UFC Star B.J. Penn Training Boxing With Floyd Mayweather, Sr.
by Nate Wilcox on Jan 7, 2011 2:00 AM EST
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Among MMA fighters, B.J. Penn is known for his outstanding boxing skills. He broke George St Pierre's nose with an uppercut, decimated Sean Sherk with his jab and used brutal counter punching to crush Diego Sanchez. He used a lovely outside slip-right cross to KTFO Matt Hughes.
Legendary boxing trainer Floyd Mayweather, Sr is less impressed with Penn's game. He's now working with Penn to prepare the two division UFC champ for his UFC 127 showdown with Jon Fitch.
Fight Hype spoke to Mayweather:
BJ Penn is a cool dude man. I'll be honest, at first, it didn't seem like he could fight that good. I mean, I don't know about his ground game and all of that stuff, but he's got some pop and in just the 3 days I've been working with him, he has improved man. In his words, man, he told me, 'I ain't never seen some of this stuff you're showing me man.' And that's only after 3 days. BJ is learning fast man. He's a good guy...If BJ throws his shots the way I got him throwing his shots, he will win. See, those guys throwing shots different than the way we do it, so I'm teaching BJ how to keep it standing and be effective. Let me tell you something man, if he uses it, then it will work.
Mayweather also talked about Penn's previous training with Freddie Roach:
"I bet he ain't going back to [Freddie Roach] either. He worked with Freddie 'The Joke Coach' Roach, and he telling me he has never see the stuff I'm showing him. So what does that tell you? Man, the only thing Freddie Roach can do better than me is wash my car."
Kaleb Kelchner comments on the wisdom of Penn spending his time working boxing with Mayweather, Sr.:
BJ Penn seeking to further improve his boxing is a scary thought in and of itself, especially when one considers that Penn just starched Matt Hughes in 21 seconds with a brutal combo that shut Hughes' lights off. Penn is set to face welterweight contender Jon Fitch at UFC 127 in Australia, and with a wrestling game like Fitch's, one has to wonder if Penn spending two weeks with Mayweather Sr. is time well spent. UFC 127 takes place February 27th, and time management for a fight camp is crucial. Fitch's wrestling and Penn's takedown defense are the two greatest variables going into this match. It's hard to point at Penn's second match with welterweight champion Georges St. Pierre and say that wrestling is how to beat Penn, when GSP's wrestling is arguably the best in MMA today.
...
On a broader note, it's fascinating that mixed martial artists are just now hooking up with world class boxing trainers. Penn is considered one of the best boxers in MMA, and he's only spent a short amount of time working with boxing coaches that are on a world class level. This is the beauty of mixed martial arts, as new generations come into the sport, they'll start where the champions of today finish.
Kelcher's concerns about Penn's time management during training are merited. Training has always been Penn's weak spot. I agree that I'd advise Penn to train some wrestling with Ben Askren or Daniel Cormier before he hones his already sharp boxing game, but what do I know?
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AKA..No?
Daniel Cormier trains at AKA doesn’t he?? I doubt he would help B.J. had he ever tried to seek out his services..
by Bwills23 on Jan 7, 2011 2:08 AM EST via mobile reply actions
yep.
He’s with AKA, and he definitely won’t be helping BJ train for Fitch.
by Anton Tabuena on Jan 7, 2011 2:16 AM EST up reply actions
yes
Dave camarillo and Bj went to Ralph Gracies academy together. They wrote the forwards on each others books.
That’s what I wonder, who is dave training with? They have alot of history.
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Jan 7, 2011 10:30 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree with this decision. Penn has got to work on his defensive movement to avoid the aggressive, dangerous standup style of jon fitch.
by Hendo_One-Shot on Jan 7, 2011 2:11 AM EST reply actions 9 recs
I kind of agree
The problem I see with boxing is that it is only effective in close quarters. If your striking/boxing defense sucks and your takedown defense sucks you are definitely either getting knocked out or taken down.
sure he could've spent two weeks training MMA in Hilo like he normally does.
but make no mistake about it people, training 2 weeks with one of the best boxing coaches in the game definitely isn’t a negative…
and yeah, training with Askren, or maybe even Hughes after this would be a huge help also
Yeah I think BJ would definately have to fly Ben or anyone out to help with his wrestling. I just can’t see him going to the Midwest..Ha. Why not try and bring Gray Maynard out? Similar style, bigger wrestler, has experience fighting Frankie twice as well..I don’t know just an idea.. :)
by Bwills23 on Jan 7, 2011 2:30 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Isn't Fitch usually around 200 pounds by fight night?
He’d be better off finding a WW or MW, it’s not like he’s gotta worry about Fitch’s speed…
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
But Bj is still a future contender should Maynard win the belt. Even if Maynard doesn’t win it, he will cross paths with BJ trying to work his way back up. I doubt the two have any interest in making each other better.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
gray was one of bj's coaches/ training partners for awhile.
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Jan 7, 2011 10:32 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'd think it would also depend on the Fitch fight...
If BJ takes out the number 2 WW in the world, what’s the point of moving back down to LW again?
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
See, those guys throwing shots different than the way we do it, so I’m teaching BJ how to keep it standing and be effective.
They throw them different because of the threat of the takedown, hence the “Mixed” in Mixed Martial Arts. I’m sure Floyd is a master on how to keep a fight standing. Hahaha, please BJ, spend some more time training with him.
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
See, those guys throwing shots different than the way we do it,
It could have something to do with them being world champion/professional boxers as well. You know, like the best punchers in the world and stuff.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
Or not ever having to worry about a takedown in his entire life. You got to ask yourself if Mr Sr has the necessary expertise to change BJ’s stand up game. Sure he can make BJ better at boxing, but this isn’t exactly boxing either.
They see me rollin...
Yeah, thanks, I wasn’t saying it as a biased fan… That honestly just seems like a poor decision to waste valuable time with Mayweather… Fitch is on nowhere near the level of BJ at striking, so I’d think BJ would want to spend time on his weak points, which are also Fitch’s dominant areas… Eh, what do I know… But I’m really anxious for this fight.
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
I understand his point
about TD’s and whatnot. That’s definitely part of the reason most MMA fighters don’t punch very well, compared to boxers.
I’m just saying that boxers also punch differently because they are better at it.
Even GSP was talking about how better a world class boxing coach made his punches.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
I’m sure Mayweather can teach BJ a world of new elite boxing techniques, it’s just whether or not BJ will ever be able to apply it to a MMA fight… It just seems like wasted time to me… If anything, it would have been better to do before fighting Mr. Stick And Move Edgar.
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
It was probably getting outboxed by Frankie...
…that made Penn want to train with Floyd
Travis Lutter is not the Michael Jordan of BJJ
Well
I mean, I don’t know about his ground game and all of that stuff,
Exactly.
Nevertheless, seeking training from some of the best in a discipline can only be a good thing. The trick is putting it all together.
that is bj’s issue. he is either striking or grappling, never putting them together like gsp, frankie, rashad, etc
Thank you UFC fans. My name Stun Gun. I want GSP
It’s crazy that we’ve never seen any submission other than a RNC from the Jiu-Jitsu Prodigy in the Octagon. It both speaks volumes for how well he’s grown as a striker, and how much he’s separated from his roots.
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
Watch the second Jens Pulver fight. He puts pulver in pretty much everything and lets it go before he taps because he’s toying with him.
Yeah, I forgot about that...
I gotta go back and watch some of the oldies again…
Fitch's only fan. It's lonely, being me.
Is this going to be...
the best B.J. ever? I’ve never heard that before. C’mon-fighter X spends extremely brief time with specialized trainer Y is one of the most tired meme’s in MMA and Floyd Sr. talking bullshit is one of the most tired in Boxing. He should just go back to 8 weeks of the Marinoviches,
by John Danaher's Hair on Jan 7, 2011 2:57 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Ya really.
The only two fighters in my eyes that always improve when they get in the ring are GSP and Fe.
I could name a few dozen others. Jon Jones, Brock Lesnar, Jacare, Dominick Cruz, and Joesph Benavidez are just a few that instantly come to mind.
Lesnar?
Really? You felt he looked improved in his outings against Carwin and Cain?
About as improved as GSP looked against Serra. Give me a break everyone has a bad fight and you know up until the Velasquez fight that Lesnar had improved by leaps and bounds since his first fight in the octagon and showed improvement in every fight to some degree so fuck off with your lesnar hate.
by Spider_Vemon on Jan 7, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
Really?
What about fighters like Kenyy Florian, Ben Askren, Jon Jones, Anthony Pettis, Dominic Cruz, Evan Dunham and many more.
GSP and Edgar are great examples, Edgar especially… but a lot of fighters are constantly pushing their game. What would be the point otherwise?
by ruckus on Jan 7, 2011 8:55 AM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
I’m not saying that fighters can’t improve, I’m just saying that if a fighter improved everytime we heard that they were spending 2 weeks or less with some specialized coach, well then, improving wouldn’t be such a big deal. I would argue that the fighters mentioned above improve consistently more because of age, work ethic and experience than which specialized trainers they’re bringing in.
by John Danaher's Hair on Jan 7, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
Hmm.
Not sure how I feel about this. BJ imporving his boxing is a scary thing to see man. However I feel that he might be thinking about keeping it standing and not working his ground game enough. This might come back and bite him in the ass. I want to see BJ win so we can Have GSP Penn 3 and watch Penn get destroyed again.
If I was fighting Jon Fitch I would ignore my boxing and just work on my takedown defense. Fitch is going to LnP Penn into a decision. If a natural feather weight like Frankie Edgar can take BJ Penn down at will, he needs to work on his TDD its so freakin obvious its painful. I am putting 50 on Fitch.
Do you seriously believe that?
If a natural feather weight like Frankie Edgar can take BJ Penn down at will,
What fights did you see?
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
How about Edgar vs Penn 1 and 2. There were numerous rounds from each fight where Frankie took Penn down
In the first fight
the only TD Frankie scored was so brief BJ’s butt barely touched the mat for more than a split second.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
Frankie got 4 out of 22 total TD attempts in both fights
He went 1-13 in the first fight, and 3-9 in the second.
http://blog.fightmetric.com/2010/08/edgar-vs-penn-fightmetric-report.html
http://blog.fightmetric.com/2010/08/edgar-vs-penn-ii-fightmetric-report.html
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
when faced with facts your hypothesis crumbles
The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.
by Johnathan Willis on Jan 7, 2011 4:19 AM EST up reply actions
and how many times did Matt Huges take down Penn? For someone who is hyped for having the best takedown defense in the biz, 4 is 4 to many times. I still stand by my original statement that Penn needs to scratch out the boxing and working his wrestling and takedown defense cause its been getting worse and worse and Edgar was the proof.
I was talking about Edgar taking him down at will
and so were you.
But don’t let that stop you.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
BTW- this is absurd.
working his wrestling and takedown defense cause its been getting worse and worse and Edgar was the proof.
How is that so? Frankie went 4-22 on his TD attempts against BJ. In his last fight, FE out wrestled the biggest and best wrestler in the division, Gray Maynard.
Matt had a hell of a time taking BJ down before he got tired in both fights. Hughes said himself, he didn’t care if he lost the fight, he was determined to take BJ down.
Quit talking out of your ass.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
Training with Floyd Sr. works!!!
It worked for Ricky Hatton!
…Wait…
by Flesh Into Gear on Jan 7, 2011 4:03 AM EST reply actions 5 recs
lol ...
iv never seen someone looks so dead, but yet still so alive.
Floyd Sr and Hatton
probably just sat in the locker room doing coke, the white magic didn’t work.
THIS FAILS
Ricky Hatton failed to follow instructions. Hatton was/is a brawler that never really learned to box.
Take a look at Chuck Liddell. He started training with Howard Davis some time before his Shogun fight. Despite looking great in training camp and following instructions during training. He did what so many fighters do. He reverted to what he knew best and worked for him in the past. Just like Koscheck failed to follow instructions against GSP.
End note: Manny Pacquiao is the fighter he is today because he spent years with Freddie Roach, not 2-3 weeks.
4 recs . . . yawn.
Excuse my emotional, reactionary, fanatic output but Pettis will be the next UFC lightweight champion. Period.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jan 7, 2011 8:47 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
Good Points All Around...
But come on you have to admit it was funny right?
by CaptainKneebar on Jan 7, 2011 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
Funny yeah . . . but what was funnier was Mayweather Sr. throwing Hatton under the bus after the fight. The Mayweathers are a bunch of characters.
Excuse my emotional, reactionary, fanatic output but Pettis will be the next UFC lightweight champion. Period.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jan 7, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
There's actually a video of Floyd Sr. telling Ricky how to avoid the same Manny punch
that leads to the first knockdown.
by phillyhoosfan on Jan 7, 2011 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
yeah. Hatton admitted after the fight that he didn’t listen. He was probably thinking about how much beer and coke he could get with his fight purse.
Excuse my emotional, reactionary, fanatic output but Pettis will be the next UFC lightweight champion. Period.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jan 7, 2011 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
BJ just fought in November, so he was probably still in shape, and had just trained for a strong wrestler and grappler in Hughes, so changing up his camp and trying to add some stuff to his arsenal is not a bad idea.
by dpk875 on Jan 7, 2011 4:15 AM EST reply actions 8 recs
very well put
The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.
by Johnathan Willis on Jan 7, 2011 4:17 AM EST up reply actions
I think BJ is pretty sure of his takedown defense
And I’m sure he will spend even more time working on it and his scrambling ability.
Doing this training, I think BJ just wants to be extra sure that he has a striking advantage on Fitch.
He doesn’t want to defend the takedown only to find out he doesn’t have that big of an advantage striking…he wants to know that he will hands down be the better striker. He’s hoping he can knock Fitch out.
Can someone post the gif of Fitch getting rocked by Pierce?
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
If BJ knocks Fitch out
Dana will blow him on the spot.
He’ll then announce that BJ is fighting for the newly vacated WW title against Nick Lentz.
"I'll rock your body with big nasty hooks!"
by TheFilt on Jan 7, 2011 4:35 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
so he’d give him a BJ?
Sorry couldn’t resist
by alexmullen4180 on Jan 7, 2011 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
I dont know Penns training schedule but he needs to be spending the majority of his
training schedule focused on wrestling if he plans on even having a chance at keeping the fight on the feet.
dont care who he's training with...
… as long as he gets in the cage with that mad-killer-instinct he shows sometimes.
maybe someone should kick his dog or swear his mom right before he walks in the oct door… something like that
Why do people seem to assume hes only training his boxing?! Hes most likely going to spend two weeks on it with Mayweather Sr. then spend some weeks on his wrestling maybe at extreme couture seeing as though hes in vegas….
Because hes training with Mayweather, he must only be working on his boxing and train no wrestling or not bother working on any TDD what so ever….
People assume such ridiculous ideas because they’re . . . (I don’t want to insult anyone.)
It’s kind of similar to the idea that GSP spending a week or two with Freddie Roach makes Roach the architect of GSP’s jab against Josh Koscheck. What Firas Zahabi and/or Phil Nurse never mentioned the word jab to GSP in all of their years working together?
Like I said, I don’t want to insult anyone but some people love Kool Aid.
Excuse my emotional, reactionary, fanatic output but Pettis will be the next UFC lightweight champion. Period.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jan 7, 2011 8:51 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
+1 I was about to post the same thing.
GSP trains with roach for a while against one of the best wrestlers in mma in koscheck and everyone was excited.
BJ trains with Floyd sr. Everyone thinks it’s horrible. People don’t remember that bj just had a camp for the Hughes fight training with the ellenberger bros. And we are still 2 months away so who knows who else his training with. And he is also training with Sergio Cunha while in Vegas.
by pooPOOmagoo on Jan 7, 2011 9:54 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Excuse me not Sergio Cunha but Sergio penha I always confuse the both.
by pooPOOmagoo on Jan 7, 2011 9:57 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Hopefully Freddie Roach comes out and responds.
Not so much in retaliation I just wanted to know what the difference in training is.
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
True. But I just wanted to know the difference in styles between the trainers
Seems like Mayweather Sr. prefers a ranged, counter attack while Roach tends to have aggressive fighters while maintaining the fundamentals
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
Mayweather Snr trash talks Roach all the time. He thinks hes the greatest coach in the world and apparently believes hes some sort of poet….Heres a video:
http://www.bjpenn.com/video/training-with-master-floyd?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:BjPennsVideosbjpenncom-UfcNews-MmaNews-Bjpenncom-UfcNews-MmaNews(BJ+PENN’s+Videos)&utm_content=FaceBook
I doubt Roach will respond, he shouldn’t bother wasting his breath.
Asymetrical warfare
One could reasonably argue that no amount of training at this point in his career is going to make BJ a better wrestler than Jon Fitch.
So the question is whether he focuses his training defense or offense. By widening his existing striking advantage over Jon Fitch, he may give himself the best opportunity to end the fight on his terms, rather than fighting a losing battle with Fitch on his.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
^This.
Personally no matter what Penn does, I just don’t see Penn closing the gap in wrestling against Jon Fitch. Whether or not Penn outstrikes Fitch doesn’t matter, one or two punches will not put Fitch away. Fitch will take Penn down. This is a “losing battle with Fitch” for Penn.
Now, if Penn happens to stop Fitch via strikes . . . wow! I’m totally wrong. And I’m sure GSP will sit back and say WT(FLYING)F!! I couldn’t stop that guy in 5 rounds.
Excuse my emotional, reactionary, fanatic output but Pettis will be the next UFC lightweight champion. Period.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Jan 7, 2011 10:09 AM EST up reply actions
BJ has always given wrestlers a hard time....
Fitch isnt a frankie edgar or GSP type wrestler that uses speed and timing to shoot for doubles and singles.
Fitch has to grab a hold of you and grind you down with trips. A nice slow, strong wrestler, perfect for BJ!
Fitch is going to have a nightmare taking BJ down. In order to take BJ down, he has to first close the distance and there is no way hes closing that gap without eating a few hard shots. Kenny Florian employed the same strategy and he got tagged hard coming in and out of clinching with BJ, hes faster than Fitch.
This isnt Ben Saunders, Mike Pierce or Paulo Thiago Fitch is dealing with this time. Its one of the very best in the world.
If BJ comes in with that look in his eye, i expect Fitch to be in for a rough night.
This is exactly what I thought. Frankie and GSP knee tapped BJ in the middle of the cage to take him down 9/10 times. BJ does not taken down very often trapped agains the cage and when he does, it is pretty brief. Unless Fitch changes his wrestling strategy, it is not going to work as well as it does with Thiago or Pierce.
That said, if Fitch can lean on BJ for the first round without getting KOed and tire BJ, then it is his fight to win.
Great Read.
Good information in the article.
by MMA: No Heels Required on Jan 7, 2011 10:39 AM EST reply actions
Fuck. I love BJ (haha). I want him to KO Fitch. But in all honesty, unless he comes out and pulls the same shit on Fitch as he did to Hughes is the last scrap, all I can see everytime I play this fight out in my head is BJ being on his back trying to throw up rubber guard while Fitch lays on him and grinds out the boring win.
The thing is, Fitch is a lot taller than BJ. Most punches, except for maybe the overhand, lose power when you throw them up to taller opponents.
People seem to misunderstand the “time well spent” comment. I ask if it’s time well spent working for two weeks on his boxing because I believe his striking is already enough to win him the fight. In all likelihood, the fight will be decided on whether or not Fitch can impose himself on BJ Penn and drag the fight out, and win at least two rounds of the three. Of course BJ Penn is working on his whole game, but 2 weeks of training is a significant amount of time in an 8 week camp.
I’m pumped to see the fight, and hope BJ can take the fight to Fitch and win an exciting match.
Twitter me @kkelchner621
Read me at WatchKalibRun
I could actually see defensive boxing movements and uppercuts helping with take down defence.
No better defensive boxer out there then Floyd Jr.
Good for BJ
since working with soemone like Mayweather Sr can only help, but his existing standup is enough to destroy Fitch on the feet. What he needs is more wrestling and getting off his back. Penn may stave off a couple TD attempts, but eventually Fitch will get Penn down and keep him down. Fitch is bigger, stronger, and will probably use a plan similar to GSP’s. Penn is going to get Fitched.
I think a lot of you guys are viewing this in the wrong light.
I’m sure this plays into BJ’s strategy more than you think. He’s obviously going for a dance n dodge type approach to pepper fitch with jabs, circle away and throw power shots.
If you think about it its the perfect way to beat him because as other folks mentioned fitch always tries to get you against the cage for a takedown, but that wont work if he cant catch penn.
by destructivist on Jan 7, 2011 3:52 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
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