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Strikeforce Disasters, Part 1: Fedor Emelianenko Flops on Showtime

Fedor, his translator and manager. Photo by Esther Lin via Showtime Sports

Oh my oh my. Lots of Strikeforce news this morning. First off, Dave Meltzer reports that Fedor's numbers were just so-so on Showtime:

The two-hour show itself did a 1.5 rating and 492,000 total viewers on Showtime, better than average mixed martial artsnumbers on the network, but not close to the network's previous high marks.

Last summer's Gina Carano vs. Cristiane "Cyborg" Santos women's title fight set a Showtime record with a 2.2 rating. Herschel Walker's MMA debut on Jan. 30 did a 1.8 rating. Emelianenko's numbers were also lower than several shows headlined by both Kimbo Slice and Frank Shamrock.

Emelianenko came with a higher price tag than the others, however, including having to give his M-1 Global backing company co-promotional rights.

The Russian's first appearance on U.S. television on Nov. 7, a win over Brett Rogers on CBS, did a 2.5 rating. The show was not a ratings home run, but was considered a success. In particular, Emelianenko vs. Rogers, gaining 1.49 million new viewers from the previous fight, was the second biggest fight in U.S. television MMA history when it comes to new viewers being added to the telecast.

The prior major Strikeforce event, on May 15, headlined by Alistair Overeem defending the heavyweight title against Brett Rogers, did a 1.0 rating, showing that Overeem, in his first live major television appearance on U.S. television (he had appeared on HDNet events televised live from Japan), needs time to develop interest among U.S. consumers

As I wrote back in April, M-1 really screwed Fedor and themselves when they sat out the April Strikeforce on CBS show:

The tragedy of M-1's hold out was that Fedor was primed for a break out performance on the heels of his dramatic KO win over Brett Rogers. Now I doubt that he'll have a second bite at the U.S. network television apple. Whatever M-1 Global is doing, they are NOT looking out for what's best for Fedor's career. Had he posted even better numbers and more media attention for his second CBS fight, he'd have been a star in the biggest sports market in the world. Now he'll be a might have been.

As a hardcore fan, I loved the show, but it was clearly a business disaster that might have cost Strikeforce the CBS relationship. With just Showtime, frankly they can't afford Fedor. But since M-1 is under contract with Strikeforce, expect it to take quite a bit of untangling to work out.

And the oddest thing of all about their decision to sit out that event is it's entirely unclear what they got out of it. There were no more mentions of M-1 Global on this broadcast than on any other. I didn't see any of their roster of dynamite talent on the main card. 

Worst of all, without CBS's PR department to push Fedor to the press, the fight got zero mainstream coverage. And I wouldn't envy the Strikeforce PR flack that had to try to pitch Fedor on Showtime because the obvious question in a reporter's mind is "if this guy is such a legend why the hell is he fighting on Showtime?"

Well luckily for Scott Coker, he won't have to deal with Vadim Finkelchstein on such uneven terms in the future. As an MMA fan with a near lust for exciting international talent I hate to see M-1 Global be the sole major player in Russian MMA -- with the bumper crop of top flight wrestlers, judokas, boxers, kickboxers and sambo fighters that country produces it's a huge loss to world MMA to not have access to the next generation of Emelianenkos, TaktarovsZinovievs, VovchanchynsVolk HansIlioukhines, Matyushenkos and Arlovskis. 

Now speaking of headaches that Coker is glad to be done with we've got the news that Strikeforce has "released" Jake Shields and the seeming collapse of their promising middleweight tournament. 

We'll cover that in Part 2: No One Wants Jake Shields' Strikeforce Middleweight Title

And in the full entry, there's some discussion of where Fedor goes from here and the status of Strikeforce's heavyweight class:

Strikeforce_fedor_vs_werdum_medium

Star-divide

Beau Dure chimes in:

But in the last five years, a class of powerful heavyweights has wiped aside the old guard in the UFC. Because Fedor and his M-1 Global company have refused to make a deal with the UFC, he hasn't faced them. Instead, he lost to a fighter who was 2-2 in an 18-month UFC stint.

Fedor is still young for an MMA fighter at 33, though he bears the scars of a long, busy career. He's not too old to rededicate himself to proving his status as a universally acclaimed No. 1.

The questions are whether he realizes the need to do so, wants to do so and knows how to do so.

Zach Arnold on Strikeforce and Fedor:

Now that he's lost, Fedor is still an amazingly great fighter and all-time legend, but he's no longer FEDOR in the psyche of so many of his supporters. It's an emotional letdown now. Plus, the fact that he lost to a fighter who most people didn't have ranked in the Top 10 of MMA Heavyweights has all but obliterated any sense of importance about Strikeforce's Heavyweight picture.

The truth is that nothing that happens in Strikeforce amongst the Heavyweights will impact the scene at all any more. Because there were such gaps in disparity between the major stars in Strikeforce's Heavyweight division, one top guy falling suddenly collapses the whole picture.

UFC already was able to say that they had the best heavyweights 2-through-5 and also some talent on the bottom of the Top 10 list. Now they are able to clearly say that the winner of the UFC 116 main event is the #1 Heavyweight in the world. The promotion is able to say with a straight face that all the best Heavyweights fight under the Zuffa banner. The Heavyweight division is still the glamour division in fighting in America. Strikeforce just lost any chance of having an impact in that department.

I'm less interested in those questions than what happens to Alistair Overeem, who, unlike Jake Shields, is presumably struck with a champions clause in his contract. That means that Overeem can't escape the clutches of Strikeforce unless he loses or is willing to endure a lengthy law suit. 

It's easy to understand why Dana White is now publicly disinterested in Overeem after talking up his desire to sign him just months ago. Being champion in a second tier organization is now going to be a career death trap.

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Better, less people saw him lose his first fight then

by mmaniac22 on Jul 1, 2010 11:33 AM EDT reply actions  

I think it’s worse. It was an amazing fight. If he had lost like that on CBS, SF could still promote the rematch. As it is, no one saw anything, and Fedor lost. What good is that?

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't envy Scott Coker right now

He’s been eating nothing but turd sandwiches lately.

You gotta pay the troll toll, to get into this boy's soul.

by WestbergIDFC on Jul 1, 2010 11:35 AM EDT reply actions  

thats what happens when u compete against dana and the ufc

they really make everything look so easy when in reality its really really really fucking hard, scotty shoulda stayed on the regional level

We have a saying back home that if your coming on, COME ON!!!!

by milk72 on Jul 1, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Look at how they let Shamrock dis their Champion Jake Shields from the broadcaste booth," under valued and disrespected " and they wonder why he is leaving without a good bye?

Shields is just one of the major mistakes they have made, but he is an easy example. Shields has been unbeaten since 2004, he has won four championships and is ranked in P4P and is one of only two fighters ranked in 2 weight classes(A Silva is the other)
He is a well spoken American, yet they have not promoted him. Instead they counter marketed him.
No more Fedor, no Shields and SF is in serious trouble.

by mixmaster2669 on Jul 3, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

blood, water, shark

couldn’t help myself

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

Quick!

Use your Bat Shark Repellent Spray!

"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe

by pdl on Jul 1, 2010 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Im sure coker calling BE a gossip site was helped with lack of motivation.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Get yours facts straight.

That was “BloodyKnees” he was insulting which is a totally different site.

If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.

by Sabate on Jul 1, 2010 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

yaeh

when dana hated on us in espn the magazine they at least got the name right!

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Calling it bloodyknees was an additional insult. Why do you think Kid Nate has 2 parts to this story?

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was being sarcastic.

Sorry I didn’t indicate that well.

If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.

by Sabate on Jul 1, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah

but Dana’s given me plenty of fuel for the fire.
I was raised to keep fucking with people who shit on you until they stop.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

the difference is you wont win a shit contest with Zuffa so stick to coker. I bet after a week scott calls you up begging for forgiveness.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Oh God BloodyElbow is such a UFC nuthugging website.

and Kid Nate is obviously paid by Zuffa… It’s true! I read the title of this post as proof!

by Anton Tabuena on Jul 1, 2010 11:47 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

blood, water, shark

couldn’t resist. it’s my nature

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

So the next question is, can you jump yourself?

Guillotine.

by iiowyn on Jul 1, 2010 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

if people weren’t watching when he was “undefeated”, who’s gonna watch his next fight after his first loss?

by kakuto kid on Jul 1, 2010 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

It didnt even do a 1.5…. Showtime didn’t count the segment where Frank Shamrock was jerking off to himself. The actual rating was a 1.38

The historical numbers on showtime:

2.2 Gina Carano vs. Cyborg
1.9 Kimbo vs. Tank
1.7 Shamrock vs. Baroni
1.6 Shamrock vs. Gracie
1.6 Kimbo vs. Bo Cantrell
1.5 Shamrock vs. Diaz

It didnt even make the top 6.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 11:41 AM EDT reply actions   1 recs

I like how Dana says it was 400,000 viewers instead of 492,000. Had it been his PPV, he’d have called it 500,000.

I want Kim Winslow or Tan Dan to ref Tito Ortiz' next fight.

by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jul 1, 2010 11:44 AM EDT reply actions  

Anyway you look at it, the are sinking.

We heard from all the anti Zuffa zealots about IFL, EliteXE, Affliction, BoDog, and now Strikeforce. Its the same people using the same strawman bs.

I heard every story know to man about Affliction and how they were going to do this and that. Someone here said Striekforce was going to do 40 shows a year. I could bank on it. And he seems to be lurking, not posting.

 Amazing what a good business model does for a promoter vs a promoter trying to make a new business model.

by Riney on Jul 1, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Seriously, SF needs to do some better promoting cause not even my Fedor-Fanboy Friend had any idea he was fighting. The release of Jake Shields just opens up the MW Tournament kinda Pride and Dream. I don’t think it’ll hurt thme that bad. But if they want a boost of ratings, especially to the guys that don’t have Showtime (i.e. Me), they really gotta put themselves out there. Find some way to appeal to bars and mainstream commercials. I knew a lotta people that knew about the Cotto-Foreman fight and had no idea about Fedor or what StrikeForce is.

by Krimson on Jul 1, 2010 11:48 AM EDT reply actions  

wow

what kind of fedor fanboy doesnt know when fedor is fighting??? i ordered superchannel here in canada just to watch the fight, then cancelled it the next day lol. fedor is forever!!!!!!!!! no matter what :)

by abatoir on Jul 1, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah I was trying to find a friend that has showtime so I could see the fight. Then realized for $15 i could see Fedor fight plus get a bunch of movie channels for a month.

Showtime just got a new customer.
I got to watch my friend break out in tears when Fedor tapped.

Everybody wins.

by sloppyknoll on Jul 1, 2010 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Under Finki’s bed.

"For your information, I would like to ask a question."
-Samuel Goldwyn

by fedorade on Jul 1, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

When it rains, it pours.

"For your information, I would like to ask a question."
-Samuel Goldwyn

by fedorade on Jul 1, 2010 11:50 AM EDT reply actions  

If everything went Coker’s way Fedor vs Werdum, Overeem vs Rogers, Shields vs Henderson, and Lashley or Mayhem would all have been scheduled for the April card, with Fedor, Overeem, and Hendo all winning to set up a big ppv. Instead basically everything that could go wrong did. Shit, if everything had gone Coker’s way Bigfoot would have put away Werdum in the first round in October and fans would have been salivating for a Fedor/Bigfoot fight

I still think Fedor fighting in April on CBS would have been a hit. Maybe not quit Kimbo numbers but a marked improvement over the November event. There was still a sense of excitement after the KO of Rogers,. b with the lack of enthusiasm for Werdum and the backlash generated by the M-1 holdout interest waned the longer it was delayed. Sometime best laid plans can go astray and unfortunately for Coker this wasn’t even much of a plan.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 11:51 AM EDT reply actions  

“Fool me once…

"For your information, I would like to ask a question."
-Samuel Goldwyn

by fedorade on Jul 1, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah M-1 really screwed the pooch

I watched Fedor vs Rogers in a big room full of casuals and non-fans. Fedor really captivated people. We watched the fight four times in a row while everyone oohed and aaahed.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn’t envy the Strikeforce PR flack that had to try to pitch Fedor on Showtime because the obvious question in a reporter’s mind is “if this guy is such a legend why the hell is he fighting on Showtime?”

Minor nitpick, but they could just say it’s for the same reason Lennox Lewis’ very last fight, against Vitali Klitschko, was on HBO: premium cable has fewer customers but they pay a lot of money for their programming. Lewis was arguably the biggest name in boxing at that point other than maybe Oscar De La Hoya.

by Chromium on Jul 1, 2010 11:55 AM EDT reply actions  

Showtime is not HBO.

by McEwen on Jul 1, 2010 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

it’s a different dynamic though. Lewis’ promoter wasn’t running fights on network TV at the time.

Ditching that CBS card is one of several very questionable decisions from M1 and Fedor’s camp.

by Phildo on Jul 1, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

you can do that

but if you’re explaining, you’re losing. if you’re pitching a busy big time reporter you’ve got about 30 seconds to sell them the story. it’s been done before. The NY and LA Times both have done long features on Fedor, so did TIME magazine. UFC could have gotten him some serious coverage. But CBS is going after an even more mass audience so they really worked it.

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

M-1

continually makes decisions that are NOT in the best interest of Fedor…i just wish Fedor could see it, or if he does see it, that he actually gives a shiiite

by SNATCHFACE on Jul 1, 2010 12:12 PM EDT reply actions  

Fixed for Meltzer
Emelianenko came with a higher price tag than the others, however, including having to give his M-1 Global backing company co-promotional rights half of the fucking money.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 12:30 PM EDT reply actions  

You know what i'm afraid of in all this?

Hershal Walker, Bautista, Jose Canseco, Bobby Lashesly and whatever other no-talnet goofballs SF can dig up on CBS. They’ll push these guys as legit mixed martial artists due to all these struggles and many of the people who watch won’t know any better. Next thing you know the public perception of MMA takes another big hit.

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former - Albert Einstein"
- Goonisis

by Goonisis on Jul 1, 2010 12:36 PM EDT reply actions  

I guess....

in a way this shows that StrikeForce maybe doesn’t need Fedor to stay afloat. Everyone tends to believe that just like EliteXC, the weight of a promotion sits on 1 fighter, perhaps that isnt exactly how it is for StrikeForce.

by Cestus84 on Jul 1, 2010 12:39 PM EDT reply actions  

I was thinking the same thing, they had alot of eggs in Fedor’s basket but now M-1 doesn’t have Coker bent over the table. Maybe he will stick with strikeforce for a lower price when his contract is up.

Even though im sure dana’s full of shit when he says he now has zero interest in Fedor, maybe strikeforce will be able to hold on to him

by 19Miles on Jul 1, 2010 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

What?
Plus, the fact that he lost to a fighter who most people didn’t have ranked in the Top 10 of MMA Heavyweights has all but obliterated any sense of importance about Strikeforce’s Heavyweight picture.

I’m pretty sure EVERY reputable site/blog had Fabricio in the Top 10.

by xfreekx on Jul 1, 2010 12:42 PM EDT reply actions  

Amen

"Players are gods, the stands are the pews, football is the new religion."

by DamnSevern on Jul 1, 2010 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Actual Event Numbers:

1.5 HH rating with a viewership of 492k. The main event peaked at a 2.1 HH and peaked at 700K viewers. The show itself did a 1.48 in Males 18-34 and 1.08 in Males 35-49.

Attendance for the event was 12,698 total (11, 757 paid, 941 in luxury boxes) with a gate of $1,066,739.00

This show was only behind Gina, Kimbo, and Herschel Walker’s events on Showtime, which is expected since they have more star power than Fedor. Still 3rd most watched Strikeforce MMA event, 2nd highest gate. Not a flop, just a good measurement stick of being a draw.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 1:33 PM EDT reply actions  

6th most attended.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yup
  1. 18,265 – “Strikeforce: Shamrock vs. Gracie” (March 2006)
  2. 16,326 – “Strikeforce: Shamrock vs. Le” (March 2008)
  3. 15,211 – “Strikeforce: Shamrock vs. Diaz” (April 2009)
  4. 14,749 – “Strikeforce: Evolution” (December 2009)
  5. 13,976 – “Strikeforce: Carano vs. Cyborg” (August 2009)
  6. 12,698 – “Strikeforce and M-1 Global: Fedor vs. Werdum” (June 2010)

… only because they have some crazy attendance numbers in San Jose.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

only this is

You’d think the attendance would go up with shows…not down progressively each year….blu blu blu….like the pacman sound.

http://www.mmaforreal.com
Follow Me On Twitter@MMA4Real

by Kelvin Hunt on Jul 1, 2010 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s the local promotion to national promotion effect, where they are drawing more outsiders now than they were in the past but also charging more for tickets.

Though Strikeforce: Shamrock vs Gracie got 18,265 in the building and about 17K paid (which still holds the record I believe) it only made 1/3 of the gate that Strikeforce: Fedor vs Werdum mad. Tickets were cheap and they relied heavily on the locals.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

only now m1 takes half.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

And still beats their old gate #’s still! Ha! =D

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

…and ONLY when Fedor fights, which has been a WHOPPING 2x’s LOL.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

there you are

glad to see you here Supremacy!

Follow me on Twitter @KidNate

by Nate Wilcox on Jul 1, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, no kidding.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

So Gina vs Cyborg peaked at 856K viewers (still holds the record and considered a huge success on Showtime) and Fedor vs Werdum considered a flop b/c main event peaked ONLY at 700K viewers??? ;)

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes

You’re supposed to grow.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

That only happened a year ago.. LOL… AND with one of the biggest starts in MMA. Pretty stable numbers for Showtime if you ask me, and if you look at their ratings for their normal events and Challenger series, they are growing and getting better ratings.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

  • with one of the biggest stars in MMA *

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

7th most watched mma event on showtime

2.2 Gina Carano vs. Cyborg
1.9 Kimbo vs. Tank
1.7 Shamrock vs. Baroni
1.6 Shamrock vs. Gracie
1.6 Kimbo vs. Bo Cantrell
1.5 Shamrock vs. Diaz

If you only want to count strikeforce and not elite xc then it was the 4th… the funny thing is Strikeforce only had like 6 or 7 shows so far!

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Misleading #'s

Fedor vs Werdum (main event) did a 2.1 HH rating with 700K viewers.

Most watched means total # of viewers, which in fact means that your statement above is incorrect. Here’s an example:

Shamrock vs Baroni had a 1.7 HH rating but only had an average of 410,000 viewers back in 2006 when Showtime had less subscribers. This event did a 1.5 HH rating and had an average of ~500K viewers, peak of 700K. In terms of most watched, this is actually in Shotime’s top 3-4 events only slightly behind Gina, Kimbo, and Walker.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

You can argue all you want,

just like you did with Affliction. This Strikeforce ship isn’t sailing. Doesn’t have a Captain or crew and is sitting in dry docks waiting for the water to rise.

Fedor was a bad business decision who is now damage goods. End of story.

by Riney on Jul 1, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

But the numbers don't matter

As a pay channel, actual rating don’t matter a whit to Showtime. They rate the Strikeforce card by how many people actually subscribe for only mma or that it is one of the deciding factors for ordering the channel. If it does 400,000 viewers but every viewer wouldn’t be subscribing to Showtime without the Strikeforce cards than it is a huge success.

I got to believe they are disappointed with not only the public numbers but their private ones as well, but it is almost useless to try and compare this card with Gina’s and say it proves it is or is not a failure.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

But the numbers don't matter

As a pay channel, actual rating don’t matter a whit to Showtime. They rate the Strikeforce card by how many people actually subscribe for only mma or that it is one of the deciding factors for ordering the channel. If it does 400,000 viewers but every viewer wouldn’t be subscribing to Showtime without the Strikeforce cards than it is a huge success.

I got to believe they are disappointed with not only the public numbers but their private ones as well, but it is almost useless to try and compare this card with Gina’s and say it proves it is or is not a failure.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

the numbers matter to sponsors. even though it’s not an ad supported channel, fighters and the event needs sponsors.

by mmalogic on Jul 1, 2010 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Correct...

The bottom line is whether people are signing up to watch MMA fights, how happy their viewers are, and how happy Showtime.

Just trying to play the #’s game with folks around here. =)

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did anyone reported the expanded ratings, quarter hours etc.? Or if you have them, can you send them to me?

This was obviously not a flop, but I guess the days of reasoned reactions to UFC and SF news are over here. Everything has to be framed in over the top militant fanboy form. I suppose if you tell everyone beforehand that Fedor can’t draw etc etc etc, you have a vested interest to portray it that way after the fact regardless of what actually happened.

by smoogy2 on Jul 1, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Or, you know, that’s what actually happened (more people tuned in to watch Herschel Walker fight than did Fedor Emelianenko) and those that hate the new MMA landscape are spinning furiously in reaction.

You know, whichever.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right, the new landscape of the inside of your head that you and 2-3 other bloggers obsess about. Yeah, that has really sent me reeling. Good luck trying to sell that retarded piece of punditry to the non-fanboys who don’t care at all.

I guarantee Hugh Jackman in a Wolverine costume vs. Brock Lesnar painted green would crush all UFC records. Fedor being less popular and mainstream than Herschel Walker in a curiosity fight doesn’t make this a flop. It would be like saying Liddell vs. Franklin was a flop becuase it failed to surpass old Ken Shamrock buyrates; just totally and completely wrong in every way.

by smoogy2 on Jul 1, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I think that last analogy is kind of a stretch. It’s like Strikeforce is losing people.

The bottom line is there will never be a #1 fighter outside of Zuffa again, and even when there was, more people were interested in an 0-0 1981 Heisman winner with multiple personalities. I mean, it can’t be fun for you, and I try to be sympathetic, so maybe I shouldn’t kick you while you’re down and allow you to sell the idea that Strikeforce’s sixth most attended card wasn’t a flop.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

That according to that gate #, which was their second gate ever over 1 million.

Here is some trivia: How many active promotions in N. America (outside of the UFC) have 1 million dollar plus gates? Answer: The WEC did it ONCE, Strikeforce has now done it TWICE.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not according…. jeebus. =)

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

You are officially a spermologist.

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Trivia is the correct word to use there.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

So how is a 1 million dollar plus gate for SF a flop again? =D

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cut it in half. That was SF’s gate. M-1 got the rest.

When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com

by Derek Suboticki on Jul 1, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do they actually get half the gate? It’s a claim I’ve seen time and time again, but is there an actual source for it? It seems linked to the idea that co-promotion means a 50/50 of all proceeds but it is my understanding that M-1 is actually more interested in possession of the foreign rights, branding, and possibly a cut of ppv sales (I think they were really hoping for an eventual boxing-type payday).

by John Nash on Jul 1, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Doesn’t matter, still comparable to their other gate #’s even after being cut in half. =D

For crying out loud, Miami’s gate was 300K and there was no co-promotion there. If you want to call ANY event a flop, that one was, but it was a ratings winner due to Herschel… soo. =)

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

You Sonofabitch!

Herschel Walker won the 1982 Heisman trophy! He should have won the 1981 Heisman also but those bastards all but had a policy not to give it to underclassmen back then

Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death

MMA For Real

by Anthony Pace on Jul 1, 2010 10:55 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

Nope, since Showtime doesn’t release their ratings people are getting them from other sources like SpikeTV releases (ha) or Meltzer.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

So where did you get the peak rating from?

by smoogy2 on Jul 1, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Meltzer, but 3 other sources all said the same thing, so that number is in fact correct. I just don’t have the breakdowns.

by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 1, 2010 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

truth

Everyone seems to misunderstand how the ratings work, and I’m glad you’re pointing it out. In terms of gross viewership, the numbers don’t matter as much. The real issue here is how many people have access to a particular channel (or in this case fight) and then the % of those who actually watch it, especially those who are willing to spend to watch it. Fedor v. Werdum did very well, and Strikeforce should be excited about the ratings. Regardless of what Dana White says, the fight did well, and I hope if there is a rematch that SF pulls through again.

by QuickJack on Jul 2, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

M-1 is like a sexually transmitted disease.

While they were busy fucking the UFC and Strikeforce over, they also managed to fuck over Fedor AND themselves. It’s like any contact with M-1 = burning piss that even Machida wouldn’t drink. All that bellyaching over co-promotion got them nothing. No 30 million dollars, no recognition on CBS, no ratings on Showtime, and their invincible fighter loses and nobody (not any meaningful significant number) sees it, thus having no ability to follow up a spectacular loss with an enticing rematch. It’s a joke.

by pud333 on Jul 1, 2010 1:40 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

This is full of WIN
M-1 = burning piss that even Machida wouldn’t drink

Fan of Tiger 'Makin It Rain' Woods

by B-A-N-A-N-A-S on Jul 1, 2010 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

M1 global sucks

i agree, they r screwing fedor’s legacy. the only good thing about the loss is that hopefully now we’ll see fedor fight more and regain his throne and mute the naysayers. m1 has lost major bidding power now

by abatoir on Jul 1, 2010 2:13 PM EDT reply actions  

M1 Just lost their bargaining chip, I hope they fade into obscurity

With Fedor no losing his status as the #1 265lbs fighter in the world, M1 no longer has a credible way for them to get their demands to be met. Perhaps after Fedor’s final fight in SF, Coker will wash his hands of M1 and move on. I’m sure he’s probably talked to Dana a couple of times and told him that he understands why Zuffa refused to go into business with M1. Perhaps the other promotions in Japan, Dream and WVR will get the memo that working with M1 is nothing but trouble and they would be better served not to work with them.

I’ve taken some time to think about this and may have figured out why M1 and Fedor refused the terms that Zuffa laid out for them last summer. M1 is a Russian company for all points and purposes and Russians are extremely nationalistic. When the UFC was refusing to give M1 50% promotional rights, it was like the cold war to them all over again. The UFC represents the US in alot of ways to the people in M1 Global and if they were to accept the terms of the contract the UFC had given to them, it would be like they losing the war again as they were not the ones dictating the terms of what was going on.

Fedor for as wonderful a person as he is, is very nationalistic and saw it as “These Americans are not going to control how the terms of this contract play out, I don’t care if they have better competition, can give me more$ and provide greater distribution. If they want to limit me to only fighting on their cards and won’t let my friends have a bigger slice of the pie, I’m not interested in going there”. Fedor is just as much at fault for not being the UFC as his management, he has said he has full control over all that is going on in his career. He would rather freelance and fight subpar competition than competing exclusively for the one place that would provide him better competition on a regualr basis. Fedor cuts open pretty easily and the UFC provides 2 things that he is not comfortable with, fighting in the cage and the one thing he has never had to deal with, Elbows to the face on the ground.

From 135lbs to 265lbs, Zuffa has the top fighters in the world, I’m not a UFC nutthugger but I call it like I see it and M1 is a total joke

by StealthBomber on Jul 27, 2010 6:48 PM EDT reply actions  

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