The New Landscape of Mixed Martial Arts
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:17 AM EDT
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(Reposted from Fightlinker - even if you don't like the site, you can say things to me over there that you couldn't DREAM of getting away with here. Feel free to drop by... and give Ryan twenty dollars that I will never see.)
I'm here to gloat, ladies and gentlemen. About Fedor's loss? Oh reader, you know me so well but you don't know me at all. I've had Fedor as the #1 heavyweight on Earth sine I got into the sport. He's incredible. I don't like his management and I don't like parts of his resume, but none of that caused me to disrespect the man's resume. He is still a top five heavyweight, and I would watch him fight the winner of Werdum/Overeem. No, I'm here to gloat about the fact that the aforementioned parenthetical will sell about 80,000 Pay Per Views. Tonight was the end of more than one era.
There will never be a #1 ranked fighter outside of Zuffa's umbrella ever again. The consistent arguments for co-promotion - dispersed talent, ambiguity as to who was really the best - are now nullified. As of July 3rd, the #1 heavyweight (Lesnar/Carwin), light heavyweight (Shogun), middleweight (Silva), welterweight (GSP) and lightweight (Edgar/Penn/Florian/Maynard) in the world will be in the UFC. The #1 135er and 145ers will be in the WEC, though I'd like to see Warren and Fernandes there, among others. There will never be another debate over who is #1 at a weight class - it will be whomever holds Zuffa's belt.
That's huge. It's never been that way in a combat sport, let alone mixed martial arts. We're going to get superfights, relevant divisional stylistically appealing match-ups, fighters are going to make more money and be more popular, and the mainstream media will find it easier to follow one league instead of many. People may call my gloating premature and fret over what Zuffa domination will do to/for the sport. These people are wrong. I am right. And time will show by just how wide a margin.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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Sorry!
Anyway-disagree. Within 10 years easy one of these fighters will walk the De La Hoya road and promote their own fights. Too much money in play for guys to be satisfied with $1-3 million.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:20 AM EDT reply actions
You keep right on shilling.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:37 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah
I hate the promotion I’ve followed since 1993. The one that inspired me to write two books. The one I’ve covered in person close to 20 times…yeah, what an intense hatred. You are a sad person, viewing the world through your own warped and twisted perspective and projecting it on people who just enjoy watching fights. No matter the promotion, no matter the country.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:21 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You have no idea...
…based on what transpired this is a pretty good sign your insider claims are as full of holes as most of your ideas.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:31 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I know exactly what happened. I never claimed to be an insider – but you do. Yet you dont know shit.
This is gonna end ugly. :(
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 3:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I really think you two should settle this in the cage…
Just sayin.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 3:35 AM EDT up reply actions
One of us has plenty of on the record
interview, stories, and books. The other one is batting at about .200 in the comments section of Bloody Elbow. So….
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:34 AM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
That’s probably true when you prefer a twisted narrative that supports your own worldview and can’t understand anything else.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:40 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
If you knew what happened with Carwin
You wouldn’t mention it. Unless you were trying to mislead people or be a jerk. So which is it?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:35 AM EDT up reply actions
How about you tell me here? I’m not tracking you around to hear your rants. You have no idea what happened. You claim you do. Put up or shut up time. You are practically Dana’s assistant right? You must know the whole story?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Nut up or shut up! This is getting fun!
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 3:41 AM EDT up reply actions
You’re the one who wrote the story which Carwin contradicted and you had to dick tuck within 2 hours… so you tell me. MR big shot new BE staff writer.
by mmalogic on Jun 27, 2010 3:46 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You got...
…..nothing. Like I thought.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:48 AM EDT up reply actions
"I never claimed to be an insider"
You just made me shit my pants even more than I usually do
I TOLD U FEDOR IS FIGHTING BROCK AT UFC 103 I KNOW THINGS ZUFFA PAYS ME 40 BILLION PER SECOND BECAUSE I AM SO VALUABLE
At least Subo is funny and admits to being Dana White’s biggest fan.
You cannot get away with all the crap you say and then say “I never claimed to be an insider.” That’s like if Kid Nate came on and said he hated controversial posts.
BOOSH
by Farthammer on Jun 27, 2010 3:36 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
um well you know i've been thinking
that i’m going to be more even handed in the future. i don’t think all the controversy is good for the blog.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
It’s good if you want to bait heated discussion. It’s bad if you want this blog to be a place viewed as the home for thoughtful opinions, analysis and articles.
Some of the article titles recently have just been flamebait and troll jobs.
i like to think we present a mix
I named the damn thing Bloody Elbow for a reason.
If I wanted to run the MMA Sorbonne I’d have gone with a different name.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
The mix is working, and is driving readership. It’s been awhile since I’ve read something new and deeply insightful here though. Still worth the read, just not as much as before.
If you haven’t found ONE of the posts here “new and deeply insightful” in the last week, something is wrong. There’s plenty of quality stuff here, along with enough flare to get people talking. It’s working good. I like it just fine as is.
People get too caught up in the politics of blogging. You like it, you don’t like it…read something else. I think BE has a happy balance of content.
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:35 AM EDT up reply actions
we'll have some new
judo chops and mma history pieces up this week.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Nate Wilcox on Jun 27, 2010 6:32 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Packing as I type this...
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
by Bob Boblaw on Jun 27, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 9 recs
Too goddamn funny...
Dude. It's Anderson Silva.
If he gives a damn he will end Sonnen’s night by either sub or KO.
-SSreporters
By Monday morning Chael Sonnen will be pissing out of his neck.
-Also SSreporters
Controversial posts are like freak show fights
Great for a quick spike in attention and cheap thrills, not great for longevity and sustained growth.
you've run that joke into the ground
it’s almost as impertinent as some pesky blogger daring to criticize the mighty Dana’s business acumen.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
It’s a cop out and we all know it. Sometimes people make a joke and it get’s missed (I know this well) but other times…yeah…“mostly joking”? lol
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Telling you man,
I hate it sometimes. Having fun and joking is cool but it just gets overdone. If you are here long enough you learn who guys are and then you can take things much better.
It was a call back a convo me and Nate had eielry about freakshows
I think there’s some truth to it (on the freak show side), but i know shit all about blogging and how well BE is doing. It really was just a tongue in cheek comment.
Controversial posts incite conversation and debate, that does it’s job. And it’s quite funny that everyone is missing that Nate was playing along with the comment above his…
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Bravo. I told you this months ago. You dont want end up a tabloid. Even Coker is calling you a gossip queen.
Brents piece on Zuffa’s, tapout issue is not tabloid. You’re piece on UFC 115 being a bust is tabloid. IT did a 4.2m gate and half mil in buys.
Zuffa didnt have to pay 12m in insurance… Zuffa had to get coverage for 12 million. HUGE DIFFERENCE! The cost for insurance was only around 4 times more than usual and that’s not the biggest expense to begin with.
Bring Subo onboard. That should even things out.
it's pretty amazing
how you can take a break from advising dana and come in and school me on how to run a blog. thanks
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Somewhere in there, there’s a compliment.
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:31 AM EDT up reply actions
i found it!
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:32 AM EDT up reply actions
Logic being quite charming tonight…
I bet ya boy is gonna sleep like a baby!
A true MMA fan from the great state of Arkansas.
by MMArazorback on Jun 27, 2010 6:21 AM EDT up reply actions
NEVERMIND
“Charming” was before I read his rant with Snowden…
Not so charming (but sleeping well nonetheless).
A true MMA fan from the great state of Arkansas.
by MMArazorback on Jun 27, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Color me disappointed
That this is your only response to what I wrote.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I got bad news for you
We didn’t make shit up. We’ve got the records to prove it.
Follow me on Twitter: @MMANation.
by Luke Thomas on Jun 27, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Why Fedor did it for a while after Pride…..
It can’t happen again?
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Fedor was a #1 fighter outside of the UFC
That will never happen again.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:29 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s still going on now… I know I know its Women’s but Cyborg???
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 2:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Technically your right
and you can also say that Zuffa doesnt have the 125 # 1 fighter or the superheavy weight # 1 fighter but it’s not really a valid point when Zuffa doesnt have any fighters at those weight classes and 0 women.
Why isn’t it a valid point? Does that mean that there is just no #1 fighter at 125 lbs? Rankings abhor a vacuum.
Because it doesnt exist in the UFC it isn’t relavent?
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 2:58 AM EDT up reply actions
You, sir, are catching on.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:59 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Cyborg is a beast, and I think Womens MMA is as much of a future for the sport as anything or anyone else.
Obviously women can sell tickets and put on great fights.. Look at Carano/Cyborg..
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Problem is
the only way women’s MMA catches on, which i doubt it ever really would sad as that may be, is if it was in the UFC.
You know know as well as i do why people watch Gina Carano fights. Same reason GSP has fangirls who could otherwise care less about this sport.
i watch her cause shes hot.
i watch cyborg cause she should be fighting men.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 3:53 AM EDT up reply actions
There's relevance and there's relevance
I don’t really give two turds about whether or not the whole world is down with tiny little guys fighting, but if they are fighting, and it’s of a reasonable quality (and my standards are low), I’m probably going to end up watching it.
I’m not alone in that desire, and pretty quickly people tend to rank these fighters, no matter who is holding their reins.
You need to have a pride before you have a fedor. A “fedor”, Anderson, GSP, Shogun, BJ, etc.. will never be created outside of the UFC again.
You guys better keep all of your fighters happy. Otherwise this all falls apart.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Anyone who thinks fighters are happy with being bullied and watching Dana blow more than they make at the blackjack tables….doesn’t know many fighters.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:45 AM EDT up reply actions
From everything I’ve heard from people in the know is that most of them are not pleased. And who would be when the median purse for last year was $16,500 (i know, I know better than everyone else) and that sponsor dollars are nearly what fans think they are.
16,500 × 3 fights a year = 49,500, and with sponsorships you can pretty much double that.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:49 AM EDT up reply actions
The only way it goes up for everyone is if more people watch
And the only way that happens is with all the best fat and happy in the same place.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:49 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
this is it
Current details are pretty much meaningless. Let the the UFC grow the sport as they claim to want to, and it’ll all work itself out.
Otherwise you’ll get this: Fractured talent pool > watered down product > decay of the sport. I’m not sure i see how that is SO much better for the fighters.
by Goonisis on Jun 27, 2010 3:22 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sponsorship money is not what people think. And of course-expenses. This will be broken down here soon enough.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:51 AM EDT up reply actions
We need another in depth Snowden post.
Find a fighter to give you a true breakdown on payouts of shit. Maybe someone who is retired or doesn’t still need the UFC in some way.
Carwin is anything but a Zuffa Shill, and he’s said he makes six-figures in sponsorship deals
You gotta pay the troll toll, to get into this boy's soul.
by WestbergIDFC on Jun 28, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Please do
I want these guys to get paid and will go after Zuffa if I feel they’re being jobbed – however, one has to realize that as the league’s revenues grow, paychecks inevitably will (man, I want a union)
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:55 AM EDT up reply actions
For someone who claims to be a liberal I am surprised at your desire to concentrate complete power into a small group of mens hands. And while pay has gone up drastically in the last five years I don’t think it has kept up at all with the rate of growth Zuffa has had. In other words the percentage of revenue fighters make now is less than it was in 2005.
In fact hold on 15 minutes and I’ll put something together
I defend my Obama vote and plan to do it again, so I think I more than “claim” to be a liberal. I criticize him from the Left, sir.
Sports benefit from a near-monopoly because sports fans are lazy and want one source to see the best. Hardcore fans are not lazy and enjoy the banter and confusion because they get to be “in the know”.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not your pal, friend.
I have an auto-correcter that places the word “sir” in for a list of curse words whenever I’m on this site.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not your friend, guy.
I don’t relish confusion in the rankings, though I don’t doubt for a second that some people do.
I’d prefer for all the weight classes to be contested at the highest level under the auspices of the UFC, because that is the best environment for doing so effectively.
That said, I don’t really get super excited at the repeated failures of other sources of MMA.
Well, lucky you
There won’t be a great deal of other failures. Strikeforce might just survive this if they don’t compete for any more free agents.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:07 AM EDT up reply actions
If there's one thing I do know about this sport
It’s that there will always be a great deal of failure
Right after a huge upset like that, it seems as if you have drawn a rather curious lesson.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 27, 2010 9:44 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm betting...
they learned that lesson after Shields / Hendo.
Dude. It's Anderson Silva.
If he gives a damn he will end Sonnen’s night by either sub or KO.
-SSreporters
By Monday morning Chael Sonnen will be pissing out of his neck.
-Also SSreporters
My point being that on a night that will remain synonomous with “anything can happen/top dogs aren’t on top forever”, subo is saying that the UFC is going to be dominant for the rest of time and never screw the pooch.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 27, 2010 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
this is silly
corporations/promotions =/= people.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former - Albert Einstein"
- Goonisis
As a fellow Obama supporter, let’s say I am surprised by your support of unchecked power. anyways here is the a year by year summary of the UFC payout against ppv revenue:
Year Total Payroll Total Revenue Number of events Average Payroll Average Revenue %
2004 $1,994,500 $11,130,000 4 $498,500 $2,780,000 17.9
2005 $1,904,500 $25,200,000 4 $476,125 $6,300,000 7.6
2006 $5,001,000 $218,350,000 10 $500,100 $21,835,000 2.3
2007 $6,106,000 $134,600,000 7 $872,300 $19,229,000 4.5
2008 $7,624,000 $212,275,000 7 $1,089,000 $30,325,000 3.6
2009 $8,053,000 $216,450,000 7 $1,150,000 $30,921,000 3.7
While not including the ppv bonuses this should give us an idea what the rank and file are making. If you notice it is only ppv revenue, and by the UFC’s own admissions they are now making more from other sources of income. Over 1/3 of their revenue is now thought to be non-gate and non-ppv sources. Which means? That the fighters percentage of revenue is even lower than what I have listed.
I agree there’s a discrepancy – I think a lot of that new revenue is being invested in long term growth. But what you’ve listed there is a payout increase of 400% over the last five years. I hope it does that again in the next five, and again in the next – but I only see it happening with a PGA, an ATP, a unified elite MMA organization.
We don’t see how much more money they’re making because of the patches on their shorts, endorsements outside the cage, TV appearances, autograph signings, etc. We agree it needs to go up. We disagree that an all-powerful UFC ain’t the best way to do it.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think I can agree to an all-powerful anything, But I can agree to disagree. Good night, sir.
(oh, and average event payroll went from $498, 500 in 2004 to $1,1,50,000 in 2005 with 3 extra fighters on average per card, So that is a little over 200% payroll growth and 170% per fighter)
In one year.
I’m sure we’ll spar again.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Ah. Still not bad for a half decade that wasn’t exactly the Roaring Twenties.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Payroll went from close to $ 2 mil in 2004 to a little over $8 mil in 2009. Revenue (from ppv alone) during that same period went from $11 mil to $215 mil. Not bad indeed
People's politics..
..don’t square 1:1 with their personal choices.
This and other shocking news at 11 pm.
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
People's biggest argument against a straight up revenue to payroll analysis is
Dana’s “under the table bonuses” and PPV cuts. Even if you factor in PPV buys according to the scale, the percentage is still like 25%. And that’s before you factor in internet buys, the money they get from bars (avg of 2500-3500 dollars), advertisers, etc. The actual number is pretty lower.
Of course, people will say “Well, the UFC has costs too.” Of course they do, but other sports have costs as well, and their athletes get at least 40%.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
As long as it’s nothing like your breakdown about how much Carwin is getting paid i’d love to see it.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 3:08 AM EDT up reply actions
You have no idea what happened there
So you can walk that road if you want. I wouldn’t recommend it.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:10 AM EDT up reply actions
as always feel free to school me.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I am curious to hear as well.
you keep asking people you claim to have the wrong information to lay it down, well how about you lay down the right information for all of us to see. Including quite possibly carwin himself. Or since he has openly told us that we can go directly to him for the truth, perhaps we should bypass you and do just that.
by Opposites Attack on Jun 27, 2010 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't think you get how journalism works
I don’t mean this in a degrading or humiliating manner whatsoever, simply that sources are sources.
A trusted source gives you information under an unspoken agreement that you don’t name names and the information they want out is in the hands of a trusted writer.
So, the information gets out and instead of getting what you want, you get a ton of blowback and have to jump into deny and discredit the writer mode.
I’ve had this happen to me at least half a dozen times now.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
by Dave Walsh on Jun 27, 2010 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sad but true.
To be fair it seems like a lot of people take shots at mmalogic without giving this consideration as well.
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
No offense taken
It was a legitimate question, and I have no idea what-so-ever how journalism works. Im an architect. I convey ideas with drawings, not words!
I just wanted to know what really transpired between snowden and carwin since he states right above that “you have no idea what happened there” in response to another person. Im just curious to hear what happened then if thats the case.
by Opposites Attack on Jun 29, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too
I would like to hear.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 7:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd like to read that.
I’ve always wondered about fighters’ expenses, but have no clue as to even their scale.
If you fight, you fight. If you hope, you hope.
Hearing employees are unhappy that the president of their company makes a shit ton of money and they make chump change is pretty much the story of every company.
UFC fighters do a lot better than many of those other companies employees.
by JeremyShane on Jun 27, 2010 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Perhaps, but those folks have pensions, retirement plans, have a modicum of job security for an entire career (which could span decades)…so yeah.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 28, 2010 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions
no, those folks do not have those things actually. Some do, but plenty of companies, especially your low level wage earners no longer get pensions and retirement plans and it’s not much of a career. And if you fight for the UFC two or three times a year and make twenty grand each time and get sponsor money each time, that puts you in a pretty good earning bracket when compared to other companies employees.
The UFC fighters make good money with sponsorships in addition to fight money and other sources related to the exposure they get from the UFC. It’s not easy to manage your money, but it’s something they need to learn to do, they are independent contractors pretty much.
Why cant Dana spend the money he has made how he wants to?
by Darren Watkins on Jun 28, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
over a year ago once all before these big contracts were being dolled out to Tito, Rampage, and even before Brock… It was created for GSP.
Zuffa knows its numbers. Zuffa calculated exactly what GSP could do on his own in Canada (he’d sell out arenas), costs of putting it together etc… potentiall ppv’s, etc… and Zuffa actually gave him a contract worth more.
And that’s how it’s gonna continue. Those numbers are gonna increase for fighters and as a result pay is gonna increase.
You mean you'll pay them what they are worth?
Cra-zy.
Just do a retirement/pension plan before everyone browbeats you into doing it.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:50 AM EDT up reply actions
If you were half as smart as you thought you were...
…it would be really interesting. I do like your attempts to turn Showtime’s night into a discussion of how Zuffa does business.
By the way, Zuffa does a shit job of projecting UFC PPV buys. You expect us to believe they have any clue how GSP or another star would do on their own?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:54 AM EDT up reply actions
They’ve had numerous opportunities to see how Fedor did selling fights on his own.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Fedor
Is a non English speaker who has never been on American TV. We are talking about UFC stars leaving to promote their own fights. Don’t straw man this thing,
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I will admit that GSP could conceivably convince an opponent to leave the UFC with him and take a one-off fight for less money in a brand-new promotion, and both of them might conceivably make a little more (not in sponsors, though – see Tapout/Fedor/Zuffa) than they would if they just stayed put.
I don’t see them deeming it worth the hassle/long term complications.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Man
Compared to boxing money, sponsorships cash is ass wiping paper.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I’d love some numbers, but I’ve routinely heard that a lot of UFC fighters make more in sponsorship dollars than they do on their paychecks.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:23 AM EDT up reply actions
I have lots of numbers. But if a fighter is getting real boxing money, of course they aren’t making $5-20 million in sponsors.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:26 AM EDT up reply actions
who the fuck is making this “boxing money” you’re talking about? you’re talking about a handful of guys for shit sake. Everyone else in boxing is making shit compared to what guys in the UFC make.
We are talking
about a handful of fighters that would leave the UFC to promote their own fights. Of course Chris Lytle isn’t really who we are talking about. But, sure, go ahead and try to confuse the issue.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:32 AM EDT up reply actions
That is true
Their PPV projections are usually quite off.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 7:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Those contracts are terrible for most fighters.
For newcomers they are fine, you sign a contract and get paid better than you’d get paid by anybody else. You then become more popular and rack up a few more wins and all of a sudden you are being used for promotional stuff and the company is making money off of you without sharing.
If UFC can consider canning you after a loss and void the contract I’m not sure why a fighter can’t choose to re-enter negotiations after a notable win.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
by Dave Walsh on Jun 27, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Until their is a fighter that draws up his own contract and Zuffa is willing to sign it that will never happen. When fighters sign contracts they should think best case scenario, if a fighter signs a contract for X amount of fights I would hope they plan on winning. The promotional duties helps the fighter in many ways and a lot of financial oppurtunities start to turn up. Tito proves you don’t have to be the best to be an MMA millionaire personality sells period. When you are not fighting and the camera or microphone is pointed in your direction it’s an oppurtunity to further your own brand name some fighters do well some don’t ask Kendall Grove.
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
ever is a long time my friend
god willing this sport will outlive Dana and the Fertittas and the Sheiks of Abu Dhabi too. I wish them all long lives and continued success, but they have a long way to go before the UFC = MMA.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
I look forward to you outlining this tomorrow and me getting banned for disagreeing with it :-D
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh
And I think you meant “inshallah”
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions
wow dude wow
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
That’s why people are flocking to this site tonight-because of the UFC event on Showtime?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:43 AM EDT up reply actions 11 recs
They don’t know it yet, but they are flocking to a funeral, and it’s not Fedor’s.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions
lol, fedor losing was pretty big. UFC = MMA to the general public.
After Tonight UFC = MMA to the hardcore community. Game is over my friend.
by mmalogic on Jun 27, 2010 2:48 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Actually it’s pretty sad how many of my friends that are just casual fans will refer to all MMA as UFC and refer to events like this as the UFC fight last night.
by JeremyShane on Jun 27, 2010 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Fabricio Werdum just showed
the way the UFC’s arrogant and bullying approach to fighter negotiations alienates top fighters. He could very easily tap out anyone on the UFC roster just like he tapped out Fedor, even JDS.
But you guys wanted to force a huge pay cut down his throat after one loss and sent him packing. If UFC is going to be the only major league, it’ll be a fucking travesty if they continue to run off fighters at or near peak ability because of their need to rub people’s faces in it.
If Dana can’t learn to be magnanimous in victory, his victory will be short lived.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Nate Wilcox on Jun 27, 2010 2:46 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I don’t know how big of a pay cut they were asking for, but the fact that he was griping about Randy choosing Brock for his comeback fight didn’t help.
Don’t you think it’s possible that Dana will be less venom-y with no one to spit at?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Dana
Will always find an enemy. This is his nature.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:55 AM EDT up reply actions
He's always had them
No organization will ever even compete with them for a #1 fighter again – it’s been shown time and time again that doing so, putting all of your eggs in just a basket or two, is suicide. It will be directed at fighters and AC’s and refs and legislatures instead of competitors, but I think it will die down.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Could he because he sure as hell couldn’t tap out AA and JDS knocked his head into the fifth row. Dana doesn’t have to be anything he doesn’t want to he’s won every war there has been in mma, I know it hurts but it’s the UFC’s world everybody else is just living in it.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 2:49 AM EDT up reply actions
big difference
AA refused to jump into Werdum’s guard, which is something Fedor should have done, or at least been a little more careful.
follow me twitter.com/GotaHemmi
by Brian Hemminger on Jun 27, 2010 3:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Couture already tried. The #1 guy in each weight class will never be able to do this. It will even be difficult for the non-#1 guys who are marketable as well.
Regardless, It’s a market impossibility.
This is a league sport. Even if a fighter can contractually leave it’s like saying the NY Giants are gonna leave and start their own league. How do you think that’s gonna work out?
People dont get it yet. In 5 years people will understand the current paradigm that they are not currently able to see.
in 10 years Zuffa will be even bigger, with distribution even stronger… 2 fighters who can do 250k buys on their own wont even make sense to do it.
Zuffa’s pay will always be inline with the market realities… and the question Zuffa always asks is how much can this fighter make on his own without us. And that’s around what he gets paid. It’s always going to make absolutely no sense for a fighter to leave and do this on his own.
You can do it in Boxing because a promoter consists of a guy with a cigar, a secretary and a fax machine. Zuffa has over a 100 employees (non fighters) Offices across the globe.
It will never happen.
Of course it will happen
You saying this is a “league” sport is silly. UFC 114 crystalized that fans will pay money for a one fight card. The fighters aren’t dumb. Someone has to pay those 100 employees. Why should it be with their money?
Zuffa tries hard to keep the fighters in their place. Look at who takes the major PR opportunities. But someone will break through and want to be an owner and not some guy making 10% of the gross.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions
UFC 114 crystalized that fans will pay money for a one fight card that is a “UFC”. You dont know the business model. The day a fighter can sell 300k ppv’s on his own is the day he could sell 3 million with the UFC. That will never change.
I wonder how many times
Bob Arum said that? Or King? Or if HBO said “Tyson will never go anywhere.”
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions
There's only one belt that matters now
As I said, this is unprecedented in the history of combative sports.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:57 AM EDT up reply actions
this illustrates your understanding of the business model. you’re comparing the market realities of MMA to boxing.
boxing promoters add little value. Zuffa adds enormous value. It’s very simple to understand. That’s why it will never happen.
Let me make it easy for you: The WWE adds alot of value, Boxing promoters add very little value. That’s why a wrestler cant just up an leave and start a promotion and a boxer can.
Boxing is not known as “Don King fighting” mma is known as UFC or Ultimate Fighting and that’s never gonna change.
by mmalogic on Jun 27, 2010 2:59 AM EDT up reply actions 9 recs
This is a league sport
Really? Most leagues are noteworthy for the regular season and playoffs they use to crown the best. The UFC seems to pair fighters against each other and then eventually decides who should fight who for the belt.. Sort of like boxing. The reason it won’t happen is that most mma fans come from pro wrestling and not the boxing world, They want the UFC to be the WWF. They can’t imagine a world without it.
boxing promoters add little value. Zuffa adds enormous value. It’s very simple to understand. That’s why it will never happen.
The WWE adds alot of value, Boxing promoters add very little value. That’s why a wrestler cant just up an leave and start a promotion and a boxer can.
LOL.
awesome reply dude.. seriously… awesome
I’m still laughing… and you’re right
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Technically
Jarrett didn’t up and leave. When WCW was bought by Vince, he was fired on National Television. And since he always liked being champion, why not run your own company and crown yourself champ?
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 4:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Look
Foolish message board shills said the same dumb shit about the wrestling business. WWE was a much bigger operation and someone with deep pockets and TV showed you could compete.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:59 AM EDT up reply actions
WWE was a much bigger operation and someone with deep pockets and TV showed you couldcompetefail.
Fixed – and that was a billionaire (Cuban and Trump don’t seem terribly interested in going in the red to put together a competitor, and Cuban fucking owns HDNet)
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Failure of WCW was unrelated to the point that they showed they could compete and, in fact, surpass the industry leader.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Surpassed in Monday TV ratings. They were never on the same footing on PPV, and that’s what doomed the whole enterprise from the start.
In fact, they put PPV-quality main events on TV to win the ratings war… sound familiar?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:05 AM EDT up reply actions
This is incorrect. The promotion made piles of money.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:06 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t recall saying they didn’t. I said the WWF consistently kicked their ass on PPV, thus making more money, thus attracting more top talent, thus thus thus.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Besides being wrong, it sounds good!
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Why did WCW lose?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I had the impression that it was a similar combination to the factors that sank Afflicition (and Bodog Fight, for that matter): over-spending on everything, over-reliance on certain guys, inability to retain other guys, and an overall lack of direction when indeed they were actively directing it in stupid ways.
Actually Vince Russo was just the nail in the coffin
WCW had been going down hill long before Russo and that is why he was hired hoping he could bring the “Attitude” that made WWE popular again to WCW.
Yes he fucked things up even more (most notably by putting the title on David Arquette) but it’s not like WCW was doing great before Russo came along.
This is true
he just killed any chance of taking them back to the top of the wrestling world that they enjoyed from 96 to early 98. WCW succeeded because Ted Turner owned the network and badly wanted to crush Vince. They came pretty close. It was bleak for a while with WWE. A lot of the guys there stayed out of loyalty and WCW ran into problems it had no control over. When AOL and Time Warner merged that was it for them. The guys running the show no longer had control over the product and Turner couldn’t save them the way he used to be able to.
Almost all of the problems WCW ran into were problems they had control over.
Well, to the extent that incompetent people ever have control over their incompetency.
Oh, no question
they made some really horrific booking decisions but after the merger they didn’t have control of the on air product. They were told what they could and couldn’t do while Vince was pushing the envelope further and further on USA.
But yeah, they were fucked after they botched the ending to the Sting-NWO angle. Then they made Kevin Nash head booker and that was the inmates running the asylum.
They lost...
because Time-Warner took over and didn’t want “wrasslin” on their TV. Without a TV deal, the promotion was worthless to future investors.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 4:37 AM EDT up reply actions
That...
isn’t quite true either. The nWo run of PPV’s drew quite well.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 4:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Where did you get that info?
My info was that WCW was profitable in the 90s for maybe all of 5 seconds. OK, a little longer than that. But they lost huge sums of money. HUGE.
BTW, I’m w/ you – eventually a serious competitor to the UFC will emerge again. Though I don’t think it’ll happen any time soon.
the only problem is in pro-wrestling you can choreagraph and create the “best fighters in the world”
in a real sport unfortunately you cant. the nails are in the coffin my firend.
Seriously
Equating those scenarios is totally bogus.
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 27, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Not even close to true.
Guys like The Rock, Stone Cold, Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, Triple H, Shawn Michaels etc etc became stars because they had a natural charisma, Yes you can stage the results and who has the belt but you can not just make someone a star in the wrestling industry. They have to have “it”.
That's partially true
but they need to be put over by somebody big first. Very few and I mean very few guys have gotten over with the crowd without a shitload of help. How they are booked is extremely important in determining who gets the biggest push.
Actually you can
Ask HHH. If you stuff someone down the throat of the crowd so much, they will eventually buy it.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions
just like elite xc, ifl, bodog, affliction, who had deep pockets and tv deals?
lol. we went through that already my naive little friend… game is over – get over it and move on.
I’m talking about a deal with a network. Like we saw in wrestling.
Unlike you, I don’t have a personal stake. So can the “my naive little friend” bullshit. I think the time when people protected you because you were an “insider” has past. At the very least the clock is ticking as you make more an more unsubstantiated and incorrect claims.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:05 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
oh like the bullshit piece you had on carwin… lol. Let the clock tick away dip shit. mmalogic is worth 25% of bloody elbow. You’re tabloid shit is worth a laugh.
ZZZ
I understand why you were confused about tonight being about the UFC and Zuffa. It’s probably because you told everyone Fedor’s next fight would be for the UFC?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:12 AM EDT up reply actions
ooh now you have warning capabilities… lol.
Tonight is about the sport and the biggest impact tonight had on the sport is that the #1 HW in the world will be crowned next weekend. and to a lesser degree the Zuffa haters are even more useless. They got nothing left except unionizing. So have at it.
Breaking quote from notable Zuffa hater Subo:
I want a union, too. Caring about the fighters and wanting all the top talent in the UFC aren’t mutually exclusive.
They got nothing left except unionizing
See how this guy “respects” the fighters? They are clearly the enemy in his worldview. Think this is a “fan?”
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:29 AM EDT up reply actions
fighters do what’s best for themselves… if there was no Zuffa all these guys would be running around like Fedor fighting sub par competition.
Imagine if GSP, Machida, Rampage, BJ, etc… imagine if the best fighters in the world were running around pulling this shit. Yeah that’s good for the fans. right….
In your worldview that’s how you want it or you clearly dont know fighters.
Zuffa does what’s best for the fans because that’s what a business does – it has to make the fans happy. The employees spit in your food.
LOL
Can’t even hide your contempt for the athletes for a minute. This guy is a fan of the UFC as a business. I wonder if he even watches the fights?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:45 AM EDT up reply actions
You have to be a fan of UFC as a business. Zuffa has done what Boxing couldnt do. And that’s why within 10 years Zuffa is the biggest ppv provider in the world beating out a 100 year old sport.
That’s why in 10 years Zuffa has been able to deliver more relevant fights than boxing could in 100.
But you don't care about the fights
You care about big daddy Dana vanquishing all his foes. It makes you tingle a little doesn’t it? Every F-bomb? Every time he bullies someone like Tapout or AKA? You are transparent and sad.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 3:52 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
so you have nothing else?
If you care about the fights you support Zuffa because in 10 years Zuffa has put on more relevant fights than boxing could do in 100.
You dont want to accept that the fans interests lay with Zuffa’s interests.
The fighters insterests is not the fans interests. If fighters had their way they would be running around like Fedor fighting tire mechanics and guys named Zulu.
i think boxing has still put on a ton of great fights…
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:07 AM EDT up reply actions
as a matter of fact
If you care about the fights you support Zuffa because in 10 years Zuffa has put on more relevant fights than boxing could do in 100.
Tyson v. Lewis
Lewis v. Vitali
De La Hoya v. Mayweather
De La Hoya v. Mosley
De La Hoya v. Hopkins
Hopkins v. Taylor 1&2
Tarver v. RJJ 1,2,&3
RJJ v. Ruiz
Mayweather v. Hatton
Pacquiao v. Barrera 2
Mayweather v. Judah
Mayweather v. Gatti
I will stop there, but you should watch more boxing before you become an expert.
Name me 12 fights in the last 10 years that were bigger then those. It’s all about money and ratings so name them.. I bet you cant
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:17 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm sorry
But RJJ v Ruiz was relevant only if “relevant” means “profitable”.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:23 AM EDT up reply actions
its relevant when bj penn steps up in weight to fight gsp.
or when silva fights irwin or griffin right??? but not when a middleweight eventually moves up to hw and wins a title.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:26 AM EDT up reply actions
A title. Not the title. There hasn’t been a true HW champ since Lennox and I think you knows it.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:28 AM EDT up reply actions
narrowmind.
i named two hw fights.
what about the other 10
i figured..
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:29 AM EDT up reply actions
You named three HW fights
Boxing is boxing and MMA is MMA. One is growing by leaps and bounds while the other stares longingly at the PPV buys of yesteryear and desperately tries to turn Floyd Mayweather into a DLH-type draw. Ain’t gonna happen, and it’s because of all the fucking belts floating around.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:34 AM EDT up reply actions
the biggest boxing match now (pac v. money) is bigger than any mma showdown you can name…
that is relevance..
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:37 AM EDT up reply actions
I look forward to that fight
Oh wait…
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:39 AM EDT up reply actions
you keep hiding behind nonsense…
i look forward to you actually trumping me… unfortunately you cant, cause you keep saying nonsense and backing it up with more nonsense..
i replied to his comment about boxing’s relevance.. now trump it or leave it be.. its ok to be wrong.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:43 AM EDT up reply actions
Your biggest boxing match isn’t happening for the same reasons countless other fights haven’t happened, and those reasons are nullified by Zuffa’s arrangement. Was his comment hyperbole? Sure. Is boxing a frail imitation of what it once was? Also true.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:50 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
who said boxing is what it was 20 years ago???
not me.. like i said keep trying, and get your weight up…
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:53 AM EDT up reply actions
and those reasons are nullified by Zuffa’s arrangement.
wtf are you talking about??? zuffa didnt make a fedor lesnar fight.. or fedor anyone.. up until tonight that was ideal, what arrangement does zuffa have?
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Fedor is the last exception that proves the new rule – can’t be #1 unless you’re in Zuffa. No boxing promoter has the power to make that claim.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 5:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Vitali and Wlad are definitely the best or the #1/#2..
HOW CANT THEY CLAIM THAT.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 5:02 AM EDT up reply actions
and the whole point is, when it happened it was a big deal, and i think your buddy made the comment that UFC has put on more relevant fights in ten years then boxing could in 100 which is stupid
he and you if you agree with that obviously never heard of muhammad ali, aaron pryor, sugar ray leonard, joe louis, rocky marciano etc.. but i was just proving that boxing has put on more relevant fights in 10 years then ufc/mma has..
btw when people are buying it and watching it, it’s relevant… the only biggest factor in sports relevance is the fans and their interest… look at OSU-Mich, or Sampras-Agassi… Sports are what the fans make them.. that pal is relevance
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:36 AM EDT up reply actions
a title not the title…
you name 3 not 2
i look forward to that… oh wait…
lol come on subo get your weight up…
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:46 AM EDT up reply actions
My weight is down
I’m as light as I’ve been since I was 14 years old and I feel great.
Seriously though, Pac/Money will be a barnburner. What’s the date for that Incredibly Obvious Fight?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 4:51 AM EDT up reply actions
possibly november..
when is silva fighting fedor
or gsp???
when is the date for that fight, cause i dont see an equivalent on a talent standpoint and neither would outsell pac money so…
btw why cant people be a fan of both sports, youre just trying to hate for no reason, and still losing…….. sorry subo
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 4:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Possibly? Why possibly? How on Earth is that fight not scheduled? In fact, how on Earth has it not happened yet?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 5:00 AM EDT up reply actions
why hasnt fedor fought in the ufc
why hasnt gsp fought silva
having the 2 best fight isnt an easy negotiation… havent you learned anything?
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 5:05 AM EDT up reply actions
The fact that you think there is a winner/loser in internet discussion is humorous.
I know tons who are a fan of both sports, but boxing is in sorry shape. I’ll take 10+ PPV’s of highly talented athletes a year in MMA over the last super fight that can be made in boxing that HASN’T EVEN BEEN SET IN STONE…any day.
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 5:03 AM EDT up reply actions
and your replies are based on opinion not fact.
the fans speak dude, more people pay for big boxing fights then mma fights period… and i love both sports.. the facts are in the #’s
and yeah im sad, i am whiping the floor with your comments, and if i wasnt you wouldnt still be trying to prove youre right..
youre not…
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 5:07 AM EDT up reply actions
thanks for joining in though..
its been fun..
i got a film to edit… check it out we just posted a new trailer… dan severn is in it..
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 5:10 AM EDT up reply actions
God damn the fighters! Soon Zuffa will promote robot fights or cartoons. It won’t matter to mmalogic as long as Dana is kicking the Discovery Channel’s ass or showing Bugs Bunny who is boss.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 4:08 AM EDT up reply actions
that was the only thing that separated you from pdl. now, its gone. :’(
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
The day that one fighter can sell a couple hundred thousand PPVs, that holds water. It hasn’t happened yet, and while I can see the UFC brand creating a name big enough to draw that kind of cheddar, by that time, they’ll be so established, they can immediately denigrate and embarrass the fighters that left (by attrition, massive output of stars and rapid development/snatching up of new talent that other promoters won’t pay to sway).
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:29 AM EDT up reply actions
so what you are cheerleading is a future where we pay millions for the privilege to watch men risk injury so a small group of non-fighters make the lion’s share of profits while those actually fighting receive a miniscule percentage of the revenue? And if they don’t like they are free to leave and fight somewhere else where they’ll make a fraction they did before because the men with money will use all their leverage to make sure it is painful as possible for anyone that crosses them?
It is a brave new world indeed.
I want a union, too. Caring about the fighters and wanting all the top talent in the UFC aren’t mutually exclusive. Imagine a world where regional MMA shows are de facto farm leagues, and instead of title shots, you have UFC undercard fights on the line for those that excel. It creates local interest, good story lines (and highlight footage) for the upcoming cards and everyone makes more money.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Plus, as I'm sure you are aware
A union is about a trillion times more likely in an industry with a consolidated labor market.
It would be awfully hard to unionize across employers. Damn near impossible, in fact.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Why would you need to
Jesus.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Collusion?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:58 AM EDT up reply actions
wait
but there are tons of unions that go across employers. Steel Workers are a great example.
by Body Triangle on Jun 28, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Not gonna happen
The number 1 fighter in the UFC will be a champion. With the championship clause in effect, he can’t walk away.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 2:31 AM EDT up reply actions
That clause
Is not exactly iron clad.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions
yes it is, people like you can keep hoping against hope but the fight was over years ago time for you guys to admit defeat like Fedor did.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions
If Randy Couture can't break it
I don’t like anyone’s chances.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Can't break it?
He didn’t even try.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:57 AM EDT up reply actions
What was that whole “sitting out for a year after the Gonzaga fight” thing about?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 2:58 AM EDT up reply actions
He didn’t test it in court. Don’t play dumb.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 2:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Do you think that was because he thought he would have won, or…
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Good article, a few things missing...
You should have mentioned what the poster above did – the champions clause. In addition to Zuffa’s intent to keep their champs happy, which is in their best interests really, that would’ve closed the loop in your argument.
Now that Zuffa has the undisputed top fighters, as long as they keep those 2 things above in place, I agree, it’s game over – they’ll always have the perceived top fighters and no one will have the opportunity to challenge that.
There’s still work they could do – get the remaining top 10 at each weight class, get into all of the markets – but as long as they don’t royally screw it up, it’s done.
Actually
It is. Ask Brock Lesnar. The WWE had him sign something similar before his last contract (a no-compete) and when he quit, it was 7 years long. It took years to fight it and get it remoced. I believe they actually settled.
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 4:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, they did have him under a contract like that.
That’s why it took so long to get him to MMA. They battled in court for a long time. Hell, he almost went back to them at one point. Imagine how different the UFC would be if he had stuck with that decision. Holy hell.
effectively it is.
Doesn’t it only run for like 6 months or a year?
The litigation to get it struck down (which it probably would be at least in part), would take far longer most likely.
I don’t really care whether every #1 fighter is in the UFC.
Strikeforce still puts on a decent card, and I enjoy watching them.
Melendez is pretty damn good. So is Overeem, and I know it’s womens MMA, but Cyborg is still unbeatable and UFC has nothing to do with her.
btw did anyone love the Cung Le / Smith fight???
I did.
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Good fights? Yes
Ability to estlabish another fighter at the top of a division? No
The thing is Strikeforce made the biggest mistake when they signed Fedor. Nothing to do with the UFC being after him but the fact after sigining him they invested so much money into getting him he became their basket. Every egg went in there including the CBS tv deal. SF is a perfect example of why it is bad business to put all eggs in one basket even though the baskest maybe the best in the world.
Never ever ever
Right up until Zuffa gets bought, or the economy bottoms out (like hyperinflation, 20% unemployment), or a company with legitimate value buys a stable promotion that already exists and builds around that framework.
Saying never is a very, very silly thing to do IMO. Pride probably thought they were invincible in January of 2001, when Zuffa bought the UFC and they were putting on shows with Hendo, Wanderlei, Heath Herring, Yvel, Fujita, etc.
Moisture is the essence of wetness.
like i said never say never…
everything has a price, and everyone is gonna pay- million dollar man ted dibiase
by Brennan Linn on Jun 27, 2010 3:40 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow
This whole comments section is a complete shitstorm!
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:45 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
The Snowden-Logic melee is pretty entertaining. Started even but Snowden is starting to beat him down.
I dont have the stomach for it right now….. I’ll barf Toy Story fruit snacks all over me monitor!
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:49 AM EDT up reply actions
the fruit snacks or the movie?
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:54 AM EDT up reply actions
The movie
But now that you mention it, how were the fruit snacks?
by John Nash on Jun 27, 2010 3:58 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The movie was awesome. Really awesome
Fruit snacks………….also awesome.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:59 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Movie was great but don't waste your money on the 3D version.
I saw it in both and the 3D shit is just a straight up money grab.
I actually gave Logic the first 2 rounds so on my cards Snowden is down 29-28 going into the championship rounds.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 3:50 AM EDT up reply actions
what title are they fighting for exactly?
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:52 AM EDT up reply actions
the wamma championship, now that Fedor lost it was vacated and the winner of logic/snowden gets the right to hold it upside down.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 3:53 AM EDT up reply actions
God, yet another choice in life between the lesser of two evils :)
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 3:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Logic was alright until Snowden pointed out he doesn’t really seem to be in know for such an insider (who isn’t an insider) and now pointing out Logic’s fetishizing of Dana’s business domination. Wow.
i’m surprised that Herb Dean didn’t deduct a point for that it was clearly an illegal blow.
"they mad at me, I keep going hard reppin/
cause what's your Rampage to Rashad Evans/"
-Joe Budden (Something To Ride To)
http://www.zshare.net/audio/76866807deabe3c1/
by Nightwhistler on Jun 27, 2010 3:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Well
Herb would only do it if it was damaging.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I wish the Santos v. Finney ref would ref this
“Snowden, do you want him up?”
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I think logic is down now that he is resorting to the “fighters don’t know what is good for them”. But dick tucking was a good comeback
I think they are even on the genitalactic insults after Snowden got him for being a fetishist.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Until he used it twice. Not much worse than openly being told to pony up and prove that he “knows” about what happened with Snowden’s Carwin story, and he just beat around the bush with juvenile comments. That’s game, set, and match for Jon. The rest is just for shits and giggles.
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:07 AM EDT up reply actions
I cannot imagine getting into one of these arguments on here. I am a pacifist. I cant handle confrontation like that.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Look at this
…is he threatening me? I think he’s threatening me? If you are going to take the cash to astroturf sites, you can’t go crying back to Daddy Dana when someone calls you out. Weak.
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Unless there was something deleted how exactly is that threatening you?
They were talking about who won in the argument between you two. He said you lost the argument but didn’t know it yet. Nothing at all threatening about that to me.
Just BE.
by mattman73 on Jun 27, 2010 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
after wasting the last 45 minutes reading through this...
the only conclusion I have come to is something I cannot even say without worrying about being banned for pointing out the utter stupidity, ignorance and stubborness of a certain invididual who until today and this argument I respected as a writer. What a sad day it is when someone you once looked up to have fallen so low and be sucked into an argument that only makes everyone involved look and sound dumb from an outside perspective. I suggest reading through all this over again without all the “im so much smarter than you and I know what’s best BS”
by Opposites Attack on Jun 27, 2010 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Lol
Weak dog. Weak.
Snowden basically had his way with you earlier. If you have inside info, share it, or STFU about it all the damn time.
Frankly....
they both lost with me. Too much childish bickering.
But what do I know, I just come to the site alot and increase their page count.
Dude. It's Anderson Silva.
If he gives a damn he will end Sonnen’s night by either sub or KO.
-SSreporters
By Monday morning Chael Sonnen will be pissing out of his neck.
-Also SSreporters
exactly.
you summarizaed ina few rods what I just wrote directly above.
by Opposites Attack on Jun 27, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
rods=words
damn cell phone typing as usual.
by Opposites Attack on Jun 27, 2010 7:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Read his article and read my response in the comments section of that article…
Guess what? 2 hours later Carwin comes out and contradicts everything he said and confirms everything I said.
But what do I know… he talks to guys who clean toilets in fighter gyms.
Well, from Luke Thomas’s comment and from an earlier comment he made on a Carwin fanpost, it seems as if Luke is vouching for Snowden and his sources. My guess is that everything was done with the promise of it being off the record, but for whatever reason Carwin felt the need or was pressured to contradict the article. But since you are closer to the story and not bound by any pledges please feel free to enlighten us on what is really happening.
by John Nash on Jun 27, 2010 7:12 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
We have everything on the record. Everything. If they keep forcing my hand, I’m going to prove it. Don’t believe me? Wait.
Follow me on Twitter: @MMANation.
by Luke Thomas on Jun 27, 2010 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Just because I don't know the answer
What would happen since the source was anonymous/off the record? Any sort of backlack/legal ramifications?
Follow me on twitter @thisredengine
Also please check out SBnation's Red Bulls blog @ www.onceametro.com
by Matthew Roth on Jun 28, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Do you want to be...
…a fucking commenter?
"The best book on the real history of MMA that I've seen," Dave Meltzer
by Jonathan Snowden on Jun 27, 2010 4:09 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Hey man. Dont harsh our mellow down here!
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:10 AM EDT up reply actions
“Ready, Fuckers?”
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions
Someone get a hold of MMASupremacy, if he joined in this, we’d have something truly epic going on here.
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 4:14 AM EDT up reply actions
SandstormRemix would have poured a lot of gasoline on this blaze as well
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Is he gone?
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
He's in a better place now....
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former - Albert Einstein"
- Goonisis
Pinkberry?
Fan of Tiger 'Makin It Rain' Woods
by B-A-N-A-N-A-S on Jun 27, 2010 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions
When I die, I hope I go to Pinkberry.
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 28, 2010 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions
It was just like the really long fight in that Rowdy Roddy Piper movie that South Park modeled the cripple fight after……cant remember the movie though
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes
bad day for me when im too lazy to go to imdb
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:19 AM EDT up reply actions
I… am a little taken aback. For those wondering, I did write a piece waaaaay up at the top there.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 3:55 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
It’s a good piece, just not as entertaining as Snowden vs. mmalogic.
Anyone else think logic is that guy who forgot his passport on Dana’s video blog where they went to Canada?
From all reports she (Cyborg) pretty much only spars men, and has been known to put some out during training. - Rudinho479
by Kaleb Kelchner on Jun 27, 2010 3:57 AM EDT up reply actions
congrats dude
Their argument is your little demon seed
Jan Finney is the toughest fighter in MMA
by Earl Montclair on Jun 27, 2010 4:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Who else has that sort of effect on people?
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 27, 2010 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s weird.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 27, 2010 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow, I took that screenshot of Dana's twitter
It’s the same URL I posted in the BE results thread at 12:10am. Things sure spread fast.
by MMAInFeRioRiTy on Jun 27, 2010 3:51 AM EDT reply actions
Subo, you really lit it up tonight.
Fanposts aren’t usually getting this many comments especially this late at night.
Now if you could only edit the writing.
by ufc4 on Jun 27, 2010 6:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
somehow a picture of Logan would be involved
"We are entering the last phases of the Farewell Fedor tour, and I, for one, am looking forward to the future." - subo -
From this angle, it almost looks like she has a butt.
If you're not watching Treme, you're a bad person.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by Scott C. Broussard on Jun 28, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Pax Zuffa
Keep Firing, Assholes!
Have you accepted BROCKLESNARRRRRR!!!!!!! as your personal Heavyweight Champion?
by Ubernoober on Jun 27, 2010 10:15 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Fedor still is #1
Im glad someone has a brain and recognizes Fedor’s skill and isn’t hard on him because of a little lose like Werdum even Anderson Silva has a lose and is still respected greatly by everyone
by Christian Cardenas on Jun 27, 2010 3:48 PM EDT reply actions
No, he's not
And the assertion that he is is pretty sad. You’re in denial, and that’s fine. You honestly think that Lesnar or Carwin defeating each other doesn’t advance them enough in the standings when Fedor got submitted in the first round last night? That’s called being a mark. Fedor is still a top five heavy and, honestly, who gives a shit about rankings?
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 27, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
This is true
Carwin/Lesnar is for #1. That is until JDS dethrones them. Then if/when Werdum beats Overeem he’ll be number 2.
I look forward to watching our Brazilian overlords.
Hahaha
Seriously. I actually just watched the Fedor/Overeem fight at around noon because I was at a wedding in Rogers last night. I’m still in shock.
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 27, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
You must be in shock if you’re saying you watched Fedor/Overeem.
If you don't like the effect, don't produce the cause.
360Gamertag:Flipadelph1a
Yeah
I’m hungover from said wedding.
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 27, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
If you’d ever been to Rogers you could understand.
by John Nash on Jun 27, 2010 5:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Yeah...
No doubt.
"I have trained to fight an army. There is no way one man can stop me if many cannot." -Georges St. Pierre
by Charles Awad on Jun 27, 2010 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Doc Brown...
is that you?
Cause there's only one, and that's me
You understand? for all that fighting, you understand
That sucka think he good, that sucka think he can whoop me
And i know he can't whoop me, Ay boy, the n**** whole style is chump
by S.C. Michaelson on Jun 27, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
“and, honestly, who gives a shit about rankings?”
The guy who just wrote a paragraph about Fedor not being #1?
by ufc4 on Jun 27, 2010 6:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Who is this new subo and what has he done with the old one?
The subo I remember would’ve made damn sure every single one of logic’s comments were rec’d.
I think we’ve got an android on our hands. Very disturbing.
I specializes in grammar fail.
by a tommy point on Jun 27, 2010 6:00 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
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