When a Loss Is Really a Win: Kimo Leopoldo Loses a Fight, Gains a Career Against Royce Gracie
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 3:08 PM EDT
in MMA History
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Recently our friends at Cage Potato put together a list of the "seven most triumphant losses in MMA history." Amazingly enough, four of these historical gems occurred in 2009-2010. Six occured in the TUF era and happened inside the Octagon. All seven went down post-2000. Somehow in this rigorous screening process, "the guy who replaced Ben Fowlkes" missed the most triumphant of all losses, a loss big enough to create a career from nothing.
Before UFC 3, Royce Gracie looked invincible. Boxers, kareteka, swoll pro wrestlers with bad ass leglocks-Gracie dismantled them all. His brother was part owner of the company and that, combined with his success, led to an announce team that verbally fellated him on PPV.
Needless to say, when he finally met stiff resistance the fans at home were shocked. Kimo Leopoldo looked like a tough guy. Covered in tats, he came to the cage carrying an enormous wooden cross on his back. He was repping Jesus, but one look at him told you he was repping his neighborhood as well. Kimo showed, if only for a minute, that size and strength do matter. That bad intentions do matter. That the best training in the world still leaves you vulnerable to a big, strong, tough dude.
More, plus a video of the fight, after the jump.
Gracie, in the end, was just a little meaner. It was this evil streak that made Royce so great. Others might have taken a loss here. Royce grabbed Kimo's hair and ripped for all he was worth. It turns out the little guy with great technique can beat the bully. He just has to be willing to fight a little dirty. Royce won the fight with an armbar, but the story of the match wasn't over.
After the beating, Gracie was unable to continue. His corner threw in the towel before a semi-final bout with Harold Howard. Kimo and his sensei Joe Son ran into the cage to celebrate. They were out of the tournament, but now, so was Gracie. Steve Jennum came in from the sidelines to become the first ninja to ever win a UFC tournament. More importantly, Kimo became a star.
With the muscles promoters dream of and a great gimmick, this loss to Gracie made Leopoldo. A year later his name meant enough for K-1 to bring him in as a sacrificial lamb for kickboxer Masaaki Satake. Two years later he was still famous enough to challenge Ken Shamrock for the UFC Superfight Title. Three years later and PRIDE threw big bucks at him to fight Dan Severn on their debut show. A full decade later he was back in the Octagon, still riding this big loss to big money matches with Tank Abbott and Shamrock.
Kimo never won a significant fight in his entire career. But this loss created a career that lasted 12 years and included more than a handful of main event bouts. Now that Cage Potato, is a triumphant loss!
ROYCE GRACIE VS KIMO (via lalete282)
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How could they leave this fight off
Not very many people would know who kimo was if it werent for this match
Exactly.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Because...
Not very many people would know who kimo was if it werent for this match is…
by truck on Jun 7, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Is Kimo, or more specifically this match, really little known? It might be for all I know, but really? For my money, this is the most memorable Royce Gracie fight of all, and I just sorta assumed everybody who bothers to watch any older MMA would see it eventually.
He isn't little known to people on here,
But most casual fans (which makes up most of the fan base) don’t know, remember or possibly even care. I have mentioned Kimo to other people and people have know idea who I am talking about.
That certainly sense, but I’d have to say that in my experience the Royce/Kimo bout was just one of the things that everybody ends up seeing. Perhaps as more time passes and many more fights are easily accessible it has become less of a touchstone.
The more I think about it, the more logical it is that, at this juncture, somebody taking the time to look up MMA from that era has gone beyond being a casual fan—especially in light of the fact that the bulk of the Gracie mystique has been thoroughly buried.
i'd take this article more seriously
if you spelled his name right.
Leopoldo.
other than that, this is the best thing you’ve written on this site.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 2:26 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
Once they die..
…it doesn’t matter anymore how their name was spelled.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
The Rock Says
How do you spell your name?
L-E-O-P…
IT DOESN’T MATTER HOW YOU SPELL YOUR NAME!
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 7 recs
and that attitude
is what’s wrong with you. and frankly, it’s what’s wrong with the world of journalism — be it the dying newspaper and TV industry or the so-called blogosphere.
facts matter. accuracy matters. journalism, whether you do it in a traditional media or a non-traditional one, still hinges on its nuts and bolts. getting a name wrong isn’t just dumb — it’s lazy reporting.
that you fail to see that is one of the reasons the community here beats on your work the way it does.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 7 recs
get off your high horse bob
Snowden fucked up. I fucked up by not catching it in the draft. We fixed it.
Let’s move on.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
my horse is not that high
i actually think Snowden’s a pretty good writer, or at least has the potential to be one. i disagree with him nearly all the time, but at least he puts his viewpoints out there and tries to back them up. dumb mistakes ruin good work, though.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i suppose
if i have to. i’ve avoided the banhammer around here, and would like to keep it that way. :-D
i think the most telling thing in Snowden’s piece here — unexplored, really — was that by the time Kimo faced Royce, it was effectively like an old-time pro wrestling storyline: Royce, the undefeatable champion, shown to be vulnerable by an upstart. and Kimo’s showing turned him into a babyface. and if Kimo’s the babyface, does that make Gracie the de facto heel? that would be a fun theory to explore.
but Snowden is right on this count: what happened in the octagon that day basically “made” Kimo for more than a decade.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
does capitalization matter bob?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions 11 recs
i've got kind of an e.e. cummings thing going on
but thanks for noticing. :-D
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
That you think the misspelling
of a little-known MMA fighter’s name is really what’s wrong with the world of journalism today is incredibly frightening to me.
Lack of investigative reporting into corporate and governmental malfeasance? Nah.
Regurgitating press announcements and public relations spin in lieu of fact-checking? No, not that.
Devoting the bulk of reporting resources to entertainment, sports and “process politics”? No no, that’s not what’s wrong.
A complete void in place of coverage of world affairs? Couldn’t be that.
It’s that an MMA blog misspelled a guy’s name. Yeah buddy, that really is emblematic of what’s wrong with journalism today.
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
by Sabate on Jun 7, 2010 4:56 PM EDT up reply actions 12 recs
I rec'd you
But if I could give you a hug, I would…
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
::sigh::
(just for the record, i’m not talking about Jonathan Snowden here. no specific writer/fighter bashing. i’m talking about journalism in general.)
yeah, i do think it’s what’s wrong. it’s indicative of the entire process these days. if you don’t care about getting the small details right, you damn sure don’t care about getting the big picture right, either. if you can’t get the small stuff right, you can’t report on the larger issues with any degree of accuracy. if your editor is smart, he (or she) won’t LET you.
which means you can’t do investigative reporting. and that you’re not qualified to report on world affairs. it means you can’t get your facts straight. if you can’t get the details right, you ought not to even be reporting a county commission meeting. and thus the rise of more and more soft news. and soft news reporters.
the list you provided are all problems with journalism today. but you need to understand that the flood of problems in today’s newsrooms didn’t start big — it came from the cracks in the dam. the cracks in the dam are fact-checking, not editing, not understanding your craft. the cracks came from laziness and indifference and inattention.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
Maybe you're right
but I’m skeptical. I certainly don’t haven’t worked in a newsroom, but I think the problems in journalism today are deep and structural. While I’m sympathetic to the argument that lack of attention to detail can have cascading effects with regard to accuracy in reporting, I think the problems with journalism are much bigger than even a lack of accuracy in reporting.
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
oh sure
that’s not my argument. the problems in journalism are as deep and wide as the ass of a reporter/editor that never gets out from behind a desk.
but i maintain that the large problems have grown from small seeds. :-)
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
still got it wrong
in the next-to-last graf.
(this is where being a newspaper reporter and editor for 15 years comes in handy every now and then.)
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by Lordjimbo2 on Jun 7, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
LOL rec'd
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
actually
i’m against the Oxford comma … it’s unnecessary, and years of using the Associated Press Stylebook have left me immune to it — for the most part.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
for 5 bucks I’ll tell you what boobs feel like
by DayGeaux on Jun 7, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
it makes me uncomfortable when you touch your moobs like that.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
I’ll have you know that I’ve worked very hard to get rid of my bitch tits. IT WAS JUST BABY FAT I swear
by DayGeaux on Jun 7, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
okay, that's a rec.
i am unafraid to admit i LOLed
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
I laughed because you can tell he just got done typing “moobs” into Google.
by Bob Boblaw on Jun 7, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Fuck Joe Son
Anyone guilty of what he did deserves to rot in prison. Hopefully, someone’s placed him in a rear naked choke in the showers!
by SmittytheCutman on Jun 7, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess the reason Kimo is left off the list is its really hard to call Kimo triumphant when he’s such a loser?
exactly why this fight doesn’t belong on the cagepotato top 7 list. kimo is not impressive at all nor does he show heart in this fight. He just loses like everyone else who met gracie up till this point.
“Losing isn’t always the end of the world. Sometimes, taking an ass-kicking — or getting screwed out of a well-deserved victory — can be the best thing for a fighter’s career.”
I think I interpreted it just fine.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I disagree
Royce’s fights lasted an average of 2 minutes. Kimo went 4:40 and actually did damage. He had Royce mounted at one point. Everyone thought Royce was in legitimate trouble in that fight. Up to that point Royce had dominated everyone and submitted them without taking any significant damage, including Ken Shamrock.
Kimo won his share of fights back in the day
He beat Pat Smith twice and Paul Varlens. Neither were world beaters but in 95/96 both were pretty decent gatekeepers. And you’re verging on fighter bashing.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
I was thinking the same thing
I figured beating Saku would be considered a quality win. I know it was his first pro fight, but right after that he went on a run, beating guys like Belfort, Royce, Royler, Newton, White, Mezger, Renzo, Ryan, Page…
a work? in my MMA?
details? or a link to them?
not doubting you, but honestly curious. i think i’ve heard the same thing, but it’s been so long ago i don’t remember.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
There’s a ton of works in early MMA, mainly in Japan. It comes from the early history of Japanese MMA being so closely tied in with pro wrestling. Hell the first ever Pride show opened with a worked MMA fight, and they once had Takada v. Otsuka in what was actually billed as a pro wrestling match.
Since Sakuraba came from a pro wrestling background, it’s not weird that he would have a sketchy fight in his past.
HeadKickLegend.com
by Fraser Coffeen on Jun 7, 2010 7:02 PM EDT up reply actions
He could read about it in Total MMA, but I know that there are some spelling errors in he book. Too bad.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Damn those editors.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
For the last 6 months I’ve been working with an Editor, a co-author, a copy editor, and a team of readers. As I go over the manuscript I’m still finding some errors. It happens.
Amazing to see this reaction. Here we have the opportunity to correct mistakes, did so in less than ten minutes, and still this occurs. Some of these time stamps let me know the commenter didn’t see a misspelling. And yet they took me to task. Tough crowd.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s amazing sometimes how you can have person after person proofread something and still end up with errors. It seems like you should be able to avoid it, but it almost always seems to happen.
The reaction wasn’t surprising. Some people are just dicks.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
that's funny
coming from a guy named Richard.
(no, seriously. funny. i wasn’t being an ass there. on purpose, anyway.)
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 7:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
actually that was pretty funny lol.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
i could list them all for you
would that be helpful? :-D
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
If you want to copy edit my next book for free…I accept.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
hey, nobody said for free
i’d at least want a credit.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
I remember watching him fight Bob Sapp in a K1 match at a friends house when I was younger, and had no Knowledge of the sport. I thought he was one of the baddest men on the planet (even though he lost to Sapp, and I really knew nothing about him).
I’d say his most triumphant win was beating the shit out of Bam Bam Bigelow, when Bigelow thought it was gonna be a worked fight, lol.
PLUS...
I’m all for an article that rips into those guys over at Cagepotato a little bit! They are sorta arrogent
elitist, too
oh, wait. is this the wrong audience for that?
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
how does this article rip into the guys at cagepotato. All it shows is JonathanSnowden failed to interpret there article correctly and miss the point completely.
by 64squares on Jun 7, 2010 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
and that he can't spell Kimo's name correctly.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
and you're banned
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Nate Wilcox on Jun 7, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
broke Rule #4
“don’t piss off the staff”
he’s never commented in six months of membership and this is what he chose to make his stand on.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
last stand or final stand?
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
Failed COD joke
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
I'm bringing my hose from the other thread truck
watch your back
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
Road? Roooaaaaadd? Ro add?
Limmiit? liiiimmmmiiiiit
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
Nitrous?
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
WTF is going on anymore
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
I thought she said nottheface?
myspace.com/tbma <--- Give it a listen, let me know what you think.
Proud conductor of the Shane Carwin hype train.
Shane Carwin hits you and even if your payin the bill it doesn't matter. Your lights are gettin shut off.
by II SMASH II on Jun 7, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Seems like we can. I dare you to play grammar/spelling police again….
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
just did ...
“Leopaldo” again in the next-to-last graf.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
There or their? I don’t know, but i don’t think i’d rip a pro writer if i was illiterate.
by sheikybaby on Jun 7, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Good stuff
Additional proof of this theory in practice— Kimo was my first favorite fighter, because of this fight.
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
Im just curious sir, so you didn’t like Gracie that much to be your favorite fighter?
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
I like Gracie just fine, but I was probably 9-10 when that fight happened and of course I was enamored with the giant badass that carries a huge cross to the ring (plus, it’s near impossible to get a kid, especially at that time, on board with BJJ). That sort of spectacle appeals to kids who read comic books and shit, yaknow?
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 7, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Got yah. I was like 7 when I first watched UFC on vhs but I immediately liked the way Gracie was choking the hell out of everybody. Kimo scared the shit out of me. I was influenced by my brothers too explaining jiu jitsu and judo at that time. Thanks for the response man, it looks loke you have been really busy these days.
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
just did
next-to-last graf, “Leopaldo” again.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
of course, i fail
at replying to threads. it’s sad, really. now that i’ve reached an advanced age, i forget how to use the interwebz.
of course, i can still spell.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
LOL
Fair enough.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Spelling corrections in place. Thanks! Next person to make mention of it…well, I wouldn’t want to be you.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions
i don’t get why you can’t have a mod just fix the article, delete those comments, and warn the commenters if they’re being idiots. instead of arguing about how it doesnt matter to trolls who spend their days making seas out of sinks.
the ban hammer is starting to be waved for a lot less nowadays, unless i missed something significant.
Even when I'm laying on my back I'm never backing down
by Austin Martin on Jun 7, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i may steal that line
“seas out of sinks.”
just for the record. lol
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
its a Killers line, so steal away
Even when I'm laying on my back I'm never backing down
by Austin Martin on Jun 7, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
…led to an announce team that verbally fellated him on PPV.
Best line ever?
"It’s going to be like sex with a grizzly bear, you know, a lot of scratching and growling on both sides." - Don Frye
by Excelsior! on Jun 7, 2010 3:06 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
BEST LINE E-V-A! !!!!!!!!!!!!
"When i get in there, in his face ,pressin the action,I'm RUFF NECKIN'EM,I'm throwin him around,I'm punchin him,hes punchin me, I'm eatin his shots and I'm Blastin him back in the face he's not goin to be able to handle it ." - Chris Leben on how his fight with Anderson Silva is gonna go.
by Rayce. on Jun 7, 2010 4:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
No, I gotta go with The Voice on DREAM.14
and the cucumber line. That actually had me spit soda out of my nose.
When you watch the Orioles every night, a beer after dinner turns into a six pack WAY too many times. Stacey
that was the best commentary line ever
but I meant as far as BE article lines
"It’s going to be like sex with a grizzly bear, you know, a lot of scratching and growling on both sides." - Don Frye
Cool article. Interesting how just hanging in with Royce made him so popular. Really shows how good Royce was at the time.
Exactly. They made Royce out to be a God. It made Kimo for a decade.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Why has there been a backlash for Snowden's articles?
Is it just me or do the comments for Snowden’s articles seem more mean spirited than most.
I like his take on things and enjoy reading them.
What’s the problem? Why do these posts seem to incite so much of a mean spirit?
by cyke on Jun 7, 2010 3:12 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
I think it's because he's an opinionated guy
who takes a stand that won’t always make him popular, and responds politely and kindly to commenters. No banhammer, no dickery, just discussion. And that shit don’t fly on the internets.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jun 7, 2010 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but what rubbed me the wrong way was the jabs he took at Cage Potato. I know you guys don’t see eye to eye, but the article could have delivered the same content (which I don’t necessarily agree with but is nevertheless good content) without the remarks about CP – its just petty. Just my two cents.
by EvilScott on Jun 7, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
But you'd think that CagePotato
would have pretty thick skin at this point, no?
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
CP isn't the issue
You’re assuming the guys at CP read this. I have no clue if they do. JS obviously reads their articles.
It has nothing to do with Cage Potato though – its a professionalism issue. I’m an avid reader of both CP and BE and it rubs me the wrong way when either site takes pot shots at the other. It’s petty and unprofessional IMHO.
HT to WatchKalibRun
I read it because Zak linked to it. It’s all Zak’s fault.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Give me a break. That was good natured ribbing. Their article led me to write this article. It’s not a “shot” at them. I just happen to think that some interesting things happened prior to TUF.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
well, that's one place we agree
there was life in this sport before TUF. and again, i thought your analysis of Kimo’s loss was good overall. up the thread a bit, i had some thoughts about some depth that could have been added — or at least questions i would have:
with the commentary being so far over-the-top in favor of Gracie, was Kimo the recipient of a kind of antihero “push” that was so popular in pro wrestling around the same time? by the time Kimo faced Royce, it was effectively like an old-time pro wrestling storyline: Royce, the indomitable champion, shown to be vulnerable by an upstart. and Kimo’s showing turned him into a babyface. so if Kimo’s the babyface, does that make Gracie the de facto heel? i don’t know the answers, because i didn’t see those early bouts until well after they’d occurred. to me, that would be a fun theory to explore.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
Should be noted that the anti-hero era in pro wrestling didn’t begin until a few years later. The fighter who took advantage of that was Tank Abbott…
If the fight turned Royce heel, he turned right back babyface the next show by beating the much larger Dan Severn.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions
aha
see, i got my time frames mixed up. that’s one of the reasons i asked it as a question.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
My bad then, I read into it wrong. Ever since the whole Gus Johnson thing I’ve noticed some back and forth between the two sites. It’s hard to put a tone on the exchange over the net – but that exchange seemed more than ribbing and it must have colored my reading of this.
Mea culpa.
Well, I hope they didn’t take it that way. I’ve written for CP and enjoy the site.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Both reasons make sense, but disagreements with writers happen. I’ve just never seen it spill out to this level.
I think some people perceive him as a Zuffa basher—due to some past articles that were critical of various specific things— and for some reason lots of fans (in the literal, fanatical sense of the word) can’t stomach the idea of somebody criticizing Zuffa. It just drives some people up the wall.
Well..
…the rest of the week is going to be interesting then! I had some interesting conversations this weekend and have some things I want to say about our friends in Las Vegas.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 7, 2010 8:18 PM EDT up reply actions
This.
I’m scratching my head as to why there’s a collective freak-out in the comments about a minor spelling mistake. Point it out, get it fixed and move on.
Freak-out aside, I thought Snowden’s article was an interesting addendum to the CagePotato article.
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
There are more comments about spelling then there are about the post...
I suppose a page view is a page view though…
The first paragraph is pretty much why, IMO. The article was decent and informative, but it didn’t need the snarky condescending tone at the beginning.
If you’re going to be snarky in the article, you’re going to get snarky replies. I am increasingly thinking this is a purposeful strategy over here as it’s become more and more commonplace. Which makes me sad, because I find BE to be an interesting site and could do without the tabloid stuff.
I enjoyed the level of snark and condescension.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
Anybody else feel a Jonathan Snowden Hate Thread coming on?
Damn, Brookhouse hasn’t even gotten one yet.
I like the stuff you write dude…. but the masses are disturbed
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
They’re good pieces… but perhaps Snowden has slept with a lot of people’s sisters?
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
my sis calls him plankton d ck. I don’t know why though.
Even when I'm laying on my back I'm never backing down
by Austin Martin on Jun 7, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Because entire ecosystems depend on it.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jun 7, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions 10 recs
Kimo-Gracie is probably my favorite fight of all time
yet I refuse to watch it again now for fear of tarnishing my memory of it.
Nice piece, btw, Kimo definitely deserves to be on the list.
turrible
you’d think the main focal point of the article (kimo) would be spelled correctly.
by nicey on Jun 7, 2010 4:14 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Really?
The Christopher Reeve pic got pulled down?
I guess 1995 is still too soon…
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
The Bob Saget roast was epic, second only to the Flavor Flav roast
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
Hugh Hefner's was really good
Especially when Ice T went up there and said “I just came to fuck some white bitches”, and then threatened everyone in the crowd with stuff like “I’ll rape you”.
If that didn’t have you rolling, little Gilbert Gottfried acted all pissed off saying that Ice T stole his act. “Word for word” he said, “it’s all right here”.
“I will rape and kill all you white mother fuckers” said Gottfried.
“I just came to fuck some white bitches” he said with all sincerity.
Hefner’s roast is the funniest I’ve seen.
Hefner’s was good. the last one, Joan Rivers I think, was the worst
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
Was it Hef's where Gilbert started the Aristocrats?
If you're not watching Treme, you're a bad person.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by Scott C. Broussard on Jun 7, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I think it was
after he had to save his set from a badly placed 9/11 joke.
Training BE since January 2010
The writer of the best book on MMA against a couple of anorak website posters? Biggest mismatch since Tyson vs Seldon 14 years ago.
by sheikybaby on Jun 7, 2010 4:47 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I'd hate to clutter up
this post with more editing stuff, but when I’ve noticed obvious spelling or grammar errors, I’ve actually gone ahead and emailed the writer. It keeps these threads cleaner and on topic (e.g. MMA nonsense).
On-topic, when Kimo has his obit actually written, the lead-off will likely be the Gracie fight, which says a lot about his career and how that fight defined him. I actually question whether the GSP vs. Serra fight was a win from a loss. That fight will always besmirch GSP’s record for people who dislike him (a small crowd, I know), and will always be a loss for fans, as we’re force-fed mismatch title fights in the guise of “you never know with a puncher’s chance.”
by rzor on Jun 7, 2010 5:05 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
that's my new nickname
threadkilla.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
I mean this in the best possible way, take your head out of your ass. If you have a grammatical error that needs fixing, send it to him. Don’t hijack the thread with your attention whoring rants on journalism.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
aw thanks for that
but i’ve never attention-whored here. fark.com, yes. but not BE. don’t like what i have to say? fine. don’t read my posts.
visit my website: http://bobthewriter.com
by bobthewriter on Jun 7, 2010 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions
linking to your website in your sig could be perceived as attention whoring
"It’s going to be like sex with a grizzly bear, you know, a lot of scratching and growling on both sides." - Don Frye
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