Fabricio Werdum Isn't Happy About "Giving" Alistair Overeem a Rematch
by Nate Wilcox on Jan 8, 2011 8:08 PM EST
in Strikeforce News
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Two-time BJJ world champion, two-time ADCC champion, and UFC and Pride veteran Fabricio Werdum shocked the world when he choked out Fedor Emelianenko in 2010. Now he'll challenge Alistair Overeem for the Strikeforce title in the first round of their heavyweight tournament.
He talked to Tatame about the fight:
Technically, your side of the key is stronger, is where the favorites are. Why do you think that Strikeforce matched the fights this way?
I believe they did it that way so that they can sell many pay-per-view subscriptions on the semifinals and on the finale. They're betting I'll beat Overeem and that Fedor beats Big Foot, because they know everybody wants that rematch. So, they want to guarantee a good semifinal so that they sell it out and they're betting on it. Who doesn't want to watch a rematch like this one?
...
Both Kharitoov and Arlovski has beaten you. Do you think about fighting them again?
What I think about is a rematch with Fedor. I wouldn't like to give Overeem this rematch, I'm just fighting because the event matched this fight. To Fedor I'll give this rematch happily, because I like him and he deserves this rematch. But first I have to think about how I'll beat Overeem so that rematch can happen.
It says a great deal about the lack of legitimacy the Strikeforce heavyweight belt has that Werdum doesn't even care that he'll be the champ going into the second round of the tournament if he beats Overeem.
The genius of the Strikeforce tournament is it's allowing them to book the fights that they should have been booking anyway. Werdum beat Fedor and earned the title shot against Overeem -- whether he wants it or not.
Fedor was so dominant for so long that he deserves a shot at the title after only one win.
Antonio Silva will certainly deserve a title if he beats Fedor.
As for the weaker side of the bracket, if Josh Barnett, Andrei Arlovski, Sergei Kharitonov, or Brett Rogers picks up two wins, they'll be a credible challenger -- especially by Strikeforce standards.
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They are betting Fabricio will beat Overeem?
"Hey, I guess they're right. Senior citizens, although slow and dangerous behind the wheel, can still serve a purpose." - Lloyd Christmas
UnintelligentDefense.blogspot.com
Seems like a special spin Werdum is putting on this one
I’d say Strikeforce is setting up a win-win for the second round regardless of who wins Reem/Werdum, as long as Fedor beats Silva.
Its safe to say that without Playboy we wouldn't have MMA as we know it today. - Jonathan Snowden
Yes
But I would not put it past Werdum to catch Overeem again. So many people thought Fedor would devastate Werdum. Can Overeem knock out Werdum? You bet. But it’s not a foregone conclusion.Werdum just beat Fedor. Why shouldn’t he put that spin on?
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 8, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I’m not so sure about that either.
Hey UFC4 go fuck yourself, how about that? Fucking punk, I was just asking for the source that says lesnar gets 5 mill a fight, it’s obvious one does not exist. Bunch of gabronis on a site pulling figures out of your ass.
by Garrett Bennicas
by ufc4 on Jan 8, 2011 8:16 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think Fabricio
has his own unique angle on the world.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Nate Wilcox on Jan 8, 2011 8:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think Fabricio is a pro athlete who is supremely confident in himself, just like most great athletes. You don’t win Abu Dhabi and the Mundials without a little swagger.
That's what she said
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Jan 8, 2011 10:40 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yes it did. Just a bad grasp of English in this case that is all. Just like in racing the Spanish guys never say we need to go faster they always say we need to make a push.
Please tell me he was talking about Overeem.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
He was…yet another reason for Overeem to stay out of Werdum’s guard…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
But that was crazy talk. Strikeforce wants Overeem vs Fedor, they have been pretty clear about that for a long time.
They see me rollin...
by spectaa on Jan 8, 2011 9:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t think so… Werdum pulled out the upset, but chance of repeating it might be minimal if Fedor fights smart. And he is not the favourite coming into the title fight, Overeem is gonna smoke him on the feet.
I think he is already promoting a PPV rematch with Fedor, but the real money match, the fight the people are looking for right now it’s Alistair vs Fedor.
by Carlos Estrada-Ibars Martínez on Jan 9, 2011 7:01 AM EST up reply actions
"Don't be scared homie."
I love the Seahawks. Go eff yourself.
by RolloTomasi on Jan 8, 2011 8:14 PM EST reply actions 11 recs
This picture actually, literally, frightens me.
Rogan was right. Overeem was genetically engineered to fuck my girlfriend.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
only if she is Japanese and brings 5 friends
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Jan 8, 2011 10:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Seanbaby gets the credit for that gem.
Satoshi Kon
R.I.P.
by Grappo on Jan 9, 2011 1:15 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I remember when Seanbaby wrote generally unfunny things about video games. I’m shocked that he went from Old Meme territory a-la fatchicksinpartyhats to trying to talk about MMA. When did this start?
by VirtualBalboa on Jan 9, 2011 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
Dude Seanbaby's shit brings me to tears.
HaHA TANK’S ENEMY IS ALL “DURRR”
Mocked. His. Siezure.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
Rogan said it on a podcast
but he was indeed refrencing Cracked.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
I hope Bigfoot gets a W over Fedor. Just so I can watch the interwebz explode……..again.
"Hey, I guess they're right. Senior citizens, although slow and dangerous behind the wheel, can still serve a purpose." - Lloyd Christmas
UnintelligentDefense.blogspot.com
I got Lavar Johnson winning the whole tourney, à la Steve Jennum.
They see me rollin...
by spectaa on Jan 8, 2011 9:36 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
You win.
Wolfgangsta @ www.ninjasplace.com
Don't eat B.L.T. sammaches
by Urijah Bieber on Jan 9, 2011 5:36 AM EST up reply actions
Fabby is scared.
He’ll try to lure Alistair to the ground and The Reem will (should) just back up and let the ref stand him up.
Why would he be scared of a guy who he has already whooped?
He’s not ‘scared’, he just doesn’t want to get tied down with the belt.
That's about like saying Anderson
Should worry about Ryo…
What happened almost 4 years and 25-30 pounds of muscle ago means absolutely nothing.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Agreed.
Overeem is going to ragdoll Werdum like a pitbulll with a chewtoy.
Like, imagine a pitbull, but with a sharks head, whipping a bloody piece of meat back and forth.
"It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere."
by Shotokanman on Jan 8, 2011 9:41 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Nah, he fears the Überknee.
Overeem wasn’t even a full time heavyweight last time they fought.
i was wondering about that, wasn’t that a light heavyweight bout when they last fought?
by Victor Rodriguez on Jan 9, 2011 5:27 PM EST up reply actions
It was a HW fight, but it was
while Reem was still fighting as a LHW – this just happened to be an open weight GP IIRC, so there was no need for cutting. He weighed somewhere in the 225-228 range when they fought.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 5:30 PM EST up reply actions
beat like 3 years ago or something
and overeem wasnt megareem back then, he just wants to prove he can take fedor again and it wasnt a fluke or lack of concentration on fedors part, but realistically he should have been matched up with overeem right away but he gets elbow surgery done….. was trying to duck overeem + fight fedor but now he has to face overeem first…. lol
I’d say Fabico i more unhappy about the possibility of getting tied down by the champions clause than he is about fighting Overeem. As far as the fighters are concerned, that belt is poison.
Fortunately,
once this tourney is completed, the belt will be completely legitimate as the SF belt and the lineal championship…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
only if the tourney winner
continues to defend the belt regularly
Its safe to say that without Playboy we wouldn't have MMA as we know it today. - Jonathan Snowden
by Chris Hall on Jan 8, 2011 8:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The fighters don’t give a shit about the ‘legitimacy’ of the belt. They care about how it affects their ability to make money.
Belts as trinkets themselves are of course worthless, but
having the title and headlining cards does mean something though. These guys fight to be the best.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
Lineal champion
Awesome. Somebody should tell Strikeforce to promote that. But then, I guess people would get bored as soon as you started explaining what it meant. That’s the problem with things that need to be explained.
by Philosophy Pro on Jan 8, 2011 9:53 PM EST up reply actions
Ha!
And if your screen name bears any similarity to you IRL, you probably face that problem far more often than most would believe…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:10 AM EST up reply actions
The winner of the tournament gets the belt
presumably he knows that.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 9, 2011 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
No, it does not
It says a great deal about the lack of legitimacy the Strikeforce heavyweight belt has that Werdum doesn’t even care that he’ll be the champ going into the second round of the tournament if he beats Overeem.
What it actually says is that Werdum knows he has a far better shot at beating Fedor again than he does at beating Overeem…so long as Overeem doesn’t try to play in Werdum’s guard…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:23 PM EST reply actions
What happened back
when Reem was fighting as a LHW, 4 years and 25-30 pounds of muscle ago means nothing today.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
Am I in the matrix right now?
Ascension MMA. Roswell, GA
by Major B on Jan 8, 2011 8:37 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
In addition
not only was that a long time ago, Overeem beat up Werdum for almost 15 minutes before getting caught in a submission. Next time around, it is unlikely Werdum could take anywhere near that long of a beating from Overeem.
by Philosophy Pro on Jan 8, 2011 9:56 PM EST up reply actions
This fight will show the difference between the old and the new Overeem.
If Alistair wins in a dominating fashion I don’t want to hear anything more about how Alistair sucks because of his earlier losses to Liddell, Shogun and Werdum
… and if he wins (again), I don’t want to hear any more about how Overeem is a new fighter because he gained some beach muscles.
Ha!
Powerlifting and strongman training give you the farthest thing from “beach muscles”…Reem has phenomenal functional strength…watch his training vids sometime…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 8, 2011 8:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
no one is paying attention to that
He does some incredibly difficult and effective lifts and training techniques. I honestly believe he could compete as a strongman.
There’s a video where he talks about training with Strongman competitors and he does some lifts and exercises. He looks just like one of them doing it. He’s just a little small compared to the real pros.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
its the Viking blood
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Jan 8, 2011 10:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Beach muscles are all on your front
Overeem has THE scariest looking back I’ve ever seen.
So they're planning on Fedor-Overeem headlining their first ppv
and the way i see it going Arlovski-Barnett Co-headliner best case scenario. I wonder who else they would stack it with
PPV or another run at CBS. Me being a cheap ass is hoping for a CBS show.
Be a man, not a child-Phil Anselmo
by ANance on Jan 8, 2011 8:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
If they do a PPV. How many buys will it do?
Who? Besides hardcore fans are gonna pay to watch these fights? I believe there aren’t enough hardcore fans out there to sell more then 100,000 tops. If Fedor’s past is any indication of future results, the number will be more like 50,000 buys. Not even a drop in the bucket compared to Zuffa. More like a WEC PPV. Look at Fedor’s PPV history. Pride 32= 32,000 ppv buys. Bodog Fight Fedor Vs Lindland=13,000. Affliction Banned=100,000. Affliction Day of reckoning=90,000. These buyrates are posted on MMAPayout. The point is, Fedor isn’t a big PPV guy. Unless Strikeforce does a major number of ppv buys, they will be paying Fedor, Overeem, and Barnett entirely too much money to be profitable. Throw in Arlovski, Werdum and Rogers salaries. This could be a death nail for Strikeforce. Didn’t Coker and company learn anything from Bodog, Affliction, WFA and IFL? You cannot overpay fighters and expect to be successful long term.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
Yes it makes total sence to use Pride as the measuring stick because MMA hasn’t grown at all in the last 5 years.
There are lots of things that make this different. first Fedor has done some more fight in North America including a nice knock out on CBS. It isn’t just Fedor selling the PPV. For the semi’s they could potentially have Fedor, Overeem, Barnett and the winner of the Arlovski fight all on the PPV along with some non title fights. And as the last week of BE and every where else has shown being part of a HW tournament rather than a stand alone fight ratchets up the buzz factor considerably.
IMO, Werdum will enter the Overeem fight as a clear underdog and I think he knows it. That’s not to say he can shock the world again, but clearly there’s a good chance he’ll lose against the ‘new’ Overeem.
I think SF’s ‘ideal’ match-ups after the first tournament round are evident as the writer of this article and other journalists have pointed out.
Personally, I hope Fedor beats Silva using a jab-jab-right like Kyle used to knock down BigFoot. We’ll see…
I honestly don’t think Strikeforce gives a shit who wins Overeem-Werdum. Either way, they get a highly anticipated fight for Fedor in the semifinals. If Overeem wins, they get the K-1 world champ who looks like a superhero versus Fedor. If Werdum wins, they get a rematch with the only guy to legitimately beat Fedor. They win either way.
by Steve4192 on Jan 8, 2011 8:36 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
In the long run, Overeem is a hell lot more marketable than Werdum though. So I still think they’d kinda prefer him to win, especially if he’d then go on to beat Fedor and the next guy in the finals. That meaning, they still have superman Overeem as champ, now with a string of highly credible title defenses. And I personally still think more people would like to see Overeem – Fedor than Fedor – Werdum 2.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 8, 2011 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
I think they can make it work either way...for a change
but they would definitely prefer the charismatic, star-is-born Reem to Werdum.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:17 AM EST up reply actions
That is, dare I say it, the definition of good matchmaking
It’s bizarro MMA all of a sudden.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 9, 2011 1:10 AM EST up reply actions
No matter what happens in the tournament
I still want to see Barnett vs Werdum. BJJ vs catch!
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 8, 2011 8:35 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I would love that too
so long as it happens after the tourney…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:18 AM EST up reply actions
Jesus Im so sick of these guys in Strikeforce bitching about fighting each other. It def says a lot when someone doesnt wanna fight for the title of thier organization… I dont care who it is.
well he may be bitching
but he signed the fight agreement and will be getting in the cage.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
You mean like when Cerronne called out Cole Miller
Instead of Edgar, Maynard, Pettis, Hendo, Jim Miller, Sotiropolous, Sherk, Dunham, or anybody in the top 20?
Or maybe Werdum currently holds the true lineal title, which means more to him than shiny jewelry.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 8, 2011 8:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I actually think a big reason why Werdum doesn’t want to fight Overeem is because he honestly doesn’t like him or respect him. Can’t forgot he said he had “So much cock.”
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 8:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yeah, I think so too. Plus he’s gotta be thinking it’ll be a lot harder to beat him this time.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 8, 2011 9:20 PM EST up reply actions
One of my favorite things Ive heard
Chael said if you go out there and call out anyone but the champ you should be handed your pink slip.
For some reason I have always liked that quote
"So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself."
by AintNoSunshine on Jan 8, 2011 8:50 PM EST up reply actions
I like that one too.
You have a microphone and a captive audience. Say something big. Call out somebody serious. No offense to Cole Miller, but I was shocked to hear his name. What does that do for Cowboy? Call out Edgar, Maynard, Pettis, Aldo… call out Brock Lesnar. Any of those would be better options. Just ask for something big and hope you rise to it.
Then again, it still looks better than Condit calling out Fitch and then turning it down. That’s some real Haye-klitchko shit right there.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 8, 2011 8:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
What it says
Is that putting on exciting fights by having opponents more likely for that scenario, is more important than winning and challenging.
This is why everyone has been calling out Wandy, even though he is not in the title picture that much.
um actually no nothing like that. I see what your trying to imply but its not even comparable here.
by CerealKracka on Jan 8, 2011 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
God,
I hope someone comes in here and makes comments about how this tournament isn’t a real tourney and UFC could totally do the same thing if they wanted to in fact they already did here look at these fake brackets.
BOOSH
No I love this tourney
I was referring to someone specifically who insists on shitting on everyone’s SF parade.
BOOSH
It's really not a tourney...
:-)
Be a man, not a child-Phil Anselmo
by ANance on Jan 8, 2011 8:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Also tell me how much money you make, just assume I’m interested.
They see me rollin...
by spectaa on Jan 8, 2011 9:55 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
ANance is fucking models in Monaco right now while planning a hostile takeover of Google.
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 10:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 5 recs
Ha i wish.
Im actually sitting at my bouncer job waiting to prey on drunk 21 year olds!!
Be a man, not a child-Phil Anselmo
by ANance on Jan 8, 2011 10:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
SEE!!!!!!
it really is him, in a rare moment of honesty…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:21 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t ever have to lie. My life is that good right now…
Be a man, not a child-Phil Anselmo
by ANance on Jan 9, 2011 12:31 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
The only offense meant, was
to he-who-shall-not-be-named…mmalogic (not BL, but nice guess)…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:47 AM EST up reply actions
do not invoke him
If you say his name, he will appear.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
by TheFilt on Jan 9, 2011 12:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I almost had this joke posted before I noticed you already did it
close one there.
Wolfgangsta @ www.ninjasplace.com
Don't eat B.L.T. sammaches
by Urijah Bieber on Jan 9, 2011 5:40 AM EST up reply actions
I’m so giddy for this to play out. The only way StrikeForces loses in this is if Silva beats Fedor. That can kill it early.
"For your information, I would like to ask a question."
-Samuel Goldwyn
Why?
It’s not like Fedor has been a gigantic financial boon to the company. If Silva wins he becomes a legit star in his own right. That is how promotions move forward. Old stars are used to build new stars. The UFC didn’t collapse when the Liddell/Franklin/Hughes trio started losing. They just made a new bunch of stars with Rampage/Anderson/GSP. Strikeforce needs to do the same thing if/when Fedor goes on a losing skid.
Which is why they wanted to book Bigfoot vs Valentijn, so that if Silva beats Fedor and faces Ubereem there’d be a marketable storyline to sell.
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 8:52 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Strikeforce’s HW division will be on life support if Fedor losses twice in a row.
I'm Don Frye and you're not - Don Frye
by MrTechnique420 on Jan 8, 2011 8:54 PM EST up reply actions
Bullshit.
The talent is there regardless of what happens to Fedor.
To be honest, their long term outlook would probably IMPROVE if Fedor lost to Bigfoot, since Fedor seems to be less interest in the sport every day (even M-1 admitted they were scared he might up and retire) while Bigfoot should be around for a while (and is a lot easier to deal with at the negotiating table)..
To be honest, their long term outlook would probably IMPROVE if Fedor lost to Bigfoot
To be honest, I can’t believe I just read that.
I'm Don Frye and you're not - Don Frye
by MrTechnique420 on Jan 8, 2011 9:10 PM EST up reply actions
As far as the company,
he is probably right…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:22 AM EST up reply actions
Gee, how could a promotion be better off if the big dollar, prima donna, monkey wrench throwing, aging star was put out to pasture and his mantle passed on to the tournament winner? Fedor is huge with the hardcore, but virtually unknown to anyone else. Given the baggage that comes with working with M-1, he really isn’t worth it anymore. It’s time for the sport to move on. The best thing that could happen to the sport is Fedor getting absolutely destroyed, in detail, by Overeem. If Silva does it, that works too.
"an excellent example of why most MMA "journalism" is a joke. Pseudonyms like "toxic" and shitty writing like that dopey article"--- Joe Rogan.
by toxic on Jan 9, 2011 1:52 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I'm a huge Fedor fan
But yes, for StrikeForce as a promotion, Overeem winning this is the best case scenario…it’s also pretty damn likely.
Fedor’s had a lot of fights, a lot that certainly weren’t easy and is only getting older. We don’t know if he’s passed his prime or how much longer he’ll be in his prime. But one of his trainers noted after the Rogers fight that he could tell Fedor was slowing down.
Overeem has a marketable look, is the 2010 K-1 World Grand Prix Champion, and the heavyweight champion of both StrikeForce and DREAM. He has a great win streak and a lot of accolades that will get people’s attention. He also works a lot more to expand his presence and his fanbase then a guy like Fedor, The Reem documentary is a fantastic way of giving curious fans a way to learn about you and become more interested.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Do you have the quote on Fedor slowing down?
I remember after the Arlovski fight his grappling trainer Voronov said:
“He’s obviously got unbelievable potential, but he had some distractions getting ready for this fight,” Voronov said through an interpreter. “The movie. The commercials. If Fedor wants to keep winning, and winning well, he needs to train professionally. Right now he won with his old tricks.”
Food goes in here
This is the best I could find
It’s not where I first read it though.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
I'm actually glad
The Fedor hype is dead.
I'm Don Frye and you're not - Don Frye
by MrTechnique420 on Jan 9, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions
You don't think Fedor's been good for SF?
There’s no question in my mind that his presence allowed them to sign a lot of big names. Hendo was intrigued by the possibility of fighting Fedor, and I’m sure most of the HWs they got also saw it that way. He makes the whole division legit, too, as without him you could always call Overeem a can crusher.
Finally, let’s not forget that he got 5.5M viewers fighting Rogers while the stacked Strikeforce:Nashville card only got 3M. That’s a world of difference. Big deal if he didn’t fight in 2010. If he didn’t fight, he didn’t cost them anything.
This is true. But when he and m-1 held out from the Nashville card they killed (at least for now) the CBS deal and a lot of the work they were doing to build that identity. And his loss to Werdum derailed their big fall breakout plans.
It’s been a mixed bag. Let’s hope the tournament can salvage a lot of their plans.
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 9:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
-f i recall correctly, Fedor was half of the reason they got on CBS anways.
The other half being the strong ratings from Carano vs Cyborg. Carano has been totally AWOL for 16ish months so it was basically all on Fedor. While he may have damaged the CBS deal because of the Nashville card, it wouldn’t have been there at all without him, right? And the PPV they were trying to build was Fedor vs Overeem. Rogers or werdum or bigfoot, without legitimacy from the lineal HW title, would not sell PPVs and might not even be enough to get Alistair back to the US.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 8, 2011 10:39 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Fedor has been good for Strikeforce, but he’s not a financial goldmine like Brock Lesnar or a PR goldmine like Hershel Walker. He certainly helped get them on CBS but then again, he also helped the CBS deal turn sour. He’s got the cachet of being the greatest HW ever and still being a highly ranked HW despite his recent loss, but he’s not irreplaceable and he seems to be at the stage in his life where he is considering moving on to his post-athletic career.
Like a boxing tourney
You beat the champ, you win the belt.
So its lose-lose for Fabricio.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
This sucks....
For some reason I actually thought this was taking place in one night like the Pride GPs. This tourney is going to take a year to complete.
The Pride Grand Prixs took 3 events to complete.
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 9:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
But each round was completed in one night rather than spread across multiple events. A big part of the fun of Pride tournaments was watching the whole picture develop from ‘Total Elimination’ to ‘Critical Countdown’ to ‘Final Conflict’. This tournament is going to be more of a piecemeal affair.
True. And I prefer it that way although I can understand why Strikeforce wants to milk it and spread out the payroll costs. I was really commenting in his “one night” statement which Pride didn’t do. That was the original UFC tournaments.
by John Nash on Jan 8, 2011 10:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Total Elimination – round of 16
Critical Countdown – quarterfinals
Final Conflict – semifinals and finals
With an exception for the 2003 MW GP that started with 8 fighters.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 9, 2011 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
Yea I see where I got confused at. It was three events with the semi- and finals on the last event for most of them. 2003 only had 8 fighters and 2000 was also a two event GP but the rest were longer.
If this was taking place in one night everyone would complain “Oh so and so got an easier path due to injury, fatique etc.” Multiple events is much better.
Food goes in here
I agree
Coker has said he wants it done by September. Whether he means before, or during September, I don’t know.
But we are getting Fedor-Silva and Arlovski Kharitonov on February 12th. Then I’m assuming Overeem vs Werdum and Barnett vs Rogers on the same even in March. Mid-June seems like it would be the best time to have an event with both Semi-Final fights, and the final could be on CBS at the end of August/beginning of September.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
I never liked having guys fight twice on the same night, sure it’s exciting for the fans but for me it just took away meaning from the last fight due to potential fatigue and injury and lack of preparation time. In MMA guys normally have weeks and months to get ready for an opponent not a couple of minutes. I think that’s one of the reasons athletic commissions are so against one night tournaments in the US, with the way Strikeforce has it laid out the commissions will all approve it.
Werdums initial reaction to the Overeem match-up.
I'm Don Frye and you're not - Don Frye
by MrTechnique420 on Jan 8, 2011 9:07 PM EST reply actions 13 recs
Looks like my reaction when Gonzaga Ko’d Crocop.
They see me rollin...
by spectaa on Jan 8, 2011 9:59 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Mine was a bit different.
I'm Don Frye and you're not - Don Frye
by MrTechnique420 on Jan 8, 2011 11:56 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
my reaction
"BE is the Fox News of MMA sites." - Teh Interwebz
"BJ Penn is a cool dude man. I'll be honest, at first, it didn't seem like he could fight that good. I mean, I don't know about his ground game and all of that stuff, but he's got some pop and in just the three days I've been working with him, he has improved man. In his words, man, he told me, 'I ain't never seen some of this stuff you're showing me man.' And that's only after three days. BJ is learning fast man. He's a good guy...If BJ throws his shots the way I got him throwing his shots, he will win. See, those guys throwing shots different than the way we do it, so I'm teaching BJ how to keep it standing and be effective. Let me tell you something man, if he uses it, then it will work. I bet he ain't going back to [Freddie Roach] either. He worked with Freddie 'The Joke Coach' Roach, and he telling me he has never see the stuff I'm showing him. So what does that tell you? Man, the only thing Freddie Roach can do better than me is wash my car."- FloydSR
by FloydJoyMayweatherSR on Jan 9, 2011 1:08 AM EST up reply actions
Damn that was lol funny...
or I’m thinker than I drunk…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 12:25 AM EST up reply actions
Easy way to tell how drunk you are
Do any of your exes seem like less of a bitch right now?
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
by TheFilt on Jan 9, 2011 12:52 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
That my friend
is an excellent test…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
Overeem will win this one he is bigger stronger faster now and smart enough to not go to the ground
Werdum could still land a good upper gut and beat him that way he may not be faster but Overeems chin is well suspect some times
Twitter @MaZZM
http://mazznettt.blogspot.com/
Werdum is pissing me off?
If he really thinks he’s the best, he should have no problem fighting Overeem again. Saying sh!t like Overeem might not deserve a rematch or he doesn’t want to ‘give’ Overeem one is ridiculous.
I want Overeem to f’cking destroy Werdum, so that any notion of being the best is blasted out of his cranium.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Alistair just gets you all worked up and emotional huh?
Nothing weird about that. Not in the slightest.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 8, 2011 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
Everyone has a favorite, but it's moreso my dislike of Werdum
Werdum submitting Fedor didn’t make me like him any more either.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 8, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
You don't like him because he overcame the odds and beat the best HW fighter in the world?
Sounds like a strange reason not to like someone.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 8, 2011 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
Fedor is one of my favorites
Is it that unbelievable that I don’t exactly like the guy who defeated one of my favorites?
Werdum deserves all the credit in the world for the upset, but I was never a fan of his, and then he defeated one of my favorites.
Then he wanted to do an immediate rematch instead of fighting for the title after winning a #1 contender fight. And then saying stuff like he doesn’t want to give Overeem a rematch…it just gets on my nerves.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 8, 2011 11:11 PM EST up reply actions
From the first sentence...
….of this article, it totally sounds like a SF hate article. Just saying.
by Cestus84 on Jan 8, 2011 10:34 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Yeah man.
Nate and Snowden play good cop/bad cop with Strikeforce for the lulz.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 8, 2011 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
Also, am I the only one that thought that the Werdum-Silva decision should have gone to Silva?
I mean, Silva dropped Werdum in both of the first two rounds, and Werdum didn’t come back to dominate either round enough to negate that.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Yeah.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 8, 2011 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
Watch the second round again and tell me Silva won it.
He gets one flash knockdown where Werdum recovers instantly and then proceeds to get outgrappled for the duration of the round. No way in hell does Bigfoot win that round or the fight.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 8, 2011 11:11 PM EST up reply actions
Sounds like I need to go watch it again
I was kinda going off of memory, I only went back and watched the fight one time since I saw it live.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 8, 2011 11:13 PM EST up reply actions
It says a great deal about the lack of legitimacy the Strikeforce heavyweight belt has that Werdum doesn’t even care that he’ll be the champ going into the second round of the tournament if he beats Overeem.
Disagree with this. If he ‘wins’ the belt by defeating overeem, its essentially an interim step as ultimately the real ‘champ’ is gonna be the tournament winner. Plus, its clear that Werdum has much admiration for Fedor. If he believes Fedor to be the best fighter, naturally he would desire a fight with him over whoever holds the belt. Belts in and of themselves mean jack shit, its who you beat thats important. This is especially true considering the fact that title shots are not necessarily merit based.
not happy about getting a titleshot?
hmmm what a primadonna, i guess a win over fedor would do that to u, also geedub what u say has points but it still shits all over sf belts with that thinking
Where in that interview
does it sound like “Werdum isn’t happy about giving Alistair Overeem a rematch”?
This is worth nothing from the interview:
Now I’m training a lot my bang but it still isn’t good for me to bang with him. The guy has just won K-1, so I’ll try to go for the ground, even because he was training his bang a lot and he didn’t have enough time to improve his ground game for this fight with me.
UFC Win Finish % (Top 15 & 6 UFC wins): Belfort 100, Penn 92, Florian 91, Velasquez 86, A. Silva 83, JDS 83, Mir 83, T. Silva 83, Franklin 77, Kongo 75, Leben 73, Hughes 72, Sotiropoulos 71, Alves 70, Couture 69, Marquardt 67, Lytle 67, Maia 63, Koscheck 62, Bisping 60, Rivera 57, Rampage 50, Kampmann 50, J. Miller 50, GSP 47, Sanchez 45, Okami 40, Evans 40, Forrest 38, Machida 38, Fitch 31, Sherk 25, Edgar 25, Maynard 13 (Updated 1/1/11)
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jan 8, 2011 11:31 PM EST reply actions
probably the part where he says he “wouldn’t like to give overeem this rematch.”
by Phildo on Jan 8, 2011 11:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Ahh, I missed it
Both Kharitoov and Arlovski has beaten you. Do you think about fighting them again?
What I think about is a rematch with Fedor. I wouldn’t like to give Overeem this rematch, I’m just fighting because the event matched this fight. To Fedor I’ll give this rematch happily, because I like him and he deserves this rematch. But first I have to think about how I’ll beat Overeem so that rematch can happen.
UFC Win Finish % (Top 15 & 6 UFC wins): Belfort 100, Penn 92, Florian 91, Velasquez 86, A. Silva 83, JDS 83, Mir 83, T. Silva 83, Franklin 77, Kongo 75, Leben 73, Hughes 72, Sotiropoulos 71, Alves 70, Couture 69, Marquardt 67, Lytle 67, Maia 63, Koscheck 62, Bisping 60, Rivera 57, Rampage 50, Kampmann 50, J. Miller 50, GSP 47, Sanchez 45, Okami 40, Evans 40, Forrest 38, Machida 38, Fitch 31, Sherk 25, Edgar 25, Maynard 13 (Updated 1/1/11)
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jan 8, 2011 11:45 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think Werdum not looking forward to fighting Overeem
says anything about the legitimacy of the strikeforce belt. It says more about the fact that Overeem has grown leap and bounds, and might just hand Werdum his own ass, before he gets to fight Fedor again.
whoever comes out of this tournament alive is the man.
and what’s this about a pay per view? Showtime right?
..!..
Reem wins this tourny
OT all the Hawks haters can suck
DEEZ NUTZ
I love the Seahawks. Go eff yourself.
Haters can suck it?
Naaah, son. He’s saying, and I quote the great Roscoe Patterson before his lynching.
“The White man can eat a dick!”
"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)
Boxing Top 5: Mayweather, Dawson, Martinez, JM Marquez, Cotto
MMA Top 5: Penn, Rampage, The Spider, Yasubey, Mayhem
K-1 Top 5: Overeem, Jienotsu, Masato, Buakaw, Zambidis
by Ryan Tical on Jan 9, 2011 1:58 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
thats the best angle of it, he's getting fined for sure.
Wolfgangsta @ www.ninjasplace.com
Don't eat B.L.T. sammaches
by Urijah Bieber on Jan 9, 2011 6:38 AM EST up reply actions
In the grand sceme
of things, I doubt the fine will be anymore then 5 grand, and thats probably what he made in the time it took him to run that one in.
Fabricio getting folded like a lawn chair.
"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez
by Ryan Tical on Jan 9, 2011 1:30 AM EST reply actions 6 recs
Scary
"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)
Boxing Top 5: Mayweather, Dawson, Martinez, JM Marquez, Cotto
MMA Top 5: Penn, Rampage, The Spider, Yasubey, Mayhem
K-1 Top 5: Overeem, Jienotsu, Masato, Buakaw, Zambidis
Arlovski, Rogers, Barnett, Fedor, Bigfoot or Kharitonov can get it too.
Cain, Dos Santos, Nelson, Mir & Lesnar….just shit themselves.
"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane
Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)
Boxing Top 5: Mayweather, Dawson, Martinez, JM Marquez, Cotto
MMA Top 5: Penn, Rampage, The Spider, Yasubey, Mayhem
K-1 Top 5: Overeem, Jienotsu, Masato, Buakaw, Zambidis
This dude is so bad ass...
that he can switch his eye patch from one side to the other and still kickass!
#1 Reason why Werdum doesn't want to fight the Reem
Werdum is still having flashbacks from JDS’s Mortal Kombat uppercut. Not to mention he’s not a fan of rematches, remember when he promised Vera a rematch than changed his mind at the press conference?
I hope Werdum is working on his takedowns. I just don’t see him with the explosive takedown that he is going to need to get this fight to the ground. So in the end, I see Werdum crumpled on the mat with his ears still flapping similar to the JDS fight.
Alot of Werdums takedowns come out of the clinch which obviously is the bread and butter of Overeem. Unlike their first matchup I see Alistair being more active in the clinch and avoiding the TD game of Werdum.
Food goes in here
Agreed
Even if Werdum had very slightly better clinch technique, and I doubt he does, Overeem is probably half again as strong as he was in the first fight, if not more.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
Werdum is simply going to be murdered
Striking – Overeem is the K-1 2010 Grand Prix Champion and has a lethal Muay Thai clinch.
Grappling – Pure grappling goes to Werdum, but in MMA he would need to clinch with Overeem to get a takedown, which isn’t a good idea to clinc with Reem, or go for traditional singles and doubles, which also isn’t going to work. Shooting a traditional double on Overeem will get him kneed.
Overeem isn’t going to dive into Werdum’s gaurd, and if he even follows Werdum to the ground after dropping him, he’ll be much more cautious than the frenzying Fedor was.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
This
The genius of the Strikeforce tournament is it’s allowing them to book the fights that they should have been booking anyway. Werdum beat Fedor and earned the title shot against Overeem — whether he wants it or not.
.
Fedor was so dominant for so long that he deserves a shot at the title after only one win.
.
Antonio Silva will certainly deserve a title if he beats Fedor.
.
As for the weaker side of the bracket, if Josh Barnett, Andrei Arlovski, Sergei Kharitonov, or Brett Rogers picks up two wins, they’ll be a credible challenger — especially by Strikeforce standards.
is why I said on twitter that while I’m really excited to see these matches, they’re really not putting on a Heavyweight “Grand Prix”, it’s more like they just announced their HW plans really early.
but don’t get me wrong, this is a great business move. Calling it a GP adds more notoriety and credibility in people’s eyes… and having them sign fights in advance prevents having to go through their (usual) troubles with booking matches (Fedor/Overeem/Werdum)… plus, a GP also saves them from those people complaining about the other guys getting “undeserved title shots”
This is almost exactly the same matchmaking as the “tournament” the UFC did with HW (I can’t find the link of the fanpost with the UFC heavyweight “tourney” that wasn’t announced), but Strikeforce did a great business move simply by adding the Grand Prix label.
no.
It wasn’t called a HW tourney. I meant how Joe Silva handled the matchmaking for HW… Someone made a fanpost that posted the brackets on how the matches (Mir, Carwin, Velasquez, Nelson, JDS etc) took place looking like a HW tournament.
it’s exactly the same… let the HW champ defend against number 1 contender, then your 2 other stars/contenders duke it out to be number 1 contender, while on the other side of the “bracket”, your middle of the pack HW’s face each other to get a single credible challenger for the next title shot…
SF isn’t really a “tournament” in a sense that we’re used to seeing in PRIDE/DREAM… they’re doing the same exact matchmaking that promotion’s like the UFC are doing, but they’re just announcing, and signing fights in advance, plus they added a label… great business move for them.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 6:51 AM EST up reply actions
I think this might be what you are talking about
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/10/8/1738131/the-ufc-heavyweight-grand-prix-nobody-knew-about
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
sorry, didn't know someone found it already a few comments down.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
I would like to see that fanpost; could somebody please post a link?
Also, if the SF tourney is a big success, do you think the UFC would eventually do something similar to try to “outdo” Strikeforce? I would think the UFC will utilize some counter-programming either way…
here:
found the fanpost.
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/10/8/1738131/the-ufc-heavyweight-grand-prix-nobody-knew-about
here are the images to make things easier… notice that it’s the same type of matchmaking with the title being defended (the reason why this Grand Prix is much different from PRIDE/DREAM or even Bellator), the UFC just didn’t label theirs as a tourney.
Welterweight:
Bantamweight:
Heavyweight:
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 10:54 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
this is all well and good, but this is still a tournament. They may not have set up the seedings the way you would have if you were making a tournament, but there is a big difference between drawing the brackets before the fights happen, and drawing them after the fights happen.
that's exactly my point.
It’s a tournament, sure… but it is not a “Grand Prix”, in the meaning that we’re used to… It’s just unveiling your plans, and setting up contracts really early…
This is great for marketing and avoiding the contractual issues that have been plaguing SF recently. Win-win for them. They’re basically doing normal matchmaking by setting up the biggest title fights possible, and building up the next contenders, but now that they announced it early and called it a grand prix, it makes things much more entertaining…
What are the normal criticisms for Strikeforce?
Biggest fights aren’t being made… The way they set up the brackets, all those criticisms are GONE.
Contractual issues and weird demands after every fights? GONE…
Complaints about who gets the next title shot? GONE…
- contender/underdog opponent isn’t getting built up… GONE…
All that plus a massive boost in fan interest. I say the GrandPrix is a sure fire win by Strikeforce.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
I think
the tourney is a joke. Well not the tourney itself, but the way they determined who fought who. No one in there right mind can sit there, look at the placement of fights and not think that M-1 had nothing to do with it. How else do you explain putting the No. 1&2 seeds against each other right off the start. No single elimination tourney has ever done that.
I suspect Reem was responsible for that
insisting that his next opponent in SF be the winner of the previous #1 contender fight that Werdum won against Fedor – as it was supposed to be all along.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Jan 9, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
you explain it by the fact that they really want the #1 and 2 seeds to fight each other, so why not put it in the first round.
Just as many people would be whining if they did it the other way.
they did it the right way.
I loved that they ensured the bouts that people want to see… I’m seriously excited about Alistair vs Werdum and the possibility of Alistair vs. Fedor…
It’s also almost guaranteed that the winner of the left side of the bracket, (and the eventual tournament winner) will be the #1 ranked HW in the world, so contrary to what that dude said, this tourney is in fact, very big, and very fucking important.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
Never
said the tourney wasn’t important, or big for that matter, as far as the winner being ranked #1, that would be subjective given how the brackets are set up. If the winner of the left side ends up fighting a can from the right, does that still make them the best, even though they may not have fought the other “best” fighters in the tourney?
Okay....
1. There aren’t any cans on the tourney… seriously, people need to know the definition of that term.
2. the eventual winner of the right bracket will become a legit (and ranked) #1 contender for the SF belt since talented guys like Barnett/Sergei/Arlovski/Rogers would be having 2 more victories.
3. the winner of the left bracket would have defeated 2 of the 4 highly ranked HWs (Fedor/Alistair/Werdum/Silva)… Regardless of who he beats on the other side, running through that left gauntlet is most likely enough to be considered #1, especially since Velasquez will be out for several months.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
Thats the whole
thing about single elimination tourneys, the No. 1 and 2 seeds should meet up eventually anyway. Does it always happen, no, but more often then not it does. And if they were worried about Reem and Werdum fighting, they should have just set it up, and then run this tourney after the fact.
It's simple...
Alistair is the champion… and would you rather see Alistair defend his title against Sergei or Werdum?
if you answer Sergei I’m gonna slap you.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
All
I’m trying to say is if Strikeforce was so worried about Werdum/Reem match up, then why not put it on, then run the tourney, they have to wait either way for Werdum to heal, and then place the fighters respectively according to rankings. No other sport puts the number 1 and 2 in the first round against each other, that just defies logic, but then this is Strikeforce afterall.
because as I said,
the “Grand Prix” is mostly (very smart) marketing… They just want the best fights possible, the most attention on them, and with the least problems… setting it up this way achieves all that.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 9, 2011 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
The reason #2 Werdum is fighting #1 Overeem is because he beat Fedor in June and is the number 1 contender. It should be looked at this way:
Overeem vs Werdum is a regular title match
Fedor vs Bigfoot is a #1 Contenders match so the winner of this gets the next shot at the title.
The other bracket is a four-man tournament to find the next contender.
What makes the whole thing a tournament as opposed to good booking is that the fights has been announced in advance.
And if anyone on the left side (which I refer to as the “Champions” side as opposed to the “Challengers” side) wins the whole thing they’ll have a good case for being number 1 having beaten 3 top 10 fighters over the year (whomever comes out of the Challengers side will be top 10).
by John Nash on Jan 9, 2011 12:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
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