How the Washington Post's Top Sports Writer Saw UFC Fight Night 20
by Kid Nate on Jan 13, 2010 12:51 PM EST
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Dan Steinberg, the big dog and the top blogger at the Washington Post's sports dept wrote a column on UFN 20. His chief take aways: the limited demographic appeal of the UFC:
I suggested to play-by-play guy Joe Rogan that the demographic seemed to be 30ish white dudes.
"But that's the people that come to the live events," he said. "I think there's a lot of people that are apprehensive about coming to it live, people who might be closet MMA fans, enjoy it at home, but . . . "
By this point, some 30ish white dudes were screaming at Rogan for a photo.
His other main concern was the perceived brutality of the arm bar that beat Efrain Escudero:
This friendly chap named Evan Dunham defeated Efrain Escudero with a third-round arm bar. Dunham said he knew he had it won by the vibrations he could feel in Escudero's arm; "when I was cranking on it, it went POP, POP, POP," he explained. "When I felt it start giving a little bit, I knew I had something there."
I later followed up with Dunham, and he seemed almost apologetic about the pop, pop, popping.
All in all, a pretty mixed bag.
Why do we care? Simple. Guys like Dan Steinberg still set the sports news agenda for the corporate media. I honestly think it will require generational change for MMA to really become a part of the main fabric of American sporting culture. And we've got many hurdles to clear to get there.
The UFC has accomplished incredible things in getting us this far, but the whole edifice could easily come crumbling down. Imagine a perfect storm of steroid scandals, an in-cage death on prime time network television, a business scandal of some kind -- if the wrong combination hit all at once, MMA in the U.S.A. could be kaput very quickly.
UPDATE (by Kid Nate): Beau Dure of USA TODAY points out in the comments that Steinberg's online column is a bit more even handed than the print-only version I linked to above. Also, Steinberg is younger than me, so the generational change point becomes a little problematic, but the reality is, MMA is new to Steinberg, not something he grew up with and understands. He's open to it and providing very even handed coverage -- and he's not a johnny-come-lately either, as his great feature on UWC champ Mike Easton shows.
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Chap? Pop, pop, popping?
His writing style is grating.
That being said, seems pretty even-keeled. It gets a lot worse than this, but I yearn for the days that columnists are more accepting of our sport, without much regard for who’s sitting behind them while they observe it.
Blackout612- "Wuts teh UFC?"
Ubernoober- "It like two guy who just stand and swing for fence and try to knock each other shit out it awesome"
Really? Because depending on the story, I’d say that the breakdown of the fanbase, old, young, white, black, rich, poor, male, female, etc might be taken into account by a skeptical neophyte trying to determine whether it’s worth caring about, or whether it will remain a fad or niche that they can ignore.
I liken it to NASCAR or Soccer. Most people have preconceived notions of the people who follow those sports, but once a critical mass of mainstream acceptance is hit, you’ll see sports fans actively TRYING to be knowledgeable and conversant in it, so that they won’t be left out of the discussion.
What does what I said have to do with the reception to his writing?
Or do you always like to argue arbitrarily? My point is that local writers often go this “look, a bunch of white guys” route in their morning-after columns after an MMA event. While MMA fans in the US are predominantly white, let’s face it— the peak of MMA’s existence came in Japan. Where there are Japanese people. This isn’t nearly akin to NASCAR and such claims are for shock value alone. The group that I regularly watch MMA with (and this is purely a for-instance) is almost completely composed of minorities; they’re penetrating a lot more markets than something like NASCAR ever can. This sort of talk will die down with time and I can’t wait for that day— that’s my assertion.
Blackout612- "Wuts teh UFC?"
Ubernoober- "It like two guy who just stand and swing for fence and try to knock each other shit out it awesome"
Yeah, of my buddies that watch MMA, only one is white. Most of my white friends stick to soccer or hockey. Of course, this is all just anecdotal evidence, but still. I think MMA is making headway especially when you have an organization like the UFC where its current champions are so diverse.
I love me some Sexyama!
Out of curiosity
How do people see soccer fans in the us?
"You hit too hard, too hard, too hard..."
by spectaa on Jan 13, 2010 1:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Somewhat diverse, mostly because of the large Hispanic contingent.
Dominant chant at RFK: Vamooooos, vamos Uniiiited ….
MLS is still grassroots, but growing slowly. Mexican/latin fans in the Bay Area will turn out 50-60,000 for an exhibition game with a European or Latin team, but still have no clue when the MLS Cup is on or who is playing. Maybe that will change if the Earthquakes can get a stadium and stop playing on a college field.
Dan Steinberg is one of the best reporter/bloggers online, check out his coverage from the Beijing Olympics if you want a sample. I think MMA fans and media can learn from mainstream coverage that goes beyond the cage fighting aspect.
It is funny to hear Steinberg described as the “big dog” at the Washington Post, he is still rather young. But he got where he is based on solid local sports coverage, and as an early adopter online with his “bog” and his old online show with Jamie Mottram.
Dead!!!
A majority of newspapers in this country are DEAD!!! Who cares what this guy writes? The majority of people I know, go online to whatever website they choose and get their news. I believe the major issue holding back MMA is the fact that the UFC does not have a network television deal like the other major sports do in USA. The Washington Post is known in DC to be a “Conservative” newspaper anyways, so it’s demographic is very limited (Caucasian + Old). I get my news from the BE!!!!
by JONBONESJONES79 on Jan 13, 2010 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
Sorry
You’re right!!! It still doesn’t change my opinion on newspapers as a whole. It’s just a fact of life that some things change as technology advances.
by JONBONESJONES79 on Jan 13, 2010 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
Steinberg is a blogger first and foremost
most of his audience is online
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Foreigners.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
by Richard Wade on Jan 13, 2010 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
How they ran their promotion in general...
late bookings, drug testing, AND an unsubstantiaed association with the Mafia.
Basically, the rumor of Yakuza association was enough to push the promotion over the edge.
by Razreshat on Jan 13, 2010 1:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Washington Post
should be more concerned about their falling circulations and the quality of their paper.
They actually had plans to broker deals with lobbyists and government officials. That’s more troubling IMO.
They are a dying source of media. Newspapers are dying out, blogs are the new sources for news among the younger generation, so I don’t think it would affect the potential fanbase for MMA, but it could hurt politically since they have political ties like you said.
Pain is Temporary
Pride is Forever
Which is a shame
I do enjoy print media over a computer screen in many cases. Especially when I’m on the throne.
by Tommy from the Power Rangers on Jan 13, 2010 1:20 PM EST up reply actions
As someone who works at a paper, it is really just the national newspapers that seem to be struggling. A lot of regional newspapers are doing fine, because they have the news that is harder to find.
The other frustrating thing is they can’t figure out how to get advertising. Mine doesn’t seem to be actively seeking sponsors for the online media, even though we put up a lot of stuff that only goes to web. Once they can figure out how to get the same kind of money from online ads as print ads, they should be fine.
by Swordslasher on Jan 13, 2010 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
except they won't
there’s tons of money in online ads but most of it goes to Google.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
MMA & mainstream media
" I honestly think it will require generational change for MMA to really become a part of the main fabric of American sporting culture"
I agree 100 % with this statement. Its going to take time due to the fact that the future sports writers and editors of mainstream media outlets 20 years from now will have worked in a world where MMA is part of the sport culture.
There will eventually be a time where the members of the sports media do not know a world where MMA has not existed.
MMA needs that turn over to breakthrough the next hurdle.Writers currently in their 20’s who replace people like Steinberg, who because of no fault of his own never grew up with MMA.
The UFC is still less than 16 years old, with mainstream media coverage only starting to get any traction in just the last 3 to 4 years tops.
Follow me on Twitter http://twitter.com/ultmma
http://www.ultmma.com
I disagree 300%
This is the age of Youtube, Facebook and Kimbo Slice— radio is hardly viable, magazines are dying, people are reading books on fucking tablets, Conan O’Brien is about to leave NBC and people no longer need a newspaper to them what to love and hate. Mainstream media is gradually becoming a less relevant term.
Blackout612- "Wuts teh UFC?"
Ubernoober- "It like two guy who just stand and swing for fence and try to knock each other shit out it awesome"
I would say that what makes up mainstream media is changing...
but the concept of a mainstream media will likely never go away, simply transform from newspapers to T.V. and internet sources.
I meant that the traditional idea of mainstream media is changing and that new media possibly won’t have the same worldly importance as the reliance on the local paper once did.
Blackout612- "Wuts teh UFC?"
Ubernoober- "It like two guy who just stand and swing for fence and try to knock each other shit out it awesome"
I think you already see this
Guys like Colin Cowherd and Jim Rome talk some MMA…I still think the media gods keep it to a minimum and it still isn’t football, but I remember Colin Cowherd ranting 3 years ago about it was absurd the NY Times covered womens college basketball, but not the UFC.
by SES 84 on Jan 13, 2010 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Strange thing is that a lot of you are talking about Dan as if he’s a dinosaur print media guy. He’s not. He’s younger than I am, and he set the standard for newspaper-site blogging. Ask any prominent general-sports blogger in the country.
I’d suggest reading the rest of his piece before turning this into a discussion of the Post’s failures and successes, about which we’d all have our own opinions.
This isn't intended to come off as ageist, racist, or anything like that...
However, 30 something white males usually have a statistically above average income, and a proportionally higher amount of disposable income. That combined with the cost of your average UFC event and the usual suspect locations leads to a extremely different demo at the event than watching it on TV.
You see the same thing in the NFL, yet no one is playing the 30 something white male card.
Associate Writer - WindyCityGridiron.com
I wish I had an above average income
by woomikee on Jan 13, 2010 3:19 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Really? Those are the impressions he took away from the event? Definately sounds like he was forced to be there and refused to pay much attention the whole time.
He might just not be well-versed technically to be able to articulate what he saw. Would have been notice if he’d mentioned that Rashad Evans is black as a counterpoint to the white-demographic talking point, but at the same time he makes Evans come off as much more of a role model than Gilbert Arenas.
I suggested to play-by-play guy Joe Rogan that the demographic seemed to be 30ish white dudes.
“But that’s the people that come to the live events,” he said. "I think there’s a lot of people that are apprehensive about coming to it live, people who might be closet MMA fans, enjoy it at home, but . . . "
By this point, some 30ish white dudes were screaming at Rogan for a photo.
That’s…not a contradiction.
I like how having 30ish white dudes as a fan-base is perceived as a bad thing. Like we can’t have a sport of our own or if we do, it must not be legit.
Is he suggesting that w/o a strong ethnic fan-base, then MMA is not a real sport? If so, this is really a antiquated Bob Arum way of thinking.
"It would appear that the strain was more than he could bear".- Doc Holliday
I didn't look at the Steinberg comment as a racist one
But at how MMA, in general, doesn’t have a fanbase of all ages (Relative to other sports like baseball, hockey, football, etc.)
by Tommy from the Power Rangers on Jan 13, 2010 2:50 PM EST up reply actions
That’s all well and good but if this was his main point then he should have left the “white guy” comment out of it.
Also, 50+ males just aren’t going to go for MMA, no matter what anyone does. MMA should not be held accountable for the obvious generation gap. Old fogies will not be converted, they will simply die off and be replaced in 20 years by the 30 somethings of today.
"It would appear that the strain was more than he could bear".- Doc Holliday
by MyFistYourFace on Jan 13, 2010 4:49 PM EST up reply actions
Just realized something — Nate linked to a condensed version of Dan’s post that must have been what they excerpted for print.
His full post has a lot more detail about the card, and the race element everyone’s picking up on here is a small part of it:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/dcsportsbog/2010/01/rashad_evans_and_ufc_in_dc.html#more
by Beau Dure on Jan 13, 2010 2:52 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Thanks for the link.
A worthwhile and (I think) pretty fair write-up of his experience at the event.
So the editor cherry picked the race stuff? maybe there is an issue there? I will read it now, thanks. Maybe the editor is showing bias and Dan’s piece is more even handed, ether way its still not that bad. A mixed bag, like Nate puts it.
Some people think I am a dumb, ugly human being, but really I am a beautiful ape, with exceptional verbal skills.
You nailed it, it's going to take a generational change....
These 30ish white guys, are going to have to score the big newspaper writing jobs before MMA gets a fair shake across the board. Guys in their 50’s and late 40’s just don’t understand the sport, all they see is the brutality, and in the back of their minds, all they can think about is how their favorite boxer from their childhood would mop the floor with these guys.
Totally agree...
What bothers me most is the ‘white male’ factor. It seems like that is a bad thing in this guys opinion. When 75% of America is white (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States) wouldn’t you generally assume that most people would be white? I know that we are all assumed to be racist rednecks (especially us southerners) but it just isn’t true. If I had a business I would be perfectly happy to have whites as customers, as well as every race in the world. The only color that matters in the business world is green. I just resent the assumption.
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