UFC 109 Preview: Making the Case for Mark Coleman's Legacy
by Nate Wilcox on Feb 2, 2010 1:00 PM EST
in MMA News
Email
Print
Jonathan Snowden is one of the few MMA writers with the necessary historical perspective to really understand the meaning of Mark Coleman for MMA and his lasting impact on the sport's rule set. He writes this for the UGO:
It takes a special athlete to make an entire sport stand up, take notice, and then change the rules of the game to slow him down. In 1966, Lew Alcindor led his UCLA Bruins to an undefeated season and a NCAA basketball championship. In 1967 the NCAA banned the slam dunk to try to make things a little more fair for other teams. In 1968, St. Louis Cardinals pitcher Bob Gibson had a season for the ages, compiling an earned run average of just 1.12. When the smoke cleared from Gibson's blistering fastball, Major League Baseball lowered the pitcher's mound from 15 to 10 inches. The list of these incomparable athletes that changed their whole sport is short - but when history is written, we might just have to add UFC Hall of Famer Mark Coleman's name to the annals.
...
In October of 1997, after watching Coleman beat the crap out of seven opponents (and feeling political pressure from John McCain and others who called the new sport "human cockfighting") the UFC banned the headbutt, a rule change that seemed targeted towards Coleman and Coleman alone. I talked to the UFC 109 Main Eventer, still fighting at 45 years of age, about his legacy and those dominant days when he controlled the sport.
Snowden also gets Coleman to talk about what he thinks are his career highlights at Heavy.com:
Heavy.com: When you look back, was winning the UFC title the highlight of your career, or was it winning the Pride Grand Prix?
Mark Coleman: UFC 10, 11, and 12, they all combine together. They were all about the same high. The Grand Prix, it was very special. Because I had been left for dead by just about everybody in the whole world. Done, finished, career over. I knew I was going to come back. But to be able to do it, and silence the critics a little bit, that was special.
Read the whole interview, there's a lot of interesting discussion of Randy Couture, their differing wrestling styles (freestyle vs Greco-Roman), different career paths, etc.
Also be sure and read up on Mark Coleman in my MMA History series. Two parts feature him especially:
I haven't yet gotten to the PRIDE 2000 Open Weight Grand Prix that Coleman won. I promise to finish that this spring.
44 comments
|
2 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Ground and Pound
Coleman invented it.
Nuff said.
by Razreshat on Feb 2, 2010 1:06 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Agreed
Champions aren't made in gyms. Champions are made from something they have deep inside them -- a desire, a dream, a vision. They have to have last-minute stamina, they have to be a little faster, they have to have the skill and the will. But the will must be stronger than the skill.
-Muhammed Ali
Nate
That Grad Prix is so amazing, I can’t wait until you see it. I recently got the special box the released (they had them at Fryes, believe it or not) and it was such a cool buy. Granted to much of it was written in Japanese so I can’t read it… but that’s cool anyway.
Coleman means so much more to this sport than he gets credit for. Whenever people leave him off the “Mount Rushmore” argument it blows my mind.
The Mount Rushmore (4 faces) needs: Royce Gracie, Mark Coleman, Tito Ortiz, Dana White…to me those 4 people did more for the sport than any other.
Royce – Showed that the ground is an actual important facet of fighting when traditional martial arts ignored this (at least in western culture)
Mark – Ground n Pound, but also showed that strong wrestling will neutralize BJJ. His run through those tournaments is epic.
Tito – He’s the one who kept MMA alive in the US. His marketability showed that when you combine the pro wrestling theatrics and real life athleticism, you can become a huge draw.
Dana – In my opinion, he’s done more for the sport than any individual. Yes he has his moments where you face palm cause he risks pushing it back years, but without him, the Fertitas don’t buy the UFC and MMA in the US dies.
twitter.com/thisredengine
Oh and I kept the Mount Rushmore of MMA strictly UFC cause Mount Rushmore is in America. Japanese MMA can build some temples or something.
USA! USA! USA! USA!
twitter.com/thisredengine
I remember when Mark came onto the scene and he was so scary. Granted I was a pretty young guy at the time, so I was pretty much easier to intimidate by a Goliath like that, but I couldn’t fathom someone ever beating him.
Seriously I just left thinking, “That’s what MMA is going to be, the best wrestler will just take a guy down and pound the ever loving shit out of him”
My 4, incidentally are
Royce
Mark
Saku
and a guy I end up switching alot (Wand, Igor, Chuck, etc.)
Nate has seen it he just means he hasn’t written it up for the history series
Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
MMA Editor - SBNation.com
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 2, 2010 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
/\ this
seen it many many times, just have hit a snag in the series — hard to find the images and video i need to really tell some key stories. the dark ages sucked!
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
I think that Coleman, and all wrestlers really, were kneecapped by the changing ruleset. The best weapons for a wrestler were:
A. In a guy’s guard, an aggressive top game that included liberal use of headbutts.
B. When you repositioned to side control or the 69, or when you blocked a shot, the knees to the head.
Losing these weapons made it possible for everyone else to compete with a Coleman or a Hughes.
by Jonathan Snowden on Feb 2, 2010 1:52 PM EST reply actions
I still agree with the headbutt rules, especially given what we know retrospectively about head trauma, as well as the risks for bad cuts (to both fighters) that end fights. But I’m still a big advocate of knees to downed opponents.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Feb 3, 2010 7:21 AM EST up reply actions
I also agree with the head butt rule and would like to see knees to grounded opponents, I don’t like elbows though. Elbows cause cuts which end fights, I don’t want to see a fight ended because a guy got cut from a glancing blow, I want to see a fight ended by KO, sub or go the distance.
"For some reason Dana White doesn't like me, and I don't care enough to find out why. So he can go pound sand up his ass as far as I'm concerned."
Don Frye
by keyboardwarrior on Feb 3, 2010 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
I see elbows as a necessary evil because they make it much much harder for the fighter on the bottom to stall and the way that ground and pound has evolved (with elbows) does, I think, increase the number of ways that a fighter can finish.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Feb 3, 2010 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
Adaptation...
MMA is about adaptation, unlike any other sport. Coleman never tried to change his style and just turned into a huge dick. (Acting out when losing to Fedor, Breaking shogun’s arm, ect.)
Sorry, But I don’t care about coleman.
I hope you aren’t implying that Coleman broke Shoguns arm and are just talking about the melee that ensued
"For some reason Dana White doesn't like me, and I don't care enough to find out why. So he can go pound sand up his ass as far as I'm concerned."
Don Frye
by keyboardwarrior on Feb 2, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions
The Fedor incident where he introduced him to his daughters and called him a very nice man and the best fighter in the world? Or maybe the incident where he hugged him in the ring, raised his hand in victory and then congratulated him again backstage on a great fight?
The Chute Boxe incident is completely overblown, he apologized backstage for his actions and they have since made up (if you search around you can see pictures of him and Shogun smiling at a party after their last fight in the UFC). Coleman even went up to Shogun before the Machida fight and wished him the best of luck.
Yeah I am a huge Chute Box fan and I think the whole situation got out of hand, adrenaline rushed and everyone was at fault.
"For some reason Dana White doesn't like me, and I don't care enough to find out why. So he can go pound sand up his ass as far as I'm concerned."
Don Frye
by keyboardwarrior on Feb 2, 2010 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
This
There is no reasonable way you can solely hold Coleman and Hammer House accountable for what went down that night. Everyone was clearly at fault.
who asked for the fight?
In the countdown, Dana tells this nice story on how the fight was booked. Coleman called and asked for it. Then Dana calls Randy who says “sure” and then Dana calls back Coleman to confirm it. I thought it was nice how with these hall of famers who Dana knows and trusts, the fight was booked in 10 minutes.
But in the interview, Mark first said the fans asked for the fights (which could be along the same line than Dana’s story).
What doesn’t get along Dana’s story is when Mark said “I was totally caught off guard by the offer to fight Couture, but like I said, I’m sure glad they did offer it to me”.
Either way, I hope we get to see something like Couture-Nogueira.
Honestly, I’m pretty excited for this fight. Cause I don’t want to see Coleman or Couture in with the young guns. Fights like this are like the Chuck/Wand and Nog/Randy fight. Should have happened long ago, but still a treat to see.
twitter.com/thisredengine
There’s just something about a great fighter “getting up” to face another great fighter. It can happen with the grizzled vets (Randy/Nog) and the young guns (Machida/Shogun). I hope this one plays out the way.
BTW.. sent your shit. Look for any @princeton.edu emails my man
We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.
There is some truth to Dana’s story. Mark’s manager, Mike DiSabato started calling the UFC for this fight when Randy first beat Tim Sylvia in 2007. I don’t think Mark personally asked for this fight.
by Jonathan Snowden on Feb 2, 2010 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
Coleman gets one last main event fight. I'm cool with it.
The rest of the card is actually solid. I’m watching.
UFC 110 is the card i’m dying to see but this will do until then.
by snakecharmer1340 on Feb 2, 2010 3:15 PM EST reply actions
I doubt they’ll change the rules anytime soon but I think it would be cool to bring back headbutts and kicks to the head when both fighters are down. I’m sure you can adjust your clinch and grappling to avoid most headbutts.
What’s the deal with pressure points? I don’t see anything against them in the rules. Can you really hurt or slow someone with pressure points. Kinda like the liver shot but to other, more precise areas.
I think pressure points are overrated
They work great in demos, but I’ve seen them fail when you add the adrenaline that comes from being in an actual fight
In addition to worries about the brain damage you probably accumulate from repeatedly smashing heads with another person and the the whole “human cock fighting” arguments, your head is a broader, flatter surface that your elbow. It’s like whacking somebody in the face with a 2×4. While we’ve seen elbows open cuts, they don’t come close to the kind of damage you can do with a headbutt.
Plus headbutts are easier to pull off in the guard than a strong shot with the elbow. They could be controlling both of your arms and have you full guard and you could still shatter their nose without much effort. At least with the elbow you have to work for it.
by ricker2005 on Feb 2, 2010 3:51 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
yeah
I used to seriously worry that Coleman was going to drive someone’s nose up into their frontal lobe with those headbutts.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Or shatter their orbital with very little effort. I’ve used headbutts in fights at school/bars and they do a ton of damage and don’t leave a lot of room for doctor stoppages before the damage accumulates.
twitter.com/thisredengine
you guys are starting to convince me that headbutts are evil, but they sure looked good in the UFC early days.
A headbutt sure helped Dexter get Doaks suspended from the force.
We're just a million little gods causin' rain storms, turning every good thing to rust.
I love that this quote gives me the mental image of you headbutting some guy at a bar a bunch of times before a doctor steps in to stop the fight (and presumably buy the next round).
Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.
by Day Man on Feb 2, 2010 4:58 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
After Royce Gracie, Coleman was my favorite MMA fighter. I still remember the excitement anticipating Severn vs Coleman back in the days. I was devastated when he lost to Maurice Smith.
With all that said, after the Couture fight (win or loss), I want him to retire. It is just time.
I am. I think. I will. - Ayn Rand
With a win over Couture he gets another main event fight. I just can’t see him walking away from that. The winner of this fight seems ready-made to take on Cain if he beats Big Nog (a big if) and I could also see Nog-Coleman. With as close together as the fights take place the only outcome that wouldn’t really make sense would be Couture-Nog 2.
Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.
You’re totally right. I’m an idiot.
Giving Shogun his props. I had the fight 48-47 Machida but Shogun put up a monumental performance and I am honored to have seen it in person.
off topic
but are you the fighter of the night man?
"For some reason Dana White doesn't like me, and I don't care enough to find out why. So he can go pound sand up his ass as far as I'm concerned."
Don Frye
by keyboardwarrior on Feb 3, 2010 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
Coleman’s run through the GP is highlighted in The Smashing Machine, contrasting Kerr’s fall from grace.
The falling-off-the-ropes has been edited out, though. Sure, it wouldn’t fit with the tone of the film, but it’s damn funny.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by Scott C. Broussard on Feb 2, 2010 7:29 PM EST reply actions
Just to be nitpicky, MLB didn’t change the rules because of Gibson. League scoring (in the NL) fell to 3.43 runs/game. That was the lowest total since 1908.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bloody Elbow
Related FanShots on Bloody Elbow
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
MMA Rankings
