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Victor Ortiz vs. Andre Berto and Orlando Salido vs. Juan Manuel Lopez Showcase Boxing's Beautiful Brutality

Photo by Chris Trotman/Getty Images

If I believe in any sort of god or gods, it is "the fight gods." The ones who give you that chill that runs up your spine when you are watching something special unfold in front of you as two men try to beat the other into unconsciousness. If they're real the fight gods are also the ones who plant the idea in your head that you really need to see an event.

Yes, I could spend my time today focusing on Joe Warren being gifted a decision. But I'd rather remember April 16, 2011 as the day I woke up with an itch to watch boxing and was treated to a back to back fantastic main events. Yes, this is an MMA blog first. But we have the staff and knowledge to cover great events in grappling, wrestling, kickboxing and boxing. Combat sports fans should be able to enjoy great action in any combat sport.

Andre Berto came into his HBO main event against Victor Ortiz with an undefeated 27-0 record and 21 knockout wins, he also was considered by anyone with a lick of sense to be the #3 welterweight in the world behind only Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Manny Pacquiao. He hadn't always been the most exciting fighter in the world but he had been plenty successful.

Victor Ortiz was signed by Golden Boy to be Oscar de la Hoya version 2. The next great Mexican-American star who would run things both at the box office and in the ring. Unfortunately, Ortiz was scheduled in a bout against Marcos Maidana in June of 2009 and despite knocking the rugged Maidana down several times in the bout, eventually he was knocked down, cut up and swelling and he quit as the doctor was checking on him. For some, that moment was enough to write off Ortiz as a never-would-be. Scott Christ discussed Ortiz's future after that fight at Bad Left Hook:

Personally, I came away impressed with Maidana as a never-say-die warrior, a guy with huge huevos and a bigger right hand. Fight alone, Ortiz's loss was no great big issue. He wasn't able to finish a double-tough guy. It happens. Fighters lose fights when they take risks, and this was a risk by Ortiz.

But his post-fight comments are troubling. Some are already wondering whether or not Ortiz will ever step into a ring again, and they're perfectly right to do so. The 22-year old slugger from Oxnard was outgtunned by a nasty opponent, but he quit. And not only did he quit, but after the fight, he remarked, "I'm young, but I don't think I deserve to be getting beat up like this. I got a lot of thinking to do."

There are a LOT of fighters that came up through the ranks very fast, were deemed the next big thing, and then met the brick wall. For Ortiz, it might well be Maidana, the heavy-handed slugger that wouldn't accept a loss despite three knockdowns. After he'd beaten Ortiz up fairly badly, he made him quit. In Maidana, there was no quit. In Ortiz, there seemed to be nothing but.

Ortiz was fighting at welterweight for the first time last night after spending his career at junior welterweight and he was looking to erase the stain of the Maidana fight in a way that going 4-0-1 against soft opposition since the loss hadn't. He came out hard in the first round and floored Berto early with a left hook, but it was ruled a slip. Ortiz refused to be denied and flurried again, stunning Berto in the corner and forcing him to take a knee. Early on it was clear that Ortiz seemed more comfortable at the new weight and looked very strong.

The second round saw Berto come back and land a hard shot that sent Ortiz reeling for a knockdown to even things up. The two men would not let up from there, firing big shots back and forth but Ortiz was clearly taking control of the fight on the scorecards early. Berto would have his moments, but much of the fight had been him going backward while Ortiz threw with power.

Then the sixth round happened, the same round where Maidana dropped Ortiz and made him quit. The two men went back and forth before Berto landed a huge right hand that sent Victor crashing to the mat. Ortiz struggled to his feet and looked to survive to the bell as Berto flurried trying to finish the fight. Suddenly, despite legs that didn't want to stay under him, Ortiz launched a left hand that dropped Berto with under ten seconds left in the round. Berto would get up and the two would continue to slug it out in a tremendous twelve round fight.

Just like the Maidana fight, the sixth round came and down Ortiz went. But unlike Maidana, Ortiz dusted himself off and removed the doubts about his heart. By staying on his feet and dropping Berto in the same round he was not a man who would always look for the easy way out when the going got tough. And his gutting through the sixth led to his winning a unanimous decision and taking Berto's undefeated record.

Fights like Berto/Ortiz are why I truly feel that there is no sport on earth that can match the drama of a great boxing match. Do I enjoy MMA more? Absolutely. But a great, drama filled boxing match is special in the sports world.

Follow after the jump as we take a quick look at the bout between Orlando Salido and Juan Manuel Lopez.

Star-divide

Just as the HBO main event was ending, the Showtime main event was about to start. Juan Manuel Lopez had become the newest star in the rich history of Puerto Rican boxing. Lopez, like Berto, entered the night undefeated, having scored 27 KO's in his 30 wins. In Orlando Salido (34-11-2, 22 KO), Lopez was facing a rugged veteran who promised to be there all night.

Lopez had started to get lazy in his defense and in Salido he met a man who had no problem walking forward and exploiting that lazy defense. It started a little slow in the first round but it was clear that Salido was going to trust his great chin to allow him to walk down Lopez and unleash overhand rights. By the third round the fight had actually gotten "subtly nasty" with both men throwing punches with truly bad intentions.

By the fifth round the fight had turned into a slugfest with both men landing and backing the other off before momentum would swing again. Gus Johnson was doing a terrible job on commentary, but once you got past that it was a tremendously entertaining bout. In the fifth round my scorecard read 38-38 and Salido was landing the right hand over and over before Lopez dropped to the ground. JuanMa managed to get back to his feet but was very unsteady as the round came to a close.

In the sixth it was an all out assault by Salido as he tried to finish Lopez, who was still badly hurt and on unsteady legs. When he couldn't manage to get the finish and Lopez survived the round it was Gus Johnson yet again ruining the moment with a shout of "Nuts and guts!" to show just how unable he is to exist "in the moment" like a great sports announcer would.

The seventh round saw Salido appearing to fade as he had spent the better part of two rounds throwing with huge power to try to get a stoppage. Lopez landed a bomb of a right early in the round that appeared to buzz Salido and it was on again with both men scoring and having moments as Lopez clawed his way back into the fight. It wouldn't last though as Salido bombed him in the eighth only to have Lopez held up by the ropes on two occasions. The referee would jump in to stop the fight at an awkward moment as Lopez was still trying to punch, but he was reeling around the ring all round and was being held up by the ropes toward the end. Despite an immediate reaction by fans that the stoppage was quick, replays and really understanding the context of the fight and round as a whole should remove much of the anger.

It was the second tremendous upset of a highly ranked, undefeated fighter in one night. Some nights the fight gods smile on you and last night was absolutely one of those nights. Great fights are great fights, and I highly suggest that you make an effort to catch these two clashes. Even if you don't consider yourself a "boxing fan" you should be able to love the gutsy efforts and huge punching put on display by these four men.

And make sure to check out Bad Left Hook for more on the fights.

Comment 86 comments  |  4 recs  | 

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Ortiz/Berto was a great fight. Round six was one of the best rounds I’ve seen in a while and Ortiz actually lived up to his nickname and looked, you know, vicious.

JuanMa/Salido was fun too, even though I like JuanMa. He needs to realise you just can’t walk forwards, eating shots and relying purely on your power like that.

"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey

by Jack.Barrington on Apr 17, 2011 12:21 PM EDT reply actions  

The first half of Ortiz/Berto was reminiscent of..

dare I say it.. Ward-Gatti.

However, it petered out in the second half. Regardless, both great fights. Another very good fight just took place as well in Indonesia – John/Yordan.

Creator of the FightMatrix rating system [http://www.fightmatrix.com].

by JCS_FM on Apr 17, 2011 12:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Looking forward to the John fight. With the Lopez fight it’s him and Gamboa at the top of the rankings.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree

It did die down in the second half, but goddamn it was GREAT. I was yelling in my room during that 6th round. Thank you Based God for giving me free HBO for this weekend :p

by HaterSlayer on Apr 17, 2011 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Here, here.

Follow me on Twitter: @MMANation.

by Luke Thomas on Apr 17, 2011 12:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Holy crap

It’s “hear, hear.”

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Apr 17, 2011 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I always thought it was "Hear here"

Like “listen to this dude over here.”

Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend

by Neil Manich on Apr 17, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hear,_hear

"All the time he's boxing, he's thinking. All the time he was thinking, I was hitting him." - Jack Dempsey

www.badlefthook.com

by Drunken cutman on Apr 18, 2011 7:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

i was thinking about this after Ortiz/Berto

MMA can’t consistently appeal to viewers on an emotional level the way a high-level boxing fight can, and i’m not sure why. i’m at best a casual boxing fan, and had never heard of Berto or Ortiz, but when i watched their fight i was spellbound.

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 12:39 PM EDT reply actions  

Excellent point. Agree completely.

"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey

by Jack.Barrington on Apr 17, 2011 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

See. I love Maynard/Edgar 2. But it’s nowhere near Berto/Ortiz for me let alone a Gatti/Ward or Castillo/Corrales for me.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

probably the most emotional response

i’ve ever seen from MMA fans was Couture’s victory over Sylvia for the UFC title … for five rounds, no one at the sports bar where i was could sit down. we were — all of us — locked in, hoping against hope for Randy.

it’s the only moment i can think of off the top of my head that could compare with the emotion of a great boxing match.

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

And even that was a pure emotion fight, other than the knockdown at the start of the fight it was far from “exciting” in terms of the actual in-cage action. It was excitement based on Couture doing the “impossible”..etc.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

true

and a lot of the emotion came from how universally Couture was respected/liked at the time, and how much people absolutely loathed Sylvia. that was one of the great moments where the WWE formula worked for the UFC — the unabashed “face” overcoming the “monster heel.”

but even it couldn’t touch Ward/Gatti.

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

It must be that i'm just not big enough of a boxing fan because

Regardless of the match, boxing always feels comparable to a bjj match to me. While it can be exciting, its never as exciting as the possibilities of an MMA bout. The versatility of of it is what excites me.

I’m not resting until I’m officially Anderson Silva status.- Jon "Bones" Jones

by AfroSamurai on Apr 17, 2011 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly, there are a lot of fights in boxing that match up to Maynard/Edgar in terms of drama. In fact, there are a lot that Maynard/Edgar doesn’t really compare with.

"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey

by Jack.Barrington on Apr 17, 2011 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Guess it just depends on the person

In no way could two people using only their hands compare to the takedowns, kicks, punches and knees compare for me.

I’m not resting until I’m officially Anderson Silva status.- Jon "Bones" Jones

by AfroSamurai on Apr 17, 2011 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

@AfroSamurai, meant that last statement...

in regards to the trilogy comment btw, not anything else. Just think it’s stupid to consider it a trilogy at this point, to consider it an exciting one, and even then you should admit theres no drama.
 
There was one amazing second fight, but no civil rights intrigue – boxing matches have sparked race wars or huge movements like Johnson – no political angle, SchmellingLouis or AliForeman being a good example of this, and really, no animosity between fighters, pre hype build up or larger than life characters – thinking Tyson or Mayweather as an example.

And how could you possibly watch something like the Ward Gatti trilogies and find it boring? Guess just matter of opinion, but even then I have a hard time believing you’ve put the time to watch rly famous or legendary fights. If you didn’t enjoy watching Tyson, then I’m pretty confused what you’d consider enjoyable.

by Matty Euripides Castourkas on Apr 17, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

@AfroSamurai, think about how dumb what you just wrote is

The first fight wasn’t at all exciting, it was smothering and impressive top control / wrestling, and a generally enjoyable fight. The third fight hasn’t happened yet, and the second fight, which was incredibly entertaining and had the qualities I love in boxing, marathon, style clash, come backs, lotsa heart…etc, was a one in a million MMA fight.

And even then, even considering the one ultra rare, ultra exciting second fight, it still can’t compare to many many many of the more common and famous boxing matches. Joe Louis Vs. Schmelling, was literally the US against Nazis, and represented the first time a black person became a hero for the country, and was a huge fuck you to the Aryan supremacy argument. Louis even lost the first one in a cartoonish almost scripted manner, as Schmelling totally saw through a flaw in his defense. He then corrected it and came back for a crushing victory.

Even this is nothing, imo, to the rumble in the jungle. See when we were Kings if you want to understand the significance of that fight, but the length of boxing matches, and style limitations allows a certain strategy and marathon fight that’s not comparable in mma. Using right straights as an insult to confuse Foreman, absolutely destroying his mind and turning the entire nation against him, getting beat senseless until everyone was sure he was done, only for Ali to shoot of a lightning speed combination and drop Foreman at the tail end of the match… I can think of only a handful of mma fights that match these, and even then, I think I’d consider them coming up short.

And fyi, this is from an mma fan, not really a boxing fan as I just check out the major fights after they happen. Whereas I follow mma in SF/Dream/UFC/Bellator, although the latter barely.

by Matty Euripides Castourkas on Apr 17, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I agree

I think something like Maynard-Frankie matched that fight. When you have two guys that are good at the same things then you have the drama when one guy gets hurt.

by HaterSlayer on Apr 17, 2011 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

In addition...

I think breaks in the actions contribute to drama. Specifically, in boxing you have shorter rounds but a greater number of them, more time for the drama to build up in between. Similarly, when a fighter gets knocked down, those 10 seconds build the crowd to a frenzy with the questions of “How will he come out? Will he survive?” buzzing around the arena.

MMA is probably the most exciting sport I can think of-5 minutes of continuous action, so many different ways to win, anything can happen at any time. But it will never match the drama of, say, Stanley waiting for the catcher’s signal when the count is full with 2 outs in the 10th inning. Would The Shot have been half as dramatic if there hadn’t been a time-out right after Ehlo’s layup?

by gzl5000 on Apr 17, 2011 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was thinking something similar after Morales/Maidana the other week. Like you, I’m not quite sure why.

"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey

by Jack.Barrington on Apr 17, 2011 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Length.

I think it’s really that simple. The 12-round (or even 10-round) format allows the drama to unfold in a way that a 5-rounder simply can’t, even if those five rounds are 60% longer. Now, I would never (ever, ever) advocate 3-minute rounds in MMA, but picture Edgar/Maynard II as a 12-round, 36-minute fight and tell me that wouldn’t captivate the hell out of people.

by Terrence Chan on Apr 17, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think another reason

at least with Berto/Ortiz, was the announcing. Jim Lampley may be a crappy human being, but he is great at calling fights — the guys he has providing color all know something about boxing, too — they work together with Lampley weaving the story of the fight for the audience. He’s great at it.

And it shows how awful Goldberg is at his job, too.

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

good point

Lampley is absolutely brilliant at both understanding the context and writing the narrative of the fight.

by Terrence Chan on Apr 17, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

On the other side of the coin, Gus Johnson was HORRIBLE last night.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

i believe that

Gus Johnson is horrible at any sport I’ve ever heard him announce.

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you serious?

Have you ever heard him announce College Basketball?

There’s a reason why so many people want him to replace Jim Nantz during the Final 4. And he’s pretty good at calling NFL games, too.

He’s a god. Combat sports is just not his forte, nor will it ever be.

by TooLegitToQuit on Apr 17, 2011 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

i rarely watch college bball

or the NFL, for that matter. if it doesn’t happen in the SEC, it doesn’t matter. ;-)

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

absolutely agree. gus johnson has a huge following. he’s regularly mentioned during the highlights of the games he’s calling on sportscenter.

by steak_knife on Apr 17, 2011 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

He’s horrible at college basketball. Just because he shouts does not make him good. I think he’s brutally bad at basketball as well.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Completely and totally agreed

He’s just always trying to be the guy that makes that breathless call that echoes through the ages.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Apr 17, 2011 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

My favorite moment was when Gus play-by-played Al Bernstein getting hit by a disgruntled fan’s water bottle instead of making sure he wasn’t hurt.

by Nick_ on Apr 17, 2011 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Showtime have never been able to compete with HBO when it comes to boxing analysis and commentary, they’re just leagues apart.

by sheikybaby on Apr 17, 2011 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Showtime has pulled way ahead in terms of big, meaningful fights.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh definitely! Especially now they’ve got Pacquiao. Tarver apart though, i think their announce teams over the last 20 years has stunk in comparison to HBO.

by sheikybaby on Apr 17, 2011 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I could not possibly disagree more

Bad Left Hook
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by Scott Christ on Apr 17, 2011 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was wondering if this would happen :)

"All the time he's boxing, he's thinking. All the time he was thinking, I was hitting him." - Jack Dempsey

www.badlefthook.com

by Drunken cutman on Apr 18, 2011 7:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Boxing people really?

I’m not resting until I’m officially Anderson Silva status.- Jon "Bones" Jones

by AfroSamurai on Apr 17, 2011 12:47 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

And we have our first person who can’t just skip an article they aren’t interested in without bitching.

Yes, this is an MMA blog first. But we have the staff and knowledge to cover great events in grappling, wrestling, kickboxing and boxing. Combat sports fans should be able to enjoy great action in any combat sport.

We also cover ADCC, we covered the NCAA wrestling championships, we cover certain K-1 events…etc.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

somebody's always gotta be a hater

you knew it was coming, didn’t you? haha

My first novel is now available in trade paperback. Take a look: http://tinyurl.com/2ag7njo

by bobthewriter on Apr 17, 2011 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, i always put those little disclaimer things in the post but the people who want to complain about it probably aren’t going to read the article anyway

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

lol yeah i came to be looking for what new mma news or article was posted and found boxing

Then i started hating lol. Yes i understand the staff has the knowledge etc… but what i can appreciate about many of the wrestling, and bjj articles is that many of these people have the possibility to come over to mma.

Anyhow it’s completely understandable i didn’t complain when there was a slew of K-1 coverage so i’ll be quiet while you have your boxing fun lol

I’m not resting until I’m officially Anderson Silva status.- Jon "Bones" Jones

by AfroSamurai on Apr 17, 2011 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Where does each round of an MMA fight start at?

Please learn to appreciate the various intricacies of Mixed Martial Arts. Particularly boxing.

by TooLegitToQuit on Apr 17, 2011 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nice post

Hopefully you can entice a few more MMA fans to watch a some of the great boxing on offer right now, as they are really missing out.

"All the time he's boxing, he's thinking. All the time he was thinking, I was hitting him." - Jack Dempsey

www.badlefthook.com

by Drunken cutman on Apr 17, 2011 1:41 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Ortiz has always had talent and apparently struggled badly to make 140, so it wasn’t a massive shock he pulled it off, but Lopez getting beat like that by a guy with 11 losses was absolutely stunning! Bob Arum must be crying his eyes out this morning, Gamboa vs Lopez would have been massive.

by sheikybaby on Apr 17, 2011 1:46 PM EDT reply actions  

Well…you can’t sit on a fight for forever and hope that eventually it pays off. They tried to let it “peculate” or whatever and eventually it backfired.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think we’re looking for “percolate” here

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Apr 17, 2011 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, fucking spell check and the bad habit of “right click, hit first word”

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

although...

the idea of Arum and peculation is far from “off”

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

yea, I call it justice. Lopez was being protected from Gamboa for years now, and finally the lamb ate the faux lion before Gamboa could.

"You can't search me without probable cause Or that proper ammunition they call reasonable suspicion Listen while I bring friction to your whole jurisdiction" - Fugees

by lcollins1 on Apr 17, 2011 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmmmmmm......

Well I hate to say it after reading this post, but my friend and I were thoroughly disappointed by the main event, which was the only fight we saw. We’re both die-hard MMA fans who were interested in seeing Berto in action. What we saw were 12 rounds of hugging, followed by 3-4 seconds of action in between the hugs. It was absolutely maddening to watch them hug each other over and over and not have this be an issue to the announcers or the ref. I’m assuming that this is something that happens all the time and is accepted in boxing… if this is true, count me as a fan of MMA only cause last night was irritating as hell. I respect the athleticism and technical prowess of the boxers last night, I just could not stand the stall in action with all of the hugging and re-setting of action. I’m thankful for our MMA…

BAWSE
Polishing turds since back in the day
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by ChickenSalad on Apr 17, 2011 1:48 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes fighters clinch to get their legs back

You realize this is a common tactic in MMA, be it standing or on the ground, right? Anyway, you may prefer the JuanMa-Salido fight as there was not a clinch to be had.

by ColtJouvet on Apr 17, 2011 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

There were a lot of clinches, as Berto was hurt and trying to slow things down, but the fight had four scored knockdowns caused by huge punches, along with dozens of other big shots landing. It will likely win round of the year for that wild 6th round and is at the top of fight of the year contenders as of now. Complaining about the action seems crazy to me.

by Nick_ on Apr 17, 2011 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess there’s no pleasing some people.

"A champion is someone who gets up when he can't." - Jack Dempsey

by Jack.Barrington on Apr 17, 2011 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just could not stand the stall in action with all of the hugging and re-setting of action. I’m thankful for our MMA…

Are you sure you’re a hardcore mma fan.

by someguy22 on Apr 17, 2011 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Wait

You want to see more boxing articles and less MMA stuff on an MMA blog?

by HaterSlayer on Apr 17, 2011 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who rec'd that?

Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."

by xFenixKnightx on Apr 17, 2011 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

i didn’t say “less mma articles”, just less mma “CRAP” articles.

by v8-Injun on Apr 17, 2011 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Everyone has their own personal tastes. The idea of a blog like this is to appeal to the broadest audience possible. If you like the boxing stuff, read the boxing stuff. If you like other stuff, read that. “Crap” is a relative term. You might view it that way. Many others don’t.

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by Tim Burke on Apr 17, 2011 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was just responding to all the people who said boxing articles have no place here. every one of these sites have "filler articles", and if I had to choose between reading about a great boxing match or reading about which mma fighter gets a chick wet, I'm gonna go with boxing.

by v8-Injun on Apr 17, 2011 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Salido was amazing. Going into enemy territory.and getting the stoppage, even though it was controversial. I had never seen this guy before but he sure made Lopez look overrated.

Strikeforce in Dallas!!
Salido in Puerto Rico and Shields in Toronto
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by DL2kold on Apr 17, 2011 2:23 PM EDT reply actions  

I felt scared for Salidos safety beating down a hometown hero like that.

Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."

by xFenixKnightx on Apr 17, 2011 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah

Even the announcers were getting hit by flying objects. They were real heated about that stoppage down there, hope Salido and camp made it out alright.

Strikeforce in Dallas!!
Salido in Puerto Rico and Shields in Toronto
Zuffa = Halliburton

by DL2kold on Apr 17, 2011 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I also immensely enjoyed Ishida vs. Kirkland the other week

by smoogy2 on Apr 17, 2011 2:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Hard not to enjoy a light hitting dude pounding out the fearsome power puncher in 90 seconds.

Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 17, 2011 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

yea 'twas weird

was it just a matter of garbage chin, or did ishida pull out something we never knew he had? the first shot that dropped kirkland was pretty much a jab, so i incline to the former.

You cannot walk if you fear to crush the ant in your wake.

by hanboxer on Apr 17, 2011 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d agree except for the fact that before this last prison stint Kirkland walked through shots from guys like Joel Julio and Bryan Vera. Neither of those two is a world-beater, but they both throw with good power. It makes Ishida’s KO-1 that much weirder.

by Nick_ on Apr 17, 2011 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

that shit was heartbreaking for me. But I’ve been following Kirkland for a long time.

"You can't search me without probable cause Or that proper ammunition they call reasonable suspicion Listen while I bring friction to your whole jurisdiction" - Fugees

by lcollins1 on Apr 17, 2011 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yesterday’s day of boxing (including Khan/McCloskey in the afternoon) was the most emotionally invested I’ve been in a sporting event (including MMA) in a long time. I had nothing riding on the fights, but my jaw dropped about 5 times and I got goosebumps many others. That just doesn’t happen to me that often in MMA. While I love MMA more as a sport, like Brent said, I don’t think there’s anything that builds excitement like a crazy boxing match.

Still a Beer Monster.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Apr 17, 2011 2:41 PM EDT reply actions  

great article

and a great fight… definitely right about boxing’s drama… mma may be more consistently entertaining, but when boxing shines, it eclipses all else.

You cannot walk if you fear to crush the ant in your wake.

by hanboxer on Apr 17, 2011 2:46 PM EDT reply actions  

boxing

@Bloodyelbow, thanks for the boxing article on your site. I am a boxing fan first and MMA fan second, and despite boxing’s corrupt matchmaking and overall mismanagement as a sport, the last two weekends have been drama filled with upsets. Boxing fans know that Berto and JuanMa Lopez are very talented offensively but had been carefully matched….Ironically, I have more respect for Berto and Lopez for the heart they showed in their losses than I did when they were undefeated but protected fighters…

by mambocowboy on Apr 17, 2011 2:52 PM EDT reply actions  

agree with everythign said here.

"You can't search me without probable cause Or that proper ammunition they call reasonable suspicion Listen while I bring friction to your whole jurisdiction" - Fugees

by lcollins1 on Apr 17, 2011 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Additionally

In my opinion, Bernstein is the pre – eminent commentator is combat sports, even when laden with Johnson.

"All the time he's boxing, he's thinking. All the time he was thinking, I was hitting him." - Jack Dempsey

www.badlefthook.com

by Drunken cutman on Apr 17, 2011 3:01 PM EDT reply actions  

Honestly...

there’s nothing prettier in the world than 2 high level boxers slugging it out. The technique is sooooo beautiful.

by TooLegitToQuit on Apr 17, 2011 3:07 PM EDT reply actions  

yup. & I lost it all on Berto.

by steak_knife on Apr 17, 2011 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think that JuanMa stoppage was bullshit. Maybe Velasquez/Rothwell bullshit in that it didn’t change the outcome of the fight, but bullshit nonetheless.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Apr 17, 2011 4:09 PM EDT reply actions  

It was early, the guy was hurt badly but the outcome wasn’t decided. Salido probably finishes him, but maybe not as he was gassed. Very surprising considering the money behind Lopez and the fact that the fight was in PR.

"You can't search me without probable cause Or that proper ammunition they call reasonable suspicion Listen while I bring friction to your whole jurisdiction" - Fugees

by lcollins1 on Apr 17, 2011 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lopez eyes and legs were getting wobbly, even if it wasn’t stopped it looked less and less Lopez would be victorious…I would blame the divorce.

Should of followed the “Keys to Victory” and kept those hands up.

Ortiz and Berto was crazy, I figured Berto would win but sometimes being proven wrong is a great thing.

Thats me and Marco Antonio Barrera in the profile picture.

by Guillermo Ponce on Apr 17, 2011 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Last nights fights were epic. Watch them. That is all.

Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."

by xFenixKnightx on Apr 17, 2011 4:29 PM EDT reply actions  

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