When Sport Is Close to Murder: German Paper Reveals a Media Debate That May Halt UFC in Germany
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 29, 2010 11:59 AM EDT
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The hits just keep coming for the UFC in Germany. Taunting friends from my years with the American Forces Network, boxing buddies and media who despise MMA, sent me an article today from Süddeutsche Zeitung, one of the country's most influential newspapers. The paper reveals that the upcoming Munich Media Days will feature a panel on October 14th called ‘When Sport Is Close To Murder: Cage Fights - A Case For Protecting Minors?"
The UFC, rightfully, is upset, not just by the inclusion of this topic in a conference that primarily focuses on other less controversial subject matters, but also by their exclusion from the debate. The European head of the UFC, Marshall Zelaznik, sent a letter yesterday to event organizer Wolf-Dieter Ring complaining about the inflammatory title of the event and the UFC's inability to present a counter argument.
While the UFC may not be officially represented in the debate, the article in Süddeutsche Zeitung reveals that Oliver Copp will represent Fighters Only at the event. Copp, in addition to these editorial duties, is also the German announcer for the UFC in Germany. Although not officially there on Zuffa's behest, Copp will surely have the power of Zuffa behind him.
The controversial panel comes on the heels of the death of fighter Michael Kirkham, who passed away after a regulated bout in South Carolina this weekend. The death of a combatant provides additional ammunition for critics of the sport in Germany, where the UFC was recently pulled from national television due to political pressure.
The debate, expected to be a high profile event, may signal the beginning of the end for MMA in Germany. As I warned earlier this year, pushing German officials by scheduling another UFC event in the country before the television matter was resolved, has shined a bright light on the MMA business. What is exposed under scrutiny may set back the sport in Germany for years to come.
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I hope they ban boxing, hockey, baseball, basketball and soccer while they're at it.
by Polyhedron on Jun 29, 2010 12:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
It's not that the culture dislikes danger.
They dislike violence. Hang-gliding, skydiving, and supercross are all as (or more) dangerous than MMA, but they don’t have Wanderlei Silva using a ‘rape choke’ as he pummels another man into unconsciousness.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
They don't like violence?
Then why are they so in love with the Klitschko brothers? Is it because of their Ph.D.’s and ability to speak multiple languages? Or is it because they are just that handsome?
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Lets be fair.
The Klitschko brothers aren’t that violent.
In seriousness though, do you not see the difference? Boxing has historical precedence of being a gentleman sport from long before German culture inherited this anti-violence fetish. Not to mention the purely technical considerations.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
I don’t see the difference, but I know a lot of people do for some odd reason. The “gentleman” roots go all the way back to bare knuckle boxing, which was incredibly brutal.
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
This isn't about logic or rationality.
It’s about culture. In the US the greatest threat to the sanctity of marriage is apparently gay men and nobody seems to care about the +50% and climbing divorce rate. Makes sense? Nope. But every culture is screwy and needs to be dealt with according to their individual quirks.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
That's fine with me.
I just wouldn’t bother with Germany if I were running the UFC.
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
These guys (politicians and media) – most of them arent doing this for a cultural or moral issue… This is a Vince Mcmahon and Boxing establishment issue.
It’s Vince plus the boxing promoters versus Zuffa and Abu Dhabi. The middle east is a big market for the WWE so that’s being neutralized as we speak and it’s mostly going to be a fight with the boxing establishment and that’s gonna be a real fight.
It’s gonna be a real fight so we’ll see who winds up with the most political and corporate support once the dust settles. They began with a head start but the turtle always wins the race.
It's both.
Pro wrestling and boxing are playing on the cultural hangups. The politicians see that as a way to gain favor amongst the public and lobbyists, and some truly believe it.
Could you elaborate on the Abu Dhabi connection? I’m not quite seeing it beyond an implication that WWE is keeping UFC out of Germany due to spite for being pushed out of the middle east.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
In a nutshell...
Vince thinks he’s at war with Zuffa and he seeing the Dubai investment as a major loss in the quest of taking his brand worldwide.
It’s asilly lil windmill war the Fertitas didn’t know they waged.
"Respond intelligently even to unintelligent treatment."
-Lao Tzu
You mean tortoise.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
by Richard Wade on Jun 30, 2010 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I kind of do hope they ban basketball actually
Moisture is the essence of wetness.
by troy145 on Jun 29, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You know they will.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
by Geno Mrosko on Jun 29, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 29, 2010 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I was hoping to see some fights here.
Alla som inte dansar är våldtäktsmän.
Cré nom de Zeus, on est jamais content.
Hadouken.
by Eugene Schelfaut on Jun 29, 2010 12:12 PM EDT reply actions
It's sad when the "Mainstream Media" pushes their agenda instead of reporting on the facts
by jpcampbell710 on Jun 29, 2010 12:12 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Or when a VERY mainstream media company refers to others, and not itself, as the mainstream media all while constantly spouting off about how they are the most watched news network in America.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 29, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Just Inform Them
The only way anyone is going to get anything done with passing MMA into law, or stuff like this, is through politeness. If Dana goes apeshit over this, bad things will happen.
The people who don’t support it are the ones who don’t understand it. Just do as much as possible to inform them of the pros of the sport and hope things work out. There isn’t much they can do and bullying will only make it worse.
dana doesnt go apeshit when dealing with sanctioning
only with fighters and sherdog
We have a saying back home that if your coming on, COME ON!!!!
And sponsors, and gyms
and video game producers, and TV networks, and…
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
Why bother?
If they don’t want it just take your business somewhere else.
The UFC doesn’t need Germany, why bend over backwards to try to sell them something they don’t want.
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:14 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
ummm
Germany’s the largest economy in Europe and is absolutely key to the UFC’s international expansion plans. They’re following the WWE’s model to a T and Germany is a key plank there.
With the ability to mount UFCs in Germany they can have a profitable European operation. The UK alone doesn’t quite cut it. France doesn’t allow UFC rules MMA. Australia isn’t a big enough market for more than one event a year and Abu Dhabi is a joke as a market.
The UFC is investing mad money to build an international market because they know there will be downturns in the US over time. Europe has been a life line for the WWE in the last 10 years and if the UFC fucks up Germany they’re fucked.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
The WWE barely survives in the US anymore. That's why they are trying so hard to make sure the UFC can't break into
a lot of the overseas markets, including Germany. This is a big deal and hopefully they fight this until they make it happen.
Forget it Donny, you're out of your element.
by Geno Mrosko on Jun 29, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions
That's nice.
They still don’t need them. Why blow money you’re not going to get any return on it. It’s like trying to sell a ketchup popsicle to a woman in white gloves.
They don’t need the European market, they’re doing just fine in NA. MLB, NFL, and NBA basically don’t get any money outside NA. (don’t bring up the few small, rare exceptions)
They should continue to focus on profits at home where they still have a lot of room to grow.
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
The US has a huge economy as well, but it doesn’t mean you can sell anything here.
Selling MMA in Germany is as dumb as selling soccer in the US…..
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Except that that last thing you mentioned
is working…
by gavingavinkindgavin on Jun 29, 2010 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Except that the Germans want the UFC , like they want to play gears of war or any banned violent game, but some people in the government and medias think they know better than other responsible adults.
I'm a lover not a fighter
It would be interesting to have numbers here, what numbers they did at the doors and on the PPV. And I wouldn’t see too much into the PPV numbers, because PPV aren’t something we’re used to in Europe.
I'm a lover not a fighter
yeah ppv wont matter but the gate was around 1.2 mil if I remember correctly. The gate was alot better than any UFC in the USA across years.
1.2 mil?
1,200,000 is less than a third of what UFC 114 pulled, so it’s not that great of numbers.
by Patrick John McGreevy on Jun 29, 2010 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Quit projecting MMA’s viability as if it was the same as pro wrestling’s. They’re completely different. MMA has the potential to be sustained only in the US as does any other respectable competitive sport. The WWE doesn’t belong in the conversation.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former - Albert Einstein"
- Goonisis
by Goonisis on Jun 29, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Germany is in some ways a very backwards country
They would like to be known as a sleek, efficient modern economic powerhouse, but, like everywhere else on earth they have plenty of ignorant power hungry jerks running that country. They like to censor a lot of stuff – for example there are plenty of movies (I’m really into 1970s Italian horror films) that are still totally unavailable in Germany.
Germany also has a lot of healthy racism they pretend doesn’t exist, take a look back when they hosted the world cup.
Fuck Germany, ignorant dumb fucks. If the UFC can, they should hold an event there no matter what, even if it doesn’t get on German TV, fuck ’em.
Germany is a lot of things
But as someone who has been there many times, the last thing way I’d ever describe it is “backwards”.
Follow me on Twitter: @MMANation.
by Luke Thomas on Jun 29, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I’d hardly call it progressive. What do you call it then? Lets settle on promoting ignornace for gain (newspapers and politicans)
...and Canada for that matter.
Our press (on the whole) is a little better, but the politicians are still guilty here
chill out there big guy
I do find it funny that they freak out over MMA but find it ok to sell orange juice with naked chick.
we're seeking articulate and thoughtful you are neither.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 15, 2010 3:47 PM CDT
Kid Hate layin it down
by II SMASH II on Jun 29, 2010 12:37 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Also, the fact that Germany has an extremely low homicide rate relative to that of the US
is nothing to be ashamed of…
Their extremely high Hasselhoff rate is something to be ashamed of, though.
by Electro Boy on Jun 29, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Did I mention
after Fedor lost I was soooo happy I looked up Hasselhoff singing on the Berlin Wall?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zXiClnK8oE
I felt pretty good that night.
Somebody here doesn't know what he is talking about
And went on an ignorant rant to show everybody he is just a hater. Regular day on the Internet.
I'm a lover not a fighter
Germany is pound for pound one of the best places to fuck in the world. I tried it backwards several times :)
I tried it backwards several times :)
You let a German hooker work you over with a strap on?
by Jahbulon on Jun 29, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
You fucked him with a strapon? Kinky.
by John Nash on Jun 29, 2010 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
i have faith in the ufc to win this battle
honestly they’ve faced worse in their history, dana and the fertita brothers have never failed to get sanctioning, they may take a while sometimes like this new york and toronto battle are showing us but they’ll pull through both there and in germany
We have a saying back home that if your coming on, COME ON!!!!
FORGET GERMANY!!!
Bring the UFC to Albuquerque, NM!!!!!
by kinghaze on Jun 29, 2010 1:58 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
German politicians try to ban lots of things
but they also fail at it many times.
Popular fails:
-Failing to ban MC Clubs “Hells Angels” and Bandidos"
- Failing to ban germany’s far right party “NPD”
-Failing to ban “Paintball”
They never tried to ban a Sport so that will be interesting to watch.
You gotta love the country who perfected mass murder, staring down their noses at us “savages”.
Forget Germany.
USMC vet. MMA nut. Rousimar Palhares is a dirty fighter.
Pain don't hurt...
Yeah,
What kind of country nearly exterminates a whole group of people while launching wars to expand their empire built on slave labor. But enough about the US in the 19th century…
by John Nash on Jun 29, 2010 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Ric’idy Rec’d.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 29, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Someone’s been reading Howard Zinn.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 30, 2010 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions
i'm from germany, i've been following MMA for a couple of years and here's my take on this whole thing:
As I pointed out in some comments below Jonathans last article regarding this matter, the UFC would be better off staying away from the south of Germany (read: Baden-Württemberg and especially Bavaria). Why? Because public opinion in those places is not going to sway in favor of the UFC/MMA anytime soon. And neither won’t the politicians who govern those states. The south of Germany is very conservative and christian. They don’t want MMA there. And the Süddeutsche Zeitung is originally a Bavarian newspaper. Just like DSF is a Bavarian TV-Channel. And most of the local politicians who rallied against the UFC moving into Germany are from Bavaria.
DSF, the UFC’s TV partner for the show in Germany, is based in Bavaria. After the event, Bavarian politicians cracked down on the topic and passed a law that would prohibit the showing of MMA on public television (like DSF). It makes perfect sense for the Süddeutsche Zeitung to take the same line.
I wouldn’t over-interpret things that happen in the south of Germany when it comes to MMA, this isn’t the area of Germany where the innovation and exciting new branches try a startup. This is hillbilly-land.
All the UFC needs to do is avoid the south, Bavaria especially, and try to move to either Berlin, Hamburg or some other places further north that actually have electricity and running water and they’ll be just fine.
Go big red!
by pornflake on Jun 29, 2010 8:00 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
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