I Hope You Weren't Surprised by Shane Mosley's Performance Against Manny Pacquiao
by Mike Fagan on May 8, 2011 2:00 PM EDT
in Boxing
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Last night's boxing superight between Manny Pacquiao and Shane Mosley drew the ire of both the fans in attendance at the MGM Grand Garden Arena and the snarky pundits that populate Twitter.
The fight started competitively enough. I scored the opening round 10-10, and Mosley seemed to hold his own through two. Pacquiao dropped him in the third, the first time Mosley ate canvas since he fought Vernon Forrest in 2002. Mosley survived the rest of the round, and looked recovered at the start of the fourth.
While his faculties returned, his offense stagnated. Mosley showed flashes of competitiveness, landing the isolated hard counter, but Pacquiao overwhelmed him with speed -- both foot and hand -- forcing Mosley into react mode.
That narrative continued through the tenth. Mosley stepped on Pacquiao's lead foot, and the momentum of the action caused Pacquiao to slip and fall to the canvas. Kenny Bayless picked up the count started by the ringside official, indicating a knockdown (though two of the judges ringside ignored the decree).
The "knockdown" lit a fire under Pacquiao, who came out strong after the restart and kept up that pace until the final bell in the twelfth.
As the bout wound down, MMA Junkie lead staff reporter John Morgan led the jeers from Twitterville:
Crowd grows very restless in the ninth. Pacman flurries but having trouble finding Kalib Star, er, Shane Mosley. It's 10-9, and 90-80.
$5 million, huh? At least try and fight back.
Never said it was, but is it too much to ask to stand and trade? RT @Mike_Fagan_13: I'm sure fighting Pacquiao is easy game.
He lost. Same as Mosley. He just looked like a fighter doing it. RT @Mike_Fagan_13 Ask Ricky Hatton how that went.
He ended with this, with what I can only assume was a sarcastic reply in my direction:
Alright - packing up. Enjoyed the experience. I stand corrected. Amazing performance by Mosley. Maybe his best fight ever.
Morgan's complaints, which emanated from more than just his account, read like your typical call into an afternoon sports radio show. "What's Mosley doing in there?! He's getting paid $5 million for this! Get in there and fight! I'M ENTITLED TO ENTERTAINMENT!"
So, what exactly did you expect last night?
Shane Mosley is 39 years old. He fought to an ugly draw in his last fight with Sergio Mora after Floyd Mayweather Jr. dismantled him last May. Oddsmakers were so confident in his abilities that they inserted him as an 8-1 underdog against Pacquiao.
It was clear to me after the knockdown that Manny Pacquiao had beaten Shane Mosley mentally. Pacquiao, as Al Bernstein noted on the broadcast, wasn't even using the angles that befuddled Antonio Margarito and Joshua Clottey and Miguel Cotto. Pacquiao blitzed him with speed that Mosley could not keep up with.
Did Mosley shut down into survival mode? Sure. But to suggest that he throw caution to the wind and engage Manny Pacquiao, the best boxer on the planet, with reckless abandon is foolish. To further compare Mosley's performance to Kalib Starne's embarrassing display at UFC 83 shows an inability to appreciate the difference between Pacquiao and Nate Quarry.
I don't feel sorry if you feel hoodwinked by last night's main event. Complaining about the pedestrian performance of an 8-1 underdog is akin to complaining that Transformers 3 didn't live up to your lofty expectations.
Shane Mosley fought the fight everyone expected from him. Deal with it.
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It’s a real shame ignorant UFC fans are using this fight to confirm boxings death.
by NoHo on May 8, 2011 2:03 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
People need to remember, fights like last night only happen
When Boxing’s best refuse to face each other. Pacquiao’s fights at the least tend to be an event in themselves, but really who are we kidding? Pacquiao vs Mayweather Jr is the only fight people want to see, and they wanted to see it 2 years ago. Boxing is killing itself.
by KJ Gould on May 8, 2011 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
i can’t understand why casual boxing fans are dying to see this fight it will look pretty similar to last nights fight with floyd fighting on the back foot occasionally countering while manny tries to make him engage its not going to be a vasquez/marquez type of fight
Well,
first off, unless you’re packing a crystal ball then I doubt you can say for sure how the fight will play out. The main reason we want this fight is because they are far and away the 2 best fighters in their weight bracket, and it’s a very intriguing style matchup. Slick counter fighter with brilliant defense, against virtuosic, agressive combination puncher.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
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by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
And I'm not even dying to see that anymore
After all his arrests and what not.
"I will do nothing lightly. When I walk, I will walk heavily. When I fight, I will fight with conviction. When I speak, I will speak strongly. When I love, I will love with everything"
Yeah, I hate when boxing's best refuse to fight eachother
Thank God we watch MMA where Anderson/GSP is happening. Wait.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
by Neil Manich on May 8, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The differences have been discussed very often, dude.
The main sticking point for me is:
Floyd and Pacman have a history of fighting in the same weightclasses
The distance between GSP and A. Silva is 15lbs, and both are very well suited to their own classes
People are begging GSP to go up a class, even though that would make him a very small middleweight and he would have a lot of trouble if he couldn’t beat the larger middleweights. Going up and down 15lbs is not a great situation.
Catchweight.
Voila.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
-Socrates
by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
That would be nice, wouldn’t it?
A lot of people are saying GSP should go up to middleweight and fight a few contenders before Anderson, but I do like the idea of a straight up catchweight superfight… if either loses it’s just “Okay this guys is #2 P4P I guess” and they can return to their weightclasses! Everyone is happy.
Fuck that.
GSP is a welterweight. Anderson Silva is a middleweight. Those are definitely their best weight classes, but Anderson could definitely make a 175-180 lb catchweight, and GSP isn’t anywhere near as undersized as people suggest. Georges is a big welterweight, Anderson is an average sized middleweight.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
-Socrates
by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
And boxing's best is only two guys.
But with MMA, there’s a constantly shifting field of top men in the sport.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
MMA fans are so confident in their ignorance.
Scary.
"Unless you can’t think of something intelligent to say, don’t reply and make the world as dumb as you are appearing to be." - mabel4life
by lowellthehammer on May 8, 2011 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Name two other guys that can draw the entire boxing audience to one TV.
Enlighten me.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions
being a draw is different then being the best sergio martinez would beat both mayweather and pac unfortunately he is spanish based argentinian middleweight who fights in altantic city who falls to draw.
Sergio beating Pacquiao or Mayweather?
Come on.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
OK, I'll believe that when I see it.
And knowing how boxing promotions work, I probably won’t.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
So Pac/Mayweather are the only draws because nobody else draws millions of buys?
Odd. How many draws does MMA have by those standards? GSP and…and…
"Unless you can’t think of something intelligent to say, don’t reply and make the world as dumb as you are appearing to be." - mabel4life
by lowellthehammer on May 8, 2011 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Lots.
Brock Lesnar, Rampage Jackson, Fedor, Alistair Overeem, Jon Jones, B.J. Penn, Nick Diaz, and Gina Carano all strike me as big draws with the MMA audience.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Jones lost ratings between the two Versus cards he headlined
and drew under 500k in a title fight. In what possible way can you call him a draw?
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
He has really really long arms.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
by Neil Manich on May 8, 2011 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
F***.
Beat me to it.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Like this.
It was his first title fight against a fighter largely unknown to the casual fan base, plus a weak supporting card — the draws they got for that event seem pretty good in retrospect.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions
This is where you went wrong:
all strike me
Most recent buyrates for events with said fighters:
Rampage – 500,000 buys for UFC 123
Fedor – 741,000 for Fedor vs. Silva (SHO)
Overeem – 448,000 for Heavy Artillery (SHO)
Jones – 445,000 for UFC 128
Penn – 260,000 for UFC 127
Diaz – 528,000 for Diaz vs. Daley (SHO)
Carano – 576,000 for Carano vs. Cyborg (SHO)
So the highest draw on PPV is 500,000. Surely they aren’t draws at all because they can’t break a million viewers. Fedor/Overeem/Diaz/Carano couldn’t even break a mil on cable! How does MMA even survive with so few drawing fighters?
"Unless you can’t think of something intelligent to say, don’t reply and make the world as dumb as you are appearing to be." - mabel4life
by lowellthehammer on May 8, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You can't fairly compare PPV buys with viewers on a pay for network
Unless you can prove subscriptions to Showtime were bought for those fights.
"How does MMA even survive with so few drawing fighters?"
Simple.
Using UFC/Strikeforce as the core example, MMA generates more revenue on a yearly basis by having lots events with competitive top-level fighters at least once a month.
Boxing (HBO/Showtime) only does a few million draws each year with a few big-ticket fights, while MMA does a lot more in the same time frame.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
You're replying seriously to obvious sarcasm?
I give up.
"Unless you can’t think of something intelligent to say, don’t reply and make the world as dumb as you are appearing to be." - mabel4life
by lowellthehammer on May 8, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Huh.
Judging from earlier posts, I think it started being sarcasm when you lost the argument.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Haye vs Klitschko will do a million PPV buys here in the UK no problem, and probably even more than that in Germany. MMA is booming in the US, but in Europe boxing is far, far bigger still.
by sheikybaby on May 8, 2011 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
American MMA fans can’t seem to grasp that boxing is a more global sport. Sure it’s still niche but so is MMA. BTW Japanese boxers draw more in Japan than MMA.
by someguy22 on May 8, 2011 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Victor Ortiz/Andre Berto did 1.5 million views on HBO a few weeks ago. I know someone will go “FREE PREVIEW WEEKEND ON DIRECTV!” but we have a pretty good idea of how free previews impact the combat sports audience and it isn’t 1 million viewers or anything.
Boxing is moving away from using PPV for every fight worth seeing and it’s doing quite well at it.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
that was a great fight btw, too bad Berto got out-worked :(
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 9:37 AM EDT up reply actions
Haha
Made me spit out some of my sammach, sir!
"You eat what you kill, and that is all." -Shane Carwin
by James Anthony on May 8, 2011 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
And then God created Saturn ... and he liked it, so he put a ring on it. ... Always a ninja
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For one, there's been plenty of other fights UFC has managed to put on where the two actual best fighters in a weight class face each other on a regular basis
For two, how many boxing weight classes separate 170lbs and 185lbs?
And lastly, both fighters should get a shit ton more then just a few hundred k each to make the biggest fight in UFC history. Split Mosley’s purse in half as a guarantee for each fighter on top of PPV % and it’s still considerably more likely to happen then Pacman / Mayweather.
Yeah
I think the way to make that fight is throw cash at Georges. And I think it’s likely that’s what they do.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
dead? nah. on life support? definitely.
shame too. boxing would greatly benefit from major restructuring and get back on track to being greater than it is now.
by Victor Rodriguez on May 8, 2011 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
To be honest
I don’t think it’s a shame at all. Boxing is a novelty, it isn’t even a complete striking form. I would much rather see Muay Thai with a western scoring criteria. Kickboxing with knees and elbows is SO much more entertaining than boxing.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
-Socrates
by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Why, why, why do people ignore the generally solid numbers that boxing has been doing for the past few years? I’m going to keep pointing out Berto/Ortiz doing 1.5 million viewers on HBO until someone comes up with a neat way to act like it didn’t happen or wasn’t a good number. And if you want to play the “free preview weekend on directv” card even though people know that it doesn’t have a HUGE impact on viewership. Cotto/Foreman did 1.6 in 2010. Guerrero/Escobedo – Judah/Mathysse – 766,000 viewers in 2010 on boxing after dark. Donaire-Montiel – 1.020 million on boxing after dark.
How about the generally weak friday night fight cards. Here’s the quickest recent ratings I could find:
January 7, 2011 – Prodvonikov/Herrera – 545,000 live viewers
January 14, 2011 – Manfredo/Eduard – 788,000 live viewers
January 28, 2011 – Arreola/Abell – 734,000 live viewers
HBO WCB Boxing – January 29, 2011 – Bradley-Alexander – 1.345 million live viewers
November 20, 2010 – HBO – 8:00pm PST – Martinez-Williams – 1.3 million viewers
November 27, 2010 – HBO – 7:00pm PST – Marquez-Katsidis – 998,000 viewers
SOMEBODY GET THE PADDLES! IT’S DYING!
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 8 recs
for some reason whenever I do this there are always 30-60 minutes of crickets
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I make a point of leaving any time a man screams "GET THE PADDLES!"
Fool me once…
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
i can't speak for the previous posters.
i simply say that because it seems to lack the mainstream recognition that it used to have. that’s not to say that it doesn’t have fans or solid buyrates.
as a sport and as a source of revenue, boxing will never die, and i stand by that. it just doesn’t seem to have as much of a future anymore with the cultural shift in this country and the ascent of MMA. i most certainly could be wrong, but i freely admit to speculating on the trends we’ve been seeing for the past few years in the sport.
by Victor Rodriguez on May 8, 2011 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Actually, the trend is that as MMA was really picking up steam, boxing ratings took a big hit. They continued trying to push cable fights onto PPV..etc. Then they learned a valuable lesson and scaled back sharply on the number of PPV’s and better fights were getting made routinely. the past few years have seen a big turnaround in how they handle business and it’s led to a pretty nice rebound in the ratings.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Those are shitty numbers
For a sport that’s been around as boxing has, those are terrible numbers in my opinion. Wait until MMA has been around another 15 years or so… 1.5 million buys will be a terrible night.
by Wrestling Uber Alles on May 8, 2011 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Mayweather and Pacquiao won’t fight. That’s a paddlin’
No next Mike Tyson. That’s a paddlin’
Rogan said “MMA is swallowing boxing.” That’s a paddlin’
by someguy22 on May 8, 2011 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
haha
I remember that episode, those kids couldn’t do shit without getting a paddlin haha!
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Eh.
Exactly how I figured it would go. Pacquiao is just too fast, too good. I think another person said a few days ago, something about how it must be paralyzing to get hit by Pacquiao, knowing you’ll get hit a dozen more times and you can’t do anything about it. They’re probably right on the money with that.
A confusing stance.
Here are your choices:
1. Play defense all night, hardly attempt to throw any meaningful punches and lose a decision but get paid.
2. Go balls out, throw caution to the wind, let ’em fly and maybe actually have a chance at winning the fight and then get paid.
Just because everyone expected Mosley to lose doesn’t mean they should be any less happy that he didn’t go with the second option. Seriously, what’s there to lose? The fight? You’re losing anyone. No one ever won a fight covering up and backing away. Yes, Pacman is the best on the planet but that doesn’t mean tuck tail and just collect your check.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
Ugh.
You’re losing anyone
Should read: You’re losing anyway.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
Oh, speak of the devil.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, I see.
Ha. Jesus, you guys gotta relax a bit.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
Seriously, what’s there to lose?
His brain cells.
by Henrique on May 8, 2011 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Because there's no difference in brain damage
between a knockdown and this, right?
Levels of consciousness don't necessarily reflect a great difference in brain trauma
If all Mosley was going to do was cover up, it’s only a step up from throwing in the towel.
People would pay to see him fight, especially in the UK
Though Hatton shouldn’t ever fight again. Anyone going to pay to watch Mosley fight now? After his last several fights? This should be Mosley’s last fight as well. He may not have got KO’d, but his marketability did.
Did you see Hatton during the 360 show?
Dude seems completely different now. Got reallly fat too.
He always got fat between camps
Now he’s retired, he stays fat. Plus cocaine isn’t a healthy lifestyle choice either.
So, what you're saying is that a 39 year old boxer
Should have been bruttaly knockout so his “marketabillity” doesn’t suffer?
Mosley will probably retire. Wiith 5 millions on his bank account and a couple thousands more neurons in his brain. Pretty sweet deal, IMO.
He would have got 5 million for doing nothing for half the fight, or 5 million for not coming out of his corner
And he would / should retire regardless.
Throwing the towell
Is a big deal in boxing. Just ask the great Roberto Durán.
I guess you think Mike Russow’s corner should have thrown the towell against Todd Duffee…
Don't talk down on the hammerfist of doom
Russow was still game. And if we’re talking about Boxing legacy, if that’s what ultimately matters, going out on your shield is better than retreating.
hmmm I thought the fight was fine, he played defense and got to a decision.
He didn’t want to get knocked out. I don’t blame him. It’s bad for your brain. He had never been knocked out, he’s in what could be his last big fight, or last fight period and he didn’t want it to end via knockout. He was fighting the best and he didn’t want to go out on his shield. He said as much in the post fight interview.
I enjoyed watching it all go down. Pac is great, so to see him not able to finish the fight is disappointing, but at the same time he won the match against a guy who didn’t want to be knocked out more than he wanted to win.
The level of boxing was exceptional and the fight before the main event was pretty good as well. I was happy.
Geno, we've disagreed on a lot of things and this will just be another instance in that long line
I’m not sure you really understand boxing. You may be a fight fan, but I’m not sure you’re actually a Fight Fan. The strategy that Mosley came in with went out the window when he was dropped. Ask anyone who’s fought before and you’ll get the same response that getting dropped usually changes the entire fight.
He had a better showing against Pacquiao than Joshua Clottey and arguably Ricky Hatton and Oscar De La Hoya. If you watch fights to be entertained all the time, then I’m pretty sure you’re a fan of the wrong sports. Your comparison to Kalib Starnes was downright ridiculous last night.
I respect the fact you’re knowledgable about certain things but this isn’t one of them.
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
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by Matthew Roth on May 8, 2011 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ha.
Okay, man. I’m not a real fan, I don’t understand, all that. Sorry. Off I go.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
by Geno Mrosko on May 8, 2011 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wait huh? Throw in the towel cause he wasn't going to rebound?
No, throwing in towel is when a fighter is in danger and taking unanswered shots. Such as the previous fight when Arce was landing clean power shots for close to two minutes. Mosley wasn’t in danger. He was just outclassed.
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So he was just wasting time then
I don’t see much difference to covering up for the rest of the fight and throwing the towel in.
Covering up is what Joshua Clottey did
Mosley was competitive against a far superior fighter. I really can’t tell if you’d rather these guys just swing at each other until one falls over or if you understand that a large part of boxing is defense.
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
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Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
No, I'm saying employ a strategy that involves a chance, no matter how remote, of winning you the fight
Mosley trying something may have given him a fraction of a percent chance of winning. Covering up gave him an absolute zero chance. When it’s a matter of absolute zero and a fraction, the difference is infinite. If he can no longer rebound from a knockdown to do anything, he should never have been in that ring to begin with. Ergo it was a waste of the paying public’s time and another con perpetuated by a crooked and corrupt sport.
Breaking news: Guy from Pro Wrestling Blog Shows Tragic Misunderstanding of how Real Sports Operate
Coming up next, an MMA fan draws a stupid comparison because they aren’t educated enough to make a good one. Stay tuned!
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
The sweet science aka the art of hitting without getting hit
Up until round 4, we saw two guys trying to implement that to the best of their abilities. After that we was a 39 year old fighter tragically hanging on until time ran out in an attempt to save face.
by KJ Gould on May 8, 2011 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Nice use of strawman
If all else fails, attempt to attack the credibility of someone you disagree with based on a stereotype.
by KJ Gould on May 8, 2011 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 7 recs
Well given that you haven't had an ounce of worthwhile conversation yet, it's fair.
All you’ve said is Mosley should have let himself get knocked out. That’s lunacy. You think he should have thrown more punches… when? What should he have thrown? What adjustments could he have made? Or what could Pacquiao done to force Mosley to open up? Would more body work have done it, and how could Manny have accomplished that from a southpaw stance without exposing himself to a right counter from Mosley?
You’re not saying anything worth listening to, you’re just shouting that Mosley looked bad over and over. And showing a tragic lack of knowledge in doing so.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I'm saying Mosley shouldn't have been in there to start with
He has as much business fighting Pacquiao as Mark Coleman has fighting Anderson Silva. Both were champions at one point, both could be considered among the best at one point in their careers, both should no longer be fighting. Mosley shouldn’t have let himself got knocked out, but that’s the risk when you’re in a sport where the rules are to punch the head or body. If Mosley didn’t want to get hit or risk getting hit, he shouldn’t have been in there but he was in there because the promoters paid him a lot of money to be in there in the hope of adding a highlight reel performance to the career of the one guy they actually cared about.
This is one of the many main things wrong with boxing.
KJ i love your pieces on grappling but your boxing knowledge seems limited. Comparing Shane Mosley to Mark Coleman is a huge insult to ‘Sugar’ Shane. The game passed Coleman by about a decade ago, at worst Mosley was a top 10 contender at 147. Mosley was against the most ferocious attacking fighter since the adolescent Mike Tyson, i salute his bravery hanging in there for 36 minutes.
I think you're down playing Coleman
A terror in the early UFC’s, a UFC and Pride tournament champion. That’s a pretty significant accomplishment. I used him because he’s too old for the sport but had been a beast and was a ferocious attacking fighter in his own right when in his MMA prime. In that regard the comparison with Mosley is apt imo.
Shane Mosley is still an elite fighter though. That’s what you seem to be missing with your comparison.
Still a Beer Monster.
http://www.instrength.com
Elite against who?
Mosley’s ranked 3-5 at WW almost everywhere that does rankings. He was given a raw deal draw against a top guy in Mora that wouldn’t engage with him. He ended the dominance of Antonio Margacheato. He demolished Mayorga. He stunned one of the best defensive fighters I’ve ever seen in Mayweather, and was competitive in dropping a decision. He’s been facing the top of the pack in 3 divisions for well over a decade, and he’s still very competitive.
Still a Beer Monster.
http://www.instrength.com
- A top-5 ranking in what is an incredibly shallow welterweight division is nothing to boast. It was a ranking based essentially on reputation than merit.
- I had Mora winning, as did many. I won’t sit here and defend Mora’s cynical approach, but it’s not as if Sergio’s history in the ring promised anything else but what we saw. If Mosley was unprepared for that, it’s his own fault. A prime Mosley tools the Sergio Mora we saw that night. The Mosley we’ve come to accept was incapable getting his shots off and neutralizing Mora’s movement. What little exchanges took place that night, Mora won.
- It’d be harsh to deny Mosley credit for what he accomplished against Margarito, and I certainly won’t claim it was a meaningless win, but facts are facts: Margarito was deprived of his illegal wraps; he entered the ring that night weight drained and ill-prepared following a prolonged celebratory period following the Cotto victory; you couldn’t craft a better style for Mosley than the one Margarito offered. It was a solid victory, and a terrific performance, but it’s a win that offers a deceptive view of where Mosley was at that point in his career.
- He stunned him, and after failing finish him (miserably), spent the next ten rounds being made to look a fool, by an opponent content to stand in place right in front him, no less.
- Demolished? Really? Here are the scores that night, at the time of the stoppage:
107-102 (Mosley) 105-104 (Mayorga) 105-104 (Mosley)
A narrow split decision. The highlight reel knockout shouldn’t overshadow the fact that Mosley struggled mightily against a shot, out-of-shape fighter. Remember, it was largely based on his performance against Mayorga that Mosley was pegged a massive underdog against Margarito. He was deemed to be a spent force. Mosley’s last fight prior to Mayorga was against Cotto, a terrific performance; one can even argue Mosley did enough to earn the nod against the pound-for-pound Cotto. If Mosley looked as good against Mayorga as you claim he did, what reason would the boxing world have to so mightily doubt his chances against Margarito?
Yeah, answering the questions pdl is posing is much better than “HE SHOULD HAVE TAKEN A CHANCE!”
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
If he wasn't going to take a chance, then what was he doing in there?
Trying to survive the clock and save face. That’s it. At least in MMA he could have been mercifully saved by the referee in the third when Pacquiao landed a couple of shots once it went to the ground.
“If he wasn’t going to take a chance, then what was he doing in there?”
Earning a living?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
You're legitimately
okay with watching a guy survive for 12 rounds just to get paid? That’s something you like and want to see?
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
apparently, so did Mosley.
Getting bent out of shape over a fight promoter lying is like getting upset that a hooker won't kiss you. It betrays a deep lack of understanding of the nature of the profession.
The tragic reality of being REALLY FUCKING GOOD at something and WAY FUCKING BETTER than everyone else at it…
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
May as well have been a Silva vs Cote / Leites fight
At least Maia fought back even though utterly outclassed.
You’re right. at no point did Shane throw a single power shot all fight…
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by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions
yes!
After the 4th round he still landed power shots!
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
If only there were some sort of system that counted power shots round by round.
I’d give him a link, but it seems he didn’t even bother to watch the fight anyways.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
LOL please.
Maia looked even more pathetic than Mosley.
by Anton Tabuena on May 8, 2011 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Swinging from his knees
Maybe that looked pathetic to some. To me it showed more heart then Mosley.
by KJ Gould on May 9, 2011 6:51 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You watched it because you're a mark who saw a flyer.
Sports fans wanted to see one of the worlds greatest athletes perform their chosen craft.
I’m really sorry that you didn’t get to see Jersey Shore folks in the ring last night, must have been disappointing.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No
I get it. Watching Tiger Woods in his prime was a spectacle because excellence should be appreciated. Same for Pacman.
It’s still okay to say I’m not a fan of Mosley just collecting a check.
Run your mouth all you want and talk all the shit you want, it’s okay for people to think differently than you.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
by Geno Mrosko on May 8, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
Mosley shouldn't ever get another payday, and it'd be criminally irresponisble to give him one
He should never have been in that ring last night.
But he shouldn't
He’s not physically able to unless they find cans for the rest of his career. Ken Shamrock has a name, he shouldn’t be fighting either but he is and at least he’s relegated to the backwoods promotions instead of being promoted by a top sports provider in an attempt to con the public into believing he’s still a contender.
yeah he should’t but he will and molsey’s name is far bigger then kens so he has a while before he ends up in the backwoods
You mean the boxing promoters who wouldn't give James Toney a fight
but the UFC threw 500k at at heavily promoted co-main event slot?
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Who'd jump at the chance for Couture to come over and take on someone like Holyfield?
Past his prime but still very capable? Toney vs Couture was a one off to send a message. Boxing would make it a regular occurrence if it happened in their world.
Royce Gracie vs. Matt Hughes
Minowa vs. anyone
The Super Hulk tournament
Shall I go on?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
And UFC promoted how many of those you listed?
You can’t even compare Boxing to the japanese train wreck of fight booking.
A: Boxing is full of mismatches and joke fights! Not MMA!
B: Well, look at Japan.
A: That doesn’t count!
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Japanese MMA for the most part doesn't count as a legitimate sport
Yakuza run, everyone can use PEDs, no strict enforcement of weight classes and no end of mismatches not to mention crowbarring in some celebrities. Unless you’re going to comparedJames Toney in an MMA fight to Jose Canseco?
Are you including Shooto in this?
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You should do an interview with Shogun
and tell him all his Pride fights don’t count. So he’s 3-3. But there was no commission oversight on the Coleman bout, so it wasn’t a real sport. He’s 2-3. A sub .500 fighter was just a world champion. What a farcical sport you watch!
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
My neice drew a picture of you
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
wow dude, that's a wild claim
there were some freakshow/celebrity fights in japan, but there was also a lot of high level competition between the best in MMA.
FFS, gracie/sakuraba – the legit shape of things to come
"EVERYTHING IS HAPPENING"
- Bob Cole
toney vs couture
Nishijima v Hunt
kimbo vs ray mercer
ray mercer vs tim
Botha vs Akiyama
yet i can’t name on mma crossover to boxing
Of all those you listed
One was by a legitimate fight promoter, the others may as well be Toughman contests. Last I checked Toughman isn’t mentioned in the same company as De La Hoya, Arum or even King.
Are you saying that FEG isn't a legitimate promoter?
Cause that would also mean that K-1 isn’t a legitimate sport.
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Not a legitimate promoter of MMA, no
But then neither’s Gary Shaw, who still at least seems capable in Boxing.
So neither Hero's nor DREAM
are legitimate promotions?
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Organized crime, PEDS…et cetera ad nauseam.
Am I talking about Boxing, MMA, JMMA, or Kickboxing?
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Where it's completely accepted?
JMMA. It’s in such a state that it can not feasibly exist without the Yakuza running things. PED’s weren’t tested for, everyone that’s been following MMA long enough knows this. Being able to fight multiple times a year compared to fighters now in the UFC who seem injury prone by comparison suggested there were a lot of users as well. Featherweight fighters facing off against super featherweight fighters wasn’t out of the ordinary in JMMA. Easily more spectacle then sport, and why a lot of fighters from it are so battle damaged today.
You can't run any business in Japan without Yakuza
So that point is moot.
PEDs weren’t tested in the states either and in some instances they still aren’t. And even when tested, there are guys who have just learned to cycle to keep juicing.
Openweights, yeah I can see how you could contest this point. But that’s more cultural than anything having to do with Budo. So really the main point is a disagreement on Budo which is the display of warrior spirit.
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I can understand Budo
I can also understand how a western mind would have a hard time viewing that as a credible sport.
I don’t know what any of those things have to do with something being a sport.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Maybe because of what makes a sport a sport
rules, structure, competitive fair play etc
JMMA is certainly entertaining and visceral, but it can also be f**king chaotic and borderline criminal.
Well, whitewash it all you want, but Japan has a long (and often celebrated) history in MMA.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
And there were certainly rules, structure, etc. Just because you don’t agree with them doesn’t mean they didn’t exist.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Too bad we can't count it...
cause it’s not a sport.
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It was competition for sure
The more MMA cleans itself up the more a sport it becomes in the eyes of the masses even if it means the dilution of what it is that initially attracted us to it.
Nope, not a sport.
Wanderlei didn’t compete in a real sport until 2007 and has mostly lost since then. Why do people think he ever mattered?
And why did Chuck Liddell leave a real sport like UFC to dick around in that crazy non-sport shit in Japan? Oh well, at least he’s only lost to Rampage once.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions
No denying its place in history
Just like there’s no denying street fighting / prize fighting prior to the Marquis of Queensbury.
Man, this is such a terrible argument on your part. You just compared JMMA to streetfighting.
Still a Beer Monster.
http://www.instrength.com
He meant Street Fighter
since Gomi throws Haduken punches.
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JMMA isn't regulated or has any governing over sight
It’s unlicensed fighting. MMA in the UK is unlicensed fighting. MMA on Indian Reservations is unlicensed fighting. It’s that weird limbo between Amateur and Professional. Sorry if you believe otherwise.
Shooto has a governing body.
Sengoku had regulations and drug tested fighters.
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Which of the big five promoters is signing and marketing freak fights? What fight has HBO or Showtime boxing produced in the last couple of years has matched Randy vs Toney, Tito vs Shamrock III, or Herschel’s fights? In fact, the worst fights Gary Shaw has put together were for mma.
by John Nash on May 8, 2011 4:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The same UFC, who it is rumored that when asked by dementia suffering Gary Goodridge for tickets to the Ohio card they agreed as long as he signed over his image rights to the video in exchange?
by John Nash on May 8, 2011 3:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh it's not a rumor
They actually made him sign away his likeness for 4 tickets to UFC 129.
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And them left him in the desert to die.
It was a generous parting gift though, I agree.
by Charlie Custer on May 8, 2011 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not going to say Mosley should or shouldn’t retire, but what are you basing this “not physically able to” thing on? He just went 24 rounds with the two best boxers on the planet within a year’s time.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
by Mike Fagan on May 8, 2011 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Not being able to do anything after a knockdown early in the fight
Not able to recover / recuperate = not physically able to. The only reason Mosley was able to continue was because Boxing doesn’t allow you to finish a guy off once it goes to the ground, therefore letting a fighter stay in a fight longer then he safely should.
You keep saying this, but he arguably won at least a round after the knockdown.
So uh, the fuck? Round six, by the way.
And then God created Saturn ... and he liked it, so he put a ring on it. ... Always a ninja
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Good for him, I guess that totally justifies his non-performance for the remainder of the fight
One of the greatest fights of all time! OF ALL TIME!
Look, his heart left him and if your heart goes in combat sports you shouldn’t compete in them anymore outside of a soulless business venture.
I really like you, so I’m going to bow out (not even in the argument), but suffice to say I really question a lot of your understanding of boxing after reading through the comments on this post.
And then God created Saturn ... and he liked it, so he put a ring on it. ... Always a ninja
SaberCats Examiner | SB Nation Bay Area | Niners Nation | Twitter
How the fuck is he not physically able to? Most observers feel he beat Mora, he wasn’t competitive with the two best fighters on the planet. I’d still take him over most of the other 147 pounders in the world.
I’d love to see him walk away, but let’s chill out on the hyperbole.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Not being able to do anything after getting knocked down?
What would you call it? Biding his time? Waiting to pick his moment?
Being outclassed and unable to do anything meaningful to the best fighter on the planet…
You’re going to have to explain why he should never be paid to fight again. Because it’s a pretty dumb ass statement.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sort of statement generally made after Leites vs Silva
But it’s supposed to be ok because Mosley accomplished more in Boxing?
Why does a dumb statement made by the faceless public after the Leites fight make this dumb statement any less dumb?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
beat me to it
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't remember anyone coming to the defense of Leites has they have been for Mosley
But I guess the state of Boxing is so fragile fans have to defend even bad fights and bad performances before admitting how pathetic and pointless an event was.
This is a pile of shit, but I defended that fight:
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/4/19/844462/aint-no-sunshine-critiquing
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Regardless, I still don’t see what your point is. Some people said Leites shouldn’t fight again? That’s stupid.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Not really
It’s just their way of saying “I don’t want to see him fight again”. Obviously there’s a difference between the two, but hysteria has a tendency to blur lines.
I have no problem maintaining this line of conversation, but you just made a point by using a line of thought following UFC 97 and then changed the meaning of said line of thought to fit a later point.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
I had a whole comment written out and then my browser crashed
So rather then re-writing it, here’s the cliff notes.
- People over react
- Leites didn’t get the same defense to this over reaction that Mosley has
- I have no desire to watch Mosley fight again nor do I believe he should fight again
- Felt the same way about Couture after the Vera fight, but still watched him anyway.
- Easier to stick to guns in not watching Mosley fight.
To chime in. If people don’t want to see Mosley fight. That’s cool. Don’t pay to watch him. That’s the basis of the market!
But saying he shouldn’t fight again remains really bizarre. His career is as a prizefighter. In the past three fights he lost to the two best fighters on the planet and fought to a draw in an ugly fight he probably should have gotten the win in. He’s in the top 5 in his weight class even after this loss. I can’t tell a priefighter he can’t fight for a prize because he didn’t put on an entertaining fight.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I think it's easy to get into the UFC mentality
Whereby there’s limited roster space, so someone who can’t contend anymore is taking up roster space from a potential prospect who can come in and go on to do great things, where as the older guys are just hanging on and in the way. Boxing doesn’t have that issue since the top of the sport isn’t limited to one promoters, and neither are the belts (despite there being arguable too many different ones and too many weight classes).
He can continue to fight for money all he wants, just as long as he does so without taking up major television dates, or limits himself to independent pay-per-views against insignificant opponents.
But that’s not how boxing works. The sport is far too ass-backwards to relegate a fighter of Mosley’s current abilities to the backwaters. Shane is a rare commodity in today’s boxing environment: he’s a fighter with a name and a following. For this reason, the powers that be will undoubtedly trot the old man out against relevant fighters, citing the same lies that made the Pacquiao fight possible: ‘oh, it was a poor style match-up; oh, you can’t judge him based on what he does against the best fighters in the world; it’ll be different this time – he’s got a new dietician!’
Before you know it, Arum will be pushing for Cotto-Mosley II, talking about how the two have unfinished business, or some such nonsense. So what’ll happen is we’ll be forced to endure a shot Mosley taking up another HBO/Showtime date – a date that could have gone to a relevant, exciting fight, with deserving contestants – against an aging but still relevant, still exciting fighter in Cotto who would best serve the fans taking on a live body.
A shot but popular fighter in boxing is not a neutral commodity; he is a negative. Mosley is to the sport today what De la Hoya was for years – a albatross around the neck of the fight game, taking up space and squeezing out what could have been great fights in favor of a lame-duck cash cow.
Shane needs to retire. For his own sake, and for the sport’s.
Why did Geno even reply to this. He didn't come here to discuss things.
He’s running from you like Kalib Starnes.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
oooh, ad hominem AND an argument from authority!
matthew roth, what makes you the boxing opinion arbiter of the internets, hmm?
watch a lot of boxing PPVs and the occasional FNF?
"EVERYTHING IS HAPPENING"
- Bob Cole
What is there to lose? Consciousness? Professional pride? Dignity?
STAND AND BANG!!
by Jonathan Snowden on May 8, 2011 3:09 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 5 recs
Ha.
People would have been more proud had he actually tried to win than they are of his running act. But I like how you flame. Not surprised.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
He's not trying to flame. He's being serious.
You’re really displaying a complete lack of knowledge of boxing.
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by Matthew Roth on May 8, 2011 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well
where did I say I was an expert on boxing? I’m certainly not, nor will I ever pretend to be. Like a lot of folks, I took a flyer and watched the event last night .. and was extremely disappointed in what I saw from Mosley. Looked an awful lot like he wasn’t trying to win the fight. I simply pose the question — why not go for glory? Calling me out for not knowing all about boxing doesn’t enhance your point. A lot of folks share your side and a lot share mine. Plenty of them are highly educated on such things and even quite a few boxing experts share my stance. Doesn’t make me any less right or wrong.
What I don’t like is how I’m so quick to get flamed because I don’t share your opinion. Sorry dude, run your mouth all you want about how I don’t know shit about boxing. That’s fine and I won’t even dispute it. I was watching as a fan last night and was disappointed and questioned it. Guess what? That’s okay for me to do.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
by Geno Mrosko on May 8, 2011 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The point is if you don't understand something
Don’t go out of your way to shit on it. There’s no shame in asking guys like Brookhouse or Scott Christ about boxing. I’m doing it right now. I’d rather gain a better understanding that be the naysayer who constantly shits on things he doesn’t get.
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?
He’s not shitting on anything, and just because he’s not a “boxing expert” doesn’t mean that he doesn’t understand what’s going on. How much intelligence and visual comprehension does it take to understand what’s going on in an event where two men are trying to punch each other in the fucking head? All he said was that he doesn’t understand why in his eyes Mosley opted to fight for a paycheck rather than to actually try and win the fight. It’s his opinion. A lot of guys are being overdramatic dicks in their responses to his logical opinions about what took place during that fight.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
I honestly can't tell if this is kayfabe by the prowrestling guys
or if they honestly believe this. I think we’re all getting worked. But hey, let’s talk about SummerSlam so Geno can contribute something to the conversation.
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Yeah
damn me for thinking Mosley should try to win the fight instead of just go in to collect a paycheck.
Hey let’s talk about alcohol so Matthew can contribute to the conversation. Oh, hey Roth, it’s 3 p.m. CT. Sloshed yet?
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
I'm actually enjoying a beer right now thank you...
but my sports knowledge goes beyond elbow drops from the top turnbuckle.
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As does mine.
Nice crack though … or weak attempt at one.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
You’ve already stated you don’t know shit about boxing. Why not walk away with some dignity at this point? You’ve had 6 writers tell you this and you keep trying to show you’re right. You aren’t. I’ve contributed to this conversation. You’ve been the guy who reads the title and then comments about how mad you are.
Keep going though, I’ll enjoy another beer or so and you’ll continue to have PDL/Fagan/Brookhouse/nottheface/myself son you all day on this. This truly is a Sunday Funday for me.
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by Matthew Roth on May 8, 2011 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
If I thought you could define the word dignity, I would take you seriously.
But you are right. Don’t know why I commented. The elitist shit got old a long time ago. Glad you think you’re a part of that group.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
Hey Gene
It’s ok man, I agree with you. You’ve been putting up a good debate and I also see that you’ve been getting a lot of unnecessary flack for your opinion, but eh I get where you’re coming from.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Because he's already getting paid, and he signed up to take part in what is still a full contact combat sport
And there’s a referee, doctor and his corner who can bail him out if it gets too much for him. Seems pretty obvious to me. Last I checked he wasn’t in there against his will, even if his will had left him. The only thing keeping him in there is ego because in Boxing there’s this archaic notion that ‘tapping out’ is dishonorable.
Legacy vs Safety have different priorities
If to understand boxing, you have to appreciate that it’s ok for a fighter to survive and run the clock down to save face, then Boxing is in more trouble then I initially thought.
Help me understand then.
Maybe I’m just ignorant, but I when I watched the fight, I heard Mosley’s corner to shouting at him to be more aggressive and take control of the fight. Now I certainly don’t think that they had any interest in just watching him STAND AND BANG, but thought that that was his best avenue to victory. Also, I’ve thought I’ve heard the commentators express the need to go for broke when you know your down on the scorecards. Now I realize that that has to be easier said than done, but doesn’t this show that Mosley backing up might still have been against his best interest?
"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey
by KingLeopardSeal on May 8, 2011 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions
There’s a difference between thinking a fighter should have been more aggressive (and no one’s disputing that Mosley needed to throw more if he wanted to win the fight) and insinuating that he “didn’t look like a fighter” or comparing him to Kalib Starnes or openly hoping he never makes a dime in a boxing ring again.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Thanks
I thought that people were arguing that Mosley was fighting a smart fight, and couldn’t grasp why. Can’t say the man’s not a fighter, though I did think he started to shut down when Manny started pouring it on after the “knockdown” late in the fight (to be fair, the knockdown in the third probably threw Mosley for most of the fight). If Mosley decides to call it a career good for him, save up and live well friend.
"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey
by KingLeopardSeal on May 9, 2011 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I don't know you,
but I can see that you’ll never win this argument. You’re apparently going up against the world’s most passionate fans of the anticlimax.
by Charlie Custer on May 8, 2011 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
haha
let’s bid him a good luck!
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
360
Was designed to make it look like mosley had a chance.
He’s just too old for a guy as fast as Pac-Man. Basically Pac-man is fighting decent guys who just want that final big pay-day.
I was shocked at the stupid things people were saying on this very site.
It was a combination of people being uneducated about boxing and trained to hate it by MMA talking heads. Dana and Rogan preface their comments with “I love boxing” the same way certain country club members will say “I’m not a racist, but I’m glad they still don’t let thugs on our golf course.”
Either way, it was really sad to see even an educated community like BE and some SBN staff on twitter sounding off like jackass morons, making it clear that they don’t understand or respect boxing and the athletes competing
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 2:17 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
What did you expect?
The event was advertised quite visibly on this blog, and in response it seemed that quite a few MMA fans had their interest piqued. Talk of how Manny Pacquiao is just the greatest thing ever and all that. Then the fight turns out the way it did, of course the dudes are going to get restless and dumb. That’s how it goes. Did you see the GSP vs Shields thread? It was pretty much just as bad.
I gave this one a shot. I don’t like boxing, and this event didn’t change my opinion. I don’t like the restrictions of the specific ruleset they implement, simple as that. The clinch stuff gets very frustrating very quickly. The Pavlik / Lopez fight was quite enjoyable, though.
There is not one thing wrong with what you just said.
Nobody has to like boxing or the rule set. But people were saying that Mosley “isn’t a real boxer.” And the Kalib Starnes references are complete idiocy. I mean, if you want to be a punk about it, make a joke about Mosley taking cues from his last opponent. But this was people who know about MMA and know very little about boxing making ignorant statements full of misplaced hyperbole and laced with a total misunderstanding of what they were watching.
I wasn’t a huge fan of the fight, and it lost my interest late. Mosley’s footwork was stiff out the gate, and although his handspeed was decent for the first two he slowed horribly by the third. Manny didn’t quite seem on his game either. Maybe he got rattled by the car crash, maybe he’s starting to slip, maybe he’s too distracted with basketball teams and congressional duties… I don’t know. He said he had leg cramps by the third round, which would explain is poor (by his standards) use of angles. He didn’t look right and still completely manhandled one of the three best guys in the division. I’ll take it for what it is.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on May 8, 2011 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Well said
This isn’t an MMA vs boxing thing. It’s the same people bitching about a P4P stalwart fighting a defensive fighter whose intention is not to give himself the greatest chance of winning, but rather to just survive and accept a decision loss.
The difference? GSP unfairly gets the blame at UFC 129, while Mosley rightfully gets the blame here.
by paythefighters on May 8, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
totally agreed in regard to GSP fight
Shields lacked any kind of urgency in that fight. GSP shouldn’t have to look for finishes, he’s the champion and in charge of all his fights
I don't respect boxing
Boxing: old and busted.
MMA: new hotness.
by Wrestling Uber Alles on May 8, 2011 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t respect soccer.
Soccer: old and busted
Hockey: New hotness
FAR better and much less limited game of “put the object in a net”
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Soccer is old, but it's not busted
Even if Fifa is corrupt, it still functions to the point where the best teams can end up facing each other through enough games played at the national and international level rather than have the Premiership champions fed the bottom of Division 2 and the public made to believe its worth watching and isn’t in any way a con.
which didn’t happen last nights fight was the number 1 ww against the number 3 just the number 1 was far better which does happen in soccer in fact look at the last worldcup
Happens in MMA too.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
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by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't acknowledge soccer as a sport.
Soccer is something unathletic people do to draw attention away from the fact that they aren’t athletic enough to play sports.
by Wrestling Uber Alles on May 8, 2011 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Whatever
Soccer requires less athleticism than this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBWwm2Wysb8
by Wrestling Uber Alles on May 8, 2011 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions
eh, ronaldinho isnt a great example of athleticism
Prime Ronaldo (nazario de lima)
Christiano Ronaldo
Hulk
Drogba
Gareth Bale
Ibrahimovic
those are guys who would give NFL players a run for their money.
last night's fight was alright
what do you expect between the best boxer in the world against 39 year old mosley? if there is no one else or they can’t get a fighter like floyd mayweather to fight pacman, he should just retire being on top of his career.
This is exactly why I couldn't figure out why BE cared about this fight
As I have compared earlier, it’s pretty much the same as trying to get hyped for Murilo Bustamante fighting Anderson Silva. Sure he was a great champion at one time, but it has been confirmed his best days were along behind him, just because a fighter is the P4P best in the world shouldn’t mean you pretend his fight is important or relevant
Shane Mosley did exactly what everyone should have expected him to do. He did, he realized he was outgunned and just fought to survive, and he got payed extremely well for it. Personally, i do not think PPV dollars is worth watching someone be a punching bag
The difference is that Anderson Silva doesn’t draw international attention on the scale of Pacquiao when he fights.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
That's true
Doesn’t mean the result is any different though.
Sure, I’m just explaining why this site covered Pacquiao. Not only was there no MMA (except for BeLOLator), but Pacquiao is a HUGE STAR.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
I did not mind the coverage so much
I do not mind that we cover kickboxing, BJJ or wrestling, so boxing deserves it’s own shot. I just didn’t find the fight in of itself to be relevant, honestly the only way I thought this fight could possibly be relevant of Mosley made the upset of the century and beat Pacman
Didn't watch the fight
So I went over to Bad Left Hook this morning to see how the fight went and I had to laugh. People were talking about how Pacs last four fights have been disappointing. It felt like Gsp Deja vu
by RoB_ex on May 8, 2011 2:37 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
When you're guaranteed a massive multi-million dollar purse just for showing up?
Losing probably doesn’t bother you. Wouldn’t be surprised if Mosley retires on this fight. It’s not like he’ll ever get a bigger payday.
Fighter pay might suck in the UFC, but at least their purses are trim enough to keep the top-level fighters hungry to win.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Georges "Rush" St-Pierre
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 2:38 PM EDT reply actions
Fighter pay might suck in the UFC, but at least their purses are trim enough to keep the top-level fighters hungry to win.
Ah yes, the classic “people who earn a lot of money have no competitive drive” fallacy.
This basically I guess.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Law_of_Wages
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Head Kick Legend
Sure.
I’ll agree with that.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Georges St. Pierre is different.
When you’re doing gymnastics, acrobatics, and drinking shark cartilage for an edge in training, the money stopped being your motivation a long time ago.
MMA Fan Since Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar
Twitter: @KenTheGreat
MBN's Current 5 Favorite Fighters: Nate Diaz / Michael "Count" Bisping / Miesha "Takedown" Tate / Shinya Aoki / Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos
by McKinley B. Noble on May 8, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Shark Cartilage?
fucking really?
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
I can't believe anyone ever thought this would be a competitive fight anyway.
You could smell the poo from a mile away as soon as Mosely was mentioned as Pac’s next opponent. It’s a payday fight, a momentum-maintaining fight. Mosely has been on a backslide ever since he looked great, to everyone’s surprise, against Margarito, which was a long time ago now. I dare say that no 40-ish year old man will defeat Manny Pacuiao no matter who it is.
Plenty of younger fighters out there could do more to prove the vitality of boxing, but that’s not the direction that Top Rank chose to go with Pac.
Therein lies the everlasting difference between the UFC and boxing promotions like Top Rank and Golden Boy Promotions. The UFC makes the best fights they can, and I have to say I love them for it.
my friends ordered the fight and i came over to mooch this fight didn't intrigue me knew pac man would win easily
my friends aren’t big combat sports fans and they didn’t get why Mosley was retreating. All in all it was a decent enough boxing card yea Mosley turned into a bit of a punching bag but meh still think he did better thatn Josh Clottey
Twitter @MaZZM
http://www.mazzznet.com/
The only people mad today are the ones who bought into the Mosley pre fight hype. Everyone who was educated on the fight knew what was going to happen. Just don’t cry when Pacman beats up JMM for 12 rounds and get angry that JMM didn’t fight back. They are going to sell you hard that JMM has a shot, but at 147 pounds there is no way in hell.
I wasn't surprised by Mosley, I was surprised and disappointed by Pacquiao
Mosley did as much as you could expect from a shot 39 year old fighter, however I was disappointed in the lack of urgency I saw from Pacquiao.
He seemed content to fight the bout at Mosley’s pace without ever really putting pressure on him for a concerted period of time. Every time he picked up the tempo he got results and, on the UK SKY Sports broadcast anyway, you could clearly hear Freddie Roach calling for more pressure and urgency from Manny in several rounds, but for whatever reason it didn’t really happen. After the “Knockdown” in the 10th Manny seemed to get angry and really went to town on Mosley and it’s so frustrating that we only saw that for 2 rounds.
I don’t think many US fans paid $55 under the impression that Mosley had a chance, however they did pay $55 to see Pacman at his best over 12 rounds, not just the final two. From that point of view, I understand and share that frustration and I don’t have a problem with people complaining.
by Andersac on May 8, 2011 2:51 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Mike Fagan: "I Hope You Weren't Surprised by Shane Mosley's Performance"
Actually, it seems Fagan should have ben surprised. His comments pre and post fight :
“But I’m going to go with my gut and pick Mosley to score the TKO win somewhere between rounds 4 and 6.” – Mike Fagan, May 7th
“So, what exactly did you expect last night? Shane Mosley is 39 years old. He fought to an ugly draw in his last fight with Sergio Mora after Floyd Mayweather Jr. dismantled him last May. – Mike Fagan, May 8th
Yep, Fagan sure wasn’t surprised.
by emeraldringer on May 8, 2011 2:52 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
You mean that post by Mike Fagan
where he explicitly stated where that prediction was by Brent Brookhouse? If you are going for a ‘gotcha!!’ moment, then you need to read your own citations better.
El Santo inspired me to be a submission grappler.
by Enmascarado on May 8, 2011 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, that was my pick and one that I’ve told pretty much anyone that asked was because I A) want to believe in the occasional upset and B) wanted to pick mosley because I thought he WAS being overlooked. But anyone that has asked I’ve told that if you told me to pick the guy I thought had the best chance to win it would have been Manny in a heartbeat
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Expect to be let down, and don't complain, that right?
It sounds like you’re saying that we should have expected a bad fight and shouldn’t complain when that’s what we got. Or maybe just that we shouldn’t expect much from Mosley at this point, all things considered.
Well, I didn’t have to buy this on PPV because I live in the UK (most major boxing and MMA is free here) but if I did purchase it, I’d have felt severely let down.
As much as I dislike the Diaz mentality at times, I really miss it when I feel like I’m watching a sparring match with a purse of about $25,000,000!
Well, I didn’t have to buy this on PPV because I live in the UK (most major boxing and MMA is free here) but if I did purchase it, I’d have felt severely let down
I never understood that, is there a specific reason why the UK gets to see the fights for free?
PPV is the exception rather than the norm in the UK. Over here, most major sporting events are shown on SKY Sports or ESPN which are subscription based satellite/cable channels.
SKY Sports do have “SKY Box Office” for PPV events, but its mainly just the big UK fights – -Amir Khan and David Haye. Most other fights show on the SKY Sports regular channels and every UFC event shows on the ESPN channel.
I guess its a culture thing, people really begrudge paying for individual events when they’re already paying on average $65-$80 per month just to watch ESPN and SKY Sports in the first place.
Outside major UK boxing bouts, the only other thing that I can think of that airs regularly on PPV over here is the big WWE events – Wrestlemania, Royal Rumble e.t.c
Ah ok, so it’s not necessarily free. I wouldn’t mind a subscription based service for MMA events. Cost of these PPV’s can add up. Especially when we can end up having 2-3 events a month.
Yeah, I quite like the way it works for us. Sky also provide my phone and broadband service, so combine that with the SKY Sports and ESPN packages and my combat sports habit costs about $140 per month. So I would definitely begrudge paying more for events.
Saying that, prior to the Zuffa buyout, Strikeforce events aired on a minor PPV channel called Primetime for $16 dollars per event which I also bought. Not sure how that will work now as Zuffa products are currently shown on ESPN.
Strikeforce has suddenly become pay-per-view, hopefully not for much longer
But we get free UFCs and big non-UK boxing matches.
Well as far as MMA goes, most of it is on ESPN here. From what I understand, ESPN is sort of like Showtime is there. It’s not PPV but it can cost a few $ a month.
As far as boxing goes, the new generation of boxers just wouldn’t draw the PPV numbers. Guys like Tyson did, and obviously the British guys did and still do in some cases.
Strikeforce stuff is PPV here believe it or not. Guess it’s better to get the hardcores to pay through the nose since we’re the only ones who watch it here.
by LWB on May 8, 2011 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
If you were “let down” by this fight your expectations were entirely too high.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Manny was an overwhelming favorite. Shane is 39 years old, but a smart and durable fighter. Recipe seems pretty simple.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
Brent Ducharme said it best last night
“I fundamentally doubt the knowledge of a lot of fight fans.”
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
Managing Editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
by Matthew Roth on May 8, 2011 3:03 PM EDT reply actions 6 recs
I bought into the hype but couldn't find a way to get the card.
Blessing in disguise, as instead of watching what was by all accounts a terribly boring one-sided decision I watched Ali/Frazier I. Now I’m getting around to watching Ali/Liston, Ali/Foreman, Foreman/Frazier, etc.. Pretty good shit. Boxing these days doesn’t hold my interest very well but the classics are incredible.
"Unless you can’t think of something intelligent to say, don’t reply and make the world as dumb as you are appearing to be." - mabel4life
Ignorant MMA Fan here!
There I have labelled that to myself so we can move on. I am an avid MMA fan who desperately WANTS to like boxing.
But after last night, I’m still having trouble. MMA has slims chokes, knockouts, submissions. Last night was 12 rounds of the worst GSP and Anderson….
Help me understand, even the fights before it were less than exciting….
I'm from Canada, and they think I'm slow eh!
the arce fight was good go watch corrales/castillo,ward/gatti and all the vasquez/marquez fights
http://www.fightoftheyear.net/
they are all at this site
Arce/Vazquez was great.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions
And if you didn’t think so? then boxing probably just isn’t for you. No shame in that. Boxing isn’t for everyone, nor is MMA, nor is baseball, nor is football…etc
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
I think this fight could go beyond regular boxing fans though. Arce/Vazquez was like the fights I grew up watching… which is to say the fights in the Rocky movies. Watching real boxing where guys do not generally take flush shots 30-40 times a round rarely lives up to the expectations created by Rocky.
Getting bent out of shape over a fight promoter lying is like getting upset that a hooker won't kiss you. It betrays a deep lack of understanding of the nature of the profession.
These comments are why it us hard for me to take mma fans seriously. They have a fundemental obsession with entertainment and excitement over actual competition. I think it confirms the theory that the bulk of mma fans are prowrestling fans.
Last night was a lackluster, non-competitive fight. that’s the truth and I said it. But for some fans that doesn’t explain it or isn’t an excuse – no Mosely should have gone with his guns blazing and gotten KOed for our enjoyment. Apparently they prefer fighters to be performers and not athletes.
The fight was poor because Pacquiao outclassed him. Mosely couldn’t open up because then Manny would find an opening and pepper him 3 or 4 or even 5 or 6 times to his one. All Mosely could do was defend, defend, defend and hope to catch Manny. And when you see the speed with which Manny can suddenly unleash a four or five punch combo you can see why Mosely started turtling up.
And I’m sure all these fans will soon move on to the talking point that boxing is dead because they can’t make Mayweather vs Pacquiao, because everone knows a sport is defined by it’s one fight just as mma was defined by Wandy vs Chuck, Fedor vs Couture, Fedor vs Lesnar, Silva vs GSP, and now Melendez vs Edgar.
by John Nash on May 8, 2011 3:52 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 7 recs
Wait...
When the fuck did Transformers 3 come out?
"I guess I'm 13-Maynard, and Maynard..."- Frankie Edgar
by Dustin Luff on May 8, 2011 4:03 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
Didn’t BE predict mosley to tko pac? How are you not surprised by the outcome.
"I’m not going to stop yelling because that would mean, I lost the fight!"-Kenny Powers
shooter/cutter for AllElbows.com and MMAFighting.com, mma enthusiast
by ekc on May 8, 2011 4:07 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
I predicted it over at SBN, as noted above along with the reasons.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, one more thing. for anyone that’s all “IT WAS A HORRIBLE MISMATCH! THE ODDS SHOWED IT!”
A bigger underdog than Shane won on the undercard…and it was beautiful.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:08 PM EDT reply actions
I am so sick of people defending these mismatches… neither Koscheck or Hardy nor Maia or Belfort had any right fighting GSP or Silva for the belt. None of them could do anything to make the fights competitive. Never mind them all being ranked in the top 10 when they fought, their losses confirm what a mismatch it was.
The only fight that matters is GSP vs Silva and I refuse to watch MMA until it happens.
by John Nash on May 8, 2011 4:19 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 2 recs
Maybe Nick vs GSP is relevant, as far as presenting a legitimate threat to the champ that is, but be sure to tune in for Okami… If he has been able to up his wrestling game a bit, there’s nothin’ to say he can’t make it a headache of a night for Anderson.
A lot of long-time maestros of MMA comment sections unabashedly demonstrating a real loathing for the sport and its ignorant fans. It’s all so fascinating.
by Charlie Custer on May 8, 2011 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Before I reply I want to make sure you’re aware that I don’t really have a problem with those fights (except for Hardy and the fact that Belfort was out for 15-months) and in fact was a defender of the Maia fight, nor am I really a big proponent of Silva-GSP. Using those examples as a mirror, nothing more.
um, sar…sarcasm?
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
And just a couple years ago Shane was a big underdog to Margarito. Gee, it must have been a mismatch. Oh, that’s right, he TKO’d Margarito. A year later, Manny couldn’t stop Margarito.
Betting lines are set partly on the basis of where the oddsmakers think the money will go. They knew there would be people willing to risk substantial money for a small payoff because Manny is viewed as nearly unbeatable. Mosley being an 8-1 underdog on the betting line didn’t make this a mismatch.
by Scabby Knuckle on May 8, 2011 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions
The stupid people are....
The ones who spent their time and god forbid money on this fight. We all knew what it was going to be. Just wait for the headlines after the fight to see what happened. Mosley is old, and for that matter, wasn’t EVER 1/2 as good as Pacquiao. How did we expect this to go over?
Does Mosley have an obligation to fight? No. Maybe when fans lash out with their wallets, and refuse to buy Mosley fights, will the promoters get a clue and stop booking them.
Not douchey enough for a Kindle yet.
Deal with it?
I have been dealing with it. Mania and BE and these articles about a match I don’t care about in a sport I don’t watch. Trust me I have been dealing with the is 8-1 odds match so much more then I wanted to because for some reason you writers thought it was worthy of so much coverage because it was a pac man fight. Let me say this for the other like 20% percent of readers who feel the same way. I don’t give a shit about boxing as a sport one way or the other and it is annoying to have you give such an “over matched” match this much coverage on a site I expect solid MMA coverage from. I can appreciate people getting irked that is was apparently a shit match up but you shouldn’t ride a high horse at the end like it was all your readers faults for wanting to see a match that they may not have even looked into if it wasn’t for all the coverage you force fed them the past week as a staff.
"That little fucker hit me with a Hadukan or something" – Nick Diaz on Gomi
"You should study Pokemon to get stronger." - Sakuraba
"A champion is someone who sweats to exhaustion, even when no one else is watching." -Bas Rutten
I'm on the Britney Palmer Bandwagon
We're all connected to each other, Biologically
To the earth, Chemically
And to the rest of the Universe, Atomically
by Pillow Pants on May 8, 2011 4:18 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
You know what?
You don’t have to use your pillow fingers to click on them articles.
by Henrique on May 8, 2011 4:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Touche
"That little fucker hit me with a Hadukan or something" – Nick Diaz on Gomi
"You should study Pokemon to get stronger." - Sakuraba
"A champion is someone who sweats to exhaustion, even when no one else is watching." -Bas Rutten
I'm on the Britney Palmer Bandwagon
We're all connected to each other, Biologically
To the earth, Chemically
And to the rest of the Universe, Atomically
You could have not read the articles. It’s real easy.
You know why I’ll always believe in the upset? Because I’ve seen huge upsets over and over again.
Vazquez was a -1100 favorite on a ton of books last night, when Jorge Arce was being pulled off him as Vazquez’s corner threw in the towel it was a hell of a moment.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on May 8, 2011 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't but I'm tired of scrolling past
it’s just that every other headline was about this match. I’m glad Arce got an upset but that didn’t justify all the coverage for the Pac/mosley fight here and on Mania (the one in question because as a non boxing fan all I can say is who is Arce and Vazquez? Those names weren’t selling points in the lead up nearly as much) which was a snooze fest apparently.
All I’m saying is it was kind of a dick sign off to tell people to deal with it being an eh fight when the staff practically crammed it all over the front pages. I didn’t watch the fight, I don’t watch boxing, I’m not a fan, I won’t knock it I just don’t take part in it. I watch MMA and I enjoy that it is a comprehensive game where there are multiple transitions and level changes for the combat to be engaged with.
Boxing is definitely a science, I’m not interested in it though. Does that make me less of a fight fan? Yes and no. For this site amongst others, to sell this match as much as they did and then critique fans for buying and being unhappy with the outcome. It’s comes off snobby and holyier then though is all I’m saying.
"That little fucker hit me with a Hadukan or something" – Nick Diaz on Gomi
"You should study Pokemon to get stronger." - Sakuraba
"A champion is someone who sweats to exhaustion, even when no one else is watching." -Bas Rutten
I'm on the Britney Palmer Bandwagon
We're all connected to each other, Biologically
To the earth, Chemically
And to the rest of the Universe, Atomically
well said sir
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
This comment section looks like a damn bomb went off in here. Some people need to check their ego and chill the fuck out.
Twitter me @kkelchner621
Read me at Cageside Seats
by Kaleb Kelchner on May 8, 2011 4:53 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
No shit, man.
People I normally really like are seemingly going out of their way to shit on people directly. So people may have different tastes than you or not know as much as you. Who fucking cares? Why go so overboard on being an overbearing, condescending prick about it? It really is pretty sad.
How do you people (yeah, you people) go to a bar to watch fights and deal with the masses? Do you go around correcting every person you overhear say something incorrect? Sounds like a miserable night out to me.
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Sorry MDH.
Nothing but respect for you, my friend.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
Twitter -- @GenoMrosko
hahahahahaha
i didnt mean you, you smartass lol
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah I was scrolling down reading the comments, and that Geno guy was unfairly getting flamed pretty damn harshly man, so I had to kinda defend him. I haven’t seen it before, but there is a good bit of an elitist attitude floating around here…
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Well said.
Reading through these comments I would think there was some clause in the “Terms of Use” that stated, “You must insult and attack any individual who’s opinions and thoughts do not match yours”. It’s like the Wild West in here…
by Brandon Degaph on May 8, 2011 8:12 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You're absolutely right,
and I’ve enjoyed it thoroughly.
Xtreme Couture- The best never rest! The girl in my av is Kari Sweets (you're welcome).
"I swear it upon Zeus an outstanding runner cannot be the equal of an average wrestler."
-Socrates
by ElliotMatheny on May 8, 2011 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
hahaha
crazy man, but yeah I’ve read all 300+ comments now and I must say that the convo has been rather…intrguing to say the least.
Anderson Silva, Edson Barboza, Jose Aldo, Charles Oliveira, Thiago Alves = Muay Thai wrecking machines!
by SentientAndroid on May 10, 2011 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
I was at the MGM last night and boxing is...
DEAD.
Not that it can’t be revived, but it is for sure dead or on life support. There was zero energy and I was amazingly disappointed by that. The last boxing match I went to was Trinidad vs Winky Wright, an even more dominating but boring fight than last night, and the energy was amazing.
During my vegas stay, MMA gear was far more prominent and that is excluding the obvious crap like TapouT. I saw more walk out shirts than boxing gear combined.
I don’t say this with a horse in the race. I am a longtime boxing fan and I hope that it regain some of its glory, but for now, it’s in bad shape.
everlast?
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
not enough glitter and skulls and dead bodies and puff paint and incoherent writing
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow
The comments on this thread are incredibly entertaining. Made my Sunday more interesting.
But I got more out of Mosley than I thought I would. I expected Pacquiao to TKO him but Mosley is still one of the best.
This is me reacting to everything in this post
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
Managing Editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
I was gonna go with
Bastion Booger
"Every time I talk on the phone with someone who doesn’t know me, they call me "ma’am"." .....cut to a couple months later....... "You can alter that sig now. I spoke with someone I know on the phone and she repeatedly addressed me as a female. Fuck." - Scott C. Broussard
by Earl Montclair on May 8, 2011 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
El Sainto.
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
Managing Editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
This comment section makes me a sad panda
"I want to tell me what you see, let's go ahead and see by in the fight, what you saw, in the ring." - Tito Ortiz
Cmon Mike...
Morgan was over the top, and he sounded like a fan who was probably pissed he had to pay for that.
but that aside… You weren’t surprised with how Mosley performed? Sure it was against Pacquiao, but Mosley has NEVER fought like this in his entire career, and you actually expected this? Sure, he was a huge underdog, but I didn’t know anyone who expected him to fight like that, because you know, he never has.
You can bring up his lack luster fight against Mora, and Mayweather, but he was the one pressing the action for the most part there. He was the one complaining that his opponent didn’t want to stand toe-to-toe, and now it was the complete opposite.
and I end with a quote from SC at BLH:
Shane Mosley has never run before. Last night, you can say that he did.
by Anton Tabuena on May 8, 2011 8:16 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
A lot of people are sort of mad at Mosley because he sort of made it difficult for Pac to do his thing. I, for one, was more than a little bit disappointed, but it was mostly not Mosley, who boxed pretty well considering, but it was because I didn’t get to see Pac fireworks that made me a fan of boxing. I can see right through that guy Morgan’s tweets. He wanted a Pac show, and he didn’t get it, and he’s blaming Mosley for it.
my band
http://www.groggybikini.com
by Dooda on May 8, 2011 8:25 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
What a terrible comments section.
I really don’t think this place deserves to be doused in all green.
"If I had a dollar for every brain you don't have, I'd have one dollar." - Squidward Tentacles
by SSreporters on May 8, 2011 9:38 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Exactly
"I want to tell me what you see, let's go ahead and see by in the fight, what you saw, in the ring." - Tito Ortiz
by CasualMMAFan on May 8, 2011 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Mosley looked like a 39-year-old
Pacquiao at this stage in his career is better than a still solid but declining Mosley and it’s not even close.
If Mosley pushed the pace he’d have gone to sleep.
"If I had a dollar for every brain you don't have, I'd have one dollar." - Squidward Tentacles
Boxing is still popular...
This is quite obvious when you see mainstream media covering boxing but not MMA. On the other hand, MMA is growing everyday, while boxing is filled with farcical fights and corruption.
Honest Question
I don’t claim to be a boxing aficionado. I also did not have the reported displeasure of seeing the fight last night. I understand there’s a far more technical aspect to a sport such as boxing than to just be “more aggressive” or “make it a fight” or “go down swinging” as some here have suggested. On the other hand however, I see boxing fans claiming MMA fans are just ignorant and unaware of the facets of boxing and therefore shouldnt expect a more aesthetically pleasing fight. What specifically are we as MMA fans missing that disallows us to expect a fighter such as Mosley (from what I’ve heard) to put more heart into the fight and not in essence run away for the majority of it. Boxing is a sport first and foremost, but entertainment as well. It should be appreciated for the technical aspect but if fights aren’t exciting, you won’t have butts in the seats or at home watching. Isn’t it reasonable to expect fighters to give it their all in a fight?
I didn’t feel like Mosley ran the whole fight, he fought defensively. Really defensively, and as he wore on he had no offense, his game was all defense, probably because he was tiring out and he was putting up with a lot of attack from Pac. To call it running isn’t accurate IMO. I felt like it was more of a really defensive-minded hockey team that traps and waits for opponents mistakes, or an NFL team that runs up the middle for 2-5 yards the majority of the game. He was working with what he had available, and as the match ran on, his offence wasn’t really available, it was all defense. His footwork and movement was pretty awesome though. If you’re able to frustrate Pac and make him not land a billion punches in a fight, you’re doing something really really well.
my band
http://www.groggybikini.com
I find it fascinating that most people here seem to lay all the blame for saturday night’s awful fight on Mosley’s performance, yet, (to bring it back to MMA), when GSP is involved in a boring fight, it’s never because of his opponent and always because GSP is boring, was too tentative, and lost his killer instinct to go for a finish. Why the difference?
Pacquiao was always coming forward, looking to land shots for a finish
GSP wasn’t and had many more avenues of attack then Pacquiao had.
Pacquiao also had one more eye than GSP did… Seriously, we can’t take anything out of the last half of GSP’s fight against Shields.
My point is that there seems to be an endless amount of excuses thrown around to defend Pacquiao, whereas the general concensus seems to be that GSP is boring and that no excuses are valid to explain why he couldn’t finish an opponent. That’s a huge double standard.
Can't beleive I missed all these comments....
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
gocyborg.com
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