CompuStrike Data on Sean Sherk vs. Frankie Edgar Proves Sherk Botched the Strategy

by Luke Thomas on May 28, 2009 12:35 PM EDT in News Comment 18 comments

Sherkvsedgarcompustrike_medium

Several things stick out here:

1. Sherk threw more punches but missed far more often.

2. Even when Sherk did land he didn't land with nearly the force or impact that Edgar was able to land on him.

3. Edgar was able to use kicks to keep Sherk at a distance at times while still being able to land with some effectiveness, add diversity to his offensive arsenal and use the appropriate distance to keep Sherk from deep penetrations on takedowns should he have elected to shoot.

4. Then, of course, there is the issue of takedowns. In my mind, this is where the fight was lost, but let me explain what that means precisely. For such an adept wrestler, the numbers here really underscore just how poor Sherk's game plan was. It's not just that Sherk only attempted three takedowns (landing one successfully). It's that you'll notice Edgar attempted five and Sherk shrugged all of them off. Sherk is not only a good offensive MMA takedown artist, but his takedown defense is also quite excellent. Even if Sherk only landed a third of takedown attempts, it doesn't really matter. By being the aggressor and trying to takedown Edgar, Sherk could've accrued points with a more consistent effort. While Sherk may not have able to gather Octagon control points, aggression matters particularly in very even contests. And normally relying on takedowns can zap a gas tank very quickly, but we're talking about Sean Sherk.

Worse, a Sherk who is constantly threatening the takedown or actively seeking it is a Sherk who is crowding or smothering Frankie Edgar. With a more consistent takedown effort (feints as well as attempts), he could've far reduced Edgar's ability to get on his horse where the New Jersey native was able to damage Sherk consistently over the course of three rounds at the distance of his choosing.

MMA pundits and fans alike are sometimes critical of fighters who win without inflicting much damage through aggression and positional control, but Clay Guida has managed to actually amass a fan following while, if being at times inconsistent, putting together some quality wins and nice paydays through valiant, disciplined effort. I doubt Sherk fell on his sword for fans, but whatever prompted him to abandon his best weapon and improperly use his outstanding cardiovascular fitness needs to be addressed immediately. Edgar fought an excellent fight and one should not lose sight of that, but Sherk made it far too easy for him. What a shame.

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Am I the only one uneasy with the increasing use of things like Compustrike in MMA?

I just think some valuable aspects of the fight are not taken into account with quantitiative analysis like this.

It seems like a boxing tool is being shoehorned into the MMA.

by Razreshat on May 28, 2009 12:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You're right

But I think in this case it was used perfectly.

Everyone could see that if Sherk used his wrestling he could have won that fight. But this kind of puts some numbers behind that claim.

by TheConcreteKid on May 28, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

To me it’s just a long way of saying, “T-Rex Arms are no good for punching.”

Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones

by jemaleddin on May 28, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

It works for certain fights, but not for others. Another problem with these stats is that strikes in MMA come in too many different sizes. One or two major shots can outweigh 20 baby taps easily, especially when it comes to ground striking.

I find the fightmetric system to be pretty accurate though

by Flyghtt on May 28, 2009 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

At least to me, Edgar’s head movement was very impressive. What was most surprising in this fight was the lack of takedowns by Sherk. By the end of the second round, he was down 0-2 and hadn’t really changed his strategy. Had he shook it up a little the outcome might’ve been different.

by JAYGK95 on May 28, 2009 12:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He can’t keep up with the younger wrestlers down. Same thing with Tyson couldn’t keep him down either. Kenny and Hermes have poor wrestling which made it easier to control them.

Also those stats are misconstrued. Edgar fakes takedowns a lot so it can look like an attempt. Plus he did take Sherk down in the first. He caught a kick and took him down.

by gunranger on May 28, 2009 12:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

That was far more of a slip on the Bud Light logo than Edgar off balancing Sherk to a takedown.

by Luke Thomas on May 28, 2009 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

misconstrued is the wrong word, I meant misleading.

by gunranger on May 28, 2009 12:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Sherk's Strategy for Edgar

I believe that Sherk underestimated the reach advantage enjoyed by Edgar. I do think Edgar’s boxing is better than Sherk’s, but not in the same way that Penn’s boxing was superior.

What was more stunning to me was Edgar’s ability to stuff Sherk’s take down. Rarely do we see that, particularly from a fighter smaller than Sherk.

It also says a lot about Gray Maynard, and really the rest of the TUF 5 cast. Here’s to hoping Maynard develops that striking game of his sooner rather than later. Say what you will about Sherk, but he’s been in three entertaining fights since he’s focused on his boxing.

...Behold, a pale horse. The man that sat upon it was Wieters, and hell followed with him.

"BJ on the BE" - Kierkegaard

by Brett Jones on May 28, 2009 12:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Yes – Maynard’s stock should jump as a result of this fight.

by subo on May 28, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I listened to the Sherdog beatdown radio show and Sherk said
-He didn’t think he would easily take Frankie down because he is 3-time all-american wrestler
-He wanted to put on a show for the fans, or as he describe it “I want fans to look forward to me fighting. I want Joe Silva and Dana White be out of their seats”
-Fight of the Night Bonus, a motivating factor
-It seemed like he basically wants fans to love him. I really think that lay-n-pray shit got to him

by The Bronzeville Bully on May 28, 2009 1:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Watching Sherk’s shitty boxing is equally as boring as watching him hump an opponent to a boring decision.

by Madskillz on May 28, 2009 1:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I guess he is of the opinion that those are his only two choices.

I guess he needs to take a few rolaids quick, because his rankings will surely plumet from here….

by Razreshat on May 28, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was not a slip; Edgar caught the kick and pushed him down

by gunranger on May 28, 2009 3:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

A) Sherk off balanced himself first by hopping straight back on his support leg, which is a major no-no, but b) that’s not really the issue. Takedowns of all varieties count, but what we are referring to and what is the central feature is common hip and leg attacks in traditional freestyle wrestling and who can win that battle. That Edgar caught a kick and tried to drive a modified knee tap is fine, but the idea we are trying to examine is matching wrestling for wrestling, which is where Edgar was stuffed. Not all of his attempts where thorough and neither were all of Sherk’s, but Sherk was the only one to hit the real power double – a trademark of his – driving his shoulder through the center of Edgar’s chest as he lifted his feet off the canvas. That’s the crux of the issue. If Sherk threw enough kicks in a fight, then I’d be more open to the idea that there is something important to the non-takedown takedown of Edgar catching a kick. But insofar as hip and leg attacks go, Sherk won. And that’s why I think there’s tragedy here.

by Luke Thomas on May 28, 2009 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

What was his corner doing?

Man I hate Sherk. My future kids better be good at sports because between him and Sherk there is no longer any kind of a college fund. I couldn’t believe it when i watched it, and I can understand that Sherk is such a meathead that he thought he was a boxer for a bit, but my biggest question is what was his corner doing or telling him? I could see them saying “Alright Sean, box him for the first 3 minutes, but if it doesn’t work, take him down twice”. And how could they not tell him that he clearly lost the first round, and that he needs to get some takedowns to win the second round? This worries me because who else will these guys corner? I look to bet a little more if Greg Jackson is in someone’s corner, and if whoever cornered Sherk (sorry for my ignorance here) corners other fighters i would like to bet against them

by mo dogg on May 28, 2009 4:48 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs