FightMetric Report for UFC 115's Tyson Griffin vs. Evan Dunham
by Mike Fagan on Jun 13, 2010 1:08 PM EDT
in MMA News
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You want a good sign that your dissenting scorecard was on the wrong side of a split decision? Have Bruce Buffer, a man with a flair for the dramatic, breeze through the cards turned in by you and your peers.
Evan Dunham controlled stablemate Tyson Griffin in each of the three rounds last night. Yet, Dunham was one misjudged round away from losing a split decision. While the result ultimately went to the deserving fighter, it's important to shed results-oriented thinking and give a critical look at any sub-optimal decision from the judges at ringside.
FightMetric released their report for Griffin/Dunham last night, and here's how the fight breaks down by Effectiveness Scores and the extrapolated ten-point must system:
| Griffin | Dunham | TPM | |
| Round 1 | 63 | 114 | 10-9 D |
| Round 2 | 16 | 80 | 10-9 D |
| Round 3 | 30 | 61 | 10-9 D |
| Total | 110 | 254 | 30-27 D |
Griffin kept the fight close in the striking department. He outlanded Dunham 62-52 over the duration of the fight, though Dunham had the edge in effective strikes 25-10.
Dunham's propensity for taking the back became the story of the bout, however, as he moved to that position in every round of the bout. Griffin's complete ineffectiveness grappling was the biggest surprise to me, with Dunham completing three takedowns in the first two rounds.
FightMetric credited both fighters with submission attempts in the second round, though neither attempt threatened its target. Dunham worked for a rear naked choke after taking the back and came closest to finishing when he locked it in with a Gable grip on a standing Griffin late in the round. His arm was not underneath Griffin's chin, however, and the choke worked more like a crank, eventually broken up when Griffin attempted to spike Dunham's head on the mat.
Griffin latched on a guillotine early in the round as Dunham shot in with a double leg. Griffin's guillotine had the same problem as Dunham's later rear naked attempt, as he never really had his arms underneath the chin of Dunham. Dunham slipped out moments later and started work from half-guard.
How did one judge see two rounds for Tyson Griffin? I'm not entirely sure, but I suspect Griffin's volume fooled the judge in question. It's really hard to make a case for Griffin in any of the three rounds unless you completely discount the positional domination Dunham displayed throughout the fight.
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How are judges instructed?
I mean for someone to score that fight for Griffin they mist have been using entirely different criteria to judge the fight.
by Worldisart on Jun 13, 2010 1:05 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Holy crap
Between the judges that don’t know what the hell they’re watching, and ref’s that can’t figure out when a fighters lost consciousness, it’s freaking amazing that this sport even works.
by mictlantechutli on Jun 13, 2010 1:07 PM EDT reply actions
Pretty sure I read it was Tony Weeks who scored the fight for Tyson Griffin. Is this Tony Weeks the boxing referee?
Yes
He’s worked as both a judge and ref in boxing.
by Worldisart on Jun 13, 2010 1:10 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Tony Weeks judges MMA?
WTF?
Ugh, some serious changes needed. MMA needs to be entirely separate from boxing.
Refs, judges, rules, scoring system, sanctioning body, etc.
I looked around the internet and apparently Tony Weeks has been judging MMA for years now and issues with him have been discussed.
The judge who gave Tyson Griffin the 29-28 score in his fight against Evan Dunham was Tony Weeks (boxing background). Weeks has been a subject of debate, including on Jordan Breen’s radio show, where Jordan has talked about how Weeks does well with stand-up scoring but when it comes to everything else, he can be shaky. When Bruce Buffer read through the 29-28 Griffin score fast, the look on Dunham’s face was priceless. He seriously thought for a second he might lose that fight on the score cards.
http://www.fightopinion.com/2010/06/12/thoughts-ufc-115/
Below are a list of notable scorecards turned in by D’Amato and Weeks, two regular judges for Zuffa cards. The cross-section of scorecards is intended to show their judgements in fights that were seen as particularly close, contentious or controversial.
D’Amato:
L.C. Davis 30-27 over Javier Vazquez (8/9/2009)
Takeya Mizugaki 29-28 over Jeff Curran (8/9/2009)
Carlos Condit 29-28 over Jake Ellenberger (9/16/2009)
Randy Couture 29-28 over Brandon Vera (11/14/2009)
Justin Wren 29-28 over Jon Madsen (12/5/2009)
Aaron Simpson 29-28 over Tom Lawlor (1/11/2010)
Frankie Edgar 48-47 over B.J. Penn (4/12/2010)
Rick Story 29-28 over Nick Osipczak (4/12/2010)
Weeks:
Hermes Franca 29-28 over Yves Edwards (4/2/2004)
Forrest Griffin 29-28 over Stephan Bonnar (4/9/2005)
Brad Imes 29-28 over Rashad Evans (11/5/2005)
Cheick Kongo 29-28 over Carmelo Marrero (10/14/2006)
Ricardo Almeida 29-28 over Patrick Cote (7/5/2008)
Antonio Banuelos 29-28 over Scott Jorgensen (6/7/2009)
Dan Hardy 29-28 over Marcus Davis (6/13/2009)
Rich Franklin 30-27 over Wanderlei Silva (6/13/2009)
Rob McCullough 30-27 over Karen Darabedyan (11/18/2009)
http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/Lavigne-Will-Referee-Machida-Rua-Bout-at-UFC-113-Judges-Named-24324
hearing this one moron score it for Tyson nearly ruined my night
I just can’t even fathom some of the shit that these judges come up with. It’s a HUGE problem, especially with how much tighter the skill divide is getting in the sport.
JESUS H CHRIST……How many peoples mmaplayground predictions are going to get f’d in the A before we get some educated judges?!?!?! Shit.
"The only reason I'm cryin is cuz of the adrenaline."
by Earl Montclair on Jun 13, 2010 1:37 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
they should have
each judge only score 1 portion of the action. 1 for striking, 1 for grappling, etc. or something. whatever.
"Live fast, die."
While I see where you’re headed, the fact that we don’t always see multidimensional fights would seem to be an immediate issue there.
by Brent Ducharme on Jun 13, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Side note:
I LOVE Tyson Griffin. Always been a big fan. I loved how he went all out the whole fight trying to get the win and going for the finish in round three, he came out blasting.
How many guys would have stood up with a guy locked on their back? Most would have been content to fight hands and ride out the round. Tyson was doing everything he could to turn it around. The other memory of a guy standing up with someone on their back was Frank Trigg and we all know how that turned out. Tyson has great RNC defense though, knew Dunham wasn’t going to get it, he never came close.
Tyson didn’t get destroyed, outclassed or embarrassed, he was just put in some bad positions and lost the fight.
by Electro Boy on Jun 13, 2010 2:05 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This is Dana talking about refs but it is the same issue with judging too:
ARIEL HELWANI: "Here’s the thing, though. I know you always say it’s up to the commission, right? And ultimately it is up to the commission. You get new media and new fans they just point the finger at you and the UFC and they say, look at these refs, they don’t know what they’re doing, so in some ways like it’s this cloud hanging over your events. So what can you do, if anything, to rectify it?"
DANA WHITE: "It’s true and it’s weird that it’s happening to us because in boxing everybody knew the referees had nothing to do with them. You still get that stuff like Don King paid the ref. Let me tell you what — the refs and the athletic commissions [couldn’t] give a [expletive] what I think. They don’t care, you know, I try to give them my input all the time. I’m very public about how I feel about fights and how I feel about referees but it does not good, man, I don’t know what else to do."
http://www.fightopinion.com/2010/06/13/ufc-dana-white-referees-judges/
I like watching Tyson Griffin fight, wanted him to win, and saw ways to score certain rounds for him.
But it was obvious what the right decision was, and I was only kidding myself. I don’t think it’s premature to say that Evan Dunham a top 15 LW. Maybe he gets the Pellegrino/Sotiropoputoulouskalhfds winner?
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
I would say he is top 5 , granted bottom 5 . I think the kurt p vs george s winner would be a step down.
For beating an unproven TUF winner and just-out-of-the-top-ten guy?
Nah. I wouldn’t rank him above Edgar, Penn, Melendez, Florian, Aoki, Alvarez, Kawajiri, or even Maynard and Sherk. He’s floating around Jim Miller, G-Sot range.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
Hrm
Please try to keep on topic. The topic here is, Tony Weeks is a horrible and possibly corrupt judge, and scored 29-28 to Griffin despite Griffin being absolutely dominated for 3 rounds. So please keep your posts on topic, please, thanks.
by Ryan Tomasetti on Jun 13, 2010 9:04 PM EDT up reply actions
29-28 for Griffin was such total BS.. how could he possibly award any of the two last rounds for Griffin? Judging in MMA is the biggest problem with this sport right now IMO. Also, Yves Lavigne.
Hell, even if that card read the right way and Dunham took the unanimous decision, I’d be willing to still say there’s something wrong with two cards reading 29-28 after that fight.
by Brent Ducharme on Jun 13, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah that’s a good point, I certainly had it 30-27 for Dunham anyway. I thought Dunham won the first round as well, although maybe not quite as clearly as the last two, so it could be expected that at least one judge saw it Griffin’s way.
by Horselover Fat on Jun 13, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Definitely. I could accept such a five minute mental lapse from one judge, but not two. :D
by Brent Ducharme on Jun 13, 2010 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
If I ever made a mistake as badly as the Tony Weeks scoring of the Evan Dunham/Tyson Griffin fight, I would expect to serve a light sentence in a minimum security facility. I don’t think I should have to take anything in the rear, but I really don’t know how the population handles this sort of thing.
by Ryan Tomasetti on Jun 13, 2010 10:02 PM EDT reply actions
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