CSAC: Josh Barnett Failed Random Drug Test
by Kid Nate on Jul 23, 2009 12:17 PM EDT
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Ariel Helwani gets the scoop from Bill Douglas of the CSAC:
Bill Douglas: ... One of the reasons why it was done so early ahead of time for the bout was one: it was largely an unannounced test. I mean, essentially when the decision was made, Josh had 48 hours to appear to go ahead and take the test...
...
How does the random selection process work? In other words, how do you come to the decision that a particular fighter is going to be tested?
Well, in some cases it's a random selection truthfully. I mean, just whomever the staff member will decide to select, and in some cases if there's prior history, that is also a flag, it is. Especially in the case of athletes that may have a previous violation, as recognized by another athletic commission, it allows us that opportunity to test that individual and require a clean test prior to renewal of a license.
Since this is Barnett's second positive test, does this mean he will never be allowed to fight in California again?
No, actually if you look at this, it is a license denial; a denial of the license for this bout. So it's a little different from some things in the past. There is no suspension here. There is no fine. So theoretically, if Josh were to fight out of country, there'd be no option because we don't have the jurisdiction outside of our boundaries in other countries when it's a case like this. If he were to go to another state, it's really up to that state's athletic commission what action they want to take.
This contradicts Josh Barnett's claims that the test was not unplanned.
Zach Arnold has some interesting commentary about the reaction of fans to the news and the perception that Affliction is more to blame than Barnett:
...with hardcore fans it’s not so much the crime (failing a drug test/PED use in MMA or being involved with questionable people) as it is ‘getting caught’ that these fans care more about. Few people online seemingly get upset about the complete lack of ‘real’ drug testing in Japan, but in the States when someone fails people care but they are more upset with the fighter getting caught than the actual use of drugs in MMA. Sports fans at this point are beyond cynical about all of this, which is sad and unfortunate.
I couldn't agree more. There is a widespread perception that most, if not all, MMA fighters are using some form of Performance Enhancing Drug on at least some occasions. The testing regimes in most jurisdictions are predictable and easily avoided by cycling off the drugs.
Barnett tested positive for Drostanolone, an anabolic steroid that only takes about three weeks to flush out of your system. Clearly had he only had to face testing on the day before the fight as is the norm, he would not have been caught.
No fighters were randomly tested by Nevada in advance of UFC 100 so its entirely possible that every fighter on the card was using similar PEDs, despite the clean results brought back by the testing the NSAC did conduct.
The hypocrisy is thick on this issue and I'm as guilty as anyone. Personally, part of me would rather see Barnett fight, then test positive and be fined afterwards rather than have the whole event disrupted, but that is clearly the selfish and immature part of me.
The serious health risks posed by steroids and the very real advantages they offer make it extremely unfair for competitors to use them because they put their opponents in the position of either competing at a serious disadvantage or risking their own health.
On the other hand, its almost impossible to catch everyone who is using PEDs and the hypocrisy of ineffective drug testing regimes is galling.
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And I am validated...
Thank you, Bill Douglas… for backing up the words you said back when the test was actually implemented.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Am I the only person that 'cares' about PED's?
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Jul 23, 2009 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Me too.
I’d like to take my kids to visit these guys at the UFC 200 expo, not read about how they fell over dead at 42 from a shriveled-testicle induced heart attack and when they hit the ground their head popped open like a gourd and sent the liquefied remains of their brain pouring into the gutter.
Unless somebody gets that shit on video.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Dear Athletic Commissions:
I can haz more random drug tests, please?
Kthnxbai!
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
just keep in mind
that the sport will take enormous PR hits and we’ll regularly have canceled events.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
The PR hits are a joke.
Turn on sportscenter and watch the reaction to Manny’s grand slam last night, people don’t care about Shawn Merriman or ARod either. The PR hits aren’t that important. And frankly, that and canceled events shouldn’t be the AC’s concern. The AC’s concern should be doing everything in the their power to make sure the fighters are clean.
Yeah, you can say that… but baseball is America’s pasttime. There are so many people against MMA in the mainstream media, they’d probably make it a crusade. Of course, the flipside is that MMA journalists can laud the AC’s for the effort to rid the sport of steroids.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions
agreed
about the role of the AC’s.
But the PR hits will be much more serious for MMA than for baseball — a sport with a long and proud national legacy. And the PR hits were serious for Baseball. My day job involves doing pr for a MLB franchise and its been a huge headache.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
Seriously… don’t say the Nationals.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions
I can see the PR angles now…
“The Washington Nationals… uhh, we serve beer at games”
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Hey now!
We’re gonna be good…in 2 or 3 years. Really. We are.
/feel free to continue discussion at SBN site CamdenChat.com – we could use the hits
"We're not the other teams' farm system." - Andy MacPhail
Who? The Orioles? Lemme tell ya something… Felix Pie sucks. Get rid of him quickly. Very quickly.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Or, athletes who are dirty will clean up their acts and we’ll have a better sport for it.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Also, having lived through the dark ages of the sport, I could give a shit about bad PR.
But look – this doesn’t have to kill MMA. Organizations that don’t police themselves will get shit on in the press, and those that take a proactive approach (educating fighters, testing fighters, writing contracts with penalties for steroid use) will succeed. Any group that can respond to something like the Josh Barnett incident with, “Here’s our 19-step plan to improve this situation that we’ve been following since…” will be given a ton of free press.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Jul 23, 2009 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Jul 23, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions
i honestly have a problem with athletes using PEDs, not just “getting caught.” while i do realize it’s the reality of the sport, i still hate to see it. i’d love to see athletic commissions go to even stiffer penalties for failing a drug test.
probably an unpopular opinion, but if fighters faced random drug screens and a five-year suspension if they failed it … you’d probably have fewer guys on the juice.
From the UG:
Check the flight logs of the Ferritas to California
by Nick Thomas on Jul 23, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions
NASA freaking erased the original tapes (so they say), so now they don’t even have the originals.
sad…sad…sad.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 23, 2009 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t call giving notice on an upcoming test and a 48 hour window “Random”.. The CSAC is such a joke.
Well, you can’t cycle down from steroids in 48 hours. So, it really doesn’t matter. The only way he passes it is if he’s on the final days of a cycle.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 11:00 AM EDT up reply actions
That joke caught a major fighter.
Whose laughing?
by Razreshat on Jul 23, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I’m not a drug nazi or anything but I do prefer to TRY to keep PED’s out of my sports. I’d be in favor of testing guys every 1-2 weeks in the time leading up to their fights. Don’t give the chance to cycle off.
Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jul 23, 2009 10:31 AM EDT reply actions 7 recs
That would require quite a bit of money sadly.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
An individual drug screen doesn’t cost that much (urine, not blood), and you could put the cost on the promotion.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Sold.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Jul 23, 2009 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Disagree on fans' perception of PED and "getting caught"
People use “there is no testing overseas” to atack the validity of fighters that have made their name in Japan. Doesn’t this indicate that to the average fan, PED = invalid fighter?
There IS a somewhat wide perception that MMA fighters are using, but until evidence comes out, there is nothing anyone can do about it.
I personally think every fighter should be tested every month while under contract with an organization, with failed tests being a contract breaker. I hate steroids, I think it’s cheating, and just when I was getting to like Barnett, he goes and gets caught being a loser.
The "there is no testing overseas" often comes up
when a fighter who was amazing in Japan looks half as good in the U.S.
It also doesn’t help that alot of other MMA business practices have been pretty shady at times.
Shady isn’t a strong enough word to describe the MMA scene in Japan.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Jul 23, 2009 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
This is just confusing to me.
How can they randomly test someone who isn’t licensed?
I’m glad he was tested and caught, but I really wish these AC’s could get on the same page, stuff like this is confusing, but I’m never going to fault any of them for doing any test.
had a scheduled fight in the state
Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Jul 23, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
That works, but that really doesn’t fit my definition of Random.
this seems like something the entire ABC should get together on and work out, because waiting for people to be scheduled for a fight in a certain state or to get their license renewed in a certain state just leaves too much gray area/room for questions.
Again, I’m not uspet he got tested, just confused by the talk about it being random but also all the talk about him reapplying for a license in the interview on Fanhouse (which really screws things up when combined with Josh’s explanation on his own.
WTF???
Interesting…. No fine or suspension.. Sean Sherk was suspended for a year for testing positive after UFC 73 and was fined $2,500 but for Barnett there is no suspension or fine. UFC 73 took place in California as well.
Even more interesting is that Antonia Silva was suspended a year and fined $2500 by the CSAC after testing positive for PEDs and the CSAC and every other athletic commission said they would never license him to fight in the US ever again if he fought overseas during his US suspension.
Why is Barnett not getting a fine or a suspension??? And more importantly why are they saying it’s out of their hands if he fights overseas?
he didn't have a license
and his application was denied when he failed the test.
Sherk and Silva were licensed when they failed their tests and where therefore fined and suspended.
Barnett’s license had lapsed and he was getting it renewed.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
whats fishy to me is....
This one of the first randoms I have ever seen and it so happens to be on afflictions headliner.
For someone reason this reads Dana White all over it. I mean he knew Josh had prior history why not target him, If vitor steps in to replace Josh, now Dana has leverage signing vitor. He has more credibility win or lose since he just fought the top hw. He can go on to bash Fedor for fighting a mw as well.
No joke here guys, this could be the final straw for affliction. Nobody ever thought that zuffa executive Marc Ratner doesn’t have ties to all the commissions.
Good bye Affliction
"What do you want from me?..... A Slap?"
by xtremecouture on Jul 23, 2009 11:19 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
except
that the UFC’s relations with the CSAC are so bad they haven’t done an event there in years and Affliction is the home town team in Cali.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jul 23, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
They are having a UFC event soon, Staples Center. Machida vs Shogun!
Everyone is going to be holding their breath for that one.
=)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 23, 2009 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
The only thing fishy in all of this is Josh Barnett. The headline needs to be:
“WELL-KNOWN CHEATER JOSH BARNETT CAUGHT CHEATING AGAIN.”
(With a sub-head that says, “CHEATER, CHEATER, DROSTANOLONE-EATER.”)
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Jul 23, 2009 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Well, Barnett had a history.. so I see it happening.
Follow me on Twitter @lelandroling
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
by Leland Roling on Jul 23, 2009 11:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Random pee and blood tests. Random pee and blood tests. Random pee and blood tests. Random pee and blood tests. Random pee and blood tests.
This shows that random tests can work. Why not implement it? The only reason the major sports don’t is because the player’s unions have fought it tooth and nail. There is no such entity to fight for the fighters in this case.
BOOSH
Count me among the jaded fans who only care if a fighter gets caught.
I fell in love with MMA during semi-early days of PRIDE, where it was generally understood that most everyone was taking one form of PED or another. These days, you’re kidding yourself if you truly believe most athletes in any major sport aren’t gobbling up the latest designer hormones, for which there are no tests. It’s just par for the course now. You can either accept it or unleash your moral indignation with a well-worded temper tantrum. Either way, the shit is going down.
Just like taking any test (reference your high school or college here), people always find ways to cheat.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jul 23, 2009 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
And that makes it OK so we should throw our hands up and not try to catch them.
When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are in a confederacy against him. - Jonathan Swift
by Derek Suboticki on Jul 23, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Can someone explain to me the difference between license denial and what happened to Giant Silva?
Srsly, why is it that what Barnett did is ok and he’s free to fight anywhere else he wants without any reprocussions but Giant Silva was black balled by the CSAC when he snubbed his nose at them and fought overseas after a positive test?
Someone explain this to me.
barnett doesn’t have a license to fight in CA, so they can’t suspend him.
They did suspend Silva, because he did have a license, they got mad at Silva for going around the suspension. We don’t know if they’ll actually keep Silva suspended/refuse to license him, they said they would, but they also let Belfort fight even though he fought in Japan while his Nevada license was suspended.
As for Barnett, to my knowledge they haven’t said anything about when/if they ever will let him reapply for a license or what the process for that would be.
You have to agree to a contract and penalties in the contract in order for the athletic commission to actually punish you. Since, Barnett’s license was expired he essentially had no agreement with them.
Not like he is going away unpunished. He’s been denied license and CSAC will continue to deny him license throughout the US until they see fit.
I don't see the difference....
It seems like a HUGE technicality that they wouldn’t suspend him for testing positive while applying for a license but WOULD suspend him if he tested positive while having a license.
Josh Barnett his ruined this entire event and I can only assume he has always been cycling off and on this, time to step up to GHB Josh, they dont do blood tests.
And if there are steroids with such a short cycle (3 weeks) then it is pretty easy to believe a lot of people are doing this, that cannot afford GHB or anything better.
Why fool around with trying to fool your body into producing HGH with GHB when you could just take HGH?
by An Old Friend on Jul 23, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Just a little wikipedia research. I was going to question GHB as a performance enhancer (it’s well known as a date rape drug), and suggest that the OP might have meant HGH. But then I saw that some people use it a HGH precursor (or something like that). You can learn a lot about steroids and the like by following this sport.
by An Old Friend on Jul 23, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, there’s a great slogan for the sport:
“MMA: You’ll learn about steroids!”
They should make Josh do one of those “The More You Know” videos.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
""with hardcore fans it’s not so much the crime (failing a drug test/PED use in MMA or being involved with questionable people) as it is ‘getting caught’ that these fans care more about. Few people online seemingly get upset about the complete lack of ‘real’ drug testing in Japan, but in the States when someone fails people care but they are more upset with the fighter getting caught than the actual use of drugs in MMA. Sports fans at this point are beyond cynical about all of this, which is sad and unfortunate""
Bullshit! I am a hardcore fan and I am upset that Barnett, Shamrock, Sylvia, Leben, Sherk, Bonnar, etcc all used steroids. Not that they got caught, but that they used drugs to enhance themselves which is unfair for their competition. Whoever made this statement is a complete idiot.
I don't like steroids
And I never liked the argument that Japan was the only place that provided shelter. The time between testing periods in MMA for US events provides plenty of time for fighters to use PEDs to train. I’m not surprised that the one fighter tested semi-randomly got popped.
Should also be noted not every drug/steroid test is the same. CSAC uses a Olympic testing capable lab which will pick up far more dirt than if a sample is sent to a less sophisticated lab.
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