Does Showtime's Grabbing of Victor Ortiz vs. Andre Berto II Signal a Dim Future For Strikeforce?
by Brent Brookhouse on Nov 25, 2011 8:59 PM EST
in Strikeforce Analysis
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The future of Strikeforce on Showtime has been a matter of some interest and concern for MMA fans. With the UFC taking stars from the Strikeforce roster already and hinting at wanting to bring in more top talent, it seems that Strikeforce's days are numbered. But UFC president Dana White has said several times that they are trying to continue the promotion going forward.
In late August, White told Ariel Helwani that he met with Showtime execs and it went well as far as keeping Strikeforce around. However, on November 14 it was announced that Showtime had hired Stephen Espinoza as Ken Hershman's replacement as executive VP and general manager of Showtime Sports after Hershman left for HBO.
Espinoza had a boxing background after working as an attorney for men like Mike Tyson and Oscar De La Hoya while also working with Golden Boy Promotions. While no one was quite sure how Espinoza would handle sports going forward after Hershman established a pattern of looking to pay solid rights fees for good fights in boxing while also showing a grand vision by bringing Manny Pacquiao vs. Shane Mosley to the network and organizing the Super Six World Boxing Classic.
Today saw some big news for the network as they outbid HBO to get the rematch between Victor Ortiz and Andre Berto. This is a big rematch that did very solid viewership numbers for HBO the first time out. Showtime going after the fight shows that they have a commitment to getting big fights on the network and are willing to pay for them.
Now, networks like HBO and Showtime work on a yearly budget for boxing. This leads to situations like HBO bidding against themselves and overpaying for the box office bomb that was Devon Alexander vs. Timothy Bradley. That overpayment forced HBO to put Bernard Hopkins vs. Chad Dawson on PPV even though they knew it wasn't a PPV worthy fight, it was just necessary given their depleted fight budget.
I'd be lying if I said I had any idea what Showtime's budget is or if they tie the Strikeforce money to the overall budget with boxing. But paying a rights fee of $2.5 million for Berto vs. Ortiz is an indication that they're keyed in on making 2012 a big year for boxing.
I think it's entirely fair to wonder if this is a revealing signal of their priorities going forward. If they can take the yearly expense of paying rights fees for Strikeforce events and even buy 2-3 more fights like this, it may be of more long term value as Showtime continues to build up their reputation as a very stiff competitor to HBO for the best boxing action.
If that is of a high enough priority and the network isn't interested in ratings for Strikeforce that haven't shown steady improvement while the UFC picks off their top fighters, it may be the end for the promotion on Showtime once the contract is up.
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I predict headbutts.
Editor at Blistered Thumbs
I love Jon Fitch.
Being a realist makes you a "hater" evidently.
Ortiz fights dirty and is a quitter
Berto fights dirty and is way too muscular for his weight class, but is way too short to move up.
I can’t wait for this fight.
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by SSreporters on Nov 26, 2011 12:15 AM EST up reply actions
I hope to god they keep strikeforce going
otherwise I will be forced to cancel my showtime subscription,
Same here. I only subscribed to Showtime for Strikeforce. However, even if Zuffa and Showtime keeps Strikeforce, I expect that we’ll see Strikeforce Challengers level cards. We would still get Womens fights, and I am a big fan of Rhonda Rousey. We would also see some decent prospects as we got Woodley, Rockhold, Kennedy, Cormier, Del Rosario, Wilcox, Saffiedine, Fodor, and OSP from Challengers shows. Guys like Larkin, Brunson, Amagov, and others are doing well in Challengers shows right now.
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by chrisbboy82 on Nov 26, 2011 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
A couple of months ago I would've agreed with you
But now that Homeland is on, and absolutely killing it, I gotta keep it. At least.
Plus they got that new show with Don Cheadle and Kristen Bell coming soon.
by phillyhoosfan on Nov 26, 2011 9:01 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe they can put Strikeforce on HDnet.
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by TheLastEmpress on Nov 25, 2011 9:26 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
That may be a more realistic idea if they want to use it more as a “minor league” to groom future UFC fighters.
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by Brent Brookhouse on Nov 25, 2011 9:28 PM EST up reply actions
I’m hoping they keep it around. It could be a place for fan favorites who can’t keep up anymore or a feeder league. I also really want them to keep around the woman’s division.
Fuck you, double fingers
- Nick Diaz
Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no influence on society
- Mark Twain
by TheLastEmpress on Nov 25, 2011 9:37 PM EST up reply actions
Be interesting if they keep strikeforce as a feeder league wonder if they would be rellagated to just running the Pearl
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it's a damn shame with women's MMA
It would be great if Strikeforce stuck around. Zuffa could build a decent women’s MMA following by signing good prospects and eventually, when a particular fight draws attention, to put a female match on a UFC card. I think it would be a great opportunity for women’s mixed martial arts to grab the attention of a more mainstream audience. I believe that people could have a real interest in WMMA. Plus it can possibly bring in the female demographic which has been pretty much untouched. In this day and age of empowering women the UFC could possibly create a decent following.
In terms of long-term development for mixed martial arts, I don’t see why promoting WMMA is a bad thing.
There's always Bellator.
Hopefully their new deal with Spike will get them to a somewhat better place than they are now at some point, where they’ll take up the torch of championing WMMA.
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by Unabomberman on Nov 25, 2011 10:16 PM EST up reply actions
I really hope
they do not get put on ufc cards..I don’t want them to be out of jobs, but for me, that would just be terrible. No interest at all.
Sticking with Strikeforce or Bellator would be cool though.
by Tats16 on Nov 25, 2011 10:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Correct me if I am wrong (and I probably am)
but wouldn’t the boxing budget and MMA budget be different for Showtime? Or is it just Showtime Sports budget in general?
In any event, this is a bit of coup for Showtime is it not? They have played second fiddle to HBO boxing for years and this is a chance to turn the tables, if even just for a few months.
And in terms of keeping Strikeforce on at Showtime, it would have to come down to there being money to have MMA, any kind of MMA on their network. It would show a real strength of the sport in general, instead of what were are used to talking about the strength of the UFC being the same as the sport overall.
But I don’t know if Showtime will be happy with having a “Feeder League” as their featured MMA programing. It seems too second class for a big time network like Showtime. The UFC would have to make major concessions and put serious fights on Showtime, maybe contenders appearing on Strikeforce cards.
I doubt cross promotion would occur as the UFC is crazy protective of their brand and I doubt they would put UFC cards on Showtime.
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in terms of MMA
I think Showtime is fucked. Unless they can get the UFC to put events on their programming, it’s a lose-lose for them in terms of MMA. In the states, we’ve got so many other stations that will pay a fraction of what Showtime is asking for to put fights on TV. HDNET has been giving fans the best non-UFC fights for a while. MMA is still pretty young in the mainstream and Showtime hasn’t built any sort of following. It’s not like boxing where you can hype one fight and make some bank on it, MMA is a work in progress.
yeah I seem to remember something along those lines also (can someone confirm?)
but if Showtime is serious about keeping MMA, they need to come to a deal for Strikeforce.
With Bellator locked up on Spike/MTV 2, Dream floundering, and the UFC locked on Fox, it is the only brand that has some recognition in the market left as a free agent. Without they will either need to elevate something like the MFC or really create ShoMMA as its own stand alone brand.
Both would take quite a bit of money, time and effort and result in likely less results that keeping Strikeforce as a brand.
aka BuckeyedBear34
Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.
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To have a Cannae you must have a Varo
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Its true
arriel hewani was giving the interview and asked dana if it was possible if the ufc could do events on showtime and dana said no. their deal was exclusive to fox and they cannot be on any other networks. So they only other option is to keep strikeforce on showtime IMO as a feeder league. They can even add other weight divisions.Banatam feather and fly weights. This would insure more fights and talent.
Sports in general can only spend so much. Now they may have had a separate budget to this point for boxing and MMA, but if they want to fully commit to boxing, the Espinoza has the power to change the 2012 budget.
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Nov 25, 2011 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
This should be fantastic news for everyone involved.
After Showtime’s top sports exec left for HBO, everyone was concerned about the future of boxing at Showtime. Welp, it appears Showtime is willing to keep boxing as a huge part of their fare.
As for MMA, Showtime currently has two promotions on their network, while HBO has none. If Showtime can stay competitive with HBO in boxing AND feature something HBO doesn’t have any of (MMA), I think Showtime will do it.
Showtime is marketing towards a younger market these days with their programming. Whether they keep Strikeforce, that’s up to Zuffa. Showtime wants MMA and there is plenty to support that. Be it, M-1, Strikeforce, Bellator, ProElite, Shark, Titan, Legacy, Dream/One, etc…, Showtime has always been very advanced for incorporating MMA
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by BVandDietPepsi on Nov 26, 2011 12:14 AM EST reply actions
HBO does a terrible job with boxing these days
I like this news.
I really don’t care too much about Strikeforce anymore. It sucks for the women’s MMA scene but I think Bellator should pick it up especially with the Spike deal coming soon. I think people should realize that women’s MMA would experience the exact same fate as women’s boxing, which died once Laila Ali left the sport…and she was not the greatest women’s boxer in the sport.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
I think that’s why they brought Hershman on and basically the first thing he did was tell Berto that they wouldn’t air him fighting a bum as a mandatory and if they wanted his fight on TV they’d have to vacate and do it against Ortiz. Then they agreed, but then Showtime swept in. I think HBO’s future is pretty bright.
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by Brent Brookhouse on Nov 26, 2011 12:35 AM EST up reply actions
HBO needs a staff revamp
I don’t need to hear Lampley and Merchant bitching and moaning about everything they watch.
I’d take one solid blow-by-blow guy and pair him with Cleveland Brown (AKA Manny Steward). Harold Lederman’s scorecards have been diabolical lately. He probably should go, too.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
by SSreporters on Nov 26, 2011 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
Word
Lampley and Merchant have been horrible lately. The whole commentary of Mayweather/Ortiz and on the undercard Morales vs cano was horrible. During the Morales fight it was like they were literally trying to persuade the audience to hate boxing. They spent the whole fight talking about how it was a BS title fight and that boxings champion system was garbage. All the while ignoring the great fight with an all tome great pulling the comeback win. It was awful. I think Kellerman does a pretty good job though, he is clearly a huge fan who is genuinely excited to be part of the fights.
by bert44 on Nov 26, 2011 3:02 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I like Kellerman as well. He really shined in his attempts to sort through the Hopkins/Dawson fiasco after that fight ended. Things like asking Hopkins to see both shoulders to compare – that’s quality interview work if you ask me.
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by Fraser Coffeen on Nov 26, 2011 6:48 AM EST up reply actions
No more events at the Shank Tark?
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
by SSreporters on Nov 26, 2011 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
They should drop Strikeforce and switch to a free market approach like boxing. Use a rotation of promoters and make the contracts tied exclusively to Showtime. Zuffa can use Strikeforce to compete with others in this setup if they want I guess.
It would be interesting to put someone in charge of a budget with the ability to bid on the most interesting cards..etc
Managing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Nov 26, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
I would like to see it as a fedder league
the more free mma the better
Regional shows do basically the same thing. Only drawback is that Bellator might snipe prospects, but they could sign guys and build them up on the prelims if a guy is that talented.
by discoandherpes on Nov 26, 2011 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed Lampley, Merchant, n Lederman are always favoring the hbo house fighter. Keep Kellerman n Steward they seem to be fairer n unbiased. The former 3 gotta go!
by Hankverdee on Nov 26, 2011 3:05 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I think the Fox deal is a much clearer signal. It is only a matter of weeks until Strikeforce gets absorbed into the UFC.
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I seen an interview with scot coker with ariel hewani
He said It was all but a done deal that strikeforce was going to be back on showtime. He said they were just ironing out some fine details and if he was a betting man he would put his money on it. I am hoping he is right. If they do another 16 shows next year that means we could very well have some kind of zuffa event on every saturday .
I think it signals that Showtime knows the UFC bought Strikeforce and probably has no plans to really further the brand.
I can’t see the UFC keeping around any second string promotion when they just gave up the WEC for nothing which was arguably more marketable than Strikeforce.
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