Quote of the Day: Understanding Anderson Silva
by Luke Thomas on Apr 21, 2009 2:08 PM EDT
in MMA News
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Print“He won the fight and he did what he had to do, so I give him that...The guy is so talented, it’s scary. Guys can’t do anything against him. People go to leg kick him and he stops the kicks with his feet. Instead of checking the kicks, he sticks his foot out and stops the kick with his foot. It’s like stuff from ‘The Matrix.’ The guy is incredible.
“My issue is, why not finish him? Where is the killer instinct? We haven’t seen that for a while? Why isn’t he letting his hands and feet go? He got on the ground and was beating the [expletive] out of Thales, but then he stood up and backed off and made it look like Thales was doing something wrong.”
-- UFC President Dana White asking some very reasonable questions.
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Thales WAS doing something wrong
When you know you’re down at least three rounds to one going into the fifth, where’s your killer instinct? Where’s you going crazy trying to finish because it’s the only way you can win the fight? Why weren’t you going desperately for takedowns/body locks (not fearing the Thai clinch, like Leites did the entire fucking fight) or letting your hands and feet go?
Because he never had a chance in this fight.
Anderson Silva is on another level. If Leites had challenged Silva, it would’ve looked more like GSP/Fitch – the Spider just does what he has to do instead of always going for the finish and risking getting caught (Wanderlei comes to mind).
Good to see Dana has come around and will not be bashing Anderson anymore.
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 21, 2009 2:13 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Question for those who disagree with subo: how riled up would you get about finishing off a second-grader? I mean, you step in the ring, you’re pumped to fight, and you realize that instead of going up against Rich Franklin, they’ve substituted a 7-year-old at the last minute. Do you go in for the kill? Knock his teeth out? Give the fans a good show?
Because that’s what it looked like on Saturday night to me.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Are you saying you wouldn’t want to see Silva fight a second grader? It would be awesome.
But on saturday I suggested giving Chris Leben a title shot. I think he is ready. I think he earned it with the loss to Bisping.
He was fighting a professional fighter...
that’s a little different from a last minute switch to fighting a child
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
http://CurseOfRonKarkovice.blogspot.com/
by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 21, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions
But that’s my point: he thought he was fighting a professional fighter, but then not so much. By the middle of the second, Leites gets this scared whelp look in his eyes, and by the start of the third might as well be running away screaming “not the face!”
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
Not finishing the fight is rude to the fighters on the undercard. They would love the chance to be shown on the main card after a quick knockout, or a dominant finish. As a fan, I prefer a quick exciting domination. I think Anderson’s problem is that he is too much a fan of boxing.
Oh, and I would finish a second grader in a second. Those little bastards are sneaky.
Does the second grader weigh the same as me?
Is he also a professional fighter who’s been training for months to fight me?
My boy is in second grade and weighs 107lbs. I have EVERY confidence that he’d put up more of a fight than Thales Leites did against Silva.
Don't believe a word I say, I don't train BJJ. -- TangleBones
The last time I fought a second grader the kid head butted me in the balls and then eye poked me when I was down. I think I made it into the third round but to be honest I don’t remember much after the third kick to the balls. The kid was truly vicious. I was told he gave me a wicked gaunch pull while I was dazed. Don’t underestimate them.
Because Anderson had completely dominated him. Leites was only able to hold him down for a moment before Anderson scrambled out of it. Then all the kicks and punches to the legs. He sprawled out of his takedown attempts. It was all over for Leites. He was beaten psychologically and in spirit. He never once got a single punch or kick even close to landing Spider’s insane defense. It’s at that point where the champ should step in and put him out of his misery.
I have an issue with a lot of arguments for Silva. This BS that it’s on the challenger to bring it ain’t true. Both guys need to bring it. Also, this crap about Leites refusing to engage isn’t true either. He only flopped a couple of times. There was more than enough opportunity for Anderson to start pulling the trigger. Instead he seemed content with gimmicks (side kicks and punches to the leg, that spinning soccer side leg kick thingy, the Ali shakes etc).
Also, this stuff about people wanting violence and blood to fly etc is totally untrue. People want exciting fights. Whether that’s aggressive grappling, Muay Thai, dirty boxing etc. They want to see a couple of people showcasing heart and spirit and talent. All three of those were clearly missing from Spider.
For much of the fight, especially in the third and fifth rounds, Leites’s favorite move was to fall on his back — so frequently that referee Yves Lavigne stood Leites up a stunning 14 times in the fight.
It was particularly egregious in the third round, when Lavigne stood Leites up seven times — it basically worked out to once every 45 seconds or so, throughout the round. On the fifth of those stand-ups, Leites simply fell to his back without Silva touching him. That’s not fighting, it’s flopping.
http://mma.fanhouse.com/2009/04/19/yves-lavigne-stood-thales-leites-up-14-times-vs-anderson-silva/
A challenger doesn’t win a championship unless he beats the other guy, when you know you are way behind on the judges scorecards but you decide to play fainting goat instead of actually trying to win the fight then there is a problem. Anderson Silva didn’t have to finish off Thales Leites to win that fight and keep his belt he already had him beat. Silva dominated the guy and the fight was never in jepardy at any time and by the third round Thales Leites wasn’t even trying he was just begging Silva to jump in his guard (which would of been stupid on Silva’s part).
Honestly Dana White has the right to be pissed because it ruined his show but the only thing that can be said bad about Anderson Silva is “why didn’t you go ahead and send you beaten opponent to the hospital?”. While that is a very valid question when you get right down to it people should keep in mind that the guy did easily win that fight, Anderson Silva did his job in the cage. Finishing the fight early isn’t something that a fighter is obligated to do(athough I agree that it doesn’t make much sense not to if you can), a fighter’s job is winning the fight.
Fainting goats are hilarious.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
SBNation would like to announce its 4th member of the MMA Blog Family.
http://www.watchthalesflop.com
Seriously though, I feel I was a little too hard on Silva and now I think Thales was for the most part to blame for this fight. My main problem is exactly what Dana said.
He got on the ground and was beating the [expletive] out of Thales, but then he stood up and backed off and made it look like Thales was doing something wrong."
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
This doesn’t mention the dozen or so times Leites went in for a hug and then rolled onto his ass.
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 21, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
You're right...
it was a brilliant performance by Silva. Truly one for the ages
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
http://CurseOfRonKarkovice.blogspot.com/
by Brent Brookhouse on Apr 21, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree that I would have liked to have seen Silva show more of a killer instinct
& throw caution to the wind in this fight. But I have to say that Leites looked like the biggest vagina (since Starnes) that I can remember seeing. I am not trying to fighter bash but Leites deserves a ton of crap for his bullshit performance. It is really embarassing for me to see someone who is supposed to be a fighter flop on his ass for more than half of the fight because he does not want to engage.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
You don’t get to have the fight on the ground because you want it there. you have to take it there. Leites’ flops were like a guy getting LnPed and begging the ref to stand it up instead of trying to stand up.
I think that was what I was saying?
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
I was agreeing and piling on Leites. Silva could have been more aggressive, but Leites did his best to stall action.
Oh alright.
So we are on the same page then. I blame Leites way more than I do Silva, but I still wanted to see Silva kill him as well.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
Same here, after thinking it over I place more blame on Thales.
Mike Goldberg: "You know Joe, When Matt and his brother Mark Hughes were growing up, they would pound each other behind the barn."
by xFenixKnightx on Apr 21, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Leites needs to stick to grappling or submission only matches.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
The funny thing is that I have seen Leites in good fights
Marquardt vs Leites was a fun fight to watch (I don’t agree with the point deductions), and I don’t recall too many particularly boring Leites fights besides Kampman vs Leites. I am personally not so hard on Anderson because he has no obligation to do anything more than he did, but I just don’t see why Leites just DID NOT come in to fight. Before this fight, Leites was not branded as a boring or passive fighter.
Maybe Leites forgot to pack
his nuts for the trip to Montreal?
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
These words never left my keyboard, Brent.
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 21, 2009 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
No, you’re right …
Next time Silva fights a bjj guy who wants the fight on the ground, Silva should agree to start in the opponent’s full guard with the opponent’s choice of submission already started. Then he’ll be above criticism.
Was this meant for me?
I was blaming Leites for being a pussy & flopping. I only said that I would have liked to see Silva be more aggressive, not follow him to the ground.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
… no, it was a reply to Brent. A similar jump from what he actually said to its overstated conclusion.
My bad Kierk,
with all of the replies I could not tell.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
Click “up” to see what comment is being replied to.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Apr 21, 2009 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Now that everyone is coming around to Anderson
are we going to get some bold typed front page action editorials on the topic?
Everyone agrees with me eventually – they tend not to publicize it, though.
S’ok. I understand.
by Derek Suboticki on Apr 21, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
You and I were on the same page since the beginning of all this subo. I said from the very beginning that it takes two to tango. Silva does have to take some blame but most of it goes to Leites. He’s had two poor performances in a row against two guys unwilling to exchange. Against two guys who’s sole purpose was to “survive” and make it to the third round. If that’s your goal you don’t belong in the cage with Silva. If that’s your goal you don’t deserve a title shot. My softball team doesn’t go into the game against the best team in the league to keep it close. We go in there to kick the hell out of the other team. Sometimes we do and sometimes we don’t but we always come to play and the top teams that relish the challenge love playing us. The top teams that expect us to flop hate playing us. On the flip side, the top teams that come out against us like Silva came out against Leites get thier asses handed to them. But that’s because we come out ready to fight, unlike Leites. I think one thing that’s being overlooked a bit is how Silva broke Leites’ will. When Leites got that takedown I’m sure he was thinking here’s my shot. Only to be held in lock down and not be able to do ANYTHING whatsoever to Silva. After that, and a few failed shots, he was demoralized and broken. Another thing being overlooked is the flip side of the take down. Silva was aggressive and went in for the strike and Leites took him down. I think after that moment he decided to play it safe and grind out the win. I don’t think he needed to do that but I believe those were the two key decisions in that fight. I just pray that he gets a somewhat aggressive fighter next for him. I’d love to see him go up to 205 and take on somebody like Jardine. A tough bastard that isn’t going to be afraid and has the skills to put up a fight.
Yikes!
You had me until you mentioned Jardine as a possible opponent for Silva. He is tough, but will just get picked apart until he is KO’d.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
you know the craziest thing...
i think we’ve all read numerous opinions/articles/rants/complaints etc.
about Anderson Silva and the main event from Saturday.
but in the end, I think Dana seems to nail it down best.
I guess the response is that “killer instinct” we’re looking/hoping for only comes out
when threatened/provoked kinda of like an animal in the wild?
I think if everyone goes and watch Anderson’s first 7 fights in the UFC you’ll see a difference between how his opponents approached him compared to Patrick Cote and Thales Leites.
I still think there’s some purposeful antics on his part, probably related to his frustrations with the Roy Jones Jr. situation and he’s general lack of enthusiasm for the opponents he’s been offered.
But good job Dana you nailed it.
I guess the response is that "killer instinct" we’re looking/hoping for only comes out
when threatened/provoked kinda of like an animal in the wild?
Pretty much.
The severity of the beatdowns he’s given out are proportional to how many times he’s been attacked.
Leben having no respect for his standup at all = face melted…
"Leben having no respect for his standup at all = face melted…"
This made me actually laugh out loud.
I got an idea for you Dana, why don’t you go ask him yourself?
Yeah, who got the final Death Blow? 'Cause I thought that Hawaiian guy had it comin' to him. - C. K.
by monkeyfightclub! on Apr 21, 2009 3:44 PM EDT reply actions
Didn't Silva Surpass a Record?
I understand from a promotional standpoint where Dana is coming from after this fight, but he seems to be missing the big picture that he has the now reigning longest ever champion in UFC history still under contract. Anderson did what he had to do to make this happen, he is still champ and by the looks of it will be champ until he desides to leave the company. Dana should reel it in and focus on how he promotes his best champion in a positive light going from here and get over this one. In a year, the casual fan won’t even be talking about this fight. It will just be another MMA trivia question we ask eachother.
Does it strike anybody as odd that Silva passed up a potential $70k by not looking to finish the fight? I have no idea how to interpret that, but I also haven’t seen anybody mention it.
How exactly are you determining Silva "passed up potential $70K"?
That was a little hard to do with Leites on his back the majority of the fight.
Arguing on the internet is like being in the special olympics, even when you win you are still retarded.
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