The Case for Watching Tape on Opposition in Professional MMA
by Luke Thomas on Sep 1, 2009 12:36 PM EDT
in MMA News
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Jordan Breen makes itIt's not that the counter itself was special. It is that Marquardt focused on a specific technical flaw in his opponent, and the instant it appeared, he sent him flying at the canvas forehead-first. Yet for as obvious and effective as this kind of hyper-specific stratagem seems, it is a rarity in this game. Even with major money now at stake, MMA is still a sport where lines like "It's a fight" and "We'll see where it goes" are familiar phraseology.
Just a few months back, Josh Koscheck commented that he never watches his opponents before he fights them and almost seemed to brag that he had no idea what Paulo Thiago looked like. I imagine he might have liked to have at least a gander at some fight tape now. Likewise, talented middleweight Dan Miller admits to not watching his opponents beforehand, but after being completely dominated by a one-dimensional Chael Sonnen for 15 minutes, hopefully he realizes that a bit of time watching tape may have helped him find an opening for a submission against a fighter far less skilled in that department than himself.
Part of the reason these attitudes persist is that MMA is still reliant on crippling generalities. We still discuss the sport in terms of "strikers" and "grapplers" and throw out adjectives like "unorthodox" and "world-class" without much thought to individual skills and technique. However, it isn't 1999 anymore, and fighters have become generally, if not perfectly, well rounded. In 2009, these oversimplifications are lies, as fights are more often won and lost on the very specific and unique wrinkles -- both positive and negative -- in a fighter's game.
The amount of phony generalization one hears from high-level, accomplished (if fatally flawed) fighters is astounding and the repudiation of studying opposition often seems positively correlated when those attitudes are present.
The reality is that watching tape to prepare for a fight against a highly skilled, modern professional MMA fighter is no guarantee of success. It's also true that fighters who eschew watching tape often find their "fight my fight, not his fight" attitude is enough to gut through whatever challenges are presented from a lack of preparation. And I understand fighters who personally elect to not watch footage on their opponents for psychological reasons, yet still leave that responsibility to trainers.
However, one has to dig deep in the bag of denial to suggest becoming familiar with the habits, eccentricities, instincts, mistakes and decision-making tendencies of opposition prior to a fight isn't, on balance, helpful. Look no further than any other professional, mainstream sport. There isn't an accomplished team in football, basketball, baseball or hockey that dismisses the idea of watching tape of upcoming teams they have to play as unhelpful. Who views the tape or how much tape is viewed or even for what purposes likely changes from coach to coach and team to team, but the lesson is the same: knowing thy enemy helps a competitor make more informed choices.
Informed choices aren't always correct choices, but they are surely a better insurance policy than anything ad hoc.
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Before the Babalu fight… Gegard Mousasi said that he doesn’t like to watch tape of his opponents because it gives them too much respect.
Instead he has his training team watch them and let him know what to exploit, etc.
I wonder how many other fighters do it this way?
Gegard Mousasi said that he doesn’t like to watch tape of his opponents because it gives them too much respect.
Honestly, I take the opposite view: not watching tape of one’s opponent doesn’t give them enough respect.
I love me some Sexyama!
Agree completely,
what happens if your trainers miss something that possibly ends up costing you the fight? If it was my career, I would take every possible advantage afforded me.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
True, but it would seem
very foolhardy to place all of your potential chance for success in the hands of your trainers without checking your opponent out for yourself. Much like having accountants to handle your finances w/o you checking their work typically never ends well.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
I'm not a proffesional fighter
so it’s all speculative, but I would imagine at least a cursory review of an opponent’s tendencies would help. Of course, when what you expected to see doesn’t materialize, that’s when a fighter can get into trouble.
Old habits can die hard though, and how many fights does a person go through without the benefit of tape review before reaching “the big show?” Trying to convince a guy who has been in dozens of fights that NOW he needs to start watching tape can be a tough sell, I would think.
I'm a control freak...
when it comes to my work, money, etc. I like to know what is going on, where things might go, what the negatives are vs the positives, etc. If I were a fighter, I can’t even comprehend not watching tape on my opponent. It’s just about good preparation, IMO. I don’t know if it’s ego or what, but I just don’t get this whole, “I never watch tape” and “feel it out” kind of mentality. I don’t expect GSP/Jackson level of game planning all the time from every fighter, but to not even watch tape seems like folly to me. You gotta figure at the elite level, where there is so much money at stake, a person would be smart to try to utilize anything that would give them an edge up on the competition. (anything legal, of course. haha).
I love me some Sexyama!
Unreal
High School kids have been watching game film of the opposition since the 60s/70s…and there are still some pro athletes that don’t?
BOOSH
Seriously
I coach a modified football team, and we are already watching tape of the team we play our first game…the tape of that team is from LAST YEAR!!
Obviously things are always going to be different from year to year, fight to fight, but at the same time, just like in every sport, there are will always be something to learn from watching tape.
To say that you can’t learn anything from watching a few fights of your opponent would just be ignorent
Recall Dan Henderson's response
when Joe asked his if he was surprised Bisping kept moving into his power.
“He does that in every fight.”
Henderson clearly watched some tape.
I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.
beat me to the punch, he said bisping circled right no matter what
by Austin Martin on Sep 1, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
my mistake
I meant into his right hand. Nice sn btw.
by Austin Martin on Sep 1, 2009 1:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Henderson was so confident in that fact that he literally beat Bisping with his eyes closed!
Dont get down on Forrest, no one has moves like Anderson Silva.
How could you not watch tape on fighters?
I don’t even fight professionally and all I do is watch the nuances and subtle things that fighters do during fights, it helps form predictions for virtual currency gains.
I can’t imagine actually fighting and not watching any footage of an opponent it seems to me like the same thing as being a race car driver and never studying the tracks you race on. Not a very good plan.
I liked how in Pride, the fighters ussually had no idea who they were going to fight so they didn’t study tape. I think it made for more interesting fights.
for all intents and purposes, just consider all my posts as works of satire.
Was it that both fighters didn’t they would be fighting each other, or just one of them didn’t know?
But yes, generally, I would like it if no one other than the main eventers knew who their opponent would be until fight night.
Sergio Non,
MMA writer, USA TODAY
http://mma.usatoday.com
It’s interesting… because this came up with the whole Ishida-Melendez fight.
I’m almost positive that PRIDE had favorites, and I wonder if some fighters knew way in advance who they were fighting, but the announcement wasn’t made official till a week or two before the event. Some fighters probably had no clue who they were fighting until that week or two, while others did.
But PRIDE also did this with both fighters, having no idea who they wanted to match with who.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Sep 1, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Keith Jardine needs to watch tape on Keith Jardine to prepare for every fight.
by mmalogic on Sep 1, 2009 1:35 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
Agreed.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Sep 1, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I would say this...
Having trainers watch tape on opponents, and then having them mimic or point out flaws should be done. At least then, you aren’t training with the thought of how dominating your opponent might be. Just train those flaws. Guys who don’t watch any tape at all can at least benefit from that.
Fighters that don’t do any of this… are at a disadvantage.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
And that’s the "at least’ case scenario.
Ideally, fighters should watch tape.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Sep 1, 2009 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
i see what you’re saying though, fighters may not want to watch footage of carwin/ duffee (even though i’ve never seen him) because they may focus on just how overwhelming those guys are instead of watching objectively for holes to exploit
by Austin Martin on Sep 1, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh i’m sorry, i forgot all fighters thought they were invincible and wouldnt be the slightest bit nervous about the fact that Carwin KOed Gonzaga standing with essentially a short jab.
by Austin Martin on Sep 1, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
They are professional athletes. If watching some tape is going to make you nervous or upset, you probably shouldn’t be stepping into a cage with them.
I think it’s more of a mental thing. They don’t want to see tape of their opponent crushing people. I’d say that’s a bit of a weak mind, but then again… I’m not them. I wouldn’t care.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Sep 1, 2009 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
"They don’t want to see tape of their opponent crushing people."
If this is true with anyone, it really speaks to that particular fighters weak-mindedness.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
a lot of it is ego. Like with baseball pitchers, its in your head. They get scouting reports and dont watch film of hitters knocking them out of the park. Dont want to start second guessing yourself… Rather then seeing your opponents weakness, it could easily be “Dont get caught with that over hand right” and youre thinking defensively.
Dont get down on Forrest, no one has moves like Anderson Silva.
I think for ground fighters its not quite as useful, but if you’re a striker, watching tapes of opponents is very very useful. Pretty much every fighter has their own little habits that can be expolited and for a striker the ability to recognise these flaws is a massive help. Dropping your other hand when you throw a punch, moving off the wrong foot, not keepign your chin tucked, being able to see these makes it way easier to land good shots
maybe not if their grappling evens out, but some people definately have holes in their ground game that can be exposed… like leaving arms open for armbars, shooting in incorrectly for a guillotine, not posturing correctly to avoid a triangle
by Austin Martin on Sep 1, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I have a feeling that almost all fighters watch tape on their opponents. All of these fighters who claim they never do are just trying to talk tough. Considering how much preparation goes into each fight, I couldn’t imagine not putting forth the effort to at least do a YouTube search. As much time as fighters spend lurking on the UG and Sherdog forums, they could easily hop over and find some footage.
(formerly TheFightJournal)
Not watching tapes on the guy you are fighting when ever possible is just stupid, I was very disapointed that the Miller Brothers didn’t and it cost both of them wins imo. You have to put in the work in the gym and in the video room if you want to be the best fighter you can be hopefully guys start catching on quickly for their sakes.
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