USAT/SBN July 2011 MMA Consensus Rankings: Heavyweight
by Richard Wade on Jul 29, 2011 10:30 AM EDT
in MMA Rankings
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| Rank | Fighter | % | Promotion | Last Rank |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Cain Velasquez | 100 | UFC | 1 |
| 2 | Junior dos Santos | 95 | UFC | 2 |
| 3 | Alistair Overeem | 89 | Strikeforce | 3 |
| 4 | Brock Lesnar | 87 | UFC | 4 |
| 5 | Fabricio Werdum | 81 | Strikeforce | 5 |
| 6 | Antonio Silva | 80 | Strikeforce | 6 |
| 7 | Frank Mir | 74 | UFC | 7 |
| 8 | Shane Carwin | 72 | UFC | 8 |
| 9 | Fedor Emelianenko | 68 | M-1 Global / Strikeforce | 9 |
| 10 | Josh Barnett | 55 | Strikeforce | 10 |
| 11 | Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira | 43 | UFC | 11 |
| 12 | Brendan Schaub | 39 | UFC | 12 |
| 13 | Roy Nelson | 36 | UFC | 13 |
| 14 | Sergei Kharitonov | 33 | Strikeforce | 14 |
| 15 | Cheick Kongo | 30 | UFC | 15 |
| 16 | Travis Browne | 25 | UFC | 17 |
| 17 | Mike Russow | 24 | UFC | 16 |
| 17 | Cole Konrad | 24 | Bellator | 19 |
| 19 | Matt Mitrione | 23 | UFC | 23 |
| 20 | Daniel Cormier | 22 | Strikeforce | 21 |
| 21 | Ben Rothwell | 21 | UFC | 20 |
| 22 | Brett Rogers | 20 | Strikeforce | 18 |
| 23 | Stefan Struve | 16 | UFC | 24 |
| 24 | Pat Barry | 15 | UFC | 27 |
| 25 | Pedro Rizzo | 15 | Impact Fighting Championship | 22 |
#1 Cain Velasquez will defend his title against #2 Junior dos Santos at UFC 138 in one of those clear cut 1 vs. 2 matchups we're always clamoring for.
In a move seemingly designed to lose whatever good will he had left following an uninspired decision in over #5 Fabricio Werdum, #3 Alistair Overeem has dropped from the Strikeforce Heavyweight Grand Prix and his next fight won't be in the UFC or Strikeforce.
#20 Daniel Cormier will take Overeem's place in the Grand Prix and is scheduled to face off against #6 Antonio Silva in the semi-finals. On the other side of the bracket, #10 Josh Barnett will take on #14 Sergei Kharitonov.
And the most intriguing upcoming heavyweight bout will be this Saturday when #9 Fedor Emelianenko will try to get back in the Win column against light heavyweight Dan Henderson.
Based on the premise that all MMA rankings are subjective but that it’s still useful and informative to know who the online MMA community as a whole ranks as the best fighters in MMA, we collect and average the rankings of the top MMA websites to produce our consensus rankings. We compile the top MMA rankings from each of our sources and award 25 points for a first place ranking, 16 for a 10th place ranking, 1 for a 25th place ranking. A formula is used to "normalize" the data so all fighters are awarded points from those lists that do not include a full 25 fighters. This formula ensures that each ranking site awards the same number of total points regardless of how many fighters they choose to rank. Each fighter’s total is divided by the number of possible points to determine their standing in the Consensus Rankings.
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LOL Overeem
Hardly even competes in MMA, has beaten no one of importance, and gets ranked 3rd. Why not just rank him first since schedule, competition, and results don’t matter?
The only substitute for victory is overkill.
You almost had an argument pre-Werdum.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "Everybody underestimates the kick in the groin." - Bas Rutten
by Richard Wade on Jul 28, 2011 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
as one of 'reems biggest bashers when it comes to ratings
he beat werdum. granted it was in embarrassing fashion, but it was dominant and werdum has (had) a deserved top10 ranking. yes he’s been can crushing, but he is, at least, actually crushing the cans in dominant fashion.
HW is a thin, thin division. he’s definitely legit top 5 based on wins, accolades and potential. no more argument from me (except for holland’s part who trolls us every month with his nonsense).
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 28, 2011 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Am I the only one who would love to see Overeem vs Frank Mir
for his UFC debut?
Yeah! Real nigga. ALL day! Just me. By myself. On the block. Holdin it down. Gun in my waist. Straight face. All day. Not a game. In jail. By myself. 1 bed. No pillow case. 1 pillow. You didn’t write me. It was early. Woke up. Went back to sleep. Took a nap. You ever go night night nigga? Everybody go night night nigga!
I think if you get kicked in the face you deserved it because that means you watched the foot come to your face.
If you out and some dude comes up and slaps you in the face while you with me? Than you just been slapped!
by RJshock 305 on Jul 29, 2011 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
fine by me
Mir is a legit gatekeeper and this should be a good fight.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 29, 2011 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions
i think that's a fair label seeing as how he lost his last 2 title shots
for example after losing to Anderson Silva for the second time, Rich was the concensus #2 MW in the UFC, yet he was still a gate keeper, since he couldn’t beat the champion
The diff is
Rich lost twice to the same champ
Mir has never lost twice to anyone.
Learn JiuJitsu.
Always looking for that new danger.
yes
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 29, 2011 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes,
there is a clear gap between the elite of the division (Cain, JDS, Lesnar, Carwin) and Mir, but there is no one else currently in the UFC at his level either.
High level gatekeeper, maybe even to #1 contender fights, but gatekeeper nonetheless at this point.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Really?
He sure looks like one to me. He holds the keys to the upper echelon. Beat him and you can fight the Carwins, Lesnars, etc. Lose to him and you are clearly not ready for the top of the division (CC, Kongo). I am certainly not the first to use this label on him.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 29, 2011 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
A "gatekeeper" can't be one or two wins from a title shot himself.
Learn JiuJitsu.
Always looking for that new danger.
Almost everyone is only two wins from a shot if they're against the right people.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "Everybody underestimates the kick in the groin." - Bas Rutten
by Richard Wade on Jul 29, 2011 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
And Mir only fights the right people.
The word is “Contender” not “gatekeeper”
Hell you can also throw in “Former 2 time UFC HW champ” for good measure.
Learn JiuJitsu.
Always looking for that new danger.
This is true and I disagree with labeling him a gatekeeper.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "Everybody underestimates the kick in the groin." - Bas Rutten
by Richard Wade on Jul 29, 2011 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Which other HWs have fought 3 top-10 guys over the last 3 years?
And he utterly wrecked 2 of them before fighting a boring, tentative fight against the 3rd.
I’ll save you the trouble of answering – only Lesnar, Fedor and Mir can claim the same, with all 3 having worse records against said top-10 competition.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
I disagree strongly.
Does anyone else notice Brock Lesnar’s concreted position at #4. Werdum was ranked ahead of him, but when he lost to Overeem, he dropped below him. Brock fights once a year cause he’s always sick, and yet his absence doesn’t make his ranking drop? He’s really the only reason the UFC HWs, outside of Cain and JDS, still have their rankings, cause if you drop him, you gotta drop Mir and Carwin.
Plus, Fedor loses to two guys ranked ahead of Mir and Carwin, two guys who earned that ranking BY beating Fedor, and yet Fedor is ranked below Mir and Carwin? How can BEATING Fedor mean you’re better than Mir and Carwin, yet BEING Fedor means you’re worse?
by Grease S. Pieces on Jul 29, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
those are legit questions
I think there was a strong will to drop Fedor, because he lost to two guys who were fringe top 10 to begin with (at the time they beat Fedor). I guess Fedor’s stock dropped because of the competition he lost to (and their respective rankings at the time).
I myself don’t mind Fedor ranked just outside the top 5. I think his ranking in at 9 is okay, although I could also see an argument to have him swapped with either Carwin or Mir.
by Body Triangle on Jul 29, 2011 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions
because he's a top 10 fighter
Who lost to the consensus #2 and #4 (almost TKOing him, in fact), but murdered #7. I see nothing wrong with how he’s ranked.
by Body Triangle on Jul 29, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Because back-to-back losses to Brock Lesnar and Junior dos Santos aren’t as bad as back-to-back losses to Fabricio Werdum and Antonio Silva, I suppose.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jul 29, 2011 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Rogers lost back to back to Fedor and Overeem
And he was quickly jettisoned from the Top 10.
How about some consistency
Also why is Lesnar still ranked so high when there’s no fight in the forseeble future for him thus far. When Barnett became inactive post Trilogy he slowly crept down and was dropped.
Food goes in here.
Because Rogers was a fringe top 10 fighter
of course he fell out of the top 10 when he lost to top 10 fighters. Seems consistent to me.
I think you’ll slowly but surely see Brock drop the more top 10 heavyweights we get to see duke it out
by Body Triangle on Jul 29, 2011 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Shane Carwin's only two losses are to No. 2 and No. 4
He also absolutely destroyed No. 7. If anything he’s underrated at No. 8. To complain about him being in the Top 10 is ridiculous.
by MichaelDavidSmith on Jul 29, 2011 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Rogers lost to 1 and 8-10 (wherever Alistair was at the time). Carwin and Rogers guys who had very similar records at one point, a string of wins over mediocre comp capped with a huge win over a former UFC champ. Just too much inconsistency in rankings for my liking.
Food goes in here.
It's not inconsistent.
Shane was ranked #2 in the world when he fought Brock. He was still hovering in the top 5 when he lost to Junior. Now he’s 8. Brett was hovering around #10 when he lost to Fedor. Then he was out of the top 10, and he further lost to Overeem. What…exactly…is inconsistent?
by Body Triangle on Jul 29, 2011 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions
All of the elite HWs in the UFC ultimately rest their rankings on a foundation of the shifting sands of Frank Mir and Zombie Nog.
Carwin’s only win over a top-anything HW is the same perpetually over-ranked Frank Mir.
Carwin parlayed that into his title fight with Lesnar who’s biggest win was also…the same Frank Mir…
Carwin then went on to dominate Lesnar it what could have easily been a stoppage, yet was not, and Carwin punched himself out and gassed, hard.
Cain’s only top-10 wins in his career were against Lesnar and Zombie Nog.
Lesnar’s only top-10 wins in his career were against Carwin (who only beat Mir), Mir and Randy Couture.
Carwin’s only top-10 win in his career is against Mir.
Mir’s only top-10 win in the last 6+ years was his thrashing of (and putting the final touches on the Zombification of) #2 Big Nog.
Nog’s only top-10 wins since PRIDE in 2006 was against #4 Tim Sylvia and 47-year old #6 Randy Couture.
Randy’s only top-10 wins at heavyweight in the last 6+ years are Gonzaga and Sylvia.
See how much fun that is…and how truly tissue thin the HW division is…
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Just having fun with the ratings
- Frank Mir is above Shane Carwin?
- WAIT!! JDS finally surpassed Fabricio Werdum?!?
- Of course, Brendan Schaub is rated above Roy Nelson. Yeah.
- Hmmm, something tells me Kharinotov would use Schaub for sparring practice and hurt him really bad.
- Overeem made the #3 spot? Who did he beat recently? How many of his opponents were in the top 10? Wait, oh yeah, Werdum. Overeem was not impressed with his performance, well neither was Werdum.
The Top 2 Fighters Report:
Interesting note about Cain Velasquez. He defeated only 1 fighter in the top 10 rank.
Junior Dos Santos defeated 2 fighters in the top 10 rank.
After Velasquez fights JDS, I just want to Velasquez face Carwin and I’m still interested in Lesnar versus Dos Santos.
I tend to be biased towards strikers . . . exciting strikers.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jul 29, 2011 10:56 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Wasnt Nog top ten when they fought?
Yeah! Real nigga. ALL day! Just me. By myself. On the block. Holdin it down. Gun in my waist. Straight face. All day. Not a game. In jail. By myself. 1 bed. No pillow case. 1 pillow. You didn’t write me. It was early. Woke up. Went back to sleep. Took a nap. You ever go night night nigga? Everybody go night night nigga!
I think if you get kicked in the face you deserved it because that means you watched the foot come to your face.
If you out and some dude comes up and slaps you in the face while you with me? Than you just been slapped!
by RJshock 305 on Jul 29, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah I guess so . . . but the operative word at the moment is “was”
I’m not, but I am taking something away from Velasquez
I tend to be biased towards strikers . . . exciting strikers.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jul 29, 2011 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
Schaub to me is the most overrated HW right now
I’m actually excited for when they start feeding him to top, young fighters. He is my current vote to be Overeem’s welcome mat into the UFC.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jul 29, 2011 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Good lord, that would be absolutely brutal...
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I know
I don’t know why Schaub chaps my ass so much, but he does, and I think a good Uberknee would teach him some humility.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jul 29, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Might be because he keeps on calling out these way past their prime “name” fighters…maybe try avenging your loss…or call out Mir…
While he has shown some improvement, I think he is about as highly ranked now as he ever will be…
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I would assume this Jim dude
is really really behind on his rankings?
for funsies, i made list of the top 20 guys, and their record against the other 34 ranked HW's on the list
1. Cain Velasquez (4-0)
• W – Cheick Kongo(15), Ben Rothwell(21), Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Brock Lesnar(4)
2. Junior Dos Santos (6-0)
• W- Fabricio Werdum(5), Stefan Struve(23), Mirko Flipovic(28), Gabriel Gonzaga(27), Roy Nelson(13), Shane Carwin(8)
3. Alistair Overeem (3-2)
• W – Sergei Kharitonov(14), Brett Rogers(22), Fabricio Werdum(5)
• L – Fabricio Werdum(5), Sergei Kharitanov(14)
4. Brock Lesnar (2-2)
• W – Frank Mir (7), Shane Carwin(8)
• L – Frank Mir (7), Cain Velasquez(1)
5. Fabricio Werdum (5-5)
• W – Gabriel Gonzaga(27), Alistair Overeem(3), Gabriel Gonzaga(27), Antonio Silva(6), Fedor Emilianenko(9)
• L – Sergei Kharitonov(14), Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Andrei Arlovski(33), Junior Dos Santos(2), Alistair Overeem(3)
6. Antonio Silva (2-1)
• W- Andrei Arlovski(33), Fedor Emilianenko(9)
• L – Fabricio Werdum(5)
7. Frank Mir (5-2)
• W – Brock Lesnar(4), Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Cheick Kongo(15), Mirko Flipovic(28), Roy Nelson(13)
• L – Brock Lesnar(4), Shane Carwin(8)
8. Shane Carwin (2-2)
• W – Gabriel Gonzaga(27), Frank Mir(7)
• W – Brock Lesnar(4), Junior Dos Santos(2)
9. Fedor Emilianenko (5-2)
• W – Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Mirko Flipovic(28), Andrei Arlovski (33), Brett Rogers(22)
• L – Fabricio Werdum(5), Antonio Silva(6)
10. Josh Barnett (3-5)
• W – Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Pedro Rizzo(25), Brett Rogers(22)
• L – Pedro Rizzo(25), Mirko Flipovic(28), Mirko Flipovic(28), Mirko Flipovic(28), Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11)
11. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira (4-5)
• W – Mirko Flipovic(28), Sergei Kharitonov(14), Fabricio Werdum(5), Josh Barnett(10)
• L – Fedor Emilianenko(9), Fedor Emilianenko(9), Josh Barnett(10), Frank Mir(7), Cain Velasquez(1)
12. Brendan Shaub (2-1)
• W – Gabriel Gonzaga(27), Mirko Flipovic(28)
• L – Roy Nelson(13)
13. Roy Nelson (2-4)
• W – Brendan Shaub(12), Stefan Struve(23)
• L – Ben Rothwell(21), Andrei Arlovski(33), Junior Dos Santos(2), Frank Mir(7)
14. Sergei Kharitonov (5-2)
• W – Pedro Rizzo(25), Fabricio Werdum(5), Mike Russow(17), Alistair Overeem(3), Andrei Arlovski(33)
• L – Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira(11), Alistair Overeem(3)
15. Cheick Kongo (2-2)
• W – Mirko Flipovic(28), Pat Barry(24)
• L – Cain Velasquez(1), Frank Mir(7)
16. Travis Browne (1-0)
• W- Stefan Struve(23)
17. Mike Russow (1-1)
• W – Jon Madsen(29)
• L – Sergei Kharitonov(14)
18. Cole Konrad (0-0)
19. Matt Mitrione (1-0)
• W-Christian Morecraft(34)
20. Daniel Cormier (0-0)
It is all abotu the ranking at the time fo the fight
not afterwards/. when will people realize that?
An impressive list, but
all that really matters is what they were at the time they fought…
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
here are my observations:
- I still think Fedor should be ranked above Carwin and Mir, he lost to the #5, and #6 HW’s, Carwin lost to the #2 and #4, and Mir lost to the #4, and #8. All three of them have 2 losses against top 10 opponents, but Fedor has many more wins against top competition that both of them. You could argue that Mir has just as many wins, but Mir was never the #1 HW in the world, i just think people are discrediting Fedor’s previous wins, because of his last 2 losses.
- why the hell is Russow ranked so high? He beat a now unranked Todd Duffe, and former UFC fighter Jon Madsen, i think Mitrione, and Rothwell both have better resumes, and Cormier and Konrad are both better fighters overall.
- it’s nice to see Barry move up the rankings even thou he lost, he dominated Kongo up until the last second
I’d take Cormier over more than half of the top-25, easily.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
meh
I like Sergei as much as anyone, but his ground game has enormous question marks still, to put it politely.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 29, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
the difference between 14 and 12 is negligible
I don’t think being 2 spots off that far down is “getting shafted”
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Mel Gibson shot the movie Apocalypto on location at the center of my taint.
-Fake Emcee
by Cory Braiterman on Jul 29, 2011 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I pretty much agree with the consensus here
1. Cain, 2. JDS, 3. Brock, 4. Reem, 5. Werdum, 6. Silva, 7. Carwin, 8. Mir, 9. Fedor, 10. Josh
Lesnar
Has no business being above about #6. He was dominated by Carwin (only top-10 win is Mir) before Carwin gassed, then was dominated by Cain. Objectively, there is zero basis for him to be #3, and I actually think he is good for the sport.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jul 29, 2011 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions
And now Reem is out of SF
This should push his ranking to #1.
The only substitute for victory is overkill.
I'm not confident about it
but I think the loss to Hendo drops Fedor out of the top 10.
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