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Can a Female Fighter Make It on Skill Alone?

When we ogle this photo of Erin Toughill are we disrespecting her as an athlete?

Bleacher Report interviewed Sarah Kaufman and asked her about the way female fighters are marketed:

Kyte: A lot of the female fighters getting attention these days are the ones who rock bikinis and take photos like they’re posing for lingerie ads. Does that focus on appearance, and female fighters having to be portrayed as sex symbols and objects of desire, frustrate you at all? 

Kaufman: (laughs) I don’t think there is anything wrong with showing a feminine side if that’s you, or looking nice and presentable. Obviously image is a big thing for anyone. I understand that image really is important, but your image has to be you.

I’m wouldn’t be comfortable posing in bathing suits, that’s not my style. I’m definitely more on the tomboy side of things: skate shoes, jeans, track pants, definitely more on the edge of comfy as opposed to dresses and heels. That’s just not me, so I would have a hard time forcing myself to play that image on a regular basis.

If there were an occasion where they asked me to dress up, I would try, but I can’t promise that I would come out looking as good as everyone else. I also wouldn’t take my clothes off.

Donna of Gal's Guide to MMA commented:

Yes, of course I realize sex sells.  But these women are professional athletes, and I’m not sure posting a picture of them in a bra and panties alongside an interview of their training regime is showing them the respect they deserve.  By all means, comment on how beautiful Gina Carano is.  I’ll be the first to say she’s insanely gorgeous.  Anyone who’s been on my website, Gals Guide to MMA, knows that I have a hearty appreciation for the hotness of many of the fighters we cover.  However, that doesn’t stop me from covering guys like Dan Henderson and Wanderlei Silva, who’ll never make it on a list of Top 100 Hottest MMA Fighters.  Right now, it seems like if you’re a female MMA fighter, and you’re not super hot or Cristiane Santos, then you’re not going to get much media attention.  If Cyborg is fulfilling a life-long dream by posing in Playboy, then by all means go for it.  But I can’t help feel she’s attempting to stay relevant in a system that sometimes praises women fighters for their beauty rather than their talent.

For my dollar, I like photos of sexy women and I like MMA, and the combination has a kind of "don't get your chocolate in my peanut butter" quality that I find a little disconcerting. It just weirds me out to have a sexual response to someone like Gina Carano based on her cheesecake photos and then to see her get punched in the face. 

But I'm not going to pretend to be the biggest fan of women's MMA. I'm a huge fan of the fighters and the heart and dedication they display, but not as big a fan of the fights themselves.

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I like photos of sexy women and I like MMA, and the combination has a kind of “don’t get your chocolate in my peanut butter” quality

I’m gonna try to think of some jokes off this one.

We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.

by Anthony Pace on Feb 24, 2010 7:04 PM EST reply actions  

Got one

But what if the chocolate is creamy and there are nuts in your peanut butter?

it’s bad, i know

We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.

by Anthony Pace on Feb 24, 2010 8:25 PM EST up reply actions  

But I’m not going to pretend to be the biggest fan of women’s MMA. I’m a huge fan of the fighters and the heart and dedication they display, but not as big a fan of the fights themselves.

Exactly my thoughts.

by thekiltedwonder on Feb 24, 2010 7:04 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

All women’s sports suffer from the same thing. All of them.

by dumbwhiteguy on Feb 24, 2010 7:15 PM EST reply actions  

One can argue that it’s due because the majority of people that watch sports are dudes. I very rarely come across women that fallow sports as much as guys do.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 7:24 PM EST up reply actions  

WNBA can’t even get people to go to their games even when it’s free.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 7:47 PM EST up reply actions  

That's true

But the few that do show up are probably women, right?

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 7:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Exactly. Nothing to do with mma.

by IronMonkey13 on Feb 25, 2010 4:57 AM EST up reply actions  

Yowza

We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.

by Anthony Pace on Feb 24, 2010 7:17 PM EST up reply actions  

damnnn

My sexiness meter is reading over 9000!

by eddyg on Feb 24, 2010 7:18 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL

I know this is a joke, but since I’ve heard this argument made in sincerity before, I’ll re-post these thoughts from my comments on GG

On a sidenote, I have no problem with this site’s objectification of male fighters. I would argue that most of these men (and men in general) have no problem being seen as something other than the object of desire, whereas female fighters (and women in general) do not have this privilege. They often struggle to be seen as something other than the object of desire.

My motto,
As I live and learn,
is:
Dig and Be Dug
In Return.

-Langston Hughes (no relation to Matt)

by loboplata on Feb 24, 2010 7:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Well it also just works better. The traditional “ideal” male is a soldier that punches people and fights for honor and blah blah blah. The traditional “ideal” woman picks flowers and faints. These ideals are changing obviously, but not as fast as some would hope.

The man known simply as "Christmas Cheesesteak"

by Neil Manich on Feb 24, 2010 7:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Lol I’m actually sincere here. See I grew up with 4 sisters and I’m used to people telling them what they can’t do because they are women, trying to change them into asexual beings when they want to do “manly” activities. It rubs me the wrong way.

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Feb 24, 2010 7:52 PM EST up reply actions  

When we ogle this photo of Erin Toughill are we disrespecting her as an athlete?

Here, I think, is one of the more interesting questions. I would argue “No” but IF and ONLY IF we also grant her credibility FOR HER MERITS AS AN ATHLETE. To paraphrase my thoughts on GG, the problem is that we make it very difficult for female athletes to exist in both spaces (or even solely the athletic space). Maybe less so for the hardcore fans, but every promotional push of a female fighter outside the base willingly engages a (primarily male) audience that is all to happy to reduce the persons value as being the object of their desire. That speaks to a systematic problem.

My motto,
As I live and learn,
is:
Dig and Be Dug
In Return.

-Langston Hughes (no relation to Matt)

by loboplata on Feb 24, 2010 7:21 PM EST reply actions  

If Carano and Toughill are showing their business in magazines because they want to, then no worries. But the problem is, it seems like most of the women fighters who get attention are the ones that are willing to wear next to no clothing in photo shoots. It should be a choice, not a requirement.

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 7:40 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

Word.

My motto,
As I live and learn,
is:
Dig and Be Dug
In Return.

-Langston Hughes (no relation to Matt)

by loboplata on Feb 24, 2010 7:50 PM EST up reply actions  

An uneven choice.

"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."

by AJB on Feb 25, 2010 7:55 AM EST up reply actions  

“Uneven” is Subjective, such is the nature of choice.

by BillyJane on Feb 26, 2010 2:39 AM EST up reply actions  

I expect people to bring up Cyborg as the example of a woman more known for her skills than her pretty face, but she also wasn’t widely accepted by the fanbase until she both destroyed Carano and feminized herself. Everyone enjoyed “Cyborg is a man!” jokes until she prettied herself, then it became bannable offense. Yes, winning played a large role in her acceptance, but had she forgone the dresses and cosmetics, I doubt she would as be liked.

New Orleans Saints - 2010 Super Bowl Champions. Unbelievable. Who Dat.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by Scott C. Broussard on Feb 24, 2010 7:26 PM EST reply actions  

Cyborg is a man jokes are still rampant. I personally don’t think she’s a good fighter. I mean she gets by being 10x stronger and 10x faster than all of the little girls she fights. Did you watch Cyborg literary pick up her opponents and throw them across the cage? Her take down defense against Marloes consisted of picking her up and tossing her like a frisbee. If someone fought her with her strength and speed, Cyborg will get exposed.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 7:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Wouldn’t this apply to Brock Lesnar as well?

by chrisbboy82 on Feb 24, 2010 8:02 PM EST up reply actions  

That’s what Crocop said about Lesnar.

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Feb 24, 2010 8:12 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the problem with Cyborg is that must people don’t take her as legit because of the strong evidence of HGH injections. I’m not saying she does it, but it could be a reason why nobody pays much attention to her.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 7:37 PM EST up reply actions  

who is saying this? I’ve never once heard that.

My motto,
As I live and learn,
is:
Dig and Be Dug
In Return.

-Langston Hughes (no relation to Matt)

by loboplata on Feb 24, 2010 7:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Saying what? That she takes HGH?

I hear it all the time, everywhere. If not HGH, than people say she’s on roids. Hell, even the MMA Junkie “doctor” had to talk about.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 7:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Problem is...

People will continue to talk about it because nobody says anything about it. We all want to assume that a fighter is legit, but how cam you when you keep hearing how rampant steroid abuse is in sports?

I’m not taking neither side, BTW. I remain on my neutral ground that if a fighter hasn’t gotten caught, than they’re clean.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 8:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed

And since that Rugby player got dinged for HGH, we may get some concrete answers.

by woomikee on Feb 25, 2010 10:31 AM EST up reply actions  

What about Lady Gaga?

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Feb 24, 2010 8:20 PM EST up reply actions  

That ain't no woman! It's a man, baby!

Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade

by Damon O. on Feb 24, 2010 8:56 PM EST up reply actions  

She’s a woman.

New Orleans Saints - 2010 Super Bowl Champions. Unbelievable. Who Dat.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by Scott C. Broussard on Feb 24, 2010 10:12 PM EST up reply actions  

I'll never eat sliced ham again...

Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade

by Damon O. on Feb 24, 2010 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Gaga's definitely a woman

Seen some nude stuff of hers on another site. ME LIKEY.

certified warlord

by kenpoboy67 on Feb 25, 2010 7:54 AM EST up reply actions  

Ummm dude look at all the Olympic girls that got busted for juice, they weren’t near as big and as cut as Cyborg.

by Raycetpfl on Feb 24, 2010 10:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

For what it's worth I like chocolate and peanut butter

And I have no problem eating them together.

Mmmm…

Get rid of the ramp!

by ihateemo on Feb 24, 2010 7:50 PM EST reply actions  

The ugly girls at school always fought....

We always wondered what it’d be like if the hot chicks got into it. That’s why everyone is interested when the chicks that can rock a bikini throw down.

by JimJoe on Feb 24, 2010 8:06 PM EST reply actions  

The problem with that line of thought

is that it presupposes that someone’s desirability might have something to do with it their ability to fight. Which is an absurd presupposition.

My motto,
As I live and learn,
is:
Dig and Be Dug
In Return.

-Langston Hughes (no relation to Matt)

by loboplata on Feb 24, 2010 8:18 PM EST up reply actions  

Wrong.

It nearly implies that interest level goes up with the chicks are hot. I loved watching the ugly chicks duke it out too.

by JimJoe on Feb 24, 2010 8:40 PM EST up reply actions  

Anecdote

In middle school, I had a girlfriend who was training muay thai (she also was an amateur model), one morning she fought with an ugly girl and broke her nose with a head butt (yeah, not really pure muay thai stuff). True story.

"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."

by spectaa on Feb 24, 2010 8:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Must have been great too watch. Chick fights in school were always the most brutal.

by Slappy san on Feb 24, 2010 9:23 PM EST up reply actions  

in h.s.

my girlfriend put a chick in a rnc. it was hilarious at the time

I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.

by Loot on Feb 24, 2010 9:29 PM EST up reply actions  

LOL yea!

My wife now, and GF in HS punched out the bitch I was fooling around with the day before graduation. She nearly didn’t get to march LOL! Amore….

by JimJoe on Feb 24, 2010 9:49 PM EST up reply actions  

She should’ve punched you out.

by BillyJane on Feb 24, 2010 11:13 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

It’s all about all the men watching MMA and sports in general. Not to mention the fact that the MMA demographic consists of mostly young males (20’s and 30’s). Does objectifying female athletes sort of cheapen the image of their sport? I would say that it does to an extent. It’s up to the promoters and the women, themselves, to maintain a balance that allows female MMA to establish athletic credibility. Like it or not, sex appeal is way for women to get their collective foot in the door.

Personally, I like Reese’s peanut butter cups. The co-mingling of chocolate and peanut butter doesn’t weird me out. As long as we don’t slobber and act too fanboyish, I see no problem with photos of a bikini-clad Erin Toughill on MMA sites. In fact, I would encourage it.

by Cannon Jacques on Feb 24, 2010 8:31 PM EST reply actions  

So the female athletes pose in sexy pictures to make money and increase their exposure with the public and we’re the disrespectful people for posting them?

How about don’t take your clothes off and pose in sexy pictures and then there will be nothing for people to post?

Not a hard concept. Also it seems to be a one way street, nobody is making some sad face interview over the exploitation of Sexyama, that poor man!

by DirtyML on Feb 24, 2010 8:47 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah, but Akiyama would fight in MMA regardless.

The question is, are the only female MMA fighters who get publicity the ones who are willing to take the sexy pictures? In that respect, it not longer becomes a choice, but a requirement if you want to get a chance for the bigger fights.

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 8:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Haven’t seen Megumi Fujii or Cyborg or Tara Larosa or Rosi Sexton doing any sexually related pictures, so I can’t say I agree with that point of view.

 Sounds more like a cop out, I do agree there is the aspect of promotion to consider when it comes to an attractive athlete, but that is a universal thing in all sports.

Attractive people always have better opportunities in entertainment that has been true since cameras started rolling.

by DirtyML on Feb 24, 2010 8:57 PM EST up reply actions  

But most of those names aren’t known outside of the hardcore MMA fans. Carano’s extra work got her to be a main event.

"I love it when a guy is bleeding on top of me." -- Diego Sanchez, post fight interview about his fight with Clay Guida

by snet tim on Feb 24, 2010 11:21 PM EST up reply actions  

What led me to ask the question is that you see fighters like LaTasha Marzolla and Miesha Tate getting more attention than Kaufman, when she’s beaten Tate and Marzolla has all of two career bouts.

In almost every issue of every MMA magazine, we have these pinup pictures of females – fighters, ring girls, whatever – and they’re in there at least in part because of how they look in short shorts and an open jacket held over their breasts.

Then there is Kaufman. All she’s done is beat everyone who has ever been put in front of her and climb into the Top 5 for female fighters, yet up until a day ago, this title fight wasn’t headlining the card, and few people know who she is.

I understand why it happens, but that doesn’t mean that we should be happy about it. Promote the athletes who excel, not just the ones who are ready and willing to pose in their panties.

Canadian Bureau Chief and Staff Writer - MMA Madness - www.mmamadness.com

by E. Spencer Kyte on Feb 24, 2010 8:51 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

Thanks for your explanation.

It was a great question, and like loboplata commented on our site, Sarah answered the question truthfully without being at all judgemental.

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 8:54 PM EST up reply actions  

lmao

You make it out as though Kaufman is some kind of victim of an oppressive society. Sarah is one of my favorites, but she gets some buzz around the forums, and in news articles too. The real victim is Hashi, I haven’t seen an interview from her.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 8:57 PM EST up reply actions  

MMA Weekly did a great interview with Hashi earlier this week.

I don’t think Sarah is a victim at all, nor does she for the record.

What I do disagree with – and this is strictly from me and not here – is pushing these fighters because of their looks while talented women with better records aren’t getting the same opportunities.

Kim Couture looks good in a bikini and has a famous last name, but she’s 1-2 and was beaten badly in both losses, and still gets more coverage than Kaufman.

Canadian Bureau Chief and Staff Writer - MMA Madness - www.mmamadness.com

by E. Spencer Kyte on Feb 24, 2010 9:03 PM EST up reply actions  

Not disagreeing with you. Good looking fighter get more buzz than non good looking fighters. Unfortunately, that’s the way its always going to be. The only women I know from tennis are Maria Sharapova and Anna what’s her face. IMO, I consider Sarah very pretty and her good natured attitude adds to her looks too.

For the record, Kim may have a nice ass, but she has some serious stretch marks on her tummy. DO NOT WANT.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 9:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Seriously? Anna hasn’t even “competed” seriously in years. Sharapova was out injured for quite a while.

Do you ever go to sports sites or watch ESPN? If you did I don’t know how you’d have no idea who Serena Williams is. It was a huge clusterfrack when she threatened an official months ago.

Perhaps it true what Sherwood and Savage says, “MMA fans aren’t SPORTS fans.”

by Slappy san on Feb 24, 2010 10:26 PM EST up reply actions  

dude

I watch the NHL and NFL, but I don’t give two shits about tennis.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 10:31 PM EST up reply actions  

i hate hockey with a passion and have never watched a whole game

and thats the equivalent of me saying ovechkin and crosby? who?
sportscenter does wonders…

by zakkree on Feb 24, 2010 11:15 PM EST up reply actions  

yeah i don't give two shits about tennis either,

but the Williams sisters are kinda the face of women’s tennis.
basically serena since i think venus has fallen off.
let me guess, no one knows who annika sorenstam is either then?

by zakkree on Feb 24, 2010 11:11 PM EST up reply actions  

I’d be willing to bet he’s heard of the Williams sisters, but they didn’t quite help his “hot chick buzz” argument.

by Grappo on Feb 25, 2010 1:16 AM EST up reply actions  

Perhaps it true what Sherwood and Savage says, "MMA fans aren’t SPORTS fans."

Some are, some aren’t. I’m pretty much not. I don’t watch SportsCenter, and don’t follow any sport other than MMA. I don’t even care to watch boxing anymore unless it’s a major fight.

by Grappo on Feb 25, 2010 1:15 AM EST up reply actions  

Ditto.

MMA is it for me, pretty much.

certified warlord

by kenpoboy67 on Feb 25, 2010 7:48 AM EST up reply actions  

Kaufman has had how many televised fights? 2?

That might also have something to do with it. She was not that highly ranked until after she beat Tate either.

And I like her she is a local fighter, one of the only pro locals.

by DirtyML on Feb 24, 2010 9:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed that she’s only been coming on of late, but after beating Tate, she looked great against Shayna Baszler and jumped into many people’s Top 10 lists…

And yes – you gotta support the local products. Bring that belt back to Victoria!

Canadian Bureau Chief and Staff Writer - MMA Madness - www.mmamadness.com

by E. Spencer Kyte on Feb 24, 2010 9:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Female MMA being in a national spotlight is so young right now. A female fighter who is attractive and can fight will most likely get pushed up faster than someone with equal skill but not as attractive. Kim Couture has that last name and is attractive to some, but she is not a good fighter, and therefore will only get so far in MMA. We really have to see how female MMA in North America pans out because there may have some female or females out there besides Cyborg that destroys her competition, but isn’t extremely attractive.

by chrisbboy82 on Feb 24, 2010 8:57 PM EST reply actions  

An interesting point to add to your comment is, if promotions are only pushing pretty, but not as talented fighters, is female mma every going to go anywhere?

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 9:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Its always gonna be at a disadvantage. Girls don’t like getting hit in the face as much as guys do. So the talent pool is smaller. So there is less completion for the elite girls. Hell it took men’s mma 15 years to really take off. Who knows how long for girls. Another 5 or 10 ?

by Raycetpfl on Feb 24, 2010 10:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Not sure it will ever take off.

Current women’s sports rarely get as much press as men’s sports, and those don’t involve watching ladies taking punches to the face. I really don’t think most people wnat to see that.

by Donna on Feb 24, 2010 11:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Let’s look at female MMA right now and see the trends. Female fighters, just like male fighters, still have to win fights to get to the champion or move up the ladder. Coenen and Toughill are both attractive females, but they are also quality female fighters as well. I feel that Female MMA will go somewhere just for the fact that it is an avenue for female athletes to make money, but it is a slow build. There are only so many avenues for female athletes to make money and do something competitive, so I can see females going towards MMA. Go to any MMA gym/academy/school, and you will find females there, so the interest is there right now. I can’t see it as a stand-alone product, but having that one or two Female MMA fights on a card seems to be becoming normal especially on Strikeforce cards. One reason that I don’t want to see Strikeforce going under is just the fact that they have a good Female MMA Division.

by chrisbboy82 on Feb 25, 2010 12:32 AM EST up reply actions  

I suppose the “elephant in the room” here is that because female MMA is typically viewed as less skilled than “regular” MMA, then no, a female fighter cannot make it on skill alone. I think there’s a small bit of truth to that (keep in mind this is different from saying that these woman are not skilled, which is obviously bullshit). Similar to the WNBA, would anyone argue that the athletes there are as skilled as anyone in the NBA? Of course not. Disregarding the physical differences that men tend to be bigger, faster, and stronger, there’s also the obvious problem with female MMA which is that the talent pool is so incredibly shallow. Observers feel like they’re watching an inferior product because generally, they ARE.

MMA is a bit different because unlike other professional female sports, the women aren’t trying to catch up with decades of sports competition. Hell, Marloes Coenan throws a better right hand and with better technique than Nate Quarry and Shinya Aoki combined. That this isn’t an exaggeration says a lot of about the sport of MMA in general.

For women in particular, there’s also the general stigma of being defined by looks. Men have a rich history of being appreciated as writers, moneymakers, artists, scientists, athletes, and a gamut of social roles in general. Women don’t have a comparable history within these roles, so for women to be appreciated by anything other than how they look will always be an uphill battle regardless.

Oddly enough, call me crazy, but Kaufman’s kind of cute.

by David Castillo on Feb 24, 2010 9:50 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

The skill is the same, it’s the athleticism that’s vastly different.

You hit it, people like watching men compete because they are BiggerStrongerFaster, not because they think women shouldn’t be doing it. It’s just less exciting…

by BillyJane on Feb 24, 2010 11:20 PM EST up reply actions  

But with MMA there ARE plenty of folk who simply think that women shouldn’t be doing it.

"I love it when a guy is bleeding on top of me." -- Diego Sanchez, post fight interview about his fight with Clay Guida

by snet tim on Feb 24, 2010 11:36 PM EST up reply actions  

There are probably more folk who think no one should do MMA.

by BillyJane on Feb 25, 2010 1:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Fair enough.

But I meant, and should have clarified, that within the MMA community there are folk who think women shouldn’t do it.

"I love it when a guy is bleeding on top of me." -- Diego Sanchez, post fight interview about his fight with Clay Guida

by snet tim on Feb 25, 2010 2:05 AM EST up reply actions  

The skill isn’t the same in part because they’re drawing from a much smaller pool of fighters.

Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Feb 25, 2010 4:33 AM EST up reply actions  

This is true. Most women fighters can’t find appropriate sparring partners on a consistent basis, have trouble finding different opponents who are still in the right weight class (and thus end up fighting the same people over and over or not fighting at all), and cannot even get fights booked. Kaufman is an example of the latter; she’s never taken serious injury, and loves to fight, but went over a year between her fights with Molly Helsel and Sarah Schneider, then fought three times in three months. But it’s kind of a catch-22: there aren’t more female pros, so the skill level and matchmaking are affected, so there are not a lot of promotions willing to book them, so some women are deterred from training seriously/going pro, which reinforces a lack of pros…

"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."

by AJB on Feb 25, 2010 5:42 AM EST up reply actions  

It needs both skill and good looks

Gina and Erin have both. If they aren’t skilled, people wouldn’t take them seriously.

by MMAGuard on Feb 24, 2010 9:53 PM EST reply actions  

If their looks outweigh their talent and skill, whats the issue?

"Like a ballet of violence clothed in fine Brazilian silk." ~ MMASuPreMaCy

by Benicio on Feb 24, 2010 10:20 PM EST reply actions  

It’s unfair for them to be pretty, charismatic and confident. Or something. I’m not exactly sure myself.

by BillyJane on Feb 24, 2010 11:21 PM EST up reply actions  

For me, the fact that “the pretty girls” with solid skills get more attention than the “highly skilled girls” who aren’t as qoute-unquote attractive is the issue. Being both will get you that exposure even faster, but since this is a sport, shouldn’t your talents trump your ta-tas?

What is worse is that even the most skilled female on the planet is realizing that being skilled and deadly isn’t going to be enough – Cyborg is working hard at showcasing her feminine side and that gets her as much attention as smashing people in the cage.

There is no problem being pretty, charismatic and confident. Those are all tremendous qualities ands things you’d want in any fighter. But being pretty can’t get you more attention than being talented…

LaTasha Marzolla hasn’t earned more attention than Sarah Kaufman… but her Playboy background puts her higher up on the recognition scale, and that seems ridiculous to me.

Canadian Bureau Chief and Staff Writer - MMA Madness - www.mmamadness.com

by E. Spencer Kyte on Feb 25, 2010 12:04 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I have to say, you pretty much summed up how I feel. I mean, I completely understand WHY Marzolla et al get more more exposure, and I understand WHY, from a business perspective, that any promotion would jump on that kind of free exposure and publicity… But that doesn’t mean I have to like it and that I do hope that, as the women’s side of the sport grows, it will outgrow this situation.

"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."

by AJB on Feb 25, 2010 12:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Exactly – everyone knows why it happens and that the double standard exists, but it’s a crappy double standard and one that will hopefully lessen as women’s MMA continues to improve and grow.

It’s like the Herschel Walker situation – I know why he was on the main card, but it didn’t stop me from thinking it was garbage that Jay Hieron and Joe Riggs got bumped…

In the long run, organizations are shooting themselves in the foot (IMO) pushing the highly-marketable, but less talented options. The figthers who have a greater long-term future are the key to long-term success, like Hieron and Kaufman as opposed to Walker and Marzolla, for instance…

But the quick buck is hard to pass up…

Canadian Bureau Chief and Staff Writer - MMA Madness - www.mmamadness.com

by E. Spencer Kyte on Feb 25, 2010 1:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Dude

Cheesecake is my favorite dessert. Cheesecake Factory is my favorite restaurant. I…..need help. Or dessert.

certified warlord

by kenpoboy67 on Feb 25, 2010 7:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Hot girls will always get me interested in anything they do. And as far as Cyborg goes I would like to see her fight men.

by darkside3744 on Feb 24, 2010 11:38 PM EST reply actions  

Eh, GSP is considered more marketable because he’s a good looking guy.

On the other hand, I remember one of the press releases for Miami referred to Marloes Coenen as “the strikingly attractive marloes coenen”. THat I wonder if that’s a little iffy.

by TLow on Feb 24, 2010 11:50 PM EST reply actions  

Wand would never make a hot 100 fighters list? But he’s so pretty now!

by rabrown on Feb 25, 2010 7:19 AM EST reply actions  

Almost 100 comments in, and you show up to say that…?

"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."

by AJB on Feb 25, 2010 9:45 AM EST up reply actions  

Stupid

Just stupid

Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade

by Damon O. on Feb 25, 2010 10:58 AM EST up reply actions  

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