UFC on Versus Preview: Bloody Elbow Judo Chop: Brandon Vera Uses the Thai Plum to Crush Frank Mir at UFC 65
In Sherdog's Pro's Pick feature about the upcoming Jon Jones vs Brandon Vera bout, Robin Black had this to say:
That Jones fella really is unpredictable and athletic and crazy, but, theoretically, the way to counter that is with strong basics and sharp fundamentals. So many guys at this weight are dangerous for an up-and-coming super talent like Jones to face at this point in his development, but I believe Vera is a particularly tough matchup for him. Vera is fundamentally strong enough to make the right decisions when Jones brings some of his crazy heat, and talented enough to capitalize when he gets the chance. Vera has so many weapons: technical striking, high enough level wrestling to counter Jones, crazy leg kicks, dangerous clinch. And Jones is not gonna shake Vera. Vera is tough. I say Vera by decision.
Mike Chiappetta also discussed Brandon Vera's skills at MMA Fighting's preview of the UFC on Versus:
Vera's striking is good enough, technical enough, that he feels comfortable standing up with anybody. His wrestling is good enough that he can take anyone down, and his jiu-jitsu is competent enough to threaten anyone. His skill-set is not the issue; the issue has been putting all the pieces together, mixing in some killer instinct and bring it all to a boil. Sometimes, you have the right ingredients, but the recipe doesn't come together.
So I thought it would be fun to go back and take a detailed look at the last fight where Vera really put it all together, against Frank Mir at UFC 65.
Vera utterly devastated Mir in every aspect of the fight, but the key technique was his use of the Thai Plum or the double collar tie to control Mir standing and fire repeated knees to Mir's face. Here's what wikipedia has to say about the position:
Also known as the "Muay Thai clinch","thai-clinch", neck tie or plum position, the double collar tie is a stand-up grappling position often featured in Muay Thai and in mixed martial arts competitions. The double collar tie can be used to effectively control the opponent, even allowing for throws to be executed from the position. The most typical strikes from the double collar tie are knee strikes, either to the head or to the body. The combatant executing the double collar tie tend to keep the elbows tucked in to prevent the opponent from countering with a double collar tie of his own, or with uppercuts.
Now let's look at some Gifs.
On the right we see an early exchange between Vera and Mir. Notice the complicated feint Vera shows before he fires a left hook. He steps forward and cocks his right hand as if he's coming with a right straight. Mir takes the bait and drops his right hand. When Mir attempts to counter with a left straight, Vera side steps away and scores with the left hook.
The important things to watch are Vera's feints, footwork and how quickly he sneaks in the left when Mir's guard drops. Note also his response to Mir's feinted right hook -- Vera puts his left hand up to protect his face then quickly reloads it and tags Mir.
On the left we see Vera score with a hard right straight that staggers Mir. After threatening the straight right only seconds before, Vera has now trained Mir to look for other punches when he sees Vera showing the right straight. So this time Mir raises his right hand to protect against another left hook and instead of feinting, Vera comes right down the pip with a hard shot.
Mir quickly attempts to regain his composure, but Vera immediately moves in to establish a collar tie by putting his left hand on the back of Mir's neck while firing a second right straight. Mir is able to cover with his left forearm and the punch doesn't score, but it allows Vera to get the dominant position he wants: the dreaded Thai Plum.
At this point, everyone knows what is coming, but Mir's not in any position to do anything about it. Vera now has both hands wrapped around the back of Mir's neck and he fires off a hard right knee while pulling Mir's face down into the blow. He immediately pistons with a left knee to the face and then readjusts his grip on the neck and scores with another right knee as well.
Mir is falling to the ground from the devastating impact of the blows and tries to go for a single leg take down, but Vera easily sprawls out of it and quickly finishes Mir on the ground.
In other early fights, Vera won with devastating high kicks to the head (Justin Eilers) and quickly applied guillotine chokes (Assuerio Silva). There is no doubt the man has the physical tools and technical knowledge of all aspects of MMA to contend at the highest levels.
The question that will be answered Sunday is whether or not he can recapture the killer instinct to make it all work together.
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note
how Eilers is ducking and putting up his forearm. Vera’s earlier kicks to the body have trained him to protect his ribs. When Vera goes over the top, there is nothing protecting the top of Eiler’s head.
Also note the killer instinct the young Vera had — he immediately charged in for the knee to the face to finish off his prey.
and RIP Justin.
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I notice 2 things in this gif
1) After vera threw that strike he took a step back to assess the situation — some might call that a lack of killer instinct — I think it’s a characteristic of Vera’s style
2)Yamasaki waited too long
Faber, Florian, Nick Diaz, 'Mayhem', Mousasi, Fedor
after unleashing the head kick, Vera was also out of balanced causing the delay in the follow up. Machida has that style you are referring to.
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
It looks to me like he’s taking two steps back — 1 to regain his balance after throwing the kick & 1 out of instinct to immediately retreat and reassess the situation
Maybe he needs to take 2 steps to regain his balance, but it doesn’t look like that to me
Faber, Florian, Nick Diaz, 'Mayhem', Mousasi, Fedor
You want a gif on how things might turn out this weekend?
That Jones fella really is unpredictable and athletic and crazy, but, theoretically, the way to counter that is with strong basics and sharp fundamentals.

Yep, this is how I see Vera winning, by catching a careless Jones. Maybe careless isn’t the right word: more like risky. I don’t think Vera really has KO power in his hands, but I think if he catches Jones just right, it’ll be enough to wobble him pretty good. The question is whether Vera has the killer instinct anymore to capitalize. I mean, he had Couture in trouble a couple of times, one time particularly bad, but couldn’t finish.
Still, I think if Vera is going to win, it’ll be by catching Jones in the middle of one of his wild moves. If Jones wins, it’ll be by decision. I don’t see him finishing Vera.
I don't want to lick any butt. - GSP
my problem with this line of reasoning (vera’s fundamentals being the antidote for unorthodoxy), is that he would have then had a much easier time with jardine. i still got jones
by phantasma475 on Mar 19, 2010 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions
That is a bad analogy...
Jardine isn’t “unorthodox” in the same way as Jones or Faber because he doesn’t attempt high risk moves, he’s just awkward.
by Anton Tabuena on Mar 19, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s not a bad analogy, as Jardine’s “unorthodoxness” is still high risk, even if we want to classify him as akward as opposed to fluid. If being technically sound is the answer for styles that are out of the norm, one would think it would’ve shown up better against Jardine. In that fight, Jardine even used his unorthodox approach to take Vera down.
Jardine needs to make better use of his takedowns and ground game.
They are better than most people think (because he never uses them) . This would protect his head.
Difference is, Jones doesn’t do idiotic things like this, and usually Faber doesn’t either. If Jones tries a blind flying backwards elbow on Vera then he deserves what he gets, but somehow I don’t see that happening.
Without pain, without sacrifice, we would have nothing.
by lowellthehammer on Mar 19, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Well
the only difference is that Mike Brown has gorilla- man- strength KO power, whereas Vera has never showed that kind of power in his hands.
I think Vera’s a tough test for Jones, but unless he somehow gets it together mentally then I see Jonny just tossing him every which way.
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by ElliotMatheny on Mar 19, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks Nate
You have helped renew my faith in Brandon.
WAR VERA!!!
by CSKit on Mar 19, 2010 12:13 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
All this ‘chop’ did was make me miss the good old days when Vera was the ‘savior’ of the terrible HW division (ala Sylvia domination)
Oh what happened Vera, you used to be so exciting. He just seems so gun-shy now. Even against Randy he had Randy in all kinds of trouble and he still only showed flashes of his initial killer instinct.
Maybe he’s so hesitant because of the split with Kaman…
by dancingChicken on Mar 19, 2010 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
for those in the Philippines...
The card won’t be on a really really late tape delay anymore… It’s gonna be on balls, televised 9am this monday. :)
Maybe nitpicking, but I don’t agree with Chiapetta’s statement that Vera’s wrestling is good enough to take anyone down. I think his defensive wrestling is very good, but even still, I expect Jones to solidly control the wrestling aspect of this fight.
i made a post of this a while ago
Its interesting to note if you watch how vera finished the fight, he used the same one armed headlock with a hand onbicep grip that Brock Lesnar used, only from his knees instead of half guard, to finish the fight
there's another point
where it’s very similar to what lesnar was doing to mir
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It's ridiculous how good Vera is when he puts it all together.
I wonder if we ever will see the oft-promised return of Vera’s killer instinct.
Without pain, without sacrifice, we would have nothing.
by lowellthehammer on Mar 19, 2010 1:32 PM EDT reply actions
If he had followed up that knee stomp with some killer instinct it would have been over. That’s all he’s lacking these days
by Jedi Mind Kicks on Mar 19, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
the judges actually scored that exchange for jardine — aggression & octagon control.
Faber, Florian, Nick Diaz, 'Mayhem', Mousasi, Fedor
by mma_dude on Mar 19, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I take it all back...
Kid Nate Rocks!
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Faber, Florian, Nick Diaz, 'Mayhem', Mousasi, Fedor
robin black is a clown
his picks have historically been hilariously wrong
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This and your inhuman ability to make the comment section lose it’s mind in blind rage.
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Speaking as a Mir fan
I am so glad that slow, fat guy that Vera smashed up isn’t around anymore.
Get rid of the ramp!
As obviously successful as Vera’s knees from the Thai plum were, shouldn’t Anderson Silva’s be a better example for Judo Chop purposes?
Could also contrast it with Machida’s “highlight reel” sequence vs. David Heath that was Judo Chop’d before, relying more on momentum than technique.
this had more to do with preparing for the Jones vs Vera fight
than showing any particular technique.
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