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The Latest on Chael Sonnen, Dana White, Steroids and the UFC

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UPDATE: Chael Sonnen's camp has responded to the test results, via Ariel Helwani:

In an MMA Fighting exclusive, Sonnen's manager, Mike Roberts, wrote that Sonnen will appeal the California State Athletic Commission's claim that he tested positive for "abnormally high" levels of testosterone and that Sonnen will break his silence on the matter in the coming days.

...

"It is our policy not to comment on pending actions by the Athletic Commission. Chael is consulting with his legal advisors and physicians and will have a statement in the near future. Chael will file and appeal with the CSAC and looks forward to working with the Commission to resolve this matter."

Now that we've gotten the news from the CSAC, the commenters are buzzing about Chael Sonnen. Here's some highlights.

The big dog is ESPN radio personality Jim Rome. Full audio of his segment on Sonnen is in the full entry, but here's Steve Cofield talking about it:

Monday's Jim Rome show was another example of "be careful what you wish for MMA" when it comes to media coverage. Now that more media big boys are on board, they'll often latch onto the negative stories before the positive ones. It was a bit shocking to hear the national radio host talking MMA on a Monday that didn't follow a fight card weekend but the Chael Sonnen saga was simply too good for Rome to pass up.
...
Rome did bring up a good point. In the end, are there really any long range repercussions for the sport? Will Sonnen getting nabbed scare anybody? Rome says no, because the penalties can never match the potential windfall from taking PED's, winning and moving up the rankings.

Rome also found time to play some drops (5:45 mark) from Sonnen's Q & A last week at Ultimate Fight Night 22. Sonnen said he'd like to stab Brock Lesnar (video - 5:25 mark). At least he's got no worries about any disciplinary action for that stupid comment, Sonnen more than overshadowed it with his positive test.

Ufc_117_button_medium

Star-divide

Geno Mrosko has a key insight about Dana White's initial comments on the Sonnen matter in which he defended the fighters and argued that it would be cruel to punish them beyond the sanctions the athletic commissions hand out:

Here is the key part of what he said. "Take away their ability to make a living...". Remember, he's a promoter and he's trying to work you. We won't let him though. He doesn't mean take away THEIR ability to make a living; he means take away HIS ability to make a living. That's what the real issue is here, at least for him. Whatever threatens his business, and in turn his money, must be dealt with and spun into something harmless.

There are many in the media that want the UFC to step up testing. There is really only one reason for Dana and company not too; money. He'll spin it all he can that the commissions already do it and they do a good job of it but we know that isn't true. They do drug tests on the same day as the event. From what I can tell, through research, they don't ever do it any other time. That means the testing in place for the UFC is the easiest to beat of any of the major sports. That right there is enough to encourage fighters to use. If they know when they are going to be tested then they know when to cycle. Which means you might as well not test at all.

S.C. Michaelson points out that Dana White and the UFC have lost the most from Sonnen's failed test:

The biggest losers besides Sonnen himself are Dana White and the UFC. First, in Sonnen they had a brand-new star when they haven't been able to create many new ones. Sonnen is the type of fighter that not only can build himself up, but also, within the context of building up a fight, generate a buzz for his opponent, giving them a "rub" (transferrence of support). In a division such as the MW division (which has been plagued with "middle sister" syndrome),. the "Jan Brady" of the UFC, that type of fighter is key. While a fighter such as Michael Bisping is a household name, he isn't a draw, but a fight between he and Sonnen would have drawing potential because of the back-and-forth that would take place.

Monetarily, the UFC loses big. The Silva-Sonnen rematch had a lot of buzz coming out of the fight. Though Sonnen had talked up the fight a lot, leading into it no one thought Sonnen would do what he said he was going to do. He controlled dominated Anderson Silva for the better part of five rounds before being choked out. It was the first time the once-thought unbeatable Silva looked to be in any serious danger in his UFC career. Many chose not to give Silva the credit for the submission and labeled it a "lucky sub" and assured that Sonnen would finish (get the decision) the job in a rematch. While early numbers (a million buys) turned out to be excessively high, the actual number (600K buys) was still a good number and among the top 3 buys featuring Anderson Silva. Despite the decisive finish, UFC President Dana White saw the potential money and decided to make the rematch for some time in 2011 after Silva had healed from a rib injury sustained before the fight. It was expected that the rematch would have an even bigger buyrate than the UFC 117 contest.

The UFC also loses because another one of their stars is caught up in a PED scandal. I would say that this is the biggest star to date that they have had fail a test (yes, even bigger than UFC Heavyweight champions Josh Barnett and Tim Sylvia) as Sonnen's name was out there and was gaining a lot of press. The UFC dodged a similar bullet when UFC Heavyweight Shane Carwin was implicated in a federal steroid trial as having received copious amounts of illegal drugs. The key factors in that case were the lack of a failed test and the fact that the known drug transactions took place before Carwin had signed to the UFC. The failed test of Sonnen puts a spotlight on the biggest dirty secret in MMA, one that for the most part the UFC (and by proxy the MMA media) try not to address: Performance Enhancing Drugs. 

E. Spencer Kyte has some criticism for the CSAC:

The CSAC has a shaky reputation at best, pops more PEDs users than any other jurisdiction and hasn't come forward with any real specifics about the situation. In fact, letting Sherdog know at the Shane Mosley / Sergio Mora bout on Saturday night is kind of an unprofessional way to break the news if you ask me.

I want the CSAC to specify what banned substance Sonnen tested positive for and when the results from his "B" sample will be ready. False positives happen from time to time and what he popped hot for will factor into forming the narrative coming away from this situation. One of the name brand performance enhancers is a lot different than ingredient 367 from an over-the-counter cold medicine that happens to present like stanozolol.

Jamie Penick has more questions for the CSAC:

My next question is: did Sonnen test positive for whatever he supposedly informed the commission he was taking? Because with all of the talk of the flu medication and him being sick the week up to the fight, I can see him saying that the medication could cause the positive result; but that's not necessarily what did set the tests off. At the same time, if he said something, and then didn't put it on his pre-fight questionnaire, I don't understand how the commission lets that fight go on in the first place. If you have a guy who is going to fail his drug screening and he tells you as much, how do you let him in the cage? If that positive result leads to a one year suspension, I just don't get how they let him step in the cage in Oakland, then. It's another interesting wrinkle to this story.

On the other hand, Zak Woods points out the CSAC has the best record among commissions for catching fighters using banned substances.

Dr. Johnny Benjamin addresses various theories as to what might have caused Sonnen to fail the test:

Internet conspiracy theories abound and include - but are not limited to - tainted nutritional supplements, workout regimen, naturally occurring increased levels of testosterone in some people, lab error, CSAC conspiracy or mismanagement, etc.
...
I've written extensively about the potential issues regarding the lightly regulated arena of nutritional supplements and functional foods. Simply put: It's difficult to be certain of what you're really getting since no one is effectively or consistently ensuring or evaluating product integrity.
...
Some people do have naturally occurring increased testosterone levels as compared to the standards. But if this is a factor, why were these "naturally occurring increased levels" not detected during Sonnen's tests at UFC 104 or UFC 109, which he passed?

Could this all be due to lab error? Possible, but not likely. The lab in question is the UCLA's Olympic Analytic Lab used by the U.S. and World Anti-Doping agencies. They test both an A and B sample just to check themselves. They happen to be more than 99 percent accurate. I'm no statistician, but I know that to be better than 99 percent accurate twice is no small feat. This is no similar home test or one that you purchased at your local health-food store. This lab is the best of the best.

And my personal favorite? This is all a CSAC conspiracy or mismanagement. I have been critical of past CSAC shenanigans, but there is nothing to suggest that in some way the commission intervened in this process or has any real interest in the outcome of any particular fighter's drug screen. What's in it for CSAC officials? What's their motivation?

The bottom line is that Chael Sonnen failed a highly accurate test evaluated by an impeccable laboratory.

And Ben Fowlkes discusses the way Sonnen's antics have damaged his credibility and limited his PR options:

Chael Sonnen isn't most fighters. He likes to keep us guessing. When an apology or at least an explanation seems like the most rational course of action - remember when he claimed that Lance Armstrong gave himself cancer? - he instead opts for the completely implausible denial. When you think he's going to be as virulently obstinate as ever, such as after his loss to Anderson Silva at UFC 117, he throws you a curveball and acts like a dignified gentleman, declaring that the better man always wins.

So now that he's been branded a cheater by the California State Athletic Commission and the MMA world awaits his reaction, what path will he choose? Will he blame supplements or over-the-counter medication? Will he explain that he needed help pushing through an injury? Will he say he did it and he's not at all sorry? Will he blame some guy with a Hispanic accent?

We have yet to find out, but it's worth noting that in times like these it sure would be nice to have a reputation for something other than being the guy who's willing to say absolutely anything.

More Bloody Elbow coverage of Chael Sonnen’s positive test result:

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Jim Rome talking Chael Sonnen via Cage Writer:


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i hope im not being cheeky but cliffs?

"How you expect to run with the wolves come night when you spend all day sparring with the puppies" - Omar Little

by The Omaplatapus on Sep 21, 2010 12:59 PM EDT reply actions  

?

cliffs?

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Sep 21, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

cliff notes?

"How you expect to run with the wolves come night when you spend all day sparring with the puppies" - Omar Little

by The Omaplatapus on Sep 21, 2010 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

ah sure

that’s what this is

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Sep 21, 2010 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Geno’s point -

They do drug tests on the same day as the event. From what I can tell, through research, they don’t ever do it any other time

This isn’t true, is it? I thought a lot of commissions did their drug testing a couple weeks out, then did it post-fight again? CSAC is obviously different, but isn’t that standard Nevada procedure?

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 21, 2010 1:03 PM EDT reply actions  

I believe he’s talking specifically about the testing that the UFC itself does

by nastyem on Sep 21, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

he’s referring to when the UFC conducts the testing in such untamed wildernesses as Texas and the UK.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Sep 21, 2010 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ahh, okay. My bad.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 21, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

In texas they actually ask the commission to do it, and then they do it.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why does Sonnen get all this credit for creating hype?

When UFC 117 didn’t do significantly better than 112, 101, or 97.

And people assume the rematch will be HUGE – but didn’t everyone say that about the Machida/Rua rematch which supposedly sold only 20,000 more ppv’s.

I don’t get it.

by Rauce on Sep 21, 2010 1:10 PM EDT reply actions  

it did much better than 112

which aired in the afternoon in the US and dramatically increased the average PPV #’s for an Anderson Silva headlined fight. It had the hardcores ON FIRE judging from our traffic numbers and did very well on replays and delayed orders as well.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Sep 21, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well

Doesn’t that say more about Silva than Sonnen? An event that aired at 1pm had a buyrate of 500,000+ meanwhile from what I’ve read 117 did approximately 600,000. I don’t know if I’d consider that “much better.”

by Rauce on Sep 21, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Silva does around 300k when he’s not paired up with BJ Penn or some other popular fighter. After his UFC 112 fight, it was probably going to be even lower, if not for Chael.

"There's this image that you have, this interior image of something that's absolutely perfect, and that's your signpost, your guide. And you'll never get there. But without it you'll never get anywhere."

by crazybones on Sep 21, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anderson hasn’t carried a show on his own in 2 years, so it’s tough to guesstimate based on that.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 21, 2010 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Silva hasn't done "300K" in two years

since then he’s done a lot of good numbers. The business has changed so much since then. Sure he’s had other names on his cards, but who hasn’t besides Brock, GSP, and BJ. No one else carries a card by themselves.

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

People see what they want to see

Remember Alvarez altering his buy rate predictions up to 1 million just because he enjoyed the show?

by William Wilson on Sep 21, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

So true, so true.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shhhh, you have to follow the media narrative, Sonnen drew a million fans

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Damn, enough said after this statement.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can see him saying that the medication could cause the positive result

It seems people are still clinging to this hope. I doubt any flu medication will raise your testosterone levels above the normal range.

by William Wilson on Sep 21, 2010 1:11 PM EDT reply actions  

Who else would you trust?

(And I can’t tell you how much it pained me to write “Phil Baroni” and “best” in a sentence.)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's the best

guido

He should be on Jersey Shore

by ecost on Sep 21, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

People are freaking inventing excuses for Chael Sonnen.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

There's a LOT of reasons why this is happening

More than you know

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still don’t understand how this test result and the Barnett test result have been handled so differently by the commission.

I guess the commission wasn’t being pestered about the results for Barnett (because no one knew about the test) but they really would have been better off telling people over the weekend to wait until they were able to issue a statement on Monday or Tuesday, or even a no comment.

Lots of the issues that have spun out of this would have been stopped dead in the tracks if the commission would have waited until they knew all the facts and gave a complete statement.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 1:29 PM EDT reply actions  

Very well put.

You are right. As good of a talker as he can be at times, he probably won’t be able to talk his way out of this. Time heals everything though.

Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
CagesideSeats.com
Follow me on Twitter at GenoMrosko

by Geno Mrosko on Sep 21, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

. It all depends on how he handles it, but even Chael is a weird one because nobody believed him before this. Americans love to forgive stars. Mike Vick was the most hated human being on the planet 4 years ago and now he’s a comeback story

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Vick had to go to jail

And completely change his life. Sonnen has to take a year off of fighting. Its going to be hard for him to look that humble.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also

Vick just lost his starting job to Kevin Kolb. So I would argue that Vick never did recover and won’t ever.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Everybody that watches football thinks Vick should get the start except for Reid.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Reid does too.

It’s a “political” decision.

You get rid of McNabb to free up the starter position for your future starter and former first round pick to be able to start getting work in as the starter of your franchise. Not only that, but you trade him [McNabb] to your rival for peanuts.

Then, you start this guy and he looks mediocre at best.

You bring in former no. 1 pick and highest paid athlete in the NFL in 2006 to come in and lead your team forward and he does what many always knew he could do— succeed!

You start him the second week and he does even better than the 2 quarters you started him the prior week.

Now what do you do?

If you start Vick in week 3, you open up the flood gates of “why did you trade McNabb in the first place?” or “Is Kolb the future of this franchise?” You also setback his development and confidence as he will have lost his job in 1/2 a game of work.

The solution for Reid was NOT to had drafted Kolb back in 2007. With McNabb still looking like he could play the game and the team being a veteran team with some playoff runs left in the tank, why start looking for a franchise QB to replace one who was still highly capable?

I think REid fell out of love with McNabb and let his “preference” overtake his better football judgement.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 21, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

You would never think having a talented young quarterback on the bench could be such a pain in the ass. Just talk to the Chargers or the Packers about that.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yep!

Funny thing is, Steve Young sat behind Montana for years and never complained. It’s weird to see how that day has changed.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 21, 2010 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

that was before the salary cap

he got paid a ton to sit on the bench (relative to salaries then)

And, it was start for Tampa or sit on the bench for the 9ers.

by ecost on Sep 21, 2010 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Vick has incentives too. If he plays 51% of 8 games he gets “x” amount of dollars, 11 games “x” amount and 51% of 16 games he gets an extra 2. something mil.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

more importantly

he could get a starting job and perhaps long term contract someplace else next year

by ecost on Sep 21, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's why Vick was so gracious in saying he doesn't care how this plays out and it's Kolb's team.

He knows in the end— he will be starting somewhere else in 2011.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 21, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kolb wasn't a 1st round pick

/nitpick

CAGO WHY SOGS CAGO WHY SOGSSSS

by soxrule!35 on Sep 21, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Stand corrected! 2nd.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 22, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he will overcome this.

I think compaing him to Mike Vick is a bit different because even though many spoke out against Mike VIck and his actions…

… Many more felt that his actions doesn’t constitute him losing his job with the NFL.

What Sonnen did DIRECTLY affected his career and the brand he represents (UFC fighter).

The Athletic Commission tests typically have a lot of gray area, so I think he finds a “loop hole”.

I think Dana will give him a short leash though in fear of having him in his organization tarnishes the brand.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 21, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Man you crazy, certain folks was UPSET

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Trust, People still hate Michael Vick.
  • Chael Sonnen will recover from his EVEN if he is found guilty.
On another note, many NFL players will continue to drive drunk, slap their girlfriends or wives, resist arrest and be accused for rape or be falsely accused for rape. Either way it doesn’t matter, Michael Vick will still be one of most hated athletes in sports. ESPN recent produced a list.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

True, but...

… People will still pay top dollar to see them perform on any given day.

Amongst those listed on that Q-Score report that you speak of was:

Kobe Bryant
Lebron James
Terrell “Getcha popcorn ready!” Owens
Chad OchoCinco
… And Tiger Woods.

All essential to their sport in some way, shape, or form.

I think “dislike” is overrated and WWE has shown how a brand can use that to make money if the player/personality has talent. That’s why I think you are correct to say that Sonnen will recover from this and the UFC will be able to benefit from this new publicity.

Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p

by ChicagoMarine on Sep 21, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m wondering if ESPN will continue to show him love? Will he still be invited back to the post-show programs?

Will the UFC invite Sonnen back to the Q&A session before PPV’s or Fight Nights? That remains to be seen. I’m almost sure that Sonnen has the full support of the UFC brass.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Of course he has the full support of the UFC, he (alleged to be) a money machine

The media supports him because the UFC does and he’s good copy

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Two of the most hated people in sports right now are Kobe And LeBron. Neither have a record.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well that's a little misleading

Considering a bunch of the Kobe hate stems from a fucking rape allegation.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

How is that misleading? I said niether have a record. Big Ben got a free pass on his first allegation and his girl didn’t have 7 different men’s love juice in her.
Allegations don’t = hate. Look at Ray Lewis.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

But Lakers = hate in a lot of places.

by Rufford on Sep 21, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yo, I guess you did not get the memo.
You’re supposed to forget about Big Ben just like ESPN and SI did.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he can overcome this image wise, people tend to forget things with time (specially casual fans), and between the hardcores, people’s dislike towards Silva and whatever defense Chael gives, I think many people will be persuaded into buying his side of the story, no matter how much BS it is.

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

People seem pretty pissed off.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

for now :p

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

People on the internet are pissed off.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

So far

They are the only ones who know.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

and they are the only one’s who will know. Look at Shawne Merriman and all the other football players. Look at the people that still defend Barnett. People only get their panties in a bunch if it’s a baseball player. Shit, Margarito is still the best non-Mayweather fight for Manny, and loaded gloves is much worse than steroids.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shawne Merriman still takes shit man

His star power has faded tons.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s mostly because of his play. He didn’t put up half the numbers after he got popped.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gee, I wonder why.

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Sep 21, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I blame it on Tila Tequila

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm not complaining

I’m a Raiders fan. Stupid lights-out dance.

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Sep 21, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

That's rough man

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

No wonder you’re always angry ;)
(I’ve been a Saints fan all my life…I’ve been thier)

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hah!

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Sep 21, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

yea because who the fuck watches Jim Rome is Burning?

by MrTechnique420 on Sep 21, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is our policy not to comment on pending actions by the Athletic Commission. Chael is consulting with his legal advisors and physicians and will have a statement in the near future.

I think if anyone can get out of a situation like this, it’s Sonnen. The political background helps and history has shown that admitting to use will get you more of a penalty than fighting it. (Or at least yelling and screaming non-sense…James Toney)

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 1:45 PM EDT reply actions  

Chael's political background is overstated

He ran for office one time. So did Lindland, and he’s not exactly known for his media control.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

and he won unopposed lol

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

With 99.6% of the vote!

Suck it, “Who cares” and “Mickey Mouse!”

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

lol

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uh, I think it was a primary.

Though my sarcasm detector may be malfunctioning.

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Sep 21, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's broken :p

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thank you for being gentile

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Sep 21, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

As opposed to being Jewish?

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

lol

to be fair, I am a heathen :p

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 5:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

“It’s going to be a one sided beatdown and im swinging the needle, errr I mean hammer.”

by liveordiemanhonk on Sep 21, 2010 1:47 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

It’s worth noting, even at the Olympic level, there have been issues with their testing although that tends to be more with the ‘natural’ steroids like nandrolone and the CSAC has said it’s not a natural steroid. Of course with the way the news keeps changing, we might find out they meant it wasn’t a ‘natural level’.

There was a famous case of an Iron Man competitor who, as it turns out, was found guilty because of a typographical error. Not only that but the Doctor who was meant to representing the opposing party ended up joining the side of the athlete, pointed out the typographical error and then claimed in his expert opinion the actual result of 14 nanograms of nandrolone was achieved naturally . 2 nanograms higher then Sean Sherk’s positive test result.

By far the biggest issue is testing is a science of estimates, not absolutes.

by KJ Gould on Sep 21, 2010 1:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Hilarious that he will appeal...

when he admitted to the CSAC pre-fight that he had used PEDs.

For the “he didn’t admit it” folks that are sure to come:

Sonnen, 33, of West Linn, Ore., was apparently concerned enough about the possibility that he would render a positive test that he told CSAC executive director George Dodd he used an illegal performance enhancing drug leading up to the biggest fight of his life.

by William Wilson on Sep 21, 2010 1:54 PM EDT reply actions  

it’s just as funny as rampage pleading not guilty when everyone knew what he did.

he would be stupid to not exhaust all his legal rights. Look at what happened with Hermes Franca/Sean Sherk/James Toney. All were suspended for 1 year. Franca said, “i’m sorry I won’t do it agai,.” Sean sherk brought in high priced laywers and challenged the validity of the test, while toney yelled and insulted the commissioners and said he didn’t do it. Toney and Sherk got their suspensions cut in half while Franca didn’t.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

to Rampage's defense though

he was possessed!

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 21, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Toney yelled and insulted the commissioners and said he didn’t do it.

Please, PLEASE tell me there’s video of this

When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON

-Joell Ortiz

by The Lethal Haze on Sep 21, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

He’ll appeal it to get the length of his suspension reduced. Everyone appeals. It’s his legal right.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 21, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

And everyone gets a little something because the commissions can't afford to defend.

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pretty much. Like Phildo said, Franca proved that honesty is NOT the best policy in Cali.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 21, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Being honest may have ruined his career

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

So he admitted it, tested hot, and now will be fighting it.

I guess that’s to be expected. I think his overly-aggressive remarks make a lot more sense now that we know he’s been roid-raging. :-/

(Still too disappointed by all of this to make effective jokes. Sigh.)

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 2:08 PM EDT reply actions  

No doubt his team is working on getting BJ’s mom as we speak.

by William Wilson on Sep 21, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think he admitted it on purpose

To set up the defense

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

It this moar pro wrassling stuff I don't understand?

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

No no no. This is BS\Politics\Sheep herding 101. Any good liar knows you have to have a back plan or a set up.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

He definitely admitted it on purpose

Its not like he let it slip after one too many appletinis. Of course he did it for a reason.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I mean I may not think Chael is funny, but I know he's a smart man

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

So the defense is?

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ.
I blog at TangleBones - you should follow me on Twitter here.
If you like it, you should put a rec on it.

by jemaleddin on Sep 21, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

It could go so many ways

I think Chael is going to blame a substance and then go for an end-around attack on the CSAC and the MMA media will be more than happy to comply

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Green this

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Has Sonnen commented on this at all?

In the article, it says that he’s opted for “totally implausible deniability”, but is that just a reference to what he had disclosed to the doctors before the Silva fight or some new information from him? The frantic pace of these articles has me confused!

by Ziggy325 on Sep 21, 2010 2:51 PM EDT reply actions  

That reference wasn't to this issue

That was to the Lance Armstrong comments he made and then denied making.

by Jamie Penick on Sep 21, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

After Sean Sherk came back from his drug suspension, what happened . . .

HE HAD A TITLE FIGHT.

Don’t cry for Chael Sonnen, he will be alright.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 2:56 PM EDT reply actions  

What happened to Hermes Franca?

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Whoa, you're forgetting key facts and spin
  • Hermes Franca lost. He eventually returned but to little or no fanfare.
  • Sean Sherk won, was suspended and eventually was featured in a PPV title fight against BJ Penn.
  • Chael Sonnen won the pre-fight interviews, then he won the fight, that is until Silva slipped on the triangle choke. But Sonnen won the post-fight interviews because he was a better translator than Ed Soares and Silva mentioned his rib injury. I think this is a very valid narrative.
  • Chael Sonnen was then rewarded an analyst job with ESPN because he doesn’t mince words and shoots from the hip.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Chael Sonnen definitely did not win the fight.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's being funny and telling you the media's narrative/spin on the fight

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought it was obvious because I slipped the "that is until Silva slipped on the triangle choke. " Because the actual fact that Silva won the fight is a mere footnote to the fact that Sonnen beat Silva’s ass and did what he said.

He made the fight a one-sided beating.

Now let’s forget all the quasi-racist, xenophobic statements.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 21, 2010 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly

Dana will act like nothing happened at all and Sonnen’s first fight back will be against Anderson. Thankfully, most fans won’t fall for the attempts at memory erasing.

by William Wilson on Sep 21, 2010 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dana White is a moron --

Giving Chael every excuse in the book. Instead he should throw the book at him, literally. Not only did he stoop so low as to say Lance Armstrong gave himself cancer, he WILLINGLY takes a PED, gets caught then Dana acts like the CSAC is at fault because they’re going to ban him for up to a year.

This makes me wonder how many top MMA fighters flew under the radar thanks to the NSAC and Zuffa influence. If Antonio Margacheato is able to get a license in Texas, thanks to Jerry Jones, the usage of Oxygen cannisters in an MMA event in the same state — I won’t be suprised what other crap goes unnoticed.

Just because it’s not reported doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.

"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

by Ryan Tical on Sep 21, 2010 3:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

You’re on a roll! Don’t stop.

by Rufford on Sep 21, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

You are a funny funny man. We all know Floyd will never fight Martinez, just like he’ll never fight Paul Williams… and sadly its looking like he’ll never fight Pacquiao either. At this point he’s the fucking Daffy Duck of combat sports. What a waste of talent.

When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON

-Joell Ortiz

by The Lethal Haze on Sep 21, 2010 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dana will act like nothing happened

because he implicitly supports steroid use (IMO, based on past comments). Or, doesn’t have a problem with people who choose to use.

But, he also understands the need for regulation and supports the commision.

by ecost on Sep 21, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

With Dana --

Dana doesn’t care about MMA, he’s a businessman. If XMA was bringing in millions of dollars, he’d swear it was the best sport on the planet.

It doesn’t matter to him. If anything, Dana will blacklist the CSAC due to this.

"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

by Ryan Tical on Sep 21, 2010 3:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

A Mayweather fan. Great!

by Rufford on Sep 21, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

He’s one of the last of a dying breed

When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON

-Joell Ortiz

by The Lethal Haze on Sep 21, 2010 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Poor Chael!

He deserves everything that comes to him. Serves him right, the insensitive Republican jackass. Maybe the Media Terrorists(Fox News) will book him on Sean Hannity so they can massage each others ego’s.

"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

by Ryan Tical on Sep 21, 2010 3:34 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Dude....

Take your politics elsewhere. This is an MMA forum, we can listen to blowhards from both sides spew their garbage anywhere else, let’s keep this site on topic: steroids, the UFC’s demise, arguing over p4p and rec’ing hilarious .gifs.

by xfreekx on Sep 21, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

MMA = Nothing but politics

It’s a business where big money is made. It’s all politics… I’m not the first one to say Sonnen is jackass.

"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

by Ryan Tical on Sep 21, 2010 3:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Well your Republicans=Bad was some astute analysis.

"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-

by Neil Manich on Sep 21, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

And?

You assume because I said “Republican jackass” means that I’m a liberal rat or some Democractic softie?

Wow, some pretty sensitive people on this forum. As I’ve said before — I’m not the first person to reference how Sonnen’s current disposition is based off his political views.

If anything, he gives Republican’s a bad name. Better?

"Okay, I stay clever like Mayweather, will lay leather 'til your face sever, one of the greatest ever." -- Big Daddy Kane

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 — 41-0-0 (25 KOs)

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. Hitlist: Manny Pacquiao, Sergio Martinez

by Ryan Tical on Sep 21, 2010 3:51 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

It’s like the Colbert Report without the humor.

by Rufford on Sep 21, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Barack strikes again! Always good for at least one funny a day.

If you want to hear my opinion on Les Miles go to BJPenn.com.

by DayGeaux on Sep 21, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is one of the best comments I've ever seen on the internet.

"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe

by pdl on Sep 21, 2010 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I love how some people are getting fired up over the excuses that they have made up that chael and dana will be using.

by Phildo on Sep 21, 2010 3:51 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Aside from funding their own scientific lab...

I will assume that if the supplement company is dodgy enough not include the substances on the label, they would be just as dodgy when asked to provide a legitimate list of the substances in their products. Aside from funding their own scientific lab, how the hell are athletes supposed to “know” what is going into their bodies if it’s that poorly regulated?

I’m not judging one way or the other for Chael but seriously, it sounds to me like an athlete could take every action necessary to ensure that he’s not taking banned substances and then get screwed over anyway.

by Daveyboy on Sep 21, 2010 4:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Anonymous MMA'er?

Dear Jim Rome, please stick to ball and stick sports because your lack of MMA knowledge is just pitiful.

by MrTechnique420 on Sep 21, 2010 4:37 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m sorry did you actually quote SC when it comes to anything Sonnen related? that is hillarious.

Anyways Dr. Benjamin clearly didn’t follow the Sherk case because if he did he would never make such a blanket and silly defense of the CSAC. They fucked up his test and the idea that well the lab is right 99% so that is good enough for me is also dumb.

When you have inept idiots running the show everything comes in question, so the only thing we know is that there are still people running the show there who don’t know how to do their jobs.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 21, 2010 7:01 PM EDT reply actions  

Do you read things or just skim through it?

And LOL at you promoting the new narrative “THE CSAC IS A FUCKED UP PLACE”

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 21, 2010 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

What new narrative?, I was yelling that during the Sherk case but then they went and got new people to replace the one’s who fucked up. Now here we are and they seem to have just replaced the last bunch of idiots with guys who are just as inept.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 22, 2010 12:07 AM EDT reply actions  

How are they idiots?

Because Chael got popped?

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 22, 2010 4:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

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