Satoshi Ishii: Once Again Japanese MMA Rushes a Top Prospect
The bad news keeps coming for Japanese MMA. Satoshi Ishii, the 2008 Olympic Gold Medalist in Judo was heavily recruited by Japan's struggling MMA promotions this year. But a disappointing decision loss to the aging Hidehiko Yoshida might be a fatal set back for those hoping Ishii will become a new breakout star.
And Japanese MMA is desperate for new stars.
About a year ago, when the UFC was trying to sign Ishii, Dana White told MMA Weekly that in the long run Ishii would be better off in the UFC:
"I don't believe in the Japanese philosophy, let's throw him in there and get him (expletive) murdered like Sakuraba," he spat. "You know, the whole guts and glory thing over in Japan. I believe in taking a kid, putting him in the right weight class, moving him up, and taking time.
"If he does it the right way with us, he'll be a superstar in Japan. It's a much better deal for him than going in and getting executed by guys who have been fighting for a long time...because they need to make a fight right now so they can survive. See, Dream-needs him. I don't. I want him."
Our own Chris Nelson wrote at the time Ishii's debut match against Yoshida was announced for Sengoku's ill-fated New Year's Eve show:
That WVR has abandoned its generally metered approach to building its prospects in favor of making Ishii's debut a guaranteed attraction is interesting, especially when coupled with the fact that PR director Takahiro Kokuho also mentioned that Sengoku could undergo a name change beginning with the New Year show. Rumors have swirled since the promotion's inception last year regarding possible deals with big time Japanese networks such as Fuji TV, but nothing has come to fruition. (Sengoku is currently partnered with TV Tokyo, the smallest of the Tokyo stations, though that deal is said to expire soon.) The signing of Ishii was thought to be a significant step toward acquiring a major broadcast deal, or possibly an indication that a deal was already in the works - could an announcement finally be on the horizon?
So basically, Ishii went for the more money now deal with World Victory Road/Sengoku after turning down DREAM and then rejecting the UFC. But because WVR was desperate for a marquee bout that could get them on network TV in Japan they rushed Ishii in against the very game Yoshida rather than letting him develop naturally against weaker competition.
But then, after the match was booked, WVR's NYE show collapsed and Ishii found himself fighting for K-1/DREAM at their annual NYE Dynamite!! show. Now he's damaged goods and Japanese MMA won't see as compelling a prospect for many years.
UPDATE (by Kid Nate): D.W. of Head Kick Legend adds the following insight in the comments:
In this case it wasn’t WVR or FEG that ruined him, WVR actually wanted to protect Ishii and nurture his career, this was 1,000% bad management. His management dropped the ball every step of the way, from the fake bidding war with Ishii going to the pres decked out in each promotion’s gear and acting like he would sign with them to his incredibly delayed decision to finally sign with WVR.
The media buzz for Ishii at Dynamite!! was really quite quiet, actually. NYE in Japan has always been about getting the fair-weather male and female demographic, which a heart throb like Masato (I wish I was kidding) retiring at age 30 with his looks and reputation still in tact did. Without Masato’s retirement I doubt that 45,000 fans would be a reality or whatever the television ratings turn out to be.
Ishii’s management killed his buzz in Japan. Nobody in Japan is talking about Satoshi Ishii. That is very, very bad. Hell, FEG has reprimanded Aoki and people are talking about that, people are talking about Fujita’s concussion and how tough Overeem is, but nobody is saying anything about Ishii.
Once you lose the Japanese imagination and attention, you are kinda screwed.
Also don't miss his coverage of the business implications of the very successful Dynamite!! 2009 show for Japanese MMA.
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Shame
It’s a shame he had to take the greedy way. He probably could’ve earned a lot more had he been patient. Think maybe theirs hope for him?
There's still hope.
He just needs a solid team. His world tour training approach was what did him in. That and the cement block that Yoshida threw at his dome.
Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade
His prospects as legitimate fighter have not changed, I think more so the public perception of him in Japan has changed, and now he’s going to have to work that much harder to earn the respect of the fans. At least that’s what I gather from the article.
I thought losses in MMA to good competition weren’t the deathblow to a fighter’s career? You know, the way it is in boxing…
Ricky Hatton came closer to beating Manny Pacquiao than Marquez did to beating Floyd.
-SC
by The Lethal Haze on Jan 1, 2010 11:28 AM EST reply actions
That is to say in boxing, having a zero in the loss column and 20 wins against bums seems to be alot more important than losses to quality opponents…
Ricky Hatton came closer to beating Manny Pacquiao than Marquez did to beating Floyd.
-SC
by The Lethal Haze on Jan 1, 2010 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
It’s not a death blow to his career, but it is will certainly tarnish his reputation as a uber-prospect. Now, instead of being seen as one of the best prospects in the sport, he will be seen as a guy who still has great potential, but is way too raw to be considered a great prospect.
Nobody is giving up on him, but a lot of folks just bumped him down a peg from exciting prospect to raw project.
Japan has a rich history of throwing prospects to the wolves.
Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade
Explain how Yoshida is a wolf? Before the event he was old and washed up, after the event he is a wolf. Where’s the logic?
He is a helluva debut match
Had he been Ishii’s 3rd or 4th fight it would’ve been ideal.
It wasn’t a criminal mismatch or anything since Yoshida’s so far past his peak, but you want Ishii to debut with a win, no ifs ands or buts.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jan 1, 2010 11:55 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Here's the thing
In this case it wasn’t WVR or FEG that ruined him, WVR actually wanted to protect Ishii and nurture his career, this was 1,000% bad management. His management dropped the ball every step of the way, from the fake bidding war with Ishii going to the pres decked out in each promotion’s gear and acting like he would sign with them to his incredibly delayed decision to finally sign with WVR.
The media buzz for Ishii at Dynamite!! was really quite quiet, actually. NYE in Japan has always been about getting the fair-weather male and female demographic, which a heart throb like Masato (I wish I was kidding) retiring at age 30 with his looks and reputation still in tact did. Without Masato’s retirement I doubt that 45,000 fans would be a reality or whatever the television ratings turn out to be.
Ishii’s management killed his buzz in Japan. Nobody in Japan is talking about Satoshi Ishii. That is very, very bad. Hell, FEG has reprimanded Aoki and people are talking about that, people are talking about Fujita’s concussion and how tough Overeem is, but nobody is saying anything about Ishii.
Once you lose the Japanese imagination and attention, you are kinda screwed.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
by Dave Walsh on Jan 1, 2010 11:37 AM EST reply actions 5 recs
That's one of the things that bugged me about this match...
With their Gold Cup projects and focus of sport over spectacle, you would think that WVR would be the major Japanese org that would be protecting him. Guess not.
Do you think it would be fair to say that they felt Ishii was a gamble on survival? Clearly there were questions of WVR’s survival even before WVR cancelled its NYE show. Maybe they were rolling the dice, a la EliteXC and Kimbo. It seems to never work out well.
From what I've heard from shows like the Jordan Breen show and read on forums...
he was supposed to debut earlier be they kept pushing his debut back because his handlers didn’t like the lack of progression in his MMA skill set. So yeah, absolute gamble.
It’s unfortunate really. By his performances in the second and third rounds, you could see he was getting way more comfortable in the ring. I still believe guy could actually be something good if he was groomed correctly.
There was a gamble involved in him.
They wanted to slow-build him an wanted to stay away from promoting giant shows like NYE. They knew it was a death sentence, but when Ishii’s management wanted his debut against Yoshida they knew they had something big on their hands.
Then their sponsors pushed for NYE and then, guess what? Nobody bought tickets and we ended up with it 3 fights down the card and Masato saved the show.
Head Kick Legend
Twitter @HeadKickLegend
He won the fight
I don’t think ishii takes a hit from this because he won the fight. Bad judging and a point deduct robbed him of the win.
Does anyone think Nate Marquart took a step back when he lost to Leites in a similar fashion?
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on Jan 1, 2010 11:38 AM EST via mobile reply actions
He won that fight?
Ishii vs Yoshida is nothing like Leites vs. Marquardt. Ishii was beaten convincingly.
Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade
How do you think he won the fight?
I can see thinking it was a draw, but him winning outright despite the point deduction? I don’t see that at all.
Personally I had it 10-8, 9-9, 9-10 for old man Yoshida. He put a serious ass kicking on Ishii in that first round. If the fight had been under old Pride rules, there would be no doubt who won, point deduction or not.
Ishii handily won 2 of the 3 rounds. Hence i thought he should have won the fight.
Unintentional groin knees are always point deducts?
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on Jan 1, 2010 12:06 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It depends on what you give Yoshida the first round IMO
My card:
First RD easily could’ve been 10-8
Second RD 9-9 because of the point deduction
Third 10-9 Ishii
With a 10-9 Yoshida first round my card would be a draw….which of course would lead to the ridiculous “must point” system they had in WVR which they would maybe give the fight to Ishii.
Very true. I’m increasingly turned off by matchmaking at the big Japanese shows.
Ishii/Yoshida: shouldn’t have happened, for reasons outlined above.
Mousasi/Goodridge: shouldn’t have happened. One of the best pound for pound fighters in the world against a 43 year old out of shape Goodridge? That’s not sport.
Overeem/Fujita: Same. And look what happened, they had to take Fujita out on a stretcher. No excuse for this crap. The fans and the fighters deserve better.
Minowa/Sokoudjou: This reeked of something being wrong. Was Sokoudjou’s knee completely destroyed? Should he have been in the ring that night, or was he desperate to try and get a tournament winner’s payday? A healthy, prepared Sokoudjou would smash Minowa. It was clear Soko didn’t want to be in there and this fight was weird and depressing.
Sefo/Nishijima: this didn’t sit well with me either. An out of shape, 3-days notice Sefo beating a helpless boxer to a pulp. I thought we saw enough when Nishijima got plastered around the ring by Mark Hunt.
And then Aoki/Hirota, the matchmaking was fine but the outcome ended up being icing on the cake as far as turning this show into a tasteless display at the expense of MMA’s image. It shouldn’t look like this. Sengoku had seemed to focus more on sport than spectacle, which I appreciated. I’m guessing that’s over…
www.tapology.com | twitter @tapology
by GregS123 on Jan 1, 2010 11:38 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Yeah.
I’m kind of surprised that there isn’t more of an uproar over Fujita’s injury.
Before the event, EVERYONE knew that they were endangering the health of Fujita and Goodridge by putting the in the ring with guys who were WAY out of their league. Well, lo and behold, one of those washed up old dudes got seriously hurt and no one is asking FEG/SRC any hard questions about their matchmaking and it’s implications for fighter safety.
IMO, that should be one of the major stories coming out of Dynamite 2009. That kind of matchmaking is a disgrace and is liable to eventually lead to one of these washed up old fighters getting seriously hurt.
by Steve4192 on Jan 1, 2010 11:48 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
those things are never a story...
People are always too busy crying about something Dana did to ever give fair attention to things that deserve it. It is part of the UFC-Against the world Phenomenon; it isn’t necessarily on purpose, but promotions aside from the UFC are given passes for things like this all the time.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
This doesn’t have any sense at all. Before the event most picked Ishii to win the fight (even the author of this article) saying that Yoshida is old. After he proved he isn’t ready yet and lost the same people are saying how the promotion rushed him. Laughable.
picking Ishii to win
doesn’t mean it was the perfect debut fight for him. He showed in the 3rd round that he can hang with Yoshida. But I have no doubt in my mind that if he’d had 3 or 4 warm up fights first, he’d have beaten Yoshida soundly.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Once again, it was a gift fight for him. He, his management and all media thought there wouldn’t be any problem for him in this bout and that he’ll obliterate Yoshida. If he would train properly and not buy his own hype he would have won. Yet he did and lost. If one is to blame for it it’s Ishii’s management and he himself, not the evil matchmakers.
Management should be looking out for their fighter’s career.
Matchmaker should be looking out for their long-term ability to promote fights and build a business.
Arguably both groups dropped the ball…
www.tapology.com | twitter @tapology
by GregS123 on Jan 1, 2010 12:07 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I think Ishii trained well for most opponents – but not well for Yoshida. The judo trips weren’t effective at all, because Yoshida had the good, solid instinctual base to defend against them.
Yoshida also did slightly better in the clinch with the punching and really did damage with his knees to the head – which Ishii wasn’t defending against.
Basically, Ishii needs to train his clinch more and boxing. I’d like to see him work in lots of practice on his shoot, but that’s secondary to the MT. Still has a good chance of being someone exciting to watch.
Ribbit.
Unless Ishii just can’t take a punch at all, he should be able to beat Yoshida handily.
-Kid Nate, Dynamite!! 2009 Staff Predictions
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
Are you saying he's totally right?
Because Ishii did not react well to being hit. At all.
"Someone is WRONG on the internet. What do you want me to do? LEAVE? Then they'll keep being wrong!"
-Randall Munroe
by pdl on Jan 1, 2010 3:22 PM EST up reply actions
If people are gonna talk about it, I felt the quote should be up, so everybody is on the same page. And technically, there was a little bit before that.
Yoshida is old.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
In the end of the day he’ll be just fine if he sits in one place and trains properly. It’s not that this lose ruined his career or anything like that. A lose to a legend isn’t hurting that bad especially in Japan. A cold shower is good for Ishii and his handlers.
Personally I’m happy for Yoshida. I was rooting for him especially after Ishii was talking how he want to punch Hidehiko, his senior, in the face. Only big talk, kiddo.
I guess there’s always TUF :/
Keep firing Assholes!
Editor of www.downsyndromematuremidgetsheltlandponyporn.com/
Does anyone believe that the UFC
Would have done anything different with ishii?
Who on the UFC roster is lesser than Yoshida at this point?
More likely the UFC would have sent this guy back to Japan 0-2 or 0-3 and Dana White would use it as a reason why Japaneese MMA is irrelevant.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
by aaronb on Jan 1, 2010 12:23 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Yes, I think they would have.
They would have put him up against someone like Mostapha Al-turk or Denis Stojnić. They might have even gone out and got a no name upstart for him to take on.
Walking the line between intelligence and ignorance since 1985
@deowade
They might have even gone out and got a no name upstart for him to take on.
Commonly known as the ‘Huerta Treatment’. The UFC gave him five Octagon virgins in a row before finally testing him against a veteran.
Given how badly Zuffa wants to break into the Japanese market and how important Ishii would have been to those plans, I have little doubt that he would have received the Huerta treatment.
I don’t think he’s ruined. I think he just needs to stick with one camp. That’s all it is for him.
Twitter: @FlyByKnite
The Ishii v Yoshida fight was the most boring fight on the card too. Classic “2 Wrestlers Punching Each Other” fight.
by Polyh3dron on Jan 1, 2010 1:06 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Ah yes a new year and the MMA blogosphere finds new double standards to apply to Japanese MMA.
It’s funny that everyone is all over this but no one has explained how this is any different Brock Lesnar’s first fight in the UFC and second fight ever was against the former UFC champion. Was Brock given a “fatal set back?”
Brock is just a freak. It’s pretty much him and BJ Penn who have shown up that readu to go at high level.
Keep firing Assholes!
Editor of www.downsyndromematuremidgetsheltlandponyporn.com/
Lots of people bitched about Brock being rushed.
They stopped bitching when he started smashing people.
If Ishii starts smashing people, they will stop talking about him being rushed too.
by Steve4192 on Jan 1, 2010 2:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

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