Jon Jones says "you're going to see fireworks"
UFC on Versus: Vera vs. Jones coverage [vs. Brandon Vera]
almost 2 years ago
Nick Thomas
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Hope he doesen't get disqualified this time kicking too much ass
by IronMonkey13 on Feb 26, 2010 12:31 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Prediction
Not to take anything from Randy, but if Vera couldn’t even get a decision from that fight even after his new found heart for serious training, I fail to see how he could go past a round with Bones.
Im a bif Bones Jones fan but I just have this fear of him getting caught by Vera…Almost hope he does cus imo seeing him get his chin tested and his lead leg beat up a bit may tell us a lot about how he stands in the mix 4 a shot at the belt down the line…
by longevity on Feb 26, 2010 12:37 PM EST via mobile reply actions
On paper I tend to agree with you but Vera hasn’t shown that he can really pull the trigger with his technical striking. He doesn’t seem to be willing to seize the opportunities like a A. Silva or Machida would take when an opening presents itself.
If Vera lets Jones get in the clinch with him like he let Randy I think we’ll see Vera being tossed all over the octagon like Bonnar. I would like to see Jones train with Randy to develop some dirty boxing in the clinch to add to the arsenal he already has with his greco-roman throws.
Am I the only one who thinks this is a bad match-up for Jones? His stand-up is pretty overrated due to the “oh shit” factor. While he does hit hard and from very unorthodox angles he leaves a lot of opening to be hit back and this is really the first guy that hes had to fight that can really make him pay for that sloppiness.
The only thing that scares me about Jones in this fight is the amazing trips and throws hes been able to use to get the fight to the ground and Vera hasn’t really shown the ability to keep a fight at a distance (where his striking his most effective). If this fight stays standing I think Vera is the favorite.
How did I end up on this bandwagon and why does everything say property of Chael Sonnen?
Good point…Almost makes me wonder if Jackson may try to have him use a modified verion of Randy’s game plan hoping JJ can get Vera to the Mat and force Vera to fight off his back??
by longevity on Feb 26, 2010 12:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
You're absolutely right
And someone better than he is will beat him, likely by exploiting those holes. And the true sign of who he is as a fighter will be seen in how he responds.
Look for Jones standup to be even better after more work with Phil Nurse for his MT and also training with Zahabi some up in Montreal. Just based on how Nurse talked about Jones in a recent interview, you know how incredible Jones can be in time.
And time is something he has
He’s only been legally able to drink beer for a year or so. He’s got all the time in the world.
For sure he has amazing potential and would be the perfect fit for the “prodigy” nickname if it wasn’t already taken.
How did I end up on this bandwagon and why does everything say property of Chael Sonnen?
Keyboard failure...
2. The elbow on Bonner was completely unfair and should have been called a foul.
Nice dynamic move, but it resulted in an illegal blow if you ask me.
itwas close but I the rule is more for the back of the neck not really near the top of the head.
but ya I also thought it was an illegal blow.
"Ehh I don't think it's just me; I think nobody likes him"
- Wanderlei Silva on Micheal Bisping
It was certainly illegal, but the ref doesn’t usually call a foul on something where the intention was clearly legal, such as Jones’ attempt. The fouls are typically called when it is clear the back of the head is right there and they hit it anyways. I’ve seen a lot of throws where the defender moves in the last second and it becomes illegal, but the ref doesn’t usually call it, or atleast only gives a warning on it.
I agree about the intention, however...
I would argue that those criteria perhaps need to change in cases like this one. Sure, Bones did not intend to strike Bonner in the back of the head, but he did none the less and a blow like that will alter the remainder of the fight. Additionally, while I can see the argument that Bones doesn’t deserve punishment for unintentionally committing an illegal strike, Bonner didn’t deserve to have to fight the rest of the match living with the results of that illegal strike either…he was clearly the victim in this situation. Perhaps a no contest would be in order for situations like this.
That is my biggest gripe/concern for Bones. He has exciting and dynamic striking…but at times it feels like it is dangerously unconventional. His other spinning elbow strike, against Jake Obrien, was also questionable in my mind (he ended up striking with the point of the elbow to the top of Jake’s head if memory serves) and also completely changed that fight leading to Jon’s victory.
The only thing about possibly revamping that rule
How would you call an instance where someone on the defensive purposefully moves into an attack for the sake of causing an illegal blow?
If when the attacker swings, the area of contact would be within the legal bounds of striking, but the defender either purposely (or out of sheer reaction) dodges in a way to make the strike illegal, should the attacker be faulted?
I spin around in a circle so your punch hits me in the back of my head, is that your fault for throwing the punch, or my fault for moving into it?
look the video again in slow motion
Bonnar sees the elbow coming and tries to dodge it making it illegal himself. Jones should not be punished because of that.
by IronMonkey13 on Feb 26, 2010 4:49 PM EST up reply actions
Nice Promo
that elbow sounds more brutal every time.
It’s hard to see where Bones will have any weaknesses. Great power. Great length and reach. Incredible wrestling. Decent technique. Maybe BJJ defense?
Well played.
I agree with Dooda, other than I don’t see BJJ defense an issue for Jones against Vera.
Agreed.
(On the well played part ;-) )
But seriously, I agree that I don’t see this fight spending much time on the ground outside of one guy taking it there out of survival…which is less likely than some clinching on the fence.
I’m with you on this one. The last thing that I am worried about is his stand-up with Vera. Guy is longer and anytime he feels threatened, he clinches (Ala BROCKLESNAR!!!).
I know that Vera’s favorite thing to do in the world is to take a fight to the judges and let them decide who won, but he’s going to have a tough time dragging this one out for 15 minutes. Jones is an animal.
Did you see the size of that chicken?
This should be an excellent fight
1. Vera has better stand-up
2. Jones has better ground
3. Jones takes his guys down from the clinch
4. Vera has as good a clinch game as Couture
5. Jones is wildly aggressive
6. Vera is frustratingly passive
7. This is one of the best match-ups I can imagine right now. — but the edge has to go to Vera
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
Randy clinches to dirty box, Jones clinches and throws people across the ring. Me thinks that if Brandon wants to play the clinch game that he’ll be flying through the air. Jones did start to gas though in that fight with Bonnar after tossing him around so much and not finishing him.
It is highly unlikely that Jones will dominate Vera in the clinch. Vera is a much more skilled greco roman wrestler than any of Jones’ previous opponents (and also more skilled than Jones himself), all you need to do is look at Couture vs. Vera to see that Vera can hold his own in the clinch with anyone at 205.
Jones has great throws and and exciting striking game, however he has not shown a dominating top game or consistent top level striking. He dominated Hammil on the ground only AFTER Hammil suffered his shoulder injury and his other previous opponents spent very little time on their back after they had been taken down. As others have said, Jones occasionally lands exciting standing strikes, but he has not dominated any of his previous opponents w/ strikes.
Vera’s downfall since returning from his contact dispute has always been mental, he’s tentative and at times looks afraid to pull the trigger. As a result he has lost a couple of close decisions (Jardine, Couture).
The deciding factors will be how much Jones has improved since his last fight and if Vera can finally get over his mental block. Vera SHOULD win, but my guess is that he will continue to be tentative and he will lose another close decision.
youre miss-judging vera’s passive style as a tentative mental failure. He is extremely technical and smooth, with no flashy display or awkward attack — a judge who doesn’t really understand what’s going on might rule against him just because he doesn’t appear as aggressive. This is exactly what happened to him against Jardine and Couture.
Neither Jardine nor Vera did any real outstanding damage to each other, but if you look at compustrike, Vera clearly was the dominant striker — Vera should have gotten the decision.
Against Couture, Vera did by far the more damage and won most of the technical greco roman exchanges. I’m really not sure how he lost that other than he was fighting Randy and that Randy has an aggressive style while Vera is passive.
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
Vera adopted the passive style you are referring to after his contract dispute. Prior to that he was significantly more aggressive and it served him well. Whether this is Vera’s intended style/game-plan or unintended tentativeness only he knows, but I believe it is not intentional.
According to fightmetric under the 10-point must system, the Couture fight was a draw and Jardine won his fight against Vera. I believe Vera needs to be more aggressive and impose his will rather than let his opponent dictate pace and exchanges, if he doesn’t he is likely to lose more decisions.
you are just wrong about this contract dispute thing other than his opponents have gotten tougher and tougher (if that’s what you mean).
I’m glad you brought up fightmetric because I think that the “Fightmetric Effectiveness Score” is probably the most objective way to determine who won a non decisive fight:
Vera 277 vs. Jardine 266 (Vera was better)
Vera 158 vs. Couture 142 (Vera was better)
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
What’s important is that the Jardine and Couture fights were very close and Vera allowed that to happen by being tentative. Watching him it almost looks like he is afraid to make a mistake and as a result he hesitates and is often reacting to his opponent’s actions rather than forcing his opponent to have to react to his own… Judges are apt to give rounds to the fighter who is more aggressive and imposes their will in situations where everything else is equal… that is what it seems like they did in Couture vs. Vera.
Vera plays the clinch game in every fight...
So if you’re right — Vera is gonna get completely dominated in this fight.
But, the ‘clinch game’ isn’t all that different if youre trying to dirty box or judo throw. Once you get those under-hooks, you can either press your opponent against the cage ala randy or take them for a ride ala parisyan. Vera uses them much like randy, and against jones, he will use them to keep the fight standing.
This fight is going to teach us allot about Jon Jones and it’s also a win-win situation for him. If he ko’s vera, he’s going right to the top — if he loses a decision, he has plenty of time to recover.
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
8. Vera is a bad fighter.
9. Vera lost to Randy Couture.
by yukkurishiteittene on Feb 26, 2010 7:38 PM EST up reply actions
in all fairness...
i just forgot to mention the last two points…
Thanks
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
Amazing Fight
This fight … will be amazing. That is all I have to say. I give Vera the edge, but no one will care, no matter what, this fight ain’t going to decision. And if it does, someone will need surgery.
How do we get this fight for free...
and we have to pay to see silva & penn crush their opponents. This says something very disturbing about mma fans and/or mma promotions.
I'm just a dude who's trying to put it together.
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