Tom Atencio on His Fight at Ultimate Chaos and Affliction Trilogy
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 28, 2009 9:13 PM EDT
194 comments
Promoted from the FanPosts by Kid Nate.
Tom Atencio talked to mmaweekly on his last fight:
Dude, I don’t remember (expletive). All I remember was being on my back and him above me and me kicking away, and just scrambling to get my wits, just get back in the game... Second round, I felt fine. Actually, when we got back up again and started brawling, I was fine. It was just a flash knockout. I didn’t even know until I watched the video last night. I saw myself wobble and go down. I literally just remember being on my back.
I’ve been hit. I knew that he wasn’t going to do anything that I haven’t experienced, but I gotta say, he dropped me, man. I wasn’t expecting that.I’m gonna figure out where to go from here. I love this sport, but I hate this feeling. I feel like a Mack Truck hit me. My whole body hurts. It’s hard to walk or do anything. But I just love it. Yeah, it was everything I’ve always known. It was a war. And there’s nothing better than knowing he was beating my ass and I came back from a virtual loss. I don’t know; it’s weird that I love it.
He also confirmed Gilbert Yvel vs. Paul Buentello for their third show:
Yep, that’s the fight. I feel bad for Pedro. I’d like to find out how Pedro is doing.
On Gomi fighting in Affliction Trilogy:
Yeah, we’re still working on it, we’re finalizing everything, but it looks like it’s gonna go through. I’m not 100-percent yet, but we’re still working on it for sure.. I don’t want to say (his opponent) because it’s up in the air.
On Matt Lindland:
We’re not going to use Matt this fight. It’s just like Tim Sylvia. We couldn’t use him in the second fight because he lost, and for us to bring him back again, we might as well bring everybody back, and then no one will show up for the fights. But we have to switch it up. If somebody wins, yeah, we’ll bring him back, but it’s only our third fight.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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It’s just like Tim Sylvia. We couldn’t use him in the second fight because he lost, and for us to bring him back again, we might as well bring everybody back, and then no one will show up for the fights
Um, they were going to use Tim Sylvia until he got knocked the fuck out by Ray Mercer.
by subo on Jun 28, 2009 9:29 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yeah but that was for the third show..
where if he won against mercer, he would be coming off a win..
think subo think! ;P
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 28, 2009 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
where if he won against mercer, he wouldbe coming off a win..not be risking brain damage by fighting in a month..
Fixed :p
by subo on Jun 28, 2009 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
think subo think! ;P
:P
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, growing up as a child Kimbo Slice was never given any bread with his meals. This is why he insists people... give him his bread."
by xFenixKnightx on Jun 28, 2009 9:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That’s a hilarious sig line, by the way.
by subo on Jun 28, 2009 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sarcasm?
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, growing up as a child Kimbo Slice was never given any bread with his meals. This is why he insists people... give him his bread."
by xFenixKnightx on Jun 29, 2009 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gratsi =)
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, growing up as a child Kimbo Slice was never given any bread with his meals. This is why he insists people... give him his bread."
by xFenixKnightx on Jun 29, 2009 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he threw a couple of punches
even after the ref stopped it haha.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 28, 2009 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gomi's got a track record of pulling that shit
there were some ugly scenes in PRIDE.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 28, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only if by ‘track record’ and ‘ugly scenes’ you mean one fight against Luiz Azeredo.
by ilostmydog on Jun 28, 2009 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that was just the worst one
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 29, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know, I actually hope Affliction sticks around for awhile. Tom seems like a good dude, and the Affliction product has improved with each show.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
by Mike Fagan on Jun 28, 2009 10:33 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
I've enjoyed both Affliction events immensely
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 28, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boo. A pox on whoever pays Fedor to stay out of the UFC.
by subo on Jun 28, 2009 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fedor would stay outside of the UFC for free
Keep firing Assholes!
Out out, you demons of stupidity!
by Ubernoober on Jun 28, 2009 11:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Affliction events are the best to bet on.
by goodbones on Jun 28, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nein.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
by Mike Fagan on Jun 29, 2009 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would agree with this, but I really hate seeing stupid decisions and mindsets validated. if they had done things more intelligently then I would be glad to have them around.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 28, 2009 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why wouldn’t people want Affliction to stick around?
For the life of me, I will never understand these people who want non-UFC promotions to fail. Affliction has put on two high quality events, yet people come up with the most absurd criticisms, like iiowyn above. Oh, he says “they haven’t done things intelligently”? What the hell does that even mean? So, because they are losing money, the shows somehow suffer? Do the fights become tainted, no matter how they unfold, simply because the company isn’t living up to a nebulous standard for “intelligence”? Someone explain that to me, because it makes zero freaking sense.
Why, sir, thank you for this delicious hamburger! I will savor it, however, I hope your burger joint fails due to your lack of intelligence! Yaaaaaaaaaay! WTF, seriously.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
I actually agree with iiowyn for the same point, they are putting on good shows but they aren’t helping the industry because they are boneheads. It’s the same logic that made me wish for EliteXC’s death and revel in Strikeforce’s growth or laugh at Dream and hope WVR rises to great heights. Affliction losing money (and not just a little we are talking tens of millions of dollars) is the kind of thing that makes other investors shy away from the sport and puts fighters in odd situations. I actually think Atencio is a good guy and means well and it’s a real shame that they couldn’t of put this whole thing together with an actually working business model but at this point they are just eating up money in a very visible way. Here’s hoping that the organization that ends up filling their space and employing their fighters has it’s shit together better.
Lets face facts, it doesn’t matter how delicious the hamburger is if the franchise is losing tens of millions of dollars one each one then their fate is already sealed anyway. The end all and be all of MMA is not in just putting on a good show or two it’s being able to stick around and grow long term because it’s the ability to stick around and grow in a positive manner that is good for the fans and the fighters in the long run too.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 1:54 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Affliction is NOT the reason why investors will shy away, in fact, its due to Affliction the likes of Trump, Golden Boy, and others have been associated with MMA.
I mean, its not even a fair comparison to mention EliteXC and Affliction in terms of being bad for the sport. Not even close.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Those aren’t investors as much as other groups making money off Affliction. Now if Golden Boy decided to take this MMA thing and run with it you might really have something but them feasting off the Affliction carcass doesn’t really do much good. As far as Trump goes everyone in the investment world knows how he works.
I didn’t mean to insinuate that Affliction was comparibly bad for the sport as EliteXC was just that they really aren’t doing a lot of good for it either. EliteXC really ended up being a pox on the sport in the end. Affliction’s story is much sadder because there was so much more promise in what they were trying to do that the other failed orgs in the junk pile but still they are giving the impression to outside investors that going up against the UFC like that is a good way to just throw away money.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exposure to the main media leads to investors.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Successful exposure leads to investors, massive public failure leads to investors looking for smarter places to invest money.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which would apply to someone like EliteXC, not Affliction.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That specific point would apply to both. In this economy don’t think that potential investors aren’t looking hard before tossing money in and they will see the same things we all see when we look at Afflcition from a business perspective, only they won’t see all the things Afflcition has done outside of that.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also,
Are you arguing that investors trying to compete against the UFC will shy away?
Why would anyone put so much emphasis in this, anyway.
What? All investors have to do is look at the UFC numbers and see how profitable it has been, which is the main reason a lot of people have put money into MMA.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
First off, why is the “end all and be all of MMA” being able to stick around?
Second, it’s pretty clear that Affliction’s biggest error was signing guys like Sylvia, Lindland, and Barnett to big money, multi-fight deals. They severely overestimated worth or had to guarantee huge money to keep these guys out of the UFC or Japan.
But they made huge strides between the first and second shows, in my opinion. They cut down on a lot of the theatrics. I could be mistaken, but they refrained from using a live band. They didn’t use Michael Buffer (who makes a shit ton of money per card, I believe). They weren’t afraid to cut losses and move the card to L.A. from Vegas when it was clear they weren’t gonna get a fair shot there.
Of course they aren’t perfect, but they do seem to be making an honest effort to learn from their mistakes. This is nothing like EliteXC which was given a golden ticket with the CBS deal and mucked that up.
Twitter: @Mike_Fagan_13
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
by Mike Fagan on Jun 29, 2009 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does no one remember how abysmal Tito Ortiz was as an announcer?
by subo on Jun 29, 2009 2:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whats your point? Tito is a horrible announces? Yup, you got him there.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not just Tito, the announcing across the board was a joke.
by MMAcGyver on Jun 29, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly. They have a promoter who is not a boxing scumbag, who loves the sport, and is willing to learn from his mistakes (which he admits) and is trying to rectify them. Plus, those who want promotions to perform like those that have been around are expectations that are just not realistic. This upcoming show will only be their third. People tend to criticize them like they have been around for years.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because for a company the goal should be profit and growth over a long term not burn out fast and lose lots of money. The end all and be all of MMA is to help MMA to grow as a whole as an industry not to have a couple of flashes in the pan that give hardcore fans a moment of pleasure. I love watching a variety of MMA now but what I’d really love the most is to be able to watch even more of it in the future and to enjoy this sport for the rest of my days.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because for a company the goal should be profit and growth over a long term not burn out fast and lose lots of money.
Yeah, why can’t everyone just rake in millions and millions of dollars like the UFC? I mean, it’s not like the UFC went through several years of massive debt to get where they are or anything.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, its not like most companies lose money in the beginning to get a share of the market and make a splash in the scene. Everyone knows most companies are profitable their first year of existence or venturing into a new market.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well the UFC almost did fail, if they did then we wouldn’t all be here talking about MMA now so that is also an example of why the business side of the sport is so damn important to the future of the sport.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly, they almost did, and if you would use your current criteria on them at that stage of their history, you wouldn’t have supported them, and would have rooted them to fail?
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No I would of looked at what they were doing in detail and decided from there if the business plan was sound. I’m not poo pooing on Afflction because they are losing tens of millions of dollars I am down on them because those losses are self inflicted wounds that came from some very bad deals and a utter lack of long term planning.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, but, I mean you make it sound like they folded already after their first show. Who is to say they can’t correct their errors, which they admit they have made?
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Spot on. Whether you start small or start big, at some point, if you have a business thats gonna revolve around ppvs, you are gonna have to bite the bullet and promote the fuck out of a shows that are be expensive to put on. Its up to Affliction to keep improving their shows as well as managing their expenses, which they have managed to do between Banned and DOR and Im sure they will make improvements between DOR and Trilogy too. So whilst they may have lost money on Affliction 1 and 2, and they may very well lose money on Affliction’s 3, 4, 5 and 6 too…….if they are then able to generate solid ppv revenue and reduce their expenses, they could see that $40mil – $50mil investment of theirs turn into a business capable of generating a good money.
Is it guaranteed? No. Is it high risk? Absolutely. Is there at point at which they will pull out? Sure, if their targets arent being met. But people seem to think because they havent made money they are failing. I dont understand that thought process. They’ve invested $5mil – $10mil or whatever in building the Affliction Ent brand. Will the investment payoff?? Time will tell, but good luck to them.
by GeeDub on Jun 29, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah. But The sad thing is,
Those improvements could be too little too late. And we might not get to see an affliction 4,5 or 6.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe, but the most important point is the ppv buy numbers imo. If they are meeting their targets (whether thats 75, 100k, 200k) it would be hard for Affliction to pull out. I mean, they have so many areas where they can easily cut costs. Like they did at the start, dropping the other Buffer, no live music……….not to mention salary reductions, fine tuning their advertising expenses and other efficiency improvements.
Its better to drop $15mil over 3 cards and fail knowing you gave it your best shot, than it is to drop $5mil over the same 3 cards and wonder what you could have done if you had attracted better fighters or spent more on marketing and advertising. Good on em for having the balls to get in there, lay it all on the line and put on the best shows they can.
by GeeDub on Jun 29, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one is saying that aspect isn’t important. We’re saying that there isn’t a single MMA company around, other than perhaps Strikeforce, that hasn’t gone through financial turmoil in the last decade plus to get where they are.
That’s still unrelated to the question of why a fan of MMA would root for a promotion such as Affliction to fail. Wishing they did business more efficiently is one thing. I think everyone who cares about the sport wants that. Just because it may take some time for the promotion to find it’s rhythm, if they’re able to survive this next show, doesn’t mean people should be rooting for them to fail.
Thankfully, we had far more patience with the UFC early into it’s second incarnation than some people here apparently would have.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 2:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, and even if Strikeforce has some growing pains getting bigger and start to lose a little money here and there, it doesn’t mean that we will start to root against them because they are somehow harming the sport.
We will root them to succeed and support them even more.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Strikeforce started strong and has grown from there because they made smart decisions. When has Strikeforce been on the losing end of the business?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Strikeforce had YEARS of experience losing money in kickboxing.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So Dana had experience with boxing, Coker had experience with kickboxing and Tom sold t-shirts.
by MMAcGyver on Jun 29, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, which is why Affliction had a much larger learning curve.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, a learning curve that likely won’t be overcome.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m thankful that I got to see Fedor fight a couple times and I really liked how they showed the under card free on cable.
by MMAcGyver on Jun 29, 2009 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We will see if they can overcome it, but either way, it will be good. Either they will keep going, or they will hand off their work to GB, etc.
More MMA with big names to us MMA fans is always a plus.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m not rooting for them to go under I just am just seeing the writing on the wall. Whether I rooted for it or not it is what it is. Hell I will enjoy their shows while they last but I’m not going to waste time hoping that they will survive when they seem to be doing all they can to commit business suicide. I’m down on them because of their wasted potential and utterly boneheaded decisions that have made them such a mess.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This applies to EliteXC, which was on CBS, WAY more than it does to Affliction.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except they’re not doing all they can to commit business suicide. In their very short history, they’ve shown that they can at least attempt to address much of what ails them. Whether or not its enough is a different matter.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s why we had to go through months of silly talk about counter-programming UFC 100 right, because they are trying to adress what ails them. They are just throwing ideas and money at the wall hoping something sticks.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or just getting some publicity and have people keep talking about them?
=)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s just simply not true. Most everything they’ve done is try to cut back. No more band. No more Michael Buffer. Fighters they’ve signed, since their initial wave of crazy contracts, have been at much more reasonable rates. They’re not stacking the show with the same fighters this time around, though some of that was out of their hands, but Attencio said that was the plan going forward regardless. And all of this has been openly acknowledged by Affliction people. They identified many of the things that would’ve prevented even a third show.
We’ll just have to see what happens. It’s more than a 50/50 chance that they’ll fold, but hopefully their investors are committed.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If its the companies goal to put on 3 incredible cards, and spend their own money doing so, what would be the argument against this?
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well in that case wishing for them to be around is silly because their goal was just 3 cards. I’m not arguing against Affliction I am pointing out that I rather have a company putting on quality future cards that I can enjoy for years to come rather than a flash in the pan. If they had done it right to start with they may of been huge but they didn’t. Hopefully the company that comes next will do a better job with the business plan and will actually give me an organization to get excited about being around long term.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
When I want a company to have a sound strategy, long term goals, and ability to make money outside of the UFC, I will tune into Strikeforce.
If I want to see some stacked cards in North America that are outside of the UFC, that would otherwise not ever be available to us to see, then I will watch Affliction.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And who will you watch for that once Affliction folds?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Of course you agree with iiowyn. I’m starting to think you’re one of those infamous Zuffa paid posters.
You’re creating too many strawmen here.
Nothing that you just wrote comes remotely close to answering the question of why a fan of MMA would root for a promotion, one that puts on high quality shows, to fail. If the proverbial hamburger is delicious, I’m going to continue to enjoy it for as long as I can regardless of what is happening to the restaurant.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 2:16 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
speaking of infamous paid posters
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 29, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions 8 recs
Is that my label now from the BE staff? A paid poster? LOL.
I thought you guys knew better than that.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You forgot the “=)”
=P
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m starting to think you’re one of those infamous Zuffa paid posters.
So you reply with the most retarded of all strawmen? Seriously does everyone who has a different opinion than you on a subject have to be some kind of secret paid hitman? Is only your opinion the one people are allowed to have? Grow up.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’ve yet to answer the question. If a little sarcasm is enough to derail your argument, then so be it.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 2:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What question, I told you my opinion, you didn’t like my opinon so you said something retarded. My point isn’t derailed, what more do you want? I enjoy stability and before I invest my time following an organization I want to know it will be around for me to enjoy in the future. I’m not a fan because it’s hip I am a fan who enjoys leagues and watching guys develop and move up and down the rankings, Affliction is the Fedor show, the entire organization is built around guys to undercard a Fedor fight or to build for the next Fedor fight and they show no signs at all of being in this business for the long haul. I’ll go watch some Strikeforce or perhaps some Sengoku or maybe even Bellator who have all demonstrated that they will be there offering me quality entertainment years from now too.
The burgers all taste the same but the knowledge that I will be able to still get that burger this time next year makes it a much better burger to me. Why become a fan of a burger you may never get to eat again?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So you are a fan of stability, yet you are discounting Affliction after a couple of events?
Makes no sense to me. Every start up company loses money in the beginning. If investors had your criteria, start up companies wouldn’t be given enough time to succeed.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He doesn’t have a reasonable answer for that one. Why? Because there isn’t one.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Strikeforce started strong and has grown amazingly with never a sign of losing money, WVR has a backer that we know will be there long term and is dedicated to seeing them grow, Bellator jumped right out of the gate with a very detailed plan and seems to be exceeding expectations. I don’t know perhaps the whole “they are all going to lose millions and millions getting established” arguement doesn’t really hold the water some people seem to think it does.
Start up companies know they are going to lose money on the start up but most can show you a detailed plan and timeline as to when they will get to profitablility, they don’t just get a business loan and start winging it hoping for the best. I’m not talking about start up companies that have long term business plans where they have set aside for the early losses and have developed a timeline for getting to profetability I am talking about a MMA organization who went in and started randomly tossing things against the wall and tossing around money hoping something would catch on. Lord knows you don’t have to have a business degree to look at what Afflcition had done compared to all the current MMA companies outside of Zuffa and tell that some did it right and some didn’t have a working plan.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
WVR lost tons of money, but because they have a great investors, they are able to overcome it. There is no way for you to even know if Bellator has lost money or not. Most likely, they lost a good amount of money on their first year, but it was all worth it and a great investment if they can get on ESPN or another station for their second season.
Strikeforce is the exception, but they have lost money on shows as well.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
WVR knew what they had and what they needed to do, yes they lose a lot of money but they do seem to have a real plan they are following and things are starting to turn. Bellator may of lost money but they had a rock solid plan in place to make this thing work and that is the big difference between them (or WVR) losing money and Affliction hemmorhaging money. Losing it as part of the plan while obtaining your growth goals then your are being successful at that point. There is a huge difference in losing money as a investment in the future of your company and burning through money for the sake of putting together a couple of shows and playing at MMA promoter for a year or two.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its only a rock solid plan if it succeeds right?
=)
Once again, they have only had 2 shows. Their business plan was to make a splash on MMA with with their first 3 shows, which they have done.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sometimes even a good plan fails but how often does a shitty plan succeed?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It succeeds when it changes to a good plan.
=)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even if a miracle happened it would still be absolutly no plan on their part, Affliction started out playing at being promoters and didn’t even take it seriously until after the lost millions upon millions on the first show. They started out with a ship full of holes and have been bailing water ever since.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its funny how you can predict that even if something positive happened in the future, they will still have no plan. =)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yep but this isn’t rocket science, even Atencio has said that they didn’t take this seriously enough at the start. If they had had a plan and done even a minimum of research then it would of been very obvious in the way they have been ran.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, it was the UFC’s plan to lose 40+ million dollars. I’m sure they expected some loss, but not that much. Not when they were that close to failing because of debt.
Affliction isn’t trying to be some backyard, square-caged show. They’re trying to grab a noticeable market share. I’m sure all parties involved expected to lose money just the same as the UFC did. How they handle that situation is what counts.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The UFC lost $34 million in 5 years (and 10 million of that was production cost they paid for the first season of TUF). Affliction may beat that in a year and a half, they won’t have 5 to build at this rate. Of course the UFC was also building the entire industry not just a single promotion too, MMA the sport was a footnote in the US at the time. Now MMA is very popular and the situations are very different, Affliction isn’t trying to swim against the stream in a hostile enviroment with a sport no one has heard of, they are sitting in a world where the actual sport is fairly well accepted and very popular.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:55 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
The Fertittas and Dana White cared about building the UFC, nothing more. They were right to do so, too.
No one is saying that Afflicition hasn’t made some pretty stupid decisions. However, this discussion started over why someone would root for the promotion to fail and if that was a reasonable thing to do. You have admitted that you’re not rooting for them to fail, so what at we getting at here? Because, again, no one denies that Affliction has effed up.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 4:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Fertittas and White care about making the UFC the top of the heap but don’t think they don’t want the regional feeder leagues below them to also be popular because that’s where the fighters develop at. Still when they were building the UFC and loosing all that money they fight that was being waged wasn’t just to get the UFC on top it was to make the sport legitimate and popular. Afflction is living in a MMA world that the UFC created with all that time money and effort from the last 8 years, they don’t have to spend millions to legitimize the whole sport or to build a fanbase they just have to tap what exist.
When did iiowyn say he was rooting for them to fail? I was agreeing with his statement. I don’t care for them to stick around because I am hoping that someone smarter will take their place. People make their decisions for all sorts of reasons and it’s just fine, opinions are opinions, you don;t have to agree with each other to accept that.
I have accepted that they are going to fail and won’t miss them when they are gone because I have faith the industry will fill the void (hopefully with something better). I just don’t feel the need to support stupid even if it does bring me Fedor fights occasionally. That is what we are getting at here.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 4:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uh, it was clearly implied when iiowyn said he disagreed with Mike’s posting of the following:
You know, I actually hope Affliction sticks around for awhile.
I’ve accepted that the probability of failure is likely, too. However, I don’t see the need to shit all over the people who are trying and, at least in the short term, succeeding at putting on high quality MMA events. There seems to be the overbearing need by some to just tear down everything that isn’t operating with the UFC’s efficiency, which I just don’t understand.
Yes, if Affliction fails, there will be something to replace it down the road. However, that has yet to materialize. In the here and now, we have a pretty strong Affliction card coming up and I intend to enjoy it.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 5:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am against stupidity succeeding, especially when it waters down the content overall. I am for a unified league/promotion with all the best fighters, and so far the closets and best run promotion to that is the UFC. So I hope affliction fails and allows the fighters it has under contract to go and hopefully join promotions with divisions deep enough to have meaningful fights for years to come, and by that I mean I hope the fighters join the UFC or WEC.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeppers.
Anyone else need it spelled out more?
by subo on Jun 29, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nope, the people who disagree with that theory fully understand. =)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A unified league...
…would be great. If they had a union. See: MLB, NFL, NBA, etc.
BOOSH
by Farthammer on Jun 29, 2009 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s the unified league that normally leads to the formation of a union not the other way around.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Either way, fight entertainment doesn’t really work like that, though.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Problem is...
A unified league has teams within that an individual can use as leverage to get the best deal possible. Don’t want to pay me? Fine, there’s 5 other teams willing to do so.
A fighter in the league that you propose (UFC is the only one), would not be able to do that and would be forced to do what the UFC wanted.
BOOSH
by Farthammer on Jun 29, 2009 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which is why a union would finally form, this isn’t a chicken or egg arguement it’s a cause and effect arguement, if the UFC became a league then the fighters would have to have a union and would form one shortly after.
by who me on Jun 30, 2009 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Which is probably why the UFC won’t give them the opportunity to do that.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 30, 2009 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Affliction is more than just the main event. Their two cards have been fairly stacked with intriguing matches.
If you think these shows all offer the same thing, that MMA is some relativistic playground where it doesn’t matter who is in the cage, then there really isn’t much more to talk about here. You go enjoy that next Brawl in the Barn, if they’re stable enough, and I’ll support Affliction for as long as they’re putting on quality shows. And who knows? Maybe might loyalty just might be rewarded in the end.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The first Affliction card was packed with stars but not a single one of those fights was a big match up (besides the Fedor fight), it was obvious from the start who was set up to win. The second card was a bit better but then you had crap like Barnett vs Yvel in there too. They were both good cards but they weren’t earthshattering like some people seem to think they were. Affliction’s matchmaking leaves a lot to be desired on a lot of levels but honestly that doesn’t matter if your not going to be around long term to build off the matchmaking anyway.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which is something they can improve on since they have only had 2 cards. Both financially and with their matchups.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At what point do you turn it around? Seriously They are burining through money at a rate that makes the IFL look frugal and still aren’t getting anywhere.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sengoku burned money for a whole year putting on way more cards. Its impossible for anyone to say they should have mode money already on their first card.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or second. Do we not remember Afflictions business plan?
They wanted to start being profitable after their third event, and then re-evaluate.
Another thing is that it is unfair to judge Affliction like we do Bellator and Strikeforce, since they have been in the fighting promotion industry for decades. Affliction is coming from retail to get some footing into promoting shows and promote their clothing brand as well. You can see why someone like Affliction would need more time to understand how it all works.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Life isn’t fair and the business world isn’t a nice place. Just because they were too stupid to hire someone from the start with some actual promotional experience is just another one of those things that points to them not knowing what they are doing.
Having a goal and having a plan are two completly separate things. Do you really think the third event will be profitable? You can either draw it out in detail how you intend to achieve that goal or you can toss money at the wall and just hope you get there, which way do you think will actually succeed?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even if Affliction fails and Golden Boy and Trump start a new promotion based on the Affliction Entertainment assets, it would be no different to me. Affliction did what they wanted to do, Golden Boy and Trump will carry on. Just like EliteXC folded and Strikeforce benefited, in the end it helped a promotion who only got bigger by the popularity and talent EliteXC was able to develop.
If its not profitable, then, it is up to them whether they call it quits or re-evaluate their plan, which is what most companies do anyways. This is no different.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trump isn’t going to do squat, they just rent out Donalds name. Now if Golden Boy decides to jump into MMA for real then the next company that fills the void should be something that may be worth getting excited about. It may be no different to you but it will be a completly different company with a completly different way of doing things, which is the point I made a couple of hours ago. Once the chaff gets out of the way perhaps something worthwhile will take it’s place.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Golden Boy will still be the same Golden Boy, no?
=)
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Golden Boy would still be the same Golden Boy but Golden Boy MMA definatly wouldn’t be Afflction MMA.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Again, Affliction has shown in their one chance between their first two shows that they are cognizant of their screwups and have at least tried to address them in an effort to keep going.
They have another such opportunity coming up. We’ll see what happens. Though, to say they don’t have people who know how to run a profitable promotion behind them is rather silly. They have one of the best in the world in Golden Boy.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Golden Boy is getting paid to produce the shows and quite possibly waiting in the wings to buy the assets at firesale prices but they definatly aren’t “behind” this any more than Donald Trump is ’behind" Affliction.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Right, and production is a pretty important part of putting on shows of that scale. I doubt Golden Boy is just along for the ride, indifferent to it success or failure, because they enjoy large gatherings of people. Oscar and Co. want money. Lots of it.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Golden Boy gets paid to produce whether it’s successful or not. Now if Golden Boy is wanting to use this as a learning experience before they jump into MMA promotion then there could very well could just be waiting for this to fall apart so they can scoop up the good parts for themselves. Afflcition folding may be what they are waiting for. It wouldn’t be the first time, heck this sport is built on picking the bones for the good parts of the org that came before you.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 4:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It should also be pointed out that Golden Boy isn’t a bunch of deep pocket promotional geniuses, they are a group that has been very adept at spending HBO’s money and making a profit out of it for themselves. The Boxing business model and the MMA business model aren’t even similar in that area.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 4:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fair enough, but that still doesn’t mean Golden Boy is doing just enough to not succeed on Affliction’s behalf.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 4:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They could have taken a look at the history of MMA organizations and done some research on what works and what is a colossal waste of money. Take advantage of the time and money spent by other people.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sengoku is building towards something with all that money spent, Affliction is throwing money against the wall hoping something catches on.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t see this as a reason to root against them.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m not rooting against them I am just facing the truth of the matter. There is no reason to put my support behind something that is just going to let me down in the end. They will get their three cards and that will be that and then they will become another wikipedia entry under Defunct promotions. Hopefully something will rise from those asses and do it better the next time.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How Barnett/Yvel played out is irrelevant. Lots of people were looking forward to that fight for myriad reasons.
Bottom line is that they were stacked cards in comparison to what almost all non-UFC US promotions have had to offer. Heck, they were certainly more intriguing than many of the ‘filler UFCs’, as I like to call them; comparable to some of the big UFC shows, even.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 3:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t forget the failed non Fedro card.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One valid reason that one might want Affliction to die would be so that the elites of their roster can be absorbed by the UFC and we can have more of the best fighting each other. I want Arlovski/Kongo, Sylvia/Lesnar, Barnett/Mir, etc., etc., infinitum.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 29, 2009 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except there is no such guarantee, since Barnett and Fedor are not in great terms with the UFC.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn’t mention Fedor and as far as Barnett, it sounds like both parties are warming to each other.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 29, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I am not so sure Barnett would ever fight for DSE or Zuffa people.
He can really hold onto grudges.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dream would be doubtful due to his history with the people from Pride who never paid him but Barnett has stated that he would like to fight for the UFC again. The key for him would be getting the money he wants, Barnett would only go there if he was getting the right payday.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why a fan of MMA would root for a promotion, one that puts on high quality shows, to fail
To see the assets used in said shows go to organizations that I can trust to stay around, to create a history of the best fighters fighting each other and avoiding most of the PRIDE vs. UFC bullshit of the past.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just say you want all the best fighters in the UFC. Makes it a lot easier.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is the thing, I like the UFC because it is the closest to what I desire for the sport. Dammit I just want the shortest route to the fights I want to see, in a schedule I can count on.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
I never understood why people root against them. Who the hell wants less fights??
by mythbuster on Jun 29, 2009 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yep,
they may have a very flawed business model, but they do provide very good fights for the fans. :)
hopefully if when they die, the UFC can pick up the pieces. (that russian and a few others)..
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Um,
This is a false fan boy theory. If Affliction fails, it won’t mean Fedor will be in the UFC, unless they are willing to co-promote with M-1.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fedor is no longer with M-1, and M-1 is now called adrenaline.
by Dropkick434 on Jun 29, 2009 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, but i only said im hoping
fanboy theory and a guy hoping to see him in the UFC is different.. im not theorizing or anything haha.
also, im not hoping for affliction’s death, but i do think they will fold sooner or later. im just hoping that if that happens, he doesn’t go back to japan fighting cans..
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 2:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, but he will go with whatever promotion is willing to co-promote with M-1.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There won’t neccessarily be less fights, as always happens someone else will eventually try and fill that spot, if they are any better run then there should be even more fights in the future. Heck it’s not like Affliction has really added that many more fights to the industry anyway, in the last year they have only had 2 events, what would be nice is a company that can put one an event every couple of months instead of every year or so.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Between Affliction + M-1, plus their ability to share their fighters (DREAM, Sengoku, Strikeforce), they add more fights to MMA and more pay days for fighters. Their contracts don’t exclude them from taking other fights, unlike other orgs who use exclusive contracts that do affect the fighters in a negative way if they only put on a few fights a year.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s not really the case for several of those guys because what good is an open contract if no one else can meet your price anyway? If you look at the Afflction roster who has been fighting a lot of outside of Affliction fights? Heck most of the bigger names aren’t fighting any.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Huh? Half the Ultimate Chaos fight was Afflictionn fighters. Strikeforce is using a bunch like Babalu, Whitehead, Arlovski, and probably Sylvia in the future. Affliction is in no way prohibiting fighters from fighting elsewhere.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Half the Ultimate Chaos card was put there by Affliction but if you actually look at guys records a lot of these guys aren’t fighting anywhere else that often. Babalu was with Strikeforce first, is Whitehead still under Affliction contract? Arlovski was paid by Affliction to fight other places, Sylvia???? Seriously?
Paul Buentello, no fights outside of Affliction since Banned.
Vitor Belfort, no fights outside of Affliction since Banned
Fedor, no fights outside of Affliction since Banned
Matt Lindland, no fights outside of Affliction since Banned
Mark Hominick/Savant Young, nothing since Banned
Josh Barnett, no fights outside Affliction since Banned
Tim Sylvia, one fight since Banned (if you’d call that a fight)
Ben Rothwell, one fight since Banned.
Pedro Rizzo, one fight since Banned
Fabio Negao, one fight since Banned
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No fights for SOME, but nothing is preventing them.
Barnett is going to fight in Sengoku . Negao just fought for M-1, Sylvia just fought, Rothwell in Strikeforce, Lindland will be fighting soon in Strikeforce, M-1 doesn’t want Fedor fight anywhere outside of Affliction for now, but they have said they will let him fight at NYE if show if he really wants, etc.
The fact that they have fought outside of the promotion is the main point.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 2:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That wasn’t “some” that was almost the entire main card, and having the ablity to fight outside of the promotion is irrelevant if you aren’t actually getting fights. Banned was a year ago, all of those guys on that list have only fought once in the last year, that’s not a little thing it’s a big deal(and I didn’t even look at the second Affliction card or most of the first undercard). It’s a really big deal for the ones that aren’t on the upcoming Affliction card too.
You keep saying Strikeforce, where are you getting this from?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 2:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except, you don’t really know why they have only fought once or what not. Its pure speculation as to the reason for that.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Any more speculation than saying that they are better off being able to fight somewhere else when they obviously aren’t doing that. This isn’t a could of would of arguement I’m just presenting how things are and that doesn’t fit with saying that the open contracts are expanding the business.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Expanding the business? No. Allowing fighters to make a living and get some paychecks, yes.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s not doing that either if they aren’t actually getting those other paychecks.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Until a fighter is saying they are somehow being prevented from fighting elsewhere and they are losing money due to their Affliction contract, this point is moot.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes because that is always how it works on internet discussions……
Everything we say on here is a moot point in that sense because nothing we say matters at all to the situation, we are just discussing it for our own personal enjoyment.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but I have proof of fighters saying Affliction has been good for them. Never seen the opposed view.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 3:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We heard all sorts of things through the grapevine about them trying to cut contracts. Are you just waiting for one guy to say something bad after he is out of the promotion?
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 3:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, we heard, but as we saw from the fighters salary, they were still paid. On top of that, Affliction trying to cut their costs and ability to not overpay is a good sign, isn’t it? Learning from their mistakes, etc.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 29, 2009 5:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gomi versus Hansen, please. I’d wet me knickers!
by FlyByKnight on Jun 29, 2009 12:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I have to agree with those that support Affliction.
Hope they stick around put on more great shows.
by Jmend255 on Jun 29, 2009 3:46 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Where's subo? or Logic? or someone else?
who me is getting ganged up! haha. ;)
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 4:19 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s just SuPreMaCy :D Lord knows it’s not like when I made the mistake of trying to defend Frank Mir.
Hell my problem is that it’s 3:40 in the morning here and I have to get up at a decent time tomorrow. I just can’t play no more.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 4:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well at least you lasted longer than a tommy point. hahah. :D
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 4:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t have lasted but about 5 or 6 posts…even if I KNOW I’m right…it eventually just becomes too much of a pain in the ass. Not enough pay off for to 1/100 chance someone sits there and goes “Oh man, your right.” lol
by kyfm621 on Jun 29, 2009 4:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Says the guy who can’t seem to stop till he gets the last word on every comment :D
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
o.O
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who the hell takes time out of their day to come in here and get into a pissing contest over Affliction’s business model? Really? Affliction puts on fights, good fights, they may or may not keep going after this.
Did you guys forget they’re a damn T-Shirt company and are most likely using alot of the money they would for marketing and in turn using it on these shows because it is just as effective and reaches their demographic? Are they losing money? Yes. Is that normal for a start-up project? Yes. Is there a chance this could be the last Affliction show? Yes.
Seriously…whats the problem? lol
by kyfm621 on Jun 29, 2009 4:47 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I miss the days those people didn’t know how the internet worked, let alone how to win a game of solitaire on their computer…oh how times have changed.
by kyfm621 on Jun 29, 2009 5:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Most people still don’t know how to clear their cache.
by a tommy point on Jun 29, 2009 5:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Check this out
ipconfig /flushdns. Now give me my cookie.
by spectaa on Jun 29, 2009 8:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
One adtracker cookie coming up!
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Jun 29, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Losing tens of millions of dollars to advertise t shirts is very silly, particularly when they could get vastly more advertising bang for their buck by just doing what they were doing before they started Affliction entertainment. When GM wants to advertise in auto racing they don’t start their own new league they just sponsor a race or a couple of teams in the existing leagues. The “they are just doing it to sell t shirts” arguement doesn’t make a lot of sense because that just isn’t efficent use of an advertising budget.
As far as these discussions, the only reason to get involved in one like that is for personal entertainment and education. I research what I post because I make an effort to try and learn something new everyday, even if it’s something sort of irrelevant I am adding to what I know. I also discuss this stuff for my own entertainment, lets face these discussions are irrelevant to the industry and it’s not something you can “win”, it’s just for the enjoyment of talking about the sport and learning new information. That’s why I can’t understand why people get worked up over it or take this stuff so seriously, it’s just the irrelevant discussion of opinions.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
time to change the mood/discussion with these pictures..
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 5:10 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Time to talk about Tom’s bad-assery he put on display. Dude’s got heart, especially at his age, coming back to win like that.
by kyfm621 on Jun 29, 2009 5:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yep..
BIG BIG props for stepping up in the cage and performing like he did.. he has set a huge example for all 42-year-old promoters out there.
haha! but seriously though, he has earned mad respect from a lot of people..
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 29, 2009 6:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly. Some fighters ont the same card would’ve given up years ago.
by spectaa on Jun 29, 2009 8:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Actually I only have one fighter in mind.
by spectaa on Jun 29, 2009 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It really shows a will to win, Tom didn’t have anything on the line at all and he still came back like that. Very impressive.
by who me on Jun 29, 2009 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sapp tapped like 10 times, poor guy. Too bad this fight doesn’t teach us anything we already knew.
by spectaa on Jun 29, 2009 8:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think Atencio is 1 solid win away from being offered a spot on TUF 11!
by GeeDub on Jun 29, 2009 10:37 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
BTW is Atencio part native-american or something ?
Not asking only because of the indian tattoo , he really looks , well … indian !
by JoelMan on Jun 29, 2009 4:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Bravo, sir..
Rec’d
What the fuck is a "robster craw"?
by Gunslinger20 on Jun 30, 2009 5:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that almost makes sense. would explain all the freakin indian skulls on those shirts….
by Headkick on Jun 29, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And most Mexicans are part indigenous.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Jun 30, 2009 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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