Alistair Overeem vs. Fabricio Werdum Set for Strikeforce Heavyweight Tournament
by Nick Thomas on Jan 4, 2011 4:29 PM EST
in Strikeforce News
Email
Print
According to MMA Fighting:
The first two quarterfinal bouts will take place on Feb. 12, with Fedor Emelianenko taking on Antonio Silva, while Sergei Kharitonov will face Andrei Arlovski. Earlier Tuesday, MMA Fighting reported Emelianenko's contract extension with Strikeforce, paving the way for his entrance into the field.[UPDATE] - Tournament bracket via Strikeforce.com:
The other two quarterfinal bouts include Josh Barnett facing Brett Rogers and Alistair Overeem taking on Fabricio Werdum, the last man to beat Emelianenko.
While the Emelianenko-Silva and Kharitonov-Arlovski fights will take place at the Izod Center in East Rutherford, New Jersey, the location and date of the second set of quarterfinals is still to be determined.
635 comments
|
2 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
They're like doing things right and stuff
Not afraid to nitpick
by joker24 on Jan 4, 2011 1:25 PM EST reply actions 15 recs
Well I mean...thats like...your opinion, dude.
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
by Krimson on Jan 4, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Come on
Rogers vs. Barnett is brilliant match making no? A triple time steroid champ vs. some guy we don’t really care about.
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
Now that it's part of a tournament
that’s reason enough for people to care. Maybe it won’t blow the skirts up on hardcore fan, but for a lot of casual viewers a tournament=instant interest
You’ll care when you’re driving away from Sam’s Club and that front right tire starts to wobble!
It's official. Les Miles DOES NOT have a deal with the devil. He beat him Nov. 6th, 24-21.
You Aint gonna make it to 20-1 Rowdy Rod.
by DayGeaux on Jan 4, 2011 2:59 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
that sounds like a threat? haha
Rogers has been losing 2 out of his 3 last fights. The one he won was a split decision. He in trouble unless Barnett fails the drug test again
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
He also lost
to 2 of the 4 best heavyweights in the world. Even Barnett, ring rust and all, won’t necessarily tell us where Rogers really is right now…(aside from #12).
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah
Anyone who has worked a blue collar job at any point in his life should not be allowed to fight professionally. And if he had the gall to lose to Fedor Emelianenko and Alistair Overeem, he should be shot.
did I say that or are you just making things up now?
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
Kinda 50:50 ;)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
well. I mean if people are going to make things up
I’ll just take a vacation and you guys can write stuff for me? :) You know, vicious stuff
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
Responding to the general contempt for Rogers.Who cares if he used to work at Sam’s Club? GSP used to be a garbage man. Not everyone was born with a silver spoon in their mouths, the way all MMA fans appear to have been. And Rogers has a good W/L record and has beaten one top guy. He might not be that good, but there are worse fighters on every big show we see.
by yarky1 on Jan 4, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
well said
and he’s a big strong monster that comes to fight, japan would love him
I think he’s let himself go though since the fedor loss
He worked for a living hes a blue collar dude. If anything he should be applauded not put down. He's living his dream win or lose.
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 4:55 PM EST up reply actions
Watch the special they did on him and Fedor.
He talks about how many hours he put in at the gym on top of working full time.
I liked the special it was especially nice to show he was finally able to buy his family a home
Just saying among MMA fans he gets no respect because of his background
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 10:45 PM EST up reply actions
I’m stuck at a part-time job right now in this economy, and Rogers is a professional fighter who is doing very well for himself despite losing recently. I don’t see anything to disrespect, and I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s doing better than most people in this economic time, plus he’s living his dream.
I won't jump off the bandwagon just because you lost.
I also find it strange that guys like Duffee don't get half the contempt...
….for an Overeem ass beating as Rogers does. The guy has only lost to Fedor and Overeem. I still think he has come a long way with even further to go.
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 8:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Odd seedings?
Only complaint I have is that the #1 seed infighting the #2 seed in the first round… But if they had Overeem fight andrei or Rogers I would cOmplain that their champ is fighting cans… As much as I bah Strikeforce, this tournament will be very fun to watch if they can really pull it off.
by flingom on Jan 4, 2011 1:40 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Agreed
As far as a true “tournament” is concerned, Arlovski/Kharitonov and Reem/Werdum don’t make much sense. Then again, the belt is pretty much a joke, so I’m all for them trying to put on the best fights ASAP. If they don’t do Reem/Werdum first, there’s a decent chance it never happens
by MemphisMike on Jan 4, 2011 1:45 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
What do you mean?
by Werdum/Reem doesnt make sense? It only makes sense, Reem is champ and Werdum #1 contender also Arlovski and Kharitonov ar lowest ranked top heavyweights of toourney, so they also make sense.
by Andrew TheSaint on Jan 4, 2011 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
It doesn’t make sense in that a tourny should be 1 vs 8 2 vs 7 etc…Why should the lower seeds have easier fights than the higher seeds? Again, I understand where SF is coming from. With their luck Kharitonov would KO the Reem and Arlovski would Buentello Werdum. But as far as a true bracket, its like If the Celtics and Heat met in Round 1 of the playoffs
I think they’re doing this because Werdum deserved a high-profile fight like this next and may not have agreed to fight his way through a tourney to get to either Arlovski or Ubereem.
Otherwise of course, you are right. Makes it look like they’re stacking the deck against The Reem by having him fight Werdum first while Fedor / Barnett get the lower ranked guys. Still: what a great tourney if they can pull it off. Say what you will everybody but to me this is the most interesting tourney since Pride died.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Politics/Tourney
I don’t know about any of the politics/jockeying going on behind the scenes, and the format off all the good fighters being on one side doesn’t make a lot of sense. However, from a sporting perspective, it will be nice to see the 4 best fighters fight their way to the finals.
The lower ranked guys should be fighting the higher ranked guys...
…That way a low ranked guy doesn’t get an easy road to the semifinals. But whatever. I think Strikeforce is trying to bank on gatting as many of the big fights to come together as possible. You’ve already got Overee/Wrdum happening. I’d bet my left nut that they’re gonna be in the opposite bracket as Fedor in order to have Overeem or Werdum meet Fedor in the final. They’ll probably have Fedor in the same bracket as Barnett and Rogers so that we can all see that Fedor/Barnett fight that never happened. If all goes well, we’ll get to see Overeem/werdum, Fedor/Barnett, AND Fedor/Overeem all in the same tournament. If Fedor wins it all, then we will even get to see him rematch Werdum at a later date.
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 1:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I really hope these guys are on crack because that would be a horrible way to do the tournament. Gauranteeing half your stars get blown out in the first round would be really stupid.
so frickin' frustrating
We finally get a tournament and they mess it up right from the start. 1v2 is just, just silly. It makes no sense at all. why do I get the sneaking suspicion that this will end up being a farce. Let us see who wins the first fights and then we’ll just group them the way they want to. I am out of my mind pissed that even when they (Strikeforce) do something right, they go and do something wrong.
by F'n Clownshoes on Jan 4, 2011 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
I hate tournaments (in mma)
but I love this.
The lower ranked guys should work there way up, until they deserve to fight the top guys. Maybe I’m just still sore that Chuck v. Wand didn’t happen in the Pride tourney back in the day.
Plus this way there is a halfway decent chance we will see not only Werdum v. Reem, but also Reem v. Fedor (or Feder v. Werdum II). How awesome is that!
the exact reason i love this the way it is set up, here are my predictions:
R1
Fedor KO’s Silva
Ubereem KO’s Fabricio
Kharitonov KOs Arlovski
Barnett subs Rogers
R2
Fedor Decisions Ubereem
Barnett Decisions Kharitonov
R3
Barnett KTFO’s Fedor
;) JK Fedor KOs Barnett
Fabricio then gets shot at Fedor the Grand Prix Champ and gets KO’d
the universe is restored to as it once was and Dana White commits Seppiku!!
If this tourney goes off w/o a hitch...
…we will see Overeem/Werdum, Fedor/vs Overeem, and Fedor/Barnett. That’s three huge fights right there. Then Fedor can defend his belt against Werdum?
You’re right, my friend. This has EPIC written all over it.
It’s absolutely horrible bracketing for a tournament but for getting fights we want to see this is pretty good. It’s Strikekforce; even with this stuff coming out it’s hard to trust them in making this work, at least this way even if the tournament fell apart we would get good fights up front. I don’t understand why they front loaded it like they did but I’m not really going to complain about finally getting Overeem vs Werdum 2 (wonder if Overeem demanded it).
It’s almost like if they were gonna stack the bracket that way they should hae just dropped out the bottom 4 guys. Have Werdum/Reem and Fedor/Barnett or Silva. The second round is gonna be a joke and could probably be avoided
Yep, they are top loading this thing in a way that puts most of the drama on the first round and potentually sacrifices the second as a joke round. It’s getting your bang up front instead of building over a full tournament. Still with the chances of this falling apart at least this way they do get some good matches up front.
Yeah, I’m starting to wonder if this is just SF following through on some promise to either fighter/ early negotiations for this fight. SF hasn’t set anything in stone so there’s room to change it.
I suspect that the only way Reem would agree
is to be fed Werdum first, as he has been promised him already…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
Most likely a similar situation with
Fedor and Bigfoot…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
How can the second round fall apart here?
Fedor vs. Silva
Overeem vs. Werdum
Arlovski vs. Kharitonov
Rogers vs. Barnett
Ideally the second round will be Fedor vs. Barnett and Reem / Werdum vs. Arlovski or Kharitonov. That is a great second round. Finale would be fantastic as well, even if it was Barnett vs. Kharitonov considering who they’d have to have beaten to get there.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
I agree. I dont see how the 2nd round is a joke. If anything there is a risk of the final being a joke.
I mean, we could see Overeem v Rogers in the final. Ouch.
If Rodgers
wins those two other fights, it won’t seem like a joke.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
Can we take Danas and the Fertitas.....
…..cocks out of our mouths for just one second and quit fucking complaining. Its happening, lets be happy its taking place period!! Fucked up brackets or not. Shit!
Shit I wasn’t even complaining, heck I mentioned that in the post:
I don’t understand why they front loaded it like they did but I’m not really going to complain about finally getting Overeem vs Werdum 2
I can’t stand people like that who can’t seem to get over the UFC vs anything but the UFC bullshit all the while telling other people to stop it when the side they picked is being discussed.
Huh?
1. Why are you replying to me with your silly sad crap? I have said I am thrilled it is happening, there is nothing wrong with discussing the brackets.
2. What the hell is wrong with discussing subjects on the internet? Shit talking about MMA issues are why we are all here in the comments section, it’s the whole fucking point of being here. If you don’t want to discuss the issues then why are you bothering to make a comment to start with?
For me, the match-up makes sense...
but not within a tournament. Ideally, I’d like to see Overeem and Werdum for the title while eight others fight it out to:
1. determine a number 1 contender and
2. establish a coherent heavyweight division.
I’d like to see Lavar Johnson vs. Shane del Rosario in there. I think it makes sense, given that they are “home grown” prospects. Maybe Griggs vs. Cormier as an alternate.
"You son of a bitch, give me my plunger back."
- welterweight contender Josh Koscheck
OK
It’s a bit silly for a tournament, but who cares? If we fans get to watch a bunch of big fights with a structure, I’m OK with unfair seedings.
Do we have any idea whether Fedor has actually agreed to complete this tournament?
If he has, that’s awesome, as it sets up potentially three exciting fights for him. But if he’s only agreed to fight Silva, and then wants to renegotiate, I’d rather not hear about a tournament that may not make it to the second round.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
According to Mike Chiappetta he signed a four-fight extension, Showtime will also be airing M-1 shows as part of that agreement. This might be good news for Strikeforce because if M-1 pulls anything again they risk having their showed yanked off the channel.
I wouldn't hold my breath
M-1 views contracts as nothing more than strongly worded suggestions
With the
Showtime / M-1 agreement, there is some leverage on that side now. I suspect their agreement is more iron-clad than the one between Strikeforce and M-1.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
Fedor
has tweeted himself that hes fighting Silva for tournament
by Andrew TheSaint on Jan 4, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
well I'll go ahead and get excited then
…cautiously
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 4, 2011 1:59 PM EST up reply actions
Fedor isn't on twitter, only impostors.
If you mean this guy – twitter.com/femelianenko, you might notice the official M-1 twitter and Strikeforce’s twitter don’t follow him.
oh of course
he tweeted on the cell phone he doesn’t have from the russian bath the other day.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:07 PM EST up reply actions
ditto
honestly i probly wont even be convinced that they can pull this whole thing off until the semis are booked
Well
Do you think they would make tourney and not make participants to sign a deal that they agree to fight semis and all?
by Andrew TheSaint on Jan 4, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
What happens if someone gets injured in training?
Do they even have another heavyweight to jump into the tourny?
Sheeeeeeeee-it
How about..
Shane Del Rosario, Daniel Cormier, and Lavar Johnson? I’m sure one of them would go for it, if they got the chance.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 4, 2011 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
It's reported that Dan Cormier, Shane Del Rosario, and Lavar Johnson will be fighting in order to cast an alternate in case of injury.
Seeing as how that’s only three fighters, they’ll probably throw Lashley or Griggs in the mix too. Maybe they’ll even sign Tim Sylvia.
If Showtime, I’m going to have to try to do another free 3-month trial.
UFC Win Finish % (Top 15 & 6 UFC wins): Belfort 100, Penn 92, Florian 91, Velasquez 86, A. Silva 83, JDS 83, Mir 83, T. Silva 83, Franklin 77, Kongo 75, Leben 73, Hughes 72, Sotiropoulos 71, Alves 70, Couture 69, Marquardt 67, Lytle 67, Maia 63, Koscheck 62, Bisping 60, Rivera 57, Rampage 50, Kampmann 50, J. Miller 50, GSP 47, Sanchez 45, Okami 40, Evans 40, Forrest 38, Machida 38, Fitch 31, Sherk 25, Edgar 25, Maynard 13 (Updated 1/1/11)
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jan 4, 2011 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
Come on, man
Can’t you fork over the $39 for three months of HW fights that the UFC would charge $50×4 for? You get a bunch of icing on the cake with Dexter and other Showtime stuff.
It’s an MMA bargain.
by Mint on Jan 4, 2011 9:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Nah he’d rather pay for the TRUE top tier Heavy’s like Kongo, Hunt and Yvel.
Food goes in here
by Pandanus on Jan 4, 2011 9:27 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t pay for any of them. I go to bars.
UFC Win Finish % (Top 15 & 6 UFC wins): Belfort 100, Penn 92, Florian 91, Velasquez 86, A. Silva 83, JDS 83, Mir 83, T. Silva 83, Franklin 77, Kongo 75, Leben 73, Hughes 72, Sotiropoulos 71, Alves 70, Couture 69, Marquardt 67, Lytle 67, Maia 63, Koscheck 62, Bisping 60, Rivera 57, Rampage 50, Kampmann 50, J. Miller 50, GSP 47, Sanchez 45, Okami 40, Evans 40, Forrest 38, Machida 38, Fitch 31, Sherk 25, Edgar 25, Maynard 13 (Updated 1/1/11)
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jan 4, 2011 9:42 PM EST up reply actions
Verizon charges $20-something per month.
UFC Win Finish % (Top 15 & 6 UFC wins): Belfort 100, Penn 92, Florian 91, Velasquez 86, A. Silva 83, JDS 83, Mir 83, T. Silva 83, Franklin 77, Kongo 75, Leben 73, Hughes 72, Sotiropoulos 71, Alves 70, Couture 69, Marquardt 67, Lytle 67, Maia 63, Koscheck 62, Bisping 60, Rivera 57, Rampage 50, Kampmann 50, J. Miller 50, GSP 47, Sanchez 45, Okami 40, Evans 40, Forrest 38, Machida 38, Fitch 31, Sherk 25, Edgar 25, Maynard 13 (Updated 1/1/11)
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jan 4, 2011 9:44 PM EST up reply actions
Either Overeem will kill someone
or he gets embarrassed by Werdum. Either way, I am down. Well. I hope Werdum survives. :)
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
If SF can pull this off
2011 will be the year for SF HW’s. Looking forward to it!
by pud333 on Jan 4, 2011 1:28 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I bet they'll be injuries
I hope not but there were 2 or 3 replacements in the super6, and Tournaments have that reputation, add in their huge HW’s, who would be good replacements for SF?
There were rumours already
That Lavar, Del Rosario and Cormier, the stand outs of Challengers will fight for replacement spot.
by Andrew TheSaint on Jan 4, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
HELL YES!!!!
VS
’Reem doing Jits and ’Dum striking it up.
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
Silva’s tattoos are fucking awful, like worse than usual for mma fighters.
Peter Aerts vs Semmy Schilt, K-1 World GP Semi-Final 2010: Fight of the Year
by StreetofCrocodiles on Jan 4, 2011 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
Werdum's on the other hand are cool as hell.
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
It doesn't make any fuckin sense but i like it.
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
by Krimson on Jan 4, 2011 1:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I thought I'd switch it up.
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
I would
rather see Werdum fight Fedor. Not sure why the champ and the only man to beat Fedor are in the first bracket of the tournamnet. I’d like to see Fedor fight them both.
What I’d really like is to see Fedor, coming off a loss or not, fight Overeem. That fight is like a unicorn – if you see a chance to grab it, you should take it – it might never come again.
Having said that, it’s nice to see Strikeforce finally do SOMETHING – all these fights look at least interesting.
Ha Joe Palooka!
Fedor dosen’t have a couple of years left.
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
by RolloTomasi on Jan 4, 2011 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Why do people act like Fedor is ancient?
Frank Mir, Shane Carwin, Brock Lesnar, Anderson Silva, Vitor Belfort, Chael Sonnen, BJ Penn, Kenny Florian, Mike Brown, both Nogs and probably a whole lot more of the recent title holders/contenders in the various organizations are around his age or older.
Yes but Fedor says himself he won’t be fighting much longer. Age isn’t the issue the fact that Fedor has been talking about retirement is.
I think he said 2 or 3 yrs and that his retirement talk was premature, I think he made a statement like that when everyone was asking him if he planned to retire and run for politics after his loss.
THIS IS AWESOME
I couldn’t have done it better myself. Everything just perfect, we’ll know whos the best MMA heavyweight out of UFC now for sure.
So does Reem give up the belt?
What if Werdum taps Reem? Would Werdum not get the belt?
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
Excellent question. Do Werdum and Overeem have to go five rounds while everyone else in the tournament does three?
by JRN on Jan 4, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It’s not like having a year with no heavyweight title defenses is anything new to Strikeforce but it does sacrifice what little meaning their belt still has.
true i guess
Reem should toss the belt in the garbage and tell Coker that if I don’t win this tournament ten I don’t deserve the belt. I mean his whole plan of success is based off of selling himself anyway. Besides, Reem knows the belt doesn’t currently carry weight but will after this tournament.
by F'n Clownshoes on Jan 4, 2011 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
The belt already got him in the Guiness Book, if I remember that correctly… so it has value for Overeem.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
I was wondering the same about the belt and # of rounds. Has this ever been done in the past, maybe in other divisions? I know in Bellator tournaments the champ fighters the tournament winnner.
Opulence, I has it.
by Psychic Octopus on Jan 4, 2011 3:20 PM EST up reply actions
No, they won’t go five rounds. If Reem gives up the belt, it would be for the tournament winner – so only the finale could and would have to be a five-rounder. That’d be awesome, but I doubt they’ll do that. My guess is, they’ll make it a GP with a seperate trophy of sorts.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Somebody below quotes strikeforce
saying that Reem is defending his title in every fight. Which seems to explain the lopsided bracket.
Its safe to say that without Playboy we wouldn't have MMA as we know it today. - Jonathan Snowden
I'll believe it when they are in the cage
People do not like to think. If one thinks, one must reach conclusions. Conclusions are not always pleasant.
- Helen Keller
by The Blackula on Jan 4, 2011 1:37 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
^this
still plenty of time to get injured or renegociate
If not, this is awesome.
"Honour is like virginity, it can only be used once." - G. Clemenceau
What are there reserve fights, don’t get me wrong I am happy they are moving forward and booking fights.
But until these guys are in the cage who the fuck knows what will happen.
People do not like to think. If one thinks, one must reach conclusions. Conclusions are not always pleasant.
- Helen Keller
someone above mentioned proabably del rosario or cormier.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions
I hope for an upset.
VERDUUUMM!!!!
VERDUUUMM!!!!
…………………..VEERDUUUMM!!!!!
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
Odd Opening Round
1 vs 2
3 vs 4
……
I guess it makes sense as at least they are then sure to get some big fights before someone changes their mind and renegotiates. These are actually the perfect fights I’d love to see, but strange pairing for the opening round of a tourny
it makes sense though. Those are the fights people want to see now, so why risk an upset in the tournament to ruin those fights?
People are going to be clamoring to see whoever makes it through this tournament, so it’s not like they are blowing their wad early. People want to see these fights (Reem/Werdum more than Fedor/Silva) and people are going to want to see the end, they guarantee more big fights this way.
What are you talking about? Rogers knocked out Arlovski.
The new editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
He trains with Freddie Roach.
The new editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
Brett Rogers won the first round against Fedor
He’s the real deal.
The new editor of HeadKickLegend.com
Follow me on twitter @HeadKickLegend
Like he finished Yvel with his GnP?
"You should work for 15 minutes to knock your opponent out, submit him, or improve your position to give yourself the best chance of doing either." - Dan Hardy
by Day Man on Jan 4, 2011 3:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
you’re not getting it. SF is thinking ahead here for once.
Bracket 1 has werdum/reem & barnett/rogers while bracket 2 is fedor/silva & kharitonov/arlovski.
Now run through the permutations and tell me this doesnt get more interesting?
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
this is not a tourny.
sorry, but tourneys are bracketed by seeds. if they aren’t seeded it’s not a tourney.
by F'n Clownshoes on Jan 4, 2011 2:16 PM EST up reply actions
read that yourself and think if I should really answer that.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
it was worded awfully, sorry
let me try again. Basically they are pitting 1v2 and 3v4 against each other first. This is ass backwards to me. Every seeded tournament I’ve ever seen has pitted bottom v top and worked towards the middle. I am not sure what Stikeforce’s theory of tournament bracketing is but this just seems off. They (IMHO) are missing some great potential marketing success, Long Term.
humor me; if you were to seed 1v8, 2v7 etc..
1Overeem v 8Kharitonov, Overeem to avenge a past defeat or a shocking upset and a new player in the division. Plus exposure to American fans
2Werdum v 7Arlovski, Rematch, either Werdum beats a guy he should and avenges his lose or Arlovski is back in the picture.
3Fedor v 6Barnett, the fight we all wanted to see forever ago, right?
4Bigfoot v 5Rodgers, No history, the only throw away fight
this way the next round will be equally as interesting.
by F'n Clownshoes on Jan 4, 2011 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That is the bracketing that makes sense. The only real reason I can see to top load this thing like they have is the fear that it will fall apart by the second round so they want to get some big fights first.
I think it’s more likely they had to do it this way to make it happen. Overeem clearly stated he wanted Werdum next. Werdum himself has everything to lose if he fights anybody else but Fedor or The Reem next. So I’m guessing, they had to make this one.
They also couldn’t make Fedor vs. Rogers again after Fedor nearly killed him. Rogers vs. Arlovski – more or less the same thing. So they redistributed them this way to avoid the stale “we’ve seen how that goes”-matchups.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
It’s not a tournament… it’s good matchmaking wrapped around a gimmick so the fanboys can jump up and down like little girls.
by mmalogic on Jan 4, 2011 3:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i'd be happiest if that were true
just have anyone at Strikeforce say “This is not a tournament. We at Strikeforce said all of our top HW’s would fight each other this year and here are the 4 match-ups we are gonna start with”
by F'n Clownshoes on Jan 4, 2011 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Arlovski/Kharitonov is intriguing for all the wrong reasons. Winner of that fight is the least competitive fighter in the semis. Barnett/Rogers is a tune up for Barnett, who should be an interesting match for either Werdum or Overeem. Assuming this plays out I see Fedor vs. Overeem/Werdum in the finals, with Barnett having an outside shot as well. Any of those 3 makes a compelling fight for Emelianenko.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
what???
So you want two of these three guys in the finals: Overeem, Fedor, Werdum. Why would you have two of them fight in the quarterfinals? Morons.
Strikeforce has one sided matchmaking! It's bullshit!
Strikeforce isn’t building up the matches we want to see! It’s bullshit!
Someone’s always going to whine about something it seems.
OHHHHH! OH MY GOODNESS DID YOU SEE THAT?! He ran up the wall like a ninja and landed a high kick! Unbelievable! I've never seen anything like that, it's like something out of a movie!
by lowellthehammer on Jan 4, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Strikeforce is learning
They know if they put Overeem and Fedor on opposite sides of the bracket there’s a chance they’ll lose. Ala Fedor vs. Werdum, Henderson vs. Shields, Lashley vs. Griggs…
I mean, I know the hardcores might enjoy it, but Fedor because an even more worthless albatross of a fighter if he loses to anyone other than Overeem or Werdum (assuming he beats Overeem).
I see
Fedor beat BigFoot and beats winner of Arlovski-Kharontinov
Fedor has an easier trip to finals. to fight either Barnett or Werdum.
If Verdum beats Overeem tho, I could see him beating ring rusted Barnett.
as long as Fedor in finals Im happy. =)
Cool!
This is smart because in the ideal picture Fedor its going to fight Silva, then Barnett and finally Overeem
I think barnett is on the other side. kharontinov-arloski are on the side with silva-fedor ( fighting same night)
Exactly.
Plus it avoids the possibility of too many unnecessary rematches like Fedor/Arlovski and Rogers/Overeem which were both decisive. It allows for more newer matchups the best of which is the potential Fedor/Barnett fight. Overeem vs Arlovski (a new matchup), or a rubber match with Sergei, would both make more sense. Should Werdum win, he can avenge losses to both those guys.
I think SF needs to go into this trying to create as many BIG fights as possible, not just in the finals.
Buuuuuuuut...
…it increases the possibility of seeing the big matchups. I originally thought that Werdum should face Rogers in the first round and Overeem face Kharitinov so that we could hopefully see Werdum/Overeem and Fedor/Barnett in the semis. But one upset would spoil the whole thing. So why not bank on some of the big fights early?
I just hope that SF can follow this up with their MW tourney that they abandoned last year.
If Kharitinov can beat Werdum then is Werdum vs any one really that big of a fight to begin with? Tournaments are democratic and that is the way they are meant to be.
As for the MW tournament if it happens it won’t be till next year because there won’t be enough Arena shows in the second half and the HWs will be eating a lot of slots so they will need some room to keep guys from the other divisions working.
But I would love to see them start doing tournaments for the Challengers shows with the winner or finalists getting the bump to the big show.
I'm just saying eventually.
If Bellator can do it, so can Strikeforce.Tournaments are how this whole sport should be structured anyway using the off season to put together matchups that never happened or qualifier matches for the next tournament.
I just hope they publish the brackets before this starts. It doesn’t take much for the people involved to start throwing wrenches into the works, arguing over the semifinal matchups would actually be a legitimate thing to gripe about.
That's definitely Strikeforce's plan
I doubt they do a pay per view if it ends up Werdum Sergei though.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
I think they are planning the winner of Fedor/Silva versus Overeem/Werdum in the second round so they can use it to either get a deal with CBS or worse case a ppv.
For the order of fights I would prefer that thus making the other bracket really a #1 contenders bracket.
I would prefer it if
Winner Werdum/Overeem fights winner of Sergei/Arlovski. At least that way we have a chance of seeing Overeem/Sergei rematch. If Strikeforce is trying to make the Reem into a star, which they absolutely should be, it would be a great storyline. Overeem avenges two losses on route to beating the invincible Fedor.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
Any sentence hat has both Kharitonov and epic in it is by definition incorrect.
by fitefan on Jan 4, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It makes the most sense but it’s not a real “tournament”. It’s good matchmaking. Based on the seeding this is not a tournament but they’re gonna continue to use the term for the marketing value I suppose.
I think they can make an even more compelling case for that by having them in separate, important bouts on the same event. That way you’re showing off not only the depth of the roster, but also the command of direction the promotion has to put on a big event that looms as a prelude to an even bigger event.
Winner of Bigfoot/Fedor will go to finals easily.
Sergei and Arlovski are both names and good people to have in the tournament, but they are far longshots. Everyone else has a chance.
every one of these fights makes sense… that’s a shocking development for shitfarce.
The only thing that doesnt make sense now is actually having a tournament.
Have a legitimate title fight between werdum/overeem and have the victor face the winner of fedor/silva.
In the background have the winner of arlovski/kharitonov fight the winner of Rogers/Barnett and you have your next contender.
Why Con volute things and make nonsense fights in between?
by mmalogic on Jan 4, 2011 1:51 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
Besides a tournament will let the casual fans "know" who's better than who.
And they’re fun.
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 2:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
In the background have the winner of arlovski/kharitonov fight the winner of Rogers/Barnett and you have your next contender.
Why Con volute things and make nonsense fights in between?
Why put any of them in the background when the tournament creates a big stage for all of them?
Tournaments are coming back in a big way. Only a matter of time until UFC brings them back as a big part of their product. How else are you going to create order in divisions of 60+ fighters like 155lbs?
There are obviously mini-tournaments
like Edgar/Maynard and Henderson/Pettis. Which was a stupid tournament. But the Brock/Randy and Mir/Nog tournament is exactly what gave Brock credibility as champ. There was structure and a storyline.
I’d like to see a lightweight tournament, since the it is so crowded right now with tons of guys on hot streaks, who have names, or are viable prospects. Get Dunham, Guillard, Cerrone, Sherk, Guida, Miller, Sotiropolous, and Florian in it, with Henderson/Pellegrino and Gomi/Stephens as alternate bouts. Winner gets whoever comes out on top of Maynard / Edgar / Pettis. If a fighter can chew through that field then it’s hard to deny that they get ranked above Gilbert Melendez (barring Melendez wins over Alvarez and Kawajiri in that time), thus strengthening the UFC’s hold on the top 3 in a fractured division. At the same time, it keeps the contenders (Miller, G-Sot, Dunham) busy with meaningful fights when the UFC belt is booked up for almost a year anyways.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 4, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Bellator does them pretty well
"The only freakshow's the one in my pants"
-James Toney
by chasethegoose on Jan 4, 2011 9:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Plus the UFC's current system is hard for fans to follow.
Most casual fans have no idea who the next contender is in a given weight class and therefore the marketability of those contenders is compromised.
For the fight game, a tournament is the closest thing resembling an actual merit based system like the NFL, NBA, etc. have.
Fans can easily follow those leagues and can better formulate who is better than who. It could also make the sport easier to cover for the media who could have segments where experts predict how the tournament will pan out.
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm not sure tournaments would be good for the UFC
since they already do an excellent job making compelling and relevant matchups.
Even without injuries, the top fighters only fight three times a year. Do we really want the champs fighting cans for a year while the tournament works itself out?
Given the fact that the UFC has long term control of most of the top fighters and already does an excellent job of matchmaking, I think a tournament would only force them to schedule some bad matches
I guess. But I bet ayear from now...
…people will be clamoring to see Brock Lesnar test himself against the world’s best HWs…IN STRIKEFORCE!!!
Perception is reality, and with the UFC’s top guys either recently exposed or sidelined with injury, this tournament could be the catalyst for a shift in perceptions about who the best heavies really are.
Casual fans don’t know or care about any of these guys and they will continue to not know or care if this tournament is on Showtime. The current perception with most of the casual audience is that if a guy was really that good then they would already be in the UFC. As wonderful an occurance for us hardcore fans as this is I doubt it will do much at all to change the general fan perception of the UFC and it’s heavyweights. It will set the rankings on their ears and keep us internet types abuzz but unless they get CBS to play ball and push this thing then the vast majority of UFC fans won’t even know it happened. That is the sad perception that is a reality in North American MMA.
This is big enough to get media attention. That is some thing that SF rarely gets. It is listed on the CBS sports site several times today. The two Strikeforce shows being broadcast on CBS didn’t even get that. Hell even Helwani is aware of it.
true enough and we should all hope this is broadcast on CBS but in that press release only showtime was mentioned. If they put fedor on showtime and reem on CBS that would sure be odd.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 11:30 PM EST up reply actions
Gross already said none of this will be on CBS. If this isn’t enough to get them there then that deal is dead for good.
Yea if CBS isn’t willing to run with this then I’m not sure what Strikeforce could do. It’s a shame because if they could get this tournament on CBS then maybe they really could make an impact with casual fans.
This line of reasoning seems to exclude many other possible reasons why the fights are not on CBS. Could be that the timing wasn’t right, could be because Coker didn’t want them on CBS because he’s angling for PPV or – and that is the most likely explanation in my mind: it’s because of Fedor. Remember, M1 renegotiated Fedors contract with Showtime as well as Strikeforce. They got their M1-events on SHO in exchange. Now, I somewhat doubt that this arrangement with Showtime states: “And then, please feel free to have Mr. Emelianenko fight on CBS”.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Coker didn’t want them on CBS because he’s angling for PPV
He needs the bump in attention being on CBS would give if he was planning on getting a PPV out of this at a later date.
Now, I somewhat doubt that this arrangement with Showtime states: "And then, please feel free to have Mr. Emelianenko fight on CBS".
Showtime is owned by CBS corperation, so that isn’t an issue and I really doubt that M-1 made “Showtime only, no CBS” as a part of their contract negotiations.
Being on an internet site (even one of the big ones) isn’t that huge of a deal. Heck I was on Comcast.net site yesterday and they had a pound for pound top 15 list for MMA fighters on their front page. MMA frequently pops up on MSN’s front page too. Do you think ESPN will push this on sportscenter? Heck do you think CBS sports will advertise this during other sporting events or cover it on the CBS evening news? The sport has been to the point of being regularly covered by bigger internet sites for a long time now, heck ESPN now gives results on tv but that doesn’t mean they are going to push this beforehand. Those of us who are aware of this are going to get a real treat but I doubt that many casual fans will even know it happens if it’s on Showtime. It’s going to help Strikeforce and get them some attention/viewers but it’s not going to shift casual fan perceptions.
Because Strikeforce would never be able to pull that off. You call it a tournament and it obligates the fighters in some totally non-concrete way. You just tell them this and they’re going to do whatever the Hell they want in a month. And when it all comes down to it, they’re going to do whatever they want anyway, which might make SF look foolish but whatever. They’re going to look like a clown with respect to their heavyweight division however they make it, they might as well try and do this.
The only thing that doesnt make sense now is actually having a tournament.
The 600 comments here is perhaps one of the reasons for it. People are already pumped and talking about it. Plus it provides strikeforce with a point of differentiation and creates a long term talking point and area of focus.
I agree about Werdum/Reem and Fedor/Silva matchups, but in doing the tourney, the other bracket basically sets up a legit challenger for whoever wins the left side of the bracket. And assuming the Reem/Werdum fight isnt for the title, the tournament winner could then fight Werdum for the belt, again assuming it wasnt Werdum who wins the tourney. All sounds good to me and gives SF lots of angles to promote fights.
Looks like Strikeforce has learned from their own and others past mistakes:
1) The M-1 tv deal with Showtime gives them some leverage to keep Fedor from taking off.
2) They are putitng together the Fedor/Silva and Overeem/Werdum fights in the first round so upsets don’t get in the way of the big money fights.
3) A prospects tournament to fill in for any potential injuries or drop outs.
Also good that they stayed silent and didn’t release a date until it was a done deal. What is bad is that I wished they could have kept it secret until they made an official press conference to announce it. Would have been much more effective and dramatic.
Exactly
They are putitng together the Fedor/Silva and Overeem/Werdum fights in the first round so upsets don’t get in the way of the big money fights.
I’m glad someone finally pointed this out.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Yes but if you are just after big money fights then just have big money fights and say to hell with doing a tournament altogether. Why do a tournament with shitty seating just book the fights people want to see.
But a tournament kind of forces fighters to face each other...
…with out too much say so on who they get to fight. If they win, they fight the winner…end of story. We all know fighters like to hold out for specific matchups. Not to mention, I think Werdum said he would only fight Fedor or Overeem in the first round.
It really looks like some of the fighters made first round seatings(wouldn’t surprise me if Overeem demanded Werdum right off the bat). Did Strikeforce need a tournament to make Fedor potentially fight the winner of Kharitonov vs Arlovski? Is that a second round fight that excites people (regardless of who wins)? The majority of the drama here is potentually in the first round instead of the second.
But a tournament gives you a storyline. Sure it’s arbitrary but it makes these fights not only more important than they really are but more importantly an incentive for fans to stay tuned in all year to Strikeforce. We will need to see what happens and for the more causal fans it allows them to make connection to fighters they aren’t as familiar with. It will also get you a lot more mma media coverage than a straight fight would. They need all of this much more than the UFC does.
Will it garner them more attention and coverage? The majority of the drama of this comes in the first round and not the second due to the way it’s seeded. It’s also in no way fair to anyone involved but honestly who cares about that….
How do you know what the 2nd round will bring? It could be Fedor vs. Barnett and Overeem vs. Kharitonov. At least one of these fights is a big deal, the other wouldn’t be too bad either. Sure, if epic upsets happen all around and you get Rogers vs. Werdum and Kharitonov vs. Bigfoot in Round 2, Strikeforce is screwed. But the chances are not exactly stacked against them ;)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Perhaps part of their intention
is to have epic demolitions in the second round, to build toward the ppv?
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:16 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t know what the second round will bring because they haven’t actually bracketed this thing yet but it’s obvious that at least two of their four biggest fighters will get knocked out in the first round.
But why do you care? You’re getting Werdum vs. Reem early. And who is the fourth fighter you’re talking about? Bigfoot? Do you really mind him getting weeded out early OR advancing as the second ever Fedor killer?
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Here i will quote myself from this very same discussion above:
Oh definately at this point getting heavyweight fights out of Strikeforce at all is wonderful news. The debate over the odd tournament seatings shouldn’t take away from the overwhelming joy that Strikeforce actually is booking serious heavyweight fights in 2011.
I’m not bitching about the brackets I am discussing them because I am on the internet and this is big news today. It’s debate for debate’s sake and I am talking about the seeds because the seeding is rather odd for this. I am thrilled they are doing Overeem vs Werdum first because even if the tournament implodes I will at least get the match I want to see. With that said……
The biggest stories of Strikeforce heavyweight division from 2010 were Werdum beating Fedor and Overeem coming back better than ever. Well right off the bat you are going to knock one of them out of the tournament, one of your division’s biggest stars is guaranteed to exit early. Losing Bigfoot isn’t as big of a deal except that he’s one of their most visible ranked guys guys, so right off we can assume the number four guy is leaving the tournament early too. That leaves you with half your most visible top guys gone and on the other side either a fading Arlovski, a Brett Rogers that got smoked by Overeem in his last Strikeforce fight or two guys who have no Strikeforce fights at all(one of which is best known for pissing hot over and over again and the other of which has all of 3 mma fights in the last three years).
I’m much more inclined to bitch about the bracket if it really looks the way you can see in the screenshot they have in the article now. To have Fedore and Overeem meet in the second round and have Barnett as the only big-name-opponent in the entire right bracket seems really odd.
It seems like they are really doing it as a “champions bracket” vs “contender bracket” as has been suggested in this thread. But now that the pairings are quite literally “one sided” it really feels a bit off. Still hope this happens. =)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Ok now that I have seen the brackets they have the greatest four man tournament MMA’s heavyweight division has ever seen and then a wtf four man tournament on the other side. I was wrong about them sacrificing the drama of the second round because it seems it’s the drama of the finale that has taken a beating in the seedings.
For me
it’s because a tournament adds hype and it so easy to market. It gives the more unheralded fighters in it to get a much bigger “rub” if they win and work their way up through the bracket.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
1) The M-1 tv deal with Showtime gives them some leverage to keep Fedor from taking off.
This is true but it wont stop them from renegotiating. In our logical minds we think “well if they try that showtime wont air the next M1 show” but in their mind renegotiation is always a must… it’s like breathing to these people. The current deal is based on their current position once Fedor wins a fight their position changes so their demands change.
The more leverage they get the more of it they use. The absolute worst that will happen is that they go back to the original deal and they know this. They did it before and now they got m1 on showtime, they do it again what else will they get. This is how they think.
I'm imagining Dana's bald head turning red
This gives me pleasure.
If this tournament happens, Dana will have trouble manufacturing the bullshit necessary to argue the UFC’s dominance in the heavyweight division.
He will of course, manufacture the requisite bullshit. He always does.
But late at night it might be hard for him to shake the growing feeling that Strikeforce is gaining ground.
Will Dana put a gag on Joe Rogan, who already seems to believe that Alisteroids is the best HW? It will be interesting, because you know Rogan’s going to be pretty chipper about the tourney on his podcast.
Not this year: there’s like half of the top of the UFC HW div. who is not able to fight right now ; this could be a huge step for Strikeforce.
"Honour is like virginity, it can only be used once." - G. Clemenceau
by Firm1 on Jan 4, 2011 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Werdum was released prematurely in most peoples opinion
Guess those are the travails of being an unmarketable Brazilian.
As for Barnett, that’s a negative, ghostrider. Left the UFC after testing positive for steroids, but on a 3-fight win streak.
you couldnt even get the cookie cutter line right.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:17 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
And Arlovski left the UFC on a 3 fight win streak
by Reedy on Jan 4, 2011 2:25 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Five fight win streak
Win Roy Nelson KO (Punch) EliteXC – Heat 10/4/2008 2 3:14
Win Ben Rothwell KO (Punches) Affliction – Banned 7/19/2008 3 1:13
Win Jake O’Brien TKO (Punches) UFC 82 – Pride of a Champion 3/1/2008 2 4:17
Win Fabricio Werdum Decision (Unanimous) UFC 70 – Nations Collide 4/21/2007 3 5:00
Win Marcio Cruz KO (Punches) UFC 66 – Liddell vs. Ortiz II 12/30/2006 1 3:15
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
by crizzy on Jan 4, 2011 2:57 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
5 fight win streak
but the last 2 (Big Country and Rothwell) were after he left the UFC…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
though I guess both have since ended up there bizarrely enough
by Superstitiousmma on Jan 4, 2011 4:53 PM EST up reply actions
Coeman
You could not be more wrong that that, lol. Arlovski was on a 5 fight win streak with quality wins when he left UFC, ROFL. Also Werdum was not released because he lost, he couldn’t come to contract terms with the UFC so he went to Strikeforce. Barnett has 4 fights in the UFC and is 3-1. When he left the UFC he was on a 3 fight win streak and had just beaten Randy Couture. What are you talking about? I hope you are being sarcastic.
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
by crizzy on Jan 4, 2011 2:30 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I stand corrected:
Arlovski was released after 3 wins: Cruz, Werdum and O’Brien
Barnnet was released after 3 wins: Schilt, Hoffman and Couture(was on steroids)
Werdum was the only one released after the dos Santos fight.
Arlovski had 5 fight win streak
Five fight win streak
Win Roy Nelson KO (Punch) EliteXC – Heat 10/4/2008 2 3:14
Win Ben Rothwell KO (Punches) Affliction – Banned 7/19/2008 3 1:13
Win Jake O’Brien TKO (Punches) UFC 82 – Pride of a Champion 3/1/2008 2 4:17
Win Fabricio Werdum Decision (Unanimous) UFC 70 – Nations Collide 4/21/2007 3 5:00
Win Marcio Cruz KO (Punches) UFC 66 – Liddell vs. Ortiz II 12/30/2006 1 3:15
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
oh yeah
I see what you mean. The two wins followed him leaving the UFC, I didnt notice that becuase both fighters are in the now.
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
Correction
in the “UFC” now
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
Didn't Barnett actually win..
…but then get canned for testing positive for PEDs?
Didnt Werdum get cut because of money?
I see more than a few dudes not getting cut after a lot of losses not just one loss
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
Yep
He refused to sign a renegotiated contract for far less money after getting KTFO by JDS when he came in completely out of shape due to his spat with the UFC.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions
The UFC will still have the best division
but it will be tough to argue against the winner of this thing as one of — if not the — top HW in the world…if it happens of course.
Just speculating, but if Overeem beats Werdum, and Fedor on the way to a tournament victory, how does he stack up against an idle Cain?
Similarly, if Fedor beats Silva, avenges his loss to Werdum and beats Overeem, how does he not leapfrog an idle Cain?
If Corker can pull this off, and they are relatively unaffected by injury, things will get awfully interesting.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 4, 2011 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This tournament will take most of the year.
I don’t think Fedor can win the tournament and get in a fight with Overeem in 6-8 mo. (the projected time of Cain’s injury).
It does make a strong case for the winner being back in the argument though, especially if it’s one of Overeem, Werdum or Fedor.
Right
A lot of things would have to fall “right” for it to even be a reasonable discussion, but particularly if Overeem or Fedor were to win out, AND if they faced the best possible competition doing it, AND if Cain continues to be sidelined, or doesn’t have a legit opponent because JDS gets burned in an interim fight, then I think the winner would have a really legitimate argument for #1.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 4, 2011 2:52 PM EST up reply actions
common sense here, these guys are all ranked opponents. so barring injuries, the winner will have beaten 3 quality heavyweights.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t see how the UFC has the best HW division? I don’t think it would even be possible for the UFC to put on an eight man tournament like this right now (if the UFC was even into that type of thing).
Whereas
Last year, Strikeforce could so have pulled this 8-man tournament off.
The UFC doesn’t have a “tournament,” but their fights could literally have been arranged into a kind of heavyweight tournament if you look at 2010. There was a fanpost to this effect, but I can’t be arsed to find it.
Wut?
"I'm gonna go after number one, whoever it is. If it's Anderson, or I gotta go up after the guys at 205, or go on a diet and go after Jose Aldo-- it doesn't matter." -Chael Sonnen
by Charles Awad on Jan 4, 2011 2:05 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
If they can pull this off than good for them it will give them something to promote
Twitter @MaZZM
http://mazznettt.blogspot.com/
Can Barnett even get licensed?
"I'm gonna go after number one, whoever it is. If it's Anderson, or I gotta go up after the guys at 205, or go on a diet and go after Jose Aldo-- it doesn't matter." -Chael Sonnen
by Charles Awad on Jan 4, 2011 2:07 PM EST via mobile reply actions
DAMN
If this happens im am easily willing to bet that after UFC hw fighters contracts are up they will be moving over to SF no matter the outcome, and if this happens then coker is fucking gold. People just want to see HW beating the shit out of each other for those big knock outs. IF these things happen and they tie up the HW division i could see other fighters from other divisions dipping over to SF
by Killuminati on Jan 4, 2011 2:09 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
UFC belt is just that. a belt. Brock lesnar had that thing and he is not and never will be #1.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 2:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
brock was #1 when he beat Carwin and Fedor lost, and Carwin had the interim belt, not the same thing
Brock
Beat Mir, Randy and Carwin in a row. Fedor had just lost. Brock was unarguably the number 1 heavyweight at that time.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 4:06 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
And IMO Cain stays #1 now, barring a loss, in which case that loss + a dominant run through the tourney by either Reem or Fedor (Werdum highly unlikely to beat Reem) puts them at #1 IMO…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
It's hard to say
with how many moving parts are involved that far ahead, but I tend to agree. However, Cain being inactive a while could mean him not losing and still losing rank to this tournament winner.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Rankings on the Internet are, of course, worthless, but if Werdum beats arguably the two best HWs in the world back to back, you gotta consider him to be the most accomplished guy in the division.
But in hindsight Cain didnt beat a top guy, Who is Mir’s best win? Brock, stff infected Nog,Sylvia? Randy is a Lengend But the UFC HW is a revolving door.
Cain did beat a top guy
He KO’d Big Nog and beat Brock, who was number 1.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
The Brock/Mir rankings is an interesting case study.
Mir went from unranked to a top guy because he beat an unranked Brock Lesnar. Then Brock got his legitimacy after beating a top fighter in Frank Mir.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 4, 2011 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
Isn't a variation of that true
for all of the UFC heavyweights?
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions
It is interesting
I think Mir got a huge bump because people believed he was back to pre accident form. Not that this would be “right” for ranking him so high, but that’s my thought.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I think so
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 4:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This isn’t at all what happened, Mir became ranked by beating Nog, Brock became ranked for taking out Randy.
I don't think that's right
It’s been a while, but Mir and Brock both got huge ranking bumps from the scenario pdl explained.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
The UFC
Is king of manufacturing there own fighters (some on TUF), matching them up well and having them fight eachother…
While on the other side the real tough interantional less marketable fighters knock eachother off till there’s 1 contender left. Cain V and JDS took that routher the 2 best HW’s in the UFC. lots of respect for them
This is one of the problems with rankings, though. People always say, “they don’t reflect how good you are. It’s just what you’ve done.” But then we have to pretend that beating a highly ranked guy means something when it’s not necessarily true. Beating good fighters means something. Beating mediocre guys who happen to have beaten someone who was highly ranked at the time doesn’t.
Forrests only top-10 win
was Rampage, who pre-Machida only had wins over Jardine and zombie Wandi in the last 3 years…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:25 PM EST up reply actions
Hendo? Was that not recent?
What about Forrest beating Shogun.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
IIRC
Both were over 3 years ago, although only by a few months…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:34 PM EST up reply actions
Ain't that the truth
Every year seems to go by far faster than the previous…I still think back to shit happening in the mid-2000s and think of it as recent…until my kids remind me it was ages ago…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:38 PM EST up reply actions
If a #1 fighter is an amazing boxer/wrestler and #2-#9 fighters are all well rounded, So the #1 fighter has an easy fight with the top 9 guys…
But the #10 fighter is a decent Muay Thai/Wrestler and can out strike the #1 fighter but matches up bad with the 2-9 ranked fighters.
This is why rankings suck and why styles make fights
who are you to say its unarguable? if it wasnt this site wouldnt exist. I dont put any stock in mir and randy was also beaten by zombie nog. as far as carwin, sure why not he was undefeated at the time, but none of those wins lets you leapfrog fedor.
Then below its already started and cain is entrenched at #1? get the fuck out of here. Whoever wins this tourney is #1 unless cain fights JDS before its over.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
who are you to say its unarguable?
I’m Batman and I’m awesome.
I dont put any stock in mir and randy was also beaten by zombie nog.
Well then, you’re clearly an objective observer.
none of those wins lets you leapfrog fedor
It does if Fedor loses. Which he did. Spectacularly.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
For straight up competition? SF
for $$$ UFC
Although im sure they could pay Carwin more than the 40k he made against Brock
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
Well considering that Dana just shit on Lesnar's hopes for a WWE return...
…I could see Lesnar bailing on the UFC after his next fight, bringing his tremendous star power to SF, if only for a single tournament (and why not considering SF will allow him to pursue his professional wrestling), demanding a fight with Fedor and making history. It wouldn’t be the first time Lesnar has bailed on a big payday. Say what you want about him, but he’s shown he’s willing to turn down a big paycheck just to challenge himself in a lesser paying arena. He’s done it more than once
This is actual one of the biggest reasons why some of the big stars won’t sign with the UFC. Granted they make less per fight, but on the flip side, they get to fight more times per year and also pursue paydays/challenges in other combat sports ie kickboxing, sambo…and err, professional wrestling.
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 2:47 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
how do people come up with this shit?
It’s about money. Brock will not go to Strikeforce unless he can make more money there. Yes, there is a big payday sitting on the table from the WWE, but once Wrestlemania ends, considerations about that payday disappear for another year, unless Brock is willing to do WWE full time, and in that case, SF still isn’t a viable option.
Where do people come up with this shit?
"I'm gonna go after number one, whoever it is. If it's Anderson, or I gotta go up after the guys at 205, or go on a diet and go after Jose Aldo-- it doesn't matter." -Chael Sonnen
by Charles Awad on Jan 4, 2011 2:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
People can’t talk about things outside of the paradigms they create in there head. They have arguments about Strikeforce/UFC all day and are incapable of talking about one without the other, so they just shit this stuff out to fit the narrative.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
by Neil Manich on Jan 4, 2011 2:34 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
No shit
My response is who gives a shit about the UFC? Who gives a shit about Strikeforce? We have a stacked set of fights with seven of the top 12 HWs. People should be ecstatic about that, just as they should be ecstatic that Jake Shields is going to be fighting GSP or that Omigawa might get a shot at Aldo. The promotional partisanship is so Marvel vs DC Comic kid shit.
by John Nash on Jan 4, 2011 2:43 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Rec'd, except
Marvel forever, punk.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 4, 2011 2:53 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
The promotional partisanship is so Marvel vs DC Comic kid shit.
DC sucks……. :D
I would say Star Trek vs Star Wars but as a youth I had an opinion on that too….. I was such a geek.
Dr. Who takes either Stars for the Dalek, The Master, and the Cybermen alone.
And man I would love to get into a longwinded comic book discussion right now about how Marvel is a shadow of it’s pre- Secret Wars greatness and how DC is now better because they can always fall back on the archetypal characters they have.
As I grew older and wiser I realized that Farscape took the cake in science fiction, still I wonder how many people around here saw the original Star Wars in the theater (3 times), and I don’t mean that special edition re-release crap.
I actually had copies of Secret Wars (but I traded them for first edition original D&D books). We should stop this before I get any geekier………….
I did
Twice. One of the first PG movies I ever saw as a kid (Jaws was first IIRC).
Came across my original D & D books (versions before the Cthulu (sp?) mythos were removed). Sadly no where near mint due to extreme over usage…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
Yea it was the deities and demigods with the cthulu stuff that I traded for, then I sold that for food money in college; you can buy a shitload of ramen for $50.
I was 8 when I saw Star Wars, that was back in the good old days when your mom could drop off an 8 year old on the side of the street for them to stand in line and go to a movie on their own.
Exactly
I think I was 10, and we regularly got dropped off like that. In fact, that is how I saw Jaws as my first PG movie…which made me scared of galveston and its 8" visibility water every time we went after that…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
That's right
it was deities and demi-gods…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
I remember waiting in a line that stretched down the block and around the corner at Cooper Theater to have my mind blown in the opening 10 minutes. The new prequels are so bad I don’t even care to watch the originals every again.
And I can’t talk because I have boxes of old 70’s and 80’s comics as well as reprints of Golden Age through the 80s comics in storage along with my Advanced Dungeons and Dragons books including the original 75’ boxed set all in storage. I got into fighting because I had to be ready at all times for someone to take my lunch money.
Its funny how awesome the special effects seemed in the theater for the original
and how comically bad they look now by comparison (plywood control panels tilted back and forth…)
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions
I just bought
a 2 DVD set of the 1940’s Batman serials. Some insane racist stuff. No joke, “The wise government had detained all the slant eyed Japs”. WTF.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
The only defense is that we were in the midst of a war unlike anything we’ve ever experienced and everyone felt the need to assist in the effort even with bullshit propaganda.
Plus the racism.
It's true
but it’s still amazing in hindsight. If you can laugh it off ( I can/do) they are fun to watch in a totally nerdy way. They are awful.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
This is you, American Ronin, and Mr. Barton having this conversation:
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 4, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Wasn't that guy
In Grown Ups?
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
Ha!
No choice but to own that I guess…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:20 PM EST up reply actions
Nerd for life!
I type this as I am being paid a nice salary to sit at work doing nothing (atm). It is good to be a nerd.
Guillotine.
One of my regrets is that I didn’t keep my nerd stuff collection but I overspent on a new mountain bike in college and had to sell stuff to keep eating (not to purchase booze and pot……….. ).
Sadly, I sold my earliest stuff (74 – 80) to a nerd neighbor because I thought I was too grown up and cool at 12 to have those anymore. Didn’t really start collecting again until a few years later…
Was fortunate in college, had a QP dealer as one of my room mates, so we always had free personal use stuff. Oddly, I almost never drank in college, heavy into training, weed when I did party (together with whip-its when we had the $$).
Best low budget, non-addictive high around, bar none.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:31 PM EST up reply actions
Lol
I guess if you did them without breathing oxygen as well that could be true.
Hell, years ago there was a news report here (Houston) of a couple of people who broke into a dentists office, moved the nitrous tank to a closet, stuffed towels under the doors and turned the tank on.
Naturally, they died of asphyxiation once the oxygen ran out…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 8:46 PM EST up reply actions
I still think Firefly is the best show I have seen
but who knows if it would have tanked or gotten even better if FOX hadn’t been asshats.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I didn't like Serenity,
but Firefly was bomb. It’s tough to tell with FOX shows. They cancel Family Guy apparently at exactly the right time and the movie was mediocre, but the Futurama movies and new season were awesome. Tough call on Firefly, but if they took the path that Serenity did with the next season, I don’t think I would have enjoyed it as much.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 4, 2011 4:25 PM EST up reply actions
Well...
Firefly was supposed to run 5 seasons. They crammed a TON of that story into one 2 hour flick, which is what caused issues with it. I still love the movie, however.
IIRC, the second season was supposed to be revelatory about past stuff as well as slowly continuing the River story. Instead, they just rushed the whole River deal into one thing.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I’d argue that The Prisoner is the best SF show of all time. Be seeing you!
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift
by Scott C. Broussard on Jan 4, 2011 8:03 PM EST up reply actions
;)
Will be great, my man!
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
I disagree somewhat
I don’t think the falloff really happened until not long after the Infinity Quest / Infinity Gauntlet and related off-shoots happened. The crossover with the DC universe with the “twins” (cosmic beings, names not recalled) were about the last new marvel titles I ever bought…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:02 PM EST up reply actions
I can pin the falloff as starting with Secret Wars 2. After that huge multi-comic events became the norm, giving us the Fall of the Mutants, Evolutionary War, and all that poorly thought out crap. And since comics had to be marketed to older kids who could purchase all these titles they started along the road to appealing to the comic book fanboys creating an incestuous universe which had none of the appeal that drew those fans in the first place. Thus we got hokey adult comic lines starting with Chris Claremounts post John Byrne’s crap and continuing into the modern revisionist shit.
This is why I actually really like the "Ultimate" titles.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Star Trek is obviously teh best!!
by Horselover Fat on Jan 4, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Now Kirk vs Picard does remind of Pride vs UFC :D
by who me on Jan 4, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Dude in the background: “Man, where is my cock?”
They see me rollin...
by spectaa on Jan 4, 2011 4:15 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Okay that's it
I’m going to take all you Marvel > CD fuckers down one at a time. Line up. My geek peen is HUGE.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I'm one of those weird guys
that likes UFC AND Strikeforce, and openly enjoyed some inferior DC along with my Marvel.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
DC was always better
Why? They don’t have Wolverine.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Ha!
I read X-Men periodically, but it wasn’t one of my faves…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
Been reading lately, I got like...60 years to catch up on
But I’m all about Vertigo. Currently reading 100 Bullets so nobody ruin it for me.
That being said DC > Marvel cause DC doesn’t have a whole slew of made up random ass mughfuckin space aliens with intergalatic mutant powers that require an intergalatic randoh team of superheroes that randomly require the aid of Captain America to save the day. Keep it simple!
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
Vertigo is amazing
Preacher is one of the greatest things to ever happen to comics. 100 Bullets is amazing. Simply great. Make sure you don’t take a break while reading the series or you’ll get lost.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I finished Preacher
Goddamn it was so godlike
And just when I thought Iknew what was going on in 100 Bullets, another curveball brings me to square one. Since this comic book store opened up down the street, I’ve been sucked in.
But yea….this “Grand Prix” I’ll be excited when it starts.
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
I hated Preacher so much…
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift
by Scott C. Broussard on Jan 4, 2011 8:04 PM EST up reply actions
What is WRONG with you!!?
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
I thought it was trying to be hard and edgy, and things like Arseface I just thought were stupid. Also the pretentiousness of it trying to explore religion was a turn-off bcause it did it so poorly. Bill Hicks issue was nice, though, and Killer of Saints was badass.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift
by Scott C. Broussard on Jan 5, 2011 1:16 PM EST up reply actions
Keep it simple...
I’m sorry, but DC is simple? You find all the Green Lantern/Blackest Night and Final Crisis, Infinite Crisis stuff to be simple? When an explanation for something in the story is that a character punched reality, you have problems.
by The Fake Macoy on Jan 4, 2011 7:45 PM EST up reply actions
Nothing is simpler than a punch
but that part of the story gave me a real “wtf” moment.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
The Avengers would shit all over The Justice League. Who has Batman fought? A skinny clown and over weight penguin! Super Man is overrated and he barley even fights in this country!
It's official. Les Miles DOES NOT have a deal with the devil. He beat him Nov. 6th, 24-21.
You Aint gonna make it to 20-1 Rowdy Rod.
Superman is juiced out of his mind
that guy pisses so hot it burns through test-tubes. Look how much bigger he is now than when he came on the scene. Also he’s what? 80 years old? And still competing at that level? If ever there was a candidate for Olympic style testing.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
by Dave Strummer on Jan 4, 2011 3:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You’re talking about juicin? There’s no evidence he’s been taking anything. Superman is all natural.
Captain America on the other hand….come on. Super Soldier Strength.
They made a video game about Yakuzas. It’s called Yakuza. And it’s about Yakuza
His condition was that some Nazis needed their asses kicked.
by John Nash on Jan 4, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If true
it was a work for sure…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
If we're using that stuff...
Then Wolverine beat Lobo.
by The Fake Macoy on Jan 4, 2011 7:47 PM EST up reply actions
So what? Lobo means WAY less to DC than Spidey does to Marvel.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
No kidding man
Ruins my enjoyment of these things. Can’t we just enjoy these great fights instead of drawing lines in the sand? So frustrating…
"I'm gonna go after number one, whoever it is. If it's Anderson, or I gotta go up after the guys at 205, or go on a diet and go after Jose Aldo-- it doesn't matter." -Chael Sonnen
Woah, woah, woah!
Put down the Kool-aid and back off. This tournament is a great thing for SF if they can get it done, but I guarantee noone will want to jump ship from the UFC to SF just because their contract is up. Woah.
And then....
Rogers ends up fighting Silva in the only bout to materialize
will be a belssing for mma
wow i fucked that up
by theworldismine on Jan 4, 2011 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
Couple of things bother me.
Barnett getting licensed? If him v Rogers happens at the March 5th event is that even enough time.
Is Overeems belt now worthless?
Big one. Injury and suspensions because of them.
I dont get what everyone is so upset about
These are going to be epic fights. Werdum gets the next title shot so OBVIOUSLY he is going to be fighting Reem for the title next. You want to give Arlovsky the next title shot? That makes no sense. Certain people will just always complain about everything SF does. So be it. Go watch all the great HW action in the UFC. Oh yeah throw a “the best fight the best” again too. I haven’t heard that parroting of DW enough yet!
Werdum beat Fedor, Dos Santos beat Werdum, Joaquim Ferreira beat Dos Santos. Therefore Ferreira is WAAAAY better than Fedor. Keep MMA math alive!
I strongly suspect
That Reem demanded Werdum and M-1 demanded Bigfoot as part of their conditions for participating…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
Waiting for Sub0t
Reppin' the NYMMAI.
Black Lesnar aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun . Imma write til the wheels fall off.
12/30/10 The day I made the MMaManiacs cry.
Don't subscribe to C.A.B.L.E.
if Overeem beats Werdum, what does that mean for the HW rankings?
As of right now most people have Werdum at #2 or #3, and most people have Overeem at around #7 or #8. Would that bump up Overeem to top 3? Or just bump guys like Dos Santos and Fedor up, and knock Werdum back down?
+1 rankings are gay. Just gimme fights
by hexbreaker on Jan 4, 2011 2:28 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Reem goes to 4 werdum 6 and as a surprise donkey Kong cracks the top ten finally.
by hexbreaker on Jan 4, 2011 2:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Ya, I like how he said he attained his goals in K1 and now hes going to focus on MMA, for UFC fans that go along with Dana, its only a matter of time before they realize what kind of Monster Overeem is now.
easily. the guy is top 3 combat sports period. It takes a while to go back on either of his records and find a loss.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
Clearly one of the 3 best
but hard to justify ranking there until he walks through Werdum…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
Best case senario for me is this:
1) Overeem is strpped of the belt since after the tournament it wont really mean anything.
2) Overeem wins the tournament anyways
3) Now that he doesn’t have a champions clause he leaves Strikeforce for the UFC and gets a shot at the Belt
i know it isn’t likely to happen, but i can’t wait to see Overeem in the UFC
by darkotto23 on Jan 4, 2011 2:18 PM EST reply actions 7 recs
Japan makes reem money. Ufc wont let him fight there. Reem wont be in the ufc anytime soon. Besides his competition is better outside the ufc. After Cain who else do you wanna see him fight there?
by hexbreaker on Jan 4, 2011 2:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Dos Santos and Carwin. But yeah, I agree, Reem is probably better off in SF and Japan.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 4, 2011 2:33 PM EST up reply actions
It does look rather bleak, doesn’t it? I’d be interested to see if Carwin can make a good comeback and threaten either Cain or Junior in a title shot, he has that crushing power albeit not as good technical striking as those guys. Considering how well he did against Brock before gassing out, I could see him get a tune-up fight and another title shot if noone else has emerged with a better case for it.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 4, 2011 2:45 PM EST up reply actions
At HW, Strikeforce even has
by far the best prospects…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions
Yep,
That’s the list. Outside of Zuffa the list is Werdum, Fedor, Aerts, Shilt, Hari, Cormeir with a lot more seasoning.
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Head Kick Legend
Agreed, except on Aerts. Reem has already crushed him convincingly two times, there’s really no need for a third one IMO. There’s more of a case to be made for Hari as they’re 1-1 with some bad blood, and also it would be cool to see how he would do against Schilt of course.
by Horselover Fat on Jan 4, 2011 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
Don't forget he also has losses to avenge like against Sergei.
Josh Barnett would also make an interesting fight, easily better than any fight the UFC can put together aside from Cain, JDS, and Lesnar.
To me this does not look like a tournament, it looks more like a way to determine a number contender
In the first round Werdum gets Overeem. Which makes perfect sense. The winner of that fight should get the winner of Fedor and Bigfoot. The obvious match for the next number one contender. After that the guy who won the other side of the bracket will be the next number one contender. This is all speculation of course because we do not know what the bracket looks like.
They mentioned the 1st two fights on the same night, youd for scedueling and promoting reasons theyd be on the same side of bracket
I take that back
The bracket looks exactly like I said it should. I stand by everything I said earlier.
I really want to punch him in the face.
I won my fantasy football leauge, so I'm kind of awsome...kind of.
Semper Fi'
Pain don't hurt...
by RolloTomasi on Jan 4, 2011 7:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Regardless of who comes out Champion
the winner will have three credible wins, which is more than can be said of their recent heavyweight matchmaking. It seems redundant though to have your champion in the tournament though, it should be 8 other heavyweights fighting for a chance at his belt. Are Overeems quarter and semi final bouts going to be for five rounds or is he giving up the belt to enter the tournament?
If the brackets correspond to the events and fedor ends up
fighting Kharitonov or Arlovski, that’s an extremely lacklustre match. It’s clearly designed to set up a Fedor/Overeem match if everything works out (Hint: it won’t)
this is awesome. we finally get to see if the hype is justified in the reem. if he KO’s werdum where does that put him in the rankings? top 3?
I pray to one god......and his name is Kazushi Sakuraba.
Honestly
If Reem just handles Werdum I’d rank him #1.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Overeem and Rogers got the toughest match ups
I mean I am not trying to read anything into this and all… .
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
When barnett had trouble taking CroCop down from the clinch. Had a long Fight with Gilbert Yvel. I think Overeem is a diff beast, He’ll beat Werdum, keeping in standing. Not a good fight for Barnet.
Fedor Will KO the slow Silva standing or Gnp, But silva is a monster on top is something like Hong man choi happends on top of Fedor. Arlovski-kharontinov is a toss up, stantup boxing match KO puncher vs footwork countering.
Fedor gets by either of them I hope, but Once you play it out It’s not as easy as you think for fedor and tough as it looks for Overeem
OMG
just read the news, this is pure awesomeness. Scott Cokerkept his promise he made to Ariel months ago, that all these guys would fight each other in 2011.
Put the whole first round in the same card FFS
That’s how you make a memorable tournament. Kinda wish it was a 16 tournament. With Lashley, Cormier, De Rosario, Ishii, Dufee, Sylvia … It could have been better. Anyway, we gonna have great fights and just for this I thank Strikeforce.
Josh Barnett will beat Rogers
Then test positive for roids. Callin it.
"When I beat Wanderlei I’m a take his belt, pull his pants down and spank him for being so ugly" - Quinton Jackson
Its on the M1 global site. All confirmed.
With Cain out for 8 months +, the winner of this HW tournament will be the #1 HW in 2011.
no. JDS has that title since he will fight before then. Good try though
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 3:25 PM EST up reply actions
There is no way
JDS should be #1 above the winner of this tourney, aside from the almost uniquely improbable case that Werdum wins it…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 5:07 PM EST up reply actions
For beating guys like Nelson?
Who arlovski KO’d?
Arlovski didnt start losing till he left the UFC, does that mean Strikeforce is better than UFC?!?!?!
lets stop with the ranking logic.
pwwwease…
Huh?
Did you perhaps miss the title line on my post?
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sorry but JDS doesn't leapfrog guys ranked ahead of him...
…for fighting lower ranked guys. The UFC already benefits from a similar privilege with fighters leapfrogging guys outside the UFC, but how does JDS leapfrog Cain himself?
No. If cain is injured
and JDS fights and beats a brock or Carwin, he is #1 till Cain comes back.
"Turn yourself not away from three best things: Good Thought, Good Word, and Good Deed" - Zoroaster
catch me if you can @ MMA Answers
by SheepleBuster on Jan 4, 2011 4:00 PM EST up reply actions
Fantastic!!!!!!!!!
Overeem vs Werdum is the most logic bout for the title.
Kharitonov vs Arlovski is just exciting, between two fighters in quest of redemption. Great match up.
Barnett vs Rogers seems the lesst interesting fight with Barnett as a huge favourite.
Fedor vs Silva finally, I will wait this fight so much. Fedor fighting again and having to prove that he is not done.
Shame that Bigfoot gets Fedor in round 1
I’d consider him a dark horse to win the whole thing.
by Trust Doesn't Rust on Jan 4, 2011 3:38 PM EST reply actions
Leaving out Cormier and Del Rosario is pretty boneheaded.
A tournament is one of the best possible ways to make a new star, just look at Shogun for proof of that.
by Rob Young on Jan 4, 2011 3:45 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Regardless, if this all pans out, Strikeforce’s HW Division >>>> UFC in 2011.
by Rob Young on Jan 4, 2011 3:49 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
They are reserves. Odds are pretty good that at least one of these 8 HW will get injured at some point so I wouldn’t be surprised to either of them. Although I would have rather have seen either Cormier or Del Rosario in the tournament instead of Overeem with the tournament winner fighting him for the belt.
Opulence, I has it.
by Psychic Octopus on Jan 4, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
This is a usefull link. TO me it suggests that SHowtime is primarily responsible for the tournament style as they have found success in their ratings for boxing tournies. It is kinda dumb having a tournie when the Champ is not in question and will himself be fighting in the tournie, but it sounds like Showitme will be able to promte it better.
What’s the over/under on Fedor breaking his hand on Bogfoot’s head? maybe 3 min?
Your beliefs become your reality.
by Hardy's in your face on Jan 4, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
After the Super 6 blew up it would make sense that they wanted to get the big fights out of the way first. Interesting that there isn’t a word about it on the sho.sports site.
Should have done the 4 big guys on one side and an 8 man on the other side combining the 4 guys on the right with the 4 guys from the challengers cards on the right. That would have given the final more oomph.
"If you want to watch stand up, go watch K-1"
And if you want to watch wrestling....... go watch wrestling.......
by OptimusPiss on Jan 4, 2011 3:54 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
When was the last time fedor fought 3 tims in one year?? his hands are a mess still? M-1 last second “re-negotiating” history..
Werdum coming off surgery
Overeem commited? Steroid testing ok for 3 fights in US?
Barnett license, steroid ok?
Injuries happen too, not too mention more easily when 250lb monsters fight.
I’m Loving it but keeping my fingers crossed, but there are so many IFs
Overeem commited? Steroid testing ok for 3 fights in US?
Seeing as he has never tested positive i’m sure he will be fine.
I pray to one god......and his name is Kazushi Sakuraba.
yea, he doesnt fight often in the US though not too mention so close together, But I’m sure you’re right he’ll be fine, Good chance he’s not even on anything just a genetic freak
He's like 6'5
Him being 6’5 and fighting at 205 is redic. He’s probably as big as he should be.
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 5:22 PM EST up reply actions
Oh come on, I know what youre saying but…he looks like a body builder…guys get caught all the time, Sterioids and GH are all over the sport.
Yeah but people single HIM out all the time and he hasnt been caught
I mean look at Chael he didnt even look like he was on steroids. A lot of the dudes take it to be able to train and recover and go train some more not for appearances sake.
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 5:29 PM EST up reply actions
The brackets are perfect
Glad to see they are minimizing the chances that things can get screwed up. I really hope this comes off.
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Jan 4, 2011 4:13 PM EST reply actions
Great brackets!!!!
The most logic contenders in the bracket 1, guaranting the big fights of happening.
And a new contender will have been created for the final with 2 solid wins.
Well done Strikeforce. You have done extremely well with that.
Can someone email coker and tell him to name one half of the bracket the “championship bracker” and the other half the “contender bracket.”
May help some people untwist their underwear that are apparently very twisted right now.
One half “Champions” the other “Challengers” after the name of their Showtime cards.
by John Nash on Jan 4, 2011 10:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
ok, well
Overeem/Werdum was the match that should have been made in the first place.
finally.
by Victor Rodriguez on Jan 4, 2011 4:17 PM EST reply actions
this is pretty tight!
But why would they stack overeem, fedor and wedum on the same side of the bracket?
2nd round of action is gonna be great though! possible overeem vs fedor!!
It's basically the same as the UFC's unofficial tournaments
Title holder faces #2—-#3/#4 fight and the winner faces the winner of #1 vs. #2…..meanwhile, they figure out who is the best of 4 other guys to face that winner. It’s not always that clear, but that’d kind of the idea.
Not afraid to nitpick
Credit to Strikeforce
I know it’s all the rage with the kiddies to hate on Strikeforce, but I didn’t actually think they’d get this far with the tournament.
As it stands now, the only stumbling block for the tournament will be Fedor and M-1. But if they’ve managed to placate M-1, there’s no logical reason why this can’t pan out.
Plus, I like the match ups. Werdum vs. Overeem was a fight people were clamoring for (now people complain about the bracketing…), Sergei vs. Arlovski is a good fight for two guys who badly need relevant wins (or wins in general for Arlovski), Barnett vs. Rogers is a solid fight between two guys who need reestablishing but were considered strong top ten guys not too long ago, and Antonio Silva is a good test for Fedor. He’s a big guy with decent striking, good survivability, and a decent jiu jitsu game. Fedor should beat him, but I don’t consider it a lock by any means.
The only questionable inclusion is Arlovski, but he’s a name. That carries you pretty far. I wouldn’t have minded Sylvia or someone brought in. But I get the feeling Sylvia is charging way more then Arlovski given that absolutely no one is signing him.
Called it…
They want an overeem/ fedor fight to get a deal with CBS or worst case a fight they can put on ppv.
This is very good matchmaking… this is common sense… this is the best thing they could do… but this is not really a tournament.
They are setting up the 2 fights people want to see (overeem/ werdum and overeem/fedor) while developing a contender.
I came here to call shenanigans on Fedor/Overeem in the second round, but this makes oodles of sense.
I love me some me.
Also
Fedor v. Barnett could be the final, which would be huge with both of them on 2 fight win streaks over name opponents. Overeem v. Barnett would be a nice finale too. I think they set this bracket up the best way possible.
by IWillPartyHard on Jan 4, 2011 5:40 PM EST up reply actions
great tourney
And all most can do on this board is bitc h. what the hell happened to people?
Discussing the brackets isn’t bitching about them finally having the fights we all want to see it’s just discussing the brackets. Discussing things is what we do in the comments section.
by who me on Jan 4, 2011 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
SWEET!
If they can pull this off it will be awesome! I should be stoked. But im not…. what was that old expression about counting your chickens before theyre in the cage?
I dig this. On one half of the bracket, you have the fights that should be made and on the other half you build up the next contender after the legit Silva/Fedor #1 contender.
"A guy in Texas came up to me and told me ‘Frye you're not mixed martial arts, you're no holds barred’, and I said you're god damn right partner." ~ Don Frye
from the press release
"We are thrilled to have come to a long-term agreement with Fedor and M-1 GLOBAL," said STRIKEFORCE CEO Scott Coker. "To have the greatest MMA fighter of all-time put his legacy on the line in a single-elimination tournament will truly captivate MMA fans worldwide. STRIKEFORCE is home to the best heavyweight division in the world; the athlete who runs the gauntlet in a tournament such as this would have to be considered the best heavyweight fighter in the world."
nuff said.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 4:43 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
at best the winner could be considered #2 but likely the winner will be top 5 and the rest will fall out.
It’s a rarity a top contender to the #1 crown being produced outside the UFC…. forget about a #1 guy being produced – the likelihood of that is nil.
The last top contender that was produced outside the UFC was Jake Shields and he had to go through multiple orgs undefeated and beat Dan Henderson and now he’s in the UFC.
If Overeem or Fedor win they could claim to be #3 or even the top contender (#2) if one of the jobbers on the other side of the bracket look legitimate. .
If JDS beats Cain and either Reem, Fedor or Werdum win via destruction throughout, IMO they become #1.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
True enough, but it matters not anyway as there is no chance Werdum gets by Reem alone, much less Fedor..
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
But by then it would have been a while ago
and Fabricio has noticeably improved.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:20 PM EST up reply actions
If this bracket wasn't done at random, they blew the chance for an amazing tournament
The left side is stacked which will most likely lead to the semi final being more exciting than the final. If they set up the bracket themselves, they should’ve swapped the Fedor-Silva fight and the Arlovski fight. This would possible set up a Fedor-Barnett semifinal. This is a fight that’s been hyped for over a year which makes it an easy sell. If Fedor won that fight, I could’ve led a final with a much anticipated Fedor-Overeem fight or a Fedor-Werdum rematch. If they just picked names out a hat and set it up that way, I understand. If not, I think they really blew a chance to optimize the matches in each round. Anyone else agree?
This is crazy
Awesome tournament, could put SF on the map.
Why not just have a 4 man tournament of Megareem/Fedor/Werdum/Bigfoot? The guys on the right hand side of the bracket are either a) on multi fight losing streaks b) very inactive.
Left Side is the “Championship Bracket”, Right Side is the “Sacrificial Lamb Bracket”.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
Whoever wins the left bracket will win the Grand Prix
Left Side – Marketable
Right Side – Will get by beaten 9/10 by Fedor, Overeem, or Werdum so Strikeforce can market a strong future with a definitive “Dana-White-Can’t-Say-We-Face-Top-Competition-kinda HW champ.”
That being said, If one of those three doesn’t win, Strikeforce is pulling yet another Lashley-Griggs.
Lets think about Megareem drinking wine out of Barnett’s skull instead. Its a much more endearing image.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
They shouldve hired Overeem to be the next Conan the barbarian (not comedian)
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 5:23 PM EST up reply actions
I would watch a talk show hosted my Megareem.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
Maybe to wrap up the show he surprises his guests with a beat down
Then fornicates with their spouses.
by Papercut Elbow on Jan 4, 2011 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
I'll believe this when it happens...It will be a good day for SF
Overeem via Total destruction.
by higgledy-piggledy on Jan 4, 2011 5:08 PM EST reply actions
How has no one put....
PRIDE NEVER DIE!
I pray to one god......and his name is Kazushi Sakuraba.
by MMA-UK on Jan 4, 2011 5:10 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Why isn’t Sakuraba fighting Megareem in the first round?
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
Feeding Sakuraba to bloodthirsty strikers is Pride’s most enduring legacy. A tradition that continues to this day.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
by Ubernoober on Jan 4, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Only question I have
What’s the point in having the current champ fight in the tournament?
are his fights 5 rounders? or is the title not on the line? if he loses the tourney does the winner get to fight him for the title?
Just doesn’t seem to make any sense…
Ascension MMA. Roswell, GA
He must be defending his title every fight he has. otherwise putting the best four fighters on one side makes no sense.
I pray to one god......and his name is Kazushi Sakuraba.
That's what I want to figure out
It just seems to make no sense. My assumption during the early rumblings of a HW SF tourney was that Ubereem would sit back and watch from his Dutch throne and laugh at the peons battling it out for a chance at his title. Not that he’d actually be in the mix.
The whole concept just seems very nonsensical
Ascension MMA. Roswell, GA
At Fedor and Megareem’s current rate of taking SF fights we should see this tourney wrapping up by winter 2014.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
Why the hell are Fedor and Overeem on the same freaking side of the bracket? Although it makes the probability of them fighting greater, the Finals could have been amazing instead of an easy win for (left side winner). At least we should be getting awesome fights.
Hardcore MMA fan since UFC 99
Man...
you guys crack me up. I’m not about to call any of the guys on the “B” side of the bracket easy fights.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Sure
but it’s not like losing to Fedor makes you a scrub. Besides, I’d actually dig an AA rematch.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
If Fedor loses
to Bigfoot, the whole tournament loses a lot of its appeal. Bigfoot in top position like Rogers had = mucho danger for Fe.
I don't think so
Fedor has never been a dream to market in the first place. And it would be a huge push for Bigfoot and he is much less a headache to market.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
marketing wise,
best case 2nd rd scenarios:
1. Fedor v. Reem (best)
2. Fedor v. Werdum (2nd best)
3. BF v. Reem (3rd best)
4. BF v. Werdum (sad Coker)
vs.
Barnett in the final.
I just can't get on board with this
AO is more marketable than Fedor. Fedor might be the least marketable of all 4 guys.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Fedor?
No way. He’s the sole reason 25 million fans tuned in worldwide to watch him fight Rogers, 5 million+ in the US and 16 million in Russia. Fedor is THE best way to turn a fighter (his opponent) into a globally recognized fighter. What better way to transform SF into a global contender?
by Sucker-Lite on Jan 4, 2011 8:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
From Dave Meltzer’s wrestling observer:
M-1 sent out a press release claiming the Fedor Emelianenko vs. Brett Rogers match drew more worldwide viewers than any MMA match in history. Of course that claim is ridiculous. There are Japanese fights that have done 30 million people in Japan on television. You probably could get the UFC 100 show because of so many watching on PPV and the big ratings in Mexico, up to around 20 million worldwide. The M-1 release headline claimed 25 million homes. The body of the story claimed 25 million viewers, which is a different numbers. Either way, it’s less legitimate than the UFC’s claim that the Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir fight was seen by 25 million people in Mexico (8 million would be closer to accurate). They listed the legit number for the U.S. (5.46 million viewers), which they had to since it had been reported in the U.S. media. Then they claimed Ch. 1 in Russia had 16 million viewers of the fight. In actuality, there are 53.5 million television homes in Russia, and the Fedor fight did a 3.8 rating in that country, which would mean 2.03 million homes .
link to russian ratings site (in Russian but babelfish can fix that):
http://www.tns-global.ru/rus/data/ratings/tv/index.wbp?tv.action=search&tv.regionId=9B17541D-53F1-4092-BD51-83041DDAB639&tv.startDate=02.11.2009&tv.endDate=08.11.2009&tv.raitingNameId=8FF6AFBD-33A4-4C3E-83F2-91B52822DDD3&tv.genreId=B1592F6A-2392-4664-85E8-84A801E10E06
That is absolute horseshit
If he was such a great and easy sell he wouldn’t have sunk every other org he fought for.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Jan 4, 2011 11:22 PM EST up reply actions
FEDOR!!! FEDOR!!! FEDOR!!!
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Time to put some meat in your pain sandwich.
by Ubernoober on Jan 4, 2011 5:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Overeem has stated that he only wants to fight either Werdum or Fedor, so I can see why Overeem vs Werdum is a first round bracket in that it may have been negotiated that way. In a Heavyweight rankings system, Fedor vs Antonio Silva does make sense in that Fedor at this time is Strikeforce’s number 3 Heavyweight while SIlva is Strikeforce’s number four Heavyweight, but in a tournament format, it surprises me somewhat that Strikeforce is putting all their eggs on one bracket. Of course, an upset or injuries could easily happen, so they are giving the fans the fights that MMA fans want to see, and I’m sure that is the reason for the early big matchups. On the other side though, the only really appealing fighter there to me is Josh Barnett.
I won't jump off the bandwagon just because you lost.
Whoa.
It’s funny because this is the second time I’ve seen it that people have started doubting Scott Coker and then he pulls out a ball of awesome. The first was back around March, then he pulled out a list of pretty big fights.
Now this.
There’s stuff you can criticize about Strikeforce, no doubt. This isn’t one of them though.
Greg Savage made a great point on his readio show and one I also want to know, How is he going to fight in this tourney if he is still suspended and it looks to be that way for the forseable future ?
He said regulatory bodies not states, maybe he is thinking of taking Strikeforce to Canada for a card or maybe a indian reservation? Who knows? Apparently he is on top of it though.
I can’t believe Coker would piss on the CSAC’s shoes like that…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 8:30 PM EST up reply actions
Athletic commissions aren’t just state agencies they are also agents of indian reservations and Canadian provinces(other countries also have regulatory agencies for boxing). The ones in the US are all inter-related through the association of boxing commissions but regulatory agency doesn’t neccessarily mean that it’s a state agency (I’m not sure if the athletic commissions in Canada are part of the ABC?).
Here are the US regions:
Region Director, Patrick Pannella, Maryland
Region 1: Connecticut, Delaware, Mixed Martial Arts Authority of Maine, Maryland, Mashantucket Pequot Tribe, Massachusetts, Mohegan Tribal Commission, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Oneida Indian Nation, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Seneca Nation of Indians Athletic Commission, St. Regis Mohawks Athletic Commission, Vermont, Washington, D.C., and West Virginia
Region Director, Chairman Colley Billie, Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of Florida
Region 2: Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Louisiana, Miccosukee Tribe of Indians of Florida, Mississippi, Mississippi Band of Choctaw Indians, North Carolina, Puerto Rico, South Carolina, Tennessee, The U.S. Virgin Islands, Virginia
Region Director, Bernie Profato, Ohio
Region 3: Citizen Potawatomi Nation, Comanche Nation Sports Commission, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kentucky, Michigan, Mille Lacs Band of Ojibwe, Missouri, Minnesota, Nebraska, Ohio, Oklahoma, Peoria Tribe of Indians of Oklahoma, (Associate Member), and Wisconsin
Region Director, Mary Feist, North Dakota
Region 4: Idaho , Kansas , Montana , North Dakota , Oregon , Siletz Tribal Athletic Commission , South Dakota , Washington , Wyoming , and the Yakama Nation Boxing Commission
Region Director, Richard Montanez, Utah
Region 5: Alaska, Arizona, California, Colorado, Hawaii, Nevada, New Mexico, Pascua Yaqui Tribe, Pueblo of Santa Ana, Southern Ute Indian Tribe, Texas, and, Utah
Technically he is ,not suspended
he just is not licensed…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 4, 2011 5:39 PM EST up reply actions
I hope a wild card wins it all shocks everyone
Lets go with the Pitbull/
by Bloodsport on Jan 4, 2011 5:31 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Wow, horrendous bracketing for an actual tournament. I mean, Josh Barnett has the worst 3 guys on his side of the brackets.
If you don’t look at it as a tournament and think of it as a serious of paths to title fights, it seems much better.
- and #2 (in Strikeforce) fighting for the belt
- and longtime #1 in the entire sport gets a tune-up fight before his title shot (albeit a dangerous one)
either Josh Barnett challenges for the belt on an 8-fight win streak, or one of the other guys turns their career around and gets some momentum with a little win streak
Josh Gross is saying the bracket is down to timing, contract obligations and injuries.
Dont know what that means
Calling it right now.
Fedor def. Silva via TKO——Overeem def. Werdum via KO
Overeem def. Fedor via KO
Khar def Arlovski via KO——Barnett def. Rogers via Sub
Barnett def. Khar via Dec.
Overeem vs Barnett in the finals.
Overeem via KO RD. 1
"Last time a Russian hit a brother that hard, Ivan Drago killed Apollo Creed"- Some guy on Sherdog, referencing Fedor vs Rogers
I’m excited about the tournament format and about the matching. Overeem needed to be include in the tournament since the three elimination rounds can take a whole year, and i don’t want him in the shell for that long. So, even if the title is not on the line, Overeem vs Werdum is a must do, because it is champion vs #1 contender.
by Carlos Estrada-Ibars Martínez on Jan 4, 2011 5:50 PM EST reply actions
According to the Consensus Rankings
According to the Consensus Rankings, this is how the tournament should have been seeded. Immediately you can see that two of the fights would be rematches. I think I kind of like SF’s to-hell-with-it pairings better.
This also reminded me how fucking weird SF’s heavyweight division is. From top to bottom, the first three seeds are Fedor, guy who beat Fedor, and then the official champion. Hopefully this tourney goes off right and sorts this shit out.
CANCEL THIS TOURNAMENT!
That M-1 logo should be bigger.
"I'm from the Fox News school of media discourse," explained White. "If you tell people your version of the truth enough times, and yell while you do it, eventually they start to believe it. Remember when I saved MMA?"
by CROOKS on Jan 4, 2011 5:55 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
I think it's been structured this way specifically for Overeem.
I read on ESPN that the “title defense” matches will be 5 rounds, while the others will be 3 rounds. Which would mean that Overeem isn’t surrendering the title before the tournament in order to win it back. He is “defending” his title with every fight in the tournament.
So starting with Reem’s match against Werdum, it’s a 5 rounder, and then the winner who faces Fedor is a 5 rounder and then the final is a 5 rounder. While the other side of the bracket fights all 3 rounders in order to decide who faces Overeem/Fedor for the title in the final.
When you look at it this way, it kind of makes sense. This means Overeem would defend his title against Werdum, then Fedor, then the winner of the other bracket (Barnett!! :P). Which are basically the fights you would want Overeem to have, tournament or no.
If Fedor beats Overeem, same thing. He beat Overeem and defends against a guy made a legit contender from winning the other bracket.
I actually think Strikeforce did well here. They have ensured some really good fights for 2011.
by Peter Nathaniel Fury on Jan 4, 2011 6:17 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The way you handle Fedor in Round 2 as a foregone conclusion makes me nervous. Nad Mojo!! ;)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
I'm jinxing it huh? :P
I for one, shall deny the possibility of Fedor losing in the first round even exists. Absolutely worst case scenario. It would make this tournament like a stillborn baby. You don’t even consider the possibility until it happens. :’(
If Fedor can’t beat Bigfoot Silva, I think the world will implode or something and leave us all disillusioned mutant wretches.
Of course, Coker would have no reaction and just inhale another cheeseburger. M1 would renegotiate.
by Peter Nathaniel Fury on Jan 5, 2011 8:39 AM EST up reply actions
Let’s hope for the best. I agree that Fedor losing to Silva would be a disaster for the tourney. Still, Silva may just have become better than we all can imagine right now…or…maybe not.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
I really hope this thing doesn't fall apart.
This GP has the potential to be one of the dominant MMA stories of 2011.
Great matchups. Looks like a ton of fun for us fans.
I specializes in grammar fail.
I am more psyched for this than anything UFC is offering right now
Never thought I’d say that about Strikeforce, but there it is.
█♣█
A wise man told me don't argue with fools
Cause people from a distance can't tell who is who -- Jay-Z
i wonder if the 2nd round and finals will be held on the same night?
Coker book Saitama and do it!!!
by zuffazombie on Jan 4, 2011 7:40 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Josh Gross tweeted the following.
Shane Del Rosario fights Lavar Johnson on Feb. 12 in an alternate Strikeforce heavyweight tournament fight. Will be on the televised card.
This looks great but......
If that is how the bracket is going to be laid it it really seems like they messed that up.
The 4 guys on the left should be matched up with one of the 4 guys on the right to start with. Or at least move on of the fights on the left and switch it with one on the right.
I dont get the point of this.
Why do this tournament. Everyone complained that the belt was only defended once in 2 years and this will just postone another title defense unless the winner gets a title shot in which case they would have to beat Overeem twice or even if Overeem wins then they still dont have anyone to face them that is coming off a win…. it makes no sense.
Rather than look through all the posts Overeem,Barnett and Fedor/M1 could ruin this whole thing. Overeems history of pulling out of fights, Barnetts failed tests/possible failing again and M1 ruining Fedor’s fight career could make this fall apart and lets face it without them this tournament would be a joke.
Also Why put Overeem in the tournament? He could possibly lose the title before ever making it to the finals? In any tournament format I’ve ever watched or heard about its been to crown a champ or a contender seems strange to me.
does anyone know if Fedors participation hangs on the deal M1 wanted from Showtime, to show M1 matches??
if they agreed to that, surely M1 wont go off trying to re-negotiate his deal after every match, and it could help make the tourney run alot smoother
Its a dunk for Barnett to roll threw his side of the bracket
Makes no sense to have reem and fedor on the same side unless Coker is done with the m-1 bs . If so good job coker lets see team m-1 back pedal outta this one!
All the GSP bashers, will be ordering a huge bowl of his nuts, ten seconds after Belfort knocks Andy out cold!!!
by TheAntiBritishTinCanHypeMachine on Jan 4, 2011 11:05 PM EST reply actions
Overeem runs through this tourney and just about kills everyone. There’s no way Werdum gets him down he’s way too small, I don’t think Fedor will be able to pass his reach as well, but I could see Fedor getting inside and doing some damage. Barnett might be interesting, cause he’s big and strong and might be able to keep Overeem down, but I even doubt that he’ll be able to get him down there.
That all said, Overeem hasn’t fought a big strong wrestler in some time.
I agree that the most likely scenario is the Reem leaving bodies in the street as he passes through. But he has some amazing fighters he needs to get through on his way and nothing is for certain. As for Barnett if he is in shape I have no doubt he can get Overeem down if he doesn’t eat a knee on the way in. But I’m not convinced he can keep him down.
I think Overeem has managed the feat of a distorted perception of his skills by getting the K1 title and fighting a few less than stellar opponents in the meantime. He may crush the MMA-Standup-Guys like Rogers but Fedor and Barnett will take his ass down, test his gas tank and slap submissions on him. I think if the Reem can’t finish these guys quickly he will get “exposed” Lesnar-style. He’s very good at one part of the game but there is little proof he’s become an all around powerhouse.
Of course we may never find out if he just KTFOs motherfuckers left and right ;)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Considering 19 of his 33 wins in MMA are via submission
and the way he at least held his own with everyone on the ground until he gassed as a LHW makes me not worry too much about this…after all, Anderson and Shogun have done pretty well for themselves with essentially the same approach to fighting MMA.
IMO neither Fedor nor Barnett have the sort of dynamic double that I think will be needed to take Overeem down anyway…only perhaps Cain could consistently put him on his ass…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
That’s a good point. And even Cain, with all his wrestling prowess had trouble getting into Kongo and got hurt shooting in. Could you imagine what would happen to him if he ate a Reem knee?
That said, this is the fight I now truly want to see. Reem vs Cain, and Reem vs Junior Dos Santos. Those matchups are absolutely insane. I think he runs through this strikeforce tourney rather easily, with the exception of Barnett.
I love this
I personally think that it’s matched up perfectly.
On a hierarchy basis, the top 4 are on one side, and the bottom 4 are on the other.
Overeem as champ, Werdum with back to back wins over Silva and Fedor, Fedor with only a loss to Werdum, and Silva are the best in SF and are the only guys that deserve to be fighting each other based only on where they are now.
It makes sense that Rogers who suffered back to back losses to Fedor and The Reem, Arlovski, who is coming off of back to back to back losses to Fedor, Rogers, and Silva, the unranked Kharitonov, and the very inactive and roid liable Barnett each have to win 2 consecutive fights over the others in order to fight one of the guys on the left side.
Because really the left and right are divided into ‘guys who have done some ass kicking in StrikeForce and are the best’ vs ‘guys coming off of big losses or have yet to fight in StrikeForce’
I think Overeem will avenge his loss to Werdum and beat the Fedor/Silva winner, and I hope that Kharitonov will upset his way to the final so that Overeem can avenge that loss as well. But in all honesty, I think whoever makes it through the right bracket will lose to whoever makes it through the left bracket.
The winner of this tournament has a very legitimate claim at being the #1 heavyweight in the world, especially if it’s Overeem or previous ‘#1 guy for 7 years straight’ Fedor.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 4, 2011 11:19 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
^rec’d
Barnett-Rogers is good in the event of a failed test as it’s not going to sacrifice a marquee matchup on the get go.
Food goes in here
man i never thought about that. In a way its good to give barnett rogers because who knows he could come back and look like garbage and lose as well.
by destructivist on Jan 4, 2011 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
In another way...
This is essentially a ‘determine who is the best between Werdum, Overeem, Fedor, and Silva’ contest with the winner getting a much more winnable fight to ‘celebrate’ them being crowned as the best. It’s solving the Fedor-Werdum-Overeem triangle to determine the official champion on one side of the bracket, and building them a challenger on the other side. I prefer that to doing mis-matches in the opening rounds and risk big time upsets.
If Barnett makes it to the final, he’ll enter it on an 8 fight win streak, Rogers and Kharitonov will enter it on a 3 fight win streak, and Arlovski would enter it on a 2 fight win streak.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Tough
For me, the favorites to win it all would be Overeem, Fedor, or Werdum…really anyone on the left side, Silva is no joke…so as far as the ‘not obvious’ guy with a pretty real chance of winning, I’d say him.
but beyond that as far as dark horses go, Barnett probably seems like the most likely to potentially upset the whole thing.
We’ve seen so many matchups it’s hard to buy any others. Arlovski has been soundly beat by Fedor, Rogers, and Silva, I wouldn’t like his chances in rematches with those guys or fights with Barnett or The Reem. Rogers has tried his hand against Fedor and The Reem, and it would suprise me if Kharitonov managed to beat the Rogers/Barnett winner, let alone the winner of the left side.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 4, 2011 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
To put this even simpler
Since it’s been made official that Overeem will defend the title in a 5 round fight with Werdum, and the title will carry on throughout the tournament…
The left side is essentially the ‘lets determine who our real champ is’ side. They have Overeem as their actual champ, Werdum as the lineal best guy because he beat Fedor, and Fedor as their former best guy who isn’t the best due to what could be perceived as a fluke.
After the 3 fights on the left, their true champion will be determined.
Meanwhile the right side is the ‘develop a #1 contender’ side that features the bottom half of their non-prospect heavyweights…and after those 3 fights iron out, they have a legit challenger for their champion.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
The belt kinda makes this feel like a game of capture the flag. When you have the belt in the fight you’ve gotta fight extra rounds haha.
It would have been nice to have Cormier in this tourney and as far as the reserves Ray vs Valentijn is more of a space filler.
Food goes in here
I agree
Cormier being in the reserve fight would be better. I just don’t think Valentijn has a whole lot left.
But yeah, after Fedor vs Silva, every figth on the left is a title fight. Werdum vs Overeem is for the belt, and the winner will be the champ defending it against the Fedor-Silva winner.
This tournament is essentially just a mapped out and streamlined version of the logical matchmaking anyway. Overeem vs Werdum made sense for Overeem’s next defense, and Fedor vs Silva made sense as the next #1 contender fight, and Barnett, Rogers, Arlovski and Kharitonov were all at least 2 fights from a title shot. Rogers and Barnett are right next to eachother in the conensus rankings and Arlovski coming off of 3 losses is the closest to the unranked Kharitonov.
The tournament is just a way to commit everyone to the gameplan, having it be a tournament forced Fedor’s management to extend his contract long enough to fulfill the tournament(plus room for one more fight) and committing Overeem to the tournament keeps him from jumping ship after one defense to go kick ass in DREAM or K-1.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Yeah I don’t Overeem will jump to K-1 seeing as he’s already got the belt and now in 2 fights he has the chance to avenge a loss and finally get the Fedor bout.
Though once all the quarters are done I wouldn’t be surprised if SF decides to shuffle the deck and have different semi final matchups. But the fact they put Overeem and Fedor in the same bracket indicates they don’t want to risk losing it a second time and have similar case of what happened in the GP with Schilt being upset by Peter Aerts, not saying all these fights are forgone conclusions but it is the path of least resistive and most successful in the end.
Also I think Chad Griggs should be given a reserve fight given he was brought into lose and though the mount standup was iffy he still won the bout and kicked over the Bobby Lashley apple cart.
Food goes in here
Also how do you percieve this could affect the rankings by the end of 2011
If Cain is to lose his title to JDS and Werdum wins the tournament are we ranking JDS as #1?
If Overeem or Fedor win will they get the number 1 spot regardless?
If the UFC title plays round robin between Cain, JDS and Carwin for example will the #1 ranking return to outside of the UFC if say Overeem, Fedor keep winning fights consistently?
Barnett seamlessly dropped out of the Top 10 due to just pure inactivity, going into the Fedor bought he was consensus ranked between 2-3 (http://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/2/Sherdog-Official-Mixed-Martial-Arts-Rankings-18558). How high does he re-enter with a tournament victory given his bracket contains guys on the lower end of the Top 15, 20 and would only get one solid Top 10 victory over say Fedor or Overeem.
Could Kharitnov get his rubber match with Overeem?
Food goes in here
If Cain loses and Reem or Fedor wins, I think they become #1. In the unlikely event it is Werdum instead, I would have to go with JDS.
Barnett is a tough call, given all of the dislike for him. I would say its unlikely he moves ahead of the group of Cain, Fedor, Reem, Werdum, JDS, Lesnar (inexplicably at #2?!?) and Carwin, leaving him most likely in the 8-10 range at best. Should he win it all (don’t laugh, its theoretically possible, if unrealistic), I can’t see him less than #3.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 4:41 AM EST up reply actions
I think that
the winner of this tournament has a very good chance of becoming the #1 ranked heavyweight…as long as it’s one of the guys on the left.
If stricter ranking rules were followed, when Werdum beat Fedor, he would have jumped to #1, but instead Lesnar got bumped, and secured when he beat Carwin, and then Velasquez became #1 when he beat Lesnar.
Seeing as Velasquez is going to be out for most of the year, I think that if Fedor or Overeem win, they may be considered #1.
The overall affect on the rankings could be pretty drastic. Fedor is #3 fighting #10, Werdum is #4 fighting #8, if Silva and Overeem win, they jump into the top 5 automatically, and then if one beats the other, and then beats the right side winner…a strong case could be made for them being #1. Or even if Fedor wins, securing his spot at #2, then Overeem destroys both Werdum and Fedor, and the right side winner…he’ll look unstoppable.
I’m not sure of Kharitonov’s chances to win the right side. I like Reem’s chances of winning the left, but the Barnett-Rogers winner will be pretty hard for Kharitonov. But honestly, that would be my ideal outcome, Overeem beating Werdum, then Fedor or Silva(don’t really care which) then Kharitonov to avenge his loss.
But as far as resume goes, Barnett would look best if he makes it to the final, with an 8 fight win streak, which would make The Reem look better if he beats him.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Boggling Cain got the #1 spot for beating the then #1 Lesnar but Werdum didn’t get the #1 for beating then #1 Fedor.
I think Rogers is an easier matchup for Sergei than Barnett would be. Arlovski’s chin looked better than previous outings in the Silva fight though his boxing ability dippedmwasn’t as crisp and he was too 1 dimensional gameplan wise.
Food goes in here
I think if
Werdum had been closer in the rankings to Fedor he would have gone to #1, but that was too big of a gap to jump with what was widely viewed as something of a fluke win anyway…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
Agreed
8 fight win streak Barnett vs. 11 fight win streak Overeem would look pretty good…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
If Cain has only one defense this year and Fedor wins three straight against Silva, Overeem and Whoever (potentially Barnett), I want to see the ranking that denies Fedor his #1 spot, especially after Lesnar got dismantled. Same goes for Werdum. Silva and Overeem (inactivity) may be more tricky to rank.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Overeem would be on a
11 fight win streak since moving full time to HW. If he dominates throughout, its pretty easy to make a case for him IMO, and a sure thing if Cain loses to JDS as well…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 11:21 AM EST up reply actions
This tournament is essentially just a mapped out and streamlined version of the logical matchmaking anyway.
That just has to be it because that’s all that makes sense. This isn’t a “tournament” like we are used to seeing it’s just Strikeforce booking heavyweights out for the next 8 to 12 months and locking them in. Hard to re-negotiate or demand a different opponent if you are locked into a bracket. Still who wins the tournament rounds aren’t the big deal the three title fights in a row are.
The difference here is that the public knows what matches will unfold. The UFC kind of has a tournament format if you piece it together but they never put out a bracket except in the case of the Lesnar/Couture and Mir/Nog 4 man affair.
Food goes in here
Pretty much
Which I personally like a lot more than doing mis-matches in the opening rounds and hoping nobody gets upset and that all of the best guys meet eachother in the later rounds.
This is the fun of a tournament that completely makes sense based on where these guys are actually at in the division.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
Anyone worried Fedor will put out of the tourney due to his 1 fight left on the contract?
This tourney looks awesome, but I bet it will soon be plagued by injuries, contract negotiations in limbo, and fighters pulling out.
I’ll pray every night that my worst fears will not come to pass, as this is the BEST HV tourney in a lonnnng time
Fedor extended his contract, he's got 4 fights with them.
Which means potentially 3 bouts in the tournament(if he wins, that is) and then one more fight after.
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 5, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions
Or 'TBA'
He’s always lined up to fight, and then gets replaced :P
CPG
Alistair Overeem - StrikeForce HeavyWeight Champion, K-1 2010 World Grand Prix Champion, DREAM Interim HeavyWeight Champion
by Chris Groves on Jan 5, 2011 12:31 AM EST up reply actions
What "tournament" though ?
They are marketing this as if it’s one of the old grand prix events that took place in Japan , e.g all the fights are happening at the same night – while clearly this isn’t the case . They would have made these fights anyway , or tried to make them .
Not being nitpicky but they should remove the ‘grand prix’ thing , it’s confusing . for a moment I really thought all the fights would be in the same time (I prefer it that way actually , it’s one big orgasm of fights).
This wouldn’t work in one night being in the states. Do you really want Fedor, Silva, Overeem, Werdum regulated to 3 minute rounds like the female tournament?
Plus if it was in one night whoever won espcially if it was Overeem or Fedor people who endless complain about how they got an “easy path” etc. as was demonstrated when people reacted to Overeems K-1 GP victory (despite the format being like that since 93 and you nitpick any GP win).
This also allows SF to build it up over a few months for the big finale. It’s a tournament, but not a 1 night tournament.
Food goes in here
I think for the most part – they did . When Fedor got injured against Nog they had to re-schedule but other than that it was a one nighter I think . Well , the UFC used to do that too at first . I know that marketing-wise it’s definitely smarter to spread it around the whole year – but seriously wouldn’t it be call to watch one more grand prix like the old days ?
Pride GP’s happened in two events, a quarter final round on one event and then a semi-final and final round on a second event. That isn’t going to fly with North American athletic commissions and it looks like this “tournament” won’t even have all the fights in a round on the same card more/less making any fighter fight more than once on a card.
would anyone agree?
Would anyone agree that the winner of this tournament should be ranked number 1 heavyweight in the world?
If it is Reem or Fedor, absolutely. If it is Werdum or Barnett, possibly. Anyone else, probably not.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
"People griping about this matchup need to stop using fight finder as their primary source of MMA information and watch some fights already."
-smoogy2
by The American Ronin on Jan 5, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
My prediction is Barnett vs Fedor in the finals
Barnett gets injured, Hershel Walker steps in and defeats Fedor via NFL.
Food goes in here
by Pandanus on Jan 5, 2011 7:52 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I don’t get this bracket set-up. You have the top 3 seeded HW fighters on one side of the bracket, and on the other side, youu have the 4 weakest HW’s.
That would be like the NCAA setting up their mens basketball bracket with all the #1 vs. #16 games on one side.
It should be that the two best HW’s have to meet in the finals, and the two best HW’s are either Fedor, Overeem or Werdum. With the way this bracket is setup, there is no way that any of those two can meet in the fianls, which is silly.
Barnett can fight in the finals with a win over Can smasher Brett Rogers, then a win over Kharitonov or Arlovski (neither of who are top 15 fighters anymore).
While Werdum would have to beat Overeem, then potentially Fedor (if he wins).
Doesn’t seem like a even bracket!
Pretend
It’s not a tournament. It’s just an excuse to ensure that these guys will fight each other.
So you have the logical championship match and #1 contender in Werdum/Overeem and Emelianenko/Silva respectively. Then on the other side of the bracket, you have the other people who are a bit further back in the title picture warring to get the next shot at the title.
Sure, it’s not logically seeded if you’re looking at it from a 1 vs 8, 2 vs 7 etc type matchup, but it makes sense when you look at it from the perspective that Strikeforce is learning from their mistakes in the upsets that happened with Fedor/Werdum, Henderson/Shields, and Lashley/Griggs. You don’t put off big money matches or you get burned like they have the last couple of years. This tournament ensures that the best guys will be in the ring fighting (at least in theory).
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bloody Elbow
Related FanShots on Bloody Elbow
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
MMA Rankings
