Joe Rogan asks How many times can a fighter be KO'ed?: "I was watching the Gilbert Yvel vs....

Joe Rogan asks How many times can a fighter be KO'ed?:

"I was watching the Gilbert Yvel vs. Pedro Rizzo fight, and I saw that Pedro is scheduled to fight in September in Brazil just a couple months after that brutal KO. Just seeing that date after watching that video made me cringe."

"I know there was a lot of debate when Dana told Chuck to stop competing, but I think at this point Pedro is even in worse shape."

"When you read about brain trauma, and you even get to read the experiences fighters post on here about their problems after being KO'ed multiple times it really leads to the question, how many times is too many?"

"Do you think there should be a standard number of times that a fighter has been flatlined in competition where after that he shouldn't be allowed to fight again? We've all seen the videos of Meldrick Taylor struggling to talk, and I watched Terry Norris who was one of my favorite fighters from the 90's barely able to string together a sentence a few years ago in Vegas, and it's just a matter of time before we see guys like this with that kind of damage from MMA."

"Is there something we can do about it? Are there more sophisticated tests that need to be developed to recognize damage? Should it be completely up to the fighter?"

"What say you?"

-- Joe Rogan on the UG

4 months ago Nick Thomas 25 comments 1 recs |

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Comments

Is he saying Chuck Liddell can form a sentence now?

by DirtyML on Jul 4, 2009 8:13 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs

bravo

for Joe. This is an important point that needs to be made.

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by Kid Nate on Jul 4, 2009 8:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

But it’s doctors that need to be making these kind of determinations, not fans or promoters. If Rizzo (or Chuck, for that matter) is cleared to fight by a trained medical doctor, nobody should stand in the way.

If they can’t get licensed here, however, than any promoter overseas (cough Japan cough) that uses these fighters is endangering their lives.

by subo on Jul 4, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wonder how many doctors clear fighters due to

A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.

by iiowyn on Jul 6, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I remember seeing this a few years ago on HBO. Sad stuff. I’m glad to see that Joe is really putting the message out there.

by Deo Wade on Jul 4, 2009 8:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I think before we can start saving fighters from themselves we need to establish a safety net to give them a future outside the cage. Money for Health care, Pensions and job training.

They fight for a living…we can’t just tell them to stop, because they won’t, they’ll just end up fighting where the doctors can’t see them.

by MMA_Messiah on Jul 4, 2009 8:26 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Very Good Point

but safety must come 1st. It’s better to stop someone before they seriously hurt themselves, than to stop them after they’ve become invalids.

by Deo Wade on Jul 4, 2009 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Its a persons choice to pursue a career in MMA, acting, singing,dancing, starting a business or any other career where high sacrifice is required and success is not guaranteed. It is your own responsibility to acquire job skills that can sustain you. There are other professions where you have trouble getting health insurance as well. Believe or not air traffic controllers have trouble getting insured because of the incredible stress the job creates. They are in the same risk bracket as crab fishermen because of the stress induced health problems they can incur.

It is foolish to think that all fighters deserve a safety net simply because they chose a very high risk profession where financial security isn’t close to being guaranteed. Some major league soccer players make 15k-50k a year. They probably won’t ever make enough money to retire on and they will need to acquire new jobs skills or parlay their talents into coaching to survive. But it is their choice to pursue a dream job rather than pursue a more safe and stable career.

by Dropkick434 on Jul 4, 2009 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs

When I said “We” I was refering to the sport….I think the fighters should form an Association and start to fund thier own Health care and Pensions for when the older fighters need to retire.

I definately don’t think the general public should be on the hook….I’m not that socialist :)

by MMA_Messiah on Jul 4, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you were a fighter would you want to pay for retired fighters pensions? People have to work for years to qualify for pensions in corporate and government jobs. I wouldn’t want to cut a check after each fight while wondering if I will ever see any of that money come back to me. And I doubt the rich fighters who don’t need to worry about health insurance or pensions would want to contribute to the lower tiered fighters who do.

by Dropkick434 on Jul 5, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was about to add something similar to my statement. I agree totally.

by Deo Wade on Jul 4, 2009 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Way to support the fighters that give there blood sweat and tear for your Frivolous enertainment! why dont you go hire some poor people to dig a ditch so you can make a bunch of money of there backs,sounds like somthing you’d be into.oh ya I am sure you have know idea how corrupt the fight buisness is yet you still call yourself a fan!

by TLAoutlaw on Jul 5, 2009 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Judging by your ditch digging argument, I am guessing you have no idea how business works period. I support fighters with my PPV dollars. But I don’t feel sorry for people getting into a profession with known pitfalls. Fighters aren’t getting into the business to save the world, they are getting into the business for fame and fortune and they know going in that success is a long shot.

by Dropkick434 on Jul 6, 2009 3:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who do you think will be the first fighter with noticeable brain damage? I would bet on Wandy – he’s taken several KTFOs recently and that can’t be good, but what else are he and others going to do? They’re fighters, that’s perhaps all they know how to do, and everything else seems dull by comparison.

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Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by themachiavellian on Jul 4, 2009 8:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Jonathan Goulet.

That dude is always getting knocked the hell out. Paper chin.

"Apparently, the only way to kill a lion is by rear naked choke...Personally, I'd just kick it in the head."- Bas Rutten

by FutureChamp on Jul 5, 2009 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

James Thompson.

by GeeDub on Jul 5, 2009 5:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Boxers also fight a lot more

Before a boxer even turns pro he sometimes has fought 50 times already….Other than a select few (Jeremy Horn), the average MMA fighter won’t spend anywhere near as long in the cage or take anywhere near as many head shots over his career.

At least that’s the way it is now…perhaps MMA fighters in the future will fight more.

by MMA_Messiah on Jul 4, 2009 8:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Does a glass chin help prevent brain damage?

Look at a guy like Goulet – he goes down when the right kind of breeze hits him. If his chin was better, he’d have to absorb more impact to get the same result. Are flash KO’s actually less dangerous to the brain then getting your skull jostled around 40-50 times on the mat via GnP? I’d argue they are – but I’m not a doctor.

by subo on Jul 4, 2009 10:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I had a similar conversation with a friend and I compared Rampage to Chuck to highlight the point you made.

Chuck: Has taken a moderate amount of punishment over his career and has been knocked out more often in the latter parts of his career. But he seems to be quite affected by it.

Rampage: Has taken the worst beatings I’ve ever seen in an MMA fight (Wandy * 2, Shogun) almost in any competitive fight he has, he is getting clocked by significant blows, Jardine, Forrest, Henderson, etc. He can absorb them somehow.

Overall I’d say the more likely you are to get knocked out, the more likely you are to have the post-concussion syndromes.

I’ve never heard Rampage acting “off-beat” in an interview(other than after he went crazy) or failing to be somewhat intelligent sounding even if what he is saying is stupid (if that makes sense) but I’ve heard Chuck lately over the last few years and he just sounds like he has had a concussion the entire time, and can’t really talk well.

I would have to say that people with weak chins are probably suffering more permanent damage, and maybe even the KO itself is what is causing the more serious long lasting effect.

by DirtyML on Jul 4, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is a very heavy price to pay.

"Stop smiling you are about to be punched in the face !"

by Warhand on Jul 4, 2009 11:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

If you want a pension, safe working conditions, and job security, DO NOT BECOME A PROFESSIONAL FIGHTER.

Keep firing Assholes!

Out out, you demons of stupidity!

by Ubernoober on Jul 4, 2009 11:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I was under the impression the propensity to get brain damage was pretty much genetic. Some significant minority of fighters brains cant take the damage. Most do just fine, with no clear correlation to how many times they actually got hit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dementia_pugilistica

by toxic on Jul 5, 2009 12:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs