The Biggest Strawman in MMA
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 5:13 AM EDT
Email
PrintThere's something that I really have to get off my chest, and I think it has been mentioned on Bloody Elbow before.
Dana White is having an arguement with himself. He either thinks, or pretends to think, that he is having an argument with Emilianenko Fedor. But really, it's with himself.
Fedor is a [snorking] joke...
[He] turns down a huge deal and the opportunity to face the best in the world to fight nobodies, for no money. Fedor is a [crandlebarge]...
White consistently falls back on the arguement that Fedor is somehow ducking competition. That if he doesn't fight in the UFC, he isn't proving himself to be the best.
Fedor has nothing to prove at this point. He boasts one of the best recods in MMA. He decimated the Pride heavyweight division for a number of years, in a sport where we all know, everyone has a puncher's chance and anything can happen (see the Fedor fish dance in the Fujita fight for evidence of that.)
Fedor has beaten no less than five of the UFC's champions after they held their belts.
In his own words:
I don’t consider myself on top of the pedestal...
This is my job, and to be honest with you, if I didn’t have to work this job, I probably wouldn’t. It’s how I make my living. It’s even tough to accept this is what I do for the living.
Those are not the words of a fame and fortune-hungry young buck willing to test himself against any and all comers. Those are the words of a humble and comfortable man who happens to be very talented at fighting.
White needs to stop spinning the "Fedor is scared of the competition" line. It's tired, and it's wrong.
In all likeliness, I think the biggest factor in Dana not signing Fedor is Dana himself.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
190 comments
|
6 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
The problem a lot of people have is that Fedor is more businessman that fighter nowadays. When Dana tells him he can offer the opportunity to fight the best in the world 3 times a year, that’s not even a bargaining chip to Fedor. He could care less about stuff like that.
It’s all about what these promotions can do for M-1 Global, and that is so far from anything that I want to be a fan of. I think he deserves all the backlash he gets, and the fact that he is only fighting either fringe top ten guys from now on means he should be removed from any P4P discussion. And over the next couple years, he will slide down the HW rankings as well.
All so he could serve the interests of Vadime the sleaze and Jerry freaking Millen. It’s literaly one of the saddest stories in MMA.
by Razzel on Aug 5, 2009 5:22 AM EDT reply actions 4 recs
Strikeforce is also offering the same bargaining chip…..that being fight world class fighters 3 times a year. Overeem, Rogers, Monson and Werdum are all top 15 fighters in my opinion and probably in the opinion of most. I am sure Fedor is just as happy fighting them as he would be fighting Lesnar, Mir, Kongo and Carwin.
People seem to suggest that inside the UFC, the HWs are great and outside they are terrible. But in reality, there could be legitimate debate as to whether UFC or non-UFC fighters could offer Fedor his biggest 3 challenges. At the very least the options are comparable which renders the accusation that Fedor doesnt want to fight top fighters void.
the options are comparable?
No… they aren’t. Outside of the UFC Fedor could fight a few of those guys, if they are protected, and don’t lose from now, until they fight Fedor… In the UFC he would consistently be facing guys who have actually beaten other decent HW’s… Any combination of fighters that would face Fedor, would have at the very least beaten a few other decent UFC HW’s…
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
If they are protected?? How is that argument any more valid for Strikeforce than it is for the UFC?? Mir just lost so he cant fight Fedor, and if Brock is protected he might be able to face Fedor…..same with Carwin. He could fight fedor unless he loses. How on earth is your protection logic only relevant for SF??
Tell me how many top HWs in the UFC have more experience than Monson or Overeem? As good a winning record as Rogers or Barnett?
Im not badmouthing the UFC HWs but at the very least they are comparable. Read up. Check out evil_poohs rant at mma-elo.com He is a wise man. http://www.mma-elo.com/rants/2009/fedor-has-no-competition-outside-the-ufc/
Thats a poor rebuttle...
Because in the UFC if those fighters lose, the fighter that beat them is usually legit… Like Mir losing to Brock… Kongo losing Cain… Gonzaga losing to Carwin… Randy or Nog losing to one another… shit even Dos Santos vs Cro Cop has a positive spin available for whoever wins, because at the very least they are credible opponents for one another… the UFC HW pool is deep enough that it doesn’t DEPEND on outcomes to create matches…. It isn’t the same as if Werdum gets ko’d by Mike Kyle, ESPECIALLY since he just got ktfo by Dos Santos in his last fight… Wh
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
by Loot on Aug 5, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
“shit even Dos Santos vs Cro Cop has a positive spin available for whoever wins, because at the very least they are credible opponents for one another”
and
“ESPECIALLY since he just got ktfo by Dos Santos in his last fight…”
Are not compatible statements.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
This is a problem that I have with alot of comparisons that people make to a fighter’s record. By discrediting Werdum for losing to Dos Santos but then crediting Cro Cop if he beats him is pretty much just twisting facts to make an argument look better. This happens often but usually not within the same paragraph.
Lesnar is #2 in the world. Fedor is #1, and since Fedor isn’t fighting the #2 he is going to get heat. But there are still credible fights for him outside of the UFC. At the time Fedor has beaten alot of his opponents, they were at or near the best they have been and it only looks bad now because guys like AA and Sylvia have gone on to get KTFO. Every fighter is only as good as his opponents and vice versa, so every fighter could have his wins discredited if you want to pick apart their record.
Take someone’s record for what it is with out trying put opinions or reasoning behind it.
Fedor was just about to fight the #2 (Barnett). Not his fault that Barnett failed a drug test, and is now #3.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
We don’t know how far Barnettt is going to fall in the rankings yet – most of the Metas that had Brock at #2 this month were done before Barnett’s positive was made public.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
You're wrong.
Timing, and context makes a huge difference in the comparisons. Werdum fell hard for losing to an unknown… after beating Werdum, and KTFO Struve, Dos Santos stock has risen considerably.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Then you have to reward Fedor for fighting Arlovski when he was #2 and Sylvia when he was still in the top 10. You can’t cherry pick this stuff.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
I said Fedor has fought credible people, but
The Point is Fedor isn’t guaranteed decent fights out of the UFC… In it he would be. I’ve said plenty of times that its not fair that Fedor mixes in fights with HMC, Zulu, Lindland, etc with fights against CroCop, Arlovski, and Sylvia… He should be fighting hw’s who have been winning fights against steady competition… and looking back for a while, Arlovski is the only one that fits that criteria… Even tho Sylvia was 1-2 in his last 3, and had looked bad in his last 5 straight was a decent opponent…
Everyone wants to talk about ranks, but HW ranks have been misleading for a while, and the performances of the fighters before they fought Fedor need to be paid more attention to, in addition to their ranks.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Did you think AA was the #2 HW in the world because he beat Ben Rothwell
You – did you think that?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I thought he was that based on the consensus of rankings in the MMA world.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
And you always agree with those, right?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think Arlovski at #2 in January of 2009 really needs to be debated. At worst, he’s still in the top 5. Curious as to who should have been ahead of him at that point.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
How...?
When Werdum lost to Dos Santos,Cigano was unknown, and a huge Dog… He instantly becomes a contender for taking Werdum out… THATS why if CroCop beats him he’s credible, because Dos Santos leapt up in the ranks after his Win, and while Cro Cop is a big name, he is trying to regain steam… It’s a matchup that makes sense, and therefore a win for either will be big…
Just like Brett Rogers is NOW a contender to fight Fedor… but going into the fight with AA he was supposed to get destroyed,
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
This they are equal argument is such a load of bunk that is being advanced by the “Clapping Seal” Fedor Fans.
Does Strikeforce have legitimate competition…YES. I agree its not freakshow fights or weight mismatches.
That said the UFC heavies are at a better an more advanced stage. They are better fighters.
The other key thing in the UFC is that the fighters who challenge Fedor and Lesnar will have other top fights before facing Fedor. I don’t know if Fedor will fight Carwin or Velazquez, but they would have to go through each other first. Strikeforce will likely protect their top 15 challengers by having them fight nobodys before setting up Fedor matches.
by SES 84 on Aug 5, 2009 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
the UFC heavies are at a better an more advanced stage. They are better fighters.
More advanced? Meaning experience wise?? On average more experienced than Overeem? Monson? Werdum? Yvel? Barnett? Rogers? Those guys probably have an average of 20 wins whilst the bulk of the the HW challengers for Fedor in the UFC have an average of 10-15wins. Cain, Napao, Gonzaga, Brock, Dos Santos, Carwin……etc.
I would suggest the guys outside the UFC are at a more advanced stage based on their experience. Would Monson beat Napao? I dont know. Would Werdum beat Mir? I dont know. Yvel v Don Santos? Again, I dont know but surely all those guys are pretty comparable in the level of challenge they pose to any world class fighter whether its Fedor or anybody else.
You could make a case either way as to which group of HWs is better, but at the end of the day, there isnt a whole lot of daylight between the groups. Any argument suggesting that they are vastly different just cannot hold up to any logical or rational criticism.
I understand how squeezing Jeff Monson’s name in there with the other 2nd tier fighters really helps your argument but when did he ever sign with strikeforce??
Would Werdum beat Mir? I dont know.
i do… he wouldnt
Why wouldn’t he? He’s got better BJJ, comparable striking, and a better gas tank. Werdum may be flaky, but certainly no more so than Mir.
Agreed.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Aug 5, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
For an informed opinion regarding Fabricio Werdum
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito Ortiz on Vitor Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Aug 6, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions
There is some truth to this, but I also think we are seeing the Fedor effect again. Whoever Fedor is going to fight starts getting this boost in the rankings. My choice of words might be off, but I think the UFC fighters present more interesting challenges, particularly Lesnar, Velazquez and Carwin.
No there is no debate unless you see things through Fedor colored glasses, the idea that Fedor who’s never fought for the top promotion doesn’t have anything to prove is wrong in so many way’s it’s hard to put them all down.
Let’s look at the history of Pride HW’s in the UFC and you’ll see that the Pride HW myth was just that. The fact is Fedor after defeating CC went 3 years without facing a top flight HW contender that alone took him off my list of being the great icon that many of you pray to at night. Fedor has plenty to prove and to try and deny that is simply not living in reality which sadly is something of a theme with you Fedor fans.
There is no “Pride HW myth.” Dana recently told Steve Cofield that the UFC HW division was godawful as recently as Sylvia’s last run with the title.
The heavyweight pool is very shallow with talent. Fedor, all things considered, has dominated that talent.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
You know, I like this posting...
Well done sir. This whole debacle has reached epic proportions of “he said, she said” bull shit.
MMA is a job for Fedor and he treats it as such. You know what, I’m not going to fault him for that. I can’t really compare Fedor’s job to mine…. but I’m only working my job because I have to, not because I want to be the best in the world at it or compete with the best in the world at my job. As long as I can provide for my family…. I don’t give a shit. A million dollars would be great, don’t get me wrong, but its not necessary to live.
I can understand Dana White’s frustration and anger…. but its time to move on. You’re “the man” in the biggest MMA org in the world…. you’ve made millions already w/out Fedor and lets be honest here… I don’t imagine a Fedor PPV would sell more if even get the same numbers as UFC 100 did.
No further comments on Bruce Wayne.
by Gunslinger20 on Aug 5, 2009 6:11 AM EDT reply actions 4 recs
Thats all fine and good...
Except, being a fighter entails being an entertainer (and having fans)… and claiming you’re the best HW in the world, yet choosing competition who’s last big win is Arlovski is weak…. Overeem hasn’t beaten a decent HW in MMA since the Head Hunter… Werdum does have 2 wins over Gonzaga… but also lost to Dos Santos in devestating fashion… And Brett Rogers has a win over Arlovski… but wat else? I like Grim, but c’mon. We’re reaching here…
Mir at the very least has wins over Sylvia, Lesnar, Nog… Randy is Randy, even if he is 46… Brock has wins over Randy, and Mir… Carwin has beaten Gonzaga, who beat Cro Cop, who also lost to Kongo, who lost to Velasquez, and Heath Herring, yet Kongo also has a win over Antoni Hardonk, and the aforementioned Cro Cop who, until coming to the UFC, was thought of as one of the best HW’s on the planet…
That last little sequence proves nothing other than the fact that UFC has enough talented HW’s where Fedor would be a favorite, but would have to fight guys who were winning against a higher caliber of HW’s. Not guys who are fighting LHW’s like Mike Kyle for a chance at Fedor…
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Except, being a fighter entails being an entertainer (and having fans)…
You’re think “professional wrestler”, not “fighter”. Tho I can see how people get them confused lately.
As for the rest of your post, I think you missed the point of the article.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
I missed the point of the article how>
I’m responding to a specific comment… and in Fight Sports like Boxing and MMA, they are selling a fight to FANS… If you think that entertainment doesn’t matter in this “career” that he chose, you’re mistaken.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Focusing on entertainment and not winning
is annoying as fuck, and part of the reason I hate “Fight of the Night” bonuses. If you are a mid-level fighter making $12,000 a show (and fighting in 3 shows a year), what is the best option? Winning your fights with smart fighting and building towards a possible title shot that may never come…or “standing and banging” and “putting on a good show” so you may get a shot at a huge FoTN bonus?
BOOSH
For example
Marcus Davis. His fights are entertaining, but I find it very hard to care if he wins or loses since he clearly doesn’t.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
by mythbuster on Aug 5, 2009 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Wait...
What I meant is, Fedor fighting the best comp consistently, is the more entertaining situation of the two, and he chose the latter… His whole image is based on being the best, because he HAS BEEN THE BEST… for a while… but choosing the easier road is kind of a diss to the fans… and if u honestly don’t think the UFC has the potential matchups for Fedor (a guy who could face the top HW’s and LHw’s the ufc has) then i don’t know what to say
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
the best potential matchups.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
naah
fighting is fighting, entertaining is entertaining. They can absolutely overlap BUT the minute it is expected to it becomes sports entertainment.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
I’m really interested in seeing quotes from Fedor claiming that he’s the best in the world. The quotes in the original article are more in line with what I’ve heard Fedor say in interviews.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
he is marketed as such.
Because in fact he is… I just don’t think it can be argued that his road outside of the UFC is significantly easier… thus puttin his spot as the best up for grabs.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Then please refrain from saying this;
“and claiming you’re the best HW in the world”
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
you're picking through each of my statements...
and finding very small things to poke at…
If Fedor was the only one making decisions on where he fought, than maybe my wording would make a bigger difference… BUT…. When you, and your team make decisions based on you STILL being the best HW in the world, and when every promotion you go to markets you as such, then my point still stands…
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Being a fighter doesn’t entail being an entertainer. You don’t see Fedor walking Seth Petruzelli out on a dog leash, or talking “mad smack” to King Mo on Youtube. He doesn’t care, he doesn’t try, and who are we to tell him he is a “crap” because he doesn’t want to fulfill OUR wishes. Give me a break.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Aug 5, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
To be fair...
Fedor isn’t claiming he is the best in the world…. everyone else is.
No further comments on Bruce Wayne.
This is getting dangerous...
We seem to be agreeing a lot lately :)
No further comments on Bruce Wayne.
A strawman is when you argue against a distortion of your opponent’s opinion rather than their actual position. For example, if I assert:
Fedor is the number 1 heavyweight in the world
and my opponent argues that:
You can’t call Fedor the best, because he hasn’t beaten as many top 10 opponents as GSP.
My opponent is using a strawman because my argument that Fedor is the best heavyweight in the world has nothing to do with whether or not Fedor is a better p4p fighter than GSP.
White consistently falls back on the arguement that Fedor is somehow ducking competition. That if he doesn’t fight in the UFC, he isn’t proving himself to be the best.
He isn’t.
Imagine if before being drafted Lebron was out there talking about how he wanted to join the and1 league instead of the NBA. We’ve all seen what he can do against a bunch of scrub players half his size, will any of that translate over once he steps up the competition??
Except in this case, Lebron would’ve already been in the NBA and won several championships before talking about joining And1.
I specializes in grammar fail.
by a tommy point on Aug 5, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Keep grasping onto things he did years ago...
It doesn’t change the argument.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
You’re right. Fedor sucks. You’ve convinced me and everyone.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Who said he sucks?
Sure as hell wasn’t me… But that doesn’t change the fact that a fighter cannot be defined by things he did years ago…. Thats a main point of argument that a fighter like Allistair Overeem is a good opponent for Fedor… Becuase he’s a different fighter than when shogun, chuck, etc beat him… All I’m saying is that RIGHT NOW, he chose to fight easier competition (thus not proving to be the best) as he has for much of the last 3 years.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Can we please stop making analogies to sports that have no resemblance to combat sports?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
I have to respectfully disagree. He, like everyone else, always has something to prove. Right now, Fedro is proving that he doesn’t want to fight the best.
I think that if the best fighter in world chooses to stop proving that he is the best, well then that probably means he is not the best anymore.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Aug 5, 2009 11:24 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
rec'd
I love Fedro.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Promoters must double
talk to inflate the value of what they have and deflate other promoters fighters. It is business.
I graduated with a business degree, have been excelling in my field for 10 years now. I am recognized as a leader in my industry. I now have 2 offers, I can go do research and teach at MIT or I can take a similar job at at the local CC. Guess who I am.
Divorced with 3 kids?
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Aug 5, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Past accomplishments in Pride = utter dominance?
CroCop was dominant in Pride
Nogueira was dominant in Pride
Shogun was dominant in Pride
Rampage was good but not great in Pride
Anderson Silva sucked in Pride
Look at them now. Amazing what a few years make, right?
There’s something that you’re trying to prove doesn’t apply to Fedor: “Everyone loses in MMA.”
You don’t win fights by using “what ifs and old accomplishments,” you win by fighting. Period. You are using the ultimate “red herring” tactic. You are now turning the blame for Fedor not fighting to Dana White. Dana is a loud mouth, but what he says is not wrong. Fedor got the best offer from the UFC and turned it down to take a lesser offer. Fedor without his aura of invincibility is nothing. He has no charisma, no ability to sell a fight. His product is his aura of invincibility which many fans still cling on. I don’t admonish him for being a business man first and protecting his “product” and an MMA fighter second. But please spare me the “Fedor has nothing to prove baloney.”
by cyph on Aug 5, 2009 11:52 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Did he?
Fedor got the best offer from the UFC and turned it down to take a lesser offer.
What were the two offers? You seem to know for fact which was the best and which was the lesser. I’d be interested to see what the actual offers were, and how Fedor decided which was best for him.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Until I see copies of the contracts
and confirmations from both parties…I refuse to acknowledge any terms as “fact.”
BOOSH
Sorry
I must not have been clear. My mistake, I will try again.
What were the two offers? You seem to know for fact which was the best and which was the lesser. I’d be interested to see what the actual offers were, and how Fedor decided which was best for him.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
So you’re basically telling me that without seeing the contract, you will believe that:
(1) Showtime has the better deal
(2) UFC offer of 3-6 million is below Showtime
(3) Meltzer is a lying UFC shill
(4) PPV percentage is below the pay which was reported as 500k plus gate
You’re about my least favorite person to argue with. You throw logic away and attack points that any sane person would dismiss as ludicrous. Therefore, I will stop. You win the Internet, mythbuster.
by cyph on Aug 5, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
exactly...
not to mention the promotion of M1 in the UFC…
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
I’m basically saying, what are the offers? You stated, “Fedor got the best offer from the UFC and turned it down to take a lesser offer.”. I asked you what the offers were, since you seemed to know exactly what they were and made the judgement that he UFCs offer was better for Fedor.
I only asked you to back up your facts, sorry if you consider that arguing.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Your honor, the defendant is not guilty because the witness testimony is not fact. Until I see the murder in front of me, the defendant is not guilty.
I’ll take that as “I have no idea what the contracts were, but Dana White said so, so it must be true.”.
All I did was ask you to back up what you said. I guess you choose to make strange comments rather than do so tho.
This is for you.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
So you think Dana was/is lying about the contract offered
One huge flaw with that logic:
What if Fedor had publicly accepted the crazy offeR?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
mythbuster never said one contract was better than the other. He’s asking you to provide details of both contracts so he can make a rational decision. Seeing as you in all likelihood have not seen terms from both contracts, you’re probably not in a position to be making these claims.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
No, I haven’t seen it.
However, with all the reports so far from Metlzer et al regarding details of the two contracts, are you seriously telling me with a straight face that the UFC contract is NOT better than Strikeforce’s contract?
We haven’t seen Brock Lesnar’s contract either. However, based on reports, would you agree that he gets paid more than 3 million at UFC 100? There are no “concrete proof” of it. Yet, everyone believe it to be true. Inferences is a powerful thing.
Instead of referencing Meltzer’s name, it would be helpful if you provided details that you’re going off of.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Google Search will get you a list of confirmations of 500k to 700k.
Strikeforce Deal: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&hs=hU6&q=fedor+strikeforce+500k&aq=f&oq=&aqi=
Are you going to claim that these are all rumors and the real contract pays him 3-6 million by Strikeforce?
This still isn’t great because that google search just brings up a bunch of forum posts (MMA Weekly and Sherdog).
In addition, you can’t judge the two offers strictly on the finances.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Are you maintaining ambiguity here because you actually think the contracts are comparable, or is this part of your new ‘arguing logically’ thing?
And sure I can judge the two offers like that – I don’t give a fuck if Fedor has the contractual freedom to fight in subpar organizations against subpar competition.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions
If you don’t give a fuck, why are you jumping in?
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Because it’s silly to say ‘the Strikeforce deal might be as lucrative as the UFC deal, we don’t know, so don’t choose sides’.
If the SF deal is even close to the Zuffa deal, I will eat my own foot.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s a crazy world when people get blasted for showing restraint and waiting until more facts are available to shape their opinion.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
by Mike Fagan on Aug 5, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You don't actually think there's a chance
that the SF contract is more lucrative. You’re just being argumentative by saying ‘we don’t know’.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I highly doubt the contract is more lucrative financially. There are numerous other variables, however, that may make it appealing to Fedor and his managment. I’ve listed examples below.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
We know how much the UFC deal is right? 3-6 million.
You are saying that if we wait, the Strikeforce deal will be worth at least 3-6 million. That’s the problem with this argument. It’s impossible.
If not, I will eat Subo’s other foot.
No.protecting.your.record.is.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Co-promotion, imaging rights, exposure on a national U.S. network, non-exclusivity, etc.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
And here we come to the crux
Get that third point out of there – Kimbo brought his fame to CBS, he ddn’t get it there. Nothing would make Fedor more famous in the USA than signing with the UFC.
Looking at this situation, one can either a) buy what you’ve listed as the reason or b) believe it’s something else. Fedor fought Zulu when he should’ve been fighting Barnett. He fought HMC with special rules. Arona and Hunt, the two guys that gave Fedor the most trouble, never got a rematch.
I think Fedor and M-1 realize that the 30-1 mark is their most important attribute and care about it more than anything else – and that, most of all, is why Fedor rejected the UFC’s offer.
I think he’s protecting his record. You don’t. Hugs?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
EXC’s second CBS show had 2.5 to 3 million viewers without Kimbo or Gina on the card.
You again provide another red herring (arguing about Fedor protecting his record which shifts the discussion from what we are talking about [that being the merits of the Zuffa and Strikeforce offers]) in addition to a fallacy of a single cause.
Protecting Fedor’s record could certainly be a factor in going to Strikeforce. However, it’s doubtful that it’s the only reason.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
You came in
And said ’don’t say the UFC contract was better than SF’s because we haven’t seen them.’ Well, A), we’re never going to see the UFC offer to Fedor, and even if we did, there would be no way to verify it, and b) every shred of evidence we have says the SF contract pays less.
As far as co-promotion and non-exclusivity,
In addition, you can’t judge the two offers strictly on the finances.
You can, but let’s not. If you view it like THAT – just money – then Fedor is insane for not taking it. We’re agreeing that money wasn’t the problem so it must’ve been another factor (or, as you point out, a mix of other factors), of which I think protecting his record is a big one.
It’s not a red herring – it’s a theory as to why he would duck the most lucrative contract in the history of the sport.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
“You can, but let’s not.”
This doesn’t make any sense. If I offer you $10m to mow my lawn, but you also have to sexually pleasure my 95 year old grandfather, you’ll probably pass that up for Luke’s offer of $5m for the same job sans grandfather stroking.
Your theory on record protection is most certainly a red herring. We weren’t discussing the decision making of Fedor and his team. We were discussing the offers made by Strikeforce and Zuffa. The discussion has now been shifted because of your statement.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
I’ll take the ten, actually.
The offer by Zuffa didn’t offer Fedor the opportunity to protect his record. How do you think that didn’t enter into his decision?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I never said it didn’t. I said you bringing it up diverted the discussion from comparing the offers made by Zuffa and Strikeforce to discussing Fedor/M-1’s decision making. These are two different (though obv. related) topics.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Jerking off grandfathers – bringing the Bloody Elbow community together since 2009.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
by Mike Fagan on Aug 5, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Nice thread ender there.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
UFN’s almost draw that many to a cable channel, and Televised UFC’s beat that easily, again on a cable channel.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
2.5 to 3 million is probably the bare minimum a Fedor fight on CBS gets. I would also assume Coker would pad that with Carano, etc.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
And I think a UFN or televised UFC event with Fedro would be much higher as well.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
That’s irrelevant because the UFC would never put him on either of those shows.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
If Carano has a face left after next weekend
'He built his whole reputation as a waffle house chef. They’ve been serving him up ham and eggs with a side of canned tomatoes' - Don Frye on Fedor Emelianenko
by Well Read Idiot on Aug 6, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Because we’re intelligent human beings who can infer that Strikeforce’s gate is 500k-750k, Showtime pays them 500k to 1m. If cost exceed revenue, they would go bankrupt.
But logic be damned!
Moving the goal posts again, Fagan? I thought better of you.
Sorry, Fagan, I don’t have the real contract here with. Obviously that is the only thing that will convince you that that Strikeforce doesn’t have 3-6 million to offer Fedor.
How am I moving the goal posts? You provided a link to a google search that (as far as I can tell) offers no official report from reputable sources.
And again, money isn’t the only thing that you can judge a contract on. Strikeforce agreed to some sort of co-promotion deal with M-1, while retarded to most of us fans, is obviously a big deal for Fedor and his management. One of the forum posts claims the deal is non-exclusive. That same post claimed Fedor is getting $500k from Strikeforce and $500k from CBS. He gets to continue to sell and control his own imaging rights. Etc.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
while retarded to most of us fans
I can judge a contract by whatever metrics I deem important – just like Fedor can. You don’t really think Fedor will make more money for himself OR M-1 by ducking the UFC – you’re just maintaining the possibility. A possibility I grant you, by the way – just not one that’s very likely.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I’ve never said Fedor could make as much money directly with Strikeforce against Zuffa, but that’s not why I think the Strikeforce deal could be as appealing.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
You attribute different motivations to Fedor and M-1 than I do – since THAT is sheer projection on our parts, I can’t hold that against you.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
No, the difference is that I haven’t attributed any motivation to Fedor and M-1. It’s, in all likelihood, a combination of many things.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Agreed – I just don’t think altruism or the good of the sport is part of Fedor/M-1’s combination.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions
We can agree on that. But I also don’t think any fighter or manager has that in mind during contract negotiations.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Yes
So when Finkie or Millen comes out and says ’it’s about competition’, you know they’re full of shit.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I take anything managers or promoters say with a grain of salt.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Probably a good policy.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Cyph
Who exactly does he have to prove himself to?
You?
Himself?
Dana White?
And to what end?
Is there a point where he has “proven himself?”
This is a legitimate question.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
If you claim that he was the best at one point, no one.
If you claim that he still is the best right now, then he must prove it to everyone. Can you categorically say that he can beat Brock Lesnar? Maybe, maybe not. We are robbed of the opportunity to answer that question.
If I tell you that Lesnar is the best but he doesn’t have to prove it because he has beaten the best in the UFC. Would you take that answer?
Here’s a question I would be interested to hear the answer to (from you or someone else, I don’t care)
Why is it incumbent on the #1 fighter to seek out and fight the #2 fighter, but the #2 fighter has no such obligation to seek out and fight the #1 fighter?
In other words, why does fedor get heat for not taking a UFC contract and fighting Lesnar, but Lesnar gets no heat for not leaving the UFC and joining Strikeforce to fight Fedor? Why one sided?
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
The #1 guy gets heat for choosing to go to a place where the best he can fight is #8.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
Barnett is not #3
Please stop flogging the fact that he was displaced at #2 by Brock BEFORE his positive became public.
iiowyn is referring to Rogers – the highest ranked HW, at 8, currently on SF’s roster. The rest of the top ten is in the UFC.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
No
Lesnar fights under the Unified Rules – he doesn’t need to go where some of his primary offensive weapons are banned to prove a point. Fedor needs to prove he can operate in an arena where ground elbows are legal.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree
His elbows KILLED Mir in that last fight from half guard. And that elbow to the back of Couture’s head.
BOOSH
Fedro cuts easily. Thus elbows are a threat.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
Hey, somebody gets it!
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I hid it.
Everyone knows that Fedor tainted Barnett’s blood test cuz he’s afraid to fight Barnett.
His last 3 scheduled opponents were all top 5 at the time (two of them #2), all 3 ranked higher than Lesnar at the time, mind you
Truth is everyone round here just wanted him in the UFC and it didnt happen. I’m disappointed to, but I’m not a fucking crybaby about it. Fedor doesn’t owe me anything.
And lastly, the US isn’t the center of the known universe. Fedor does have fans in his hemisphere, he could retire today and he can be proud of himself. He doesnt care about the money, by Russian standards he’s a freakin billionaire…it’s Russia and he lives in a back woods part of Russia. And if he doesnt care about money, he sure won’t sign with someone who has publically insulted him for years for just money. He wants respect.
Look at Randy too. Yeah he wanted a lot of money because that is a part of getting respect, especially when you are getting the money from someone known to be tight on salaries. But in the end, the greats fight for their own self-respect. They won’t bend for a big pay day, they wont bend if you say they are chicken. Fedor and Randy are both true Warriors who have proven their heart time and time again.
Disintegration -- I'm taking it in stride.
AbsurdMeridian
Follow me on Twitter.
by Eugene Schelfaut on Aug 5, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Truth is everyone round here just wanted him in the UFC and it didnt happen. I’m disappointed to, but I’m not a fucking crybaby about it. Fedor doesn’t owe me anything.
Ding! Ding! Ding! You are 100% correct, sir. The guy has proven himself over and over and over again, but now suddenly these people are claiming that he has to prove himself to them. The UFC nuthuggary hasn’t been this silly since the Cro Cop-Dream debacle.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
by mythbuster on Aug 5, 2009 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
What is so hard to understand?
If people want to say he is STILL THE BEST while he’s fighting lesser opponents half his career, then fine… But As a champ in the UFC he would have to fight the top HW contender in the division every fight AS LONG AS HE STILL FIGHTS… Whereas outside of it, he can choose to fight matt lindland, hong man choi, zulu , etc in the midst of fighting Nog, Cro Cop, Sylvia, and Arlovski… any time he wants… Thats like defending the MMA HW TITLE against fuckin Zulu… why is that ok? Why does Hong Man Choi deserve to fight Fedor as a legitimae challenger?
Like right now… people would call bullshit, if the UFC announced that Vitor Belfort was in line to fight Brock Lesnar… but weeks ago, thats a legitimate opponent for Fedor? THE BEST HW ON EARTH is fighting a fringe top 10 guy in Vitor? Thats the type of shit we can expect if Fedor fights out of the ufc.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
fringe top 10 MW
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
http://www.bloodyelbow.com/rankings/heavyweight/detail/730361
and by the way, lets just get Couture and Nog out of there for the sake of reality.
Then realize, Fedor was just about to fight Barnett (#3) so you’re idea that he’s dodging top fighters goes right out the window.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Barnett is a joke... second of all...
He has fought 2 top fighters recently… even tho I STILL contend that Sylvia was 1-2 in his last three and had looked bad for his last 5… But those aren’t what I’m talking about… Outside the UFC Fedor can go from fighting a decent HW to a scrub in the time it takes to pull a hamstring or get a staph infection… He chose the road with less competition period… and it remains to be seen if he’ll even face decent opposition as it stands… In the UFC it wouldn’t have been a question.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Barnett is a joke? The guys been ranked #2 all year. I think I can see where you’re coming from now, tho. If it ain’t the UFC, it ain’t real?
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
My opinion of Barnett and rankings is of no consequence here...
You’re going to grasp to your “You nuthug UFC” argument regardless of what I say because your fandom is blinding you to the things I’m saying.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Don’t get all personal now. Who am I a fan of that that is blinding me?
I’m wondering how you can consider Barnett a joke when he’s been ranked #2 by this site. Even if you disagree with the rankings (which god knows I often do), you would have to consider him a top 10 at least. Do you consider anyone who isn’t in the UFC to be a real challenger to the #1 spot?
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
I said Barnett is a Joke, because...
a fight that didn;t happen isn’t relevant, and if supposed matchups are relevant, what’s more telling is… when Barnett popped, the best replacement they could get was Vitor…
Fedor is the best… but Fedor in the UFC is going to fight a decent HW every fight… Outside of it, it becomes a crap shoot, where if ANYTHING goes wrong, we can end up with more HMC’s and Lindlands… He CHOSE that situation though, for whatever reason… but if he doesn’t fight consistent competition, he won’t hold the spot as the best.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Nog and Randy are tons more credible than Brett Rogers, Monson, or Werdum,
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Aren’t you the one above who wrote: “Keep grasping onto things he did years ago…”? ;)
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
TODAY
RANDY OR NOG would be favored OVER ANY OF THOSE GUYS….
Past accomplishments versus, one accomplishment? Come on now… Nog and Randy faced Mir and Lesnar respectively in their last fights… Before that, Nog beat the same Tim Sylvia that later went on to lose to Fedor, as did Randy, and Randy also had the win over Gonzaga who had just destroyed CroCop….
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Nog and Randy faced Mir and Lesnar respectively in their last fights…
And lost – hard. And yet, one of them will get another hw title shot :(
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Fedor would've gotten the title shot.
:(
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Or Lesnar could get one if he joins Strikeforce. WAMMA belt, anyone? ;)
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
So now...
because Fedor chose to fight in StrikeForce against lesser competition people should leave the best organization in the world to fight fedor for much less money on showtime?
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Naah. Only if people want to remain true to their belief that, if a fighter wants to fight the best, he should give up everything to do so.
Personally, I don’t care one way or the other. I’m happy to see fights. Also, if the WAMMA belt comment didn’t tip ya off, my comment above was said mostly in jest. I wouldn’t expect Lesnar to give up his money to fight the best any more than I would expect Fedor to give up whatever it was that he liked in the Strikeforce contract to go fight the #2.
("you don’t like Brock" – helping Weobo out)
Yea...
I mean, I think personally, a lot of people are taking too much offense to criticism of Fedor, since he, for a long time was immune to it… I don’t think most are arguing that Fedor isn’t still the best HW in the world, but its hard to accept that he could’ve been in the UFC, where potential matchups are readilly available even after Lesnar, Mir, Carwin, Randy (further down the line Lyoto, or Anderson? CC rematch? maybe Dos Santos, Cain, Rampage)…. and he chose Strikeforce, who doesn’t have enough decent hw’s to give Werdum a real matchup… It’s the dissapointment talking, but doesn’t mean that we can’t look at it rationally…
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
This is akin to saying that you don’t know if Anderson Silva is the best middleweight because he hasn’t fought a legit challenger at 185 in over a year and a half.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
I disagree...
Anderson beat everyone who had “earned” the right to fight him… comparing cote and leites to HMC and Zulu is reaching…. I’m not saying Fedor hasn’t done enough so far to still be 1, I just have a hard time believing we will get decent matches consistently with him out of the UFC, nor do I believe if he fights AO, Monson, and Werdum that it’s equal to him fighting in the UFC….
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
Until Lesnar steamrolled the UFC, that was true of Fedor as well. I can’t name one HW that Fedor hasn’t fought/beaten that sticks out like a sore thumb.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Brock Lesnar.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Did you miss the entire first clause?
Brock Lesnar’s been a legitimate threat for an entire month. When Fedor retires in X years, we can look back and start to criticize him for not fighting X and Y. Up until now, Fedor’s cleaned out the entire HW division.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
Thats why the argument is being posed now... not before.
and EVEN IF THERE ISN’T ONE… There is a whole ROSTER of fighters fighting on the biggest stage against other decent HW’s… Just because there isn’t a guy YOU think can beat Fedor doesn’t mean the actual fighters aren’t better competition in the UFC than out of it.
I'm like PacMan fightin you silly kids... throw ya Hatton the ring, and get knocked outlike Ricky did.
lol.
But he’s a legitimate threat right now.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree. Now can we please show some restraint and hold off on this “not fighting the best” stuff because he’s done it throughout his career.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
And he is choosing not to do it now.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Aug 5, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There is NO OTHER WAY to paint his decision.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Randy won’t bend for a big payday? Really? The entire reason Randy left was because the UFC offered more money to Fedro.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
where do you work? let’s put you in Randy’s shoes.
you are loyal company man. you’ve been there since early on, before the company became big and successful as it currently is. you truly believe you helped get them there, you have done everything asked of you.
time comes for your yearly raise or contract negotiations, in this case. you dont get what you want, but you do get a small raise and are happy simply knowing you are the highest paid guy at said company.
but then you get wind that they actually offered an outside guy more, a lot more than they offered you, possibly double or triple.
your pissed right? do you feel disrespected? what could your company do to make you feel respected again? and what do you do if they dont do this?
and thus i argue randy is a man of principle and while money was involved, that is what i meant when i sai he wont bend for a big payday.
hooray for writing incessantly long posts on the internet to clarify a small part of my earlier post, that even if proven wrong does not discredit the point I was making in the 1st place.
Randy fighting Brock as his first fight back was because that was the biggest money match he could do.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
so the UFC proved to randy they could tie him up in court til he was too old to fight anymore. that’s why he came back. he really had no other choice but to retire. and note how much he lost by not fighting during that time period.
so who was he supposed to fight other than brock? was he suppose to fight for free or what?
No, he was supposed to do what he was he was supposed to do in the first place – fulfill his contractual obligation to the UFC.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
let me simplify the point of my post.
DANA WHITE:
Hey you fucking Russian fat piece of shit. Here’s millions of fucking American dollars, shit yeah. Take it you fuck.
FEDOR:
Fuck you.
DANA WHITE:
OMG you sooo don’t wanna fight good fighters lyk omg.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 1:17 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
DANA WHITE:
Here is more money than you will make anywhere else and we caved on everything you want.
FINKIE:
Where is M-1 Global, you no mention M-1 Global. M-1 Global wants half of your profits.
DANA WHITE:
No.
FEDOR:
You hurt my feelings before.
GARY MILLEN:
We are taking our basketball and going home.
DANA WHITE:
Your loss, come back to me when you actually want to deal.
SCOTT COKER:
We will pay you far less but co-promote with M-1 Global.
FINKIE:
Woot more money for me! Err I mean M-1 Global and Fedor.
FEDOR:
Sadface.
SCOTT COKER:
We have ice cream.
FEDOR:
Yay!
DANA WHITE:
Crazy fuckin’ Russians.
FERTITTA:
Cry havok, and release the lawyers of war.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Aug 5, 2009 2:53 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
that was good.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Completely disagree – and that’s a first for us, Farts.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 2:41 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Disagreement is healthy.
I just don’t think Fedor has to continually prove himself to be anything, and evidently, he doesn’t either, which is pretty much the end of it.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
by Martial Farts on Aug 5, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
We clearly have different expectations of our world champions.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Aug 5, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I will admit that I desperately wanted to see Fedor in the UFC. Desperately. I think it’s a shame.
But, my point is, I just don’t think Fedor is out to prove himself at this point, so dangling that bait in front of him is not going to work. Money didn’t work. The chance to crush Lesnar’s hairy ballsack didn’t work. Calling him a crazy Russian didn’t work.
As long as it’s White vs. Frankeshtein, it’s not going to work.
Be water, my friend.
http://martialfarts.fightlinker.com
http://twitter.com/martialfarts
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Bloody Elbow
Related FanShots on Bloody Elbow
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
MMA Rankings
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
