Crazy Smart or Just Plain Crazy? M-1 Global and the Career of Fedor Emelianenko
It was a shabby end for a fighting promotion so beloved by so many across the globe. Once known for pomp and pageantry, Pride Fighting was also known for putting the best fighters in the world in the ring. By Pride 34, that element was long gone. Instead of Fedor Emelianenko or Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira, the main event was Jeff Monson against Kazayuki Fujita. The shadow of death lingered above the promotion. A month later the sale to UFC parent company Zuffa was official.
Despite promises of super fights and an independantly operating Pride promotion in Japan, the company never held another show. The fighter contracts were transfered over to the UFC. A new day had dawned in mixed martial arts. And Fedor Emelianenko, the Pride heavyweight champion, widely considered the best fighter in the world, was in the catbird seat.
"The purchase took place around the same time that Fedor's contract expired. At that moment Fedor had no contract and his new contract was being discussed," Fedor's manager Vadim Finkelstein told Bloody Elbow in an exclusive interview. The UFC pursued the champion aggressively. At the end of the day, UFC President Dana White and owner Lorenzo Fertitta are fight fans - and they wanted to see Fedor fight. But, as Finkelstein points out, the issues in 2007 were the same ones that plagued negotiations in 2009.M-1 Global is both a management entity and a fight promoter. Finkelstein and his team wanted to partner with the UFC in a meaningful way. In Nevada, the UFC brass wanted to sign a fighter to a contract - with no strings attached. It was a classic impasse.
"Aside from the contract for Fedor, the UFC didn't offer much else," Finkelstein said. "When we couldn't reach an agreement with the UFC that was mutually beneficial, we created M-1 Global with the ambition to build up our own organization. The UFC was not interested in anything but Fedor, while BoDog and Affliction both offered co-promotion which was a much more attractive offer."
The fights with Affliction and BoDog did little to diminish Fedor's stature as the sport's top heavyweight. Three fights, three wins, all decisively, two of them coming against former UFC heavyweight champions Tim Sylvia and Andrei Arlovski. In 2009, with Affliction crumbling under the weight of bad decisions, the most damaging involving exorbitant contracts for undercard fighters, Emelianenko and the UFC again looked to do business. White, more desperate than ever to sign the one significant fighter who had eluded him, made an offer that he called the biggest in UFC history. As both M-1 and the UFC tried to spin the media, I had independent confirmation that the offer wasn't as large as the six fight, $30 million originally reported by radio host Carmichael Dave and was actually less than the dollar guarantee Fedor had with Affliction:
"The actual guarantee offered Fedor was less than $2 million. The other money would only come into play if the PPV's did extremely well," Snowden said. "Fedor was not offered a $5 million guarantee. It is also important for the entire Russian crew to have a chance to help grow the sport there. Although Fedor can make more money now in the UFC than he likely can elsewhere, it wouldn't allow an opportunity to expand Russian MMA."
Therein, as they say, lies the rub. For Emelianenko and M-1 it's not just about the quick buck. With an ownership stake in the M-1 fight promotion, rumored to be in the neighborhood of 10 percent, Fedor has a lot invested in the promotion's success. And that means building a brand and securing the promotion's future. It means co-promotion. It's something the UFC wasn't even willing to consider.
"As part owner of M-1, Fedor has a vested interest to see the brand succeed," M-1 Global's Director of Operations Evgeni Kogan said. "His fighting career has secured him financially but there will come a day when he retires, when this will happen only he can say. But when this day comes, Fedor will always continue to be involved in the sport and having a share in Europe's leading mixed martial arts promotion will not only provide financial benefits but will also ensure his legacy lives on."
More on Fedor, M-1, and the UFC's offer after the break.
With this in mind, the UFC's contract offer doesn't look quite as attractive. Sure it was more money guaranteed than anyone in UFC history had ever been offered. But to Finkelstein, that's short term thinking. The M-1 boss never even seriously considered it - and he disputes White's assertion that it was bad business not to take it.
"It may have been the largest contract offer that he ever made - we don't know - but during subsequent talks Fedor was not made any offer which was worth considering," Finkelstein said. "Perhaps the UFC was planning to make an interesting offer but the one they made was not interesting enough for Fedor."
"For us as a brand, there was more than just contractual money which came into play," Kogan explained further. "It's common knowledge that M-1 enjoys co-promoting within MMA as we feel it's necessary for the continued growth of the sport and is the next step in its evolution. The UFC have a different position on co-promotion, and no one can take away from what they have done for the sport to date."
While White has been very vocal about the deal, or lack there of, even going so far as to call M-1 officials "crazy Russians" to Kogan it's all just business. While Fedor may not have been pleased by some of White's most incendiary comments, they weren't the reason a deal didn't get done.
"Personality conflicts are common in this sport; athletes fight in the ring or the cage; managers fight with promoters; promoters fight with promoters," Kogan said. "But at the end of the day, if there is business to be done, personality conflicts are set aside and the deal is made. In this case, personality conflicts didn't affect the outcome."
Instead of a deal with the UFC, a successful partnership with Strikeforce and Showtime was created. Riding Emelianenko's fame and status as one of the sport's all-time legends, Strikeforce made the tough move from regional to national promotion. With the successful launch of a heavyweight tournament and the growth of stars like Nick Diaz, M-1 and Strikeforce helped make Showtime a must see channel for MMA fans in America. And, as this is the fight business and not the fight game, everyone got rich in the end.
Fedor made millions fighting in the Strikeforce cage, Showtime added thousands of new subscribers, M-1 Global was able to leverage Fedor's success as an attraction into a seperate contract to promote fights on Showtime. And Strikeforce was able to build a brand that attracted several major offers to buy them out. Win, win, win, win.
"The Showtime offer was not smaller, it was different in nature and actually financially better for our organization," Kogan said. "M-1 has enjoyed working with Scott Coker and Strikeforce in the past and we're excited to continue working together in the future. The leadership at Showtime is phenomenal and M-1 is happy to be included in their programming as part of the co-promoted events as well as with our stand-alone M-1 Challenge cards. (Showtime Sports Executive Vice President) Ken Hershman has been vocal about having Showtime televise quality cards which showcase top prospects and lesser known international stars; the M-1 Challenge fits perfectly into this equation."
Later this Week: Securing Fedor Emelianenko's Legacy
160 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Vadim and Fedor were via translator.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
question
do you find it odd at all that in today’s age the head of a “global brand” doesn’t speak English?
WAR peace
No, only when they don’t speak Chinese.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 8 recs
rimshots
To be fair, China is not as much of a consumer economy as the United States yet.
by Confucius on Apr 12, 2011 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I know it's a joke
But the Chinese will be learning English for a long while seeing as how they are 1/3 the size of the US economy. Their growth is ridiculous, but let’s not get too crazy—-their GDP per capita even on a PPP basis is 1/6th that of the US, 1/10th nominally. They’ve gone from absolutely destitute to “1/2 the global average” on a per capita basis.
Not afraid to nitpick
There are more people in China learning English currently than there are in the USA.
It's just a world, it's just a life.
by DirtyML on Apr 12, 2011 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Mandarin/Cantonese/etc is what you meant right??
or is this like how mexicans speak mexican and americans speak ’merican?
No. It’s perfectly acceptable to refer to “Chinese” as a language.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It kills me that you deride Helwani for trading critical thinking for access and then post interviews that are overwhelmingly positive for the people you interview (for example, the interview with the Strikeforce announce team).
Still, great interview. It’s always interesting seeing the other side of the M-1 story. So much of what we get is so anti-Vadim that he’s effectively been turned into this caricature of himself in the media. Yeah, it’s debatable whether he’s ultimately acting in the best interests of Fedor, but you can’t argue he’s been effective in at least making sure that Fedor gets well remunerated.
It kills me that you deride Helwani for trading critical thinking for access
Put up or shut up. When and where? I don’t give two shits if Helwani doesn’t disclose his affiliations or if our competitors want to do PR work. That’s their choice.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t deride anyone who has to make a living at this from making certain choices. It’s easy for me to talk big as a professional hobbyist.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, you do have a book which isn't free.
Just to be fair. I’m not trying to slam you personally but it’s not as though you don’t make money at all through your connections.
Well, you do have a book which isn’t free.
Right. Getting paid is what makes me a professional hobbyist and not a hobbyist.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Why I never joined a frat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-KNVrZaN8M
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
"A samurai would bite your cock off if you tried that shit on the battlefield." - Kid Nate
by Chris Barton on Apr 12, 2011 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions
This is exactly why I am boycotting M-1's Showtime events.
The fact that they have weaseled their way into getting M-1 a TV deal on Showtime by fucking up Fedor’s career sickens me.
by Rob Young on Apr 12, 2011 6:00 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, damn them for trying to make their promotion successful in an incredibly difficult marketplace.
Yes, damn them.
I don’t want MMA to be like boxing where every big name fighter has their own promotion that they are trying to build purely off of strong-arming legit promotions into co-promoting with it. M-1 brought that shit into MMA and I don’t want to reward them for it by paying any attention whatsoever to their organization.
There are fighters who would not see the light of day, let alone get on US television and have a chance to make both a living for themselves and enhance the sport if it wasn’t for M-1. Vadim’s tactics might be mind boggling and frustrating but I’m happy as a MMA fan that a org like M-1 exists.
by memitim on Apr 12, 2011 7:00 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
rubbish
thats the mantra for all the rubbish fighters not willing to try to make it in the big leagues.
That mentality of having to be in the UFC to even be considered relevant is just sad bullcracp.
Some fighters have to start somewhere. And especially so for those hailing from Eastern Europe. What are they supposed to do? Keep fighting in regional orgs and waiting to make it to the UFC so that you can be happy, or maybe go to a promotion that has a deal with Showtime in place? Hmmm…choice, choices.
You, sir, are way off base.
by Unabomberman on Apr 12, 2011 9:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Meh
I think we’re able to look at the end product as it is now and say that while it was probably good for Fedor’s financial well-being – home, gym, etc. etc., it’s been pretty poor for his legacy – losing two in a row to people widely regarded at the time as being in the 2nd tier of competition. Results oriented? Sure, but it’s still been a damn shame that we never got to see some of the big what if fights…. Couture, Brock, Cain, etc. It’s also said damned shame that he’s never fought more than twice a year for the past five years. Seeing the “greatest” squander opportunities because of constant bickering and crap is why M1 shall forever be derided.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 6:04 PM EDT reply actions
I don’t get why people want to always harp on how often he fights. Here is a list of some of the top HW and the number of times each has fought since the start of 2008:
Fedor Emelianenko – 5 times
Brock Lesnar – 6 times
Shane Carwin – 4 times
Frank Mir – 6 times
Randy Couture – 5 times
Antonio Noguiera – 4 times
Ben Rothwell – 4 times
I don’t see anything outrageous by his schedule and yet it is a huge talking point.
Well if you exclude Affliction,
His fight schedule has been considerably less busy. Part of that is due to Strikeforce constantly being forced to renegotiate his contract (including him pulling out of a couple of fights). The big joke was that Strikeforce, prior to the tournament, had the best HW division not seen in the ring. Nobody was complaining about his fight schedule back when he was consistently fighting for Affliction.
Also consider the back injuries keeping Carwin, Nogueira and Rothwell out of the ring… Fedor has been healthy the whole time.
He re-injures his hand fairly frequently
And generally takes part in Sambo competitions during the year.
That ignores the fact that Fedor’s fight with Arlovski was postponed for four months because he injured his hand against Sylvia. Or the fact that it was of no fault of his that Barnett tested positive for their fight, derailing it. Or the fact that he had surgery after the Rogers fight, and then re-injured his hand during a sambo competition which is probably the real reason he couldn’t fight Werdum on the CBS card (and is a whole nother story). And yet Carwin fighting once in 2009 while waiting for a matchup with Brock is a different case?
by John Nash on Apr 12, 2011 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
thats less than 2.5 years
I’m talking double that time. in “just” two years and change, injuries play a big role – Lesnar had a life-threatening injury and has fought more than Fedor. Couture is in his 40s, has retired, is close to retiring again and is making movies. When Lesnar et al go five years and only get ten fights, then we can bitch about their lack of fighting. We’re talking about lack of fighting simply because of playing politics, not because back surgeries, staph infections, etc.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions
No, he just injured his hand severely after two fights, had his opponent test positive derailing a bout, and likes to take part in Russian combat sambo championship tournament every year. But obviously those aren’t legitimate reasons.
by John Nash on Apr 12, 2011 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
oh bull
Sure the hand injuries are perfectly legit. Ignoring the constant, CONSTANT contract bickering, renegotiations and other assorted bullshit is either legitimately stupid or willfully ignorant, take your pick. Being mad that Fedor has allowed M1 to piss away at least four matches within the past half-decade is a legitimate gripe and to pretend otherwise is what I just said above.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions
How many of those renegotiations got in the way of a fight? The last round of negotiations following the Werdum loss obviously did, but that also was because both parties – Strikeforce and M-1 – were tied into a ppv they knew had no chance of success. The renegotiations that led to the derailment of the CBS card, and which is the incident that seems to have created this meme, I really doubt led to the postponement of that fight. As i linked above, Fedor was injured after the Rogers fight and re-injured in a Sambo competition. According to Russian sources he actually wasn’t healthy enough to even fight on that card, so M-1 took advantage of the cards they were dealt and instead of reporting his injury turned it into a holdout. Sleazy? Hell yes. That’s even sleazier than what fans charge them with. But it doesn’t change the fact that when he’s healthy he seems to be fighting at a regular clip.
The idea that Fedor is fighting inferior opposition or less regularly than any of his compatriots is a construct of those insulted that he didn’t sign with the UFC.
ok, it's willful ignorance
at least i know what i’m talking to.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I see your still mad he didn’t sign.
by John Nash on Apr 12, 2011 11:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Most MMA fans are
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 12, 2011 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Apparently I'm not a fan
For although I’m dissapointed he didn’t fight in the UFC I’m not mad or insulted that he didn’t. For whatever reason they chose not to and as long as he fought tough enough competition (which he did) and regularly enough (he has fought as much as Brock or Cain have during their careers) I didn’t feel a need to complain.
by John Nash on Apr 12, 2011 11:31 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It's been pointed out by Bas...
That all his hand injuries are a direct result of his punching style—throwing the ‘casting’ punch. You’d think he’d wise up and be more technical.
A bit off-subject, but it’s a bit stupid to continue to make the same technical mistakes and expect a different result.
Randy – contract disputes/in his mid 40’s
Brock – almost died
Carwin – major back surgery
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 12, 2011 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions
there's a reason i used life threatening
and not ‘almost died’. one is accurate, and the other is from subo >_>
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Is "derided" the word of the day?
by Myke2525 on Apr 12, 2011 7:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Has anybody ever asked the people at M1 why they think its not a conflict of of interest to be both Fedor’s manager and promoter?
They’ve never promoted one of Fedor’s fights.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Monte Cox really grilled them about it.
The amount of conflict of interest in every level of MMA is goddamn hilarious.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
Snowden said?
Interesting stuff. But, “The actual guarantee offered Fedor was less than $2 million. The other money would only come into play if the PPV’s did extremely well,” Snowden said – is that correct?
by Worth on Apr 12, 2011 6:12 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Jon's a very quotable guy.
If you want to know what I think go to HeadKickLegend.com
Managing Editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
by Matthew Roth on Apr 12, 2011 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, I was quoting myself. I was the only one at the time speaking to both sides – so why not?
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Why didn’t you just say it then? Jhf884 said.
Otherwise it gets weird and self-referential.
by jhf884 on Apr 12, 2011 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think that this post from another thread sums it up quite nicely:
I don’t know what you’re talking about
- John Danaher’s Hair
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Ok, that was the past, now what?
Is Fedor sticking with UFC or M-1 will co-promote with Bellator, MFC, Titan, Jungle Fight…?
Maybe go solo?
Who knows if the problem is M1 or if it's Fedor.
Most would agree he should signed with the UFC when he had a chance. One would think his “team” would of talked him into fighting at 205 long ago. Let’s face it, it behooves everyone that he wins. Nevertheless, decisions were made that didn’t bode well for his career. But again, nobody knows. Perhaps he’s happy. I just hope he moves to 205 and gets busy.
100% of what M1 is getting
would be more than 10% of what M1 is getting.
having said that, fedor’s a grown ass man he can do what he likes.
this interview seems a tad sympathetic to M1 no?
…
I will always back the Englishman - from Hardy to Daley to Hathaway - because we are an island nation and I am an ex-pat living in California. Lee Murray comes from the same village as me. Where I live now Fabricio Werdum is a neighbor, as is Bruce Buffer. I am also a Diaz fan!
No kidding
How dare the UFC turn down cross promotion with an Org that reps one guy
Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud
by Sons of David on Apr 12, 2011 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
to be fair
M1 puts on shows throughout Scandinavia and eastern Europe. Big whoop for us, I know, but it’s still more than just Fedor, it’s crazy neo-Nazis like Tomi Valtonen!
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree....
but I have to say, that I’ve read enough “M-1 ruined Fedor’s career and MMA” articles to last me forever. It’s somewhat refreshing to see another perspective.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd say Crazy Smart
How many times do we have to argue about Fedor and his “Legacy”, the man appears to simply not care about it so why can’t we let it go?
We have no idea exactly how active Fedor is w/ M-1 from a business management standpoint. If he is as concerned w/ Russian MMA development and growth than it would stand to reason that these moves were very beneficial to him and Russian MMA in general. IMHO the M-1 Showtime fight was great for M-1 and great for MMA.
The real question is where does Fedor go from here? Will Vadim allow/accept him moving to Zuffa as a fighter only? Does Fedor even want to? If he does this is the time to do it. M-1 has a foothold w/ the deal they have w/ SHO. He can either prove to everyone that he is more concerned w/ his business and less concerned w/ his legacy….again, or he can challenge himself w/ Zuffa knowing that he has helped establish M-1 and Russian MMA.
"There are no atheists in foxholes" isn't an argument against atheism, it's an argument against foxholes. ~James Morrow
"There is a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot."-Steven Wright
“How many times do we have to argue about Fedor and his "Legacy", the man appears to simply not care about it so why can’t we let it go?”
Well said. I’ve found that since I stopped giving a damn about his legacy and who he fights, M1 Global’s efforts to piggyback their promotion into Fedor’s contracts don’t irk me so much. Good luck to them and I hope they succeed (more MMA – GOOD!) but with the two losses Fedor is certainly not worth their demands.
Question about this line though:
“Strikeforce was able to build a brand that attracted several major offers to buy them out.”
Was that really their intent though? Wasn’t the sale motivated by the fact that they needed more capital and that the company who held the largest controlling interest didn’t think it was worth it and decided to cut sail and sell to Zuffa? And was the Fedor contract a big reason (as well as Dan Henderson I imagine) for that required capital?
Just curious if that was a motivating factor and if you could really call it a win if they were sold because they essentially couldn’t afford to keep operating at the level they were at.
Run on sentences like woah.
Crazy Smart or Just Plain Crazy? M-1 Global and the Career of Fedor Emelianenko
Who?
by High Knee Destroyer on Apr 12, 2011 7:02 PM EDT reply actions
Here you go boys
There is only ONE fighter that has beaten:
5 different UFC champions
Coleman
Randleman
Sylvia
Nog
Arlovski
4 kickboxing champions
Schilt
Hunt
Goodridge
HMC
7 different MMA champions
Coleman
Randleman
Sylvia
Nog
Goodridge
Mirko
Arlovski
2 silver olympic medalist
Lindland
Ogawa
1 ADCC open weight champion
Arona
There is only 1 fighter that has gone 30+ fights that has
- Never knocked down by any type of strike.
- Never lost a decision.
- Never been knocked out
Only one fighter that has ever won 5 different mma championships.
- Wamma HW belt
- Pride HW belt
- Pride Grand Prix tournament
- Rings king of kings tournament
- Rings world class tournament
All while finishing 76% of his opponents.
28 fight win streak
22 victories in the first round
5 victories in the first minute
12 victories in the first 2 minutes
Lowest strikes absorbed per minute, percentage out of any fighter with at least 10 fights at .59 in 2009
Andre's Posse
by Anr on Apr 12, 2011 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Wow...
a dirty knees, sticky chin post. He’s had an incredible career, such an incredible career, that it didn’t really require pedantic hyperbole here. Making note of the WAMMA belt and mentioning Arona’s achievement in another sport seems a bit superfluous to me.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Just copy and pasted some stats so nobody has to debate on how Fedor’s career wasn’t/isn’t really that good.
Andre's Posse
I don’t think anyone was asserting such. The last 5 years of Fedor’s career is absolutely a viable topic to scrutinize…
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:53 PM EDT up reply actions
This is exactly why I posted the stats. Here are some more for you...
Since 2008 Fedor has faced 5 top 10 opponents – more than any other HW.
Andre's Posse
So you think that the argument that Fedor hasn’t been fighting the best available opponents since leaving PRide holds no water?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions
If you think fighting 5 guys in the top 10 since 2008 doesn’t mean he’s been fighting the best opponents compared to any other HW I guess we have different opinions.
Andre's Posse
Where do Matt Lindland and Hong Man Choi fit in to your argument again?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn’t know he has fought them since 2008 but thank you for educating me on that.
Hong Man Choi is a kickboxing champion and Matt Lindland was a last minute replacement for Jeff Monson.
Andre's Posse
The argument is since he left Pride...
2008 is just the year you picked so that you didn’t have to include those fights. And mentioning that Hong Man Choi is a “kickboxing champion” to somehow solidify your stance tells me all I need to know, considering that kickboxing champion fought Jose Canseco. Jose. Canseco.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I’ve been stating facts over a career, you have now dwindled your debate to on one fight. I guess one fight over an 11 year career diminishes his legacy to people who weren’t fans of mma when he was dominating in 03-10.
Which is another reason why you probably had no clue Lindland was a last minute replacement for Jeff Monson who when he was scheduled to fight Fedor was just coming off of a UFC title fight.
Keep reaching for knowledge maybe one day you’ll show respect for the elite athletes of combat sports you concern your time with instead of belittle.
Andre's Posse
you’re twisting shit all around- my last statement was not meant as a surrogate for my argument- that’s the way these discussions work- we work from general to specific. I’m not demeaning his whole career- that’s not at all what we were talking about. Fedor is what got me into MMA and he’ll always be one of favorite fighters of all time, which is why I, like the vast majority of MMA fans, was disappointed with this latest act of his career. I knew that Lindland was a replacement- but he didn’t fight Monson (who if he did, would have punched a hole in your top 10 point)- he fought Lindland. You’re correct in that he just came from a UFC title fight- at middleweight.
If you would have just read my words instead of getting defensive and hostile to me (not my ideas), you’d see that this started because A) you took a sarcastic response seriously and B) you brought trivial, unimpressive distinctions (i.e. WAMMA belt- naming the accomplishments of opponents in other sports). I never belittled Fedor’s career, in fact, I started out by saying “He’s had an incredible career.”
I’m an easy guy to debate with on here- I don’t lose my head, I don’t attack people and I really enjoy having discussions with people of differing views. As I re-read our discussion here- I really don’t know where you’re coming from… c’est la vie.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 13, 2011 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm with you...
Fedor has had an incredible career. And I, too, can come off as anti-Fedor, but I’m more anti-Fedor’s management and I’m downright bitter with his choice in not coming to the UFC. Really a fucking tragedy, particularly given his epic fall from grace.
Also...
once he got to Strikeforce, he fought everyone other than who the organization and fans wanted to see and quite honestly, it’s a good thing, because Overeem may have been convicted of manslaughter if they would have fought..
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions
No one in the US knew who Overeem was. He hadn’t defended his belt once and also was absent from the US MMA scene for years. They needed to showcase him first to make the fight interesting and the plan was for it to be on PPV.
I was really referring to post-Rogers, when Coker wanted to make that fight and M-1 started slinging shit and going all Floyd Mayweather to avoid the fight.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 13, 2011 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions
That’s not what happened though. Fedor’s next opponent was always going to be Werdum. Reem was never in the conversation. No one knew who he was. They stated that as early as December right after the Rogers fight. The idea that was supposed to happen was Fedor v Werdum and Reem v Rogers were supposed to take place on the same CBS card so the US audience could get introduced to the Reem and build towards a PPV later in the year. Instead you got the ill fated Nashville event. But, Fedor’s hand got busted up and M-1 pulled their re-negotiations, really as a smoke screen, so the fights happened on two separate cards. Reem kept up his end to lead to a PPV for the two of them to square off. Fedor didn’t as he fell to Werdum.
But, Fedor never avoided Reem. That’s the Bas Boon line. It’s not what happened.
I still don’t get how Fedor doesn’t immediately fight Strikeforce’s beltholder. Especially when said beltholder is slated to face (or just beat) the last guy Fedor beat.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Editor, HeadKickLegend.com
Contributor for CagesideSeats.com and Bloody Elbow Radio
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 13, 2011 1:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Because of two things. One, no one knew who Alistair was in the US. Two, Alistair was fighting in K-1 and just suffered a loss to Badr Hari when Fedor was ready to have his first fight in Strikeforce. Rogers was the best known heavyweight for US fans. That is where they needed to start. There needed to be a build up to the fight with Reem. A fight with Reem would eventually be the best fight Strikeofrce could put together but the groundwork had to be laid first.
Genuine question: Has M-1 ever done anything that you didn’t agree with or upset you?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 13, 2011 1:51 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes. When they used Fedor’s hand injury as an excuse to re-negotiate their contract I felt that was disingenuous. I also hate the way they have led Fedor’s training regiment. I feel if Fedor was training the way GSP or Anderson have been he would still he the top HW in the division. Instead they were yes men to their cash c
by memitim on Apr 13, 2011 2:59 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
1st of all: That’s what you think happened. According to other sources, that’s not what happened. There’s no way that Strikeforce’s plans were to have Fedor beat Rogers, then have the loser of that fight get the shot. I’m too tired to get into a whole thing, but I found this quote from MMA fighting, in an article from 10/25/09 (one week prior to Fedor-Rogers)
"Interestingly, Overeem said he’d prefer to fight Fedor in Dream rather than in Strikeforce, even though the Fedor-Overeem fight is one that Strikeforce has said it hopes to promote.
Here’s the link: http://www.mmafighting.com/2009/10/25/alistair-overeem-i-want-to-fight-fedor-emelianenko-in-april-201/
Here’s another quote from 11/10/09, reporting that Fedor injured his hand and that they will book Rogers for Overeem’s tune up fight in order to give Coker time to promote Overeem-Fedor:
According to the recent report, Coker is planning to use Fedor’s time off to help promote current Strikeforce heavyweight champion, Alistair Overeem, who is currently the front runner to face off with Emelianenko upon his return to the cage. As of right now Overeem is expected to headline a Strikeforce card in early 2010 which will air on Showtime, the question is: Who will Alistair face in the tune-up bout? Will it be Brett Rogers or Fabricio Werdum? Is there a "safe" tune-up bout for Overeem in Strikeforce?
Here’s the link for that: http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2009/11/10/fedor-out-four-to-six-months-with-hand-injury-overeem-likely-next-opponent/
There’s no way that Strikeforce paid what they did, and made the concessions that they did to have Fedor fight 2 warmup fights. They wanted him to win the belt (and not the WAMMA belt) to potentially lock him into a champions clause. Whether this fight was due to air on PPV or SHO is a non-issue- but Coker wanted the Reem-Fedor fight, Reem clearly wanted the fight, and we got mud slinging and calls for Olympic Style drug testing from Vadim.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 13, 2011 1:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Reem wanted the fight. Both Strikeforce and M-1 wanted Reem to have a lead up fight before Fedor. Do the research. No one, except Reem or Bas Boon, was talking about a Fedor fight in the spring of 2010. Not Coker, not Rich Chiu. Just Reem and Boon. That’s the reality of the situation.
by memitim on Apr 13, 2011 3:06 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I did the research- Strikeforce officials were reporting that they wanted to make the fight. Fedor injuring his hand allowed them some time to introduce Reem to the US, but everything I’ve read insisted that Strikeforce wanted to make the fight. In fact, Werdum was being considered for Reem’s tune up fight to lead in to Fedor, so he wasn’t always going to be Fedor’s 2nd SF fight. If you have conflicting info, please send links, because I’d like to know- but I’ve not been able to find anything on the web speaking to your view.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 13, 2011 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
sarcasm, sir
straight over your head
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Apr 12, 2011 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You’re ignoring that Jerry Millen’s insider opinion is that M-1 is 15 million in the hole, and Fedor is getting played for a rube with his 10% ownership stake. Or Bas Boon’s claim that in PRIDE, his management was pulling stuff like ’we’ll charge 500,000, tell Fedor he earned 200,000 and pocket 150,000 each’.
Pretending like M-1 doesn’t bankrupt organizations or if they’re not exploiting Fedor is so disingenuous.
by it never gets better on Apr 12, 2011 7:45 PM EDT reply actions
Nottheface, can you tell us the amount Fedor has been paid by M-1 and if he has been exploited? I’m mobile right now and can’t remember the exact numbers.
by memitim on Apr 12, 2011 7:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Because Millen and Boon are reliable sources?
"There are no atheists in foxholes" isn't an argument against atheism, it's an argument against foxholes. ~James Morrow
"There is a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot."-Steven Wright
As a fan, I've been largely diasppointed bu the way that M-1 has handled Fedor...
but I have to say- making him a shareholder was a masterstroke by those guys. Does anyone know when Fedor was brought in as a minority owner?
Also:
"When we couldn’t reach an agreement with the UFC that was mutually beneficial, we created M-1 Global with the ambition to build up our own organization
I was under the impression that M-1 was around for awhile, but I see that they didn’t hold their first event until 2009, so what kind of considerations were they looking for in ’07, if not co-promotion?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 7:58 PM EDT reply actions
if I’m not mistaken they (M-1) wanted to get some of their fighters on some of the undercard fights, but I’m not sure tat absolutely meant co-promotion.
"There are no atheists in foxholes" isn't an argument against atheism, it's an argument against foxholes. ~James Morrow
"There is a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot."-Steven Wright
by F'n Clownshoes on Apr 12, 2011 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions
According to what I’ve read, they weren’t a fight promotion in 2007- so were they looking for co-promotion as a management firm??
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions
got this from M-1's website...for what it's worth
M-1 Global (www.m-1global.com) has been one of the leading Mixed Martial Arts (MMA) organizations in the world for over a decade. International MMA stars who have fought under the M-1 banner have included Fedor Emelianenko, Andrei Arlovski, Aleksander Emelianenko, Keith Jardine, Alistair Overeem, Yushin Okami, Ben Rothwell, Mike Pyle, Melvin Manhoef, Roman Zentsov, Denis Kang, Martin Kampmann, Amar Suloev, and Chalid Arrab, to name a few.
Yushin and Martin have been in the UFC since 2006. Jardine was in the UFC by 2005 unless M-1 is counting him based on the Strikeforce fight (which I do not think they co-promoted on).
Due to this info I’d venture to guess that prior to 2007 the were promoting/managing fighters rather than fight cards.
"There are no atheists in foxholes" isn't an argument against atheism, it's an argument against foxholes. ~James Morrow
"There is a fine line between fishing and just standing on the shore like an idiot."-Steven Wright
by F'n Clownshoes on Apr 12, 2011 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Couple of follow-up questions
Interesting stuff here. Couple of things I was wondering about:
1. Showtime is adding new subscribers because of its MMA coverage? How many? (I can’t afford pay channels, so I’m really in no position to tell.)
2. Hasn’t M-1 put on fights since 1997? That’s what Sherdog has. Or are there two M-1s?
3. What was the deal with M-1’s office in the Netherlands last summer?
4. Do you think Zuffa and M-1 will end up competing for the European market? Or Chinese?
A little tip...
1. Showtime is adding new subscribers because of its MMA coverage? How many? (I can’t afford pay channels, so I’m really in no position to tell.)
I can’t either, but I order Showtime the night of every fight and cancel it the next day- it’s prorated to 50 cents a day by most cable/satellite providers…
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:21 PM EDT up reply actions
1. Per Showtime yes. They wouldn’t discuss raw numbers, but the network is thriving.
2. Yes. I think the confusion here is with M-1 Global which was created to attack the American market just a few years ago, kind of a spinoff. They signed Fedor and hired Monte Cox looking to make a splash.
3. I don’t know.
4. That’s an interesting question. I think for sure it will be easier to compete in those markets with the proper ethnic and national heroes.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions
2. Yes. I think the confusion here is with M-1 Global which was created to attack the American market just a few years ago, kind of a spinoff. They signed Fedor and hired Monte Cox looking to make a splash.
Do you have any idea when Fedor obtained his ownership stake?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:50 PM EDT up reply actions
I believe it was right before the creation of M-1 Global (2007). I also believe it is a 20% stake and not 10% as Snowden reports.
And since Fedor left Vladimir Pogodin to sign with Vadim in 2003 because he thought he was getting shorted in financail matters, I wonder if he is more on the ball than people give him credit for?
Where’d you hear it was 20? I’ve always heard 10 as well.
Still a Beer Monster.
http://www.instrength.com
Holy shit – found my old notes for an aborted fanpost. Supposedly Fedor was offered the following deal when he signed with M-1: A large signing bonus (claimed to be $10 million but it really breaks down to $1.5 million signing bonus and an investment in m-1), a 6-fight deal with a guarantee of $2 mil a fight, and – here’s the kicker – a stake in the company if he sticks with m-1 for 5 years. That could really explain his loyalty,
Now lets see if I can see if I can find my sources for this. I think I got it from a Russian blog.
As for his percentage, i’ve seen it reported as being 20% by Michael Rome and others. I always assumed the 10% has become more common because that’s Dana’s stake in Zuffa. WHo knows for sure?
It’s not a 20 percent stake. It’s not a 10 percent stake. I just talked to them and that was made very clear.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 12, 2011 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions
So less? More? If it’s not 10 or 20 that only leaves 99 other options between 0 and 100. Any ideas on what Fedor’s deal is with m-1 and how much he’s making?
by John Nash on Apr 12, 2011 11:38 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It leaves options in the neighborhood of 10 percent. But not more than 10 percent.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions
That reads really funny.
Still a Beer Monster.
http://www.instrength.com
by Tim Burke on Apr 12, 2011 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
2. Yes. I think the confusion here is with M-1 Global which was created to attack the American market just a few years ago, kind of a spinoff. They signed Fedor and hired Monte Cox looking to make a splash.
Do you have any idea when Fedor obtained his ownership stake?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 8:50 PM EDT reply actions
I don’t see any crazy smart?…Every business move has not worked out for them. This is the problem that Dana has always said “you can’t build off only one guy” if this was WWE yeah it could work, but the uncertainty of fighting just doesn’t allow it. If M-1 had more fighters that were top level… maybe, but I think this just cemented what Dana was saying all along. M-1 even had Gegard for a while, but they somehow messed that up too.
This is why Dana doesn’t give a shit who his top fighters are fighting because even if they get smoked they got a Jon Jones right there to take over, or a Phil Davis to begin marketing and it goes on where as if Fedor fights someone who is a bad style match up, it could prove costly for M-1 or any organization that relies on 1 fighter (see: Elite XC/Kimbo)
Thats why I thought Strikeforce sold too fast, they had the right model going, but in this economy where even large well established companies are having problems getting financing, I can see why strikeforce sold so fast.
That’s another thing people forget, the UFC succeeded because it was basically self financed through the tough times, where as all the other organizations rely on financing.
I've been very anti-M-1 Global for awhile...
so it’s strange for me to defend them, but I don think that this: “Every business move has not worked out for them.” is a fair statement. I think that the above article illustrates that M-1 has done quite well for themselves through all of this. They got themselves a T.V. deal in the States, which is pretty unprecedented for a foreign org of their size. Imagine if King of the Cage got a deal on a premium channel in Europe….?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions
I just don’t think a tv deal is that good for an mma organization…. its still too much of a niche sport that anyone will really watch, unless its the UFC, its very much like watching darts or snooker or poker…. I think the UFC realized this with the WEC brand and thats why they just folded the company and merged the two well that would’ve been part of the reason
I just don’t think a tv deal is that good for an mma organization
Say whaa???? Any eyes on your product is a good thing.
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions
M-1 got nearly 200,000 people to watch their show on the exclusive SHO network without barely any publicity or build up for the event. That’s a good number and good for the organization.
Are you watching the SF replay?
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Is it on right now? I have it saved on my DVR. I think I have watched the Diaz/Daley fight about 20 times.
yeah
and me too- that round still takes my fucking breath away
by John Danaher's Hair on Apr 12, 2011 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Can't disagree more
But I do agree with Just Plain Crazy statement. These idiots think they know the American market. Snowden good article less bias than your others.The only people that won were Scott Coker and his team. M-1 is going to vanish after the contract is done with Showtime which will now focus more on boxing. Signing with the UFC would have brought so much more than just the “short term” money. During that time Fedor and his team could have made millions in PPV revenue the DW offer for Fedor to promote M-1 on his clothing meaning he will allow M-1 to exist and promote in eastern Europe where the UFC doesn’t have a representation, which will than maybe bring an offer from the UFC of a buyout and big money and managment positions for all the M-1 team. How much money did Fedor lose in sponsors?TapOut to name the big one. Being promoted by the UFC promotional machine, being exposed to a much larger audience than just SF. Are you kidding me not signing with the UFC is the worst business decision ever made coming from people that do not understand the market. Of course they will tell you this was the right decision either you’re naive to believe it or you just can’t face the truth. They lost millions and will disappear into the darkness in a year. Unless their backer which is a Russian “business” man needs to show losses on his income tax.
I love how Snowden quites himself, I swear this site is like fox News, When Im here its like banging my head on a wall and it feels so good when I change the channel. But credit where credit is do, it keeps me coming to this site to listen to the opinuendo
by Papi Troy Esquibel on Apr 12, 2011 10:23 PM EDT reply actions
An interesting take on the reailty of the situation but...
Fedor is a fighter I don’t think he has made good choices AS a fighter with regards to his career. He’s made some money. He would had made money in the UFC AND he would have fought Couture, Lesnar, Cain, et al. Instead, he’s gone this route and sullied his fighting career by fighting sub-elites before dropping two in a row to fighters who wouldn’t make top five in the UFC (although I think Bigfoot is starting to really shine).
I still think Fedor is one of the top 3 of all time, but it’s pretty much pre-2007. Since then the best we can say is that he has “stayed busy.”
The UFC can help grow Russian MMA by getting the TUF International scheme up and running, or by getting a card held there. Simply signing a gaggle of sambo prospects doesn’t make sense. Would a Brazilian team make such a request?
"First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win."
Mohandas Gandhi
"The fight is won or lost far away from witnesses - behind the lines, in the gym, and out there on the road, long before I dance under those lights."
Muhammad Ali
"If MMA is like dog fighting, those are some pretty fucking smart dogs."
"I don’t want to lick any butt."
GSP
sullied his fighting career by fighting sub-elites before dropping two in a row to fighters who wouldn’t make top five in the UFC
I don’t understand this at all. Almost every fighter ends their career with a loss, just like most athletes in team sports don’t hang them up until someone makes them. It’s the nature of the athlete. Losing fights at the end of your career doesn’t sully anything.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
^This^
I disagree with much of the article. It is important to remember that Dana acquiesced to allowing Fedor to have as much M-1 Global advertising as he wanted—mention it in post-fight interviews, t-shirts, banners, etc. That being the case, Fedor could have fought in the UFC and, provided that he did well, brought much more exposure to himself, M-1, and Russian MMA fighters.
Instead, he took the gamble of doing co-promotions in SF and basically sunk his career and tarnished his legacy, IMO. Two questions remain: Did Fedor and M-1 do better financially in co-promoting with SF and will Showtime continue their business with M-1, given the 0.52 household rating of that first M-1 show?
IMO, what is not up for debate is whether the UFC should have co-promoted with M-1 simply to get one fighter. Absolutely not—and the fact that Finkelstein would try to take x percentage of UFC PPV buys and live gate as well as leeching off the UFC brand just b/c they have Fedor is ludicrous.
If Jerry Millen is right, then M-1 Global is in financial trouble anyway:
http://www.mmanews.com/forums/general-mma-forum/47535-former-m-1-exec-jerry-millen-lashes-out-m-1-claims-they-massive-debt.html
Good call on not joining the UFC, Fedor and Finkelstein! With all the re-negotiation shit they pulled with SF, it is probably a good thing.
M-1 ruined Fedor
and made money out of it.
will there ever be a russian as great as the last emperor?
probably not.
atleast Fedor can retire with some cash
Nice article but I am not sure I agree with this part right here:
And, as this is the fight business and not the fight game, everyone got rich in the end.Sure they all earned some money off of it but did they all get rich off of it? M-1 Global has a lot of mouths to feed but only have Fedor doing the heavy financial lifting. Sure Fedor has 10% of the company but he undoubtably does more than 90% of the earning, only having 10% of the company doesn’t seem like all that much of a get rich deal to me in terms of financial accomplisments here. We won’t really know if Fedor got “rich” off the deal until we can look back on this and see how much he gets out of his 10% of the company once he’s not fighting anymore. Then again getting “rich” doesn’t seem to be something that Fedor is overly concerned with anyway. Wonder if the rest of the M-1 Global guys got “rich” off Fedor’s fighting for all these promotions?
We won’t really know if Fedor got "rich"
We do. He’s been paid millions.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Not the millions he would have gotten from sponsors PPV and bonuses if signed with the UFC don’t kid yourself and I don’t think you really believe that.
You’re acting like UFC fighters are getting paid boxing money. If they were, yeah, he’d be an idiot.
by VirtualBalboa on Apr 13, 2011 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Well...
The deal that Fedor would putatively have gotten had he signed with the UFC would have gotten him over a couple of million for a few fights, plus a % of PPVs, and who knows what he would have gotten in sponsorship $.
The question is whether he is doing better with SF or with the M-1 Showtime deal…my guess is that he is not, particularly with the poor showing of M-1’s first show.
The UFC deal was theoretically worth a hell of a lot of money but it wasn’t a guaranteed money deal. Who knows what he would of actually made in the UFC, we can only guess at what his ppv buyrates would of been.
Obviously the issue was that M-1 Global got more out of anyone not the UFC in every deal they did and that’s why Fedor isn’t in the UFC but it’s hard to compare what we think he got personally from other companies to what he may or may not of got from the UFC. Snowden probably knows more than we do but I doubt even he has a financial crystal ball that could give him hard numbers for Fedor PPV % in the UFC.
Alot of variables here...
It’s been previously posted, but it is worth repeating. There are a lot of variables here—% of PPV buys, win bonuses, and the ability to attract new sponsors. I think it is conservative to surmise that Fedor would have made millions with the UFC, again assuming he was successful.
IMO, a Lesnar vs. Fedor fight would have easily topped a million buys—hell, Brock vs. Carwin and Rampage vs. Evans topped that! Even if he negotiated 1%, he would have a chunk of change and that is before factoring in fight pay, bonuses, and sponsorships. Do you honestly think that sponsors would not be all over his nuts?
Ultimately, the question is whether Fedor, M-1, and Russian MMA is better without Fedor in the UFC. I personally think the answer is no—but again, it is predicated on Fedor having success in the UFC back in 2007.
again assuming he was successful.
And that is a real issue here. The more successful he was in the UFC the more he would of made but there was no guarantee of any of it. Showtime/Strikeforce is still going to pay M-1 Global what they pay M-1 Global even though Fedor has lost two fights in a row and didn’t really look very good in either of them. Huge potential money with the UFC provided things go well vs. solid guaranteed money no matter what happens and M-1 Global gets co-promotion with Strikeforce/Showtime. They may of left millions and millions on the table by not going with the UFC but they took the safe choice with Strikeforce where the money was guaranteed and their company got what it wanted to. Thing is we will never know how things would of actually turned out if Fedor went to the UFC, heck if he had lost his first UFC fight to say Randy Couture or Frank Mir then would he of ever got a big money fight with Brock? If Fedor had followed the Cro Cop path then this huge money wouldn’t of happened for him but even after a loss they still had crazy leverage to renegotiate with Strikeforce. Showtimes money may not of had the bigger up side but it didn’t have as big a risk either.
I talked a lot with the UFC people during negotiations too. Maybe you should comment about things you know about, not about who I spoke with for stories?
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
OK I deserve that but
It seems very peculiar that the numbers between what was originally reported to what you reported are so far apart and closer to what M-1 wants us to believe was the offer that’s all.
What’s peculiar was a report of a contract with five times more guaranteed money per fight than the UFC had ever offered anyone. Made me interested in looking into it in the first place.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
And...
…would Fedor have done better simply joining the UFC, particularly if Showtime drops M-1 fights? My guess is that he would have done a hell of a lot better in the UFC just on sponsorships alone, provided he won his fights.
There’s not going to be a huge difference “on sponsorships alone” just because he’s in the UFC.
by Jonathan Snowden on Apr 13, 2011 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Cheap Infomercial
This reeks of cheap infomercial. Maybe it needed to be said, but it makes every move by M-1 sound like a brilliant move instead of rationally analyzing them. Personally, I don’t care if they promote fights, but this co-promotion bullshit has gotten really old. They don’t have the resources or the ability to promote a Fedor fight, so they are basically holding his career hostage for their benefit. I don’t know what 10 or 20% of M-1 is worth, but I would guess not much. I guarantee you that 100% of Fedor is worth more than 20% of M-1. I don’t get how people defend them by saying they are his promoter. They promote Fedor by extorting some organization into calling their own show an M-1 copromotion.
Snowden is a contrarian
Which is OK but in this instance I believe that the M-1 crazy business logic blinded him.
Holiding off in 2007 Good, Holding off in 2009 Madness
The MMA market in 2007 was like the high-tech market in the mid 90s many startup companies lots of money from investors the UFC had many competitors Affliction, IFL, EliteXC. I agree that holding off signing Fedor with the UFC in 2007 only gave value to his stock. He was unattainable and the more wins he had his value went up. I believe in 2009 after the fall of Affliction was the golden moment to sell. The UFC would have paid and agreed to almost anything Fedor’s team would have asked but the air went their heads and they poorly calculated the long term implications on Fedor and their brand. At that time it was clear that the UFC will be the only name associated with MMA and they will win the war with anyone trying to compete with them. If it wasn’t clear enough after the Pride purchase, reality slapped Finkelstein in the face with the purchase of SF. This arrogance was also shown in the negotiations with SF which frustrated their partners and in the end was one of the reasons that led to the sell of SF. In the end M-1 got stuck with the UFC breathing down their neck anyway, with probably much less money and much less to bargain for after their contract is done.

by 























