Wolf in Sheep's Clothing: Nate Marquardt Will Do What It Takes to Get UFC Gold
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 8:48 PM EST
in UFC Editorial
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The first thing you notice about Nate Marquardt when you meet him is his smile. It's infectious. He seems to enjoy life, the kind of joy that's hard not to be inspired by. Soft spoken, funny, quick with a laugh, Nate could be a youth counselor at your church or the best player on your Thursday night softball squad. Instead, he's a cage fighter. A first look captures the smile. It's a second look that is the dead give away. As we noted in The MMA Encyclopedia, it's only then you notice the tools of his trade:
The middle knuckle on both hands is swollen all the time. On his left hand, one of the knuckles is missing, pushed up into his hand courtesy of a long-ago bare-knuckle fight early in his career. Make no mistake: Marquardt is a great guy, a religious family man from Colorado. But he can and will throw down with the best of them.
Marquardt has the reputation, because of this easy going attitude, of being one of the sport's nice guys. But if opponents mistake that kindness for weakness, they'll be in for a long night. Marquardt is a vicious competitor, not just an aggressive fighter, but one that is constantly walking the thin line between right and wrong.
Trouble seems to follow Marquardt, across promotions and even across continents. Every conceivable manner of foul play has Marquardt's name stamped all over it. There was the incident when he attacked Ricardo Almeida after the bell in a Pancrase bout. Against Ivan Salaverry he tested positive for steroids. And then there was the Thales Leites bout.
At UFC 85, Marquardt broke nearly every regulation in the book, landing an illegal knee, illegal elbows, and a piledriver that skirted the line. Poor Leites could do little but hold on for the ride, eventually winning a decision when Marquardt was penalized for his foul play.
Accusations of greasing followed his recent win over Rousimar Palhares, a leglock expert who claimed Marquardt was greasing when he slipped out of an ankle lock in the first round. As Palhares turned to complain to the referee, Marquardt unleashed with devastating ground and pound. After the fight, Palhares joined a group of detractors that includes BJ Penn, by accusing Team Jackson of greasing. Marquardt and Jackson denied the claims, and Palhares later retracted his accusations, but there's no doubt the controversy affected the fight. When some might have paused to let the official sort things out, Marquardt went on the attack:
"It's kind of disappointing to have to try and defend yourself over something like that. I'm not a dirty fighter, and I don't cheat. I don't grease."
"I didn't really know what he was doing, but I saw his hand was kind of pointing toward the ref or something. He took his eyes off me. Once he took his eyes off me, that's when I jumped in... I guess I was surprised, but at the same time, I was watching him the whole time for an opening. That was it... I was very excited for the win, but that kind of took a little bit of it out of it for me."
For Marquardt, the ends justify the means - in the case the ends being a title rematch with champion Anderson Silva. Marquardt has visualized a method of beating Silva, one he won't share but feels increasingly confident in. Now Yushin Okami is standing in the way of that opportunity. On Saturday the Team Quest fighter better be ready for whatever Marquardt throws at him - whether it is within the rules or not. Don't be fooled by the smile Yushin- a stone cold killer lurks behind it.
Nate Marquardt vs. Ricardo Almeida after the jump
Almeida vs Marquardt (via UVray2)
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Nice read
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 12:05 PM EST reply actions
Good article.
It is hard to reconcile the guy’s demeanor with his behaviour. I think the greasing was bogus, and knees and elbows are accidents that can happen, but steroids?
"I'd love to be a Cheick Kongo looking brother that could actually move and do a lot of funky stuff - Jiu Jitsu, takedowns, kicks and stuff." - Jon Jones.
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The greasing thing is total shit. The ref checked him, the SAC officials checked him, RP’s corner said he was not greased…and RP said, afterwards, Nate was not greased.
To not include that here is poor journalism.
This is fantasy. I have never seen a SAC check a fighters legs before a fight on their way to the cage, at most a cursory look. Who knows exactly what happened after the fight. The commission only checked the leg then after Dean had performed his “test.”
Anything Palhares and team said after the fight was a job saving desperation move. Hardly dispositive.
I don’t know if he was greasing or not. I just mentioned the accusation.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
So we should ignore what EVERYONE said afterwards? What does Herb Dean know? He has only been doing this for years. And the SAC folk? Bah, they are fools. Herb’s “test” would have removed it grease (and not left any on the paper towel Herb used) and prevented the official from finding any.
And then there are the words of RP’s manager:
“But I looked at Nate’s legs myself. The commission checked them out, too. There was certainly no grease there. It was our error, and we owe Nate an apology, as well as Greg Jackson and the rest of his coaches and team.”
According to all involved, Nate was cleared of any wrong-doing. It certainly appears that you have a position and opt to ignore those involved.
Not at all. There were allegations of greasing and it affected the fight. That’s all I wrote.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
but
its pretty biased to write that, but leave out the fact that he was cleared
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
He wasn’t “cleared” in any meaningful way.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
What more do you need than the ringside official (Herb Dean) checking the accused on the spot and not finding anything out of the ordinary? Do yu require a lab-test for traces of grease? Palhares retracted his statement right afterwards. Marquard gestured to him to “inspect” his leg on the spot as well. If Marquard has not been cleared, then I don’t know what you would deem necessary for that. It’s even close to a stretch to write “After the fight, Palhares joined a group of detractors” because Palhares only complained right on the spot and retracted right AFTER the fight. Yeah, technically his complaint was after the fight was stopped and it stood for maybe a couple of hours, but that sentence sounds like he stood by it even after some time for consideration. He did not. He accused Marquart in the heat of the moment (and in a foolish manner) and as soon as he got his wits back about him he conceded Marquart did not grease.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Nor
was he found guilty in any significant way. Being “insignificantly” cleared is just as big a part of this story as him being “insignificantly” accused.
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
It’s part of a series of actions that show a fighter willing to do whatever it takes. The article is not about the Palhares fight specifically. There are links in the story that take readers to more information.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
Gloss over it as you will, but it is what it is to us the readers.
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 8, 2010 3:19 PM EST up reply actions
“Us the readers.”
There’s a diversity of opinion in this thread. You speak only for yourself, or maybe for the other account you have registered too? Either way, you aren’t the readership ombudsman.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
The other account having been inactive for how long? Oh that’s right, since before I made this one from a inability to access the other one for some reason. This sort of response doesn’t surprise me in the least though. Attack the person and ignore what is said…
As for “us the readers”, I meant that you left the comment in question completely up to the individual reader to read what they will. You purposefully did not give all of the facts in a attempt to further your article and in doing so you leave it to the less informed to assume that Nate cheated. You’re a better writer than that but you simply like to push buttons even if you won’t admit to it.
Instead of just editting your article to clarify, you’ll spend your time here being snide to your readers. Anything other than just admitting that perhaps you should have worded the article differently.
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 8, 2010 3:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Clarify what? There are links in the story to more information. I’m not going to “clarify” it by suggesting Marquardt wasn’t guilty. I don’t know that to be true.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
Innocent until proven guilty, how about that? Especially as a journalist you should know better than to insinuate guilt and then leave it up to the reader to follow your links to make an informed decision on whether what to believe. This is not a scientific text where people could be expected to read footnotes or references.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Fine. So, without following the link, the reader will know that there were allegations of cheating, allegations that directly affected the result of the fight. I’m comfortable with that.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
You shouldn’t be. You have portraied Marquard as a possible cheater in this fight whith much addded gravitas by the other examples of foul-play you listed. This in spite of all the evidence except for Palhares INITIAL reaction pointing to Marquart being innocent. You wanted another example to make your point and you took it by force.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
What would you change?
Accusations of greasing followed his recent win over Rousimar Palhares, a leglock expert who claimed Marquardt was greasing when he slipped out of an ankle lock in the first round. As Palhares turned to complain to the referee, Marquardt unleashed with devastating ground and pound. After the fight, Palhares joined a group of detractors that includes BJ Penn, by accusing Team Jackson of greasing. Marquardt and Jackson denied the claims, and Palhares later retracted his accusations, but there’s no doubt the controversy affected the fight:
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
How about…you work with what is given to you and make your point with that. Just as an example: Accusations of greasing followed immediately after his recent win over Rousimar Palhares, a leglock expert who claimed Marquardt was greasing when he slipped out of an ankle lock in the first round. The allegations however were most likely unfounded in this case as ring officials checked Marquart on site only minutes after the bell and found no evidence of greasing. Palhares however was so convinced of Marquarts foul play that, in a grotesque lap of judgement, he started complaining to referee Herb Dean during the fight, diverting his attention from Marquart. His opponent didn’t hesitate for one second and pounced on his defenseless opponent. Although Marquart very likely did not cheat in this instance it can be seen as evidence pertaining to two things: 1. a reputation preceeeds Marquart that may have caused Palhares to be utterly convinced his opponent was using illegal measures when he escaped his hold, even when he was not. 2. Marquart may be a good sport but he will not give you a pass for anything. Another fighter may have spared Palhares who obviously was irrationally thinking that the fight had to be paused. Another fighter may not have wanted to win by exploiting such a lapse in judgement instead wanting to claim a “legitimate” win against a game opponent defending himself to the best of his ability. Nate Marquart just wanted to win. And he did.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
by KGNLuc on Nov 8, 2010 5:52 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I actually
think his point may have been stronger if he would have referred to how Marquardt recognized that Palhares was doing something odd and not defending himself, but chose to strike anyway. Other fighters may have given Palhares time to get his head right, or complaint heard. But not Marquardt, or Trigg for that matter.
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
Nah
That was Palhares’ fault 100% for getting KO’d. Protect yourself at all times isn’t a cliche, its the first rule of combat sports.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
Yea,
he should of kept his cool, stay covered up, and waited for the round to end. Notify the ref when someone isn’t trying to punch you in the face.
For real. Wait till the round is over.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
You realize this is an editorial?
And this is Snowden’s opinion, right?
Just write your own fanpost showing your point of view. You can start with copy and pasting your post right here. It would make for some good discussion.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:28 PM EST up reply actions
“It’s an opinion” is not an excuse for a misleading presentation of pretty clear cut facts by omission. What I wrote here was to illustrate that a point in line with Snowdens argument can be made without resorting to this.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
There’s nothing omitted or misleading. The facts are presented in an accurate way, additional facts provided by a single click.
I mentioned the accusation, the retraction, and Marquardt’s belief that the accusation allowed him time to whack Palhares. Not sure what else could have made you feel any better. This is not really a valuable conversation anymore.
You didn’t care for the post: noted.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 8:18 PM EST up reply actions
You’re like the TV-Producer who puts someone in a chair in a dark room, puts a red background light on, lights the subject from slightly below his chin and then says: “I don’t know why you accuse me of deliberately making the man look shady. I quoted him in full and the voiceover accurately described the happenings!”. Putting the Palhares incident to which there is no proof whatsoever except for Palhares initial reaction in line with other, much more clear cut cases and by being vague about the timeline it makes it sound like a far more serious matter than it was. If you can not see that, than this really is a conversation withot value but for different reasons than what you think.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
He can see it, he just won’t ever openly admit to it.
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 9, 2010 12:26 PM EST up reply actions
"It’s an opinion" is not an excuse for a misleading presentation of pretty clear cut facts by omission.
Snowden has said repeatedly he doesn’t think that what was used by the ref or the AC conclusively proves Marquardt didn’t grease.
Snowden also has stated why he thinks the retraction from Palhares’ and his camp does not have as much merit as the accusation.
So the “facts” you have as your evidence are in contention. You think what the AC did was adequate to show Marquadt didn’t grease. You think that the retraction was motivated by nothing other than Palhares and his camp coming to their senses.
This is why this is an editorial, and why I suggested you write one to promote and explain your point of view.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 8:24 PM EST up reply actions
But Snowden has offered no explanation as to WHY he does believe Herb Deans test to be inconclusive. A mere “I don’T buy that!”-statement is absolutely not enough. Not enough for a man of his position who has proven access to the fight world and should have done an interview with Dean or somebody “in the know” about this to investigate his doubts. And it is especially not enough in an article that is attacking the reputation of a fighter. Nate Marquart deserves the courtesy that there is more to Snowdens claim than "I “think” he’s dirty, ya know, and therefore that Palhares thing…bit too convenient, right, Marquart?", “Well Mr. Snowden, since I am innocent I find it decidedly inconvenient that the test was not made to your fullest satisfaction”. ;)
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
This is getting ludicrous. I didn’t say he was “dirty.” I said there were allegations that were later retracted. I said that the incident affected the outcome of the fight. It’s written down in the article above. You can reference it. In fact, next time you have something to say about one of our writer’s ethics, you better reference what is written very carefully. This is out of hand.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 9, 2010 9:10 AM EST up reply actions
The BJ Penn remark is a little bit of a non sequitur. I also think your point would’ve been stronger if you had focused on the fact that he attacked while Palhares was trying to complain to the ref instead of the accusations of greasing which were cleared in as meaningful a way as they could’ve been, and retracted by Palhares and his management.
I also find it ironic that in a piece where you describe Marquardt as a guy for whom the ends justify the means you’re willing to spin the story so heavily to support your argument. I feel like there’s plenty to your statements without trying to mischaracterize that fight.
Don’t you think that it would be more accurate to state that it was during the match, since after the match Palhares’ team, including Palhares himself acknowledged that there was no damned grease on his leg? BJ Penn complained about it for months afterwards.
Your defense is so fallible it’s hard to believe.
Then
while you’re speculating about his actions that may or may not have taken place, you could include something that suggests it is equally possible it didn’t happen.
Didn’t intend to make this solely about the Palhares incident, as there are other examples that illustrate your point. However, in this particular example that you chose to include, you show a bias toward him being a guilty party. The only problem I have is, unlike the steroids and late hit examples, there’s no evidence either way and you fail recognize that.
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
by Chris Hall on Nov 8, 2010 3:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
A professional MMA fighter’s reaction in the cage was pretty telling. I don’t recall seeing anything like that before.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
cool story bro
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
I'm inclined to agree with your critics
Where I understand the point of your article, it puzzled me when I initially read as to why you left out that he was basically cleared of the accusations. I don’t know how “official” you need it to be. He was cleared by multiple officials and also the fighter himself along with his coaches…
Your argument is not sound, sir.
The “clearing” was not what one would call scientifically vigorous, and the fighter and his came may have had economic motives for dropping the complaint.
Snowden’s not allowed to have an opinion?
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
Surely you can see the difference between having an opinion
…and trivializing the only facts in the case because they happen not to support your opinion.
Well put
Snowden writes some great historical pieces when he leaves all of the relevant facts on the table for all to see. It’s some of the best stuff out there in fact. When it comes to opinion pieces and analysis though, often times his write-ups ignore pertinent facts just to try to push a specific angle and rhetoric. When compared side-by-side with his historical pieces, the thoroughness and candor seen on one side vs. the blatant bias and shoddy reporting on the other is glaring. Either he’s someone who goes to no ends when he has an agenda, or he likes pushing buttons to bait for comments. I don’t know which it is, but either way, it drives traffic.
Holy crap are you serious? And you can prove that Palheres was just saving his job how? A released statement? Palheres’ clearing of Marquardt was dispositive to the 11th degree. Compare him to BJ??? Good lord what planet are you on? Herb Dean, who cleared Nate is one of the most experienced refs out there.
I mean, how can you be so damned delusional in your own bias? Is it a desire to get a ton of attention under your posts? I have news for you, your style and knowledge is good enough to attract attention and be a value to BE on it’s own. You don’t have to write the bias attention getting shit you do on fighters like Nate or Brock to attract attention. It may get a lot of comments in the short term, but in the long term it’s poison. I guarantee it.
Why do you talk about poor journalism?
Mr. Snowden is not a journalist. He’s a writer. His writing might have a base in reality but his goal clearly isn’t to portray any kind of truth. His sole goal is to get attention and ignite discussion. At least that’s how I take it and why I appreciate his articles.
A journalist who wants to stay even remotely close to handling facts in a responsible manner would obviously have to mention that there was no evidence at all of Marquardt doing anything illegal but that in fact everyone involved from the referee to the commission to the opposing camp publicly recognized immediately after the fight that everything was on the up and up. If I yelled “Barack Obama is a gay white man” out of the window and such a journalist would report on it, he would probably have to mention that I’m either insane or drunk, now wouldn’t he? The same applies here. Someone claming something obviously untrue can be reported on and his claims repeated, but that’s not journalism. Journalism would have to make it clear that the obviously untrue claims are, in fact, obviously untrue.
But then again, Mr. Snowden is not trying to be a journalist. Or is he?
The evidence of Marquardt doing something wrong was in the reactions of Palhares. It was pretty telling. Any physical evidence was long gone (if it existed), washed away in sweat, on Palhares himself, or removed by Herb Dean. The fact that it wasn’t discovered postfight isn’t a sign it never existed. Just that it wasn’t present at the moment.
No one is hiding anything about this situation. It was presented as an allegation. Links were provided in the story to more information.
This was clearly labeled as an editorial. It was not a historical account of Marquardt-Palhares and didn’t include the postfight manuevering by the officials and the Palhares camp. That’s a different story.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
This baffles me. The ref checks immediately. The AC checks. The other corner checks. Nate says check right now there is nothing there. All this adds up to the allegation that Nate is dirty so I will call him dirty.
Wow. You really don’t get it do you? Use actual evidence like the roids, like the point deductions, those are proven, but to latch on to a nebulous thing like Paulharris having a major brain cramp as evidence that is really grasping at straws.
Immediately? All this happens after the fight has been over for some time, more importantly, after Rousimar has already grabbed the leg in question. What happened in the intervening time? The ref checks by wiping his leg with a paper towel. It comes back wet. By the scientific principle known only to Herb Dean, it will someone magically coalesce and separate any greasing agent from sweat? This is unbelievably the “test” Nate passed.
The Commission checks. Of course, the ref has just wiped his leg off. The opposing corner has a say after that, and no doubt after being told to control their boy.
It’s not super compelling to me. Maybe it is to you. It’s something that happened. The fighter felt strongly enough about it to complain vigorously on the spot (comically costing him the fight). I don’t know enough to say he was cheating for certain. But the allegation is a real thing and it certainly fits a pattern of behavior, both with Marquardt and Jackson fighters.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions
The fight over for quite some time huh? How about less than a minute. Grease don’t evaporate or jump to the other fighter. Herb Dean checked with his gloved hands first. Then afterward watched Nate then checked with the paper towel. Try this at home, grease up your legs, choice of grease is your own. Get sweaty, wipe with towel let towel dry and see if you can see grease.
Herb Dean is a fighter and has a wealth of experience with all manner of combat sports. I am sure he would know what was grease and what wasn’t.
If Nate was greased why did he say check it right there. Wouldn’t he have been better off going to his corner and getting toweled off? You say to the reaction of a fighter then Nate’s reaction can be counted with equal weight.
Now you see why it is easier to link to the articles explaining the issue in full?
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:58 PM EST up reply actions
What if you don't use grease?
What if you use a water-based lubricant or any number of lubricants designed specifically not to leave any residue?
That’s not to say definitively that Nate illegaly used a lubricant, just to say that a paper towel test is not exactly dispositive.
This is ridiculous? Palhares grabbed his leg. So? Are you saying that would remove all of the vaseline or whatever could have been used from the leg at once? Please. And Herb Dean took a swipe off the leg. And yes, of course his test is accurate as after the water evaporates the greasing agent would become apparent on the paper. Why else would an experienced ref like Dean do this? You honestly declare Palahres’ reaction “proof” but this is hokus-pokus to you?
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
Snowden did not use the word "proof"
So I’m not sure why you’re quoting him as if he did.
A few posts up he writes: "The evidence of Marquardt doing something wrong was in the reactions of Palhares. " That is what I was refering to. Also note I didnt write proof, I wrote “proof”, thereby acknowledging he was not explicitly using that expression although his statement comes pretty close, don’t you think?
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
I think I understand what you're going for
But generally when you put something in quotes, you are quoting someone or something.
Not if it is just a single word. But english is not my first language so maybe I misjudged what you guys would normally use to indicate a more ironic use of a word.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
…because if the grease was designed to evaporate it wouldn’t stay on long enough to be effective? It’s a magical greasing agent that lasts exactly long enough for one submission attempt but disappears the second the fight is over? You realize this is a silly idea, right?
It might be silly, but it helps their argument so it is what it is…
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 9, 2010 12:33 PM EST up reply actions
Just saying...
It is kinda funny that GSP (UFC 94) and Marq (UFN 22) BOTH won with questionable victories that involved alleged “greasing”.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
In Marq's defense though...
… You gotta keep fighting, kid!? haha?
You can’t start “politiking” and playing Magnum P.I. in the middle of a fight round.
He should have defended himself until the bell, then brought it up after the round was over.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
No need to defend Marquardt for the Palhares fight.
Palhares made a piss-poor error. In a street fight you never take your eye off your opponent and you never do it in a professional fight. Period. Rousimar Palhares coach acknowledged his error in that match. There’s a reason why referees instruct fighters to protect themselves at all times.
Greasing? That’s another story.
- - - - -
VEe is ANIMated!
by VeeisAnimated on Nov 8, 2010 12:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
agreed
It’s just like when you ge het eye-poked, hit in the balls, or any “unintentional” mishap, you have to keep your eye on your opponent and don’t just trust the ref to catch it all. That’s the mindset you have to have in wrestling and several other sports
Except the part we saw on camera of GSP getting rubbed with grease
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:17 PM EST up reply actions 10 recs
I saw Kieth Kizer live just going crazy between rounds. With GSP, it is indisputable. He was greasing.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:18 PM EST up reply actions
Dude
If you wrote an article with that topic… it would be a firefight.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Nothing they could do at that point
I love the ABL crew. Y'all keep keeping it GREEN in this mofo
Black Lesnar aka Slap ya Favorite MMA Writer
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:47 PM EST up reply actions
Any evidence is gone.
Semper Fi
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by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
So uh, what happened in that Anderson Silva fight where we see him clearly taking vaseline off his face and rubbing it on his chest? Oh yeah, that gets ignored.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:21 PM EST up reply actions
Almost positive its the Leites fight
and its ridiculous how it NEVER gets mentioned.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
plus, he’s not in the UFC anymore and didn’t do anything to AS in the fight. Just sweeping it under the rug.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
It’s only cheating when it’s an excuse for why your favorite fighter lost :)
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
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by Worldisart on Nov 8, 2010 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
haha i guess so. Its a non-issue because people don’t like Leites.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
Ummm, how? HOW? HE TAKES THE GREASE FROM HIS FACE, and immediately rubs it across his chest. IN DIRECT VIEW OF THE CAMERA. If that isn’t blatantly cheating I don’t know what is.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:32 PM EST up reply actions
For one, it’s a minimal quantity.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:35 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
wow, so now we’re getting into quantities?? Just another example of double standards.
GSP greases- completely knocked as a fighter, possible tainted fights and championships
AS greases- “but not a LOT of greasing, so its ok”
Chael and PEDS- he is a mid tier fighter and needed those, or else he would’ve been dominated by Silva
Nate and PEDS (or anything related to cheating)- “Nate Marquardt will do what it takes to get UFC Gold”
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
no, i’m trying to say the exact opposite. Sonnen was widely criticized and made to look like that was career ending, while Nate is allowed to do virtually anything and he’s still considered a babyface by fans. At what point does this change?
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
Time and wins post steroids will change opinions. It will never go away, but unless he is a repeat offender it won’t stain him forever.
This
Fans are likely to be more hard on somebody when they JUST failed a test than otherwise.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
There’s a difference between the corner systematically applying grease and someone wiping an extra bit off their face. I didn’t say one or the other was “OK.”
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
In one instance AS was the culprit, in the other instance, GSP was the victim. He thought he was just getting a rub down.
by truck on Nov 8, 2010 1:49 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
not directly, but you made it seem as if you think Silva’s actions were defensible because he may not have had a lot of vaseline on his face. Whereas anyone who’s every used vaseline knows a little goes a LONG way, so that’s not a good point.
In GSP’s case, they wiped him down with towels after they saw it happen!
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
That would work if it were systematic, which it was not. It was excess grease that was first applied to the face and brow of GSP. There was never direct application. If you want to see direct application, check Rich Franklin’s corner man, don’t try to revise history.
by Hardcharger on Nov 8, 2010 3:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Ha.
The timing. Sorry, wasn’t trying to steal your thunder.
Staff, please delete my gif right underneath this.
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LOL. Bathing? How much do you think was on his face?
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:46 PM EST up reply actions
This much...
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PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
Why mus I cry? Why mus I cry? Why?
Tell me whyyyyyyyyyyyyyy?
Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade
Unintelligent Defense, I bring Cricket bats to fist fights.
Did Leites file a complaint? No? The point is moot
Plus GSP did it between the 1st and 2nd and the 2nd and 3rd. That’s two violations.
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
GSP didn’t do shit. His cornerman allegedly applied the Vaseline. In the GIF provided it was AS himself that greased up.
WHEN I SAY GSP I MEAN HIS CORNER
C’mon people. Semantics?
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
like you couldn't fucking tell grease was being rubbed on your body!!!!!
Anyone that has ever grappled knows this is the dirtiest trick You can pull. They should be ashamed of themselves.
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Nov 8, 2010 4:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
where he transfers all of the grease from his face
to his ARMS AND CHEST AND NECK, where just about EVERY SUBMISSION MANUEVER is applied.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:44 PM EST up reply actions
For me
The difference is a fighter doing it to himself as opposed to his corner applying it.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
i don’t understand your point. which position is more defensible?
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I guess that's up to you
For me it would be Anderson’s. Would it be illegal for Anderson to rub the vaseline off of his face and on to his body during the fight? No. But the vaseline man’s main job is to not fuck up and it is the fighters responsibility to make sure his corner is capable.
Then again I can also see the other side because GSP was passive in that situation.
So basically, you make your decision.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
The Silva situation is completely and undeniably indefensible
He’s going into a fight where the opponents ONLY chance at victory is submission, and he is trying to obscure people from seeing that he’s transferring vaseline to the vulnerable areas of his body, given the situation.
it doesn’t matter the outcome or the winner, or the style of victory. AS blatantly has bad intentions for his actions. It’s completely illegal.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:07 PM EST up reply actions
He’s trying to obscure people from seeing something by doing it in the cage in front of thousands with the cameras rolling?
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he has a banner in front of him, along with his team. he has a back to the camera, helping obscure the camera’s angle. He’s eliminating the angles that people can get a really good look on what he’s doing.
And true to yourself, you ignore the true point of what i’m saying, to attack a smaller issue i’m talking about. Why don’t you reply to me about how Silva is applying vaseline to the only areas of his body that were vulnerable to Leites?
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
People surround the cage. There are people all around it, both above, below, and right in the middle of the cage. There are multiple cameras all over the place, including overhead. You can see exactly what people are doing.
I’m not sure what “true to yourself” means. I don’t know what you want people to say. He shouldn’t have put grease from his face to his body. You are right about that.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:14 PM EST up reply actions
THANK YOU.
my point about true to yourself is that occasionally you respond to the ticky-tack issues and not the central argument.
we are now in concordance that Silva cheated.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:17 PM EST up reply actions
respond to theticky-tackslippery issues
by truck on Nov 8, 2010 2:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
how is what he did NOT cheating, whereas what GSP did is cheating?
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Because it isn’t apparently. Don’t expect more than that is my guess…
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 8, 2010 3:20 PM EST up reply actions
I don't really care about either situation.
Both were wrong, but both fights were blow outs and the grease wasn’t the reason. Much ado about nothing.
that’s not the point though. the results don’t affect the intention at all. What Silva did was blatantly cheating, in the moment of time that he did it. The GSP stuff is inconclusive, because he’s not doing it to himself, and we have no evidence of him directing his cornerman to do it.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
That is completely untrue. The act isn’t any more legal because the corner is involved. It’s more systematic and less legal that way.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:16 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This ^
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That is probably another excuse for Sonnen's back acne
He was hoping the zits would pop and the puss would have a lubricating affect on his back.
by truck on Nov 8, 2010 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Ew.
That’s just all kinds of ew.
"It's meaningless to just live. It's meaningless to just fight. I want to win!" - Ichigo Kurosaki
Garbage reference?
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The band, that is
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drama, drama
Grease…is…everywhere during the fight, unless there is an event where the fighters fight with plastic bags on their head…or there’s no clinch…nor…grappling…
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by dancingChicken on Nov 8, 2010 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
true
a lot you say I disagree with, but in this case I agree
Did Leites file a complaint?
Nope.
I see people break rules all the time in fighting (fence grabs, short grabs). What’s your point?If they don’t file a complaint, why should I care?
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
so its only when people complain that its a big deal? Or is it a big deal because AS is going into a fight with a very dangerous submission artist and wipes vaseline on every area of his upper body that could be used in a submission, and does so in a manner where he’s hidden from the crowd by his banner, and his back is turned to the cameras?
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
Why should WE care if the opponent doesn't?
How is his back turned to cameras if you posted a gotdamn gif of it ?
I love the ABL crew. Y'all keep keeping it GREEN in this mofo
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
i’m assuming his opponent didn’t care because he was roundly criticized for the fight and probably embarassed, and didn’t want to shine any more light on it. What Silva did was blatantly cheating, and your’s, Jon’s, and Chris’s attitude on it is what really, truly reflects the double standards in MMA journalism
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t understand on why you insist on personalizing this and escalating the conversation into an argument.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:04 PM EST up reply actions
Huh? His back is obviously turned to the cameras in the gif.
Nobody said he wasn’t caught on camera…
Good thing it’s a one camera shoot! Seriously, they have a ton of cameras all over the place. There’s no hiding.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:16 PM EST up reply actions
Trolling gets thrown around too loosely
GSP was “visibly” seen being greased and Marq and him are teammates.
I’m not accusing anyone, or even being sarcastic about it, I’m just point out to obvious and true statements.
Lighten up. It’s a readers blog.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 1:40 PM EST up reply actions
I love how even the slightest suggestion of any wrong-doing (even when it is immediately discounted) is preyed upon by the “Intertard” community and concluded as HARD CORE evidence.
God I hate the internet.
If you hate the internet so much
You probably shouldn’t read it, create an account on a site, and contribute to the community.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
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by Neil Manich on Nov 8, 2010 12:57 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Saying you hate the internet...
is a pretty broad statement and obviously exaggerated. Your response is one that never gets old. It is played out in some circles though. See Sherdog.net. for examples.
Stop reading???
Are you insane? Internet forums provide some of the best comic relief known to man!
And occassionally you can find some un-biased articles that excersize responsible journalism.
Don't go to a blog for journalism
This isn’t a news site nor is it a forum and if that’s what you believe and that’s why you come here then you have only yourself to blame for being upset.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
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But, why be upset over someone's opinion expressed over social forum anyway???
… It’s about as “re-re” as challenging someone to a fight over the internet.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
Wow?
God bless you, homey. smh
All I pointed out was two fights for two guys who are teammates that had questionable victories. How is that me saying, “YES! They cheated and were greasing!”
Stop being reactive and just keep it conversational. It’s a comment blog for christ sake! You don’t like it…
… Look away.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Question?
Does anyone know what apparel items are legal and illegal in the Octagon circle?
The reason I ask is because if a fighter has an inkling that his/her opponent might be looking to find away to slide out of hold (such as the one in the Palhares/Marquardt fight), would it make sense for said fighter to possibly wear some form of forearm taping or brace?
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
Not sure of the exact rules but some people have skirted it (see: George Sotiropolous).
The other thing is putting shit on your arms is also going to give your opponent something to grab and grip onto.
But, if you are going to take the fight to the ground and go for a submission anyway…
… Wouldn’t some extra “friction” be a wanted thing even if it means giving up an advantage in grappling?
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
It depends
If your a BJJ Ace (Palhares, Aoki) and the guy you are fighting is a purple belt, who do you think the extra friction is going to help more?
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
I can see the frustration in the...
Almeida fight. That choke was held longer than it should have been. Ref was trying to get Almeida to let go and it looked like he was just paying attention to his corner and not the ref. So the parting shot by Nate was definitely retaliatory in nature due to what he thought was Almeida holding the choke for to long.
I don’t find it dirty. Definitely not Daley dirty.
also he paid for it
when Renzo kicked him in the face.
Semper Fi'
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Pain don't hurt...
I don't see how a retalitory blow after a fight isn't dirty
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by Neil Manich on Nov 8, 2010 12:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It was dirty,
but not completely unjustified, I mean, Almeda held the choke a good 3 mississippi after Nate taps.
Semper Fi'
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Pain don't hurt...
I really hate this argument
Someone else’s bad behavior doesn’t justify your own.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
Support independent artists
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Eye for an eye
Is the worst way to live your life. What Nate did was wrong, and it wasn’t made any less wrong by what Ricardo did.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
Support independent artists
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Some people say "An eye for an eye", I don't believe in that..
I say TWO eyes for an eye.
by Horselover Fat on Nov 8, 2010 3:39 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Any Bas reference...
gets a Rec from me.
"Last time a Russian hit a brother that hard, Ivan Drago killed Apollo Creed"- Some guy on Sherdog, referencing Fedor vs Rogers
What’s that whole bit about people being toothless and blind?
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
by Neil Manich on Nov 8, 2010 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I love it as the perfect example to show soldiers why any ground based fighting system is bullshit for real life. On top punching a dude? Next second his buddy is kicking you in the face!
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Ground based fighting can be very effective in real life,
If you add eyegouges and biting.
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
Don't forget brass knuckles!
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:00 PM EST up reply actions
Nice! Those are best used with the ancient art of the...
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
Still getting your ass kicked in that situation. The ground is where the boots are.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
One on one yer fine.
Plus we all carry Rifles anyway.
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
You can garauntee you’ll be in a one on one fight in the street?
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
My point is that “one on one yer fine” doesn’t make sense except in a sporting environment.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Or, you know, the desert when it’s just the two of you.
Luke: What was our best moment?
Nate: When I banned Subo?
Luke: That was a good one.
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by Derek Suboticki on Nov 8, 2010 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
exactly.
And so what if it’s more than one guy. Whats the alternative? surrender? Hell no, I aint gettin my head cut off on the internet.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
No, but you want to be able to stay standing against multiple opponents and be able to retrieve a weapon with due haste. The shift to teaching BJJ in lieu of other unarmed combat is short sighted in my opinion.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:58 PM EST up reply actions
If you are facing multiple people without backup and you are unarmed, you are screwed anyway. The best way to win a fight against multiple people is run the fuck away and find a weapon, then come back on your own terms and take care of your opponents one at a time, ideally without any of them knowing it is coming.
The best way to win an unarmed fight is to bring a gun.
Guillotine.
And how well can you exit a situation that gets worse if you are messing around on the ground? There is an application for BJJ and other control techniques, especially for military police. I just think it’s an epic fail as the sole unarmed combat discipline for soldiering.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
It's not the only disipline they teach.
Just one of many.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
I’m familiar with what they teach and what they don’t in the Army. I know the Marines have a different program.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:39 PM EST up reply actions
MCMAP
it’s basicly basic MMA.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
I did a bit of messing around with the Marines too. Lots of cool knife fighting stuff too. We messed around too much with stupid bayonet instead.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
The funnest training ever was the rubber knife dipped in red paint.
We would just start fuckng each other up, total blast.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
Apparently you’re not. Not everyone is using BJJ based self defense systems
by disinferno06 on Nov 8, 2010 8:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
sorry i was a dick in my other post but....
Here is my point. A well trained Bjj fighter doesnt “mess around on the ground”. They quickly move into a dominant position and have a choice of attacks.
The thing is it takes years (if ever)to develop balanced consistent one punch knockout power in both hands and it takes years to develop the ability to sweep,mount and choke anyone at will.
the combatives are for confidence building. I have yet to meet a soldier that was any good at either stand up or ground without outside training. If the soldiers actually want to be to be good fighters they need to put in the time at a good school, under good instructors.
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Nov 9, 2010 2:26 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Step 1: Get him on the ground
Step 2: Gouge his eyes out
Step 3: Get up,
Step 4: Stomp his brains out
Step 5: Find another guy to kill.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
by RolloTomasi on Nov 8, 2010 3:36 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Unfortunately not everything requires lethal force. Stupid ROE.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
The ROE changes every week,
I can’t keep up.
Are we still alowed to kill the enemy?
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
I don’t think you can even say “kill” anymore.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
I'm just going to jump in, but
I think waay to much is made out of unarmed combat for practical purposes. Even knives. Look at load out weight and it typically shows the importance of what you carry. 4 oz tactical knife, 10 lbs of tach carbine and ammo. What really gets the job done?
Unarmed combat falls into an LE role imo, not when shit gets serious.
@rask4p on Twitter
Your fantasies are disturbing.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:22 PM EST up reply actions
If your name is "Bad MF'er" you can.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:37 PM EST up reply actions
that is the stupidest thing you have ever said.
The only reason ground fighting is a bad idea is because you could be out numbered? Opposed to where you could totally Kickbox two people at once? Bullshit.
I study krav and bjj ….and I gotta tell you Gracie Jiu jitsu has the most real world applications.
"Even Hulkamania wouldn't get you out of this hold"
"True strength is not always shown through victory. Stand up, try again and display strength of heart."
by the-gentle-way on Nov 8, 2010 4:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
especially when you add a knife.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
I didn’t say groundfighting was a bad idea. I said it was bad to learn as a sole form of unarmed combat in the military because of the likelihood of bad things happening on the ground and the inability to easily remove yourself from a situation that escalates.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with that.
It’s just a piece of the puzzle.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
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Pain don't hurt...
First of all its not the ONLY thing being taught in the army. Even in units dumb enough that they actually do that MAC bullshit, only level ONE is ground fighting. Its a “complete” system. As you go to different levels you learn more complete skills. It’s not perfect but it at least gives them some kind of baseline familiarity with H2H. But other units have other programs are their disposal
by disinferno06 on Nov 8, 2010 10:06 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It was just as justified as Daley's was
That is to say, not very
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 1:19 PM EST up reply actions
I was OK with Daley's.
It was Koscheck.
What I’m not OK with is him still missing with the punch despite Kos’ bac being turned.
I thought the athletic commision looked at Nates legs and said it was all good?
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Pain don't hurt...
They did, it just wasn’t mentioned in the article for some reason. I’m guessing because the implied cheating being proven false immediately doesn’t help the article…
by Empty Thoughts on Nov 8, 2010 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
Looked at his leg when is the question? What happened in between the accusations and the observation? What was “proven.”
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
PhilHarris is a crybaby?
Herb Dean also looked at it in the cage and said it was fine.
PhilHarris even said he was wrong. What more do you need?
Also Almeda held the choke too long, and the slam on Letes was close but legal (he slams him on his face = legal)
The knee to so much.
Semper Fi'
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Pain don't hurt...
He said what he said after some intense pressure to do so. His immediate reaction speaks for itself.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
So your true intentions come out.
I thought this piece was about Nate and the controversy he has been involved in. Seeing your comments makes it clear you either A. want to point out that you don’t like Nate or B. that he is dirty, no matter the slightest accusation. Possibly both. You tricked me on this one.
Using your logic, I can imagine being on a jury to prove your innocence or guilt. Even if you were innocent, any slight culpability would have me leaning towards the death penalty.
I think you are coming unhinged here. I liked Nate, quite a bit. I think he’s an interesting guy and one willing to go to whatever dark places will help him win.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
What “dark places”? Cheating?
Luke: What was our best moment?
Nate: When I banned Subo?
Luke: That was a good one.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
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Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Nov 8, 2010 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
You realize you are trying to reason with a guy who calls himself “Crazynutts” right?
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
No matter how long Ricardo help that joke what Nate did was horrible and totally out of line. The slam was illegal. At least according to Big John.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
They did, and RP said the same and apologized. Additionally while he got points off for the elbows to the back of the head in the Lites fight, subsequent replays showed the elbow to be legal.
Shitty reporting, IMO, for omitting facts that the author did know or should have known.
Or
you guys are missing the point. It’s not about his guilt in these things, it’s that the cloud of them follow him.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
i think the article is stating that the cloud is justified.
me thinks this is a case of Snowden being Snowden.
by F'n Clownshoes on Nov 8, 2010 12:51 PM EST up reply actions
It is justified
this shit keeps following him. He absolutely cheated multiple times in the Leites fight, elbows being legal or not. He got caught for PEDs. He attacked a guy after the fight was over.
Where there is smoke there is fire.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
And he may or may not have cheated. I’m not ready to say it “proven” wrong because they took a glance at his ankle after the fight.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
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I wouldn't say he was proven innocent
as much as he wasn’t proven guilty. I don’t care if they used a scientific paper towel test of not.
Well, by stating these things without stating the full facts, it’s not reporting on a cloud, it’s creating the cloud.
The could existed before this article.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
This is not a new train of thought.
I had a similar discussion with some buddies after the Palhares fight.
Nate is to performing illegal moves as Koscheck is to faking them
I had this discussion on this site immediately after the Palhares fight
I was of course shouted at for ever bringing up the potential that a fighter may have a mixed past.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
Agreed, this isn’t just Snowden making things up. Nate has a somewhat shady reputation because of his tendency to walk the line and occasionally step over it. I remember when he said that “I’m not a dirty fighter” after the Palhares fight, I thought to myself “Actually, you kind of are”. The Leites fight is a good example.
by Horselover Fat on Nov 8, 2010 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I felt the exact same.
I remember when he said that "I’m not a dirty fighter" after the Palhares fight, I thought to myself "Actually, you kind of are".
Nobody thinks they are a dirty fighter
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
Contributor at cagepages.com Come check us out.
He prides himself on it
If the ref doesn’t call it… its legal.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:46 PM EST up reply actions
Actually subsequent replays showed the elbow to be questionable and ignited a huge controversy between officials and refs.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 12:53 PM EST up reply actions
IIRC
It’s the elbow where the big disagreement about what the “back of the head” really means, yea? Headphones or Mohawk.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
Yes. There was, and remains, huge disagreement about this area.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 12:56 PM EST up reply actions
I remember this
Big Jon made a stink about how Herb (I think it was herb) was doing it wrong by using “Headphones”. Herb continues to state “headphones” is correct. I think I remember reading some AC rules that differ on the subject too, making it more muddled.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:57 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is that there is no definition. Dean and others saw a presentation by a doctor about the dangers of blows to the back of the head and made an unofficial decision to enforce nebulous rules a certain way. Others, like Mazzagatti and McCarthy disagree.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
The part that sucks in that entire situation is that it forces fighters to have to know who if reffing what to know where they can hit on any given night.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Just like pitchers have to find out where the strike zone is for each ump
One of the unescapable effects of having humans judge sporting events.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
A pitcher figuring out the strike zone is not a guy taking elbows to the back of the skull. If a pitcher finds out a ball just outside isn’t going to be called, he’s not going to give a guy brain damage.
I rarely tweet
I less-rarely write
"I ain't having it" - Buster Posey, hosing folks down
I concur
My point was about the subject nature of humans judging sporting events though.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
I don't think that works as a good analogy
simply because the huge disparity in the consequences.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Things like small discrepancies in whats allowed or not that are based on judgment of an official will necessarily lead to slightly different rules under different officials.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
When the ref says “we’ve been over the rules in the dressing room”, maybe he means it and has explained it or given the fighters opportunity to ask? Not 100% sure if he really does talk to them or if that’s just the official way of saying “we know our shit, right boys?”.
To save me some time on 25% of all threads, here's the universal answer to the Fedor-debate: Fedor is the most accomplished MMA fighter ever. That is a fact. If he still is the best fighter at this point in time is up for debate.
They actually do
meet with the ref before every fight, so that the fighter and/or his corner can ask questions to clarify. I read an article about Marquardt from the Maia fight and it went over them asking specific instructions concerning their gameplan. Don’t remember the details, but they def meet with the ref.
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
part of my point
this is how i see it and perhaps i’m just not seeing properly.
the Ricardo fight, the reaction was justified.
the Leites fight was odd, elbows are still being discussed. Leites totally adjusted his own body which created the pile driver.
Paul Harris is a little out of his mind, stopped fighting, was reaching for an excuse due to the fact that no one had ever escaped his leg locks, got TKOed and whined. Followed by an apology.
no excuses whatsoever for the PEDs
by F'n Clownshoes on Nov 8, 2010 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Okay
I can see we won’t agree on this, but attacking someone after the fight is over is NEVER justified.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
nor is it cheating
to attack your opponent after the bell, which means it’s irrelevant to the point of the article, which is that Nate might do anything to win. Scuffling after the bell was poor judgment but didn’t help him win.
Well that is an interesting
and delusional spin on the situation.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
Sure it's an illegal act
Only in this case it’s not cheating in the confines of a sport, but instead it’s a felony in the context of the law.
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I don't think the article called him a cheater.
It is just a commentary on how he walks a fine line between following rules and fighting outside of them.
From the title:
“Nate Marquart will do what it takes to get UFC gold.” My point is that attacking Almeida didn’t help him get anything.
It also didn't happen in the UFC, so what...
It shows that Nate isn’t scared to cross the line or walk right on it (despite seeming like a nice guy). That is the point of the article.
It’s an example of his state of mind in a fight.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 1:51 PM EST up reply actions
actually it helped him get punted by Renzo Gracie
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by the-gentle-way on Nov 11, 2010 2:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
In the Almeida fight what I saw happen was him tapping while half unconscious, the ref pulling Almeida off and as Marquardt came to he blasted him only to eat Renzo’s shin.
It wasn’t an intentional foul or retaliation for a long choke (I didn’t think it was)just instinct kicking in on the return trip from lala land. With no more bad intent than someone sitting up and trying to double leg the ref.
More than anything I think it was a failing of the ref to truly seperate the fighters.
One way or another, Nate has a dirty reputation.
I wouldn’t have been surprised if he had been greasing, although the super scientific tests they ran prove the greasing to be false.
Dirty or not, Nate's ability is undeniable.
AS still insists that Nate will be the next MW champion. Only time will tell.
AS knows his days are numbered
I wouldn’t be surprised if he lost to Vitor.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
I can't remember him ever facing a striker as talented Belfort
It will be an interesting test to say the least. This is the first fight in a long time where AS’s smart play would be to work the ground game.
I think the AS who fought Franklin
Would beat Vitor. The AS who hasn’t looked the same since going to LHW? Not so much. I think he RJJ’d himself.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
by Chris Barton on Nov 8, 2010 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
He looked bad against Sonnen, but I don't think he showed any ill effects agaist Maia
Just a bad attitude in that one. I can’t blame the guy for gassing a little in a five round fight, that was held outdoors in a desert.
We'll see
I really think his timing and speed are not the same. I hope I am wrong.
"Don’t quote old fucks to me" – Brent Brookhouse
I hope you are wrong too, but who knows
A lot of people have fussed about Belfort not deserving the fight, but I don’t care. Belfort is far and away the most exciting matchup.
agreed.
His ribs weren’t the culprit when we got dropped by a Sonnen left hand in the first round. If Sonnen could drop him, Vitor can take his head off.
The good news for Vitor is that Chael’s performance may have lead more of us fanboys to believe that Vitor can unseat the champ, possibly leading to bigger buzz and more PPV buys.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:25 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed, however
I think Chael landed that punch quite possibly b/c AS was more worried about keeping his hands low for some TDD.
I'm the best ever. You're the most average in a minute.
by slapjaw ackrite on Nov 8, 2010 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
yea, but AS hasn't always had the best standing defense
He does get hit occasionally (just not against Griffin) His calling card has always been having an iron head and concrete chin. Notsomuch if that “casting” punch could sit him down
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
His ribs weren’t the culprit when we got dropped by a Sonnen left hand in the first round.
I think its safe to assume you’ve never had a bruised rib. Tensing your abs hurts like a motherfucker. If you don’t think that will change the entire dynamic of a fight, I don’t know what to tell you.
When I'm on the mic it goes down, CINTRON
-Joell Ortiz
by The Lethal Haze on Nov 8, 2010 2:47 PM EST up reply actions
Not to mention, that wasn't a "drop", that was more of a off-balance as Silva got right up and actually never touched the ground with his back/butt
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
I think the biggest thing about Vitor
Is he might be able to match his speed. Anderson made Forrest look like he was in slow motion, but Vitor might just catch him with those same punches.
"I am a man who pisses largely and frequently, which they say is a sign of great mental activity" -Henry Miller-
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The first thing you notice about Nate Marquardt when you meet him is his smile. It’s infectious. He seems to enjoy life, the kind of joy that’s hard not to be inspired by. Soft spoken, funny, quick with a laugh
Somebody has a man crush…
Piranha 3D will give you the most confused boner ever... When the Piranha spit out dude's dick I was all like, "That's because it was HIS dick. MY dick is fucking delicious - Joe Rogan
About the greasing
I’ve heard that Jackson fighters have a technique of bathing in baby oil the night before a fight, so that it sinks into their pores and comes out when they have a good sweat going. Is it possible that the baby oil wouldn’t have produced the same effect on the paper towels that vaseline would have? And that certainly couldn’t be considered cheating. More unsportsmanlike IMO.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
Greasing thing has so many grey areas
The reality is depending on your diet, you work up a good sweat and you feel “greasy”. You use a certain kind of soap and you become a little “slippery”.
It’s gamesmanship, much in the same way some pitchers in baseball are always rumored to be palming something on the ball for a specific grip, some fighters are always gonna be accused of greasing. Some will get caught, some won’t. But the reality is when part of the regulated pre-fight routine includes rubbing vaseline on a fighters face, right off the hop you’re leaving the door open for an easy defense.
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I dont think the fight ended up going long enough for Nate to work up a sweat lol
Also, I heard Greg Jackson was the second shooter on the grassy knoll in the JFK assassination.
Give me smallest finger on man's hand. I'll produce information. Computer unnecessary.
by hobbie on Nov 8, 2010 1:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
any type of oil on the skin would leave residue.
There is no “stealth” oil out there.
There are a number of lubricants that will not leave residue
They’re called water-based lubricants.
And from now on I'll be calling them
Stealth Oil. Because that sounds way cooler
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- T-Rex
by sitnam90 on Nov 8, 2010 9:08 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Palhares
This part where Palhares joins the group saying Nate greases is BS
He clearly thought that for a moment but then he and his trainer retracted their feelings. The author is just using this as a ploy to imply that Nate greased. BS poor reporting or blogging
by cuervo on Nov 8, 2010 2:05 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
I didn't get that from the story.
Palhares did retract his accusation, but there could have (had to have) been other factors in that maneuver.
The fact that you bring blatant attention to a rule that the Fighting Commission is suppose to enforce and be a watchdog for and call out one of the UFC’s elite fighters after only 5 fights is a poor “business decision” in my opinion.
I’m not saying that Palhares was giving lip service and only trying to save his UFC career, but I can see the fighting commission being offended at the idea that they didn’t do their job to make sure both fighters were fighting within the rules and regs.
Semper Fi
PREDICTION for 2010-2011 NFL Season: "The England Patriots will finish 8-8 plus or minus 1" ~8/13/10 1230p
by ChicagoMarine on Nov 8, 2010 2:20 PM EST up reply actions
Trend?
Snowden has become a masterful troll lately. Every piece has had at the minimum 100+ comments. He is doing his job well haha.
while i agree with you that some of his articles are definitely written to have a huge debate about, I think that just reflects one aspect of being a good blogger, and Kid Nate is definitely guilty of the same thing.
I don’t think he’s being a troll, and i’m not sure how this article would fall into that category at all. I bet you didn’t even read it.
Will I ever get to where I'm going?
If I do, will I know when I'm there?
by Austin Martin on Nov 8, 2010 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
It's a terrible meme here
Let’s all shit on Snowden instead of discuss the article. I don’t know why the moderators allow it to continue.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
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I don’t know why the moderators allow it to continue.
Think about it. It’ll come to you.
Luke: What was our best moment?
Nate: When I banned Subo?
Luke: That was a good one.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Nov 8, 2010 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
They'll get the hits
Whether the idiots are allowed to post or not.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
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I don't know why people think that BE runs on page hits
They don’t. No website does. It’s about UNIQUE VISITOS. So whether your ass comes once or 8923823 times a day. You count the same.
I love the ABL crew. Y'all keep keeping it GREEN in this mofo
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by S.C. Michaelson on Nov 8, 2010 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
Fine
Point remains the same, you get the unique hit whether the clowns have valid working accounts to post with or not.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
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There’s certainly a group of commenters that have made incredible efforts to destroy conversation here. We’ll see how long we want to keep them around.
by Jonathan Snowden on Nov 8, 2010 2:49 PM EST up reply actions
You know, I don’t always agree with you and I think a lot of your opinions are right out of left field but if I’m going to comment I’ll debate the issue, not make stupid comments like “That’s Snowden being Snowden!”
You’re one of the best writers about MMA around and I think it’s really shameful that members of this community are allowed to carry on like that.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
Support independent artists
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sorry to upset your sensibilities....
i wrote that. “Snowden being Snowden” was meant kind of tounge in cheek. he does have a history of blurring the lines himself in his articles. i enjoy his articles even if sometimes i find them a tad "creative’. one comment does not mean i carry on. the site has moderators; let em do the job they have been asked to do. you have your opinion, i’m glad you have the ability to express it. please allow myself and others to do the same.
by F'n Clownshoes on Nov 8, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
Here's the thing
I’m not asking you to agree with him. I often vehemently disagree with his opinion but I direct my arguments at that opinion and not at him. Tongue and cheek or not, “Snowden being Snowden” is a stupid comment which contributes nothing to any real debate and turns off people who might otherwise have something constructive to offer.
And while I may not be a moderator, I’m a long time member of this community and I find it really disturbing that just about every single article that John posts devolves into that kind of idiotic drivel. There are people here who would rather have real conversations and real debates rather than rip on the motives of the writer.
It’s old, it’s not funny and it really goes a long way to ruining what made Bloody Elbow such a great community.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
Support independent artists
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ok let me get this straight
because you find my comment to be stupid you feel that other posters (besides yourself) will be turned off. sorry man, i don’t buy it. my comments should in no way shape or form detract anyone from posting anything ever. there is no way on god’s green earth that the ladies and gentlemen who freqent this site would feel turned off and refuse to comment after i make a unimportant little post. (i really don’t carry that high of an opinion of myself on this particular subject.)
i too enjoy relevent “real” conversations related to MMA. this is an opinion piece. we can agree on that right? it was a joke. if you read all of Mr. Snowden’s articles you will notice how much fun (you know…..FUN) we can have with his opinions.
i love this site. i do not post often. i 100% feel you are over stating yourself here. perhaps Mr. Snowden could give us his opinion on the subject and we can put this to rest. i refuse to get into a name calling match here, as tempting as it seems.
by F'n Clownshoes on Nov 8, 2010 6:32 PM EST up reply actions
There’s a difference between inciting intelligent discussion and defending a blatantly ridiculous claim or poorly worded argument in order to goad people into replying. The first indicates intellectual quality, while the second only has value when viewed under the capitalist lens where money/hits/replies are all that matters.
As mentioned by someone before, has anyone ever seen a commission member actually wipe or feel a fighters ankles?
And doesn’t Herb Dean wear gloves in the ring?
I’m not saying that Marquardt absolutley greased, but the possibility of it happening, and someone not catching it, is very real.
Also, is it easy to tell the difference between grease and sweat? Doubtful.
If there’s a non permanent ink, there has to be non permanent grease. I must run an independent studies on that matter.
the Rooster! the Rider! a Man on the Rooster! the Rider of the Apocalypse!
by dancingChicken on Nov 8, 2010 2:32 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe all the grease had already transfered to Palhares’ hands & arms & chest. I bet no-one thought to check there. Think about it..
by Horselover Fat on Nov 8, 2010 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
The slam on Leites. (ok maybe it was a spike)
Soooooo awsome!
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
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Pain don't hurt...
by RolloTomasi on Nov 8, 2010 4:58 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
but but but
it was soooooo cool.
"From the womb to the tomb, spit sick lyrics like MF Doom"
Semper Fi'
WatchKalibRun.com
Pain don't hurt...
Agreed, very dangerous move, forbidden with good reason.
by Horselover Fat on Nov 8, 2010 6:32 PM EST up reply actions
On the one hand
It was dangerous, but I think you can pretty clearly tell that he was leaning forward with the intent of slamming him on his face and chest rather than going straight down with the intent of spiking him on the top of the head (which happened because Leites curled forward a little).
Not saying it wasn’t illegal or he shouldn’t have been DQ’d/deducted, just it doesn’t look to me like he did that with the intent of doing spinal damage.
“I haven’t cheated like that since I took roids”
the Rooster! the Rider! a Man on the Rooster! the Rider of the Apocalypse!
by dancingChicken on Nov 9, 2010 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
Great article
I’ve been on ya in the past for what was in my opinion less than stellar writing but this was really good.
I enjoyed seeing him beat Palhares, even though I thought “man, kinda lame for Nate to go after him while he was not paying attention, not the way anyone wants to win a fight”. But I will say that Palhares himself had a reputation for tomfoolery going into that fight and I have to imagine that Tomaz Derwal and others probably enjoyed seeing his head bouncing off the Octagon floor so it is what it is.
Fighting is a brutal experience that I think a lot of fans don’t truly understand. I’m not going to be overly critical of any guy who walks the line IN his fights.
Steroids is a non-starter for me of course, but the other stuff that Marquardt has been involved in I tend to look at and say, well, he’s cage fighting, what did you expect.
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