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Strikeforce Disasters Part 2: Jake Shields Released, No One Wants the Middleweight Title

I think Dana White's smile has gotten even bigger since then. Photo via MMA Mania

First the Shields situation, per Sherdog:

The 31-year-old Shields had been in a final-phase "matching period" of his recently completed contract with the San Jose, Calif.-based promotion, which allowed him to receive bids from other organizations, including the UFC, that Strikeforce could review and match in order to keep his services. However, the source said Strikeforce waived that contractual right in its final 2-3 weeks and opted to release the Cesar Gracie fighter altogether before the period expired.

Strikeforce CEO Scott Coker confirmed to Sherdog.com that the promotion informed Jack Shields, the fighter's manager and father, of the release on Wednesday. Coker would not comment further on the decision.

"In the conversation we had today, they said they felt that Jake was leaning towards the UFC. Honestly, we were talking to them with an open mind, though Jake wants to fight the best," said the elder Shields. "Between Strikeforce and EliteXC, Jake had the chance to fight on Showtime and CBS four or five times against some top fighters like Dan Henderson and Robbie Lawler. Strikeforce gave him great opportunities and exposure. They've been nothing but great for Jake."

Zach Arnold transcribes Dave Meltzer's take on the situation and adds some commentary:

"Yeah. Well, it was bound to happen. I mean, before he even left when they were already talking about the tournament, you know what I'm saying? I mean, you know, and I saw Jake at the show Saturday and you know I mean he wasn't like 100% but I mean you know... the minute he showed up on that WEC show with Dana (White), you know, even if he hadn't decided, the bottom line is that I think that Strikeforce pretty much decided they weren't going to make him any kind offer. That was slapping them in the face, it really was."

...

I mean as far as leverage and going back-and-forth, you know them pulling out certainly hurts his leverage, you know but I think Dana is going to make him a good offer no matter what. He was already going after him. I don't think he's going to lowball him even though he's got the leverage to do it now. However, he... if they had gotten both sides you know they could have gotten into a bidding war to take it higher on both sides and that is not going to happen. So, you know, he's going to get I think what probably would be a fair deal, you know, and it'll be interesting to see who he faces because you get a guy who can strike with the takedown defense and I mean Jake's got that weakness, you know, I mean his striking sucks, you know by you know the level of a top 185 or 170 pounder. His ground game is fantastic and his wrestling is very good. So, you know he can beat you know if you don't have very good takedown defense, he will beat you. But, you know, the guys, if you got great takedown and you can hit, that's going to be Jake's weakness."

The most interesting aspect to this story is that the Shields camp wants to face Anderson Silva. We all know what Dana White said before the fight between Shields and Dan Henderson when he said that Shields had no business being in there against a guy that big. Wonder what Dana would say if there was money at stake to book a fight between Shields and Anderson?

Shields certainly didn't help his chances of using Strikeforce to generate competing and better offers from the UFC when he all but sat in Dana White's lap on camera at WEC 48. I doubt that really helped his case with either promoter. It might have been hard to decline Dana's invitation, but he played himself by accepting. Insulting a soon to be ex never helps in the divorce.

Now as for the big tournament to replace Shields as the Strikeforce MW champ, Coker's been spinning some alluring fantasies: Cung Le, Nick Diaz, Dan Henderson, Mayhem Miller, Jacare Souza, Tim Kennedy, the Sengoku Champ, etc etc. 

Well not so fast Scott. Cung Le wants none of it. Dan Henderson says not so much. Diaz and Mayhem are suspended through August. So it looks like once again Scott Coker's big plans are collapsing around his ears.

One thing I'm wondering, have the fighters begun to notice that the Strikeforce belt -- with its onerous championship clause that means the champ can't leave until he loses -- is really a golden pair of handcuffs? The natural step for a fighter who's cleared out a minor league (and with Fedor's loss, that's what Strikeforce is in all but women's MMA and the mens' 155lb division) is to move up to the bigs. But the UFC won't take a fighter off a loss and unless he wants to spend years in court,  he can't up and leave.

Shields didn't have a champions clause in his deal because his contract with Strikeforce carried over from his EliteXC days.

This goes for Bellator too. Will Hector Lombard, Eddie Alvarez, Lyman Good or maybe Ben Askren and Joe Warren be stuck in minor league purgatory for the end of their careers?

I'm a big fan of Strikeforce and have generally been more sympathetic to them than their competitors, but it's getting to the point where even Kid Nate knows which way the wind is blowing. And it's a gale force blast that's wiping out competing MMA promotions. 

More on what it all means in the full entry.

Star-divide

Zach Arnold elaborates:

Strikeforce has been trying to rehabilitate its image since the debacle last April in Nashville on CBS. It was such a terrible show on so many levels. You had title fights for titles that the fans don't care about. Therefore, you had five round fights involving fighters who have shown throughout their careers that they can go five rounds a fight. 

After killing the crowd with King Mo vs. Gegard Mousasi, Gilbert Melendez vs. Shin'ya Aoki, and Jake Shields vs. Dan Henderson, proponents of having most MMA fights go five rounds got burned. Then there was the riot at the end of the Nashville event with the Diaz Brothers going after Mayhem Miller. On top of that, the ratings were atrocious for the CBS broadcast. Put that all together and you found Strikeforce in a desperate situation to try to get back onto CBS. 

The June 26th event from San Jose was supposed to be a show that rehabilitated the brand so the suits at CBS would give the promotion one more crack. So what did the suits see? They saw a fight between a natural 170-pounder in Cris Cyborg versus a natural 140 pounder in Jan Finney with a .500 record, a fight that should have never been sanctioned by the California State Athletic Commission. However, it was sanctioned and it was every bit the beating that everyone thought it would be. Unfortunately, it exceeded expectations and disgusted a lot of people who were watching. 

After that fight, the suits watched 38-year Cung Le work his San Shou magic and obliterate Scott Smith in their revenge rematch. Smith pulled out a win last December and gave Cung his first loss. Cung has been spending time making movies and do out-of-the-cage activities in his life. So, naturally, Scott Coker decided to book their revenge match and announce it to the public... two weeks before the show took place. On top of that, he announced that the winner of the fight would be in the promotion's upcoming 8-man Middleweight tournament now that Jake Shields is all but gone to UFC and will vacate his belt.

And lastly Fight Opinion transcribes this exchange from Sherdog radio that gets to the heart of Strikeforce's problems with their fighters:

LUTFI SARIAHMED: "Here's a question for you that just kind of popped into my head: For the longest time when we were talking about the Dan Henderson discussion in regard to what he was going to do, where he was going to sign, why he was going to sign where he said, we had said, all right Dan Henderson is going to go to Strikeforce because it's more about the individual as opposed to just the promotion and it's more about pumping up the individual than it is about the promotion on the whole. And you love that for the fighters because obviously it's good for them, but it seems as if Strikeforce has run into all sorts of problems because they let the fighters dictate what's going on."

JACK ENCARNACAO: "Yeah. I think rather the fighters feel more emboldened to you know speak their mind in the direction and I've praised fighters in the UFC and the WEC on air for calling people out after fights because I consider it a huge waste of time to get a great win on TV and then just be you know not put into the mind of people who just watched you get you this great win who you might fight next and therefore invest them in your future to some small degree. But you know it seems to go in the complete opposite extreme with Strikeforce where I mean their big names are just impossible to pin down for fights, you just don't know where they're going, what they're doing, who they want next, they'll throw names out there just there's nothing that's built to it, you know why does Babalu want to fight Dan Henderson? If he has his reasons, you know he lost to him in 1999... if he his reasons, they certainly have nothing to do with what's happened in Strikeforce you know whereas when guys in the UFC want to fight certain guys it's because pf things they've done in the UFC and I think that's part of the missing ingredient there for Strikeforce right now."

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I think Jake will get paid well by the UFC

I can see him getting 80k/80k or maybe 100/100 plus hidden bonuses etc.

by JimJoe on Jul 1, 2010 1:32 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Also allow me to say this

in the voice of that lost toy character from the christmas special Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer:

“Nobody wants a Jake Shields-in-a-box!”

by Body Triangle on Jul 1, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just have a hard time....

believing that Jake with literally, “0” leverage could get that sweet of a deal from UFC, especially considering that he is not a knockout artist, my borderline casual/medium core MMA friends still know zilch about him, and his fights have a habit of being fairly uneventful..

by Jonnycaz2.0 on Jul 1, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Point, point, and point.

by goodbones on Jul 1, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fighting under the Unified Rules Shields had 8 straight TKO's or Subs, SF does not allow elbows, the UFC does.

Shields went up 15lbs in Strikeforce because there was a lack of competition at WW, without a control fighters best weapon, he still beat 2 consensus top 5 MW’s, Hendo and Lawler and a top 20 MW to win and defend the Strikeforce Middleweight Championship.

Shields fought in the main or co main event in 4 of the 5 CBS Saturday Night Fights and was featured in 4 Showtime events.
 Before that he fought on basic cable for BodogFights, I read he is one of the 3 most watched MMA fighters in American history according to the Neilson list.
He finished 9 of his 11 TV fights. I watched 8 or 9 of his fights plus some older fights on youtube and you can tell I’m a fan.

by mixmaster2669 on Jul 1, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

So…Anderson Silva is going to have sexual relations with Jake Shields, then punch him in the head? That’s really, really weird. I always figured Anderson would just finish him with regular punches.

by GetYourHeadStomps on Jul 1, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

With regular punches? Are you dating Cyborg?

I get more rec's then a Toyota!

by DayGeaux on Jul 1, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

regular punches

hammerfists and unorthodox striking gives me gas

by Body Triangle on Jul 1, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

nice

mine gets me via the “fish hook” every time…..there’s just something about her fingers in odd places that seem to finish me off

by SNATCHFACE on Jul 1, 2010 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

TMI!

I get more rec's then a Toyota!

by DayGeaux on Jul 1, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why does the UFC even need Jake Shields?

How did I end up on this bandwagon and why does everything say property of Chael Sonnen?

by Day Man on Jul 1, 2010 1:37 PM EDT reply actions  

By that I mean, will anyone buy a ticket or pay per view because Jake Shields is fighting? If not why even bring him in when you can get a young fighter willing to take 1/10th what you have to pay Shields to take that spot?

How did I end up on this bandwagon and why does everything say property of Chael Sonnen?

by Day Man on Jul 1, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nate Diaz vs. Jake Shields

There you go.

"Fedor is in major trouble! FEDOR TAPS! FEDOR TAPS! FABRICIO WERDUM WINS BY SUBMISSION (TRIANGLE CHOKE), ROUND 1!" - Brent Brookhouse, BloodyElbow.com

by SSreporters on Jul 1, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shields gets hit in the face a few times, takes down Diaz and controls him, round ends. Repeat for two additional rounds. Jake Shields by unanimous decision. Saved you the trouble.

How did I end up on this bandwagon and why does everything say property of Chael Sonnen?

by Day Man on Jul 1, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shields by decision before totally kickass Diaz brawl.

"Fedor is in major trouble! FEDOR TAPS! FEDOR TAPS! FABRICIO WERDUM WINS BY SUBMISSION (TRIANGLE CHOKE), ROUND 1!" - Brent Brookhouse, BloodyElbow.com

by SSreporters on Jul 1, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sheilds takes that by Staph and stay.

I get more rec's then a Toyota!

by DayGeaux on Jul 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

They seem to be tight knit too. I highly doubt they would fight.

Hard core MMA fan since UFC 99

by ChiCubs23 on Jul 1, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

just wait til the ufc gets the hype machine going, jake shields fans will be everywhere and no one will know where they came from despite at this moment I can count the number of shields fans that I know personally, myself included, on one hand and still have fingers left.

www.mmalinker.com

by exsanguinator on Jul 1, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I guess you missed seeing him fight from September 2006 to June 2009.

In that three year period he finished all eight guys that he fought and reeled off five consecutive first round finishes to boot (six in all).

Boring indeed.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Last year he was finishing guys, this year he's not.

To clarify, I’m no longer a fan of his because he doesn’t try to advance his position.

by B.H. Farnsworth on Jul 1, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Huh?

How can you advance from the fucking mount?

It’s not like he is laying in people’s guards. He is advancing his position. He’s just not finishing once he gets there.

Bitching about Shields not finishing is reasonable. Bitching about him not advancing position is ludicrous.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

He got the mount and couldn't finish. Twice, I think.

After that he didn’t try to advance at all. The Mayhem fight is a perfect example. He either didn’t want to or couldn’t advance his position. Both of those fights were practically no gi grappling matches, except for the right hand by Hendo. Not to mention almost getting finished by Mayhem.

by B.H. Farnsworth on Jul 1, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Frank Shamrock is a fan

Well, he was for a little while

How is that like Goulet? That dude goes out cold in a drafty room - Blackout612

by Well Read Idiot on Jul 1, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because he is top level talent. The UFC wants a monopoly on top talent, and someone new for GSP.

Shields is a submission machine at WW, at MW he runs into trouble because his opponents can power out of subs.

I think Shields will get Kampmann and the winner of that will get a title shot.

Keep Firing, Assholes!

Have you accepted BROCKLESNARRRRRR!!!!!!! as your personal Heavyweight Champion?

by Ubernoober on Jul 1, 2010 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Shields will get Kampmann and the winner of that will get a title shot.

I’d prefer Shields fight GSP right away, but yeah, I think this is what will happen.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shields turning Kampmann into a pretzel and getting a sub win is a great introduction. The UFC would also need footage of Shields, because they don’t really have any.

They don’t want to end up like SF and just have footage of a guy who is contending for a title just hitting a heavy bag.

Keep Firing, Assholes!

Have you accepted BROCKLESNARRRRRR!!!!!!! as your personal Heavyweight Champion?

by Ubernoober on Jul 1, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Shields is a legit top-5 middleweight who can easily make 170 and offer some variety in a UFC division that GSP is very close to cleaning out entirely. I think it would be a slap to the MMA community if the UFC passed on an opportunity to sign a guy with Sheilds’ skill set and pedigree.

Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.

by Monte Fisto on Jul 1, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

So what does that say about Strikeforce not even making an effort to retain him?

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

(crickets)

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because he’s really, really, good.,

USMC vet. MMA nut. Rousimar Palhares is a dirty fighter.
Pain don't hurt...

by RolloTomasi on Jul 1, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why does the UFC need Jake Shields?

Uh, perhaps because he’s a top 5 middleweight and probably a top 5(ish)welterweight and the UFC could use some new blood injected into both those divisions.

I

by TMadeBurner on Jul 1, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Reply fail…

They don’t need him but they want him because he’s a top 5 middleweight and a top 5(ish) welterweight and could inject some new blood/life into those divisions.

by TMadeBurner on Jul 1, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lawler, Mayhem, and Hendo

are pretty legit scalps. Arguably better than any three he’s gotten at WW. Although his consistency at WW was insane.

"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe

by pdl on Jul 1, 2010 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

He does have his biggest win at MW

but I just think he was dominating guys by a wider margin. He’s finished more guys there too. Not to mention he’s got wins over Condit, Daley, and Okami at WW.

by B.H. Farnsworth on Jul 1, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Condit is not a great win to me.

I’ve never been impressed with him and he’s a result of WEC mania. Daley was a solid win even though Shields is a nightmare matchup for him. and Okami is a decent win but didn’t impress nearly as much at WW as he does at MW.

Shields’ tenacity against Lawler after failing on takedowns was remarkable, and to maul Hendo the way he did was insane. The Mayhem fight… whatever. Impressive control most of the time, bad position once or twice, tough guy to finish. Needs better GNP to soften guys up, but usually does OK without it.

"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe

by pdl on Jul 1, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Condit is a great fighter with one glaring hole in his game (wrasslin’). He’s basically the American version of Gegard Mousasi. Unfortunately for him, Jake Shields is tailor made for beating guys with crappy wrestling.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Needs better GNP to soften guys up

Needs elbows IMO.

Watch his EliteXC fights. He was stopping guys and setting up submissions with ground & pound. Now that he has elbows back, his ground & pound will be more than adequate.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Zuffa always is looking for credible challengers for Georges St. Pierre. Shields fills that role nicely.

by Andy R on Jul 1, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because both the MW and the WW divisions have been cleaned out by their champions and most of the top fighters have fought each other already.

 As it says he is Top 5 in MW and WW and has wins over four of the other top 10 in MW and 3 at WW.

8. Jake Shields (25-4-1)
.SHERDOG: P4P Ranking #8
There was a time just a few short years ago when Shields was reviled for being one of MMA’s most loathsome fighters to watch. During the last five years, the Cesar Gracie protégé has transformed himself from a drab, peripheral contender to one of the sport’s elite fighters. With his dominant April 17 upset over Dan Henderson, the Strikeforce middleweight champion now boasts a 14-bout winning streak and top-five credentials in two separate divisions. With it seeming more and more likely Shields is UFC-bound, he’ll have ample opportunity to expand on his resume inside the Octagon, regardless of whether it’s at 170 or 185.

by mixmaster2669 on Jul 3, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

This goes for Bellator too. Will Hector Lombard, Eddie Alvarez, Lyman Good or maybe Ben Askren and Joe Warren be stuck in minor league purgatory for the end of their careers?

I haven’t seen much of Lombard but Askren and Alvarez are ready for any bigger promotion. Askren could benefit from another year in bellator, but shit happens in MMA and you want to take your chance while you still have a strong hype behind you.

I'm a lover not a fighter

by spectaa on Jul 1, 2010 1:42 PM EDT reply actions  

i'm all for Askren and Warren building and growing in a smaller promotion right now

Lombard is UFC ready now. As is Alvarez.
BUT I fear for the day when Askren or Warren want to move on up and can’t. What’s the point of that?

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I swear that...

the UFC signed Hector Lombard for a fight once, but he had trouble getting a visa (he’s from Cuba, right?). Then he never ended up in the octagon and wound up with other promotions.

by mma_critic on Jul 1, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Australian of Cuban origin

We need all the elite fighters we can get, thankyou very much ;-)

How is that like Goulet? That dude goes out cold in a drafty room - Blackout612

by Well Read Idiot on Jul 1, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

he's now an Australian citizen

and can get into the US at will

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeez, if I didn’t know you, I’d swear that you were acknowledging that it’s ovah.

Also, boo Cung Le for not joining the tourney.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 1:44 PM EDT reply actions  

This is what I was saying in another comment regarding equity flow but in this case in the opposite direction…

The little equity they can build or sign is not flowing in strikeforce. Cung Le should have lost to Robbie Lawler… not scott smith. Hendo should of beaten or lost to Gegard not Jake Shields. Fedor should of lost to Overeem not the guy who was 2-2 in the UFC. In almost every instance UFC got the equity! Scott Smith a washout… Werdym couldnt make it in the UFC… and Shields is headed to the UFC.

They’ve been running in quicksand and they are sinking faster than they can stay afloat…

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

they tried too hard to build matches

i don’t believe much in building. i say make the best fight you can make

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

i think the ufc could come to regret shelving cain

and booking JDS vs Roy Nelson.
or they wanted to make sure cain was ring rusty so he won’t beat Brock.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

The beauty of the UFC is that they can spin it anyway that want and still get buys.

I get more rec's then a Toyota!

by DayGeaux on Jul 1, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Beauty or skill?

by McEwen on Jul 1, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Skill… or CURSE?

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

the ring rust wont help but it was also cains decision… he also wants to wait for the title shot.

From Zuffa’s perspective there are no regrets. If JDS cant beat Roy nelson he has no business fighting for the title. At the end of the day the cream rises to the top. Machida rose to the top and he and Zuffa were better for it – if machida lost on his way – oh well.

The equity Zuffa and the fighters build remain inhouse and gets stronger everyday. It’s like this giant bubble that just gets larger and larger as time goes on.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Win/win matchmaking

Joe Silva is the master of it. Rarely do you see a fight made in the UFC that doesn’t have upswing for the promotion regardless of who wins.

When you engage in matchmaking where the promotion openly pulls for one fighter over the other you’re just asking for trouble.

I have accepted BROCKLESNARRRRRR!!!!!!! as my personal Heavyweight Champion!
Baptized in Coors Light and Jack's Links jerky!!!
Dressed in my heavenly DeathClutch robes!!!

by Worldisart on Jul 1, 2010 2:47 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

i don’t believe much in building. i say make the best fight you can make

This is why I’d like to see GSP / Shields right away.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Zuffa might do the same thing they did with Hendo

and have Shields fight Silva at 185, then drop down to 170. The benefit for Zuffa is that, if he loses against Silva, they can still make the claim that he’s a natural WW who shouldn’t be at MW, but they gave him the shot anyway for dominating Henderson, who was himself close to a title shot when he left.

I can see many downsides to this approach, but the upside is that Zuffa gets a new opponent for both Silva and GSP, and they seriously need opponents for both of them.

by mma_critic on Jul 1, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

GSP vs Shields right away.

by goodbones on Jul 1, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jeez, if I didn’t know you, I’d swear that you were acknowledging that it’s ovah.

Kid Nate moved into the stage of acceptance after all his bitching and moaning didnt work.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Referring to yourself in the 3rd person

Goonisis likes this new development.

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former - Albert Einstein"
- Goonisis

by Goonisis on Jul 1, 2010 1:49 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Not sure what the point of the article is?

So now we are taking cheap shots at all non-Zuffa promotions? The sport is growing and none of us can honestly say what the future holds for anyone.

Is the UFC the best promotion today? Absolutely

Will it always be that way? Nobody can say

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 1:50 PM EDT reply actions  

I can.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not sure what the point of the article is?
No One Wants the (Strikeforce) Middleweight Title

I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down

by woomikee on Jul 1, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Um… wut? The current state of Strikeforce’s middleweight division, and the fact that they will lose their champion to the UFC is something to talk about for sure.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

When BJ Penn and Tito Ortiz left as UFC champs

Did the media write the “doom on the horizon” narrative that seems abundant since Fedor lost?

Jake wanted to pit Strikeforce against the UFC to drive his price up. Strikeforce decided Jake wasn’t worth what he was asking. They move on.

That is how free agency works.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s not just Jake leaving. It’s a culmination of a whole bunch of events that have led up to this point that makes SF looks so bad right now. SF will be okay. They’re not going to fold like EliteXC or Affliction. They’ll continue on, but their chances of competing on a national level just got even slimmer. PPV? Forget about it.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

PPV is the worst thing Strikeforce can do

The appeal of strikeforce is that they put on good, entertaining shows on Free and cheap access tv.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Tell that to Coker. They were planning on a PPV. Maybe he needs better business advisers.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

It sounds to me like they’re still planning to go PPV. How else do they generate the revenue to afford and keep any stars they build?

by Jahbulon on Jul 1, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think that’s what they want.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

BJ leaving with the belt is ancient history in MMA years.

by Jahbulon on Jul 1, 2010 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Strikeforce has been a national stage promotor for exactly 1 year

Not really fair to expect them to be the UFC on day 1.

Especially considering the UFC does anything in their power to hinder the Strikeforce promotion.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

they tried to play in the cand box with the big boys but the big boys either kept taking there best toys or their best toys ketp breakin. SF tried to be a big promotion but insted of looking to build up stars they tried to just leap frog off old ones.

Their formula was to build up one fighter banking on him to win. Thus far the results speak for themselves

by Riley_96 on Jul 1, 2010 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

When BJ Penn and Tito Ortiz left as UFC champs did the media write the "doom on the horizon" narrative that seems abundant since Fedor lost?

What little media there was …. absolutely …. and they were right.

The UFC was on life support and were getting their asses kicked by the Japanese promoters in terms of talent acquisition and retention. The perfect storm of TUF and a yakuza scandal in Japan eventualy brought the UFC back to the top, but that doesn’t change the fact they were getting eviscerated prior to 2005.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I can honestly tell you what the future holds for strikeforce but you probably dont want to hear it…

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Due tell

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Showtime is no closer to their goals than they were 3 years ago. This wasnt a strikeforce/ufc battle… it was a showtime/ufc battle… strikeforce is just a proxy. First time Zuffa went up against a network.

Strikeforce has been relegated to a b-league and Showtime will be out of the mma business because it’s not permium content anymore. Initially their goal was to have comparable content to UFC ppv’s but on a premium outlet. 3 years ago that niche seemed more plausible but now with all the UFC prelims, fight nights ufc on versus you cant be a premium channel when the brand leader is available on free basic cable on a such a frequent basis. Next year it will get worse for them with even more UFC programming.

You now have like 3 UFC’s inbetween every show they put on. They cant get any momentum.

3 years later their not closer to even a viable ppv to keep things going. It’s over.
 
Strikeforce will find a more permanent home, most likely hdnet and showtime will be added to the tombstone.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

hdnet should become an all mma channel

it’s the closest thing they’ve got to a niche with so many other HD channels.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, if they could televise all the regional promotions from all over the world that would be something.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nostralogic

I get more rec's then a Toyota!

by DayGeaux on Jul 1, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Keep Firing, Assholes!

Have you accepted BROCKLESNARRRRRR!!!!!!! as your personal Heavyweight Champion?

by Ubernoober on Jul 1, 2010 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

the fastest route is a straight line….

USMC vet. MMA nut. Rousimar Palhares is a dirty fighter.
Pain don't hurt...

by RolloTomasi on Jul 2, 2010 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

The sport is growing

The UFC is growing.

Everyone else is struggling.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hope Joe Warren does get stuck in Bellator and goes away. Dude has no finishing ability, just toughs his way out of subs he supidly puts himself in, and sits on top for the decision. doesn’t even try to be active. puts forth zero actual offense, and he ain’t gonna improve. don’t need any more boringness.

Unlike Askren (who’s been doing some BJJ since he was 17), Warren is too old and too traditional of a wrestler to develop the transitions and subs that can allow wrestlers to not be soul-crushingly boring, like Askren, GSP, Shields (i know peeps will disagree on that one, but they have only watched his last 2 fights).

Wrestling isn’t the problem, we should just not let any wrestler over the age of 26 and hasn’t trained anything else come over to MMA

a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon

by eastcoastatlas on Jul 1, 2010 1:55 PM EDT reply actions  

sorry for the tangent, got worked up about Joe Warren

a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon

by eastcoastatlas on Jul 1, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah, no retroactivity

a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon

by eastcoastatlas on Jul 2, 2010 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

except i've really enjoyed some of warren's fights

his ability to get take downs at will is always fun to watch and the fight with pitbull was a testament to heart. it shoulda been stopped in the first tho.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Kid Nate on Jul 1, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

obviously can’t question the guy’s heart or willpower or cardio or toughness, but the pitbull fight was the only time in this tournament he even bruised up somebody’s face.

I wrestled in high school and love takedowns, but in MMA i can’t stand seeing nothing done with them. it’s no mystery to me why even when my wrestling team had multiple state-placer quality guys, the stands were still empty except for our parents

a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon

by eastcoastatlas on Jul 1, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anderson Silva LOLOLOL

"A man that does not fall, does not stand up."

by CROOKS on Jul 1, 2010 1:59 PM EDT reply actions  

true

I would like to see it. If he can do Anderson like he did Hendo my head would explode.

"A man that does not fall, does not stand up."

by CROOKS on Jul 1, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

He also got dropped in the first round.

If Hendo didn’t gas so early we might be having a very different conversation right now.

by B.H. Farnsworth on Jul 1, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hendo gassed because Jake was riding him like a pony.

by Steve4192 on Jul 1, 2010 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Scott Coker is like Michael Scott from The Office

In that everything he tries to do turns into one epic clusterfuck. Coker is just really uncomfortable to watch when he does business. He’s done really well with Strikeforce as a regional promotion, but on this national stage, it just falls apart. I think he’s in over his head and won’t admit it. It’s really uncomfortable.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 1:59 PM EDT reply actions  

That’s what she said.

by INGO B on Jul 1, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

It's easy to criticize from the sidelines and with the benefit of hindsight

As you said, he did wonders with a regional promotion, enough so that he got a crack at the big leagues. He got hit with some bad luck, made some bad decisions, and was faced with formidable antagonists (Zuffa, M-1, etc.). And just because Strikeforce isn’t close to the UFC, that makes Coker a bumblefuck? What other MMA promotion is close to the UFC? Wouldn’t that make every other promoter in MMA not named Dana White a bumblefuck?

by Pantherhare on Jul 1, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wouldn’t that make every other promoter in MMA not named Dana White a bumblefuck?

Dude. Kind of.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Sorry, that’s just asinine.

by Pantherhare on Jul 1, 2010 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

What's your point?

Don’t try to aspire to be more than a regional promotion because many have failed before?

They don’t put guys with that type of gutless attitude in charge.

by Pantherhare on Jul 1, 2010 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think his point is that every other fighter in MMA not named Dana White is a bumblefuck.

by Phildo on Jul 1, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

No not whats hes saying. SF are making stupid mistakes that are easy to see coming. Banking on one dude to win in a fight and thus planning a PPV around outcomes that have not happened is foolish and a terriable way to do business.

by Riley_96 on Jul 1, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Now all we need is..

for Strikeforce to release itself from MMA

by SBrooks on Jul 1, 2010 2:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Why does my account say I posted something with 2 replies....

Then I come here to see what they are and I havent posted anything? Did i say something wrong? I dont even remember what it was.

PLEASE HELP

by Opposites Attack on Jul 1, 2010 2:06 PM EDT reply actions  

When you go into your profile, and see that there are two replies to a post you did, like the one you did on The Art of War posting, click on the specific comment link itself and you’ll see it takes you right to the posting. In that case, RolloTomasi and SSReporters both replied to your “hahahaha” post.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

The thing is, When I clicked back to my profile to verify....

even that notification that I had 2 responses was gone. That one was to something entirely different. Something strange is going on here. I definitely didnt say anything offensive….Im confused

by Opposites Attack on Jul 1, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also....

the 2 replies were to something I posted here, not the art of war one.

by Opposites Attack on Jul 1, 2010 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hm. don’t know what to say then.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Strikeforce is in a no win situation with many of the "Fans" on the interwebs

If they overpay to keep Shields, they run the risk of blowing their budget and following the Affliction model.

People hated the affliction model

They adhere to a budget and don’t cave to Shields’ demands.

People hate that they won’t overspend for this guy or that guy

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:07 PM EDT reply actions  

Meh. It’s how the internet is. Kid Nate says something negative about the UFC, he gets called a Zuffa hater. He says something positive about the UFC, he gets called a Zuffa nuthugger. See what I did there?

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn't call anyone a name

I just thought the article took a fanboy tone, and took some unnecessary shots at Strikeforce.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t meant to imply you called someone a name. You didn’t. I was just articulating a similar example of how fickle and braindead the internet can be.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately the MMA interwebs

Tend to be populated with some mouth breathers. Probably for a combination of reasons.

" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "

by aaronb on Jul 1, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I hate trying to read something that is transcribed word for word with all of the “you know’s” and stuff like that…you know what I mean?

by KYBengalsFan on Jul 1, 2010 2:15 PM EDT reply actions  

You know it’s important to keep all the “you knows,” you know?

by frosnt1 on Jul 1, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

1. Really good article that gives a pretty concise view of everything that is wrong with Strikeforce right now. They constantly back themselves into promotional corners and when thing don’t work out – which seems to always be the case – they’re left standing with their dick in their hands looking like twits who don’t know what they’re doing. You can blame fighters and M-1 for some of it, but that falls at Coker’s and SF’s feet as well since they’re supposed to be the PROMOTERS. And, I hadn’t thought much of the “champion’s clause” in terms of what that actually means for fighters, but the end result is really quite awful. I see the need for it as a promotion, but at this point, why would ANYONE want to be an SF champion?

2. People need to stop quoting Dave Meltzer. Or, at least run it through a 1980’s valley girl to English translator. The man gives me, like, such, a, you know, like, really, you know, a headache.

by McEwen on Jul 1, 2010 2:34 PM EDT reply actions  

I don’t think Strikeforce pulling out of negotiations with Shields really hurts Shields bargaining position, as I don’t think Dana wants to start getting into bidding wars either. And I think for whatever reason SF was never all that keen on keeping Shields around from the looks of it. They started putting out all that talk of a MW tourney (that now looks like its not going to happen) when they were supposed to be negotiating with him.

And yeah, at the end of the day Dana would book Silva/Shields to make money.

by Hardcase on Jul 1, 2010 2:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Nice

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

There’s a confusion regarding the strikeforce champions clause. You dont need to lose to become a free agent. IF you win a title strikeforce has the optone to extend the contract 1 year and I believe it’s 3 fights. They can extend it ONCE. So that means a strikeforce champ doesnt need to lose to become a free agent even though they have that clause in their agreement.

Now the agents in the know dont sign that. I believe King Mo had that taken out of the contract and instead of agreeing to 3 fights he agreed to 4. Same with Hendo, Overeem doesnt have it and he has 2 more fights left or an expiration date of end of the year to early next, etc…

Guys like werdum who had their sister negotiate for them and brett rogers sign whatever was put infront of them only looking at the dollar amounts.

Bellator is different… Im not clear on it but Monte Cox surely didnt sign anything too restrictive. At one point Bellator wanted to trademark their fighters names and have lifetime ownership rights to them regardless if they won the belt or not. I think they were bitchslapped but I dont know how far down to earth they dropped.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 2:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Luke asked Rebney about that trademark clause when he was on his show recently. Rebney explained it as only trademarking the fighter’s name to be used in a promotional way for events. They can’t use it for merchandise or anything else like that.

Just BE.

by mattman73 on Jul 1, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok question here

what exactly are the terms of the champonship clause? and how the hell does it work something like that really doesnt seem at all legal to me

We have a saying back home that if your coming on, COME ON!!!!

by milk72 on Jul 1, 2010 3:15 PM EDT reply actions  

In Bellators case have a look over here. Keep in mind that not every signs for the same terms. Contract templates get modified all the time based on you pulling power.

Strike force is in kind of a funny position because they picked up a number of contracts from EliteXC that have different terms from what they may have asked a fighter to sign. Fighters like Shields and Beerbohm come to mind.

by j.villain on Jul 1, 2010 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Strikeforce has the ladies 135 tournament lined up for August so the odds of them kicking off the mens MW tournament in Aug were slim to begin with. Meaning that Diaz and Millar if they want in will be fine.

I have read internet trolls writing hundreds and some times thousands of times every single day for the last 3 years that Strikeforce is finished and will be gone any day now. But they are still here. They have a very small staff of 10 people and they don’t over pay their fighters. The tab for the really big names is mostly picked up by CBS/Showtime. The internet seems to be a magnet for haters but a year from now I will still be watching Strikeforce fights.

by j.villain on Jul 1, 2010 3:17 PM EDT reply actions  

of course you will, just you will find it on youtube.

by Riley_96 on Jul 1, 2010 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

First off, Jake Shields really screwed himself out of some money. After beating Hendo, he should have been set. Unfortunately for him the ratings tanked, which means that he was no longer vital to Strikeforce’s plans, and then had the mental lapse to pose with Dana. Easily a $100,000 a fight lost between those two items.

Secondly, it pains me to suggest it but Strikeforce’s best hope is to start promoting pure spectacle. Book every pro-wrestler, street fighter, and celebrity they can get their hands on. In other words become the type of promotion I have no interest in watching.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 4:28 PM EDT reply actions  

I can’t believe Strikeforce’s offer to Shields wasn’t at least 100k guaranteed a fight. Just look at their recent payouts for guys like Cung Le, Robbie Lawler, Babalu and others. In fact you posted some of this the other day.

vs Scott Smith at Fedor vs Werdum – $100,000
vs Scott Smith at Strikeforce: Evolution – $150,000
vs Frank Shamrock – $200,000

Renato “Babalu” Sobral ($100,000) def. Robbie Lawler ($85,000) from Strikeforce: Los Angeles

If those guys are making that kind of money then how does Strikeforce not offer Shields at least 100k guaranteed a fight. I mean if I’m Shields and those guys are making that kind of money then I got to get an offer of at least 100k a fight.

Maybe I’m crazy but I see Shields getting at least 125k/125k deal from the UFC.

Just BE.

by mattman73 on Jul 1, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fitch gets 45/45 for UFC 100.

125/125 would be madness for Shields. BS he gets that…

"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe

by pdl on Jul 1, 2010 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

When I said he lost $100,000 I meant an additional $100,000 per fight i.e. he went from a 150/100 contract to 75/75. All because a) the Nashville fight bombed in the rating, and b) he had to stick a finger in Strikeforce’s eye.

Hell, if everything fell into place he might have got more.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Strikeforce should just do away with all their belts……..it’s not like they hold much value anyway.

USMC vet. MMA nut. Rousimar Palhares is a dirty fighter.
Pain don't hurt...

by RolloTomasi on Jul 1, 2010 5:29 PM EDT reply actions  

“cleared out a minor league”

Not sure which is worse, that comment or what Lutfi Sariahmed and Jack Encarnacao attempt to put out on a regular basis as informed commentary.

by pj48 on Jul 1, 2010 8:01 PM EDT reply actions  

You know...

Dave Meltzer is the most annoying writer/speaker in the world. I can read one sentence and no more…you know?? There are at least 5 “you knows” in every freakin sentence. Please, somebody has got to teach him how to write or speak.

I don’t even care what he says anymore…you know..he’s got to grow up and learn to speak proper English. He sounds totally ghetto.

by H3R0 on Jul 1, 2010 9:08 PM EDT reply actions  

Actually, I think dominating in a smaller promotion for a few years can help a fighter’s career more than signing with the UFC right away. I mean, take a fighter like Ben Askren. He’s a young guy who’s still getting better. If he signed with the UFC right now, he would probably wind up lost in the shuffle in a division full of other monster wrestlers. But if he stays with Bellator he gets to look like a world-beater, which as Shields has shown, increases your bargaining power once the promotion folds or you get freed up for whatever other reason. And even if he ends up “trapped” in a Bellator contract, he can still make a decent living. So “golden handcuffs” is too negative, I think.

by Amor on Jul 1, 2010 9:47 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m wondering about this whole thing where it is being implied that this Strikeforce Middleweight Tournament won’t happen. The Diaz and Mayhem thing where they aren’t able to fight until August/Septemtber shouldn’t hinder a tournament considering that August is just next month and September is a month after that. If Cung doesn’t want in, then there are fighters like Luke Rockhold, or even Scott Smith or Joey Villasenor that they could put in. I mean, is this tournament just not happening, or what because I am honestly confused whether this is conjecture or really not happening?
To my knowledge, even if someone has the Strikeforce Title, that person gets more money from sponsorships by having the Title and being in main events making the belt not totally meaningless as far as getting more money for a fighter is concerned. While I imagine that fighters want to go to the UFC, there are fighters that have opted to go to Strikeforce or resign with them like Mousasi instead of going to the UFC. Maybe some of these fighters know that they can be champions at Strikeforce or be constantly on their main cards, but can’t do the same in the UFC.

by chrisbboy82 on Jul 2, 2010 1:07 AM EDT reply actions  

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