Could Takanori Gomi Hang in the UFC Lightweight Division?
by Kid Nate on Jun 23, 2009 1:47 PM EDT
in MMA News
Email
Print
He's talking about coming over to the U.S. Per MMA Mania:
Derek Bolender (MMAmania.com): Now that the (Brett) Cooper fight was called off can we expect your next fight be in Japan or in the United States?
Takanori Gomi: My next fight will be in the U.S. Now we have several offers from some promoters, including, of course, Affliction. We are considering all those offers right now. I am willing to have a fight in the U.S. as soon as possible. I want to show the U.S. fans my fighting spirit.
Derek Bolender (MMAmania.com): Has the UFC ever been in contact with you about potentially joining its organization going forward? If so, how did those discussions go?
Takanori Gomi (MMAmania.com): We do have their offer and we are in the middle of discussion.
Derek Bolender (MMAmania.com): What is the motivation for you wanting to come to the United States and fight at this stage in your career?
Takanori Gomi: My motivation is to innovate myself.
Derek Bolender (MMAmania.com): Will you be moving your training camp to the United States? If so, who will you train with and where?
Takanori Gomi: Basically, I will keep my training in my gym (Rascal gym in Kanagama, Japan). Occasionally, I would like to train at Xtreme Couture or Wanderlei Silva’s gym. They have all been great to us. We have great relationships with each other.
First off, Gomi hasn't been himself for a long time. His tenure in Sengoku was undistinguished to say the least. After winning two tune up fights (Bang Ludwig and Seung Hwan Bang), he then had back to back losses to Sergey Golyaev (by a very questionable decision) and Satoru Kitaoka (via a very definitive submission).
Those followed his loss No Contest against Nick Diaz in what was an epic bout that still had Gomi fans questioning his conditioning. But Diaz' shattered orbital bone left no doubt as to Gomi's power.
Frankly he hasn't had a win against a top 10 light weight since New Year's Eve 2006 when he crushed Mitsuhiro Ishida and even that followed a less than impressive split against Marcus Aurelio.
But all the same, anyone who paid attention when Gomi tore through PRIDE's 2005 lightweight tournament -- KO'ing Hayato Mach Sakurai, and convincingly beating Tatsuya Kawajiri and Luiz Azeredo along the way. The tourny field included Joachim Hansen, Yves Edwards, Jens Pulver and Naoyuki Kotani -- at the time a who's who of the division.
Gomi was at his best in that tournament, rolling out a brand of sprawl and brawl that just hadn't been seen before from a Japanese fighter at any level.
But here's the question -- even if Gomi reattains his peak form, could he swim in the shark tank that is the UFC 155lb class?
Is his sprawl good enough for him to keep his feet against Sean Sherk, Clay Guida, Gray Maynard? Can he stand and bang with Ken Florian, Diego Sanchez, Frank Edgar? Can he survive in the scrambles with Tyson Griffin, Joe Stevenson? Most of all, can he avenge himself with B.J. Penn -- a fighter who demolished him way back in 2003?
There is a reason Joachim Hansen avoided the UFC and it wasn't all money. Same for Eddie Alvarez. Shinya Aoki's addiction to magic submission pants obviously keeps him out of the Octagon. Gomi's style seems made for the UFC, the question is, can he hang?
Obviously I don't know the answers but I hope we get to find out!
102 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
No.
Man, you should have just asked me before going to the trouble to type all that out. :-)
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
by jemaleddin on Jun 23, 2009 1:07 PM EDT reply actions 5 recs
Tell us about how Guida would wreck Gomi if only the judges were more into wrestling.
Just kidding. :(
Hah – tell ya what, if Guida is Gomi’s first fight in the Octagon, I’ll sell everything I own and bet Clay.
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah guida would win
But him “wrecking” gomi, or anyone for that matter is untrue.
But if wreck=smother,lay, or to make it sound prettier, “control”, then I agree.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 23, 2009 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
You know, I don’t like the “smother/control/lay&pray” style any more than the rest of the world, but a) it works, and b) it sure looks stupid with guys who are great at it (Sherk/Guida/etc.) instead do something stupid like trying to stand and trade with better boxers. I’m not saying I’d LIKE to see Guida smother Gomi on his way to victory, but if he tried it’d work.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
I think Gomi could hang in the UFC's lw division....
I think he would have problems with Penn and Sherk though.
Yeah, he could definitely beat most of the guys but he wouldn’t clear out the division. Gomi has good wrestling, though, so I wouldn’t count him out to beat Penn or Sherk. The way Gomi/Penn went the first time is probably how it would go most of the time between them. But I think if Sherk kept it on the feet he would get embarassed. Guys like Frankie Edgar, Nate Diaz, Joe Stevenson and others would be hard-pressed to take out Gomi, though.
I think KenFlo would mess him up. I think KenFlo’s weakness would be a guy who was great on the ground, like Aoki. KenFlo would crush him standing, but always takes it to the ground to finish, mistake with Aoki. I think Gomi destroys Aoki.
So there is you beat loop.
KenFlo > Gomi > Aoki > KenFlo
Such is MMA.
I’d like to see the actual fights before we get too carried away.
I think Aoki is too small for KenFlo.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Aoki is 6'1 or 6'2?
I don’t think he’s too small for any light weight. He might not be as physically strong as the others, but he certainly isn’t small.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 23, 2009 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I was simplifying with small – but you knew that. After seeing how he fared against the slightly larger Mach, do you really think he could handle Kenny?
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Why not?
He had trouble with Mach cause Mach weighed 170.. Florian also isn’t exactly the (physically) strongest guy at 155..
I think it would be a really good fight which could go either way.. Florian would be better standing but aoki would have the huge edge at the ground. Plus what Mach did to aoki isn’t allowed in the UFC.. But so are his pants, so we’d never know. Haha.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 23, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Florian does not cut from 170. In his interviews he always talks about how close to 155 he walks around, because he feels it’s more important to be in shape and not feel like shit from a weight cut.
Yeah. Kenny started at LHW or maybe MW if I remember correctly. His body can obviously handle being larger but as you said it’s pretty obvious that he’s most comfortable being at LW, and I doubt he cuts more than 10 pounds to make it.
KenFlo is big, but I think its more of a reach advantage for him then a strength one, although vs Aoki he will likely have a strength advantage. Aoki is small and likely used to giving up some size. But for all of KenFlo’s well roundedness, he finishes on the ground. He can beat Aoki’s ass standing, but he will try to finish on the ground. If he is under control and smart, he will just make Aoki cry standing, but as of right now I call it the way KenFlo fights. I think Aoki is horrible overrated and completely one dimensional. Kenflo is underrated in his skill level, but he does take the fight anywhere. Aoki can give him problems on the ground.
Not that I want to get carried away with speculation, but this whole thread is based on speculation so I am just throwing out my opinion. I think KenFlo is one of the smartest fighters out there and can figure out anyone, but thinking historically and matching style vs. style, I have Aoki.
Aoki will have the reach advantage..
But he won’t use it anyway. Hahaha.
by Anton Tabuena on Jun 23, 2009 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, to clarify, I am saying KenFlo’s size at LW usually translates to a reach advantage and not a strength one. That might be reversed vs. Aoki.
Probably accurate. But unfortunately a strength “advantage” doesn’t really work out vs. Aoki. The last thing you want to do is try to take him down, and the second-to-last thing you want to do is get into a clinch game with him, considering he’s one of the most skilled judo fighters in MMA.
Spot on. Aoki is hardly a weakling so whilst he may be at a disadvantage strength wise, practically it doesnt mean all that much. Would Florian really want to use his ‘strength advantage’ to take Aoki down? Hell no. He’d wanna keep the fight standing and beat him up with his MT. As has been the case with so many of Aokis fight though, you can only keep it standing for so long as he has too many ways of taking you down, and I dont see how Florian, Sherk, Maynard or Griffin could keep the fight standing against him. Once it hits the ground, your odds of winning drop significantly. One dimensional, yes. Overrated, no.
First of all,
Gomi is a much better striker than Kenny Florian with the exception of Gomi gassing after the second round anytime he puts on a striking display. That’s pretty much how he lost to Nick Diaz.
And I’m not sure how we made the jump to Aoki, and while these fights haven’t happened, I think it’s a bit ridiculous to assume that Gomi is a sure thing against Aoki. Especially considering Gomi’s lack of submission defense against quality grapplers (Kitaoka, Diaz, Aurelio, etc.), there’s not much reason to think that Aoki would lose. Aoki is definitely not small, either…he fought Sakurai at welterweight, as well. Obviously I’m an Aoki fan but I think he’s a lot better of a LW than a WW simply because of his size advantage and how it makes up for his striking. He’s a lot more vulnerable against guys like Sakurai who are competent on the ground as well as being Aoki’s size.
And while Aoki/Florian is besides the point, I think such a match-up would be MUCH closer than any other fight you could make for either of those guys (barring BJ Penn, which is a whole other topic of discussion).
Yeah, none of what I said was predicting the future. I am just speaking on opinion and how I think the fights would go. I brought those guys up because the fights in that triangle would be fantastic.
I will elaborate on Gomi > Aoki a little more. Gomi is a great wrestler. I do think his ground game is weak, but he has the power that Kenny doesn’t and the wrestling to avoid the ground, at least long enough to make Aoki cry and give up.
I totaly disagree with your opinion that Kenny Florian has better stand up then Gomi, I actually think its the other way around that Gomi’s Boxing skills are much much better then Florians and most others in the UFC’s LWD. When Gomi is not brawling and thorwing wild rights which he does do sometimes especially when he gets tired. He has great technical Boxing a outstanding Jab and left cross to the body some of the best body shots of any MMA fighter. His punches our pretty straight also not the best but his foot work and head movement and weaving our top notch. Also if Gomi hits you with that Big shot you are going down he has some great power in those hands.
I was saying that KenFlo would crush Aoki standing. I think Kenny’s strength on the ground would win him the fight in a Gomi match up.
You might be right but I don’t even think Florian could get the fight to the ground Gomi is a much better wrestler then him. I could actually see Gomi taking Florian down and gounding him from he guard ? Who knows though lets hope this is a fight we get to see, I would love to see Gomi and others from the LWD in Japan come and try it out in the UFC
I want to see it, but for speculation sake I see it going like this:
Kenny stays way outside and picks his spots really well. Staying clear of the power shots. Maybe Kenny gets inside and pulls guard. He might eat a few shots, but he has a good defense and rarely eats big shots. He works through the GnP and gains a sweep. Kenny is like a snake on the ground. He never lets guys up when he is on top. He has GREAT hips, no homo. Then he would just ware him out and get a RNC or a TKO Lauzon style.
i feel exactly the same way as what you said in the last line
We could analyze and debate about it, but we will never be sure about anything. The only thing that’s certain is that I do want to see him in the UFC.
Hansen is just a pain to deal with. He had problems with Zuffa. And now he is having problems with DREAM.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Jun 23, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
i feel exactly the same way as what you said in the last line
We could analyze and debate about it, but we will never be sure about anything. The only thing that’s certain is that I do want to see him in the UFC.
kenny florian a banger dont make me laugh
aoki is 6’0 ken is like 5’10
kenny isnt a banger and he knows it
wait i dont understand hansen has a very active guard he can so hang in the ufc and eddie is a wrestler
and since when are kenny edgar ad sanchez bangers???
when they suck they get lucky opponents to make them look like aweasome strikers wich they arent niether would be able to hang with eastside muay thai
I don’t understand what “hang with eastside muay thai” means but I generally agree that most fighters have an overrated standing game, including Diego Sanchez, and Kenny Florian. I think Frankie Edgar has pretty good hands but I don’t think any lightweight has the boxing that Gomi brings to the table. But as I said above, Gomi’s primary problem is that he gasses, not that he sometimes gets taken down.
For Those Not Paying Attention
Gomi said he is going to fight in America and in the Japanese Vale Tudo new promotion popping out, so, it is most likely he would fight for Affliction than the UFC at the moment.
Also, we already he is in talks with Affliction to fight in their upcoming show.
Gomi has been entertaining UFC’s offer for years and has yet to accept. Not to say that it is not possible after a few fights or in a year, but, hes not going to jump into the UFC at the moment.
He WAS in talks with Affliction for the next show, and now, he’s not on it. I don’t think he’d pull better than a .500 record in the UFC, so he’s probably better off staying in Japan.
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Gomi could very conceivably make his way to #5 or 6 in the UFC before running into serious trouble. If nothing else, I think he would make a very valuable litmus test to fighters that have lost their way in the division (read: Sherk) and current up-and-comers (Gomi and Creepy Joe would be interesting). I feel the same about Alvarez and I hope he makes his way to the UFC sometime in the next few years as well.
"The wise have something to say, the foolish have to say something."
Gomi would likely struggle in the UFC. I would pick Penn, Florian, Maynard, Edgar, Sherk, & Sanchez to beat him. And I think it would be a toss up between him and guys like Stevenson, Guida, Griffin, and maybe one or two other guys.
The UFC Lightweight Division is extremely underrated. I know guys like Thomson, Melendez, Kitaoka, Alvarez, & Hansen are ranked above many of them on these online rankings…. But most of them would like struggle to even get a title shot due to how tough the division is.
by AlwaysRelaxing on Jun 23, 2009 2:01 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
I agree the old Gomi might still have problems. The new Gomi would be a middle of the road guy at best.
I dislike Matt Hughes.
I don’t really buy into “old _” vs. “new _” stuff. Personally, I think Gomi’s the same fighter he was a couple years ago, if not better. Same goes for guys like Shogun (aside from the obvious injury-related cardio “problems”), Coleman, Wanderlei, Vitor, others…none of them have changed. It’s the climate and competition that has changed.
Barely. Gomi has fought a lot of good Japanese-scene fighters but he’s also fought a lot of cans. But even the good guys he did beat were kind of a convenient match-up for him. We got a flash of it in his first fight with Aurelio and later with Kitaoka. I don’t think Gomi is a weaker fighter now because he lost to Kitaoka. I just think he’s been exposed to some new guys and so people have this perception that he’s lost some flare that he had.
The rest of the guys I listed don’t really fight in Japan anymore. And maybe Vitor was a bad example because he’s jumped around in weight and his ground game has also improved significantly so he’s definitely bound to vary in certain aspects due to that. He’s always had fast hands and people kind of slept on him for a while after his unspectacular series of fights following his UFC career. But now that he’s dropped back down he’s about as good as he was before in my estimation.
Coleman, ok he’s definitely gotten worse with age but he wasn’t that good to begin with in my opinion. When he was a “great” fighter, he never really beat anybody who could hang in modern, elite-level MMA. So maybe he’s gotten a little worse, naturally, but he’s also going to be fighting some tougher guys now that he’s in the UFC until he retires. Even low-end guys like Stephan Bonnar are huge favorites over Coleman. And even if he was 10 years younger, I still don’t think he’d beat Bonnar.
Some guys have definitely changed. Vitor, for example, has dropped a weight class and that is bound to affect his performance – for the better, I think. Going the other way, Coleman has not only dropped a weight class but gotten much older, and I think that his skills have definitely deteriorated. Some fighters are definitely changing, though not all, but perhaps that helps (along with climate and competition) to give such a widespread sense of change – even fighters who are the same as they were in times previous look very different even against the same fighters.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
“Could Takanori Gomi Hang in the UFC Lightweight Division?” Hell no! Nor could Hanson, Aoki, Calvacante or Alvarez. Talent in Japan is watered down. Plus Gomi has had what, like one win in his last 3 or 4, and all of a sudden “he’s back.” Please.
Please add some substance to your argument so that I know what to disagree with.
I can understand why people aren’t big on Aoki in the UFC (personally I think he could beat everyone, though a fight with Penn would obviously be very close). But guys like JZ, Hansen, Alvarez and Gomi don’t lack anything that UFC lightweights have.
I assume you are comparing them to the likes of Sean Sherk, Tyson Griffin, Frankie Edgar, Joe Stevenson, Sanchez, Florian, and Penn. With the exception of BJ Penn, all of those guys have a huge gap in their game. Sean Sherk can’t strike and not very effective against quality grapplers. Tyson Griffin is pretty much in the same boat considering he got twisted up like a pretzel in his last (or two fights ago) fight. Frankie Edgar is a good boxer but is often over-powered by larger guys and probably doesn’t have the submission acumen that somebody does. Joe Stevenson is pretty well rounded but even he is known to fail on the feet against superior strikers. Sanchez isn’t that great a stand-up fighter and would be exploited in that way. Obviously BJ Penn and Kenny Florian are great fighters but I think people overhype them pretty dramatically.
But compare them to the guys you mentioned. All of them are great wrestlers, and on top of that, Aoki/HAnsen are great grapplers, and Alvarez/JZ are pretty good strikers. Personally, I think those four are better than all of the UFC LW’s with the exception of 2 or 3.
Yes they are all scared to come. Which is why they all stayed and fought most of the ranked fighters in Japan because it took the UFC so long to build their LW division.
This is a fucking shit article if I ever seen one. I bet Fedor has to come to the UFC too to prove himself.
What an insightful comment.
I’m sure they’re all shaking at the concept of fighting in the UFC. After all, if you aren’t in the UFC you can’t be that good of a fighter, right?
No, you just can’t be the best in the world (unless you’re Fedor, and even his clock is ticking)
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
You have Gomi beating everyone except Penn and Sherk, and being competitive in both fights. Nobody outside the UFC at LW, in my opinion, has enough quality wins to be ranked top five, so I’m betting Penn, Sherk, Edgar, Maynard, and KenFlo against all of em.
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, I don’t have Gomi “ranked” in the top 5 either. I’m just saying he has a lot more of a chance than some of you guys are suggesting. Clearly we have differing opinions, so all I say is that we don’t know for sure how these match-ups would go. Obviously I give all of those guys you mentioned a chance – more than a chance, a GOOD chance – to beat Gomi. But as I just said I think his wrestling is underrated considering the amount of wrestling and combat-wrestling (or whatever it’s called) he participates in on a regular basis. Let’s not forget Gomi was a wrestler to begin with, and he beat Nagata in wrestling, who has like a silver or gold in the Olympics. That said I don’t think it’s a sure thing that guys like Sherk, Guida, Edgar and Maynard would beat him hands down.
I don’t mean this as a flame but I am on a totally different page as some people in terms of rating certain fighters. You as well as others (to me) ignore holes in the game of a lot of fighters. I could just as easily be wrong but I’ve seen a lot of fights and I don’t think guys like Maynard, Sherk, Edgar, and Guida are THAT good at wrestling that it completely bypasses all of the weaknesses that can be found in their striking and grappling. And I don’t think it’s because wrestling isn’t effective because I don’t feel that way about guys like Jon Jones who are still one-dimensional (obv. he’s quite young, so nothing against JJ) are overrated at all.
thanks for the feedback
thoughtful yet pithy.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 23, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
There is some weird speculation in this article. Hellboy won’t fight in the UFC because he’s afraid of the competition? Aoki won’t fight in the UFC because he is “addicted to magic submission pants”? Is there anything out there to substantiate either claim?
Just sayin'
I think Aoki’s pants loom far larger in the imaginations of his detractors than they do in his own.
Totally. I said somewhere above or maybe in another thread that I think the magic pants have little to no bearing on Aoki’s success.
I think the fact that he doesn’t have to worry about elbows to the head on the ground helps him more than the pants.
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
lol
fair enough!
I speculate, you criticize.
That’s how this blog works.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
by Kid Nate on Jun 23, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
How many fighters have successfully emigrated from Japan to the USA? You can list them on one hand.
Where do fighters go when they are on the downhill of their career, Japan or the USA?
Just saying, actions speak louder than comment threads, and if you watch the how the talent moves between the two countries the answer to the Japan/UFC debate becomes pretty clear. Maybe its weight classes, maybe the rules are just different, but as far as I can tell DREAM is the minor league of MMA; plenty of talented and possibly great fighters, but it ain’t the big show.
Alvarez avoiding UFC??
He expressed interest in joining the UFC after the Dream tourney. I’m pretty sure he went to Bellator b/c his 175k he just made is way more than the UFC was offering him for 3 fights. Now he has 50+50 at least fighting for Bellator and he has freedom to fight in other orgs if he wants. Plus he is a star in Japan, where the UFC doesnt go
Thats kinda true. They are exclusive during the tourneys, but at this point he can fight somewhere else while he waits for next season’s tourney to play out so he can fight the winner of that
He wasn’t exclusive until he became the champ. Now Bellator and Monte are claiming that he is exclusive.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Jun 23, 2009 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh yeah and next season he fights on ESPN 2. The UFC wont be able to match the sponsorship potential that fighting on ESPN provides
i don't think it'll be
ESPN2.
Bellator is working on a bigger & better TV deal but they’ve hinted it won’t be ESPN.
Follow me on Twitter @KidNate
I think japanese fighters can hang with the best of them but lack the size and strength that American fighters gain with weight cutting. Weight cutting has been a tradition in the US which Japanese fighters have not yet mastered as well as the americans. Really anyone japanese fighters who fights in a certain weight class outside of the US should go down one weight class when they get to the UFC. Because you have guys like thiago who cut like 25 pounds to gain an edge
Does he cut weight or diet. That’s a huge difference too.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 23, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Excuse me, there should be a ‘?’ after ‘diet’, not a ‘.’
I will carry this shame with me the rest of my life.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Jun 23, 2009 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions
You are pretty much the new Tito.
I dislike Matt Hughes.
by MonkeyCHops on Jun 23, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I wish they would weigh fighters after the fight as well just to see what the true weight difference was
me too
or at least weight them come night of the fight, like hbo does with boxing(sans hw’s). weigh them a couple of hours before their fight. i would love to see how much guys like a.silva, marquardt, t.silva, gsp, bj and plenty of others weigh on fight night. forrest griffin too. :-)
Not sure why anyone thinks guys in Japan are ducking American fighters/the UFC. They make a ton more money over there. Why would they ever jump overseas?
http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com
(not my position)
I think the idea is that they’re taking the easy money rather than truly testing themselves.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Jun 23, 2009 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I, for one, am interested in watching guys that want to be the best in the world at what they do.
by Derek Suboticki on Jun 23, 2009 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
MMA Rankings
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
