The Live-TV Strikeforce Gap and the Future of Women in Strikeforce
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:48 PM EDT
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From what I can tell, people who attended Strikeforce live loved the main event, while those watching at home saw it as the one-sided beating that it truly was. I attended the show live myself, and knew within about 30 seconds that Gina would need a miracle to win. There's something about a fighter's body language after they get hit that says a lot, and I think her body slumped more out of exasperation than exhaustion.
Gina really lost this fight in the clinch, which is where she needed to be successful to win. In order to beat Cyborg, she had to withstand 2 rounds of hell and take it later. One of the keys to that was tying her up to avoid a beating, but as soon as she started reverting to headlocks I knew it was a matter of time. She almost got that miracle when she ended up in full mount, but a split second decision to give that up was a costly error. She almost certainly would not have won from there, but it was a good opportunity to get a breather and lean on Cyborg a bit, and she passed on it.
From a live atmosphere perspective, few fights I've attended have ever garnered this kind of crowd response. I've been to a lot of UFC events, and the only thing that was hotter live was Brock-Randy. Unfortunately, most women's MMA discussions end up focusing on the future of the sport and whether there's anything there besides Gina. For a round, about 15,000 people were absolutely losing their minds for a fight that featured a woman they wanted to win against a woman they wanted to lose. In a little over two years, it's a hell of an accomplishment for Gina, who carried the sport to this point.
They've made a great pick with Marlos Coenen for the next title shot, but the big challenge for Strikeforce is creating stars. Part of making stars is insisting upon it, making women's title matches main events even when they don't feature Gina Carano. Cyborg has great charisma of her own and is eminently marketable, but Strikeforce showed little sign in the build to this fight that they know how to do it.
I like the idea of doing tournaments at 145 and 135. The key thing is to get a number of girls on TV and let them sort themselves out. Putting Gina in the tournament would be insane, they obviously should not do that, but the tournament format may do more to create stars than Coker can do on his own over the course of a year.
My guess is the fight last night broke the Showtime MMA record, and Cyborg will be able to defend her title in the main event or co-main event of Showtime shows for some time to come. Gina can main event any Showtime show without a title, and co-main CBS shows as well. I think people should step back, breathe a bit, and realize that the girls aren't going anywhere, and that Gina's loss won't kill the sport.
-- photo by Esther Lin.
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Coenen just lost her last fight. How can she be in line for a title shot now?
Cyborg as a champion really hurts the female MMA. Female boxing has had it’s moments, but has never been able to become big. The WNBA struggles to this day. Until I see a long-term success of women’s MMA, call me negative, but I don’t see it being remotely successful.
Not to mention Strikeforce has always had really good crowds in San Joe. It’s outside of that arena that they struggle. It’s safe to assume female would struggle as well.
Females work well for free TV. They work well to get casual fans into buildings with cheaper ticket prices. I highly doubt it can work for PPV or big gates.
Not to mention, article after article I read on this fight, the writers completely ignore the fact that the fight itself was uglier then sin. The UFC could put on a fight between Jose Canseco & Mark McGuire. Market it like crazy and do great buys. Doesn’t mean it is good for the sport.
What I saw last night were two ladies who have been pushed really hard by a network (Showtime) and promotions (EliteXC & Strikeforce), that completely lacked true fundamental fighting skills. To praise this and act like it is okay for a pay TV station to put this on just for the ratings is pathetic.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Number one ufc fight of all time: Forrest Griffin vs. Stephan Bonnar.
Show the fight to any kickboxer and they’ll mock both fighters. The girls are 7 fights into their career, seriously give it a rest. People try too hard, throughout fighting history the legendary fights are the ones that capture crowd emotions, not the technically great fights.
This is the most basic lesson for anyone that wants to act like they know anything about promoting MMA.
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
Frye vs. Takayama is another great example.
I don’t mean to sound vulgar but last night, at least from most people I discussed it with, people were tuning in to watch a “hot chick in a fight.” Although the fight wasn’t technically sound, the average fan got what they wanted, and that’s the bottom line.
Griffin vs. Bonnar was a fight to determine who would get INTO the UFC. Carano/Cyborg was for a World Title. It took Griffin 8 fights after that before his title shot.
And you are missing the point. Not every fight has to be a technical masterpiece. But you can’t promote horrible fighting just because it sells. Female fighting in EliteXC and Strikeforce has been nothing but amateur. The punches thrown by Cybrog & Carano made Bonnar/Griffin look like P4P Boxing champions by comparison.
It’s a complete disservice to the sport when you have a fighter, regardless of gender, get protected until they get a title fight, and then put on a display of complete nonsense. Cyborg literally pulled Carano on top of her twice. Carano had no clue how to keep a mount.
it was amateur hour. And instead of admitting it and calling it what it is….. The MMA Media is talking about how it gets a good crowd reaction and how it could potentially sell.
Promoting a fight is great…. But make sure the athletes are at least of a certain level….. Which these two are not. And that, as I have said before, is a disservice to the sport of MMA.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
What a disservice it did to Gilbert Melendez and Fabricio Werdum, two skilled MMA veterans that both heavily praised Cyborg and said they were thrilled to be on a show with these girls as the main event. Especially Gilbert, who went on at length about how great it was that the girls brought all this publicity to the show he was on.
Then again, what do these fighters know about MMA? At least they have you to protect it from being disserviced.
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Yeah, because fighter’s are always the best at dictating the direction of a sport. They see more fans at a live event, they think their careers will get better because of it. It’s as simple as that.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
As far as Coenen goes, they’re simply doing what they need to do to give Cyborg a first title defense. There are endless examples of this, but I really don’t feel like spending hours arguing by distinction or analogy.
Arguing against developing the women’s side of the sport because some of the first fighters in it aren’t technically sound is beyond flawed logic. May as well have given up on MMA at all in 1993. These things take time, if your point is that the male divisions are deeper with better fighters, nobody is arguing with you. It will probably take 5-10 years of actual growth to have
There were like 8 male fights and one fight between women at the show last night. The female fight had more crowd interest than all of them combined, actually more than all the fights Strikeforce has put on so far combined. And unlike Jose Canseco or whatever flawed analogy you’re going for, both are actually pro fighters that train. And at the same stage of development they’re a lot better than a lot of fighters were around 1994-1995.
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Your example would work, except female fighting has been around since the 1990’s.
it’s not going to get much better. High level female athletes are already a tough find. And the WNBA and Tennis gets the vast majority of them.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions
There have been female fights, but honestly now, you’re just playing dumb and I’m going to give up for the day. Over the last year more girls have joined MMA gyms than in the last 20 combined.
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Same could be said for males too.
I’m not playing dumb. You are just wrong. There have been all female Hook’N’Shoot cards. There has been female MMA in Japan for multiple years now. And never have we seen the level of the fighters really improve that much.
With the guys, we have seen it improve at a very minimum every two years. Sometimes at a extremely fast pace too.
Not to mention the huge social stigma for females to be fighting. It will always stop credible female athletes from trying the sport. There is no male stigma
Lastly, men have so many martial arts to pull from to get top talent. Females don’t. Joining a gym at 18 years old won’t change that. Male MMA has pulled from wrestling, boxing, BJJ, and many other art forms. Guys have been competing in some form of martial art since they were 10. Those leagues are almost non-existant for females.
Without a feeder system, female MMA will continue to struggle to increase the skill level.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Griffin was sloppy, but it was a back and forth fight. Last night looked like a Japanese squash match.
A wise man told me don't argue with fools
Cause people from a distance can't tell who is who
by thetakeover on Aug 16, 2009 5:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
"completely lacked true fundamental fighting skills"
How can anyone take you seriously when you earnestly emit pablum such as this? Carano has exhibited time after time that she starts fights (and even individual rounds) slowly, clinches for a time, and steals rounds at the end with flurries. Santos is a straight-ahead aggressive fighter—almost stereotypically Chute Boxe—who looks to push the action and physically bully her opponents.
The fight that developed was clearly within the realm of foreseeable possibilities (Indeed, I seem to recall sombody, perhaps Jordan Breen, suggesting just this sort of brawl on the Sherdog roundtable), and it certainly doesn’t indicate that the two competitors “completely lacked true fundamental fighting skills.”
Was Lesnar/Mir II a terribly technical fight? Did that really harm the legitimacy of that bout? Was Henderson/Bisping a technical fight? Are they, too, devoid of skills? Your dislike of women’s MMA, while it may or may not be based on sound reasons, has caused you to espouse completely unreasonable positions.
It ends in an armbar or a strangle regardless.
by capital L on Aug 16, 2009 4:37 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
"Was Lesnar/Mir II a terribly technical fight?"
Hell, yeah, it was for Lesnar. He went in with a strategy and executed it. That one-arm headlock where he grabbed Mir’s armpit so Mir couldn’t defend against head shots was brilliant. His insistence at staying chest-on-chest, so Mir had no room to move his hips and get anything for a submission, was totally by design.
Just because the tactics aren’t pretty doesn’t mean technique wasn’t used,
"We're not the other teams' farm system." - Andy MacPhail
by duck on Aug 16, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Lesnar used superior wrestling skills to slowly dismantle Mir. He took arm control and made it impossible for Mir to switch positions. From there, he slowly beat him down. Like the above poster said, it wasn’t pretty, but it was very technical, and shows a lot of skill.
What the females did last night showed very little skill. Those takedown attemps by Cyborg were a joke. Especially when Carano ended up in the mount position from them.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Although that fight was entertaining, the only thing worse than Cyborg pulling Carano on top of her in the mount position, was Carano trying to defend takedowns with a side headlock from the standing position. Both ladies need some work on their wrestling.
by filipinomix2oo0 on Aug 16, 2009 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I just watched it
And I agree. Both were very sloppy in the fight and I didn’t find it engaging at all but it could have been a different story if I was watching it live and didn’t know what happened. Although I was pretty sure that the fight would go exactly as it did.
"I will do nothing lightly. When I walk, I will walk heavily. When I fight, I will fight with conviction. When I speak, I will speak strongly. When I love, I will love with everything"
great write-up, mr. rome. i don’t think anyone expected a bjj or boxing clinic in the headliner, just an exciting fight – which is what we got. i feel women’s mma has (and will have) it’s own particular nuances, just like certain weight classes do. that’s perfect for me, i wouldn’t want to see the same type of fight over and over. overall, i think strikeforce did a great job last night and, with mousasi and fedor aboard, the sky’s the limit.
Mike..
Great post..
I agree with you that womens MMA isn’t going any where .. But I meant it in a literal sense. I dont think it’s going to cease to exist now, but I do not think it will ever be able to support itself and break free from all the stigma’s attached and survive on it’s own..
I agree with AlwaysRelaxing here, he makes great points.. Show me a womens sport that truly has a great following ?? I would say Tennis is about the biggest for women and that’s because Tennis has the “girly” girls in it.. They have the good looking “normal” womens physique.. They are appealing to the eye.. But it still doesn’t make it a “must see” attraction.. I think it fall’s even harder down the scale when you’re attaching the word “fighting” and women..
I’m by no means saying they’re not great athletes or that they could not hang in the sport.. I’m saying there isnt enough appeal by the mainstream American audience for women’s sports as a whole.. WNBA, womens boxing, WPGA, etc… How are those doing in comparison to their male counterparts ?? I htink it’s great that women can compete and be athletic.. But let’s be totally honest here, women are not physically capable of competing to the standards of what the male audience is accustomed to .. Combine the fact that there are not enough “great” women athletes and even less of them are actually attractive..
Sad but true..
It won’t be its own sport, but there will be room for a women’s fight on cards for some time to come.
What you said about ability is perfectly true, at the same time, the male audience doesn’t seem to care because Gina draws males 18-35 better than all the guys do, so obviously they’re looking for something different than you are.
by Michael Rome on Aug 16, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
And that is the problem. Strikeforce promoted based on a women’s looks and not her fighting abilities. Once they have a fight where there is no good looking female (which will happen), the “sport” of WMMA is non-existant. It always hinges on looks, and likely always will. As MMAuthority said, females in tennis has a nice look to them. Plus they aren’t hitting each other.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions
NO
That was EliteXC. Gina had already fought for Strikeforce before and they didn’t do anything just based off her looks. There will always be room for women bouts in an event. There doesn’t need to be an entire event filled with women for women’s MMA to succeed.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Aug 16, 2009 4:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Thank you..
for noticing the “headlock” strategy/habit employed by Carano. I’ve harped on this during her last few fights. Anyone who trained to solidify their game, technically, would not continue to make this mistake.
By doing this, she was ripped down twice, and luckily ended up in mount once, almost twice. This approach also allowed Cyborg to take her back standing two-three times. If you’re training at Xtreme Couture, shouldn’t this be coached out of her game quickly?
I don’t think there’s enough technical training going on which leads me to believe if she trains just to make weight or if she’s training to truly be the best MMA fighter she can be.
I just think she isn’t putting enough time in the gym. If you look at Randy’s postfight quotes, he basically states that Gina needs to get in the gym more and really go full steam ahead with this thing. The side headlock strategy was pretty piss poor, and I honestly didn’t expect that from someone training out of Xtreme Couture.
by filipinomix2oo0 on Aug 16, 2009 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions
No that's my point...
Gina draws on her “attractiveness” .. nothing more .. nothing less…
Anna Kournikova drew more eyes that Venis & Serena.. Why is that ?? When Venis & Serena are the “much” better athletes ??
People aren’t interested in the “sport”.. They’re interested in the “individual” due to the “attractiveness”.. It’s a reverse of what mens sports attract.. Men are looking for the best in their sport.. Men drawn into womens sport are looking for the “hottest” woman in that sport..
It’s a sad truth..
I do agree with everything you’ve stated and I absolutely agree with the fact that it will need time for growth.. I just dont ever think it’s going to “break out” like some people think… I meant that womens MMA is going to be as appealing as womens boxing or the WNBA or the WPGA and so on.. It’s going to be a viable outlet from here on for women looking to compete in MMA.. But it will never even come close to being the kind of draw it was for last nights “one off” event…
The XFL did GREAT on their “first” broadcast.. EliteXC did great for their first show.. It all has the novelty of “something new”.. but not the attractiveness to sustain against it’s counterparts by comparison..
Anna Kournikova drew more eyes [than Venus] & Serena.. Why is that ?? When [Venus] & Serena are the "much" better athletes ??
That’s odd…I’m pretty sure that women’s tennis routinely gets its highest ratings when either Venus or Serena makes it to tournament Finals. I’m sure that if you can find Anna Kournikouva finals ratings (heh) that conflict with that understanding, you’ll be quick to present them.
Or are you just talking about MAXIM covers and bikini calendars?
Anna Kournikova is by far the girl that brought mainstream media attention to womens tennis.. And regardless, tennis isn’t a good comparison to womens MMA because it’s apples and oranges..
Womens Tennis is based on girls that actually look like the perceptive male’s ideal as to what they’re attracted to..
Find me a woman “fighter” outside of Gina that supports any of your arguments.. Cyborg is not allowed because she got her recent fame based off the fact that she was fighting Gina.. Erin Toughill is not a bad looking woman.. But how many people outside of BE do you hear screaming her name ? Or any japanese womens names ?
Bottom line.. The whole basis about this topic is tried and tested.. Womens sports “DO NOT” have the same appeal to the mainstream as mens sports do.. All I’ve heard in argument is people using a few individuals names from certain sports to say that womens MMA doesnt need a pretty face to succeed.. Which I find absolutely hilarious because I know for a fact that if you took Gina “out” of this whole equation and replaced it with a more suitable fighter of equal skill to Cyborg (which there are far better fighters than Gina) that this board, let alone Showtime or CBS would have NEVER aired anything regarding womens MMA..
Womens MMA became popular by Gina’s looks and the fact that she got cross promotion on American Gladiators helped her mainstream appeal.. She’s a pretty face.. nothing more… Womens MMA will survive with or without her.. But it will never reach the appeal that it had with Gina as the front runner… In 2 years you wont be talking about womens MMA … Although we will know it exists, just like womens boxing & the WNBA & tennis etc.. It wont matter to the “main MMA demographic” (ages 18-34)…
Dude, you’re just wrong. Women’s tennis was “mainstream” before Anna Kournikova was even born. Was it on par with the Big Four? Of course not. And the Williams sisters have been, and continue to be, bigger and more relevant stars AS ATHLETES than Anna Kournikova ever was.
And it’s funny how you bust out “apples and oranges” when your entire argument is based upon “apples and oranges.” Why is WNBA not apples and oranges compared to MMA? Or soccer? People are always going to gravitate to “stars” that are aesthetically appealing — it’s why Michael Jordan, Alex Rodriguez, Oscar De La Hoya, and Tom Brady are marketable on a different stratosphere than other “greats.” Talent combined with looks. YOU might not see it because you’re not sexually attracted to men, but if you spend time around women, you’d notice the correlation between casual fan appeal and guys that women want to sleep with.
If Gina never came around, someone else would come along who was both talented and good looking. And when she came along, the sport would experience a jump in mainstream popularity. It’s the way of the world. If the UFC had a championship contender who looked like The Rock, and he faced off against Brock Lesnar, that would be the male version of Cyborg-Carano. Except people like you wouldn’t see it like that, because in your eyes, “sex appeal” is something that only women have. And that’s pretty much definitionally sexist.
Gina is a talented fighter
People here need to cut the bullshit that she only got the title shot because she’s a looker. That’s fuckin bogus..
I STILL poop rainbows.
by Blackout612 on Aug 16, 2009 3:37 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
We're not saying she isn't talented...
We’re also not saying she only got a title shot because she looks good.. She got the title shot because she was the only one with the appeal to make it a worth while promotion.. Gina was the draw and Cyborg was the fighter.. Gina is very talented.. Mainly in womens MT.. But as an MMA fighter she lacks serious basic fundamental skills.. That’s not a knock on her in the least bit..
Gina was undefeated because she was always put in there with women smaller than her.. She was the bully and it never got to the point of being a true MMA fight until last night.. Cyborg was bigger, faster, stronger & a real MMA fighter.. Thus the reason Gina withered so quickly in the fight.. She had zero answer’s when her one major strength didnt work.. Even when it went to the ground and she had mount she was still lost..
Gina and womens MMA isnt going to “stop” from existing.. But it will never get further than it did last night for the simple fact’s of the obvious from last night..
It is kind of similar to Japanese MMA in terms of the main attractions not being able to compete, and the sport hurting because of it.
MMA in Japan become really popular during the Pride days. One of the reasons for this increase in popularity was that some Pro Wrestlers were able to transition over and bring with them fans.
However, once the level of competition increased, these Pro Wrestlers were unable to be competitive. It is one of the many reasons why MMA in Japan suffered. Organizations like K-1 and Pride were unable to just put regular athletes in there and have them be successful. This hurt business.
The attractive females like Carano just aren’t good enough to compete with the real fighters. And when that happens, female MMA suffers.
(And I know the Yakazu Scandal helped end Pride, but the lack of popular Japanese fighters didn’t help much either).
by AlwaysRelaxing on Aug 16, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Ha
They pitted Gina against one of possibly two women in the world capable of beating her, so now she’s a song-and-dance, glorified Muay Thai practitioner? Give me a break… Way to dually disservice Cyborg with that sort of commentary.
I STILL poop rainbows.
by Blackout612 on Aug 16, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
show me a fight ...
That proves otherwise regarding Gina ??
In which of her previous 7 fights before last night show’s her more than MT fighter with weak striking ?? I mean in which of those fights was she showcasing her great wrestling or BJJ ?? Which of those 7 fights was she fighting through adversity ?? I cant remember a fight where she “wasn’t” the bigger fighter and just stood and threw kicks and punches until her smaller counterpart quit..
It's not a dicredit to Cyborg in the least..
My point was that Gina is not as good as people made her out to be and Cyborg is..
It reminds me all too much of the movie where Cyborg is “Tong Po” & Gina is “Jean Claude’s brother (American World Champion)”.. Who honestly never fought anyone.. Cyborg is the real breed of a woman fighter.. Gina is the pretty face to sell tickets.. Not that either aren’t talented, but that there is an obvious talent gap between the 2 and I’ll let you decide how much of that gap truly exist’s..
You have conflicting reason. You say that Gina isn’t good enough to beat Cyborg, yet you (and others) also infer that womens MMA has no depth or real future. Gina is the number three women’s mixed martial artist in the world, period. Even in losing. If you can’t rank more than Megumi Fujii and Cyborg before her, then pack it up. You’re asking me to tout her wrestling or any other individual facet that has not been a neccessity to her successes? Tout Anderson Silva’s. This undersized argument is purely ridiculous. Would you shit a chicken if a 135 pound men’s fighter moved up to take a fight at 145? Never.
If you think Evinger, Young and Kobold are easy fights, you are unqualified to be in this argument.
I STILL poop rainbows.
I think..
Your not understanding my point..
I’m not saying womens MMA is going to cease to exist now.. Or that it doesn’t have a place in the future..
I’m merely stating that the fight last night was the absolute “pinnacle” for mainstream attention regarding womens MMA.. And yes there is no “real” depth for womens MMA at the present time.. You’ve listed a total of 5 women.. 5 women doesn’t make a division, let alone an entire roster for the whole sport of womens MMA.. I’m not saying there wont be in the future either.. I’m saying that in the long run womens MMA will have about as much appeal to the mainstream audience as womens boxing or the WNBA etc.. Which isn’t a bad thing.. It’s just the honest truth and arguing against it really makes no sense.. I dont say it to hurt anyone’s feelings..
Exactly
I can’t stop laughing at all these people stating that women’s MMA is now DEAD because Gina lost. Not to mention those saying that Gina is DONE fighting because she lost or there is no one else out there that is marketable. It is just ignorant statements made by people who keep comparing womens MMA to sports that have female only leagues and their disappointment.
What is even more hillarious are people like AlwaysRelaxing, who have already deemed Coenen not worth of fighting Cyborg because they wen and found her Fight Finder profile on Sherdog…LOL.
Yes, she lost to someone making their debut? Guess what, that person, Cindy Dandois, making their debut is a great grappler and judoka that Strikeforce in the process of signing.
There are not many women that can beat Cyborg, period.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Aug 16, 2009 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Getting a title shot off of a loss just screams legitimacy to me…
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
In fact, after losing both of those title shots (back to back) at HW, he then was given an immediate title shot at LHW at UFC 43.
Several years later, Couture lost to Liddell at UFC 57 and was given a HW title shot in his next fight at UFC 68.
It ends in an armbar or a strangle regardless.
Andrei Arlovski
Got an immediate rematch with Tim Sylvia as well.
Clearly these are different in many ways from bringing in an outside and relatively unknown fighter coming off a loss and giving her a title shot. I think Coenen should have some sort of build-up fight several reasons.
Nonetheless, the fact is that such things aren’t unheard of, even in the UFC. Whether they were any more legitimate when the UFC did it is a fair question, but I have a hunch that many people who would decry Strikeforce doing such a thing would come up with plenty of reasons why the UFC could be justified doing it. (Indeed, every match is different, and there certainly can exist justified reasons for immediate rematches.)
It ends in an armbar or a strangle regardless.
Also...
This is not official. Erin Toughill has the next shot at her at well. The plan was for the winner of Toughill vs Coenen to take the winner of Cyborg/Gina, which the winner would indeed by worth.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Aug 16, 2009 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions
She didn't give up mount
Cyborg got half guard.
Strikeforce did make ESPN’S ticker last night, but gina/cyborg was not listed, just the werdum/kyle and mousasi/babalu results were. strange that they left out the main event and the 1rst ever womens mma title, unless womens mma doesn’t register with them. i know i really enjoyed the live show in st.louis, but that doesn’t always translate into a ratings bonanza. what is Showtime’s MMA record btw? if they did break it, while ufc was countering with 100, that would indeed be impressive.
Not really...
Showtime is a cable subscription channel.. The only true way to evaluate that statistic is to see how many “new” subscribers it generated surrounding the event date..
The people who were going to watch the SF event were already going to watch it anyways.. They had already had subscriptions prior to the event and were planning on watching it.. The true tell is to see how the UFC programming did in regards to the demographic at that time schedule… If it did great ratings that meant it pulled away from “other free” broadcast’s on that same schedule..
Then factor in the amount of people that were recording one or the other while watching one & also number of viewers flipping back and forth.. The SF card ended earlier than alloted for and it was over right before the start of Lesnar/Mir II on Spike so I imagine the ones that were doing dual viewing were all glued in to the final fight on Spike regardless.. Which increases the ratings..
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