Does the UFC Need Floyd Mayweather, Jr. to Cross-Over to Break the PPV Record?
by Kid Nate on May 3, 2010 6:50 PM EDT
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Jake Rossen paints an intriguing scenario:
So long as Mayweather and Pacquiao linger, they will continue to prove boxing's last great bit of bragging: For as much progress as MMA has made in the past five years, it's clear that the biggest boxing fights almost completely bury the biggest MMA bouts, and by a considerable margin. The UFC had a rumored 1.5 million household rate for UFC 100, which was due in majority part to the considerable drawing power of Brock Lesnar. Boxing still holds the record for purchases with a 2007 bout between Mayweather and Oscar De La Hoya: 2.4 million. Both Pacquiao and Mayweather have broken the 1 million mark independent of one another.
..but there are still bouts that could fill bigger arenas. Had Anderson Silva not whiffed against Demian Maia in Abu Dhabi last month, the UFC might have drawn their largest home revenue gate ever in a super-fight with Georges St. Pierre: It's this sport's closest equivalent to Mayweather-Pacquiao, with two seemingly invulnerable forces going at it. Silva will need a fight or two of pure domination to light that fire again; Brock Lesnar versus Fedor Emelianenko would draw more than 1 million buys with no blinking. It also seems unlikely until one or both men are past the point of backing up their reputations.
In the end, the UFC's greatest opportunity of seeing a buy rate comparable to boxing's at the highest level is collusion: So long as he remains undefeated, Mayweather versus a mixed martial artist would be the kind of spectacle that would infect every conceivable demographic out there. (It's also virtually bootleg-proof: You'd have to have leprosy to feel satisfied watching it alone on a 13-inch screen.) And unlike Emelianenko, St. Pierre or Silva, Mayweather can do something none of them has any cross-training in: talking.
Rossen also postulates that if the rumored James Toney vs Randy Couture bout does big business that that will increase Mayweather's interest in crossing over.
Mayweather has mused out loud about such a cross-over in the past, that is when he's not busy talking crap about MMA fans and fighters or making guest appearances with the WWE.
This month's Din Thomas vs Ricardo Mayorga bout could be an early indicator of fan interest in MMA vs boxing cross-overs. If that fight draws any significant interest or attention, expect big things from Toney vs Couture and look for even bigger things down the road.
If Mayweather did cross over to MMA while still at the height of his powers, it would be an epochal sporting event that could determine the future of both sports.
UPDATE: Bad Left Hook has the numbers for Mayweather-Mosley:
Kevin Iole of Yahoo! said on his Twitter that he's heard from "good sources" that Saturday night's fight between Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Shane Mosley did around 1.1-1.2 million buys on pay-per-view, a figure that while impressive and realistically should be celebrated, would have to be seen all-around as a disappointment.
For one thing, it surely doesn't meet the four million homes that Richard Schaefer of Golden Boy Promotions was insanely talking about last week, but then anyone with a brain knew that was pure crazy talk.
But honestly, this would be an under-performance by what I personally expected, too. I figured around 1.5 million, maybe a bit more. This is lower than I thought it would be, but I'm not shocked. A bit surprised, yes, but not terribly so.
Facts are inconvenient things.
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Mayweather will only fight in MMA
If he ever goes bankrupt or some money mark promoter is willing to pay Mayweather twenty million for a fight he could lose.
this is just silly
mayweather will never cross over to MMA, so the whole article is moot. he makes more money in one fight than the highest paid MMA fighter makes in his entire career.
Yes it is – Max Kellerman was saying on a radio show last week if Mayweather beats Mosley which he id he could easily demand $50 to $60 million for a Cotto fight, That is just crazy.
by Shocbomb on May 3, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think you are way over estimating the cross over appeal of the two sports.
by j.villain on May 3, 2010 4:38 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
well
if you believe HBO’s estimate that only 5% of boxing fans order MMA ppvs that leaves an enormous untapped pool of potential ppv buyers for a Mayweather vs UFC ppv.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
in sum
I think a UFC ppv featuring Mayweather fighting MMA in the next 2 to 3 years could expect to do between 2 and 3 million orders on PPV.
It would also generate earned media coverage that would dwarf anything the UFC and MMA have ever gotten.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
It could... But I think it is very very unlikely...
Would Dana White pay Mayweather 60 million dollars for that fight?
Would Mayweather take 60 million to get destroyed an humilliated?
If he faced Aldo, Aldo would destroy Mayweather with leg kicks from outside of his boxing range… It wouldn’t be close to fair.
Sure it would be the biggest PPV event ever, but I don’t see the gain for either side (especially Mayweather) as big gh for it to happen.
by truck on May 3, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
in order for him to get the huge buys though they'd probably have to throw him in with the top guys at his weight
mayweather vs a can would get a million easy but u’d need a faber, brown, gamburyan or even aldo to get the huge numbers and those are hellish matchups for mayweather
faber brown and gambuyran are very very powerful wrestlers who are historically (thats for ur last fight brown) hard to knock out with a single punch, which mayweather has never shown he can do
and we all saw what aldo did to fabers leg and thats against an experienced mma fighter with years of practicing checking leg kicks mayweathers leg would be in the first couple rows after a single kick
5oz Gloves Changes a lot
I would be willing to bet PBF would bring some serious power with those new gloves
"I have to carry out another fine moment before I die."
-Tatsuya Kawajiri-
he has serious power, whatever the gloves
"All I guarantee is violence" - Wand
The big problem I see is what is Mayweather’s nickname? Mone…. the UFC can not offer him the kind of cash that would make Mayweather even blink about crossing over.
risk vs. reward
Plus, the UFC and Mayweather don’t really need each other. They are both doing their own thing and doing it well.
Follow me on Twitter http://twitter.com/ultmma
http://www.ULTMMA.com
The money would all be based on PPVs
Of which this would sell a lot.
I’d also like to think Mayweather could risk this, just because it wouldn’t take away the “O” on his record
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
yea but the images of him gettting subbed in the 1st would be all over
why would he risk venturing into a different sport while hes currently dominating his own
I think Mayweather is a smart business man and since when has Money ever put himself at a competitive disadvantage? He’s very calculated and selectibve on who he fights
Everything is done on his terms no way he would go in versus a top flight MMA fighter in his prime
Follow me on Twitter http://twitter.com/ultmma
http://www.ULTMMA.com
by ultmma on May 3, 2010 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I said I’d like to think it… I don’t actually, haha
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
Mayweather a smart business man? Didn’t he come out of “retirement” cuz he was almost broke? Doesn’t he owe the government millions? Knowing how to make a lot of money and being a smart business man are two different things.
by ufc4 on May 3, 2010 10:04 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He gets a huge % of PPV’s in his boxing matches though?
Would Dana be okay with his fighter taking home a check far greater than that of the UFC?
If he can build a great card around it full of exciting fights
it’s obviously a very smart long-term business move.
It would be a great long term business move for the UFC.
Aldo beating Mayweather would bring a lot of attention to the sport, but it would be a terrible terrible terrible business move for Mayweather…
No.
It would be a freakshow shortsighted move for the UFC.
How would it be a freakshow?
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
Maybe I should clarify.
If PBF came in and dedicated himself to MMA ala Hershal Walker, and then faced a lower tier zuffa opponent, that’s fine.
But folks are talking about Jose Aldo vs. Mayweather. And let’s get real, Mayweahter is 33 years old, w/ zero incentive to train properly for MMA. Plus, his boxing style is terrible for MMA. This adds up to overhyped match, where Mayweather is made to look like a real threat, when in fact, he’s gonna get his ass kicked.
This is Japanese style matchmaking, imo.
Luckily, UFC will almost certainly never book this. (Toney is bad enough!)
nah
he would in this fight, though.
In boxing I guess it’s first and foremost about the split of the purse, then how much the PPV actually does.
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
Its not about cross over appeal
Its just that people would know its an event they had to see, who cares if they were a fan of either.
Please no...
I know it would be good for draws but I can not stand Mayweather. His demeanor and flaunting of money rubs me the wrong way. I know he’s building a persona for himself and everyone has to put food on the table somehow, but take it easy. Dude’s a talented athlete, but a jackass and ghetto boy burning through cash.
I’d love to see Money fight Jose Aldo. I’d easily pay $50 for that fight alone, just to see Floyd get wrecked.
But if you are stupid, you will be beaten with a stick - Proverbs 10:13
by Ominous on May 3, 2010 4:42 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I would love to see it too but...
Why would Floyd let it happen? Quite simply he won’t derail his own money train…
That's the ironic part
The person who we are dream matchmaking Floyd with (Aldo) :
- doesn’t even fight in Zuffa’s flagship promotion or,
- make more than 40K a fight.
I know it’s redundant, but they should take greater advantage of the lower weight classes…
I don’t find anything appealing about cross over fights, because i truly believe that a mid level wrestler with decent striking defense could absolutely dominate even the top of the upper echelant of boxers. I think that mma is still in its infancy, so the fact that that it could have produced 3/5’s the sell of one of the biggest fights in boxing history speaks for itself. The appeal of someone like GSP is only going to be transcended by a Jon Jones at his peak, and then the next star in the making. 20 years down the road, I think that mma will transcend any number boxing had ever done simply because the different skill sets it encompasses will be more appealing to the masses once it is more generally accepted, and is no longer a niche sport. to say that mma’s biggest paydays rest on the hope that we can get a boxer to cross over is somewhat an insult, given the rise in popularity of mma compared to the death throws of pugilism.
Even when I'm laying on my back I'm never backing down
by Austin Martin on May 3, 2010 4:43 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
you're not the target audience
for a boxing vs mma ppv. Boxing fans are.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
i hadn’t thought abt it from that perspective. do you believe that a boxing fan would enjoy his favorite fighter getting dominated in a less than appealing style? If mayweather were to step in against a 145er like manny and get clinched, taken down, or tossed around, would a boxing fan enjoy that enough to convert? I don’t believe so
Even when I'm laying on my back I'm never backing down
by Austin Martin on May 3, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions
No, he would hate it.
But, the boxing fan is adament about how much tougher a boxer is then an MMA fighter. The boxing fan would tune in, just to prove his assertion right.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
JT vs. Couture is an attempt by Zuffa too bait in the Boxing audience and;
Put the challenge out to any other “high” level boxers. This could potentially open doors for the UFC in the future. I could realistically see a scenerio unfold where, Mosley or Pacman say to themselves, “JT is a chump, I would kick that guys ass.” For this and this reason only, JT vs Couture could be a significant fight. The fight itself should be a one sided ass whoppn. Couture by anything he wants at anytime he wants it. Just to be clear.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
I think Maywether PPV
wouldn’t even be boxing fans, it would just be an event type audience…a lot of the audience might never have ordered a ppv.
Give MMA ten years and lets bring this issue up again. MMA is a biweekly event, boxing hold 3-4 major fights a year, fights that draw a big PPV number. You go to a BBW or Hooters every other weekend and see a packed house watching a UFC PPV. I seems to me like, UFC have a more sustained following, and boxing catches people 3-4 times a year. The UFC have the advantage in this scenerio. Mayweather is a great self promoter, he would break the PPV record again if he fought in the Octagon. Maybe after he fights Pac man we could see him, but, I will not bank on it.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
typo
BBW is something completely different than Buffalo Wild Wings…
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
although I’m sure there are many BBW at BWW on a daily basis.
The more you drive, the less intelligent you are.
Mind fart, guess that sweet looking BBW that walked past me subliminally distracted me.
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
big beautiful wings?
"Justice is the whim of a judge, check his chest density
It leaves much room for error, and the rest left to destiny."
-Sage Francis
OH crap, what did I start? lol
If Russia attacked Turkey from the rear, Do you think Greece would help?
the way they break the ppv record is to do what boxing does
put on only 3 ppvs a year that ppl care about
however the UFC wont do this so they’ll continue to have their ppv buys spread among each card and at the end of the year have way more buys then boxing has
don data
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
by Anthony Pace on May 3, 2010 4:51 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Please educate me....
How is there such a discrepancy on the pay scale? Floyd Mayweather Jr. gets $22.5 million guaranteed just to show up plus almost $6.7 million from pay-per-view sales. George St. Pierre made under a million at UFC 100 and the card sold over a million.
How can boxing promoters pay this and still turn a profit? Is there a boxing cartel? Sketchy betting? Or is it the frequency in-which the pay-per-views are offered?
Honestly, enlighten me please!
I'm from Canada, and they think I'm slow eh!
Well, the UFC cards might have 4 “names” on the card. They all got to pay those guys, plus all the undercard guys. As good a fighter as Mosley was, Mayweather is the only reason people bought that card on Saturday. Basically, people were paying to see a Mayweather fight, not a “boxing PPV”. People pay to see UFC events in their entirety.
Also, the live gate is bigger in addition to large PPV buys.
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
Very simple.
In boxing, the boxers are the stars. The promoters, who work often for them, have to give them the majority of the profits if they want a chance to put the fight.
It’s Mayweather who sells, not a promotion. People don’t care about which promoter will sell the fight.
In MMA, it’s the UFC who keeps all the money. Because MMA fans buys the UFC brand before all.
GSP vs insert a name outside the UFC would do badly so they can keep paying low salaries compared to boxing.
You got it.
In boxing the power lies with the fighters and promoters basically have to bid to put a fight together and then take a percentage of the top, the inverse of the UFC. For UFC 100 Brock and GSP were reportedly paid a little over $8 million total. Throw in the rest of the card and the total purse was $10 million max. Great. Except for the fact that gate and ppv revunue for 1.5 million buys ws $42.5 million. Now throw in all the auxiliary revenue streams (DVD sales, Spike Rebroadcasts, merchandising) and that’s a massive amount of money floating around.
And people wonder why ever mma fighter always toys with the idea of going into boxing.
Second question
If GSP and Brock’s basepay were say $400,000 where did they get the extra zero?
I'm from Canada, and they think I'm slow eh!
Based on what others have reported a select few UFC fighters get a bonus based on ppv. the simple way to tell which fighters get this bonus is look at who get a base pay with no win or lose bonus. All the champs plus Chuck, Tito, Randy and a few others qualify. The bonus is multi-tiered and different for each fighter, so GSP may get $1 for all buys between 100,000-200,000 and $2 for 200,000-350,000 up to $3.50. I’ve read (and I believe it) that Brock has the highest tier at $5 a buy at some point close to a million buys.
Who are the fighters with a lose bonus?
by ufc4 on May 3, 2010 10:08 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Compare UFC yearly PPV buys to Boxing yearly PPVs.
Whats the difference? Who has more yearly buys? I’m not sure if I’ve ever seen these numbers compiled. It would be interesting to see trend data for the past 10 years between the two.
i was wondering exactly this
boxing has a big event, what, every six months, if lucky? mma (the ufc specifically) has one a month, and it’s usually pretty hard two find to lackluster events in a row.
mayweather has fight twice in the past 2 1/2 years, anderson has fought six times. a. who is working harder and b. who has taken more risk?
The UFC has a PPV every month. Whether or not its really a bigger event than some of HBO’s headlining shows is debatable. Different business model with different TV deals.
As far as finding lackluster events in a row, well, didn’t we just have a big run of those?
by VirtualBalboa on May 4, 2010 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Hmm..
FMJ vs. Anthony Njojuani?
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
*Njokuani
Inhale deep, like the words of my breath—I never sleep, cause sleep is the cousin of death
first round sub by money may
"All I guarantee is violence" - Wand
the short answer is yes
If money may decided to fight on a ufc card it would crush the record with any other title/contender fight that would get mma only fans excited.
but i do not think there is a need for ufc to do that. It would be like dealing with fedor’s people, it would get messy about money and mayweather’s brand being involved. plus, what is wrong with what they are doing? performance of late has been substandard, but with the big fights coming up ufc will be fine without mayweather and will not have the risk of a one off fight with “a boxer beating a mixed martial artist” stigma attached to the event.
"All I guarantee is violence" - Wand
Seriously? What are the odds of Mayweather fighting MMA while he's undefeated?
We’re talking like a million to one. No chance. Never!
Why are we even talking about this?
by Ilias on May 3, 2010 5:13 PM EDT reply actions 6 recs
This month’s Din Thomas vs Ricardo Mayorga bout could be an early indicator of fan interest in MMA vs boxing cross-overs. If that fight draws any significant interest or attention, expect big things from Toney vs Couture and look for even bigger things down the road.
Too bad that PPV is clearly going to be DOA.
Want to break the PPV record?
Have Mayweather fight Pacquiao. Done.
You can’t convince me to place a red cent at any odds that Mayweather takes and MMA fight in the next ten years.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
Or..
..have the Brock vs. Fedor super fight in a sold out full capacity Cowboy Stadium. That would generate enough buzz to get 2 million buys. Oh yeah, throw GSP vs anyone in there too and Canada is locked down.
by Reciprocity on May 3, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
two of the three fights mentioned have a shot at happening
the third is fedor/lesnar. Zero shot unless something fundamentally changes.
http://mixedmartialartsblogger.wordpress.com/
by Cory Braiterman on May 3, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed however....
..I hold out hope that the UFC will do some polling and next time negotiations with Fedor come around they can say that X number of people (X = a really huge number) would buy a Fedor/Lesnar ppv and here’s how much money you would make.
I can tell you how to make Fedor vs Lesnar happen
Pay Fedor and m-1 as big of cut of the revenue as Mayweather got. I guarantee he signs for that fight.
I'm not sure that fight would outdraw Mir Lesnar III
I mean that in all seriousness. Fedor just isn’t that well known and therein lies a lot of the problem in putting that fight together.
maybe i missed it
but i was wondering who decided a boxer would ever be better than a true well rounded MMA Artist or where this whole argument started? No disrespect to anyone but to me it is simple arithmatic : Boxer has the skill of Boxing which is very good but
MMA Fighter has skills in wrestling, boxing, BJJ
1 < 3
Maybe because the sport of boxing is more the established sport but this argument has never made sense other thatn a boxer having a punchers chance. As far as PBF he is sooooooo boring and reminds of that guy from TOSH.O. i hope he never fights in the octagon Spare me please but i admit i would love to see him get RNC’d that would be funny
like i said maybe i missed a valid point in the debate but if so please let me know I am not closed minded about this i love a good fight
because the majority of mma fighters cant box for shit
in mma the majority of mma fighters are only good at either wrestling or submissions (so they can avoid “fighting”) – and hardly any mma have all three skill sets unless your named anderson silva – peace out
Get ready for the tease
SC on Luke’s show last night was talking about how really the only acceptable fight for PacMan or Money is with each other. I can see Money flirting with fighting in MMA not as a legitimate goal, but just to drive up his value in boxing negotiations or make it seem as if he has a viable alternative.
LOL
So the ufc wont Co-Promote with M1 but they will with HBO? haha
If I had to choose someone to go into business with
It would be Mayweather and HBO over Fedor and M-1.
One of those two companies is a well established, properly run, money making company. The other one is riding the coattails of their one valuable asset and running their partners into the ground.
I’ll let you figure out which one is which.
by Worldisart on May 3, 2010 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
he will not fight in MMA
Until he is as irrelevant to boxing as James Toney is. Boxers will only come over if they can get a bigger paycheck in MMA than in boxing
by logic_101 on May 3, 2010 6:43 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 2 recs
Has nothing to do with Mayweather… Boxing has a base that has been built up for countless generations. Look at what Zuffa has done with less than 10 years compared to boxing’s 100plus.
Boxing fans are dying and will continue to do so where as UFC has millions of more fans waiting for the sperm to meet the egg.
on a side note: Mayweather vs Pacman will beat the current record set by mayweather/delahoya.
Mayweather would go to the WEC, the guy’s a 147lber.
If Mayweather goes to the UFC he’ll get fuckraped. For all his bluster and showboating, he is a rational man, and a rational man does not want to get fuckraped. Ergo Mayweather will stay away from the UFC.*
*Until he’s 41 and he needs money again
Keep Firing, Assholes!
I bet I can do more weighted chinups than you. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7ij3paczCc
Can you imagine what Aldo’s leg kicks would do to him? I don’t even want to see that.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
By the time that Mayweather is 41 and needs money again, MMA would have made another quantum leap, and someone faster, meaner, and harder hitting will have taken over from Aldo.
Keep Firing, Assholes!
I bet I can do more weighted chinups than you. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7ij3paczCc
an epochal sporting event that could determine the future of both sports
C’mon, Kid Nate. You’re better than that.
It would be a freak show, as PBF would get destroyed by any halfway decent MMA fighter. He is an all-time great boxer, but this is MMA. Plus, he has pretty much the WORST boxing style for mma. Shoulder roll. Lead leg exposed.
I could go on.
This would just be a freak show for a big pay day. And then UFC would really be Japanese MMA.
Gotta agree. If he’s not fed someone who’s gonna try and stand and brawl, I just don’t see how he’s going to deal w/ leg kicks, the clinch, takedowns, etc.
And if he doesn’t wait till he’s washed up in boxing, for the amount of money he’d want to be paid, on top of all the stipulations he’d try and insert into the pre-fight and possibly even the fight itself, would it even be worth it to do it?
If the UFC really wants a big number they’ll do GSP vs BROCKLESNARRRR!!!!
Keep Firing, Assholes!
I bet I can do more weighted chinups than you. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7ij3paczCc
The Update
Really takes all the bite out of the argument from the rest of the article doesn’t it. Mayweather-Mosley pulls smaller numbers than UFC 100, so clearly UFC doesn’t need Mayweather to raise their numbers.
Lesnar-Carwin will pull bigger numbers than any boxing match outside of Mayweather-Pacman.
The UFC can beat there own personal best
but I dont know how soon they’ll be beating the type of numbers to get the revenue Mayweather demands.
so at the end of the day, It would be great for the Fans, probably bad for Floyd. Im sure he would take it seriously and train. I could see Mayweather VS Edgar competitive on the feet, but edgars wrestling is light years beyond and if he got BJ down, mayweather would definately go down, little mma/boxing math!
all you gotta do is...
Did anyone else read on ESPN that Pac just stated he’s willing to recondsider the testing business? Eegads it’s really going to happen this time.
Oh no
until both men are physically in the ring close enough to breathe on each other I’m not getting my hopes up for that.
"With great power comes great responsibility" -Spiderman's Uncle
maybe Pacman saw some holes?
Make it happen! Would be the first boxing PPV I EVER bought
all you gotta do is...
Even if Pretty Boy Floyd were to ever fight in MMA, he’d sure as hell stay away from UFC. Strikeforce or some Japanese promotion might actually pay him a truckload and let him crush a can. If Zuffa was ever going to give him anything like the sum he’s sure to ask, they’d toss him into the deep end, full stop. Faber, Brown or Aldo would murder him.
by Monday Morning Martial Artist on May 4, 2010 4:59 AM EDT reply actions
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