Judo Chop: Little Nog and Brilz Round 2, the Turkish Ride
In the first installment of this series, we looked at round 1o f Antonio Rogerio "Little Nog" Nogueira's UFC 114 fight with Jason Brilz. We focused on the two instances where Nog attempted a sweep from deep half guard. One time, Brilz stuffed the attempt and transitioned into a front headlock. The second time Nog escaped out the back and quickly took Brilz down from back control.
In this chapter, we'll look at round 2, the high water mark for Jason Brilz.
Once again the fight centered on the half-guard position with Brilz on top. Half guard is what BJJ practicioners call the position, but many wrestlers call it the Turk.
K.J. Gould elaborates:
A Turk / Turkish ride is a cross-body (side mount) & leg ride where you trap their nearest leg with your leg, sometimes in a figure-four but not necessarily. It's known as Turk'ing the leg.
When a BJJ guy pulls half-guard they're putting themselves in this position.
As the name suggests, it was a technique invented / popularised by Turkish wrestlers.
There's a similar ride from the back known as a Navy Ride which also traps the leg and was popularised by the US Navy Wrestling team in I think the 1940's.
He also recommends Josh Barnett's Punishing Rides instructional DVD as a way to learn more about the Turkish RIde.
I also checked in with Rami Genauer of Fight Metric, the official stats provider to the UFC, about the fight and why they scored it for Jason Brilz. Here's Rami, via email:
I think my observation is generally that the Effectiveness Score model doesn't particularly like the way the Nogueira brothers fight. A lot of it has to do with their willingness to sacrifice position and get hit in the face to achieve other aims. It pays off when you get the KO or submission, but puts you in a much worse spot if things go to decision.
I imagine the half guard thing as equivalent to an intentional walk in baseball; you're allowing a guy to advance because you want to setup a play more advantageous to you. But because MMA fighters can't raise their arm indicating that they are willingly sacrificing position, we have to go by what we see. It reminds me of this apocryphal story about Greg Maddux:
"Others may be as much myth as fact. In one, Maddux is facing Jeff Bagwell and the Houston Astros late in an early-season game, and Maddux is tossing a shutout. Bagwell, recall broke up Maddux's early career bid for a no-hitter with a solo homer in the bottom of the eight.
In this, one of many rematches, Maddux "repeatedly shook off catcher Eddie Perez's signs and threw Bagwell an inside fastball which they both knew was his favorite pitch. Bagwell clocked it for a home run and angry Perez confronted Maddux in the clubhouse asking him why he would throw that pitch.
Maddux explained that sometime later that season he would face Bagwell in a more important situation and he would be expecting that pitch. Perez was still annoyed that he had "blown" a shutout. Towards the end of that season, the Braves did indeed play an important game against the Astros and Maddux struck Bagwell out late in the game with the bases loaded."
In that case (although it didn't really happen), Bagwell gets credit for a HR and Maddux gets his ERA dinged, even if it was "intentional." The stats don't show it, but the great ones always have a way of turning negatives into positives.
In the full entry K.J. will break down the action with a little help from Luke Thomas and we'll also look at a Frank Mir training video where he talks about how Brock Lesnar's use of the Turk beat him at UFC 100 and an excerpt from Nogueira's twin brother Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira's book Mastering Mixed Martial Arts: The Guard (reprinted with permission from the publisher) on how to get underhook control from half guard. We'll also look at a gif of the final punching exchange in the round. It's not technically accomplished like the grappling, but it's fun.
Gifs by Chris Nelson.
Here's K.J. Gould of Cage Side Seats breaking down the action:
Here we see Brilz try a high single-leg takedown with his head on the outside of Nog's right leg. Brilz tries to sweep Nog's left leg with his right shin but it looks like the momentum is already in place and Nog is content to pull half guard and maintain an arm-in guillotine. Nog could absolutely have gone for that neck crank but his half guard would have to have been tighter, he would have had to take his right arm off Brilz head and get a deep underhook and then give up his overhook on the other side and quickly gable grip his other arm and keep everything tight. Pretty difficult to do once you're already on the ground and the opponent is already trying to posture up.
Nogueira was actually far more secure going for an arm-in guillotine as opposed to a regular one, as it's essentially the same as an arm-in headlock (which as the Matt Hughes Judo Chop explains is a great control point). This actually leaves Brilz with far less options. The safest option would be to abandon the single-leg on the left leg and try to single-leg on the right leg potentially getting a takedown into side control where Nog no longer has leverage to choke. Failing side control, even if Nog pulls half-guard, because it's now the leg that's the same side as Brilz head there's still little leverage and Brilz would have been in less danger.
Brilz postures up with his hand and legs to alleviate the choke giving him enough time to pop his head out. No real technique there, just forcing his head out before he goes out! Nog could have been more successful had he switched the position of his legs so his outside leg was across Brilz leg, and trying to bring his inside leg to at least a butterfly / inside-hook position before transitioning to either full butterfly where he could possibly get an elevator sweep (also found in wrestling) or a form of full guard to try and choke out Brilz.
I just wanted to interject that this was the critical mistake of the fight on Little Nog's part. On rewatching the fight, I was astonished to see a fighter as experienced and cage savvy as Nogueira put so much energy into a choke attempt from a poor position.
That ill-advised energy expenditure haunted him throughout the rest of the second round. In the third it came back to haunt him even worse when he had an opportunity to sink a Brabo choke but lacked the arm strength to go for the kill.
After Nog abandoned the guillotine attempt, it took him another 15 seconds or so to escape from bottom position and get top control. Back to K.J.:
Nog works the deep half guard pretty well here using it to get out from under Brilz but maintain control of his right leg to spin around and take Brilz down.
I asked Luke Thomas to look at this gif and he commented:
Very impressive sweep. That is years of mat time right there. First Nog gets perpendicular to Brilz and uses his legs to get Brilz' right leg moving forward -- breaking his base. But to really get Brilz' leg moving he's going counter clockwise. Then he hooks his right arm underneath Brilz' right thigh and pulls it forward some more, even bridging up for more leverage. Then he switches his hip from his left hip on the ground to the right. That creates the space he needs to roll over and get up to his knees. Brilz posts his right hand back on the mat to stay up but Nog shoots forward and drives Brilz to his back, using his right hand to block Brilz' left leg. It's similar to a knee tap.
Unfortunately for Nog, he also left his neck exposed when he took Brilz down and once again, Brilz counters a sweep with a choke attempt. He used that choke to roll Nogueira back over . Advantage Brilz.
Now back to K.J. Gould who picks up the action with Brilz once again on top in half guard, still holding the choke with one arm:
This is a pretty common control position from wrestling even if you're in their half guard. For some wrestlers this can be beneficial as it allows them to do what's known as a Turk / Turkish Ride. A good wrestler in this position can make a half-guard work against a BJJ guy if the wrestler on top can get more perpendicular with the guy on bottom.
It's why you often see Randy Couture Ground'n'Pound from here and why we saw Brock Lesnar content to work from Frank Mir's half guard, but stand up when he nearly ended up in Mir's full guard in their second fight. Brilz could have tried to work a Stockade like Lesnar if for nothing else then to make it even more difficult for Nog to roll and try the sweep. As it is Brilz is content to lower his hips (like in a sprawl) and ride it out. Also notice he's using a headlock to stop Nog getting deeper. He's essentially separating his head from his arm and putting his head and body out of natural alignment. It's also helping him to remain perpendicular and coupled with the Turk ride makes for an effective deep half-guard neutraliser.
This is kind of interesting as Nog slips an arm inside which could have given Brilz an opportunity for a Billy Robinson style neck crank had he known how to do it. The headlock control with the Turk ride was enough to control though.
There's a point in the third round where Brilz had poor head position on a single leg and Nog had an opportunity for a neck crank that he missed. We'll talk about that next time. Back to the fight.
But Brilz could only keep Nog down for so long, only a few seconds later he's gotten out of position and Nog strikes. Take it away K.J.:
Here Brilz' base is too high which is why Nog got the sweep. You see Brilz try to sprawl back at the last second but it's too late, and he's become more parallel with Nog (rather than perpendicular as I mentioned earlier). Brilz is also trying to jump out of Nog's half guard but he's already turning and gives up side control as a result.
But once Nogueira succeeded in getting the fight to the feet, where his vaunted amateur boxing experience should have given him the edge, Brilz managed to outscore Nogueira with punches. Landing the most damaging blows of the entire fight and putting the icing on the cake to win the second round.
Tomorrow we'll look at Round 3, Nogueira strikes back.
Here's a video of Frank Mir talking about the drawbacks of holding a closed half guard in MMA, and how he found out Brock used a Turk Ride against him.
Here's a good wrestling video talking about the Turkish Ride and how it can be used to roll your opponent:
Here's an excerpt from Nog's twin brother's book talking about one way to get the underhook when you're on the bottom in half guard. As we've seen, that underhook is the key to executing the sweeps that bedeviled Brilz.
If you're interested in understanding how the bottom half-guard can become an offensive position, Nogueira's book is literally THE book on that topic for MMA.
From Mastering Mixed Martial Arts: The Guard (reprinted with permission from the publisher):
Securing Underhook Control (option 1)
As I have mentioned, creating space and turning on your side gives you a couple of options from the bottom half-guard position. You can execute an attack from the cross-face and hip block position, which I will cover later in the book or you can work to secure an underhook. The latter is often harder than it sounds. Your opponent's goal from the top half-guard position is to keep your shoulders pinned to the mat and either pepper you with strikes or pass your guard into a more dominant position such as side control or mount, and the easiest way for him to achieve both is to maintain a far-side underhook. If you steal it away from him, expect him to fight tooth and nail to get it back. For this reason, you must transition through the steps quickly. The instant you get up to your side, immediately secure an underhook and either transition to your opponent's back or reverse your positioning by executing a sweep. I demonstrate how to apply both types of attacks later in this section, but first it is important that you become a master at securing the underhook. It's the gateway to your offense from the half guard.
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That is my favorite jujitsu book
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Sep 23, 2010 4:08 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
is now
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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 23, 2010 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The real detail I think people are overlooking from Brilz:
He used the whizzer grip to great effect in the first round to keep from getting swept. Between basing on his head and pulling hard on the arm, he was able to keep from getting spilled over the other side. Watch how every time Nog got the underhook, he counters with the overhook.
His biggest mistake is, after the first round, when he realized he was doing well, he started giving up control in order to deliver a strike here or there. He got cocky and overagressive, and that’s why he started getting swept. C’mon, you don’t jump around when you think there’s an opening to pass a Nog guard.
explain that, you lost me. I know the two basic ways to stuff that deep half sweep are to get an overhook and get head control so he can’t dive underneath you.is that what you mean?
its more prominent in the first round, when Brilz is staying on top and not getting swept. Nog gets an underhook, and Brilz gets the overhook on tight. When Nog goes to sweep, he can’t spill Brilz over because Brilz is using that overhook on Nog’s arm to stay low and centered.
You see him also take the other arm and wrap underneath Nog’s head to keep him from getting underneath, but he didnt use it all the time.
When Brilz was using that tight overhook, he wasn’t getting swept. When he stopped controlling so much and started trying a little GnP, he got rolled.
Sure, but the over hook is part and parcel of the arm-in headlock control :)
Now what the heck did you say? I don’t speak Catch. :)
What I meant was an arm-in headlock is virtually the same as an arm-in guillotine in terms of arm positioning and I thought that was what you were referring to.
Also getting that over-hook when someone under-hooks you from half guard is pretty common even in BJJ to stop them going to your back. I think the head control was more important, especially in the deep-half guard as it stopped Nog getting his arm deeper between Brilz legs so he could get under his hips disrupting his base and getting a sweep or takedown attempt depending on what he’s after.
See, he totally loses head control, but Brilz still uses the overhook while basing out on the head and totally smashes Nog’s sweep. Sorry, the GIFs are in the first Judo Chop.
You’ll also notice while he was based up and surfing on Nog later in the first, he was first controlling Nog’s hips by hooking his knee with a free arm. When he goes to GnP, he lets this go and Nog is free to turn on his side and take the backdoor.
You’ll also notice while he was based up and surfing on Nog later in the first, he was first controlling Nog’s hips by hooking his knee with a free arm.
I don’t think we covered that in the first part, but that sounds like a cradle, another staple from wrestling :)
Yeah, hooking the far leg either in an over or under hook type grip is cradling. In wrestling it tended to be used to stop them turning away to go turtle as this was defensive strategy to stop being pinned. But it can also flatten the hips if they try to turn into you like a BJJ guy would. Don’t tend to see it done form half gaurd though, usually just side-control.
The cradle is a great half guard pass in bjj. You get the cradle, get head control, then turn towards their feet with your shoulders and lay your hip on their stomach.
Everybody think you have a bad base when you do that, so they try to explode up and roll you off. BUT they have to open their legs to do that. You swing that trapped leg far out to post, then use the arm in the cradle to shove their knee back down.
If that doesn’t make sense, I can try and find video of it tonight.
by judonerd on Sep 23, 2010 5:24 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I watched the fight on Unleashed last night for the first time I was sober
And Nog won that fight pretty clearly I think
Drink to remember, drink to forget.
by doonerthesooner on Sep 23, 2010 4:17 PM EDT reply actions
I agree I thought he won the fight from the beginning.
If Brilz had gone after him at the end of the second round when he had Nog shook he probably would have finished the fight. After he landed that right hook to the temple Brilz was content to smile at him for the last 30 seconds of the round. I wonder if the judges took that into account.
Well, if you look at the fight as a whole, Nogueira definitely won by attempting to finish the fight more often. Brilz controlled him a little better, but other than the one guillotine (which was, I have to admit, pretty tight), he didn’t do anything to him. Also, I’m not sure what was wrong with Nogueira at the end of the second round, but Brilz may or may not have hurt him.
"There's this image that you have, this interior image of something that's absolutely perfect, and that's your signpost, your guide. And you'll never get there. But without it you'll never get anywhere."
I guess I should watch it again too.
Though I’m pretty sure I was sober on that one and still had Brilz winning the fight. Fightmetric showed the fight going to Brilz. But on the 10 point must system it was a draw. I’m still saying Brilz won that fight. Fightmetric also shows Brilz winning in the striking and grappling department.
Also Fightmetric showed Brilz going for 3 sub attempts and Lil Nog 1. So the comment below about Lil Nog attempting to finish the fight more often might need to be reevaluated.
And also if you had Shogun winning the first fight against Lyoto remember Fightmetric was on your side. So don’t start dissing the stats because they don’t reflect your opinion.
Nate, forgive me, I have no idea why I forgot this but if anyone wants to know more about the Turk or other rides check out Josh Barnett’s “Punishing Rides” instructional.
good stuff
as good of a grappling match this was.
it has alot of faults. Too many.
Nog shoulda, coulda, woulda.
Brilz ditto…
Perhaps the mutual respect made both of them nervous?
A la Pat Berry v Cro Cop?
Jackie Treehorn treats his objects like women, man.
I scored Lil Nog/Brilz last night
Here’s how I did it:
Round 1 – Nog wins the first 2 minutes standing up, including landing a solid knee to the body. Brilz takes the next 2 minutes with his positional grappling + takedown. Nog wins the final minute standing and takes the round 10-9.
Round 2 – You are blind if you gave Nog this round. 10-9 Brilz
Round 3 – I think Brilz had 3-4 takedown attempts and they were either stuffed or he completed the takedown and got swept by Nog. Lil Nog also had him in the crucifix position and landed 2 hammerfists before Brilz escaped. Brilz also didn’t do much standing up so it was a clear 10-9 Nog and 29-28 on my scorecard.
Basically the controversy at hand is round 1. If you scored round 1 for Lil Nog then you thought Lil Nog won, likewise for Brilz. I thought Rogerio had much better striking, landed crisper shots, and Brilz didn’t do enough on the ground in said 2 minute span to warrant winning the round.
Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.
I tried to focus on the takedowns
And basically I wanted to see what Brilz did with his takedowns and outside of Brilz regaining top position in the 1st and the very tight guillotine attempt in the 2nd Nog just brushed him aside.
Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.
the first round is the one that decides the fight because it's the closest
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This is probably right
Really? Didn’t you just explain to me that they judge each round separately? Didn’t the guy who won win the first and third rounds?
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions
That wasn't the post I wrote
So I don’t know what to tell you—I may try to rewrite it later.
It just deleted almost all of the post except some random sentence which only makes any sense in context.
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll try again.
Really? Didn’t you just explain to me that they judge each round separately? Didn’t the guy who won win the first and third rounds?
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Holy crap it did it again!
what is going on with the site?
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions
God Damn you Bloody Elbow
Now I’m going to try again, just because I’m pissed.
Here is what the post was supposed to say, assuming this one gets posted properly.
This UFC event was the first one I ever took one of my friends to, and I was pretty disappointed with it. I assumed she would be too, but she absolutely loved it. She still talks about the event, but mostly about the Nog/Brilz fight.
The fight really had a lot of tension and excitement in it, and if I hadn’t known who the two fighters were, I might have enjoyed it more myself. Anyway, after the fight was over I turned to her and told her that I thought the judges had made a bad decision.
Then she said (and this is the only part of my original post that got posted):
Really? Didn’t you just explain to me that they judge each round separately? Didn’t the guy who won win the first and third rounds?
There was more to the post but I just wanted to explain what that sentence related to. Hopefully this time the site won’t make a weird edit to what I write.
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Now that seems right.
Hey I know, maybe I’ll just create a whole thread of me replying to myself like a retard with totally incomprehensible quotes.
That’d be fun!
Oh well, it’s the internet.
by Lauren J Darkbloom on Sep 23, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I rewatched the fight yesterday as well. I scored it 29-28 Nog just as you did, and did the same last night.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
something to note--
Failing side control, even if Nog pulls half-guard, because it’s now the leg that’s the same side as Brilz head there’s still little leverage and Brilz would have been in less danger.
As in his head position on Nog, since the switching of legs means he would have a head inside single-leg takedown attempt.
no worries.
glad you’re taking the time out to do this. good to hear from another sub-grappler with a wrestling base.
^hmm my comment cut off
this is actually not the case. in half guard guillotines it is preferable to have the head on the same side of the body/free leg. matt hughes and jeremy horn calls this “keeping him in the pocket” or something similar. the reasoning behind this is that the only direction that opponent can rotate in is away from you, thus tightening up the choke. if the head is on the opposite side as the body/free leg, the only direction that the opponent can rotate is toward you, thus loosening the choke and making it fairly easy to pass to side control. an example of this poor technique is sokoudjou’s guillotine attempt against machida; an example of the correct technique is any of faber’s guillotines.
Great judo chop again!
Got the Summer hatin on me cus I'm hotter than the sun. Got the Spring hatin on me cus I ain't never sprung. Winter hatin on me cus I'm colder than ya'll; and I will never I will never I will never Fall.
The mat is my church, the ground is my heaven, Jiu-Jitsu is my religion. And once you hit the ground you're in my world. My world is like the ocean, I’m like a shark and most people don't even know how to swim - Draculino
thanks!
please add any commentary to this one to fill in any gaps that I missed
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LOVE THE CHOPS!!! THANKS! This series is so helpful and well done…
What's this war in the heart of nature? Why does nature vie with itself? The land contend with the sea? Is there an avenging power in nature? Not one power, but two?
by Kwisatz Haderach on Sep 23, 2010 5:20 PM EDT reply actions
The Whizzer
Forgive me if this is too noob. I’m stil unsure as to what, exactly, the Whizzer is. I hear it constantly but I’m never seeming to spot it for what it is. Any gifs out there that could illustrate?
"Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong." - Dennis Miller
it's just an overhook
here’s from wikipedia:
An overhook, also called a whizzer, is a clinch hold that is used to control the opponent. An overhook is performed from any direction by putting an arm over the opponent’s arm, and encircling the opponents arm or upper body. Having an overhook with one arm is called a single overhook, while having overhooks with both arms is known as double overhooks. Overhooks are typically employed in response to underhooks by an opponent.
here’s an image:

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It’s a bit more than an over-hook. From the over-hook to get a whizzer you want to drive and focus your weight into their shoulder through their armpit. Like a lot of Catch Wrestling it was cleaned up for Olympic (and subsequently scholastic) wrestling, but in it’s original form you could face plant someone with it from standing and possibly tear their shoulder. Once on the ground you can go the back, or turn them over with a quarter-nelson.
In fairness though, the term “whizzer” often gets applied whenever someone does something aggressive with an overhook.
For some reason though, I’ve always most closely associated the term with using it to fight off a single leg, and turn the tide. I can’t find a great example, but the best I can do is the setup at the beginning of this seacost catch wrestling vid. For djganesh, the gripping your own leg with the whizzer arm at the beginning is a nice variation. Long armed cradle lovers get a fee bonus at the end.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_pIiJiz-vE
Calling it the "Turkish leg-hump"
might not improve the standing of grappling in MMA. But I like it.
Again you’ve got to think about the sport of wrestling. The ride originally was a way to stop them going to their knees, as in wrestling you give up your back because a) it stops you being pinned and b) there’s no chokes in the wrestling we’re familiar with. So you would ride while they’re trying to turn to stop both their shoulders touching the mat. There are certain things to try in sub grappling or MMA from either half guard or deep half guard to transition from a riding position into a more attacking (subbing or striking) but it requires experimentation and refining.
No but it seems like a fantastic idea in bed.
Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.
He's fighting Matyushenko at UFC 122
Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.
oh I knew that
that should be a good scrap. Brilz might just send Vladdy packing.
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No it's not Luis Cane..
It’s Liu Kang!
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"Of course, that's just my opinion, I could be wrong." - Dennis Miller

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