in America, “screwing over your employees the most that you can get away with” is considered a brilliant business move. That’s a sad state of affairs.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Feb 23, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions
I didn’t dismiss it, I openly recognize the malfeasance in contract negotiations. It sounds like you just want me to vilify them for their business practices, which I just don’t feel compelled to do. Sorry. Objectively, it is smart business. Subjectively, it’s unethical and coercive. I didn’t say it was “good business.”
As far as my “loyalty” goes, do I wish that struggling fighters had more favorable contracts at the expense of the Zuffa brass who are already financially set for life? Of course I do, but my opinion does nothing to change the reality of the situation. Only the government has such power, and they’re done looking into Zuffa for now.
reread what you wrote
You dismissed the malfeasance with this statement:
the athletes don’t have to be UFC fighters, and the UFC doesn’t have to make ridiculous demands like this. There’s free will to choose on both sides though, you can’t look at the fighters as helpless victims; they are able to read the contract before they sign it.
I figured you to be a UFC apologist (cause alot of people on this site are), but after reading your subsequent posts I don’t think you’re a danabot in the style of Subo (lets say). My bad for coming on so strong.
My original objection was that you seemed to make a value judgment on Zuffa not paying royalties for using likeness rights- that this was a good thing. Its not. I’m not asking you to vilify Zuffa, I was trying to illustrate the absurdity of celebrating the UFC’s exploitation of their workers.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Feb 23, 2012 6:41 PM EST up reply actions
I did dismiss it with that language, you're right.
Hopefully as the UFC gains more exposure there will be enough scrutiny about these sorts of things to force a change. I just don’t see it happening right now. You’re not the first to see me as a “dana-bot” though; perhaps I need to examine how I discuss these issues. We don’t need another Subo :)
same as the nfl, fighters and players dont make the sport, the hype machine and marketing department does
you will always have talented athletes to fill your team, or octogon with
if they let colquitt walk im going to kick someone
Team Colquitt
It's not
The sports model for the nfl is completely different. I don’t watch football, but even I know that the comparisson falls short.
Your argument would make sense if the fighter’s camps were making direct revenue from the fights, paying a unionized stable of fighters, and also paying licensing to the UFC.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 1:07 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Labor politics are so much fun
Adopting even one of the three recommended changes listed in this article (not the full version of the “Bill”) would erase the UFC’s business model, which is exactly what the Culinary Union wants. They’d sooner see the UFC destroyed than the fighters benefit at all, and that should be taken into account here.
Proud member of The Voices in Paul Harris' Head, BECW Season 2.
"By doubting we come to inquiry and by inquiry we perceive the truth." -- Abelard
"You guys are old-school gangsters."
Dana would certainly know old-school gangsters when he sees them due to his long association with the Fertittas.
Really?
Your last two comments, this one on the 23rd and your last one on the 12th, are both about the Fertittas being gangsters. I could give a shit what their grandparents did. It’s pretty clear that this isn’t like the Yakuza running Pride, so why keep taking shots at them?
INEPT coming for the season 2 BECW title.
"Believe me I have my own demon in my had. People has no idea how dark I am in my head sometime. Nick Diaz deserves to be beat down."- Georges St Pierre
Follow me on Twitter if you like MMA, baseball, and moderately funny people: @TimBernier31
Fertittas’ great grandparents may have been in a mob=Dana is a mobster or works with mobsters. Okay.
INEPT coming for the season 2 BECW title.
"Believe me I have my own demon in my had. People has no idea how dark I am in my head sometime. Nick Diaz deserves to be beat down."- Georges St Pierre
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by Tim Bernier on Feb 23, 2012 9:01 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Legitimate billionaire businessmen whose fortune came from their mob grandfather. Still as Balzac said “behind every great fortune there is a great crime”.
I noticed you didn’t say “they’re not legitimate businessmen.” The “mob-grandfather” barb does nothing to change the here and now.
Statute of Limitations.. ish.
If you trace most modern things back, there’s darkness in that chain somewhere. At what point do you stop taking it into account? Just a very slippery slope trying to judge someone by actions outside of their immediate control.
Of course they’ve benifitted from it and I think it’s plausible that they’re involved in less than clean things themselves, just because I’ve seen a lot of movies with casino owners that are jerks (or even James Bond villains?). That said, unless you’ve got proof.. eh.
Firm supporter of performance enhancing facial hair - see Fitch v. Hendricks.
"I like to believe that my best hits border on felonious assault." - Jack Tatum
If a mobster is successful enough
Then they will go legitimate. Less legal hassle. Hell look at the banking industry and what they get away with— pure gangster mentality but it’s all under the guise of legitimacy.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 1:12 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Legitimate billionaire businessmen whose fortune came from their mob grandfather.
And the point of pointing this out is… ?
"To me, the function and duty of a quality human being is the sincere and honest development of one's potential." - Bruce Lee
by Genki Sudo's Choreographer on Feb 24, 2012 12:08 PM EST up reply actions
The mob built Vegas, dude.
Anyone who owns casinos and hotels from that era has some sort of mob tie.
There's no moral order at all. There's just this: can my violence conquer yours?
by ElliotMatheny on Feb 24, 2012 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
It Sucks When It Happens to Dana It's business when he does it.
It is so ironic that Dana says he hates how certain groups behave against the UFC when from numerous accounts the UFC has behaved the same way to others. With Dana if it is happening to Zuffa or the UFC it is corrupt if he is the one doing it then it is just business.
Troy Macraft
Editor/Writer, The MMA Zone Blog
atleast the ufc actually go after businesses in or associated with mma
the culinary workers union have nothing to do with mma.
"Caol Uno was like Mutoh. He developed into a star overseas and then returned to his home country a much bigger deal. Dokonjonosuke Mishima is like Kobashi because they both do moonsaults. Don Frye is like Stan Hansen because they are both fat dumb rednecks with mustaches." - Jonathan Snowden
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by RagingNoodles on Feb 23, 2012 5:57 PM EST reply actions 7 recs
Whole situation is pretty annoying...
The unfortunate thing is that some of the things the CWU presents are legitimate concerns that need to be addressed, but the fact that they’re just doing this as part of their ridiculous anti-Zuffa campaign totally undermines those points.
They bring up some good points
but man this is getting annoying
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I don't agree with the Union's tactics or what they are trying to do
That said, all these points are valid. I would love to see them do away with champions clauses and total control of likeness rights.
Champion’s clauses are necessary for the UFC’s business model, but the likeness rights garbage needs to change.
Isn't the champion clause
Such that Zuffa have first right to negotiations at the end of a new contract? Can’t a champ just give up the belt and walk away at the end of his contract?
...he also sends me messages saying "Prepare your soul, only god and jiu jitsu can save you and god isn’t listening". -Patrick Tenney
It's a bit more restrictive than that I think.
From what I remember if you are a champion at the end of your contract, it automatically extends the contract for another fight. As a champion you can try to renegotiate compensation for the extension, but you’re still locked in with Zuffa; there’s no free agency under the champion’s clause. If you lose the title, you are subject to Zuffa’s exclusive negotiation period, and then once that passes you can choose to enter free agency. I could be wrong about some of the details, but that’s how I remember it. If you wanted to walk away as a champion you’d have to effectively “retire,” and if you did come back they’d still hold your contract.
don’t believe anything you read about zuffa’s champions clause because they have been able to give a new contract to every champion that they have had with an expiring contract, so we have no idea what it says.
The amount of internet ink that has been wasted on something that is never used boggles my mind.
I’ll admit I use to be worried about the UFC’s Champions clause as well but to my knowledge the UFC has never used it. They have always negotiated extensions with their champions before having to use it.
I was thinking that Scott Coker actually used it on Sarah Kaufmann when he was running Strikeforce though. I am still worried about Bellator’s use of those type of clauses though.
Total control of likeness rights is a big issue for me though. I just don’t think it’s a complete and total control of their likeness rights. Could we maybe get someone with exact understanding of the policy to explain the actual details of how the UFC’s and other MMA organization likeness rights policies work?
Just BE.
i love how dana uses....
helwani’s videos to give direct messages/rants to his detractors, he probably thinks a lot of people check out mmafighting.com, including floyd mayweather, that guy is too busy making paper planes with 100$ bills.
"you don't wanna turn your back on a Kongo" Rampage
No Offense, guys...
Okay, maybe SOME offense intended. Some of you sound willfully ignorant here.
You’re getting hung up on the union’s NAME? So do you get annoyed that the TEAMSTERS, don’t JUST represent workers who run merchandise with animal teams in wagons?
Sorry that there is no MMA Fighters Union, the one that hypothetically excludes pro kick boxers (because they belong in the kick boxers union, right? Do we need separate one for both Dutch and Thai?).
I actually don’t think unionizing an individual-based sport is terribly effective. I think minimum standards are better managed through Federal regulations in concert with promoters, agents, gyms, and individual fighters. So it may in fact be the case that the Culinary Union may simply have a beef with the UFC, but I can’t imagine getting a fair shake in Vegas is anything other than a cut-throat affair.
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."
Mohandas Gandhi
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses - behind the lines, in the gym, and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
Muhammad Ali
"If MMA is like dog fighting, those are some pretty fucking smart dogs."
"I don’t want to lick any butt."
GSP
pretty sure the station employees can unionize if they want to and choose not
¬_¬
by ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ on Feb 23, 2012 10:18 PM EST reply actions
Station casinos was unionized
The fertittas cleverly weeded them out by firing anybody with union ties/sympathy and rewarding those that didn’t.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 1:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Liable without a source
Source?
"To me, the function and duty of a quality human being is the sincere and honest development of one's potential." - Bruce Lee
by Genki Sudo's Choreographer on Feb 24, 2012 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
Oops
Good on you, station casinos was never unionized. The aforementioned tactics were used to prevent any organizing. I was misinformed.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 25, 2012 3:33 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
i think this is just to be an annoyance to the UFC
if station casinos unionizes, all of the problems with the culinary workers union will go away.
Maybe they should cook up a better scheme to get their way.
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I'm surprised how much everyone is siding with Zuffa
I mean yeah the UFC puts on awesome fights and has really revolutionized the sport of mma but the proposed bill of rights would literally take the sport to the next level of legitimacy.
Unions are the reason we have weekends. I’m sure back when there was plenty of talk about how these gangster union pigs only want to give workers ‘weekend holidays’ to line the gangster unions pockets, or how they should stick to what they know and stay out of the factory or workplace model… And yeah unions are incestuous and often times bloated beauraucratic that leech off of hard work, but they serve to buffer the workers from the biggest leeches around.
Zuffa didn’t invent mma. They didn’t invent modern mma. They have no monopoly on fighting, and it’s strange we’ve bought this idea that it’s healthy to pretend otherwise
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 1:36 AM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
For me in this case it’s about this union being incredibly stupid. I mean they can’t be actively fighting MMA in New York and hurting MMA fighters there while at the same time pretending to be standing up for those same MMA fighter’s rights in Nevada. It makes no sense and undermines any credibility they have.
Just BE.
they could not care less about fighting MMA
they are putting pressure on the fertitta family. if the fertitta boys owned a casino and a carwash, then the culinary workers union would be messing with their carwash business. they want station casinos to be unionized and they are hoping that applying pressure to their MMA business will work as a backdoor to that end. unionize station casinos and all of the drama with their MMA interests will suddenly go away. quite clever on the part of the culinary union.
Do you work in a Cotton Mill?
If not, Unions are decidely NOT the reason the rest of us have a weekend.
I smoke on the mic like Smokin' Joe Frazier
Ya no. Ever hear of 'labour day'?
A five-day work-week, mandatory minimum wages, and paid leave are all legacies of organized labor. So is Social Security, Medicare, and child labor laws. Without organized labor it is very possible none of these benefits for workers would exist.
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 9:35 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Thanks for citing wikipedia to me.
Publicly editable encyclopedias must be correct about non-hot button issues like the cost and benefits of the union movement. But I’m not gonna debate labor law and the history of the labor unions w/ you on an MMA site. I’ll note however that I am extremely thankful that I have a job that doesn’t mandate that I work 5 days or week, or even 40 hours a week.
I smoke on the mic like Smokin' Joe Frazier
No prob
Though it’s disingenuous to refuse to engage the facts presented but instead try and attack the credibility of the source. I’ll take a publicly reviewed encyclopedia over an anonymous opinion any time.
And again framing it as though unionized jobs mandate a limited time one must work is just flagrantly ignorant. Unionized jobs mandate extra compensation for work past the 40hr or 5 day work week.
Have you ever been a part of a union?
by Armleglegarm Head on Feb 24, 2012 8:12 PM EST up reply actions
What is ridiculous is that,
other than some handringing from bloggers (not so much on BE), they haven’t been able to affect Zuffa’s bottom line AT ALL.
If they actually could pull off the Mafia-like tactics, then it’d make sense as a use of dues. But their approach is so ham-fisted and inept that they are basically wasting their union members time and money.
It’s like if 5th graders try to extort businesses for protection money—not gonna work.
I smoke on the mic like Smokin' Joe Frazier
My whole issue with talk like this is that I don’t think that all these things, or even wholesale application of the Ali Act to MMA will actually be a positive gain for fighters.
These things will completely destroy Zuffa’s business model, as a result they will either take their ball and go home, which will suck, or they will turn into a boxing promotion, which will give the top guys a larger percentage of revenue, but will severely hamper the ways Zuffa can generate that revenue, and also totally fuck over everyone at the bottom.
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