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What Will the UFC Do About Chael Sonnen's Failed Drug Test?

Chael Sonnen after losing to Anderson Silva at UFC 117.  (Photo by Jon Kopaloff/Zuffa LLC/Zuffa LLC via Getty Images)

Kevin Iole talks to Dana White and clarifies the consequence for Sonnen (emphasis mine):

That will mean no lucrative championship rematch with Silva in January or February, which in and of itself will cost Sonnen hundreds of thousands of dollars. When you add in the fine and the loss of a fight, plus what likely will be a drop in endorsement income, it will probably wind up costing Sonnen in excess of $1 million.

...

"When one of them fails a test, the government is going to fine them and suspend them and tell them they can't make a living for a year. So should I come in after they've already lost the ability to make a living for a year and been fined all this money and, in the worst economic disaster in the history of the world, fine them another huge amount and take away their ability to make a living even longer?

"These are guys with homes and families and personal lives and bills and debts and obligations, just like me and you," White said. "After they lost all this money already, money that, A, they've probably already spent and B, which they owe taxes, do I fine them another huge amount? What else do you do to a human being?"

First off, let's note that Chael Sonnen has not been fined or suspended, nor has he had a chance to tell his side of the story. 

Some fans are very vocal about wanting fight promoters to also act as judge, jury and executioner and boycott fighters whose rule violations have exceeded some sort of imaginary level. But that is a patently unrealistic position. Fight promoters are in this business to promote fights and make money. It's up to state athletic commissions to issue licenses, conduct testing, assign punishment as required and suspend fighters.

Once fighters have served their legally mandated suspensions and paid their fines, they've paid their debt to society as it were. If fans want to boycott them and the promotions that they fight for afterwards, that's perfectly fine. Regardless, it is neither realistic nor appropriate to expect promoters to act as enforcers above and beyond the athletic commissions. 

But I do want to take exception to one statement made in Iole's fine piece (emphasis mine): 

Yet, despite the UFC's attempts to educate and the various state athletic commissions' rigorous testing procedures, fighters continue to use, clearly because they believe the reward outweighs the risk.

I understand the PR value of wishing to pretend that the current testing regime is rigorous. It is anything but. First off, not every fighter is tested at every event. Secondly, since only urinalysis is conducted and no blood tests, there is no chance of catching athletes using HGH -- human growth hormone -- and other advanced agents. Thirdly, since the benefits of using drugs like that can remain with an athlete for life, even long after he has stopped using, it is a problem that simple testing cannot eliminate.

If we really want to ensure the safety of athletes and even the playing field, it will require fans to demand that a larger percentage of the money we pay to see fights goes to more rigorous testing procedures -- including blood tests and random year round testing of all licensed athletes.

I'm more than happy to spend an extra $2 per PPV to subsidize such testing in MMA.

But in the meantime, let's not pretend that the current testing regimes are "rigorous" or that only the fighters who test positive are using performance enhancing drugs. Shane Carwin, for example, was named in a federal courtroom as an athlete who had received illegally prescribed drugs and he has never failed a single drug test. 

Chael Sonnen has apparently run afoul of the current procedures and likely will be punished. Let's not add insult to injury by hypocritically pretending he's the only Mixed Martial Artist who has used PEDs.

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They will respect the commission's suspension and strip him of his title shot

He will have to work his way back to where he is.

Let’s also not impugn the hundreds upon hundreds of mixed martial artists that have never tested positive.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 19, 2010 9:21 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

freudian slip?

I think you meant “have never used PEDs” rather than “have never tested positive.”

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 9:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think those things are relatively interchangeable

I don’t buy that Chael Sonnen didn’t have access to the magic drug-test-passing elixir everyone else seems to use.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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Still Subo at Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Sep 19, 2010 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

like HGH?

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 9:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Looking forward to the Randy piece, by the way

I just don’t enjoy saying things about fighters I’ve never met on the Internet that I wouldn’t say to their face.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 19, 2010 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

?

what does that have to do with saying that the testing procedures are anything but rigorous, since they’re not random and don’t blood test.
But if you want to ask Randy about HGH be my guest. Not something I was planning on covering since it’s never been reported that he has used any PED.

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kid Nate, I hear you all the way. I’m a cynic and believe that he’s just one of the guys that got caught. i don’t want to indict anyone particularly but I’m sure there are other guys that have used in the past if they’re still not using it now.

“If you’re not cheating, you’re not trying hard enough.”
I don’t know where the quote came from but its applicable.

- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!

by VeeisAnimated on Sep 20, 2010 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

meh, i think he should be able to work his way back to where he is relatively easily, as long as he doesn’t fight maia or to a lesser extent paul harris, but hendo did do a pretty good job of neutralizing harris’ jitz, have no doubt that sonnen can do the same.

whatever PED he may have tested + for, doesnt take away from the tremendous talent that he has, although his one weakness is the bjj guy that can throw up triangles.

by kanodogg on Sep 19, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

harris would sub him

for sure. harris would crank an armbar or guillotine that would end chael.

dude needs some sub defence big time

Forever indebted to CroCop's left leg for getting me into MMA

by Well Read Idiot on Sep 20, 2010 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

He should definitely lose the rematch with Silva. And once he returns he should have to work his way up from the bottom.

Are our bones not dust?
Is our Blood not Poison?
On my knees in the black light
Praying for Salvation, bitter Redemption
So throw your dice and cast your shadow
You may look away
But your children will not...

by ProfessorBLove on Sep 19, 2010 9:23 PM EDT reply actions  

If he gets suspended for a full year...

he’ll lose the rematch simply because he will have to work his way back into the public interests…which, lets be fair, is a big reason why he had it in the first place.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is RETARDED!

Why would a guy who nearly beat the yellow out of anderson’s piss have to start at the bottom? Lay off the bong for a day-hippie.

by magneto on Sep 20, 2010 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

...

the following two things are signs of weaknesses:
stay silent when it's needed to speak up, and speak up when it's needed to stay silent.

by Orcus on Sep 20, 2010 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

People are going to say that this is because I'm "Anti-Chael" but Josh Gross is right there with me

If you fail, you’re out. Period. If you’re dumb enough to get caught and tarnish the name of MMA and the UFC, you’re out of the UFC and you gotta work your way back.

That’s a strong deterrent if you REALLY want to curb the PEDs.

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 9:24 PM EDT reply actions  

The UFC will attempt to curb PEDs only to the extent that it financially benefits them.

"You should work for 15 minutes to knock your opponent out, submit him, or improve your position to give yourself the best chance of doing either." - Dan Hardy

by Day Man on Sep 19, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

And now that we know it was roids watch Chael say "bad supplement"

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 1:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

ANOTHER RETARDED STATEMENT!

Do you REALLY believe that top MMA fighters aren’t using PED’s? In fact, do you think that most top athletes arent using PED’s? Lance, Bolt, Williams sisters? WAKE UP!

by magneto on Sep 20, 2010 12:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Question – why would PPV money be used to subsidize testing? You’ve already stated that it’s on the commissions to do that stuff, not the UFC. PPV money doesn’t go to the commission. They take their sanctioning fee and and that’s it. What you’re suggesting sounds good, but it’s not really possible, is it? Are you saying you want the UFC to test on their own?

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 19, 2010 9:26 PM EDT reply actions  

He believes that the UFC should have its own testing policy independent from the commissions

And I agree. I don’t agree it should be extra PPV cost. I wouldn’t cost the UFC much to do 2 random out of training tests a year. Revenue is exponentially increasing and salary isn’t, so the money is somewhere.

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Salary is also exponentially increasing.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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by Derek Suboticki on Sep 19, 2010 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

No it isn't. Unless the exponent is like 5/4

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

no

you’re putting words in my mouth.
I would ideally like a federal or an international sanctioning body that had the power to test athletes. Like all sanctioning bodies it would have to be subsidized by the profits from the sport.

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

So you’re talking about re-working the sanctioning fees that the UFC pays to commissions for this to work then? Because from what I understand (and I’m sure it varies between states), it’s a flat fee + a percentage of the gate, isn’t it? PPV money is still a separate thing.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 19, 2010 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

since I don’t pay to see live events I can’t really pledge any of that money now can I?

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why don’t you pay to see live events?

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 19, 2010 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

well

I paid to see UFN 22 but generally I get credentials and I only attend one or two events a year. It’s not exactly a bold stand for me to offer $$ from tickets I don’t bye is it?

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ahh, okay. Makes sense. As for what you’re saying, I’m not disagreeing with you, was just asking for clarification on the PPV money thing.

http://www.instrength.com

by Tim Burke on Sep 19, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

"...in the worst economic disaster in the history of the world..."

We’re in the 1930s? Interesting theory, Dana…

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift

by Scott C. Broussard on Sep 19, 2010 9:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Then 2nd worst...

you’re nitpicking, Dana’s point remains the same…especially because these guys make their entire year’s income on 2 to 3 opportunities a year, remove 1 or 2 of those and the effect can be devastating.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I got that. The moral of the story is that Dana wants a chicken in every fighter’s pot. His history is still wrong, though.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift

by Scott C. Broussard on Sep 19, 2010 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Then send him a fucking history book and get over it.

Seriously, is your Dana hate so strong that you can’t get past the example to see the concept of what he is talking about?

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dana is pretty well known for his hyperbole – most promoters are

"You should work for 15 minutes to knock your opponent out, submit him, or improve your position to give yourself the best chance of doing either." - Dan Hardy

by Day Man on Sep 19, 2010 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Doesn't change the point...

that the economy is bad and adding an additional layer of punishment to a suspended fighter could be argued as excessive…which is what Dana is saying.

Getting lost in whether or not he is right about where this current recession ranks amongst economic disasters in history is missing the point.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

LOL current recession

Been a really long 6-12 months

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."

by Barack Lesnar on Sep 19, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

That is my point

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."

by Barack Lesnar on Sep 20, 2010 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah I got your point that it's not really "current" as in "recent"

it’s been long as hell

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Recession by definition is only six to twelve months

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."

by Barack Lesnar on Sep 20, 2010 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ys it's a depression now

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oil, USD, Gold, one does not fit hmmmmmmm

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."

by Barack Lesnar on Sep 20, 2010 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Dana is using the recession as a smokescreen. It doesn’t matter precisely if its the worst or how long its been going. Its irrelevant to Chael Sonnen’s personal ability to make money or that a drug suspension will prevent him from fighting.

If anything, it sounds like Dana White is upset he’s suspended at all, as if the economic hard times on the working class are in any way applicable to a guy serving a drug suspension from fighting.

by VirtualBalboa on Sep 19, 2010 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

This.
as if the economic hard times on the working class are in any way applicable to a guy serving a drug suspension from fighting.

Green Jacket, Gold Jacket, who gives a shit?

by Hendar on Sep 19, 2010 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I don’t hate Dana. I just don’t like people getting their facts that obviously wrong.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift

by Scott C. Broussard on Sep 19, 2010 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not for Chael...

Cause let’s face it: MMA is only a hobby. He’ll actually make more money since he can put those three hours per day to work!

To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.

by KGNLuc on Sep 20, 2010 7:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

The shane carwin situation really doesn’t tell us anything about the state of drug testing in the sport. I think it needs to be improved, but lets be realistic about it. Carwin received steroids in 2006. In that time period he fought in that time he fought in hawaii, which was unregulated, texas, which doesn’t test for steroids, and california, which has since overhauled their entire drug testing process.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 9:40 PM EDT reply actions  

He was known to receive them then

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes, 4 years ago, in states with shitty or no testing, and then took time off. Not sure how that says anything about the current state of drug testing.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

except that any mass he may have gained and retained

is still being used in hiss fights.

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t say it didn’t have an effect, I said it says nothing about the current testing system.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was just being more specific

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oops, hit the return button. Here is the post
But in the meantime, let’s not pretend that the current testing regimes are “rigorous” or that only the fighters who test positive are using performance enhancing drugs.

Chael gets a special amount of derision because of his bashing of PED users. But, we all have to be and I think are realistic that most of these fighters are using, most athletes in professional sports are using. There is too much money to be made and so many ways to not get caught.

by memitim on Sep 19, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

"Chael gets a special amount of derision because of his bashing of PED users.

Chael gets a special amount of derision because he generally acts like a smug, judgmental asshole towards anyone who doesn’t fit his model of what an MMA fighter should be like, let alone what they should fight like.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

I think people are jumping the gun a bit, when we don’t know what he tested positive for yet, nor has he been suspended. All we know is that he failed his piss test. That’s it. But expansive narratives have already been built, since it’s a slow news week.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

by Brian Mayes on Sep 19, 2010 9:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Uh, if you fail, you get suspended

The only reason we don’t know specifics is because they were told informally at a boxing event. The press release is coming tomorrow I’m sure

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

What? So you are saying we are going off all of this on an informal comment made by some athletic commision member at a boxing match?

Now you know why I’m not quick to say anything.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

by Brian Mayes on Sep 19, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

No.

Do you know what informal and formal means? Formal, i.e. a press release from the CSAC stating that Chael failed and what he tested positive for. Informal, the head of the CSAC telling someone that a fighter failed a test.

/sarcasm
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 19, 2010 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

That said, I don’t really think the UFC should do much more than shuffle chael back in line for a title shot. We can argue all day if the UFC should do more testing, but in the current situation, the government handles the testing, and hands out punishment, I don’t think we need double punishment, especially for a first time offense.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 9:47 PM EDT reply actions  

Rome left BE? Dang, I liked his stuff.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

by Brian Mayes on Sep 19, 2010 10:05 PM EDT reply actions  

yeah I did too

He got a very good break in his career that presents a conflict.
What brings that up?

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can you give details?

I like it whenever the staff here get career opportunities, make me feel like hard work pays off and grass roots efforts lead to opportunities.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'll leave that to Michael

seems like a pretty good opportunity though.

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Couldn’t he have at least given us a farewell post? Come back, Rome, come back!

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
Reasoning will never make a man correct an ill opinion, which by reasoning he never acquired. -Jonathan Swift

by Scott C. Broussard on Sep 19, 2010 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Luke brought it up on the show. Post fail?

by Rufford on Sep 19, 2010 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeez, I fail at life.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

by Brian Mayes on Sep 19, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

no worries

you just confused me

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I confuse myself, more often than not.

It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat. - Theodore Roosevelt

by Brian Mayes on Sep 19, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rome left?

Good for him, I guess. I don’t know how to feel about this since he was one of the main reasons I “tuned” into BE.

by John Nash on Sep 20, 2010 2:58 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Bisping vs Marquardt
Okami vs Vitor
Palhares vs Maia

Then let Anderson fight winner of Belfort/Okami , he can use the extra month or two to heal up from the rib injury.

by DirtyML on Sep 19, 2010 10:24 PM EDT reply actions  

what about Bisping vs Akiyama?

I don’t expect him to win that one

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by Nate Wilcox on Sep 19, 2010 10:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hope he doesn’t but I have a feeling somehow he will win.

by DirtyML on Sep 19, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sucks so bad this happened. The title picture really became very uninteresting again outside of Vitor. I guess GSP vs. Anderson became a lot higher of a priority for Dana White

"I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me" - Philippians 4:13

by Noah'sArk on Sep 19, 2010 10:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Dana will get pissed off

Cut Chael Sonnen from the UFC, declare he’ll never fight in the UFC again, only for him to re-emerge to fight Gerald Harris in early 2012.

Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.

by SSreporters on Sep 19, 2010 10:35 PM EDT reply actions  

Paul Daley is not allowed to make a living in the UFC

I can’t believe Dana would take away Mr. Daley’s ability to make a living during “the worst economic disaster in the history of the world”.

by 110 South on Sep 19, 2010 10:55 PM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Did you just compare sucker punching to testing positive for PEDs?

Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.

by SSreporters on Sep 19, 2010 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Reply to SSreporters

You wrote:
“Did you just compare sucker punching to testing positive for PEDs?"

Yes I did. They both involve fighter safety. Taking PED’s can give a fighter an unfair and dangerous advantage in a fight.

by 110 South on Sep 19, 2010 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Taking PEDs is dangerous but it's not guaranteed as an advantage

Daley was ready to commit assault in the ring. These two things are not related.

Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.

by SSreporters on Sep 19, 2010 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uhhhhh, they don't call em PEDs for nothing

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I thought they called them “PEDs” because it’s a lot easier than typing out “Performance Enhancing Drugs” every time.

by ufc4 on Sep 21, 2010 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

SSreporters

Are you serious? Taking illegal drugs that make you hit harder, faster, for longer, causing potentially life threatening injuries, thats not as bad as a split second moment of douchebagery that Paul Daley pulled? To me taking PED’s is right up there with loaded gloves in terms of malicious cheating.

by sheikybaby on Sep 20, 2010 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

people need to stop comparing daley to anything. Daley’s screw up is a special kind a screw up. A very public, very obvious, very very very poorly timed screw up.

And besides that, Steroids don’t have the same cachet with the general public as a sucker punch does. People don’t get overly upset about steroids unless you play baseball or like to ride your bike around france.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Again different. Nate was 1 of many people doing something stupid.

Daley was 1 of 1 people doing something stupid AFTER the brawl. Daley is in his own planet of stupidity.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nate did it in another promotion and made them look bad

Daley did it in my promotion the UFC and made them look bad.

That’s what you mean to say.

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

That is also part of it, I’m not sure why people seem to think that is a bad thing.

Didn’t everyone learn when they were in like second grade that the one doing something stupid second gets the worse punishment?

by Phildo on Sep 20, 2010 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nate Diaz would be done in the UFC if he pulled that off at a UFC event

Mo Johnston finally fired. Let the house cleaning and road to success begin.

by SSreporters on Sep 19, 2010 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

"since the benefits of using drugs like that can remain with an athlete for life"

I knew a couple guys who, at 19, were great athletes. I’m talking 4.5 40 yard dash, 36 inch vert, with real ability to play the game. The only problem, both guys were about 5’ 10" 160lbs or so. Over the summer, one of them gained 30 lbs of muscle. He was twice the size and more athletic than ever. A star was born. He never got any bigger or stronger, but he didn’t need to at that point. The other guy was a really good friend of mine. Between spring training and the end of the season he went from 155 to 190. Way quicker than ever. After one season, he got an offer to Kansas St.

I should note one of these guys in prison for a long time and the other is a drunk washout.

"I trained with Steven Seagal."

by B.H. Farnsworth on Sep 19, 2010 10:57 PM EDT reply actions  

And won't change a thing...

as far as getting suspended, etc…

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 19, 2010 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fight promoters are in this business to promote fights and make money. It’s up to state athletic commissions to issue licenses, conduct testing, assign punishment as required and suspend fighters.

Just because the promotions are out to make money doesn’t mean they don’t have any responsibility regarding drug use. The UFC in particular ,due to it’s status in the MMA world, has a huge responsibility to nip these issues in the bud BEFORE fights take place. Currently, the UFC and MMA in general is pretty much on par with the Olympics and the Tour de France in that there is pretty much a belief amongst the masses that PEDs are rife which puts a question mark over all fights and the legitimacy of the sport.

Sadly, as you said, the UFC is about $$$, so finding out 3 weeks before a headline fight that their star is on PEDs is bad for their bottom line as the fight cannot take place. Learning about it after is no biggie as they have already got paid from the ppv and havent lost too much in promoting then fighter.

But the long term damage this does to the sport is great. To the uninitiated, MMA will just be that bloodsport in the cage with all the juiced up muscle-bound freaks. Pure, unashamed exploitative entertainment.

Alternatively, the UFC could lead by example. Take a tiny percentage of their huge profits to invest into both targeted and random drug testing. This could be done during a fighters camp and even months out from a potential fighters next bout. The increased likelihood of getting busted combined with harsher punishment could lead to a much more positive image of the sport as well as a decrease in the number of people using banned substances.

Sadly, them actually doing this is unlikely. Imagine one month before Lesnar v Couture, they learn that Brock just failed a drug test. Do they make it public and punish him or do they sweep it under the rug, leak that he is injured and wait til he is clean to go again? Im pretty sure the latter.

People generally accept that high profile athletes are role models and have a duty to lead by example. If one single athlete has that kind of responsibility, surely an organisation as large, profitable and influential as the UFC should also take more responsibility for the growth and image of the sport, not to mention the health and well being of the fighters it promotes.

Thumbs down to the UFC for their constant failure to address the issue of drugs!!

by GeeDub on Sep 19, 2010 11:16 PM EDT reply actions  

It’s both touching and hypocritical to hear Dana being so concerned of his fighters’ financial wellbeing – all the while UFC pays peanuts to a large portion of their ‘independent contractors’.

Don't like wrestling in MMA? Go watch K-1.
Can't deal with the occasional boring fight? Let me introduce you to ROH.

Dear Mr. White - would it kill you to drop a few f-bombs less?

by Monday Morning Martial Artist on Sep 19, 2010 11:18 PM EDT reply actions  

Dana pays more peanuts than everyone else.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Let’s not add insult to injury by hypocritically pretending he’s the only Mixed Martial Artist who has used PEDs.

I haven’t gotten that impression.

I can understand Dana’s point somewhat, that if the athletic commission is going to punish them, does he need to punish them even more? On the other hand, this guy’s coming off a big title match and was already being rewarded for it with an immediate rematch…does he deserve to maintain that position if he’s coming off a year long suspension for getting pinched for using PEDs?

As for Chael allegedly using…any ‘everyone else is doing it’ argument just won’t wash. I liked how Iole put it -

MMA doesn’t have the public and political acceptance that football and baseball do. A steroids-aided linebacker who drills a running back and gives him a concussion won’t do much to enrage the public or garner the attention of lawmakers.

Let that happen in MMA, however, and there could be all sorts of government inquiries.

by Hardcase on Sep 19, 2010 11:29 PM EDT reply actions  

Iole’s comment is just wrong. I don’t know why people keep bringing this up.

If there is a government inquiry, Dana will say, “go talk to the government.” It won’t be a big show like the other sports had, because Dana says that and he is absolved. The other sports had to go there and get their asses kicked because they were trying to keep the government out, the government is already in MMA. If the government gets involved, Dana can just say, “we will do whatever you want,” and it will be over. For whatever reason, the other sports did not want that option, so they were scared of the government and had to scramble to keep them out.

Besides that, it’s foolish to put baseball and any other sport together when talking about reaction to steroids, the reaction in baseball is unique.

by Phildo on Sep 19, 2010 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

So here I am just getting home and checking out the mmanews of the day and everything goes to hell wow.

Alright now that i’m trying to wrap my head around everything, assuming that this report is true and that we don’t have another Sherk situation with the CSAS. Then sadly Chael won’t be getting another shot at the gold so Anderson will be able to keep the belt longer. That means IF he is guilty that he’ll be fined and suspended so no more great promo’s which sucks. Then after the suspension and everything else, it looks like he’ll get back in line and try to pull a Leben and earn back his position. Aside from that there really isn’t anything else to do on the UFC’s part everyone knows the rules so IF they fail it for whatever reason then it’s on them.

Though I am curious to find out what he tested positive for and what he has to say about it IF everything i’ve read is true. As far as people wanting to turn this into something it’s not let’s not reach, there isn’t some epidemic this idea that everyone is doing it is reaching without facts.

Finally i’ll say i’m still a Chael fan, i’ve never been in the group that goes crazy about steriods or other PED’s. The only guy i’ve ever bashed because of them is Barnett and that is only because he’s been busted 3 times and at somepoint you’ve just gone too far. But the rules are the rules regardless of my own personal opinion on them, IF you do break them then you suffer the consequences hopefully though he’ll be back because I just find him too entertaining to not have around.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 19, 2010 11:52 PM EDT reply actions  

Funny I was thinking of you when I read about this and how much you would personally enjoy hearing about this news, because it’s become even more obvious that for whatever reason Sonnen’s comments got to you. Showing once again that all this talk of I know what Chael is doing still hasn’t stopped you from reacting to it just like a mark would.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 20, 2010 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

Basically

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
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by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

No a mark would take it personally, I don’t I find it funny that he can’t let it go and has posted on and on and on about it swearing up and down that he’s not a mark when he acts just like one.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 20, 2010 1:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yet, you've made the same comment about 20 times

According to your warped logic, you’re taking it personally.

Let me get this straight, for months Sonnen dissed my favorite fighter Anderson Silva and I “didn’t take it personal” and then he does a Q and A and dissing fighters I don’t even really like (minus Silva and Lesnar) and NOW I take it personally? That don’t make no sense.

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

You’re the last person who should be talking about repetitive posts here, and I have no clue what has sparked this thing with you and Sonnen that’s part of what i’m trying to figure out. But whatever it is has clearly made you personally invested in going at him which is baffling to me because it’s not that serious.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 20, 2010 1:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

Who's taking it "serious"?

Certainly not mysefl. I bid you adieu, got work ina few.

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 3:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wait wait, lemme get this straight

You think I’M taking it personally for commenting on it. Yet, you and your numerous comments about my comments are NOT?

As a writer, I comment on MMA happenings. As a fan, I do too. As a fan, so you do. So as a fan, why are you commenting on what you think I take personally. And not just once, but over 10 times. Unless you’re a fan.

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

You’re not just commenting, you’ve made it clear in your posts that you’re taking this personal. You’re not just giving your opinion you basically sound like a furious fanboy that is outraged by Sonnen and his comments. You’re like a dog with a bone and you just won’t let it go, it’s not that serious it was funny but for whatever reason you’re almost on a crusade to say it wasn’t that’s gone past a normal back and forth about a topic.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 20, 2010 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

If you haven't noticed...ALL my posts have the same "tone"

I only comment on it as much as people keep responding. You act as though I’m bringing it up when it doesn’t apply. Have I mentioned the Q and A section in here? I don’t think so, this is about ur boy roiding. Now maybe if I had mentioned it, you would have a point.

Now play my music

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

I couldn’t miss your posts if I tried which is fine but they all seem to have come out since the Q&A which for whatever reason really has fired you up again I just don’t get why?.

"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/

by Nightwhistler on Sep 20, 2010 1:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

I support PED usage.

by zY on Sep 20, 2010 12:00 AM EDT reply actions  

i do as well

but it’s not a popular stance

if it wasn’t against the rules i’d be all for athletes using them
but it is against the rules and the rules should always be observed

The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.

by Johnathan Willis on Sep 20, 2010 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

i think the only real issue with PED use is where do we draw the line
like look at the sport of bodybuilding , its basically who is willing to play chemistry set with their body the most
like do we literally let guys run
test
plus an oral
hgh
igf
insulin (not sure if that would benefit a fighter or not )
blood doping (addition of red blood cells for higher oxygen saturation)
and then maybe a line of coke before a fight just to jack you the fuck up

would it turn into a game of who is willing to use the most shit or who has the best chemist on their side ?

by Richard Doughty on Sep 20, 2010 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

i completely agree

that sounds like an interesting stack

i’d prefer to just skip to the line of coke at the end though

The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.

by Johnathan Willis on Sep 20, 2010 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

That's not entirely accurate.

If PEDs were all legal it would favor, from among the fighters willing to play chemistry set with their body, the ones with the best genetics, training, skill, and discipline.

by Finian1 on Sep 20, 2010 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

I know they could do more, and really UFC is the only organization out there that could do year round testing, but I also like to think that it shows the system is working to some degree when they bust guys.

Sonnen will do his time, and then return in a middle of the pack match-up where he will need 2-3 wins to get back in contention. If I was UFC, when he came back I would put him on the undercard and not on TV just to send an additional message.

by dpk875 on Sep 20, 2010 12:03 AM EDT reply actions  

steroids in sports are an epidemic

i personally don’t have a problem with steroids in general or steroids in sports but they are against the rules and the rules of the sport should always be obeyed.
there is only one way to stop it or slow it to a crawl and that is random blood screenings bottom line and nothing less will be effective especially not the system most ac’s have now.

if they’re not going to take the testing seriously then they shouldn’t test at all.

The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.

by Johnathan Willis on Sep 20, 2010 12:15 AM EDT reply actions  

Sonnen, your mouth is getting too big for your muzzle

Chael, you used to be arrogant and obnoxious. Now you are just the opposite, you are obnoxious and arrogant. I heard after the Silva fight, you were taken to the hospital for x-rays of your jaw, but all they got was a moving picture. However, Chael, I must say I admire you because I’ve never had the courage it takes to be a liar, a thief, and a ‘cheat’.

by coyoteye on Sep 20, 2010 12:38 AM EDT reply actions  

awesome

The sea refuses no river. The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes. The ride does not require explanation - just occupance.

by Johnathan Willis on Sep 20, 2010 1:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

In all seriousness though

I’m relatively certain this dude is hyping a fight against Sonnen. We should be excited for him.

by Brent Ducharme on Sep 20, 2010 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

For some reason reading coyoteye’s comment reminded me of Jerry ‘The King’ Lawler

Great article, I completely agree. Kid Nate is someone I generally agree with a lot, and his pieces are well put together.

by Mr Pulla on Sep 20, 2010 12:50 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

For some reason reading coyoteye’s comment reminded me of Jerry ‘The King’ Lawler

Great article, I completely agree. Kid Nate is someone I generally agree with a lot, and his pieces are well put together.

by Mr Pulla on Sep 20, 2010 12:50 AM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Are you Crazy

WHO cares if the fighters use PEDs to put on performances for us. Do you really believe guys in their 30’s can train and fight every three months on the natural?

I think we are past the point of being shocked and appalled that Professional Athletes use whatever means they can to give them an advantage!

by derreckla on Sep 20, 2010 1:08 AM EDT reply actions  

And it's officially a "natural steroid"

/sarcasm
SCM aka Black Lesnar aka Wesley Types aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
Follow me on Twitter
Read me at WatchKalibRun

by S.C. Michaelson on Sep 20, 2010 1:14 AM EDT reply actions  

See what happens when you put Brock’s name in your mouth? Shit gets real.

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."

by Barack Lesnar on Sep 20, 2010 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

In the long run, though, it will be up to the fighters to eradicate steroids from the sport. They need to understand the risks of usage, to themselves, to their opponents and to their sport. If a push to eliminate performance-enhancing drugs from MMA doesn’t come from the fighters, it will never be truly effective.

From Lole’s article. Just curious what you guys think of this. Is it unrealistic to expect fighters to do a sober cost-benefit analysis and choose the long-term benefits over short term ones? Has any effective PED regulation (assuming it exists somewhere) come from the athletes themselves?

"The only freakshow's the one in my pants"
-James Toney

by chasethegoose on Sep 20, 2010 1:40 AM EDT reply actions  

The NFL is as living, breathing example of that.

I like Fedor, it’s just his fans that are intolerable...and his management.

by Razreshat on Sep 20, 2010 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

somewhat off topic but...

“These are guys with homes and families and personal lives and bills and debts and obligations, just like me and you,”
Debts, Dana, do you really think anyone believes you have any debt? you probably pay someone to sit and watch your credit card bills and have them pay it off seconds after something gets charged to it.

by proflex on Sep 20, 2010 11:40 AM EDT reply actions  

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