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Pat Miletich and Sam Caplan Resign From WAMMA

The details from a press release not sent to me but in my inbox nevertheless:

PAT MILETICH AND SAM CAPLAN ANNOUNCE THEIR RESIGNATIONS FROM THE WORLD ALLIANCE OF MIXED MARTIAL ARTS

After serving in prominent positions with the World Alliance of Mixed Martial Arts since its inception 20 months ago, Pat Miletich and Sam Caplan have jointly announced their resignations from the MMA sanctioning body, effective immediately.

Miletich, the first-ever UFC welterweight champion and a world class mixed martial arts trainer, had been serving as the company's Vice President of Fighter Relations. Additionally, he had recently made multiple appearances on ESPN.com's weekly MMA show "MMA Live" on behalf of WAMMA.

"Throughout my entire time with WAMMA, I've been sincere in my belief that the sport needs undisputed champions in every major weight class," Miletich began. "To this day, I still feel that way and still believe in WAMMA's basic principles. However, I no longer believe that WAMMA's execution is where it needs to be in order for it to meet its full potential. Based on that and a growing difference of opinion with WAMMA's board of directors, I made the decision that it is time to move on."

Caplan first started with WAMMA as the Chair of its independent Rankings Committee. In early-April, he accepted a position within the company as WAMMA's interim Chief Operating Officer following the resignation of renowned class action attorney Michael Lynch.

"There's no way to sugarcoat it. When you leave a position you had planned to serve for at least three months after just six weeks, it's not an amicable parting," said Caplan. "But like Pat, I believe in what an organization such as WAMMA could bring to the sport. However, in my brief time as serving as its COO, I also share Pat's concerns whether WAMMA will be able to accomplish all that it originally set out to do. I felt the only decision for me to make was to leave the organization."

The rest of the release after the jump.

What is there to say except I think this spells the demise of the organization with now Lynch, Caplan and Miletich gone - two of the three being original founders and pioneers? This isn't a release that acknowledges as much, but it isn't a mystery how I and others on staff here feel about WAMMA, their rankings and perfunctory role in MMA. Many have predicted the demise of WAMMA for quite some time for their inability to matter and I obviously get the sense that those chickens may very soon come home to roost.

I'd also say that since our rankings have been the most visible in the sport since the USA TODAY was signed, we believe WAMMA's clear state of flux is a renewed opportunity for us to make the case that our rankings are the most informative anywhere in MMA. WAMMA very likely doesn't have much life left in it with major backers now jumping ship. My contention is that our rankings are better for reasons outside of the precarious situation facing WAMMA, but that reality only reinforces the truth that their rankings should not now nor ever be viewed as the sport's ranking leader. The time for transition is now.

Additional Analysis from Brent Brookhouse:

The main point from the press release that sticks out to me is the following:

Despite being a sanctioning body, we never once asked a promoter or a fighter for a fee. In fact, in many cases, WAMMA went out of its way to contribute to the growth of several promotions.

Which promotions are those exactly?  Affliction, without a doubt, gave WAMMA a rub by using their title.  Would Affliction have suffered in any way by using their own "promotional title" rather than getting on board with WAMMA?  In fact, as WAMMA becomes less stable it actually hurts Affliction that they got in bed with a sanctioning body to begin with.  Adrenaline MMA was a "friendly promotion" that WAMMA liked to claim they were helping but where are Monte Cox run cards now?  Oh...that's right.  It's just another case of WAMMA involved parties saying things with little regard for reality.

With all the talk of the DREAM, Affliction..etc co-promotional supershow that WAMMA was trying to assist in putting together I have to wonder if something in that whole mess was a part of why suddenly Pat and Sam are jumping ship.

Regardless, that's 3 high ranking WAMMA officials gone.  Which is one more than the number of champions they have ever "crowned."

Star-divide

Like Miletich, Caplan also was clear to indicate that his support of WAMMA has always been an accurate reflection of his beliefs.

"For as long as I've been associated with WAMMA, I've asked people to look at what we had to offer and to pledge their support to our cause," he began. "Some people offered their support while others did not. Regardless of what was decided by each individual, I always respected their decision but I am also especially appreciative of those who did support me by supporting WAMMA. I can't thank them enough. I want those people to know that when I asked for their support, I was 100 percent sincere in my beliefs. Recently though, I've lost some faith in WAMMA and I am not going to ask anyone to support a cause I am no long fully committed to."

In the time that Miletich and Caplan both served with WAMMA, the organization became the first-ever sanctioning body to launch independent rankings polls for both male and female mixed martial artists. The WAMMA men's poll, featuring some of the most respected names in the MMA media, were also used to crown champions in both the heavyweight and lightweight divisions. Additionally, WAMMA also gained acceptance within the industry after ESPN.com's "MMA Live" premiered its mens rankings poll on its past two episodes.

"I am proud of the work we did during our respective tenures at WAMMA," said Miletich. "WAMMA still has its critics to this day but not nearly as many when we first began. When we first started, many people pre-judged WAMMA because it was a sanctioning body and since sanctioning bodies have hurt boxing, people just assumed WAMMA would have the same effect. But WAMMA has always been about trying to move the sport forward and I feel confident in my belief that during my stay with the organization, WAMMA did nothing but try to act with the best intentions. Despite being a sanctioning body, we never once asked a promoter or a fighter for a fee. In fact, in many cases, WAMMA went out of its way to contribute to the growth of several promotions."

Caplan concurred with Miletich's sentiment.

"I often have asked people to name one bad thing that WAMMA has done for the sport," he said. "And when I ask that question, I never receive a straight answer. Instead, I would be told about all the ways that WAMMA could possibly hurt the sport. There were a lot of assumptions that were made by people that simply never proved to be the case. Since Pat and I have been involved with WAMMA, we never witnessed or partook in any actions that we believed would be detirmental to the sport of mixed martial arts. And the reality is that we spent a lot of time talking to people within the industry with the intent of trying to make MMA bigger and better than it already is."

While both Miletich and Caplan have ended their association with WAMMA, they will continue to work in the MMA industry on a daily basis. Miletich will continue running his Miletich Fighting Systems fight camp in Bettendorf, Iowa and has also been named in recent months as a color commentator for many of Showtime's mixed martial arts background. Meanwhile, Caplan will continue as the owner of the highly-trafficked MMA content site FiveOuncesOfPain.com and has plans to announce a new venture within the near future.

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I am in shock. What can I say…..

by szucconi on May 19, 2009 5:56 PM EDT reply actions  

WAMMA did it to themselves.

I guess that’s what happens when you don’t stick to your own principles and basically try to deceive the public.

I love me some Sexyama!

by pud333 on May 19, 2009 6:08 PM EDT reply actions  

If their main goal was to crown undisputed champions, why did they crown a disputed champion? BJ Penn is the consensus #1 fighter in the world at 155 lbs, and yet WAMMA gave Shinya Aoki their 155 title. Maybe they shouldnt have put ,“undisputed” in their constitution. WAMMA needs to stick to trying to get regulation in “disputed” states.

by bubbafat on May 19, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

But they said it’s undisputed. Doesn’t that make it undisputed?

by Phildo on May 19, 2009 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

In that case I’m the undisuted #1 135lb fighter in the world. If Miguel Torres wants to become the undisputed #1 he needs to fight me. I’ll be hiding in the woods.

Keep firing Assholes!

This is a dream competition for me. I drink as much coffee as I want, and eventually I hallucinate.

by Ubernoober on May 19, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

You’re using WAMMA logic, so to continue the story, all you need to do is give yourself a belt, and then you’ll be it. I don’t see how anyone will be able to argue with you.

by Phildo on May 19, 2009 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions  


I dislike Matt Hughes.

by MonkeyCHops on May 19, 2009 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have a feeling something else went down. No way did they think WAMMA would reach it’s full potential without the UFC’s cooperation and that was never going to happen.

by steveoc24 on May 19, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

If Sam Caplan and Pat Miletich are resigning from WAMMA because they were unhappy with the way things are going, who was giving directions?

PS. Due to the power vaccum, I am taking over WAMMA. Carpe diem!

Keep firing Assholes!

This is a dream competition for me. I drink as much coffee as I want, and eventually I hallucinate.

by Ubernoober on May 19, 2009 6:11 PM EDT reply actions  

I said a long time ago that I could save WAMMA. I think they are too far gone now, but I could still give it a shot. Call me WAMMA.

by szucconi on May 19, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dave Szady...

is the CEO

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

http://CurseOfRonKarkovice.blogspot.com/

by Brent Brookhouse on May 19, 2009 6:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

CEO Szady has been liquidated. Long live the People’s Republic of the World Alliance of Mixed Martial Arts!

Keep firing Assholes!

This is a dream competition for me. I drink as much coffee as I want, and eventually I hallucinate.

by Ubernoober on May 19, 2009 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

He was associated with subversive elements.

"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR

by Rundownloser on May 19, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cmon Brent. You’re the Wamma guru. I want some exclusive content on this drama!!!!! :)

by GeeDub on May 19, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm working on it...

trying to get an interview with a couple key players in this whole mess (and not who you might think I’m trying to get in touch with)

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

http://CurseOfRonKarkovice.blogspot.com/

by Brent Brookhouse on May 19, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d also say that while our rankings have always been the most visible in the sport…

Que?

by -Sam on May 19, 2009 6:13 PM EDT reply actions  

since the USA Today deal

"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"

by Kid Nate on May 19, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

The real problem with WAMMA was that there was never any reason to give a damn. And it didn’t help that the name WAMMA just sounded dumb.

by MMAEruption on May 19, 2009 6:14 PM EDT reply actions  

Oh, Sam....

“I often have asked people to name one bad thing that WAMMA has done for the sport,” he said. “And when I ask that question, I never receive a straight answer”

I just assume he never pays much attention?

by Chris Barton on May 19, 2009 6:16 PM EDT reply actions  

The UFC game comes out on the same day as this? You should add a poll:

 Is this the best day ever?

- Yes
- Hell Yes
- Best day there could possibly be

"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR

by Rundownloser on May 19, 2009 6:16 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Happy Dance!

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by Scott C. Broussard on May 19, 2009 6:21 PM EDT reply actions  

I’d be very interested to know specifically what went down that triggered the resignations. Like Caplan and Miletich, I think an org like Wamma has a place in MMA, but I guess all the potential problems that were apparent were perhaps real problems for the people working there too. Oh well, the next few days should provide some more interesting news.

by GeeDub on May 19, 2009 6:28 PM EDT reply actions  

This is my first and most pressing thought.

http://www.sackmikegoldberg.com

by Mike Fagan on May 19, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good point.

"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR

by Rundownloser on May 19, 2009 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sweet Sweet Sweet

Ding dong the witch is dead and all that. Caplan’s still a tool, but now I don’t have to throttle my admiration for Pat Miletich. Hoo-ray! Hey Fedor, some rhinestones fell off that purdy belt of yours.

by Derek Suboticki on May 19, 2009 6:38 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Schadenfreude

Keep firing Assholes!

This is a dream competition for me. I drink as much coffee as I want, and eventually I hallucinate.

by Ubernoober on May 19, 2009 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

AKA sour grapes

Those Germans have a word for everything!

by Derek Suboticki on May 19, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

You know when that fast food place that you never go to and never cared about closes? That’s kind of how I feel.

by MattTil on May 19, 2009 6:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Assuming they close.

by MattTil on May 19, 2009 6:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

how does this effect their stance on internet satire?

by woooburn on May 19, 2009 6:59 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

Our attorney will be contacting you shortly with a response.

Sincerely, WAMMA

by ufc4 on May 19, 2009 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

well played, my good man.

by woooburn on May 19, 2009 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d also say that since our rankings have been the most visible in the sport since the USA TODAY was signed, we believe WAMMA’s clear state of flux is a renewed opportunity for us to make the case that our rankings are the most informative anywhere in MMA. WAMMA very likely doesn’t have much life left in it with major backers now jumping ship. My contention is that our rankings are better for reasons outside of the precarious situation facing WAMMA, but that reality only reinforces the truth that their rankings should not now nor ever be viewed as the sport’s ranking leader. The time for transition is now.

Judging by how much more traffic Sherdog gets than Bloodyelbow (or WAMMA), I’d venture to say their rankings are the most visible in the sport. Who the “leader” is, I suppose that is open to interpretation, but I like how the Sherdog staff votes directly on the rankings instead of relying on dubious sites like MMA ELO or whoever.

Maybe we need an MMA Ranking Sites Meta-Rankings to settle this.

by smoogy on May 19, 2009 7:26 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m willing to bet more people buy USA Today than read Sherdog.

by Derek Suboticki on May 19, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

MMA Fans read Sherdog. USA Today? I’m not so sure. I mean, I get a newspaper every day, but I never read the junior hockey standings.

by smoogy on May 19, 2009 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smoogy's Law

It works kind of like Murphy’s Law:

If and when Smoogy can be insulting, he will be insulting.

Do we want to play this game? The second most widely-distributed media in the English language on the planet Earth + BE’s traffic isn’t more visible than Sherdog.com’s rankings? More MMA fans read Sherdog.com than USAT. There’s really no question, but I seriously doubt the number of pure readers is even the same much less higher. And USAT reaches into more mainstream demos. That means we’re putting MMA content in front of the nose’s of a lot of people who otherwise would never get introduced to it. It’s in hotels, drug stores, supermarkets, airports, bus stations, kioks, and even restaurants. Oh yeah, and everything’s online, too. That’s visibility.

by Luke Thomas on May 19, 2009 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right. Hardcore fans will always be with MMA. They’re the choir. The unconverted masses is what we need to reach out to.

I love me some Sexyama!

by pud333 on May 19, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe you misread, but I didn’t insult anyone. I’m saying based on levels of readership, Sherdog’s rankings are probably the most prominent in the MMA world, and as far as whatever constitutes “leadership”, I prefer their direct approach to rankings.

At least we agree more MMA fans read Sherdog than USAT or BE. I have no question more “pure readers” are looking at USAT, but it would be a stretch to say they’re being exposed to “MMA Content”. If I don’t follow the sport, why would I care who the #18 WW is on paper according to the rankings you’ve compiled? Maybe there is a tiny, tiny percentage of the USAT readership that will stumble on the rankings page and strive to learn more from there. But I think you are vastly overstating the importance of that partnership when it comes to the actual MMA world.

Anyway, the whole interpromotional rankings thing is kind of silly when you think about it, considering the closed promotional nature of companies like UFC. I’d say the vast majority of MMA fans aren’t reverent towards rankings systems from Sherdog, MMAWeekly, Bloodyelbow, or anyone else. The only rankings that have ever been used by promoters to make matches are WAMMA’s, and that was for a no-brainer undisputed HW champ (Fedor) and a LW belt that doesn’t even exist.

by smoogy on May 19, 2009 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

The only rankings that have ever been used by promoters to make matches are WAMMA’s, and that was for a no-brainer undisputed HW champ (Fedor) and a LW belt that doesn’t even exist.

I thought those fights that ended up being for WAMMA belts were already made prior to WAMMA getting involved or jumping on board and making them a WAMMA title fight.

by mattman73 on May 19, 2009 9:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

At least we agree more MMA fans read Sherdog than USAT or BE. I have no question more "pure readers" are looking at USAT, but it would be a stretch to say they’re being exposed to "MMA Content". If I don’t follow the sport, why would I care who the #18 WW is on paper according to the rankings you’ve compiled? Maybe there is a tiny, tiny percentage of the USAT readership that will stumble on the rankings page and strive to learn more from there. But I think you are vastly overstating the importance of that partnership when it comes to the actual MMA world.

Actually, this is a good point. How many “pure readers” actually hit the MMA rankings pages within the paper if they don’t care. I have no doubt that we are receiving some added readership through the paper, but we’ll never truly know. I’m hoping it gets the exposure it deserves.

Follow my analysis of all things MMA on BloodyElbow.com

by Leland Roling on May 20, 2009 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

About MMA ELO

I really think they should be removed from the Bloody Elbow meta-rankings. I attempted to do a Featherweight consensus using the same sources that BE uses, but in addition to how flighty MMA ELO’s rankings are in general, they mixed Gina Carano into their FW rankings, at #14 (her “Strength of Schedule” was just a smidgen higher than Hatsu Hioki’s, apparently). MMA ELO just have a really wacky ranking system and I have a hard time considering them legit.

by Chromium on May 20, 2009 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Actually this renews my faith in Miletich to some degree. I had thought he was blindly supporting WAMMA even though they were not living up to their promises and intentions. WAMMA had a nice list of goals to accomplish but seem only intent on accomplishing one of those goals. Which was to crown champions so they could make money.

This is purely speculation on my part and just a stab in the dark as to a partial reason for the fall-out. I’m guessing the top person in charge or people that would profit financially if WAMMA were successful are looking to even further lessen their standards for crowning “Undisputed WAMMA Champions”.

by mattman73 on May 19, 2009 7:33 PM EDT reply actions  

Am I the only one that thinks Pat’s comments on E60 about how Dana has never said a true word might have something to do with this? I mean, it’s clear the UFC doesn’t want anything to do with them, but WAMMA still clearly needs Zuffa to be successful. I feel that he may have been asked to resign and that Caplan was something of a temp, anyway.

I poop rainbows.

by Blackout612 on May 19, 2009 9:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Nah.

Pat has been talking shit about Dana since long before WAMMA came into existence. His IFL deposition pretty much burned that bridge.

by Steve4192 on May 19, 2009 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not as publicly as ESPN

And not as aggressively in recent months.

I poop rainbows.

by Blackout612 on May 19, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

I said they’ll be dropping like flies, didn’t I?

by mmalogic on May 19, 2009 10:53 PM EDT reply actions  

Heh, still in denial over that? Every MMA site has it that way. You can’t even come up with a credible alternative, you just dump on those two fighters like they “don’t deserve” to be so high when there is nobody else you can nominate with a straight face. Reality hurts I guess.

by smoogy on May 19, 2009 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Barnett hasn’t beaten a top ten heavyweight since September of 2006.

by Derek Suboticki on May 19, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well...

you’ll have to take that up with…pretty much everyone.

Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.

http://CurseOfRonKarkovice.blogspot.com/

by Brent Brookhouse on May 20, 2009 12:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

He is probably right about that – Monson is the only arguable Top-10 guy he’s beaten since then (05/18/08); Nastula, Yoshida, Rizzo, and Yoshida aren’t the most terrifying opponents.

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett

by Scott C. Broussard on May 20, 2009 12:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

and he cheated to beat Nastula

by Chris Barton on May 20, 2009 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but Yvel is a legitimate… um… top 30 HW?

by Derek Suboticki on May 20, 2009 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not to mention that fighter he beat [Nogueira] avenged the loss in an immediate rematch.

by Zack Gobie on May 20, 2009 5:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

I swear, subo is peaces.

Follow my analysis of all things MMA on BloodyElbow.com

by Leland Roling on May 20, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

rec'd

Which is why WAMMA is completely unnecessary.

Additionally, there is no reason for a self respecting promotion to have any dealings with them. Affliction is the only one so far and they are suspect at best.

by Razreshat on May 20, 2009 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

those guys are being pulled up by the gravitational pull of Fedor

He’s so clearly the #1 that those fighters who are being groomed as his opponents (Barnett) or have given him a tough match (Arlovskii) benefit wildly from his reputation.
The other thing that is artificially inflating Barnett and Arlovski in the rankings is the sudden rise of the new bloods in the UFC. Mir and Lesnar have proven quite bit in the cage, but only in the last year so most sites refuse to rank them commensurate with the ability shown in their latest performances.

"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"

by Kid Nate on May 20, 2009 8:34 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Subjective rankings will always be influenced by name recognition, many of those guys have sat on the list for years and they don’t seem to drop off the radar unless they pull a Cro Cop(and even Cro Cop is still on some top 10 rankings). Josh Barnett is still getting a huge bump in rankings from what he did in the 2006 openweight grand prix even though he hasn’t really done much of anything since, it’s going to take a loss to unseat him even though he hasn’t fought top 10 talent in years.

by who me on May 20, 2009 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

i think its easier to pretend that barnett beating a bunch of guys that hes supposed to beat meas something than it is to pretend that randy couture being old and inactive doesnt matter or that nog losing to mir wasnt a big upset. maybe you have some weird ideas but if im picking someone to lose a bunch of fights in a row against big names right now it aint barnett.

by nigelzackit on May 20, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Barnett hasn’t fought anyone of importantance since Randy Couture was retired. Of course even if you look back to 2006 what did Josh Barnett do that made him the second best heavyweight in the world? What does losing to Cro Cop 3 times and splitting two fights with Big Nog way back in 2005/2006 tell us about where he stands in 2009? If rankings are about accomplishments and standing in the sport then Josh Barnett’s ranking at 2 just doesn’t make a lot of sense right now. Sure he might be able to win against all the top ten guys but how do we know that for ranking purposes? He hasn’t fought top ten competition in two and a half years and the last two top guys he faced he lost to. It’s not about whether he is a good fighter or not it’s about what the heck kind of criteria are they using to rank the guy at this point?

by who me on May 20, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

To be fair, Barnett’s third loss to Cro Cop was under bullshit circumstances. It was his second fight that night. Cro Cop had just knocked off Wanderlei Silva’s head off. Barnett then went the distance eeking out a decision over Nogueira, and looked like hamburger afterwards. If Barnett had faced Wanderlei in the semi finals instead then he would have almost certainly won the Grand Prix.

As for why Barnett’s ranked #2, it’s because the only people he’s lost to since 2001 have been Cro Cop and Nogueira, and both of those people have since seen downturns, while Barnett hasn’t lost to anyone who was ranked outside the top 4 at the time he fought them while, still keeping active (2007 aside). Meanwhile no one in the UFC HW division has been able to put on an impressive enough string of victories to supplant him. Should Mir or Lesnar clean out the upper echelon of the UFC heavyweight division I’m sure they’ll jump to #2. Meanwhile Barnett is in the top 3 by attrition, its’ just the way rankings work.

by Chromium on May 20, 2009 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

while Barnett hasn’t lost to anyone who was ranked outside the top 4 at the time he fought them

Lots of guys have great records against fighters they are supposed to beat but that doesn’t make them the second best fighter in the world at their weight class. Who has Josh Barnett beat in the last 2 1/2 years for him to be moving up the rankings like he has? Why would Mir or Lesnar have to clean out a division when Josh Barnett never did that either? I’m not trying to bag on Barnett but he’s only fought 4 times in the last two and a half years and none of those fights were important fights yet he keeps going up in the rankings for some reason. It’s long past time that someone gave Josh a fight that was a real step up in competition.

by who me on May 21, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Who has Josh Barnett beat in the last 2 1/2 years for him to be moving up the rankings like he has?

barnett beat the people he was supposed to and noguiera and couture didnt. if you think those two deserve special credit because of who they are and dont want to maybe consider that the losers dont deserve to be highly ranked, thats your choice. it seems that the majority of voters are considering that couture is an old ass man who hasnt won a fight against anyone in almost 2 years could be affecting the way they look at lesnar. same thing with nog nearing dying against tim sylvia, not fighting for almost an entire year, and then getting blown up by a guy almost no one had in their top 10.

now what will happen is those two guys will fight each other before barnett and fedor bang out. odds are pretty good someone will win. then the voters may decide that one of them really is better than barnett and everyone who feels the ufc heavyweight division is getting a bad rap can start complaining again about fedor needing to fight pat barry or something.

by nigelzackit on May 21, 2009 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

So instead the rankings reward you for fighting cans…. sweet. This past year Frank Mir has done more in the division than Barnett.

by Chris Barton on May 21, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

i dont disagree that he did more. but mir was a washout at the start of the year. no one ranked him. no one ranked him when he beat lesnar. he wasnt ranked until lesnar won a fight.

who me isnt even making that argument. he wants to count barnetts losses against him as reason not to rank him but not mirs. mir hasnt gotten his win back against brandon vera or pe de pano, has he?

by nigelzackit on May 21, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Um

Mir got the TUF gig opposite Nog before Lesnar beat Herring.

by Derek Suboticki on May 21, 2009 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not surprising, WAMMA was so fundamentally flawed it was obviously never going to go anywhere. The first step to trying to start a MMA sanctioning body would be to get all parties involved on board, without that there is no reason to even try. Even with the best of intentions (and what I got from all these people leaving is that it’s become obvious that the people behind WAMMA didn’t have the best of intentions) you just can’t succeed in sanctioning MMA without everyone on board. Of course the WAMMA plan was flawed in so many different areas(how were they supposed to make money?) but they were doomed from the start without the biggest organization on board regardless of what their plan was. They won’t be missed.

by who me on May 19, 2009 11:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Well that and the fact that there is no need at all for a sanctioning body in MMA due to the business structure of MMA organizations and the fact that the athletic commissions already fill much of that role anyway. Crowning champions was just one of WAMMA’s stated goals but when you get down to it none of their goals had a chance unless they hade every single MMA organization on board. Fred Levin (the guy who is behind all of this)only jumped into MMA after they failed to start their own boxing sanctioning body, obviously he went into this from a boxing viewpoint as opposed to a MMA viewpoint and that viewpoint conflicts with the realities of the MMA business model.

by who me on May 20, 2009 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

My guess is WAMMA just isn’t making any money and they’re sick of wasting their time. You can’t unify the sport through Affliction when the UFC runs the show and wants nothing to do with you.

by toughaintenough on May 20, 2009 2:27 PM EDT reply actions  

Probably about the same as they were before: 0.

"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."

by AJB on May 20, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

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