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Manny Pacquiao vs Joshua Clottey Shows the Huge Potential Cross-Over Audience Boxing Could Bring to the UFC

Manny Pacquiao's trainer Freddie Roach has respect for the abilities of many MMA fighters.

HBO executives went on the record saying that less than 5% of their boxing Pay Per View buyers were also customers of MMA PPV's. Then we have multiple reports of the expected huge success of last night's Manny Pacquiao vs. Joshua Clottey fight. Kevin Iole reported the optimistic pre-fight promoter talk:

Only a few hundred of the 45,000 tickets for the card remain, prompting Dallas Cowboys owner Jerry Jones on Friday to offer standing-room tickets at $35 apiece.

Jones refers to his standing-room seats as "party passes," and Arum will be partying for a week if early indications of the fight's popularity prove true.

The closed-circuit locations and presales in the East are at record levels, surpassing where they were in 2007 for the Oscar De La Hoya-Floyd Mayweather Jr. fight. Indications are that the pay-per-view is tracking better than expected, and Arum said he won't be shocked if it touches 900,000 buyers.

Bad Left Hook's Scott Christ had a more conservative estimate, after discussing the amazing live gate sales in Dallas he commented:

But can it sell on PPV? I think this might be a reverse of the Mayweather-Marquez situation last year, where the live gate and attendance in Las Vegas were very disappointing, but the PPV numbers shocked everyone in and around the sport. The gate for this isn't going to set any records (well, it'll set the record for boxing in Texas, which is currently held by last year's Marquez-Diaz fight), but the attendance is obviously something that American boxing hasn't seen in a dog's age. But on PPV? I'm just not sure.

Pacquiao's fight last May with Ricky Hatton did around 800,000 buys, and his November bout with Miguel Cotto did about 1.25 million, matching what Pacquiao did against former PPV ruler Oscar de la Hoya the year previous.

MMA Payout had a different take:

The fans won't be happy until they see Mayweather-Pacquiao, but in the mean time the interest level in these two fighters has never been higher. I, too, would be surprised if this fight didn't hit 700,000 buys; and Mayweather-Mosley will like exceed 1 million buys.

Regardless of whether Pacquiao vs Clottey winds up doing 700,000 or 1 million buys, if only 5% of that audience has also ordered an MMA PPV, that means there is potentially a large potential MMA audience segment out there untapped.

The conventional wisdom is that boxing fans are older, more conservative, and ethnically more diverse than MMA fans. It is also widely believed that boxing fans are not just disinterested in MMA, rather many boxing fans actively dislike MMA.

But with the numbers being this big, it's no wonder that there is serious interest in the MMA community in fading champs like James Toney and Ricardo Mayorga

Many in the boxing community reveled in Ray Mercer's crushing victory over former UFC champ Tim Sylvia, seeing the fight strictly in terms of boxing vs MMA rather than as a bout between two individuals. You have to think that a few hard-core boxing fans -- including many who proudly attest their hatred and contempt for MMA -- will tune in to see if their aging champs Toney and Mayorga have what it takes to KO the MMA fighters they face in the cage.

Boxing legend Freddie Roach talked to Inside MMA about how boxing technique translates to MMA (transcript via USA TODAY):

"Definitely, the biggest thing is to get them to be more comfortable being closer to their opponent. In boxing, they can't use their legs for kicks and they don't need that room that they might when they are using the legs. ...

"I have to take into consideration that they may be kicked in their fights and so forth. That's why I ask a lot of questions and I learn as we go.

"It's like bobbing and weaving in MMA. It's really not the best move in the world to make for an MMA fighter. And I didn't realize that at first, because I forgot about the knees."

He also talked about the striking skills of B.J. Penn, Anderson Silva, Georges St. Pierre and Fedor Emelianenko. Notable is this regard for the abilities of B.J. Penn, "I think he's one of the best strikers I've ever worked with. He can really punch."

He also discusses the abilities of Fedor Emelianenko, a man who KO'd his pupil Andrei Arlovski last year:

"His balance isn't that good. He's flat-footed a lot. He's kind of easy to box if you use in-and-out or side-to-side motion. He can be outboxed, but the thing is, he's such a good puncher -- you've got to be careful with that."

With Fedor having earned the grudging respect of Roach, I would think that many other boxing fans might be pleasantly surprised by what they see if they tune in to see a freak show featuring James Toney or Ricardo Mayorga. 

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How bad was it, was it Silva/Leites bad?

Keep firing Assholes!

Blackout is always right

by Ubernoober on Mar 14, 2010 2:55 PM EDT reply actions  

I’ve heard it compared to a “ceiling fan rattling against a turtle for 12 rounds”

by dumbwhiteguy on Mar 14, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

It wasn’t that bad, many kept attacking with scary fast combos, clottey just covered up throwing punches sporadically

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Penn/Sanchez?

Keep firing Assholes!

Blackout is always right

by Ubernoober on Mar 14, 2010 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nope not that much visible damage, more like watching Pacquiao training with an overmatched sparring partner. Impressive speed by Pac but not much else.

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

SC over at Bad Left Hook said it was like watching Pac get a good workout with a heavy bag for 12 rounds.

by Tedd Welch on Mar 14, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yup, it was that bad.

Clottey didn’t even come to compete, really. Just collect a paycheque and say he went 12 with Pacman.

by Mr. Reynolds on Mar 14, 2010 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think everyone at one time has said they would be willing to just get in the ring and do nothing with the champ for the amount of money they get paid to do it. Well that guy was Clottey.

by TheKeyboardWarrior on Mar 14, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

If friggin’ Alexander Karelin signed tomorrow it would be a freakshow.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 3:01 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

No it’s a freakshow because at this point Karelin (a man who at one point I would wager had the tools to have been the greatest mma HW of all time) would have a snowball’s chance in hell of doing anything in the UFC right now.

Toney is a 41-year old who’s boxing career and talent is on a massive downward spiral. He also happens to be fighter who is notorious for not staying in shape and who’s fighting style is tailor made to get his ass kicked in mma.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

In that case

I hope you were one of the few who was defending Mercer vs Sylvia as not being a freak show.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would call that a bad fight

With nothing particularly interesting about it. Not something i’d pay to see or go out of my way to watch.

But no, i would not call it a freak show.

by The Flying Gentleman on Mar 14, 2010 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I only thought it was a freakshow afterward

When the photos surfaced of how “prepared” Tim was. The fight was a faded boxer versus a faded mixed martial artist.

by asa on Mar 14, 2010 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Semantics.

Toney hasn’t been relevant in the boxing world for years. That should read ‘was’ a real fighter. No disrespect because I loved Toney back in the day but that day was 10-15 years ago…

by Mr. Reynolds on Mar 14, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Clottey not Clotto

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 2:55 PM EDT reply actions  

It’s like Cotto and Clottey merged Dragon Ball Z style. Maybe if they actually did they could beat pac.

by The Flying Gentleman on Mar 14, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Even with the fusion dance, I don’t think they would stand a chance

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly

They’d need the Potara Earring Fusion to form Colottey, to defeat Pacquiao!!

by CSKit on Mar 14, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cotto is damaged goods. Clottey was never good.

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Success?

Maybe it was financially successful but I bet there are a lot of people really disappointed with the fight.

by dumbwhiteguy on Mar 14, 2010 2:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Cowboys fans are used to being disappointed.

Keep firing Assholes!

Blackout is always right

by Ubernoober on Mar 14, 2010 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

No

It just made us want to see Pacman vs Mayweather that much more.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 3:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Keep reaching for that rainbow dude.

by dumbwhiteguy on Mar 14, 2010 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Manny completely dominates the #4 ww and people are not going to want to see him against Mayweather? Wait until after Mayweather/Mosely and if Mayweather wins, unless you’re living in an mma cacoon, the clamor will be deafening.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 3:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Was it not deafening before? I’m sure they’ll find some way to fuck it up again.

by ufc4 on Mar 14, 2010 3:34 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I'm sure they'll muck it up somehow

But that stll doesn’t mean that if Mayweather clobbers Mosely it won’t go all the way up to 11.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 3:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I agree

—I know I was. I was pulling for Clottey too.

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joshguel Angel Clottorres

Goldie: "Michael Jordan-esque in his grappling skills is Travis Lutter."
Rogan: "No, no he's not. No."

by Stillberry on Mar 14, 2010 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am glad

I didn’t get sucked in one last time and pay for a boxing PPV that sucked.

by Riney on Mar 14, 2010 3:09 PM EDT reply actions  

What is this "pay" you speak of?

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

If Freddie Roach and Bob Arum are any indication of how boxing fans would act towards MMA, they can keep their homophobic fans and their boring fights. Dominated? yes, but never even close to putting Clottey away.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 3:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Did you see the interview with Roach? He and Bob Arum have very different views towards MMA.

Putting him in the same group as Arum makes him look bad, please stop doing so.

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bob Arum is just Freddie Roach when he gets old. They’re all the same. Boxing is King all else is weak and unskilled.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

you should really watch the interview dude…

by kovy on Mar 14, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

ive watched and read many interviews with Roach.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am speaking about his latest interview with Inside MMA that was posted on the front page of BE. Go watch it.

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

you’re assuming that i haven’t watched it

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

well if you did watch it and that ^ is what you took away from it then uh…dunno what to say ta ya buddy…get a hearing aid? learn english?

by Curbside on Mar 14, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I’m guessing you didn’t watch the interview. Thank you for your input anyway.

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Roach understands that Boxing is a huge part of MMA. He’s trained many MMArtists, I gurantee that once Pacquiao retires, Roach’s next project will be bringing better Boxing training into the sport of MMA.

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

What are you talking about? Freddie Roach is one of the biggest supports of MMA in the boxing world.

by TheKeyboardWarrior on Mar 14, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

if he chooses to fight us like a man, we’ll dominate him

said of Fedor before his affliction fight with Arlovski by Roach mixed in with all the typical boxing garbage about how he can’t punch.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Watch the interview and maybe your misguided perception of Freddie Roach will change.

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

it’s misguided because i dont agree with you?

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Your opinion is misguided because it isn’t based on factual information.

Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on Mar 14, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

he spends the whole time talking up the guys he’s either worked with or wants to work with/make money off of. that’s nothing new.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kruk asked him whether MMA or boxing would be bigger going forward and Roach answered MMA (paraphrased).

Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on Mar 14, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

again…an obvious statement, and he only said that after he said that boxing was coming back. no matter what he says to MMA outlets, he still believes that the only way to “fight like a man” is to stand and punch

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

and then what did he say after that?

by Curbside on Mar 14, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

he said exactly what Mike Fagan said he did(paraphrased), i didnt dispute that

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

so all the fans that like watching stand up are chumps too? everyone is entitled to their own preferences except freddie roach of course

by Curbside on Mar 14, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

if everyone is entitled to their own preferences, then why am i not entitled to mine?

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Yeah, because MMA trainers never say things to try and get the opposing fighter to fight the way they would prefer.

Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
MMA Editor - SBNation.com

by Brent Brookhouse on Mar 14, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

And i never said that they don’t. what i was saying is that regardless of what he says about fighters that he previously worked with( and will presumably work with again), and the few big names he mentioned (that he wants to work with and cash in on), he still believes that anything other than standing and punching isn’t manly. I’m not saying that he and Arum are the same. He’s a modernized version of Arum, his opinions are more PC. He’s smart enough to make $$$ off of the few big names in MMA that can afford to pay for his services, but that doesn’t make him a supporter of MMA, it makes him a smart businessman.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

"I’m not saying that he and Arum are the same. He’s a modernized version of Arum"

You could at least wait a whole sentence before you contradict yourself.

You’re putting words in Roach’s mouth and making a whole lot of assumptions about what he thinks when all evidence in the here and the now says the dude is cool with MMA.

by Worldisart on Mar 14, 2010 6:05 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

how am i putting words in Freddie’s mouth when the only words of his that i have used came from a direct quote of his from when he was training Andre to fight Fedor?

what evidence? he picked 4 of the best fighters on earth and talked about how good they are. How hard is it to point out how badass BJ, GSP, Anderson, and Fedor are? how does this make him an MMA supporter? He’s just recognizing good talent, like any trainer worth anything would. Not to mention he’s picking guys he’s either worked with or wants to, and guys who make enough to actually hire someone of his caliber to work one aspect of their game.

by BradCr on Mar 14, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m a bigger MMA fan than I am a boxing fan but I watch both. However when I buy PPV’s my only criteria is that I’m buying a GOOD card.

Last night’s Pac-man led card was not a good one. The undercard was lackluster and I knew that Clottey would be a completely defensive fighter so I didn’t buy it. The same goes for the UFC PPVs. I buy the cards if they’re good cards but skip the ones that are cobbled together with replacements and lack luster decision fighters.

by NateDouble on Mar 14, 2010 3:16 PM EDT reply actions  

Good for you for being a discriminating buyer. I don’t know why for some people you have to see and buy everything to show you’re a fan.

by John Nash on Mar 14, 2010 3:21 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I just wanna say that Jim Lampley last night made me appreciate Goldberg

BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG! BANG!

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 3:48 PM EDT reply actions  

BOOM!

"BANG!" - Jim Lampley's first word as a child

by SSreporters on Mar 14, 2010 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, Lampley’s rare low moment completely validates Mike Goldberg as a broadcaster…

Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on Mar 14, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s probably because I don’t hear Lampley as much as I hear Goldberg

In my view

Bang! Bang! Bang! = The Michael Jordan of BJJ

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think that’s even close to the same thing. Goldberg’s claim was factually incorrect (and not unusual for Goldie). Lampley just lost his marbles for a few seconds.

Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on Mar 14, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not talking about information-wise

I’m just saying it was just as funny

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Aye. In that case, you are correct.

Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on Mar 14, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

What made the BJJ comment funny was how Rogan just completely disagreed with him.

My favorite Goldie comment though is “They are speaking the Portuguesa!”

And Rogan said “Uhhh that’s Japanese, Mike.”

"BANG!" - Jim Lampley's first word as a child

by SSreporters on Mar 14, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

The atmosphere of being in a stadium with 50k in attendance and seeing Pacquiao for Jim Lampley was like being a 14 year old who is standing ten feet from the stage at a Jonas Brothers concert.

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s because it was a pue WTF moment 15 secs long, nothing is wrong with you. Goldberg is bad overall, 15 years of constant suckage vs 15 secs of intense madness if you will.

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Mar 14, 2010 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's getting worse. Whether it's making up non-existent 9-9 rounds

Or thinking a left hook by Cotto was from Pacquiao, these mistakes are piling up.

"BANG!" - Jim Lampley's first word as a child

by SSreporters on Mar 14, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

He still has a looong way to go to build up a blunder resume like Goldberg has

by IRodC on Mar 14, 2010 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Goldberg is a man amongst boys in the MMA blow-by-blow range.

And that’s sad. I don’t know much about Schiavello so listening to Todd Harris, Mauro Ranallo post-PRIDE, and Gus Johnson have led me to believe Goldie is a legend.

Chuck Lie-dell!

"BANG!" - Jim Lampley's first word as a child

by SSreporters on Mar 14, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RT2s9LTUvaA

Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade

by Damon O. on Mar 14, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lamps must have been listening to this before the fight

watchkalibrun.com

by Nick Becker on Mar 14, 2010 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

This was the only thing good about Pacquiao/Clottey

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RT2s9LTUvaA

Introduce Lampley to MMA so he can call Duane Ludwig fights.

"BANG!" - Jim Lampley's first word as a child

by SSreporters on Mar 14, 2010 3:48 PM EDT reply actions  

That was a very technically sound commenting.

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Mar 14, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

I SAID-A

BANG BANG, BANGITTY BANG! I SAID-A BANG BANG, BANGITTY BANG!

by Burlap_Sack on Mar 15, 2010 4:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

I can imagine that Kellerman and Stewart were looking at each other like: “wtf is this dude smokin’? — where did he get it and does he have anymore?”

"I do no speak of the future. Your demise is already an inescapable fact of the past. " - Aizen

Floyd Mayweather, Jr. fan since 7/12/97 -- 40-0-0 (25 KOs)

by Ryan Tical on Mar 14, 2010 9:03 PM EDT reply actions  

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