UFC 141 Fight Card: What Would an Alistair Overeem Victory Mean?
by hobbie on Dec 21, 2011 10:57 PM EST
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"Ladies and gentlemen…welcome to the Horse Meat era!"
No, I don’t expect to hear Joe Rogan make that call next Saturday. "Era’s" typically begin once you win a title and become invincible, and end when you lose your next fight.
But let’s be real here: if Overeem beats Lesnar in his UFC debut, us fans will be watching the birth of a new star like we were in that episode of "Star Trek" where they…uh…watch the birth of a new star?
I think from an "untapped potential" point of view, Alistair Overeem is an absolute gold mine. Of all of the stars and champions outside the UFC, I think Dana White has wanted Overeem more than anyone. And it’s not hard to see why.
Just look at the buzz this event is getting. "The biggest card of the year!" if we accept the common wisdom. And for what? A relative neophyte vs. a guy making his UFC debut.
But just like his mammoth opponent, Overeem is an asset because he bypasses the need for a "sell". He’s a human mountain range who’s got muscles in his sh*t and hits with the kind of soul-destroying power you wouldn’t wish on your worst enemy. Unless your worst enemy is Todd Duffee, in which case you can rest easy, Mr. Hague.
So like I said, if ‘Reem gets his hand raised against Lesnar, we’ve got a new HW superstar on our hands. Of course, a fight with champ Junior Dos Santos awaits the winner, so we’ve kind of know who Overeem’s got next if he wins. A fight with JDS is a very intriguing possibility for a number of reasons.
Firstly, with Junior’s recent network TV exposure and Overeem’s post-Brock upgrade in public profile, this fight would be perfect to headline a "UFC on Fox" card. In such a case, a 64 second KO finish wouldn’t be a disaster, it would be best-case scenario. The UFC clearly wants an MMA version of Mike Tyson, and the winner of this fight could fit the bill nicely.
But if the UFC doesn’t want to go that route, than Overeem vs. Dos Santos also makes sense as a main event for a Japanese card. That’s assuming there is another UFC event in Japan after Edgar vs. Henderson – hardly a certainty in today’s JMMA climate.
But either way, Overeem vs. JDS is a huge fight with an almost guaranteed KO. I have a feeling, should Overeem win, it’ll be the first of many blockbuster Ubereem main events. You know, assuming that whole "getting outstruck by Fabricio Werdum" thing was an aberration and not a sign of things to come.
And that Brock guy? Oh, he’ll be fine. His popularity and ranking have never been determined by such trivial things as wins or losses. Remember when he lost to Frank Mir in his UFC debut and was fighting for a belt two fights later? Yeah, I think he’ll be just fine. And he always has that long-awaited Wrestlemania showdown with the Undertaker if he’s feeling short a couple million bucks.
By Elton Hobson
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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JDS would smash Overeem to bits.
Overeem has a lot of holes in his stand up, and they play right into Junior’s strengths. He is slow, plodding where JDS is faster and more agile. Overeem’s guard doesn’t work well in MMA and he lets guys with significant reach disadvantages tag him constantly. It would also do absolutely nothing to defend him against a vicious uppercut. Alistair also tends to go for one big punch, while JDS throws punches in volume. I just don’t think this plays out well for Overeem.
Overeem has a better pure standup that Junior.
And he has been tested against much better standup competition than Junior ever has given that he was a kickboxer. At least on paper, Alistair should envy him nothing.
Mind you, Junior could just trounce Alistair, and standing up, but until they fight—if they ever do—we can’t say for certain.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
by Unabomberman on Dec 22, 2011 3:10 AM EST up reply actions
Even from a pure striking match
JDS is a horrible style match up for Overeem. The quickness and volume as mentioned is a problem. Just look at how much success Spong had. And the small MMA gloves mean Overeem’s double forearms guard will be full of holes.
by GreyedOut on Dec 22, 2011 3:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Overeem should be expected to adapt to the striking he has to deal with.
He’s done it in the past when he fought in Pride. He had one shit fight against Werdum; but he should, in theory, be expected to know how to engage Junior.
He’s not a moron, and extrapolating him as a pure kickboxer who covers up in the style where he uses his kickboxing globes, in an MMA setting, is not exactly logical.
Again, he could get trucked, but we have little reason to assume that he could be easily bested by just exploiting the glaring holes when he competes in a different sport by someone over the internet.
The Internets: Where there are no girls and men become children.
by Unabomberman on Dec 22, 2011 4:07 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
While it's not a kickboxing match,
A fight with JDS is not a match that will be chock full of takedown and transitions. A majority of the match will be on the feet, and the Werdum match did show that Overeem is more likely to cover up as he would in a K-1 bout.
by GreyedOut on Dec 22, 2011 5:37 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
He has been successful in kickboxing.
If that is what you mean by pure striking. If this was a kickboxing match, Overeem would win. The problem is, this isn’t kickboxing and Alistair hasn’t really adapted. When he fights, he still holds his hands like his kickboxing, and it lets even mediocre strikers hit him constantly. He has a 5 inch reach advantage over Werdum and was getting hit from the first round. What do you think a JDS uppercut would do to Overeem? I ask because it absolutely will hit him.
Here's what I'm talking about.
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And it did.
Just imagine that those uppercuts are all JDS uppercuts. Do you see how ineffective his guard is at blocking Werdum’s punches? The only reason he wasn’t KOed, is that the punches that Werdum actually lands are pretty mediocre arm punches, not the vicious uppercuts Junior would be throwing.
Maybe that was a reason he didn’t care about the punches that Werdum landed? Because they were so ineffective and didn’t hurt him anyway. It was clear Werdum was just going for volume, while Reem was looking for the big shot. Just different tactics.
Also, this was the first fight back in MMA after his K-1 adventure. Even if there were some deficiencies in the adaption here, I don’t see why he shouldn’t be able to change things over the course of his coming fights. Of course he won’t be just standing there letting JDS tag him like that, he’s a smart guy and will know the difference in danger level between JDS and Werdum.
Did he get tag repeatedly by Duffee? Did he get tagged repeatedly by Brett Rogers? No.
by Horselover Fat on Dec 22, 2011 11:49 AM EST up reply actions
He did get tagged by Rogers
Quite a few times, actually. The difference was that Rogers is one of the few guys at HW who is slower in his movement than Alistair, so Alistair was able to avoid most of the damage. JDS has the speed required to deliver a flurry of punches like Werdum, plus the accuracy to make them find their target and the power to end the fight if only one of them connects.
Overeem’s ineffective guard(for MMA) is serious problem for him in a fight against JDS. Then there is the fact that he doesn’t use his reach well. Werdum was able to land on him like that because Overeem turtles up puts himself in his opponents range. Junior is going to destroy him if he doesn’t that shit.
Well, actually I agree with you, I would favor JDS in a fight with Overeem, because of JDS speed and precision. I just think you are selling Overeem’s striking skill a bit short, he’s pretty damn good technically. His lack of speed is the most apparent deficiency though, especially against a young buck like JDS.
by Horselover Fat on Dec 22, 2011 3:00 PM EST up reply actions
Okay, sure, yeah. I think my point was that the Werdum fight maybe wasn’t the best example, because since he punches like a girl it doesn’t matter if he tags you. But that’s a minor point, could be argued either way.
by Horselover Fat on Dec 22, 2011 8:01 PM EST up reply actions
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