UFC Five-Round Main Events Won't Lead to More Finishes
by Bloody Elbow on Jun 10, 2011 2:00 PM EDT
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This is a guest editorial by Josh Nason.
I've started and stopped writing this editorial about five times because for the first time in a long time, I can't think of any clever way to introduce my argument. So instead, I'm just going to come right out and say it.
I don't like the UFC's decision to make all non-title main events five rounds. Actually, I don't like it at all.
Lest you think I'm some relic who is holding on to the past and carry around a baseline argument about how everything "used to be good" in MMA, that ain't the case. I love logical progression in sports and I'd say that I am on board with nearly all the decisions that have been made by the Zuffa crew.
That is, except this one. Here's why, including some updated stats I compiled that I found fascinating. The finish percentage that Mike Fagan referenced in February 2009? It's done gone and changed quite a bit.
The value of the "championship rounds" is diminished.
Call me crazy but I think being a champion matters. A fighter's climb up the rankings and the eventual increased importance of each fight as they approach contention is part of what makes the sport great. It's the chase that's fun and something that eventually will result in a title opportunity if the time is right.
In order to beat a champion, you gotta do a little extra and that's where I like keeping the 4th and 5th round unique to title fights. You have to be willing to increase your cardio, game plan accordingly and prepare to potentially endure an extra 10 minutes of hell.
What can happen in those 10 minutes can mean a lot. That is time that should be devoted to the ultimate goal of every fighter: winning (or defending) a championship. Ideally, your title fights should be the best fights your promotion can offer and the potential of a full 25 minutes is part of that.
Now, the same guys headlining on Versus and The Ultimate Fighter finale show are also getting that extra 10 minutes. That doesn't sit right with me. You should earn the right to get those two rounds.
But the belt is the difference! (Isn't it?)
I remember preparing to watch Rampage Jackson and Rashad Evans last year and didn't once think, "Man, I wish a title were on the line." What I said above about championship fights being your best fights? You know that's not always true. Some title fights just don't work, no matter what you do.
So pretend you're Joe Fan and you've watched a bunch of shows and the non-title main events are better than the title matches you're seeing. The more that keeps happening, doesn't that almost lend itself to the belts feeling less important?
You may think this is the most preposterous argument you've ever heard and it very well may be, but give it time. I hope I'm wrong, but those interesting numbers I mentioned are coming in a bit.
There are main events that don't need an additional 10 minutes.
Take UFC 130 as an example. After Frankie Edgar/Gray Maynard III was postponed, we were left with Rampage Jackson vs. Matt Hamill. I can't imagine a scenario where I would have been excited to see that in five-round format. After seeing it, I definitely wouldn't have wanted to see another 10 minutes or even five.
How about Michael Bisping vs. Yoshihiro Akiyama? Gray Maynard vs. Nate Diaz? Court McGee vs. Kris McCray? Those were all main events in 2010. Do those give off that five-round importance to you?
I first remember hearing the argument for five-round non-title fights after Evans and Jackson went the distance at UFC 114, mainly because it felt like nothing was settled. I didn't remember hearing that after Yushin Okami beat Nate Marquardt or when Phil Davis defeated Antonio Rogerio Nogueira earlier this year.
And there are times that a guy is plain beat after 15 minutes. What are two extra rounds going to prove?
More Finishes? The Numbers Say Otherwise.
I looked at every UFC event from 2010 through last week's TUF 13 finale. Here are some stats:
- 34 total main events with 12 title fights and 22 non-title fights.
- Finish percentage in non-title fights was 54.5% (12-of-22). There was nine decisions and one draw.
- Finish percentage in title fights was 41.6% (5-of-12). There was six decisions and one draw.
Initially, the decision felt like the UFC trying to create situations where main events would see more finishes due to the potential of extra time, leading to a more satisfactory feeling for people that bought on PPV.
But if the numbers over the last 34 main events tell us anything, there will actually be MORE decisions as the finish rate is 13% higher in non-title matches.
So Why Is This Happening?
Over those 34 events, I found it interesting that only 12 were main-evented by a title fight, accounting for just 35.2%. One could argue that if that number were to hold up over the next 34 shows, it would be in the best interest of the UFC to put equal emphasis on non-title fight main events because 65% is frankly a massive number.
That would also allow them to put added emphasis on championship fights because in fact, they have been somewhat scarce over the last 18 months. Then again, one can debate the sell value of a Jose Aldo/Chad Mendes 145-pound title match to the mainstream in any situation.
Regardless of why the UFC is choosing to do this now, I wish they wouldn't have. I'd gladly deal with the one or two fights a year where you wish there was more time as opposed to the four or five other times when you're glad a main event is done.
Josh Nason (@JoshNason) is a New England-based MMA journalist that contributes to BloodyElbow.com, FIGHT! Magazine and WrestlingObserver.com. He co-hosts the weekly MMA Show on ESPN Radio affiliate WGAMradio.com.
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Well, your numbers are right
but Diaz vs. Maynard? Really? That would have been an incredible 5 round fight.
I think the fighters should have the choice to sign on 3 or 5 rounds.
Dude. I agree. I don't know why people are pissing all over this.
Machida would have finished Rampage.
Fitch I’m sure would have left no chance of a draw, or made BJ quit (that pains me to say).
Ebersole would have continued to amaze me with his sideshow of MMA and probably capped of Lytle.
Pettis may have finally sunk that triangle in with 20 more attempts.
People are essentially complaining about watching more fighting. “Dude, I have to watch 2 more rounds of this garbage? Pfft. Pass me my Zima.”
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
by Shotokanman on Jun 10, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 17 recs
sure
and if hominick vs. aldo was nine rounds, maybe hominick would have won. there’s no magic number of rounds that solves that problem.
i don’t get it. i have no problem with all ufc main events being five rounds for the reason you’ve listed, although it certainly takes the lustre off of championship fights a bit.
but really – what is it going to change? the answer is nothing. in some cases as you’ve listed you’ll see different, perhaps fairer results. but in a lot of cases boring fights will just go on longer, or else you’ll run into the same problems as one of the two fighters comes on stronger towards the end.
five round fights won’t fix the inherent issues with a 10-9 must system the way fights are currently scored by judges.
for me, i just don’t get what all the fuss is about. i personally would rather see more fights than longer fights. boring fights are usually boring no matter how long they are – you don’t usually see dramatic finishes in the last two rounds (although you do sometimes!).
on the other hand, with all the prelims televised, there’s plenty of fighting to see. so there’s no downside to 5 round main events either.
it seems like either side in this debate cherry-picks particular fights to prove their point. if you want 5 round main events, point to fitch/penn. if you don’t, rampage/hammill or silva/maia.
overall, i doubt things will get better or worse. i’m happy enough for longer fights, but a bit sorry to see the “specialness” of championship fights decrease.
Machida would have finished Rampage.ERRRRR NO
Fitch would have left no chance of a draw, or made BJ quit…MAYBE
Ebersole would have continued his sideshow of MMA and probably capped of Lytle…LOL
Pettis may have finally sunk that triangle in with 20 more attempts…JUST STOP ALREADY
by The Evil Dr Pork Chop on Jun 10, 2011 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with each of those points
Maybe not the Fitch one because I think BJ could’ve still pulled it off, but he is making a good point
Let the fighters fight, let the referees ref, but dear God, don't let the judges judge.
Less fights will make it to PPV most likely, due to the longer main event......something to consider.
People are essentially complaining about watching more fighting
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
Machida would have finished Rampage.
I hate it when people talk about that fight like it was a game of Tekken or something. “Dude, Rampage’s health bar was down 50%, he was definetely getting finished soon.”
To be honest, I think that Wanda Sykes commercial where she warns the teenagers about throwing around the word "gay" because it contains such offensive connotations actually makes a really good point...No Homo.
THANK YOU BASED MODS!!!!!
Well, he was psychologically affected too, we saw it in his face after the fight.
by burakkuburain on Jun 10, 2011 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
What, a completely gassed and defenceless Rampage was gonna come out and get the KO.
I’m sure man.
Machida would have taken him down with ease, again, and maybe finished that arm triangle he was flirting with all 3rd round.
Your Tekken analogy was super impressive though.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
Another crappy side effect
of 5 round non-title fights is less room on televised cards for other bouts. With the UFC streaming entire undercards on FB, this isn’t really a huge issue. However, if I were a fighter deserving main card status, I might be pissed to have my fight broadcast on FB on not on a PPV main card
"If I wanted to spend a half hour between two hairy legs I'd go to your mother's house." -Don Frye
by mburtoni on Jun 10, 2011 2:10 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Actually:
I don’t know that I would be upset. Do we know the numbers for viewers on the facebook prelims? Or the SpikeTV prelims? How do they compare to the PPV?
It may not garner as much sponsorship money at first, but I think with some digging we may find that being viewed by 3 million viewers (someday) on the Internet live will beat out the 800k PPV buys.
A shitty side effect I foresee is even less title bouts
Let the fighters fight, let the referees ref, but dear God, don't let the judges judge.
I cannot believe that people still make the argument that championship fights are “special” so they should be longer.
According to this theory, the Battle at the Barn championship fight is more important than Randy Couture vs Lyoto Machida or BJ Penn vs Jon Fitch, and that is just completely idiotic.
The skill of the fighters should determine the length of the fight. Little league baseball starts at 6 innings, then as you get older you get too play more innings until you get to the full 9 in every major league game, whether it’s game 1 of the season, game 162 of the season, or game 7 of the world series.
In boxing, you start fighting 4 rounders, and then as you progress through the ranks, you work your way up to 12 rounders, belt or no belt (like Mayweather Marquez).
Or maybe if the UFC is trying to sell half a million PPV's based on the strength of your name
you better be ready to put on more of a show than the other guys on the card.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
So all the PPV main events will be 5 rounds?
Or are the TUF Finales/Fight NIghts/Versus main events a 5 round fight?
ALL main events, including fight nights/versus
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I would happily give back those extra 2 rounds
If the UFC lets Mayhem do one of his ridiculous entrances
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
This is cool and all but I don't like seeing less fights.
I didn’t really know that 5 round main events was in high demand
Has a sig bet with Californication for Wiman/Siver at UFC 132
Further more, I have a sig bet with Chronogata on Lesnar over JDS
by doonerthesooner on Jun 10, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
They air every single fight now. You’re not going to see less.
Formerly ChiCubs23
by Tim Bernier on Jun 10, 2011 2:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Rampage vs. Hammill
I actually think this was the tipping point in the five-round fight argument. A lot of people felt ripped off by that fight at the top of the card. An extra two rounds, with Rampage trying to close the show with a knockout, could have saved the day.
But I’m with you that TUF finales shouldn’t be five rounders.
A good compromise could be K-1 style rules where they add rounds if warranted, but with MMA judging already controversial that could be another can of worms (Cecil would be scheduling 7 1/2 rounders).
█♣█
A wise man told me don't argue with fools
Cause people from a distance can't tell who is who -- Jay-Z
I like that idea
why not just have guys go a 4th or 5th round ONLY if it’s going to be either a close split decision or a draw? That way we’d get a decisive finish out of Fitch/Penn and other close split decisions. I saw Rampage beat up Hamil decisively, so I’m not sure if a round 4 or 5 would have been necessary, but then again Hamil COULD have came back in the latter rounds.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Jun 10, 2011 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
5 Round Fights and Finishes
My guess would be there are less finishes in title fights, not because they are five rounds but rather the fighters tend to be of a higher caliver i.e. harder to finish.
by Mongoose44 on Jun 10, 2011 2:14 PM EDT reply actions 6 recs
I kind of agree
But it’s not like they just let any scrubs headline a card, whether it’s a championship bout or not
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
As much as it pains me to say this, Cro Cop is a scrub, and recently headlined a non-championship main event. It does happen, and is easier to sell without a title on the line
You retired from kick boxing in 2006. If you had to do it all over again, would you have tried fighting in MMA?
Jean-Charles Skarbowsky: No.
Obviously there's going to be exceptions
But I would think that if you compared the rankings of headliners, regardless of whether they’re championship fights or not, they would at least be top-5 type guys. But I could very well be wrong in that.
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean Hamill wasn’t top five, BJ wasn’t top five at WW, but with championship fights the last one that really stuck out was Vitor. I think when a belt is on the line the UFC needs a highly qualified challenger. When it’s just a main event they have much more leeway
You retired from kick boxing in 2006. If you had to do it all over again, would you have tried fighting in MMA?
Jean-Charles Skarbowsky: No.
That’s true. But generally if the UFC is given leeway to choose, they choose fighters that are likely to get a finish, which would lead to more finishes… again, all errant speculation.
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I just like 5 round fights more.
I honestly think that 3 rounds is too short and would actually prefer if all fights were 5 rounds. Championship fights could be 6 or 7 rounds long. I know this probably will never happen and that the huge majority of fans would disagree, but hey, it’s a matter of taste.
I would point out that 5 round main events have the potential to weed out challengers who are unprepared to go 5 rounds and that the picture you used and the caption are a bit inadequate because Silva vs. Maia was going to be 5 rounds no matter what and so is a bit irrelevant to the discussion.
I honestly think that 3 rounds is too short and would actually prefer if all fights were 5 rounds.
This is my #1 wish for MMA. I do think title fights should be differentiated somehow, preferably even longer than the other main events.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Jun 10, 2011 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Less fights will make it to PPV
and boring Fitch style fights would be even longer…….just sayin’.
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
And awesome Sanchez-Kampmann fights would be longer... just sayin'.
"No person can disobey reason, without giving up his claim to be a rational creature." - Swift
Thats cool with me. 15 minutes, 3x a year is not enough. 25 minutes, 3x per year still isn’t enough, imo, but its a step in the right direction.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Jun 10, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
One thing is that many fighters start to relax and really get into the groove of the fight around the end of the second round/beginning of the third round. There are slow starters of course, but then there is a feeling out process in the first round as well. I have to wonder how a fight like Thiago Alves vs Rick Story would go if it was five rounds considering that Thiago was really getting his shots in at the third round.
Check out the C&D Channel on YouTube for MMA reviews, predictions, analysis, and other MMA related content.
On the other hand
A lot of people seem to have wanted another two rounds for Pettis/Guida.
"Run and tweet THAT, homeboy."
One issue with that...
Ferguson/Nijem was the main event.
Josh Nason - Freelance MMA Journalist
Twitter.com/JoshNason | libsyn.com/nasonmedia
I’m sure it would have been co-main with the new rules for main event, no? If I’m not mistaken TUF finalist won’t be main events next time.
Boys becoming men...Men becoming wolves
that would be best
Bob Sapp vs. Rodrigo Nogueira Bob "The Beast" Sapp is 400 pounds, and if 300 pounds of it aren’t pure steroids, then someone has got to be fucking kidding. -SeanBaby
Whether there are actually more finishes, is besides the point.
If I’m a fighter, I want every opportunity to control my destiny. Two more rounds allows for that. If we get some snoozers that go five rounds, well, it’s not like we haven’t gotten title fights that have done the same. I think the upside outweighs the downside.
So in that case...
Shouldn’t all fights be five rounds?
Josh Nason - Freelance MMA Journalist
Twitter.com/JoshNason | libsyn.com/nasonmedia
No. I can tell you that currently, since 2000, the numbers are 28 decisions in 93 five-rounds fights (70% finishing rate), and 493 decisions in 1270 three-round fights (61% finishing rate).
There’s still huge sample size issues, obviously, and Josh’s numbers are an incredible misuse of statistics. Intuitively, there’s no reason to believe that five-round fights would usher in MORE decisions. That is a backwards way of thinking.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
by Mike Fagan on Jun 10, 2011 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions 8 recs
Josh’s numbers are an incredible misuse of statistics.
I’m glad you pointed this out. I know the sample size is pidly to begin with, but Josh’s numbers are intellectually misleading. His whole argument is shot.
If this is the...
Case, why bother posting the article?
I don’t agree with it but I’m all for intelligent debate and welcome the prospect of having my mind changed by someone.
But when the argument is based on flawed statistics, it’s just seems pointless.
by Sergio Hernandez on Jun 10, 2011 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Josh is a contributor here and we like to let all sides of a debate have a say.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I can understand...
That but his argument is based on flawed logic.
Kinda takes the wind out of its sails.
by Sergio Hernandez on Jun 10, 2011 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
In most arguments AT LEAST one side of the debate is using flawed logic.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "Everybody underestimates the kick in the groin." - Bas Rutten
by Richard Wade on Jun 10, 2011 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
How hard would it be
To get a breakdown of finishes by round in 3- and 5-round fights? I would be interested to see what the trend looks like, if you chart number of finishes vs. the round they occurred in.
My hypothesis would be that if a finish is going to happen, it has the highest percentage chance of happening in the first round, then declines from there before spiking up at the end as guys that know they’re behind on the cards start getting crazy.
Could be a subject for one of those statistics challenges…
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
But then we’d only have 3 or 4 fight main cards, and only get to see highlights from prelim fights if one or two of the main cards get an early finish…
I think having the main and co-main fights would be a good start as 5 rounders… that could still give us main cards with 5 fights.
1) You get to see every fight on every card now, so that point is moot.
2) I’d much rather see an eight-fight card with 4 five-round fights on the main card than you’re typical ten- or eleven-fight card with a bunch of garbage at the bottom.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
But the UFC needs to put on MORE fights, not LESS. They already have too many fighters for the number of events they hold, and that’ll be made much worse once SF is absorbed. If they cut the number of fights to 8 per card, they’ll have to cut their roster in half.
Here’s a list of cards that had two five-round fights scheduled:
UFC 129: 12 total fights
UFC 112: 10 total fights
UFC 111: 10 total fights
UFC 100: 11 total fights
UFC 92: 10 total fights
UFC 73: 9 total fights
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Ok, but those only had two five-round fights… they can’t have 9-10-11-12 five-round fights during the usual 6 hours the events last. More like 7 or 8 fights.
Like I said, baby steps.
If the UFC is deadset on putting on weekly fights, this is a realistic goal.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Right, thursday night fights on the ufc network or whatever, and suddenly you have all those lower card guys with a place to fight.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, I absolutely agree with that. If they hold more events, and have weekly events, make every fight a 5 round affair. I’d love it.
See, I knew you’d come around on the all-UFC channel that’s coming… ;-)
I’m not against the channel, per se. I just don’t think an ALL-UFC channel is realistic right now.
I do want weekly fights, regardless of which network they appear on.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
More free events maybe? Or move some of the lower-end fighters over to SF, just keep UFC 100% strictly for the names/upper level fighters. I could go without seeing guys like Struve, Rafaello Oliveira, and…Vagner Rocha on a UFC fight card honestly.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Jun 10, 2011 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
That actually sounds
really really fucking good! Last card:
Rampage/Hammil – 5 rounds!
Mir/Nelson – 5 rounds!
Alves/Story – 5 rounds!
Stann/Santiago – 5 rounds!
Just fucking remove Struve/Brown *ugh and that’s just an extra 25 minutes of solid mma! Actually it’d be an extra 20 minutes since Stann finished Santiago in the 2nd round. Make the main card 4, 5 round events and then rotate between 2-3 unaired preliminary fights (on fb or youtube or whatever), and then 2-3 televised preliminary fights! Sounds like a great idea to me, now let the cons begin…
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Jun 10, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm okay with that.
Though I know it’s not going to happen. Time constraints. I think this is a fair enough balance.
A) I wish people would stop going “THE TUF FINALE BOUTS WILL BE FIVE ROUNDS!” I’m fairly certain that when the time comes, they’ll rearrange the card and put a fight like Pettis/Guida in the finals.
B) I still don’t get the need to feel like the 4th and 5th round are “special.” Almost all main events have someone that is at least at a “title contender level” in them. If you’re of the skill level that you can challenge for a title, you should be fighting 5 rounds. I honestly think a fight like Couture/Machida should have been 5 rounds too, even though it was further down the card. Two former champions..etc.
C)
But if the numbers over the last 34 main events tell us anything, there will actually be MORE decisions as the finish rate is 13% higher in non-title matches.
I hate to say it Josh, but this is a really poor argument. The SAME fighters would be in those SAME fights. Why would the higher non-title finish percentage change because of two more rounds? They still would have been finished within three rounds unless you’re playing the “I bet they wouldn’t fight as hard” card, which is pretty crazy. Why would a fight that was finished in 2 rounds suddenly go to decision if 2 more rounds are added?
D) “How about Michael Bisping vs. Yoshihiro Akiyama? Gray Maynard vs. Nate Diaz? Court McGee vs. Kris McCray?” Bisping/Akiyama would have been fine for 2 more rounds. It wasn’t a bad fight by any means. Maynard/Diaz was a close and somewhat controversial decision which likely would have been made more clear by 2 rounds. McGee/McCray is pretending the TUF finale would still be a main event.
Will some fights be boring for 25 minutes instead of 15? Sure! But the increased amount of rounds available to the best fighters is a GREAT thing.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 2:21 PM EDT reply actions 7 recs
I was on the fence on this, but you convinced me
Good rant. Almost makes up for your bizarre speculation about Cigano earlier today. Almost.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jun 10, 2011 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I missed the comments on that article, but I never said Junior WAS looking past Carwin, I just asked IF he was. To…you know…facilitate discussion.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know why some people believe that everything you write, you actually 100% believe. Sometimes you’re just writing things to get people talking. Get page hits. Whatever.
I've become a firm believer that all of BE's writers
get into character before they write. In fact I think Kid Nate said as much at one point.
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I hate to break it to you, but I’m an asshole in real life too.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
by Mike Fagan on Jun 10, 2011 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
I’d honestly feel a little disappointed if you weren’t.
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Mine too
On a related note, I’ve always found the writers (and posters) around here to be quite open to criticism and friendly bickering. It’s the personal attacks that that get people booted.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jun 10, 2011 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
Discussive Douchebaggery = poster
Belligerent Douchebaggery = banned
Bob Sapp vs. Rodrigo Nogueira Bob "The Beast" Sapp is 400 pounds, and if 300 pounds of it aren’t pure steroids, then someone has got to be fucking kidding. -SeanBaby
Not only finishes...
5 round fights isn’t only about finishes, it’s about minimizing the value of each round, and giving the chance to someone to come back in later rounds and getting a decision. It also minimizes the chance judges screw up the decision, IMO.
For me it’s an issue of decisively determining who the better man was – i.e. more important in the cases where the fight is actually likely to go the distance. Producing an extra 10 minute space for someone to potentially get finished is of secondary importance.
"I don't care, hit him with your groin!"
The logic here is a bit flawed. This change does nothing but allow for a chance at a definitive finish. The finishes that have happened in the 3 round fights will still occur, but will have more opportunity to occur with the addition of 10 more minutes of potential fighting.
While it is easy to point out which fights u didn’t want to see 2 more rounds, there are an equal number where u wanted to see it continue on.
by mjw2e on Jun 10, 2011 2:23 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
please retire this gif.
yeah its funny, its cool, but please . . .
I tend to be biased towards strikers . . . exciting strikers.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jun 10, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
I can’t stand that gif anymore.
Boys becoming men...Men becoming wolves
by spectaa on Jun 10, 2011 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Use this one...
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
by RolloTomasi on Jun 10, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
And yes, that is Gary Busey
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
I thought it was that guy from Buffy the Vampire Slayer
Never approach a vast undertaking with a half-vast plan.
Same guy
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
Is it a problem
That I find Gary Busey to be infinitely more disturbing than the… whatever those are?
Fas est et ab hoste doceri. (Right it is to be taught, even by the enemy) ~Ovid
by Damnatio Memoriae on Jun 10, 2011 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Good Lord
wtf are those!? Creepy as shit!
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on Jun 10, 2011 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I remember watching Rampage vs Evans
And being like “Alright Rampage can mount a comeback in the other rounds, he can still win. Oh wait, fuck this is only a 3 round fight!” and being so disappointed.
Not sure why I felt it was a 5 rounder. I guess I was just so excited for the fight up to that point and all the drama that it felt like a 5 rounder. I’m glad the ufc is doing this for main events. Not all main events are created equal, but a lot of them deserve to be 5 rounds, title or no title.
I imagine with the other weight divisions fully in swing you won’t have Bonnar/Pokrajac type fights in that situation.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't imply that it was
I’m just saying that if my theory is correct, it will mess with the stats, as fights with a higher probability of being finished will main event.
I suppose, but nobody cares about the stats, really. It’s all about wins and losses in this sport, how you win doesn’t have that much importance in the grand scheme of things.
You're missing the point
We are discussing whether 5-round main events will lead to more finishes or not.
And I’m saying that it doesn’t matter if it does produce more finishes and ends up messing with the stats, as you said. This isn’t baseball, we don’t care about the stats.
If you don’t care about the frequency of finishes in five round fights, why did you comment on a post about the frequency of finishes in five round fights?
Rampage vs Hammil
Using this fight as evidence that the 5 round fight is a bad idea doesn’t make alot of sense. This was never supposed to be a main event fight but because of a freak occurence where a weak card had both its main event fighters have to pull out on short notice so the UFC couldnt get another high profile fight to fill in for it they had no choice.
This doesn’t happen very often and there have been way more main events that I would have loved to see go longer than ones that I was happy they were only 3 rounds.
From what Dana said this fight wouldn't have been ended up being 5 rounds anyways
He wants it to be made 5 rounds when the fight is signed so both fighters know what they are getting themselves into. In a situation like that either he would have to find a new main event of 5 rounds or there would probably on be a 3 round main event
More fighting is a win.
Right?
Right.
It takes great work and thinking to keep from doing work.
by tito (eight and oh) on Jun 10, 2011 2:37 PM EDT reply actions
According to some...
see the best fighters get more ring time is bad.
"No person can disobey reason, without giving up his claim to be a rational creature." - Swift
eh we all get freakin duped in to watching 25 boring minutes of gsp time and time again
why not 25 minutes of others..?
Fine! I'll go build my own lunar lander, with blackjack and hookers. In fact, forget the lunar lander and the blackjack.
PRIDE fan boy
Nice to see we still can't make it through a thread without someone hating on GSP.
Chael Sonnen!
by MichaelD8 on Jun 10, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
oh dont be that guy!
Fine! I'll go build my own lunar lander, with blackjack and hookers. In fact, forget the lunar lander and the blackjack.
PRIDE fan boy
I think there's plenty of room
for us all to be “that guy.”
I don't want to lose
championship rounds. No, sir.
I don’t care if fights are 28 rounds, honestly. I’d rather it was no time limit again, but they way it’s set up now championship rounds should still exist.
Why I never joined a frat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-KNVrZaN8M
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
"A samurai would bite your cock off if you tried that shit on the battlefield." - Kid Nate
That's dumb
Why I never joined a frat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-KNVrZaN8M
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
"A samurai would bite your cock off if you tried that shit on the battlefield." - Kid Nate
by Chris Barton on Jun 10, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
That's funny
It takes great work and thinking to keep from doing work.
by tito (eight and oh) on Jun 10, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
how is it special when without the system the promoter can literally pull a belt out of his ass to make a fight a title fight and 5 rounds if he wants to?
To expand…
How is it special when Christian M’Pumbu and Richard Hale just fought five rounds for some garbage belt and Rampage and Lyoto, FORMER CHAMPIONS AT THE HIGHEST STAGE!!!, had to settle for three?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
We could have Carwin vs. JDS for the UFC 131 Championship!
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jun 10, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Because nothing matters
outside of ZUFFA
Why I never joined a frat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-KNVrZaN8M
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
"A samurai would bite your cock off if you tried that shit on the battlefield." - Kid Nate
by Chris Barton on Jun 10, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks, Derek.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "Everybody underestimates the kick in the groin." - Bas Rutten
by Richard Wade on Jun 10, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
The logic is simple
If the fight isn’t worthy of 5 rounds, it shouldn’t be a main event in the first place.
Mcloviiiiin!!
by Disco1Stu on Jun 10, 2011 2:41 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
so true
especially with 7 belts!!! injuries is the only reason a main event should be anything other than for a title or a title shot
I just had a flash back to wanting 2 more rounds during Rampage/Rashad
with every fiber of my being, except my genitals?
"Run and tweet THAT, homeboy."
see that is not possible for me.
my balls do all my thinking. so my genetalia always get a say.
"Many have the will to win. Few have to will to prepare to win."
" A black belt only covers 2 inches of your ass. The rest is up to you." - Royce Gracie
"Wanderlei eventually got to his feet and stalked Fujita like a Japanese octopus in an all-female prison." - Sean Baby Cracked.com
by the-gentle-way on Jun 10, 2011 2:52 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
What about the middle one?
"So even though it’s the gayest sport ever, MMA is still the best sport ever. I love my gay sport." - Wrestling Uber Alles
"Ellismania is, along with the black President, a symbol of the future." - Mayhem Miller
Tweeter!
by alicks on Jun 10, 2011 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
its a sad truth
"Many have the will to win. Few have to will to prepare to win."
" A black belt only covers 2 inches of your ass. The rest is up to you." - Royce Gracie
"Wanderlei eventually got to his feet and stalked Fujita like a Japanese octopus in an all-female prison." - Sean Baby Cracked.com
by the-gentle-way on Jun 10, 2011 3:18 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
So crappy fights will be 66 percent crappier
and awesome fights will be 66 percent awesomer. I can live with that trade-off.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jun 10, 2011 2:49 PM EDT reply actions 7 recs
Exactly
If I don’t wanna watch you fight for 5 rounds, I probably wouldn’t wanna watch 3 rounds either.
"Run and tweet THAT, homeboy."
Bathroom break.
Obvious solution to crappy fights.
by pud333 on Jun 10, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
green
i <3 grammatically incorrect postfixs hammered onto ‘awesome’
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions
5 round fights provide less incentive to go all-out for a finish, given the greater risk of wearing yourself out during the course of a fight. Forget about saying “what if” a certain fight had been five rounds: the pace and strategy within those fights quite likely would’ve been different.
Apples to Oranges
Abc
Walmart
Clean car
Mike jones
I think the mindset and intensity of fighters is different in title vs non-title fights so to compare the stoppage rate between the two based solely on five round criteria is wrong. The better question for those stat comparisons is weather title fights themselves reduce stoppages, not the number of rounds. It’s simply speculation until enough data can be gathered for five-round, non-title fights.
An aweful fight doesn’t do expenentially more damage to the paying fan’s opinion with two more rounds. Would the complaints increase a bit? Sure, but the logic is creating an opportunity for a “home run” in the final 2 round on a lackluster card. A moment that could erase what had been an average fight or card. One finish in a fight such as Rampage v Hamill would justify this move for the UFC, even if it was followed up by five, five-round decisions in non-title fight headliners afterward. There is simply more to be gained than lost.
by Luffmania on Jun 10, 2011 2:56 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I don't like how the article picture implies that the Silva/Maia fight has to do with
this argument. That was a title fight, yo. It would have been 5 round no matter what.
Also, I like 5 rounds. So there.
somebody compiled all the non title main event fights in the past 2 years that went to a decision:
UFC 131 Rampage/Hamill
UFC 127 Penn/Fitch
UFC 123 Rampage/Machida
UFC 122 Marquardt/Okami
UFC 120 Bisping/Akiyama
UFC 114 Rampage/Rashad
UFC 108 Rashad/Thiago Silva
UFC 106 Tito/Forrest
UFC 105 Couture/Vera
UFC 102 Couture/Nogueira
UFC 99 Franklin/Wanderlei
UFC Live Sanchez/Kampmann
UFN Nogueira/Davis
UFN Maynard/Diaz
I cant see one I wouldnt want to see 2 more rounds of.
The 5 round main events has more to do with closure than finishing. In general people care more about the main event than any other fight. The main event is also promoted and hyped more than any other fight. 3 rounds simply does not provide the “closure” necessary to match the anticipation, hype or the promotion.
Whether it’s a boring fight or not has nothing to do with closure. That is more about performance. Even if the main event fighters perform 3 rounds isnt enough of a platform to get that closure
Closure is needed… even if it goes to a decision getting 5 rounds of something you’ve been hearing about for more than a month provides that closure to the hype and anticipation.
3 rounds does not.
Moreover, from a sport perspective as guys continue to tighten up their games finishes and clear victories will be less and less. from a sport perspective eventually every fight needs to be 5 rounds and championship possibly 7. from a business perspective It’s tough to see happening though.
On one hand you’d have to cut half of the fights on a card which means a significant savings in fighter pay per event which is the bright side…. however the probability of a card turning into a dud greatly increases. Right now 2 title fights on a card is a big risk because if they are both snoozers it ruins the night…. imagine every fight being 5 rounds. With 3 round fights you mitigate that risk – where even if a few fights are duds you improve the probablity of holy shit moments with more fights.
So from a sport perspective it should eventually become 5 and 7 but from a reality perspective that will likely never happen.
I wanted 3 things structurally to improve the sport:
1. 5 round main events (check)
and
2. knees on the ground
3. upkicks (not soccer kicks)
knees on the ground and upkicks will provide a more fluid experience for the fighters and the fans.
We got # 1. The likelihood of the other 2 happening is slim to none for 2 reasons:
Zuffa – in its efforts to get sanctioning – uses a 10 year track record based on the current unified rules. If you change the rules the entire case goes out the window.
So now we have to wait for every market to get open. Even after that you have to organize every commission and market in changing the rules. It’s improbable at best.
Structurally the only other problem I see with the sport besides ringside official/judge education is scoring.
Greg Jackson and Firas Zahabi have realized that controlling a fight scores as much as attacking and it carries alot less risk. what this means is more and more fighters will look to control rather than attack because it makes more sense.
Here’s the problem… there is no good structural solution. People suggest a yellow card. Zuffa already has a yellow card that’s more significant than what pride had (locker room bonuses, future opponent options, slot on card, etc…)
so yellow card out the window.
The other solution people suggest is to not score takedowns on top position as much or at all if nothing is done with it. This will result in an even worse product because as soon as a guy gets taken down they will just hold on from the bottom and stall. At least now the fighter on the bottom knows he’s losing so there’s incentive to move and create action in either getting up, sweeping or subbing.
There is no good structural solution to “controlling”. It’s so bad that Kenny Florian even one a round or 2 dry humping Bj’s leg against the fence.
The only real solution is the fighter solution. Fighters need to defend being controlled. Fighters need to realize that when their back is against the fence or on the ground they are losing.
only fighters can solve this problem. And controlling can be done in many ways… it can be done with a jab, leg kicks, top position, against the fence, etc…
I am convinced that the biggest improvement to product quality will come in the form of peak performance mental training. Flow state. The more fighters are in flow state the better they perform. The fight night, submission, ko bonuses make absolutely no difference to product quality.
Zuffa could scrap that tomorrow and nothing would change… Zuffa could spend a quarter of that providing fighters biofeedback mental training, peak performance sports psychology, etc… and the difference would be staggering.
how to get fighters in or close to flow state during their fight is the greatest key to product improvement.
What is flow state: Flow State as described by Csíkszentmihályi:
Flow is the mental state of operation in which a person in an activity is fully immersed in a feeling of energized focus, full involvement, and success in the process of the activity. Proposed by Mihály Csíkszentmihályi, the positive psychology concept has been widely referenced across a variety of fields.1
According to Csíkszentmihályi, flow is completely focused motivation. It is a single-minded immersion and represents perhaps the ultimate in harnessing the emotions in the service of performing and learning. In flow, the emotions are not just contained and channeled, but positive, energized, and aligned with the task at hand. To be caught in the ennui of depression or the agitation of anxiety is to be barred from flow. The hallmark of flow is a feeling of spontaneous joy, even rapture, while performing a task2 although flow is also described (below) as a deep focus on nothing but the activity – not even oneself or one’s emotions.
jordan performed mostly in a flow state. Fedor at his best peformed in a flow state (seemingly emotionless). Anderson flows. Jon Jones Flows.
GSP doesnt flow. He thinks too much during the fight.
Getting fighters to perform in or closer to the flow state is the greatest key to improving the product.
by mmalogic on Jun 10, 2011 3:03 PM EDT reply actions 7 recs
Check, and mate.
I didn’t read the whole thing, but I can say that I would’ve loved to see two extra rounds for most of these main events that went to a decision you listed. Check, and mate. Well done.
Gotta be careful, dude
I didn’t read the whole thing
At one point, he says some really anti-Semitic things and begins listing dudes he thinks are cute.
"Run and tweet THAT, homeboy."
by TheFilt on Jun 10, 2011 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions 12 recs
And I think anyone who rec'ed it is now technically Logic's wife.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jun 10, 2011 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Csíkszentmihályi's book on this "Flow", is one of the biggest life changers I've ever read.
It’s like a self help book written in reverse. The author is not trying to say “do this and be happy”, the author is saying “Here’s what happy people do. I researched the shit out of it.”
Thanks for posting, mmalogic!
I don’t have the patience to read all that, but it looks like logic and I found a bunch of things to agree on.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
im on chapter 42
it certainly starts to drag around chapter 27, but it really picks up inthe 30’s. just when i was getting bored the 3-way with gina carano really sucked me back in.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions
the very idea of lesnar hold a pen in those lunchboxes writing, or hammering away at a keyboard with those giant fingers of his…. its just comical (and ludicrous)
how many pens did he crush? how many keyboards did he smash? seriously? you know the old joke, jenna jamesons vajayjay blah blah, so loose, blah blah hot dog down a hallway…. lesnar fingers could satisfy that hallway.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think I wanted to see any more of Couture/Vera . . .
. . . regardless, your point stands because that’s the only one in like two years that I wouldn’t want to see any more of.
Ranked #2 P4P Best BloodyElbow User Name
The Solution Is:
Apply the unified rules as they are meant to be applied! Octagon control should be determined if and only if someone did not have the superior striking or grappling.
Effective aggression (landing strikes/techniques while attacking) counts if and only if you can’t determine who controlled the fighting area.
Effective defense (avoiding strikes/techniques) counts if and only if you can’t determine who was more aggressive effectively.
It is simple. Just apply it as it is meant to be applied.
Imagine how effective Clay Guida will be with 5 rounds under his ass!
My angry blanket will never lose!
The dude abides.
Guida beats BJ 9 out of 10 with 5 rounds. Matter of fact, Guida beats everyone but Frankie in five rounds
You retired from kick boxing in 2006. If you had to do it all over again, would you have tried fighting in MMA?
Jean-Charles Skarbowsky: No.
Or Roger...
Huerta.
Or Tyson Griffin. Or… well, you get the idea.
by Sergio Hernandez on Jun 10, 2011 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, bring up the two fights of his that could've gone either way and were the most exciting!
FSKING Clay had Huerta by the balls and threw it all away.
The dude abides.
So? Dude said that...
Guida is the number two LW in the UFC which is BEYOND false.
He doesn’t beat Edgar, Maynard, Griffin, Miller, Sherk, etc.
by Sergio Hernandez on Jun 11, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
pfft!!!
He wouldn’t be awake for 5 rounds with bj or kenny.
"Many have the will to win. Few have to will to prepare to win."
" A black belt only covers 2 inches of your ass. The rest is up to you." - Royce Gracie
"Wanderlei eventually got to his feet and stalked Fujita like a Japanese octopus in an all-female prison." - Sean Baby Cracked.com
by the-gentle-way on Jun 10, 2011 5:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
That is beyond stupid.
Sorry but it is.
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
I guess you forgot
Learn JiuJitsu, it's fun.
Hey, hey what can I do?---I got a little woman and she won't be true.
He's got 6 sub losses
A fight with BJ would resemble that GIF and this pic.
"Run and tweet THAT, homeboy."
Mark has been missed.
thinking you can draw a math equation to determine if someone if going to get finished is silly. you cant, its a fight. past that the argument appears to be ‘some fights i dont want to watch more of i.e. rampage v. hamill’ to me this is just as silly. dont watch it. pick up the remote and change the channel. easy as that. they have these things called mma websites, theyre pretty cool. if you dont want to, or cant watch a fight, you can go to one and find out what the outcome was. you should check them out, heres a good one.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:13 PM EDT reply actions
Community,
I want to ban this gentlemen for posting a link to They Who Shall Not Be Named.
What say you?
Love,
Michael (G.) Fagan
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
by Mike Fagan on Jun 10, 2011 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOH
damn, that slipped right by me. huge no-no.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
thanks brother
haha… i was totally not thinking… or drunk… pick one.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Did you quit drinking or something?
"So even though it’s the gayest sport ever, MMA is still the best sport ever. I love my gay sport." - Wrestling Uber Alles
"Ellismania is, along with the black President, a symbol of the future." - Mayhem Miller
Tweeter!
im no quitter
scotch has attempted to ban me a few times, but i always find a way back in.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sterling Mallory Archer has been thrown out of better by worse.
You retired from kick boxing in 2006. If you had to do it all over again, would you have tried fighting in MMA?
Jean-Charles Skarbowsky: No.
HAHAHAHAHAHA
so much win.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
We are on an mma website. If you are going to link one, use the one we are fuggin using
You retired from kick boxing in 2006. If you had to do it all over again, would you have tried fighting in MMA?
Jean-Charles Skarbowsky: No.
*ahem*
that was the joke, coupled with it being the worst website…ever
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Who the fuck is Mark?
"So even though it’s the gayest sport ever, MMA is still the best sport ever. I love my gay sport." - Wrestling Uber Alles
"Ellismania is, along with the black President, a symbol of the future." - Mayhem Miller
Tweeter!
i dont know
but i miss him.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I can spare him one time but that's his last warning
“I’ll allow it”
aka DJ Enwurd, on the wheels of steel spinnin only the livest shit you've heard on the radio over and over again while shakin his dreds.
@KrimsonTVN
DIA2ill.com coming soon....
wait, i had something for this
…something about judge greg mathis and court tv evidence…..
damn.
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions
You know why title fights have a smaller finishing percentage? Competitive match making.
Am I sorry for Frank Mir-ing by answering myself? Absolutely not.
by castleeb on Jun 10, 2011 3:32 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
What a strange hypothesis.
There are more finishes in non-title fights, so 5-round non-title fights would have less finishes?!? There are some serious logical fallacies at play in this article.
Reporting from inside a padded cage at MMAmadman.com.
agreed
its clear that a lot of research went into it, so the effort is certainly there and i do appreciate that. but that doesnt save it from being very flawed and thusly judged…mostly by people like me that dont post, just comment in a negative/drunken manner because its oh so gratifying. seriously, what else am i suppose to do in my underwear on my couch, hand clasping a glass of scotch and a lap full of gummi bears. you tell me sir. WHAT ELSE AM I SUPPOSE TO DO?
Jonny Bench called.
by Sterling Archer on Jun 10, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t like this idea because it devalues the sport aspect of MMA. What is the precedent for five-round fights? Does the UFC just pick the fights they want to be five-round? If fights like Couture/Machida are still three rounds due to not being main or co-main event, should all TUF, VS or FN main events really be five rounds? Fighters now have incentive to try and NOT be main event, just for the purpose of not having to go five rounds, if that suits their style. With only title fights being five rounds, you don’t see fighters refuse to get a title shot because they have to fight five rounds. I just don’t like how a random selection of fights are going to be made 67% longer just because matchmaking happened to create certain fights. With title fights, it’s the be-all and end-all – champ vs contender.
I wouldn’t mind if all fights were five rounds. That’d make it fair. If that happened, there’d also be the option of making title fights 7 rounds.
Who cares how many finishes there are?
Do you make the super bowl 6 quarters? Should the Stanley Cup finals be 6 periods?
The point is that all these guys are fighting for the same thing, and they should all be fighting within the same rule set. Not to mention that 3 rounds is just a ridiculously short amount of time to truly decide which fighter is better. Unless its amateur every fight should be at least 5 rounds, because that’s how long it takes to decide who’s better.
"The only freakshow's the one in my pants"
-James Toney
This just kind of feels
like one of those things that everybody is going to be all stoked about beforehand, but gradually start to become less enchanted with as time goes on.
To be honest, I think that Wanda Sykes commercial where she warns the teenagers about throwing around the word "gay" because it contains such offensive connotations actually makes a really good point...No Homo.
THANK YOU BASED MODS!!!!!
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