Brocktober's Best: Five Fights to Enjoy This Fall
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 12:45 PM EDT
in MMA Editorial
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Another month relegated to history. September provided plenty of entertainment, capped off by a great night of fights last night courtesy of the WEC and Bellator. Now we turn our attention to October, sorry, BROCKTOBER. Everyone is excited for the return to the cage of the mighty Brock Lesnar. But what other fights should we start gearing up for this month? Here's five.
5. Satoru Kitaoka vs. Kuniyoshi Hironaka (Pancrase Passion Tour 9, October 3rd): Ah, Pancrase. The sport's groundbreaking promotion has fallen on hard times in recent years. Founders Minoru Suzuki and Masakatsu Funaki departed for pro wrestling and many of the promotion's top stars jumped ship for a variety of leagues worldwide. Now Kitaoka is back after a mixed bag in Sengoku. While he beat Takanori Gomi in his highest profile fight to date, Kitaoka lost his last two before slinking back to Pancrase in June. His opponent is UFC and Dream veteran Kuniyoshi Hironaka who cut down to lightweight in 2009 after competing his entire career at 170 pounds. This should be a really competitive and fun fight.
4. Dan Hardy vs. Carlos Condit (UFC 120, October 16th): This should be an amazing fight. Carlos Condit is one of those guys that just seems to trail excitement. Jon Fitch would do well just to bask in the glow of Condit's left over excitement. Combine the unpredictable Condit with Hardy's growing and well rounded game and this should be a fight that starts standing and then goes completely and irrevocably bonkers. I can't wait.
3. Usama Asiz vs. Joachim Hansen (Superior Challenge 6, October 29th): There's a pretty good little card brewing in Stockholm, Sweden, probably on par with the UFC's German offering later this year (okay, at least comparable to the undercard). Murilo Bustamante, Daniel Acacio, and Hector Ramirez will all throw down, but the best bout of the night will feature Swedish wrestler Sammi Asiz against former Pride standout Joachim Hansen. Anytime Hansen fights it's a major milestone for me as an unabashed "Hellboy" fan. This is no exception.
My top two fights after the break, photos via sherdog.com.
2. Sarah Kaufman vs. Marloes Coenen (Strikeforce, October 9th): Sure, I may have given Ms. Kaufman a bit of a hard time. But she made a real statement against Roxanne Modafferi in her last fight and got her wish - an appearance on the main card of a big Strikeforce event on Showtime. This should be a really competitive fight and go a long way towards establishing the winner as a legitimate rating's booster for Strikeforce.
1. Eddie Alvarez vs. Roger Huerta (Bellator 33, October 21st): After a shocking loss in his second Bellator fight and a summer spent trashing giant woman beaters on the street, Roger Huerta is returning to the cage. The former Sports Illustrated cover boy racked up a 6-2 record in the UFC, losing only to contenders Kenny Florian and Gray Maynard. Huerta is good - real good. He's the perfect test for Eddie Alvarez. Bellator CEO Bjorn Rebney says Alvarez belongs in the discussion of the very best at 155. If Alvarez beats Huerta, it will be hard to argue he isn't right.
Which fight are you looking forward to the most? Vote in our poll.
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BROCKTOBER!!!!!
Anybody who can’t get excited about a Lesnar fight, whether you love him or hate him, needs to get their pulse checked.
"So, while you're taking a break from the UFC, hanging out at some lame party that your girlfriend dragged you to, I'll man up and watch some goddamn fights like a goddamn adult."
- Mike Fagan
Support independent artists
http://worldisart365.blogspot.com/
by Worldisart on Oct 1, 2010 12:10 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Lesnar fights are event fights.
It takes a lot of things to go right for the UFC to put together event fights when hes not involved (BJ Penn moving up in weight to fight GSP, Chael Sonnen’s crazy smack talk leading up to the Silva fight, getting access to the Pride lineup to put together Chuck v Wanderlei, etc)
"You should work for 15 minutes to knock your opponent out, submit him, or improve your position to give yourself the best chance of doing either." - Dan Hardy
At least it made the poll...
Personally, I would love to see Diaz – Mayhem…don’t be scared homie…lol
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Alvarez isn’t that good at all. Who has he beaten? Hansen? Hansen’s fucking terrible. Oooo he beat Gomi and Uno. And he got lucky against Shinya “I only win in Japan because the talent is lesser over here” Aoki. Huerta isn’t even a ranked LW and for a good reason. He beat up cans in the UFC. Stopping Clay Guida was really impressive until you realize Clay Guida loses to everyone that has marginal talent.
slow down Zuffa zombie.
And FYI, it’s a list about the potentially most exciting fights, not necessarily the most quality fights
I don’t even know how to respond to this. Calling Hansen terrible is weird. He’s awesome. And how can you not enjoy a superlative talent like Shinya Aoki, whether you believe he is a top 5 or only top 10 fighter?
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm sorry I called one of your favorite fighters terrible.
I realize that is kind of douchey just to be such an ass about it. But honestly, I don’t think he’s that good. He’s never wowed me. Chalk it up to whatever you want but he’s just never done it for me. I think being stuck in the middle of road has a lot to do with that. And Shinya Aoki, eh. It’s hard to be impressed by him because we see him over here and it’s almost exactly what we expect: A hyped Japanese fighter crumbling to American wrestling/the American style. Like pointless yet entertaining bouts are great (it’s what I was hoping Guillard vs Stephens and Mir vs Cro Cop would be…let’s just like they didn’t happen) but at some point it’s kind of like shit or get off the pot.
Saying Aoki sucks because he hasn’t adapted to American style wrestling is like saying Mousasi sucks because he had weak take down defense against Mo. It is an extremely myopic way of looking at MMA.
Its just the reality of the modern elite MMA fighter
If you haven’t evolved, and can’t handle the elite mma wrestlers, you really have no chance at the highest levels in most weight classes now, all classes soon enough.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
First, it is just silly to say Aoki can’t handle American style wrestlers. He is quite adept on the ground. He is one of the best grapplers in the LW division. Melendez beat him because of his excellent stand up. It’s just bad analysis of Aoki as a fighter. Second, when an excellent fighter, like say Mousasi, comes up against a style that exposes a weakness he needs to adjust to that style. It doesn’t make him a bad fighter. If he doesn’t adjust and that weakness is constantly exploited than he can be reevaluated. But, nothing about what he is saying makes a lick of sense anyway.
Against “american wrestlers” (i.e. Old School wrestlers in mma like Sonnen or maynard) that is true, but the modern elite MMA wrestler (GSP, Jones, Davis, Askren, etc) tools even any elite pure bjj player under the Unified Rules.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
But what American style wrestlers has Aoki lost to? It wasn’t just Melendez’s wrestling that beat Aoki. He stuffed the take downs but he beat the hell out of him standing up. I didn’t realize Hansen or Sakurai were American style wrestlers. And I would say King Mo is among the modern elite wrestlers but he went up against a guy that anticipated his take downs and got knocked out. Each type of fighter has to adjust. That’s why Jones is so unique. He is a complete fighter. Very exciting to see where he goes.
He hasn’t faced any, outside of Melendez and perhaps arguably Alvarez. To clarify, I am not talking about american freestyle or folkstyle wrestlers who have no submission game (offensively or defensively), but rather true New School MMA Wrestlers like those I listed.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Not exactly
Melendez beat him standing too, but he won because he was not so foolish as to spend any significant time in Aoki’s guard, and never so deeply in where he was in danger. When Melendez went to the ground, it was because he chose to go there.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions
You don't watch much MMA, do you?
Alvarez actually got smoked by Shinya “I only win in japan because of the ring/rules” Aoki.
Huerta is no joke, he lost a SD to Maynard a year or so ago, and he’s only been finished once IIRC, and many years ago at that.
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Huerta has been finished by anyone during that time. He fell out of favor with Zuffa, but is still a very talented fighter…should be a great fight.
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions
mmalogic, did you come out?
Of anonymity I mean…
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re awful.
Just leave.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Oct 1, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions 13 recs
Great picks...
There isn’t really anything I would rank higher. I am really looking forward to Akiyama / Bisping, Shields / Kampman, Noons / Diaz and Lyman Good / Ben Askren in Bellator, but the fights you picked are dandy as well.
I like how you think
Along with Lesnar-Cain, I would take those 4 above the 5 offered as those I am most looking forward to, although I am looking forward to most of those Snowden listed as well.
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
My list
1. Diaz -Noons
2. Alvarez -Huerta
3. Lesnar -Brown Pride
4. Condit -Hardy
5. Fujii -Frausto
by 110 South on Oct 1, 2010 12:24 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Damn, Brocktober is shaping up
As one of the sweetest months of MMA in memory…
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Aziz is Swedish
Jonathan,
Aziz is Swedish, not Swiss. Sweden, Switzerland, not same country. The amount of times people I meet are able to make the distinction is clearly lower than the opposite. (I say this as a Swedish guy who lives several months each year in Switzerland and the majority in a third country. Also, this is the single thing in the world that upsets me the most. Ok, not really.)
And I wrote that as a guy who has traveled to both Switzerland and Sweden. D’Oh.
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
It seems to happen to everyone, in every country, except for the countries in question. I lived with Turkish phd student in Switzerland for three months. He had known me for five years. Still he mixed the countries.
Sometimes I feel like I am part of a very tedious version of the Truman show.
Voted hellboy vs Asiz just because its fun to have fights worthy of BE-mentioning happening in Sweden, also been a hellboy fan since he stuffed that TS with a knockout-knee :D
Awesumness
And also, it’s a Swede versus a Norwegian. It can’t get any better.
Aziz is good for the European scene, but Hellboy should really win this. though. However, if Aziz wins I will be stoked. On the other hand, if Hellboy wins I will also be stoked, because he is a Norwegian (and Norwegians talk funny) and obviously a fun fighter.
But honestly, an Aziz win would simply amaze me.
Twas my vote
Brock and Cain pretty close though. Just don’t see Cain pulling it off.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Especially
After seeing him standing next to Machida recently…
Might look like Fedor-HMC when they meet…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
With a much different outcome
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Completely agree
I knew Cain, for all his skill, was a small and somewhat soft HW (physique I mean, not heart), but after seeing him with Machida I find it hard to believe his slightly superior wrestling will be able to overcome Brock’s huge size/strength advantage…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t thnik Cain is gonna sit there and give Brock a running lane for him to charge at. I gotta feeling Cain is working on his hands and is gonna jab him to keep him away. It’d be a David vs Goliath type fight. I still like Cain here.
But I’m glad Condit/Hardy got pointed out. Hardy is gonna start some shit. I’m curious on what Condit’s response will be. But I got Hardy on this one.
Hardy/Bisping…make it happen.
I’m not positive on the reach advantage for Brock, but I’m pretty sure it’s enough to neutralize a consistent jab from Cain. Besides, when have we seen Cain implement a consistent jab into his gameplan (not that he’s needed to so far).
I don’t think Condit will play into it too much. On top of that, Condit’s a pretty cool customer. That said, I’m not sure Hardy will have a lot of material to work with. You can’t make fun of a guy for being a warrior.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
I like
Your Hardy/Bisping idea…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
If both win their next match, I don’t see why not. If it’s in Manchester, GANGBUSTERS! I don’t even know what that means I just know tht Luke Thomas uses it.
It usually means going at it hard
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Now see, I don't know what that means
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
That always trumps other considerations imo...
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Looking forward to all off these except:
Kaufman vs. Coenen. Sorry but every major female fight is either one sided or boring. No, a powerbomb doesn’t make up for a boring fight just like Mir’s KO over CroCop doesn’t.
Tired of females getting a pass for terrible fights.
Oh I’ll watch it, but I’m not expecting much. They could always surprise me with a great fight.
by Lunatic-Fridge on Oct 1, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah because Larosa/Roxy was really boring
get out of here dude.
@TylerTreese on twitter
check out my site @IWannaPolka
some other great fights compiled by TheEnigma from Sherdog
http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f61/greatest-fights-womens-mma-history-1149606/#post36442456
@TylerTreese on twitter
check out my site @IWannaPolka
That list has most of the exciting females fights over the last 5 years…Kinda proves my point.
You watch a major male MMA fight expecting a good fight but sometimes get hit with a snorefest. You watch a female fight expecting a weak fight and are sometimes surprised with a great fight.
by Lunatic-Fridge on Oct 1, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
How?
Out of all the recently overhyped female fights, how many didn’t suck?
by Lunatic-Fridge on Oct 1, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Which ones DID suck? Other than Kaufman/Hashi, I can’t really think of one. The Bellator tourney has been awesome. Did you see Mega Megu last night? Cyborg/Finney was sloppy but full of action. The women’s 135 mini-tourney wasn’t bad at all.
The fact that you used the word “overhyped” shows your bias right there. If you don’t like women’s MMA, it’s cool, lot’s of people think that. But at least dislike it for logical reasons.
http://www.instrength.com
overhyped
Cyborg vs another underweight person to get ragdolled..
oh the excitement
by Lunatic-Fridge on Oct 1, 2010 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions
watch Roxy/Larosa from Mossin and tell me that
didn’t live up to the hype and was boring.
@TylerTreese on twitter
check out my site @IWannaPolka
Guess im the only guy
Looking forward to kikuno vs obiya (if it happens) and JZ vs thompson.
Not to mention vinicus queiroz and maiquel falcao make their debuts @ ufc 120 and 121
JZ-Thomson is a great fight. We will have an interview with Josh next week.
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions
haha ask him why his wikipedia entry says “He is an animate neo-conservative”.
And if it is true, how does he represent himself as such and what functions or events has he served as a neocon?
I am glad he cleared up the burning question about whether he was an animal or a plant.
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions
What kinda crazy question is this?
Who doesn’t want to see the undisputed HW champion in any fight sport go against the #2? It’s what fighting is all about. I know Fedor is still out there but he’s on the downside of his prime and Cain is an amazingly hungry and talented prospect.
Can Cain over come Brock’s size? Is Cain’s wrestling really THAT great that he could out wrestle Brock? Who will win the stand up war? Can Brock land a huge shot? There are tons of questions about Cain’s chin.
This poll is a no brainer. Noons Diaz is only interesting because of the heated rivalry
Well fuck me!
How stupid of me to think that Hardy/Condit will be 3 rounds of pure madness.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Everybody is overlooking Paulo Thiago vs. Diego Sanchez.
It has the makings of a great fight, although I think the fact that Paulo’s going to whoop that ass is making people care less. But it will be an entertaining ass whooping.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess I did overlook that fight
For the very reason you mentioned, but…
Sanchez + G. Jackson = X Factor
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
I hope you are right.
but i have a bad feeling that w/ Sanchez back in New Mexico we will see a fight similar to Fitch/Thiago. YUS I do.
by F'n Clownshoes on Oct 1, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Nah dude.
Diego doesn’t have the size, strength, or wrestling chops of Jon Fitch. Reference his fight with… well… Jon Fitch. Diego’s going to do his silly square off and run forward 1-2 and get blasted for it.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
If he does that he’s wasting his money in NM. He might as well train in his living room.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Jackson's is not a place that emphasizes significant or even nuanced striking improvements.
See: Jardine, Rashad, Guida…
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions
What I meant
Is that is Diego’s plan everytime. If he’s not threatening with takedowns and mixing it up with leg kick (sorta like a gameplan) why is he at Jackson’s? He can practice his 1-2 rush in the living room
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
I like that fight too. I think Thiago has a good chance to finish the fight, but if it goes three, Diego’s cardio may give him the advantage.
by Jonathan Snowden on Oct 1, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Ummm...hmmm....
And who would you suggest as #1?
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I smell some Fedor type shit in the air
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Well lets use common sense
Fedor was #1, werdum beats #1, so werdum takes the spot as #1.
Did you notice in the rankings how velasquez went up without even a fight? The rankings are way too influenced by hype and not much else.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Child please
Beating #1 does not make you #1 when you come in at #10. Were he ranked #2 – #4 going into the fight, there would be an argument to be made for #1.
Werdum is basically a glorified journeyman in mma, and Fedor was a -800 favorite in that fight. Werdum vs. Fedor 2, Overeem, Lesnar, Cain, JDS 2, or Carwin would have any of those guys as at least -500 favorites against him.
He is not remotely qualified for the #1 spot, unless you are a disciple of the “linear champion” nonsense, in which case I have no idea who is #1 under that criteria.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
It worked for #8ish Frankie Edgar
beating BJ Penn and becoming the top dog.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
He was ranked @ 2 or 3 before the second win wasn’t he?
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Nope.
Straight to number 1 after UFC 112. Then there was the talk about if Melendez vs. Aoki was for the number one spot now that BJ was dethroned and Frankie didn’t impress with the win. Turns out that it wasn’t. Subo rejoiced.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, Werdum still isn’t #1 so nanny nanny boo boo.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
It don't bother me none.
Brock is the top dog of heavyweight since Fedor lost. You won’t see me earnestly argue otherwise. But if people say Melendez can’t be number one because he didn’t beat BJ but Brock is number one even though he didn’t beat Fedor, there’s a problem with their logic. And no, I’m not advocating Melendez be ranked number one either. Just looking for consistency.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Oct 1, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
FINALLY
somebody gets it. we’re not talking about fantasy matchups, we’re talking about the logic (or lack thereof really) behind the rankings.
I dont care what anyone says, sensical rankings would mean werdum is #1.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Unfortunately the rankings themselves
Are all over the map with their methodology. Look at Brock’s career tract compared to Jon Jones and tell me who should have been ranked where along the way.
Some guys seem to get ranked on “potential” some on having a “name” some on having beaten a “name” and many based on nothing more than perception and an inability to see their recent history (last 3 years or so) for what it is…these should not be “lifetime achievement” awards (Forrest, Rampage, I am talking to you…).
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, but
Aoki (who was #2) also lost, and badly which further diminished Alvarez’s standing for having fallen so easily to him. Moreover, previously clowned by BJ Florian was in the mix, and there is no way Melendez passes Edgar given what unfolded.
You make a valid point, but the comparison of Edgar to Werdum is far from equal.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Read your very first sentence a couple times and ask yourself if you really believe that.
I’m not sure where your argument is in there other than trying to detract from werdum—-not the topic at hand.
- with logic like that, you are not in a position to call someone else child.
Without getting into a goofy ass HW vs HW debate, take it this way: lesnar vs carwin was a fight between two guys variably ranked in the top 10, (personally for me at the bottom of the top 10) so how can one of them vault to #1 if neither of them were the #1 fighter? Thats my beef. you cant let hype inflate the statue of these guys. I dont care who holds what belt etc., it is simply who beat better guys.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Its a figure of speech, not calling you names, but…
Lesnar was the consensus #2, so when #1 fell to a #10 guy, #2 naturally moves up, as in almost all sports (at least those I follow).
The fact is that almost no one would give Werdum a chance against any of the top-5 or more guys (including against fedor again)…he is just not an elite guy, except perhaps at adcc…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Again
You resort to basically calling werdum a shitty fighter, so i’m just going to leave this dead horse alone since I can’t seem to get through to you.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Child please
Fedor is probably the last man who will rank #1 outside of the UFC ever again.
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
and you're using the same silly argument.
UFC belt <> #1 ranking.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 2:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Werdum did get from the UFC after going 2-2
just saying
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
That Werdum has no business being ranked #1 by any but the most diehard fedor worshipers…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
Contributor for WatchKalibRun.com
Still Subo at Fightlinker.com
by Derek Suboticki on Oct 1, 2010 8:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I think I just made it
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
Unfortunately for both of you
Those are not arguments. I think you guys should enroll in a logic class, and im not trying to be an assclown when I say that.
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I have to say I agree. I can’t see how anyone in their right mind can pick any of these fights over Lesnar – Velasquez, if you’re going to be completely honest about this poll. None of the others even come close! It’s not even up for debate IMO. Seriously, who are the 13 people that picked Kaufman – Coenen? What’s wrong with you? Come on! BROCKTOBERRR!!!!! BROCKLESNAR!!!!!
Looking forward to Diaz – Noons 2 also, hoping KJ humbles Diaz again. Hardy – Condit and Huerta – Alvarez are probably also going to be good and entertaining. The rest I could live without though.
by Horselover Fat on Oct 1, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
I picked Noons-Diaz
Though I suspect in the end I’ll be more excited for Brock-Cain. Seems too obvious though. I think Noons-Diaz has the potential to be a great, nasty fight.
Tatum: I think he's a good man. I like him. I got nothing against him, but I'm definitely gonna make orphans of his children.
I like them all. But of course i had to vote for Brock/Cain. Brock is the fuckin’ man. He’s the only champion where I don’t just automatically root for the underdog. Althoough if Cain wins, I will surely be looking forward to Cain-uary, or maybe it will be in Cain-pril if he needs a bit more time.
a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon
second most looking forward to is Shields/Kampmann. l love Shields, I use his takedown-based style of BJJ in my training
a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon
by eastcoastatlas on Oct 1, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I have long wondered
Why the vast majority of bjj camps have been unwilling to add wrestling-based techniques, particularly with regards to takedowns.
Makes me wonder where Ryan Gracie (RIP) learned his moves…
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
well, considering I just got my but whooped at my first tournament even though i was tossing people all over the place, and then watched a 160pound brown belt from my gym who i routinely take down proceed to completely tool 205pound former 3time MD state wrestling champ who spent the last 4years in the Marines and became a purple belt in 2 years, i can see why they don’t think its necessary.
that being said, there so many philosophies that can work, including a wrestling based plan like Jake Shields; it just takes the right combination of athleticism brains to make it so.
a life: it's the shit that happens while you're waiting for moments that never come -Lester Freamon
by eastcoastatlas on Oct 1, 2010 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions
There is much truth in that, and imo bjj is still the best discipline IF you are going to restrict yourself to one system.
However, at the highest levels of mma, high level wrestling is a requirement for future success.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I really am excited for 120
crazy right? Condit/Hardy, Sexy/bisping, and Hathaway is really exiting to watch.
Yeah this card is getting hated on just for being in the UK.
Anyone with some sense looks at the card and acknowledges there are good fights
by destructivist on Oct 1, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Forgot about
Hathaway being on there…there may be a lack of so-called “star power” but this is shaping up as having some very good fights.
"Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it."
-Mark Twain
"If I tell you I'm good, you would probably think I'm boasting. If I tell you I'm no good, you know I'm lying..."
-Bruce Lee
by The American Ronin on Oct 1, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow the Lesnar hype train is working overtime
It’s not that I’m not looking forward to BROCK vs CAIN but I’m surprised that Hardy vs Condit only got 9% so far. Im far more excited to see Hardy-Condit than CAIN-Lesnar.
I’m hoping that CAIN can man handle Lesnar though…
“Manhandle” would not be an intelligent strategy
When some wild-eyed, eight-foot-tall maniac grabs your neck, taps the back of your favorite head up against the barroom wall, and he looks you crooked in the eye and he asks you if ya paid your dues, you just stare that big sucker right back in the eye, and you remember what ol' Jack Burton always says at a time like that: "Have ya paid your dues, Jack?" "Yessir, the check is in the mail." - Jack Burton
by donkeypunch on Oct 1, 2010 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
this post is as boring as jake shields.
by Hendo_One-Shot on Oct 1, 2010 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Might be boring.
But he wins fights. Ask your boy Dan.
Diaz vs. Noons? Really? Over Condit/Hardy? Laughable man, laughable…
What's this war in the heart of nature? Why does nature vie with itself? The land contend with the sea? Is there an avenging power in nature? Not one power, but two?
by Kwisatz Haderach on Oct 1, 2010 5:09 PM EDT reply actions
My List.
1 – Dan Hardy vs. Carlos Condit
2 – Sarah Kaufman vs. Marloes Coenen
3 – Eddie Alvarez vs. Roger Huerta
4 – Lesnar vs. Velasquez
I’m excited for the others as well, but these are the ones that I really want to see. In the order of the ones I’d choose if I had to make a choice between them. October is shaping up to be a good month of fights however you look at it.
I can't wait!
Lesnar vs Velasquez: The fall of Lesnar
Coming this fall on PPV.
I'm a lover not a fighter
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