The Nate Marquardt UFC on Versus 4 Saga Timeline
by Mike Fagan on Jun 30, 2011 12:01 PM EDT
in UFC Event
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Kid Nate and I were talking about the Marquardt storyline last night after he pointed me to Dave Meltzer's recent piece (subscription only) on the whole thing. Meltzer mentioned that Marquardt was given a blood test on June 18 by New Jersey that came back high, and, hence, caused their denial of Marquardt's therapeutic use exemption application. At first, this didn't jive with Marquardt nor MMA Junkie's version of the events, both claiming that the former had passed the three blood tests New Jersey had asked of him as part of their conditional TUE.
Meltzer eventually clears up the June 18 test later in his article, but I realized just how confusing the chronology of the story is, and that's from someone who has been following with great interest. So, I put together this timeline to clear things up:
August 2010: Marquardt experiences sluggishness, short-term memory loss, mood swings, etc. He visits a doctor who runs blood work, which comes back for low testosterone. His doctor recommends testosterone replacement therapy. Marquardt consults with the UFC before beginning treatment.
September 15, 2010: Marquardt stops Rousimar Palhares in Austin, Texas. Palhares complains that Marquardt greased, but Herb Dean settles the matter with his infamous "paper towel" test. The Texas commission claims Marquardt "met all medical requirements."
November 13, 2010: Yushin Okami defeats Marquardt by decision in Oberhausen, Germany. The UFC, specifically Marc Ratner, acts as the commission for this event. Marquardt claims the UFC was made aware of his TRT treatment.
February 11, 2011: Marquardt applies for a therapeutic use exemption with the New Jersey State Athletic Control Board. Marquardt receives a letter back from New Jersey stating that, while the information his doctor submitted was incomplete and the treatment did not follow USADA guidelines, they would grant him a conditional exemption so long as he agreed to halt treatment for eight weeks following his fight with Dan Miller and submit to three consecutive blood tests.
March 19, 2011: Marquardt defeats Dan Miller by unanimous decision in Newark, New Jersey.
March-May, 2011: Marquardt goes off treatment for eight weeks. New Jersey administers three blood tests, all of which come back within an acceptable range for a TUE.
Early June, 2011: Marquardt's doctor recommends restarting treatment more aggressively. Marquardt had been using pills to kickstart his pituitary glands, but his doctor insists on injecting him with testosterone because of the close proximity to his fight.
June 18, 2011: New Jersey requests another blood test from Marquardt. New Jersey protocol requires two tests before and after approval for a fight. This test fails for being, quoting Meltzer, "more than double normal males of his age group, which would have been due to his just receiving a testosterone shot." New Jersey denies Marquardt's TUE application, and sends that information to Pennsylvania. Pennsylvania tells Marquardt to get under the limit, or they will not license him to fight.
June 19, 2011: Marquardt begins testing himself every day. His levels fall throughout the week, but still remain above the acceptable limit.
June 23, 2011: Dana White becomes aware that there's an issue.
June 25, 2011, 1:00 p.m. ET: Marquardt takes a final blood test which comes over the acceptable limit, though he claims he just missed the threshold. Pennsylvania refuses to allow him to fight and places him on indefinite suspension.
June 25, 2011, 3:30 p.m. ET: MMA Junkie announces Marquardt has been scratched from the show, Charlie Brenneman will fight Rick Story, and Cheick Kongo and Pat Barry move into the main event.
June 25, 2011, 4:57 p.m. ET: Dana White tweets about Marquardt's removal from the show and his cuts him from the UFC.
June 26, 2011, 12:08 p.m. ET: Nate Marquardt tweets an apology to his fans.
June 26, 2011, 4:44 p.m. ET: Greg Sirb, executive director of the Pennsylvania commission, addresses the media.
June 26, 2011, 8:00 p.m. ET: Marquardt releases a terse statement to the Versus pre-show.
June 26, 2011, 8:32 p.m. ET: Marquardt tweets that he will address "all issues" on Tuesday.
June 26, 2011, 10:45 p.m. ET: Charlie Brenneman defeats Rick Story by unanimous decision.
June 26, 2011, 11:00 p.m. ET: Dana White appears on the UFC on Versus post-fight show. White says he is "pretty disgusted Nate Marquardt," adding that Marquardt will never fight for the UFC again.
June 28, 2011: Marquardt appears on The MMA Hour with Ariel Helwani.
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Agreed
But something is weird about this whole timeline…it ALMOST seems like an innocent mistake, ALMOST…except for this shady doctor, and his “aggressive” treatments. Sorry Nate- I think you dun effed up with that guy.
by Body Triangle on Jun 30, 2011 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
And the initial “off-label” pills that were used instead of the correct injections…
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
At this point, I actually think it was
Mainly because it seems like he did honestly communicate with the relevant ACs what he was doing at the time he was doing it. He seems to have complied with everything they requested, and he seems to have passed their test for TUE.
Unless I’m missing something, this sounds like the doctor injected just a little too much testosterone in that shot.
ive never done roids but are they safe if donr right?
by The Evil Dr Pork Chop on Jun 30, 2011 12:05 PM EDT reply actions
They can be totally safe
If you have help monitoring them from a Dr., or someone qualified.
It’s when people start juicing up solo, with no supervision, and with no restraint that they can become dangerous. In other words – abusing them is all bad (just like any drug).
BOOSH
Do we know
why Jersey had that additional test done?
1. Anderson Silva is waiting for you to punch him.
2. That guy is Anderson Silva.
3. Don't fucking punch that guy.
Because Jersey sucks ass
and can’t do anything right.
by av1o3 on Jun 30, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently they have a right to request two blood tests before and after fights. I gather from Meltzer (it’s hard to figure out sometimes with the way he writes) that it’s their standard protocol for TUE applications. The three blood tests they asked of him were a part of the conditional TUE they granted for the fight with Dan Miller.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
So in theory, they could have (or did?) tested him 5 times? They tacked on 3 additional? No wonder it caught him doing something weird.
1. Anderson Silva is waiting for you to punch him.
2. That guy is Anderson Silva.
3. Don't fucking punch that guy.
by Chris Barton on Jun 30, 2011 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions
From what I understand, they could test him up to four times under standard protocol (twice before the fight, twice after). The three additional tests bring that up to seven. We know they tested him at least four times, but after that nothing is for sure.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
We are on the same page
Another question… so the 3 additional were done in 8 weeks. Nate knew about that. Did the 2 regular post fight tests have to be done in a set time frame too, or could they just do them randomly?
It almost seems like they knew they had a fight coming up so they decided to test him right at the time he would be juiced up if he had really been abusing.
1. Anderson Silva is waiting for you to punch him.
2. That guy is Anderson Silva.
3. Don't fucking punch that guy.
by Chris Barton on Jun 30, 2011 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not sure what, if any, timeline there is for the “standard” post-fight tests.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
June 30, 2011: no one cares anymore.
Can we get the list of the few “clean” athletes instead of the dirty ones.
by malo on Jun 30, 2011 12:12 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
This is off topic but I just heard that JDS is no longer with blackhouse and Ed soares
by 775assassin on Jun 30, 2011 12:13 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Ed must have taken a bit much from cigano after his last fight and pissed him off.
by malo on Jun 30, 2011 12:25 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
How does someone test their testosterone levels so easily?
Do you take some kind of naked women-sex test?
by Gideon Jay on Jun 30, 2011 12:17 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
There are probably colorimetric kits that are available
like the ones you can buy to test your kids for drugs.
by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jun 30, 2011 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions
You can't tell
levels from a single urine test.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Correct. You can tell that artificial testosterone has been introduced into the body, but not the level of that testosterone.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Blood tests, at any medical lab.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions
I just had it done
Super easy. I have low levels, but still in the normal range (I am at just under 400). I almost begged for Test anyway because I want to be cool, but the Dr. said it’s not necessary. He said once you pass 30 this happens. He also said if I come back in a year and it is lower, we can talk.
In other words – hook me up with some Test.
BOOSH
Levels vary literally continuously (test has about a 10 min 1/2 life), but if you are that close, spend a little time reading some of the endocrinology journals and look at factors they consider, exclude or hold constant for clues on how to manipulate it some. Diet, sleep, exercise, time of day (highest in the am), stress & certain unrelated RX drugs all affect the levels.
You might have to go to a more “friendly” physician and use some of what you find to try to get in the 250-300 range though, but throughout the country there are various clinics (usually anti-aging places) where such products are widely available for those with a legitimate (or even quasi-legitimate) medical need, but aside from truly high-end (read: cash only) private practices, they are not readily available to others with no obvious need and, even then, it is very difficult to get them for PED purposes (as a competitive athlete) because of the enormous legal, financial and career risk to the doctors if/when they are caught.
Now, if you’re the over-worked, over-stressed CEO of a local business, sure, a medical need can probably be found if you are willing to look hard enough, but for pro, collegiate and high school athletes those places are generally not an option because of the potential for bad publicity inherent when testing is involved.
As an aside, I’m sure there are modern day BALCO’s (I don’t run in those circles), but if they are the real deal, that knowledge stays within their close-knit, referral-only circles. If you’ll recall, it was a revenge/falling-out that led to BALCO’s product being discovered.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Email me when you can, it doesn’t come to my phone so its not always a super-fast response, apologies in advance.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
question
What happened 6 weeks before the fight that Sirb was referring to when he said "Nate has known for probably about a month and a half. He knew the situation. It was no surprise. Everybody (including the UFC) knew. Everybody’s known. I think everybody assumed he was going to be able to qualify."
According to this timeline, 6 weeks could be when he restarted treatment because he had finished with NJs period of no treatment, but that doesn’t really mesh with sirb’s statement with me. It’s too early to be NJ denying the exemption. Unless I’m reading it incorrectly and they’re saying he had 6 weeks to go from too low to normal. Is that it?
I was just looking up that quote and have the same question
and can we assume from the Sirb quote, and that his testosterone levels had to be more that double in order to fail the test, that he had more than double normal T levels for at least six weeks.
I don’t know the chemistry and physiology of PEDs, but at least six weeks of more than double testosterone levels sounds like abuse not use to me. That’s sounds like juicing for a training camp.
I imagine it means
that he had known for 6 weeks what was required to get the TUE for his TRT.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions
to me, the only way the Sirb quote fits with rest of the timeline, is that Nate had six weeks to bring his T levels into compliance. And, compliance means no more than double “normal” limits.
That would be a condition of it. Compliance in most places means within the normal range, not double, although it is possible to be different there…it is, after all, Jersey…
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s not how I read it. I assume Sirb means six weeks because that’s when Nate contacted them about a TUE. That, or Sirb just misspoke on how long he knew about the situation.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
I assume Sirb means six weeks because that’s when Nate contacted them about a TUE
For me, this still doesn’t explain it. If, six weeks out, Nate informed the PSAC that he was under going TRT, then, presumably, the PSAC gave him a list of requirements to meet. What were those requirements?
also, presumably, by that time (six weeks out), Nate had met the NJSAC requirements by going eight weeks off and undergoing three blood tests.
Sirb could have misspoke. But, considering they had three days to prepare for the press conference, I’m more inclined to think that he was very careful and exact in what he said.
“For me, this still doesn’t explain it. If, six weeks out, Nate informed the PSAC that he was under going TRT, then, presumably, the PSAC gave him a list of requirements to meet. What were those requirements?”
Make sure you show up with blood work showing normal T levels?
“also, presumably, by that time (six weeks out), Nate had met the NJSAC requirements by going eight weeks off and undergoing three blood tests.”
Six weeks before the fight, by my count, would have put him right at the eight week mark after the Miller fight, so he would have been starting the blood tests.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
oh, I think I get it now
Six weeks out, Nate just completed eight weeks off treatment. His T levels met the NJSAC requirements for TRT. Nate informed the PSAC commission that he would be going back on treatment. The PSAC said they would approve his TRT provided he maintained his exemption with the NJSAC and he showed up with normal T levels.
Nate goes back on treatment and four weeks out tests his blood for the first time. He finds out that his doctor spiked his T levels and he is way out of compliance.
June 18 (8 days out), a surprise blood test by the NJSAC shows that Nate’s T levels are more than double the normal range. The NJSAC yanks his TRT exemption and informs the PSAC.
The PSAC tells Nate that he can still fight provided his T levels are within normal range by the time of the weigh-ins. Nate cannot meet this requirement, etc., etc.
It sounds like both commisions bent over backwards to allow Nate to fight.
This is actually
a pretty likely description of how it went down, nothing shady (on the commission side at least).
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
The next entry will be
Lorenzo yanks Dana’s leash, reminds him he just cut a top-10 185er (potentially top-10 170er), and Dana resigns him simply to keep him from fighting for Bellator.
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 30, 2011 12:20 PM EDT reply actions
No, they stay in touch with his manager. Say look have Nate stay busy while this blows over dont sign an exclusive contract and we will see about bringing him back
by PML on Jun 30, 2011 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The 3 blood tests is weird. NJ wanted him off the stuff to see if he really needed it, doing it after the fight is better than not doing it, but still seems silly. If there was a question they should have denied it until they felt sure he needed it.
This is the most interesting/confusing part to me as well. I’m not sure how they could allow this.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
It's amazingly
stupid. It’s like the were working on the “honor system” we had in Boy Scouts.
1. Anderson Silva is waiting for you to punch him.
2. That guy is Anderson Silva.
3. Don't fucking punch that guy.
by Chris Barton on Jun 30, 2011 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Considering what’s gone on with the CSAC in recent years, I’m not that surprised with what any athletic commission does. I’m more surprised that they not only ordered the he provide medical proof of his condition (other than a note that could be written by a corrupt doctor) but that they also ordered the surprise test that caught the cheating.
The knowledge that Texas and the UFC had apparently approved his usage for his previous 2 fights probably factored in, but still… if the doctor and his protocols were enough that you were going to have him stop treatment to prove he really needed the TRT, don’t let him fight. And also, (this may be made up, but I’ve gathered it from the comments I’ve been reading on this subject) whether he’s being treated correctly or incorrectly, testing him close to when he receive an injection seems like a guaranteed way for him to fail the test.
On the first point, this brings up questions for Texas and, more interestingly, to the UFC.
On the second point, though he’s taking injections, they should put him within the normal limits, not over them. While Meltzer says they are “more than double” normal males, he reported his number at 1200, when the typical, healthy range for an adult male is between 250 and 900(ish).
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
It is important info, IMO. The fact that he had to be more than double the upper range in order to fail the test makes me much less likely to believe it was all a simple mistake.
Who reported the"1200"?
1100 ng/dl is the upper end of normal per Quest, other labs vary somewhat.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s true, but I can see that you would actual give someone more than the normal amount, spaced out over time because if you just give someone enough to get up to normal, they will be below normal very quickly, while if you pump them up a bit, on average they will be “normal.”
I think a lot depends on how close to an event doctors are allowed to provide medication. If they’re allowed the weekend of the event, spiking his numbers doesn’t seem necessary.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
testing him close to when he receive an injection seems like a guaranteed way for him to fail the test
IDK either, but we also have a quote from Sirb saying he had six weeks to resolve the issue. If that’s true, it could still be case of mistreament. Or, Nate could have been trying to keep his T levels as high as possible for as long as possible and time it to meet the requirements on the day of the weigh-ins. That would be a case of incorrect cheating.
whether he’s being treated correctly or incorrectly, testing him close to when he receive an injection seems like a guaranteed way for him to fail the test.
Yes, but.
The levels peak at about 72 hours post-injection, and by day 14 or so it should be back near pre-injection levels. This assumes only injectable TRT is used, not hCG or similar with it.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Wasn't it actually
he had to go off for 8 weeks, not 8 weeks after the fight? Presumably he just had to test within the normal range prior to fighting Miller. It sounds like they gave preliminary approval when he stopped treatment and his levels dropped to low normal.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions
No, they asked him to go off treatment for eight weeks after the fight so they could test him. Presumably, he tested within range prior to the fight.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
So the Junkie info about NJSAC was incorrect?
After consulting with the UFC, Marquardt began testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) this past August. He applied for the exemption in New Jersey on Feb. 11, according to Lembo, and was cooperative with the commission’s requests.
Among the requirements for gaining an exemption, the NJSACB required Marquardt to cease use of prescribed testosterone for eight weeks (and preferably three) in order to measure a baseline level of his natural testosterone, and thus determine whether it was a necessity. It also required a “detailed” plan of how levels of testosterone in Marquardt’s body would be monitored to “ensure maintenance of therapeutic levels.”
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s not incorrect, but it isn’t explained very well. From my live blog:
[Marquardt] applied for therapeutic-use exemption for fight against Dan Miller. Commission allowed it, but they wanted Nate to do tests after fight. Go off treatment for 8 weeks and take blood tests. Nate claims he went off treatment, took the three blood tests. Results came back and doctor wrote letter that said Nate had low testosterone and was a candidate for treatment.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
I want to see him go up against Lombard or 170 champ. k
by malo on Jun 30, 2011 12:28 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I like Askren, but I think he’s biting off WAY more than he can chew calling out Marquardt.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 30, 2011 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
On Helwani's show
they were saying a clearing and license or end of suspension was coming within days. Has that happened yet? When do they go in front of the Board?
I’ve been overwhelmed and I’ve been underwhelmed. Can I ever just be whelmed?
Marquardt and McMahon said Sirb told them that given current information, Marquardt’s suspension would likely be lifted. Sirb has to meet with his board to review, however. Not sure when that’s going down.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
What I don’t understand is why NJ wanted Nate to stop taking the TRT after a fight, and tested him then. What does it matter what he does after a fight, if he was on TRT and over the limit leading up to the fight?
"Very broken in his right hand is Martin Kampmann"
"This is the internet: you either have soul-stopping power or you’re a pillow-fisted pansy. There is no middle ground." - woomikee
Given the timeline, they didn’t have enough time to tell him to get off for eight weeks so they could do their tests. Instead of cancelling the bout, they gave him the conditional TUE.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
It’s still mind boggling that they let him fight on faulty paperwork after acknowledging unapproved methods, and only bothered after the fight to see if it was something he, you know, needed. Testing him after eight weeks of non-medicating does zero to show whether or not the testosterone he took in the lead up had him over the limit.
Just Blog Guy - http://JustBlogGuy.wordpress.com/
Testing him after eight weeks of non-medicating does zero to show whether or not the testosterone he took in the lead up had him over the limit.
That was to see how low his levels dropped, trying to ascertain whether TRT was truly called for or not.
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The 8 weeks off the TRT should allow the levels to return to his normal
If they tested him before then, they could be testing elevated levels or depressed levels from the TRT.
by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jun 30, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
is nate officially cut yet?
cause i think we’ll see him back
"I have smoked weed with alot of UFC champions" - Joe Rogan
"Você ta fudido. Se vai levar muita porrada, ta ligado?" - Anderson Silva
How much of an advantage does TRT give? Are we talking like barry bonds home run breaking advantage? or something akin to fighting with like 10 extra pounds on a guy.
If used properly, they should only return testosterone levels to “normal” amounts.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Exactly
“used properly” is the rub though…
I have the WADA/USADA requirements for getting a TUE for TRT, but only as a pdf, I don’t have a link. Is there any way to post that or does it need to be linkable?
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I emailed it (and some other stuff) to Leland
I’ll forward it to you if you want to either post your email address or send me one and I’ll reply (don’t always check it).
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if you're stupid." -John Wayne
Death before dishonor, drinks before lunch.
Never send sheep to kill a wolf.
by The American Ronin on Jun 30, 2011 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
August 2005:
Marquardt tested positive for high levels of nandrolone, an anabolic steroid, which led the commission to file for his suspension. This was after his UFC debut victory against Ivan Salaverry.
I tend to be biased towards strikers . . . exciting strikers.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
after pondering the timeline, I think I know why Dana is so pissed
Since August of last year, the UFC, NJSAC, and the PSAC all bent over backwards to give Nate the benefit of the doubt regarding his TRT. He returned the favor by getting disqualified from the main event the day before the show.
Yeah, that's what I thought
The impression I got was that Nate talked to Dana about TRT, and Dana probably said something along the lines of "Listen, this has already gotten us in trouble with Chael, I’ll let you do it AS LONG AS YOU PROMISE ME THAT YOU WILL BE CLEARED TO FIGHT." Nate promises him, promises him, promises him, and then comes up short, Dana is livid, and cuts him.
This is the only reason I can think of that Dana would cut Nate so quickly, especially since he would have made a lot of interesting new fights at WW.
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