Brock Lesnar, Georges St. Pierre Top List of UFC Top Pay Per View Draws Since 2008
by Kid Nate on Sep 9, 2010 12:59 PM EDT
in Business of MMA
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MMA Payout has been playing around with different ways to calculate the top draws in the UFC. They've hit on a method that I think reveals something interesting. They take Derek Jenkins' list of the top 10 draws in the UFC that appeared on Yahoo! and compare cards featuring those fighters to cards lacking any of the top 10 draws.
Here's their chart:
Average buys for all UFC PPVs since 2008 that do not feature ANY of the ten fighters: 308,000
Events not featuring any of the ten fighters:
- UFC 85 (Hughes vs. Alves) - 215,000 buys
- UFC 93 (Franklin vs. Henderson) - 350,000 buys
- UFC 99 (Franklin vs. W. Silva) - 360,000 buys
- UFC 103 (Franklin vs. Belfort) - 375,000 buys
- UFC 110 (Nogueira vs. Velasquez) - 240,000 buys
Fighter Average PPV buys for cards featuring fighter Difference from "baseline" average Brock Lesnar 1,007,000 699,000 Georges St. Pierre 889,000 581,000 Quinton Jackson 735,000 427,000 Rashad Evans 693,000 385,000 Forrest Griffin 691,000 383,000 Lyoto Machida 610,000 302,000 BJ Penn 603,000 295,000 Randy Couture 573,000 265,000 Chuck Liddell 550,000 242,000 Anderson Silva 530,000 222,000
*Note that I've reordered the chart so that it lists the fighters from first to last in terms of "Difference from 'baseline' average".
No really big surprises here, but it's interesting to see how much of a bump Brock Lesnar and GSP bring to the PPV business. I think it's obvious that Quinton "Rampage" Jackson and Rashad Evans are benefiting greatly from the mega-success of UFC 114 which may be a one-time event.
Lyoto Machida is another who performs stronger than I might have expected, but now that he's lost his light heavyweight title and his aura of invincibility, I doubt he'll remain a major draw.
Note also that Anderson Silva is at the bottom of this list. He remains only slightly more popular than Rich Franklin, the champ he deposed from the MW division.
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I’m surprised that GSP has such drawing power. I always found him a bit boring, especially his past recent fights.
I guess it’s too early for Shogun to pop up in that list.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
GSP is a mega star in Canada.. everyone and their father buys those PPVs. Not all that surprising but i’d like to see this divided up by geographical location, it would make for an interesting read to see where all these PPVs are purchased
Sheeeeeeeee-it
While GSP is very popular here
The bump in PPVs he gets from Canada is probably overstated. MMA as a whole is incredibly popular here.
Where GSP does well is in attracting people who normally wouldn’t watch the UFC namely women. The man is able to draw Ina broader demographic because of his clean cut style and the way he carries himself.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:05 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
truth
Where GSP does well is in attracting people who normally wouldn’t watch the UFC namely women.
this statement is absolutely true but i also think the canadian ppv numbers are probably significant
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by Johnathan Willis on Sep 9, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm still skeptical
And I’m telling you this as a Canadian who’s pretty plugged in to the popularity of the sport in this country. While I do think there is probably a spike in numbers for a GSP fight, I don’t think it’s nearly as significant as outsiders seem to think it is.
It’s easy to dismissively say that GSPs popularity is a result of Canadian buyers but that really doesn’t get to the heart of what has made GSP so popular and what has made him a potential crossover star.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Canada buys most UFC events at a fairly high rate per capita...
We are a small country by comparison though. I doubt the numbers for a GSP vary that much from the base. Gatorade and Under Armour seem to believe in GSP’s marketability accross the boarder.
GSP always being on stacked cards
have more to do with the great numbers.
He always is with other stars.
111 & 100 both had two title fights, etc.
False
You can’t actually believe that GSPs popularity is propped up by other fighters. The only other “star” on the 111 card was Frank Mir and he’s a fighter who you can actually argue his popularity is propped up by other real stars.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:33 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The UFC said 17% of their total revenue is from Canada
That fucking nuts for a country with 34M people.
If a large part of that Canadian revenue is concentrated from the five GSP cards out of ~40 PPVs since 2008, then that would mean most of his buys are from Canada. Granted, that ‘if’ is probably not true, but he probably is a big draw.
Revenue meaning merchandise/ticket sales/stuff like that
How many events does the UFC do in Canada? A few a year.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions
The majority of the UFC's revenue comes from PPV
It’s silly of you to think the UFC was excluding that when they said 17% of the company’s total business comes from Canada.
It’s not a few a year, it’s three events total in the history of the company.
They had two events in Canada in 2010 already
I know that over 50% of the UFC revenue came from PPV. I meant that revenue doesn’t just mean PPV numbers only.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 10, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
The PPV number FWIK
don’t include Canada
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Should be FWIR(emember)
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Numbers are usually for North America
For example:
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2008/12/13/691403/top-10-north-american-ppv
BTW, FWIK is pretty much the same thing :)
I always found him a bit boring
Really?
Sure he has had a few wrestle centric fights lately, but I was largely his exciting / flashy fighting style that earned him his fame. Nobody ever really called him boring until the Penn, Aldo, Hardy trifecta… People have short memories.
That was years ago. Literally, years ago.Hardy, Alves, Fitch, Penn (II) and Serra (II) honestly bored me. I understand what he’s doing and he’s a smart fighter, but I was never sitting on the edge of my seat.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
GSP hardly used his wrestling to beat Fitch
He beat the living crap out of him standing.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
As I recall, there was a lot of wrestling involved. Fitch has poor standup, we all know that, but there was a lot of wrestling. In my opinion, he outwrestled Fitch.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
Subject line
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Shit
Look how he wrestled all over Fitch’s face!
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Can't you see? Fitch was implementing lay-and-pray
By laying on his back praying he wouldn’t die.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
Preemptive strike
“Yeah, but in between kicking his ass, there was wrestling” is not valid.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The Wrestlers are Coming!
Someone should make a b movie horror flick called that for whiny MMA fans.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'm not sure I have ever
Seen a mouth piece get knocked that far out of someone’s mouth…
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." -Arthur Schopenhauer
Haters are gonna hate and bitches are gonna bitch...
by BigDNotDallas on Sep 10, 2010 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions
You recall incorrectly
Rounds 2 and 4 were almost all standup, and between the limited wrestling of rounds 1 and 3 we had spectactular standup highlights. Only the last round was relatively uneventful wrestling/GnP (but not boring either).
This fight was voted Fight of the Year on MMAjunkie.com. I’m not saying I agree with that, as there were better fights in 2008 that didn’t get as much exposure, but it certainly tells you that the vast majority of people disagree with your assesment that this fight was boring.
This
I was amazed that Fitch made it the distance. Lookoutawhale’s Terminator video on that is priceless.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
it's ridiculous to argue anyway
I don’t mean you are ridiculous, Mr. truck, although you may be. It’s just silly to challenge another person who was bored by something. You can’t call personal tastes stupid (well, maybe in outrageous instances like the Twilight books). If Keren was bored by a GSP fight, it doesn’t make her any less of an MMA fan.
Although I personally found the Fitch and Serra II fights entertaining, I wasn’t exactly titillated by Penn II, Alves, and especially Hardy.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Gah!
First of all… I am indeed ridiculous!!
Second of all, I didn’t call her taste stupid
Third of all, I never called her a wrestle hater
Third of all, Twilight is stupid. I agree.
Fourth of all, I never said she was less of an MMA fan
Seventh of all, I also aknowledged that Penn II, Alves and Hardy were slow
First of all, I said “I don’t really have a counter argument” not because I want to argue, but because I don’t have a reasonable counter point to continue the discussion. I thought those two annihilation were very entertaining (which you agree with) and clearly Keren and I were looking at things differently. Therefor dicussion /end
In conclusion I think we can all agree that you don’t like Twilight.
by truck on Sep 9, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i meant "you" in the general sense
it’s pretty apparent a gang mentality develops when people suggest GSP to have been boring in recent fights. i just picked your comment, Mr. truck, to place my response :-D
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
I can see why people would find his last three fights dull
I was just surprised to hear someone say they always found him boring is all. He used to have a reputation as an exciting fighter. I know nothing about gangs and pigeons.
"Are we just gonna waste this angry mob?"
I, too, always viewed GSP as an exciting fighter. But now his path of least resistance, so to speak, is less than entertaining in my eyes. Can’t fault him for using it, but it also makes me think twice about buying his fights.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
I personally didn't mind the Penn fight.
I thought it was cool how he gutted out the Alves fight with an injured groin.
I did find the Hardy fight a little frustrating though. If he was successful on one of those submission attempts I wouldn’t have been though.
Major props on the Alves fight, for sure, but I still wasn’t enamored with it.
The Hardy fight reminded me of Shields/Mayhem… everyone would’ve had a different opinion if the sub forced a tap
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Shields gets a bad rap
Similar to GSP, the guy has a string of finishes, then 2-3 dominant performances against VERY tough competition and they’re labeled boring. It’s crazy
Shield is a little different...
He was boring, got exciting and then had a couple slow fights
GSP was never boring then had a couple slow fights
Fans just have very short memories…
GSP used to be my favorite fighter
Not as much anymore.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
GSP was the first guy ever to drop Alves (although Alves once walked into an upkick way back). The only way that fight was going to get closer to a finish was if GSP KO’d himself.
Even when GSP was apologetic to Dana backstage, he said “You dropped him!”
You have to put expectations in line with reality. I don’t think anyone on the planet can win against Fitch, Penn, and Alves in more entertaining ways than what we saw from GSP.
But I don’t add qualifiers to what entertains me. That’s like saying, well, Indiana Jones 4 would have been good but what can you do with a George Lucas script these days?
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
That said...
Tiger woods having three bad tourneys in a row doesn’t make him a bad golfer. It could just be a slump or a run of bad luck.
I never said I always found him boring. Lately, he has been, in my opinion. But not always. There is a clear distinction.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
In your own words...
I always found him a bit boring, especially his past recent fights.
I never said I always found him boring.
I don’t really care though. Opinions are opinions, we don’t have to agree.
I was on the edge of my seat for the first two rounds of GSP-Penn 2.
And the last two rounds I was all “Woooooooo!”
I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.
Hardy I can see, but
The Alves fight was made all the more impressive by the injury.
The Penn fight, IMO, once his dominance was established, was one where IMO GSP (for the only time I can recall) choose to intentionally punish BJ, rather than trying to finish him, presumably for all the shit-talking in the lead up and perhaps the vasoline as well.
If Kos is as mouthy as I expect him to be during TUF and the related build-up, I suspect he will do the same thing to him, once GSP feels he has the fight where he wants it.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." -Arthur Schopenhauer
Haters are gonna hate and bitches are gonna bitch...
by BigDNotDallas on Sep 10, 2010 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions
And of those
Only Hardy could be considered even remotely boring…
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." -Arthur Schopenhauer
Haters are gonna hate and bitches are gonna bitch...
by BigDNotDallas on Sep 10, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh god not another "GSP is boring" person
If Hardy had his arm ripped in half I bet the talk would be “GSP is a finisher”.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
Yep. I mean
He stopped Jay Hieron, dominated Frank Trigg, broke Sean Sherk’s nose, smashed Hughes in the rematch and in the rubber match, knocked out Serra in the rematch, assaulted Fitch like no one else has, knocked out BJ Penn, dropped Thiago Alves, and almost broke Hardy’s arm and he’s boring?
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
It's the internet MMA board meme
Wrestlers are boring, guys outside of the UFC are inherently more exciting, meh there’s a few other ones but it’s hard thinking like a moron for long enough to write the whole post
Not all wrestlers are boring, but some wrestling-centric fighters and fights tend to be. I love the sport and all aspects of it, but what I’m saying is that it can get a bit boring at times.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
I feel you
Don’t let them pidgeon-hole you into a wrestling hater… lots of us find GSP’s recent outings rather lackluster
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Thank you.
I’m not a hater. I’m a fan of his. I like the way he carries himself in and out of the cage, but let’s be honest, he’s recently been lackluster.
I hate it when someone makes a comment about a certain fight or fighter being a bit boring because of the way they wrestle. Not all wrestlers are boring. Look at Hughes, Couture, Aaron Simpson, etc. Nor do I think that there’s too much wrestling in mma. That’s just a ridiculous thing to say, but I do think that GSP’s past few fights have been…uninspiring.
"Girls are mean." Lisa Ward
Name five wrestlers more exciting than GSP
Who? Koscheck? There’s nothing exciting about his game aside from the fact that he was given a couple glass jawed cans to KO. GSP doesn’t have that luxury.
Sonnen? The guy can talk some shit, and he isn’t boring, but he is certainly not more exciting than GSP and has never come close to finishing any UFC opponents.
Rashad? I’ve been defending him a lot, but he’s not GSP in terms of excitement.
So who are you thinking of?
Urijah Faber, Scott Jorgenson, Joseph Benavidez, Eddie Alvarez, and Tyson Griffin.
I’m much more entertained watching any of them fight than GSP as of late.
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-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Sep 9, 2010 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions
That's not fair
Lightweights, featherweights and bantamweights are always more entertaining, and you can’t compare GSP’s recent competition to the types of fighters in the WEC and Bellator.
Show me UFC wrestlers that are more entertaining and win against good competition. Any loser can be exciting by getting KO’d, so Griffin is a weak answer. Franca and Dos Anjos are weak competition.
That's what people don't realize
Do you want the best fighting the best, or do you want steamroll KOs/subs? The stupid part is UFC gives you both on most cards, but people seem to expect steamrolls out of the champions while bitching that the challengers need to be better.
Look at the most popular sport in the world: Soccer.
Almost always close, low scoring games whenever two high level teams face each other. So do people prefer the ‘exciting’ games in regional leagues? Of course not. They want to see the best face the best.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but
I thought you were a “multiple organizations housing top fighters” supporter. If so, what gives with the “best fighting the best” argument?
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
I want freedom and competition
Freedom gives the best fights. Strikeforce got better fights on their cards by allowing their fighters to fight DREAM fighters. Melendez-Aoki. Diaz-Zaromskis. The same would happen if the UFC joined in. Overeem or Fedor vs. Lesnar. GSP-Shields instead of GSP-Hardy. Competition helps fights and fighter pay, so that’s a no brainer.
Returning to the reality of the world I live in, there is no question that the UFC has almost all the top talent in all divisions at 155 and above, with HW being a bit of a close call. If you’re going to compare GSP to someone, compare him to a top level fighter in the UFC.
I gotcha
I used to be of the same opinion myself, but as you said, “the reality of the world we live in” dictates otherwise. SF not being able to handle their fighters (Fedor/M-1) and the fact that their production value sucks, leads my to belive that there needs to be one nation under UFC.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
The only problem is that monopolies tend to fuck over their employees and the consumer.
The top fighters are not like some blue collar worker where almost any unemployed bum can replace his job. They are the best fighters on the planet, and without them the UFC is worthless. My PPV money should be going to them, not three owners that do something that a hundred other people could do if they had access to the same fighters.
first off, it is fair
second, you didn’t say anything about my list, which is filled with guys from the higher weight classes.
Also, “you can’t compare GSP’s recent competition to the types of fighters in the WEC”? I’m of the opinion that the WEC has more consolidation of the top fighters in the world than the UFC.
And if you have to keep adjusting your argument with qualifiers, it’s a weak argument with which to begin.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
I was talking about WEC lightweights in that part where I lumped WEC together with Bellator, though I was unclear. I addressed your list below.
My argument has no more qualifiers than yours. You are implicitly saying GSP’s wrestling is not too exciting when fighting tough, top-5 fighters, because that’s what ‘recently’ entails. I’m saying show me wrestling that is more exciting at doing the same, and so far you’ve failed.
What are you trying to get from me?
That GSP is the best I’m going to get, so I should be satisfied? If GSP is the standard for “wrestler”, here’s my list:
Chuck Liddell
Brock Lesnar
Cain Velasquez
Mike Thomas Brown
Jon Jones
Josh Barnett
Scott Jorgensen
Randy Couture
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Lesnar, Couture, and Barnett are big names who’ve recently fought flawed or declining competition. Their fighting is no more entertaining than GSP’s. If Hardy was as gassed as Carwin, GSP would have easily finished a submission. GSP-Penn II was just like Lesnar-Mir II, except Penn doesn’t get KO’d by anyone while Mir is all too comfortable taking shots to the head. Who has Couture beaten recently in an entertaining way? Two joke opponents, and really boring in the rounds he won against Vera. He decisioned Sylvia with half the entertainment value of GSP-Fitch.
Liddell? Like I said, any loser can be entertaining when getting KO’d. He may be a wrestler in name, but he doesn’t actually wrestle.
The WEC is incomparable. The public doesn’t find it exciting because there’s just no money there. Purists find lighter weight classes more exciting in boxing, too.
Velasquez and Jones I’d agree with, but you can’t compare their competition or career to GSP. If you did, you’d have to look at GSP from 2006.
Entertaining is subjective!!!
You can’t ask me for a list, then change the criteria, then just say I’m wrong because GSP isn’t at the top of it.
Also, Liddell was champion for years. He didn’t wrestle? Was there some BJJ masterclass he consistently put on that I am unaware of?
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Chuck used his wrestling in the most basic way
To dictate where the fight took place. And at the end of the day, that is the underlying advantage that those with a strong wrestling game bring with them.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." -Arthur Schopenhauer
Haters are gonna hate and bitches are gonna bitch...
by BigDNotDallas on Sep 10, 2010 1:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Wait, what the fuck?
This post is ridiculous.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
this post doesn't make any sense
Randy’s fight with nogueira was insane. your mir- penn comparison is ludicrous, doesn’t make any sense. His decisioning of sylvia was fucking awesome; you saw the fight ex-post facto. Had you seen it live or even before randy took the title, the hype leading up to the fight was insane. that was a HELLuva entertaining fight.
Liddell uses his wrestling to stand and bang. His sprawl is awesome.
The public doesn’t find it exciting because there’s no money in the WEC? Is that why people find the UFC exciting, because of all the money there? Why isn’t the public fucking watching oil drills?
I’m assuming you meant Liddell when you said Lesnar, because he’s fought high quality opponents. Shane Carwin is a wrecking machine, Frank Mir is damn good, and he finished both of them.
Sorry, but this was a silly, silly post.
“Let’s not go to camelot. It is a silly place”
-King Arthur
by Body Triangle on Sep 9, 2010 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re right: the hype leading up to Sylvia-Couture was insane. During the fight, it was amazing to see this 45-yr old finally solve the Sylvia riddle. It had nothing to do with Randy putting a more exciting fight than, say, GSP-Fitch. That is my point. Couture-Nog was two evenly matched declining legends without KO power facing each other. You simply can’t have that type of fight at the top level.
You’re talking about a different era with Liddell. The last time he put on exciting wins was when GSP had exciting fights also. Since then, he’s been controlling the fight into getting KO’d. Wow, very impressive.
No, I did not mean Liddell instead of Lesnar. Lesnar fought flawed opponents. If GSP fought a gassed Hardy/Alves (Alves is a wrecking machine, Hardy is sort of one), we’d see an ending just like Carwin-Lesnar. If GSP fought a Penn with Mir’s TD/GnP defense, it would have ended quicker.
It has nothing to do with GSP’s fighting style being more boring than Lesnar. It has to do with hype, HW awe, and opponents.
Also
You could have at least taken the time to read the correction immediately below my post.
Lighter weight classes are not as exciting to the general public and we know this because they don’t pay as much to watch the WEC. They put arguably the two most exciting top-level featherweights in history against each other, plus had Brown and Jorgenson from the list above, put Zuffa marketing behind it, and got under 200k PPV buys.
WEC has a niche appeal, and it doesn’t translate to high level fighting at higher weights. Welterweights don’t move like featherweights, and you can’t get to the top fighting like one. Even if you do, like Edgar is doing at LW, people say that’s not exciting.
And he was advancing position constantly and with ease
That makes for an exciting fight in my book. I have to say I’m rather rarely bored watching mma. It sucks when guys gas out or stall either in the clinch or on the ground but I haven’t seen that from St-pierre recently (ok, a bit in the Alves fight where he clearly slowed down after he got injured (hit him with it!)).
full disclosure: I’m from Montreal and work next to his gym.
Chuck so far down?
Really?? and rashad, boy that’s a surprise. He probably benefited from fighting top draws like rampage and iceman.
I was wondering that as well.
Mir’s last two fights were co main events on 107 and 111. Both cards did well above average. If GSP gets credit for coheadlining ufc 100, then why does Mir not only not get credit for his 2 coheadlines, but for headlining 100 as well?
I’m not necessarily suggesting that Frank Mir is a huge draw, but if the numbers are all we have to go on, what’s to definitively say he’s not?
by zY on Sep 9, 2010 1:06 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
His old fights back in the day might have brought his numbers down. I don’t know how many people were excited to see him face Wes Simms.
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
Thus list is only since 2008
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:16 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah and his numbers since then have been solid.
UFC 81:
650,000
UFC 92:
1,000,000+
UFC 100:
1,600,000
UFC 107:
620,000
UFC 111:
800,000
Average PPV buys for cards featuring Mir:
934,000
Difference from “baseline” average:
626,000
That would put him second on that list.
As I pointed out above
Frank Mir is the beneficiary of fighting on cards with real stars, most notably Brock Lesnar, GSP and BJ Penn.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
While I'm sure there's a delusional Frank Mir fan out there somewhere that believes that
I’m going to go with my gut and say that that’s probably not the case. Lol
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
FWIW
He is very good at hyping fights and I am sure he helped to push those numbers upwards at least a little.
I guess we'll see how popular he is with 119
Because he doesn’t really have another big name to help sell the card.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Fair enough.
I don’t see the card doing that well. Mir didn’t look good in his last loss and there isn’t much hype behind it.
It'll be a tough sell
Because no one really trashes Cro Cop, and it’d seem even more disingenuous than usual if Mir tried. The only person, I believe, who ever had semi-legitimate animosity with Cro Cop was Wandy. But also, I wasn’t around for the 06 GP, so maybe I’m wrong.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Anything over 300k or so
Is pretty much Mir bumping it up. I expect this to do on par with the last card full of PRIDE vets.
Well, beating Brock probably helped.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
They take Derek Jenkins’ list of the top 10 draws in the UFC that appeared on Yahoo! and compare cards featuring those fighters to cards lacking any of the top 10 draws.
Because he wasn’t on Jenkins’ list.
by mma_critic on Sep 9, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s certainly possible, but it’s simply conjecture, considering we’re going by numbers here.
by zY on Sep 9, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I think UFC 100 is going to make analysis about this type of stuff very hard. I really think Brock and GSP are the biggest draws, but 100 had a lot of things going for it, that I think the whole might be greater than the sum of all the parts. it had a title match, a title unification rematch, a TUF coaches fight that was pushed as a title eliminator, and a big round number.
by Phildo on Sep 9, 2010 12:58 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
truth
and rec
The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.
by Johnathan Willis on Sep 9, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep. Making sense of these numbers is like learning to skateboard when you are too old and too fat.
It isn’t easy and you often look silly.
Using that analogy is about as relevant as an old naked man in a helmet walking past a fire
by RS26 on Sep 9, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
That was kinda the point.
You can make a million cases one way or another related to the buy rate of any even. There is no way to prove much of anything.
You know
Used to be it was the big draws that averaged 300,000 a show. Now it’s the fucking baseline. How sick is that?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
Got to watch out for that oversaturation
we each must become like fishermen, and go out on to the dark ocean of mind, and let your nets down into that sea
by Barack Lesnar on Sep 9, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions
TOO MUCH FREE MMA
Also, my wallet is stretched to the max and my diamond shoes are too tight.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Are your gold socks too thick as well?
we each must become like fishermen, and go out on to the dark ocean of mind, and let your nets down into that sea
by Barack Lesnar on Sep 9, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Just means more arguments with the wife
Wife: Board games with Tammy and Mike Saturday night dear.
Me: Fight night with the boys at Tobey’s Eatery sweetheart.
Wife: You’re sleeping on the couch.
Me: So that means I can go?
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Oh, the trials and tribulations of being an MMA fan in 2010.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
It's about to get worse
NFL season kicks off this week! I really should have married a sports fan.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Divorce is imminent
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Meh
We’ve been together for fifteen years, married for seven, if it hasn’t happened yet, it ain’t happening anytime soon.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:10 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Woo complacency.
Bolts from the Blue // "It is what it is." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // "Richard is a jewel." - Kid Nate
My lady will usually watch one MMA event every two weeks
and one or two football games per week. She reads while I watch the rest.
The abundance of MMA over the summer was tough though, especially since she is pregnant and way more needy than normal.
I can get her to watch Patriots games with me
And GSP fights. But that’s only because she thinks they’re both hot.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 1:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Just say no to Brady bashing!
The man is my hero. Kids with two different supermodels? Check. Three Superbowl rings? Check. Eyes that could penetrate straight to my soul? Check.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
P. Manning > Brady
And I don’t care about the Super Bowl count.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
My brother is a diehard Colts fan
Once a year we nearly come to blows when they play each other.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It must suck knowing that the Colts have pwned the Pats
For 3-4 years running after a long period of Pats dominance.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
All I know
Is that when this era of football is looked back upon, they’ll say the Pats and the Colts were the premiere teams of the era and the ledger will read:
Superbowl championships:
Patriots – 3
Colts – 1
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:18 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
No.
This is the dawning of the Matt Ryan era.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Not as long as he plays in the NFC South
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
against...
The Saints? Riiiiight.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
I mean they did win a Super Bowl (went 2-0 vs the Dirty ducks) last year and lost 1 LB, but yeah they suck. What was I thinking?
Matt Ryan will be drawing social security in a few years anyway.
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
You talking about the same Saints who were on the ropes last year against the Falcons WITHOUT Matt Ryan or Mike Turner?
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Yes the ones that beat them twice
I remember that game. That was one were Sharper, Porter, and Greer were hurt.
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
seriously?
two of our three best players were completely out of the game.
We’ll see you on the 26th, DayGeaux!
P.S. “Who Dat Nation” is officially the lamest thing ever, tied with ATL’s 1998 “Dirty Bird” craze.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
Ah we will!
And yes “Who Dat Nation” is pretty lame. I hear the phrase “2 dat” the other day and almost cried at the cornyness.
The Dirty Bird dance was pretty f’n cool I must admit.
Good day “sir”!
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
The Dirty Bird was cool when I was in 4th grade and won a pack of Crayola markers in the shool “Dirty Bird Dance Off”, but in the wake of Jamal Anderson’s cocaine woes I just laugh at it.
At least neither of our teams have Ray “The Killer” Lewis doing a stupid dance before taking the field.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
As stupid football dances go, Ray Lewis’ dance is pretty great.
Bolts from the Blue // "It is what it is." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // "Richard is a jewel." - Kid Nate
Besides
Beating Rex Grossman in a Super Bowl shouldn’t count.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Subo
You just made me spit coffee out laughing on the bus.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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by Worldisart on Sep 9, 2010 2:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
:-)
Glad I could help
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure Jake Delhomme is a world beater either.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
True
But then again there’s the superbowl victories over the McNabb led Eagles and of course Kurt Warner and the “Greatest Show on Turf”
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
Support independent artists
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I know but still
Fuck the Pats – I’m from Indiana
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
That period ended after the Pats got caught cheating, right?
Bolts from the Blue // "It is what it is." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // "Richard is a jewel." - Kid Nate
My Man
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
That said, I drafted Brees in fantasy football
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
I always take a running back
Cross my fingers and hope for the best.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
Support independent artists
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I took him in the 1st round
RB crew is Ryan Grant, Ricky Williams, Ahmad Bradshaw, and LeSean McCoy.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
That is a lot of RB's
Grant is a solid starter. Moreno, Bradshaw and McCoy could have big years, but who knows.
I personally never take a QB before the 5th round.
you in an 8 team league or what
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
You must have a lot of good recievers then – or IDPs
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
I cleaned up with the receivers
I got Wes Welker, Marques Colston, and Santana Moss. While Moss is a question mark I hope McNabb makes him useful.
Only Seahawks I picked were John Carlson at TE and Olindo Mare at K.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
Welker
He is the ultimate fantasy player. My pool laughed at me last year when I took him second round and he almost single handedly won me the pool.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
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uh.... last year?
he was the 24th best receiver by default Yahoo standards.
Also he’s coming off of ACL surgery, and he’s been quoted as saying he isn’t 100%.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Sep 10, 2010 4:15 AM EDT up reply actions
I joined a 10 team pay league and
I think I rocked the draft. Some people made questionable picks early.
RB: Turner, Gore, Forte, McCoy
WR: Marshall, Fitz, Nicks, Floyd, Bowe
Eli is my QB, all set.
I will never pick a Saints reciever. Brees spreads it around too much. You’re gold with Wes though
If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.
I'm hoping Colston's yardage oversets his lack of catches.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
no, you didn't
Welker is coming off of ACL surgery and has stated that he isn’t 100% yet. Players coming off ACL surgery are nowhere near what they used to be that year – wait til year 2.
Colston, like all N.O. wideouts are risky, since they spread the ball around so much. Today: 62 yards, no touchdowns. Enjoy your 6 points.
Moss plays for Washington. He’ll probably do better than last year with McNabb at the helm, but seeing how he was ranked 25 in Yahoo default, shrug.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Sep 10, 2010 4:19 AM EDT up reply actions
that is
a terrible, terrible crop of 2nd and 3rd and worse tier rbs
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on Sep 9, 2010 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Grant is solid and three of them have upside
I think Bradshaw will be his second best RB, but McCoy or Moreno could explode.
That sucks. I ended up with Chris Johnson, Jamaal Charles, Arian Foster and Matt Forte.
Bolts from the Blue // "It is what it is." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // "Richard is a jewel." - Kid Nate
I ended up with Rodgers but I’m comfortable with that.
"If the commission would sanction it and Dana would move, I’d fighter Anderson right now."
- Chael Sonnen at the post fight press conference following his loss to Anderson Silva.
Support independent artists
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Rice and Shaub
picks 1 and 2
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
300,000 buys...
is just “failing to capitalize on the momentum from UFC 100” haven’t you heard?
As someone who’s been following this for a while it’s amazing how big the sport has gotten. I remember being amazed to see the results of a fight on the local news after if happened. It’s really cool to take a step back and smile at how far it’s come every so often.
As an aside, I’m reading Snowden’s book, and there’s a LOL-mazing part where he says that Liddell-Ortiz II was Zuffa’s peak. GG Snowden.
...the book was written in 2008.
If that wasn’t the peak at the time of writing, I don’t know what is. Are you trolling or just willfully ignorant? I honestly can’t tell anymore.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Sep 9, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
The way it's worded
He ends the entire chapter with a single sentence seperated:
“Little did the Fertittas know that they had peaked.”
This is giving the strong impression that it was the best they would ever do. Saying “it was the strongest event ever!” would be accurate in the context. Saying they had peaked is saying they’ll never do better, which couldn’t be more wrong.
It’s a good example at how funny a lot of this doom and gloom stuff looks when you actually go back a couple of years later and look at it. Hell, go back to the end of 2009 and look at all the posts talking about UFC’s buyrates being in the toilet and the market being over saturated. Not even a year ago!
That was actually this year
After Evans/Silva did around 300,000 buys. Those were the days!
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Sep 9, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Perhaps
Perhaps Lesnar is the biggest draw they’ll ever see, perhaps some guy will come a few years down the line and set the world on fire and draw in even more eyeballs. We don’t really know.
But if you don’t want to look like a fool later, it’s irresponsible to make statements like that. If I wrote in 2000 that there’d never be a black president, I’d look like an idiot now. If I wrote in 2000 that there had never BEEN a black president, I’d be accurate.
The danger of sensationalism in writing is that the facts have a way of fucking with you.
You know
Since UFC 57 they have had 57 ppv events and only 5 have done less than 300,000.
Now before 2006, if you could sell 300,000 you were definitely a star. Of course, no one sold over 300,000 until UFC 57 so we have to wonder who the big stars were.
Shows you how big the effect of TUF and Spike giving the UFC all of the WWE time spots.
Biggest overall draw
Brock Lesnar is currently 2nd in all time pay per view draws among active fighters including boxing. This does not include Brocks WWE days. With Brock only 500,000 behind Floyd it is pretty safe to say that after Oct he will be the leader in pay per view buys for any active fighter in any sport.
Floyd- 5,650,000
Brock- 5,115,000
Manny P- 4,050,000
by andrewsj7 on Sep 9, 2010 2:03 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
It’s interesting to compare PPV buys with boxing. Do they stack cards with those two boxers? Brock always has a lot of help selling.
UFC 116 was basically a FN with a great main event
It could’ve been better if we had Kongo/Nelson and Marquardt/Sakara there like scheduled.
Mo Johnston is what John Schneider could be in 4 years.
until Floyd draws 1.5-2 mill in a pair of matches next year
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
with who?
Floyd is a pretty good draw but unless it is Manny there really aren’t too many fights that could draw. Plus Floyd has only gone over 1 mil buys twice, once with De La Hoya (2.4) and then Mosley (1.4).
I firmly believe Floyd's recent rant was to keep his name in the news
People who are legit fans of Floyd for more than his legendary defense love that kind of shit.
I think Floyd can do ~750k each with Andre Berto, maybe some other guy like Sergio Martinez. I don’t know if he takes those fights, though, especially the Martinez fight.
"Frankie Edgar... beat the fuck out of Snooki, that's why she looks like Dio after Sabbath." --Joey Diaz
EDIT
Floyd has 7 million buys including earlier events. Also Floyd is #5 all time in history for buys including retired fighters, De La Hoya, Tyson, and Holyfield.
So bringing it back to Brock, if he can get 1 mil+ each out of Velasquez and Dos Santos. He would eclipse Floyd. Assuming Floyd doesn’t fight again in that time frame which doesn’t look likely.
I shall
I need a weekend where I have nothing planned
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
It'd be nice if someone could point me to a list of buyrates since 2007
So I didn’t have to go through WIki
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
MMAPayout
That site is woefully underutilized by people writing about the business aspect of MMA. Almost every business article I’ve seen written has been done better by MMAPayout. I believe in the topbar on their page they have a link to all of the PPVs since the TUF era.
The one thing you’ll notice is that the UFC is careful to stack the odds in their favor on every card, and almost no cards stands alone on the back of one particular fighter. You have to sort of abstract the buyrates because it’s almost never Anderson Silva and a bunch of lower tier fighters…they typically have a clear main and co-main that are designed to bring in different portions of the audience, as well as a card that is designed to bring in a lot of local fans and add interest from the sporting crowd.
It’s brilliant, honestly, and people don’t give the matchmakers enough credit for consistently building strong cards top to bottom.
Except UFC 116, 115, 114
were built on the backs of one (or two in the case of 114) fighter.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Perfect examples of planning in action
114 was supposed to include Forrest Griffin vs. Lil Nog, but when Forrest got hurt, they soldiered on with a replacement and the card sold on Rampage-Rashad as well as Bisping and Diego (who both have solid fanbases that are very different)
115 was supposed to be Liddell-Ortiz, Ortiz got swapped with Franklin, Alves-Fitch got pulled from the card and it went off with Liddell, Franklin and CroCop to anchor it.
116 lost Wanderlei Silva in the co-main event and replaced him with Chris Leben, lost Kongo vs. Nelson (both well known HWs), lost Sakara vs. Marquardt
Almost every event has a solid main event, a solid undercard event that typically appeals to a different portion of the fanbase, a contender eliminator or two and some up and comer fights. Barring extreme circumstances like 106 they rarely end up without several popular fighters on the same card, and it’s impressively good matchmaking and event planning.
If a lot of internet warriors had their way, there’d be 2 PPVs a year and they’d both be 5 title fights.
Sorry brother
Diego abd Bisping do not have “solid” fanbases unless you mean “Hey, I know that guy.” They aren’t “Hey, It’s THAT GUY, let’s buy”. UFC 114 was on the backs of 2 people.
115 was off the strength of Liddell and Franklin (not a draw) and Crocop (not a draw)
116 was Lesnar (and to a lesser extent Carwin). Not Lebel. No one else had ever been a main or co-main event.
Those three PPV (and I don’t care what the circumstances are) were built off 2 draws or less.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
It's basically impossible ever get it perfect
you have the unavoidable problem of statistical entanglement. Who is causing what. It’s like in the NFL where you cannot untangle a QB’s stats from a WR’s stats. Did the greatness of the WR cause his great stats or was it the QB who made him look good? Or were they both average and the O-line made them look good?
With guys like Penn, Silva, and many others who have fought on cards with other champs, it’s next to impossible to declare who was really responsible for the buys.
Jeremiah Johnson, Cageside Seats
Follow me @J_JohnsonMMA
by Jeremiah Johnson. on Sep 9, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
If you took the events in sequence you could diminish the buyrate based on the previous performance of the others on the card. Doing this correctly might remove the synergy you get in sales by packaging a lot of great fights in one card.
Far from perfect but that’s one idea.
Also, let the numbers decide who to include. Truck showed that Mir belonged on the list if the listing was created fairly.
Agreed on Mir
Yahoo’s list is kind of subjective, but if you look at MMAPayout’s other articles, Mir is always listed among the top draws.
What are the flaws??
I am ok with criticism but at least offer a suggestion for improvement.
There are tons more factors that affect buyrate
Also using the “average” in things like this with such wide variance provides skewed numbers.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Also, just going through your data
It seems like you have some bad data.
You list Ortiz/Machida as the main for UFC 84. It’s not. It’s wasn’t even 2nd billing match. That was Silva/Jardine. So Machida gets credited for that buyrate even though he wasn’t a) a draw at that point and b) in the top two matches.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 9, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Talk about flaws...
First I didn’t use any averages… I used total buys.
Second I am thinking you meant this to be a reply to Kid Nate somewhere as I also did not mention or list Ortiz/Machida anywhere.
Also
Most of the factors that affect buyrate effect boxing in the same way so Floyd vs Brock total pay per view buys is fairly accurate.
Oh see we're talking about two different things LOL (see below)
I agree. Total buys is the way to go.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 10, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I said "the methodology is flawed"
You said “What are it’s flaws, I’m open to criticism”
I said " There are tons more factors that affect buyrate
Also using the "average" in things like this with such wide variance provides skewed numbers"
I assumed that you were involved with MMAPayout because you said you were open to criticism.
/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 10, 2010 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions
When I was at the Memorial Day Weekend UFC Fan Expo in Vegas...
I met a group of like 8 girls who flew down there from Canada just to meet GSP. He wasn’t even fighting on the UFC 114 card and had female fans flying out to see him. That’s insane.
Funny to think...
I met GSP at a signing they did inside of a Wal-Mart here in SoCal. I got a free UFC shirt for being one of the first people in line, I was like 30 minutes early.
Last year Vitor Belfort was in a K-Mart and the line went through the entire store and out the door.
Just looking at the comments here you can pretty much get a sens of who the biggest draw are
I’ve bought (almost) every UFCs since I’ve started following it so I’m kind of the baseline.
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