Is Big John McCarthy Being Blackballed in Nevada?
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 6:53 PM EDT
97 comments
I blogged about the hypocrisy of Dana White complaining about there not being enough top quality referees in MMA while Big John McCarthy is no longer in the Octagon.
Today Big John talks to Sherdog and sheds more light on the situation:
Sherdog: What is your status right now as a referee? Where are you licensed?
McCarthy. I am licensed in California, Ohio, Utah, in certain places in Canada, and that’s where I can go right now. I am not licensed in Nevada. Even though I have thought about doing it, I haven’t applied for it. So I go where the commissions ask me to work.
Sherdog: Why haven’t you reapplied for a license in Nevada?
McCarthy: You know what, it's one of those situations where I'm trying not to cause anyone any problems. I should probably talk with Keith Kizer before I apply, and I haven't, so that's on me.
He also replies to Kevin Iole's speculation as to why he might not be welcome to referee in Nevada:
Sherdog: And what about criticizing Keith Kizer?
McCarthy: I never said anything bad about Keith Kizer. I personally don't have any kind of issue with Keith Kizer at all. He is the executive director of the Nevada State Athletic Commission. It is probably the most powerful athletic commission because of the Vegas area and the huge world championship fights that happen there. They may not do as many fights as some other commissions, but when it comes to the biggest fights, they're usually in Vegas.
I had a criticism toward people being put into place as far as officiating. You listen to what Dana White was talking about the other night. His real problem now is judging and reffing in MMA. We're looking at things the same way. I have a problem when you have an official who is put into place to have an impact on the sport I love when they don't understand the sport, when they don't understand what the fighters are doing. They understand someone getting hit in the face. They don't understand the manipulations of the ground game and who is winning the fight. I probably should've shut my mouth because I've got a big mouth, and it's got me in a lot of trouble, but it's the truth. I want everyone to understand what is really happening in the sport so they can make educated decisions and judgments.
Big John is the best referee in the history of MMA and he's still reffing. If the UFC is blackballing him from reffing in Nevada, they are cutting off their nose to spite their face.
UPDATE: I posted the below in the comments in response to some dipshit a reader who was hating on Big John but it needs to be in the main post:
Big John didn't shit all over the UFC. He criticized them on a few key points. We live in a world where those with unique skills can make unique rules.
Randy Couture did exactly what you describe above and worse. The UFC needed Randy so they patched it up.
The reality is that Big John has a very unique skill set. According to Dana White himself, there are only three other good refs in MMA. Big John is the best by any measure.
When someone dies in the ring because of bad reffing, that will be that for the UFC.
They need Big John more than he needs them.
Big John didn’t shit all over the UFC and the NSAC. He criticized them on a few key points. Whatever. Get over it. The sport needs the best referee in the Octagon before we all see someone die in the cage due to bad reffing.
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I read something recently about this being a case of McCarthy knowing the fighters a bit too well… vacationing with Couture, etc. I don’t know about blackballing, but they do have a case in his judgment being affected because of it.
Should he be allowed to referee in Nevada? I think he should be regardless. He’s still the best.
I still believe he’s better suited for being the head of some type of organization to forsee referees, judges, etc. His vast eexperience is second to none, and someone needs to teach judges what to look for and referees to stop fights when appropriate. It’s too bad the commissions don’t have the money to set up organizations to govern those aspects.
Editor-in-chief of MMA-Analyst.com
by Leland Roling on Mar 19, 2009 5:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Big John’s opinion on reffing is perfectly valid and I am personally sort of sick and tired of people in power that are unable to accept any sort of criticism or counter opinion. When you have a guy as experienced as John is with MMA reffing, you listen to him cause you know what? Maybe he’s got a point. If he is being blackballed, that’s brutal, cause it’s a real shame if he is kept out of what is basically the premier venue for MMA.
by pud333 on Mar 19, 2009 5:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Big John is the best Ref.
But once he got a juicy job with the fight network he started talking lots of shit… Some people are just too stupid to know any better.
Now he’s slurping Dana’s and Kizer’s balls.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 6:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Give examples of “talking shit”. I have TFN and I never saw him say anything unreasonable or out of line. It seems like you’re just putting this in Dana White Tough Guy parlance, or talking about something you don’t actually know about. The crude “slurping balls” comment is consistent with that.
If BJM is supposed to make amends with Dana for some perceived “shit-talking” before he can get re-licensed in Nevada, it would just go to show how crooked and indecent the NSAC/UFC relationship really is.
by smoogy on Mar 19, 2009 6:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There seems to be a whole ton of speculation without any proof about any blackballing.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 19, 2009 7:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hence the question mark in the title
I’m not a fucking prosecutor, i’m a blogger.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comment in general, not focused at anyone.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 19, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
reply in general
not focused at anyone.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do some research and you’ll see what went down as soon as Big John got a high paying gig…
He made some really fierce accusations about the NSAC. He also talked shit about the UFC when he went to work for affliction.
Now he’s dick tucking on everything…
The real question is if what Big John was saying about NSAC true then why does he want to go back to work for them? So he is either a liar or he has no integrity…
He’s sure as hell slurping now.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Could you maybe re-post those accusations and shit talk here instead of asking people to go look for them? It probably would make your case a bit stronger.
by ilostmydog on Mar 19, 2009 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't give a shit about any of that
Big John is the best in the game and we’re desperate for good refs.
Most of my favorite fighters are assholes too. I don’t care.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, you’re not listening. I don’t want the bullshit UG version. Don’t tell me to do research, give me the examples of “talking shit” you allude to. Otherwise you’re just pumping hot air into the comments as usual.
BJM is apparently not on great terms with the NSAC/UFC conglomerate. This is probably why you’re doing such an agressive smear job on him. But your accusations are still baseless if you can’t tell us what “shit talking” was going on.
by smoogy on Mar 19, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
smear job? I said he was the best ref…
Why do I have to prove he said shit about the NSAC or Zuffa – please use some common sense.
Why would the NSAC not be eager to work with him??? the best ref in the business?
Why isnt Zuffa using him for overseas shows?
Because as soon as he left he shit on everyone because he thought he had a nice paying job which didnt turn out the way he thought… now he’s slurping nut sacks.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Would you mind not saying “slurping nut sacks” or anything similar? Thanks.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Mar 19, 2009 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Actually had the rec that one.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 20, 2009 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
so let him do his time in the wilderness just bring him back
I could give a fuck about Zuffa’s feud with BJM.
The two of you need to work together.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In the perfect world he should not only be refereeing but he should head the training and approvals on MMA referees.
He’s the best Ref… but I think he’s even better at teaching and articulating what being a good ref is.
The problem is who wants to work with someone who isnt loyal… If the best mma webmaster behind Bloody Elbows blog found a better job and as soon as he left started talking shit about Luke, bloody elbow, sbnation, etc.. would Luke bring him back or just find another decent webmaster?
Notice I didnt say the best mma “writer”… Randy Couture is a “writer” who is not easily replaceable.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you obviously don’t know dick about running a blog — its much harder to find a good webmaster than a good writer. In fact in our case, the webmaster (SBNation) owns the damn blog.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve created and run over 10,000 blogs… they were mostly spam blogs but still blogs… wordpress, blogspot, yahoo360, you name it Ive exploited it.
A webmaster is a dime dozen… you just dont know dick about where to find them.
I can get them by the hundred in india for 3 bucks an hour or opt for a higher level of talent and pay 8-10 bucks an hour in eastern europe and former soviet states.
A content writer who knows a certain niche and can write is way more valuable on the net.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i wonder if you've noticed
that the bad ass community platform technology that this site runs on is what gives us our competitive edge?
that didn’t come from taking the cheap route and using indian endentured servants to do wordpress hacks and spamblogs.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I could have this “badass” technology replicated for less than $2,000 and Ill wait no more than 10 business days max.
I have a custom tool that was just created for me that bypasses googles, yahoos and all of the hardest Image verification (captchas) automatically without human intervention.
Cost me less than $1000.
Return = priceless.
What makes money on the net is content and ideas…programming “code” is cheap.
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You can get cheap code anywhere, what you pay for is good design and domain knowledge.
by szucconi on Mar 20, 2009 1:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
“Why do I have to prove he said shit about the NSAC or Zuffa – please use some common sense.”
Because you’re making an accusation and you’re not backing it up.
If you can’t tell us what “shit talking” entails in this example, you’re just making baseless accusations, or passing them along. I’m not shocked you would take the truth of those accusations as self-evident because the NSAC and UFC are apparently butthurt over it, but some of us have higher standards than that.
Seriously, you’re so adamant about this and you can’t give ONE example?
by smoogy on Mar 19, 2009 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im not gonna go get links for you…
There are alot of good researchers here:
someone please find all of Big Johns interviews from the time he “retired” being a ref til present. (focus on MMA rule changes, Dana, NSAC etc…)
Also Keith Kizer went on record to dismiss some of his allegations… find those too.
Post the links here.
(boudelaire you can even create a graph on it)
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So “shit talking” = still undefined after a half dozen comments, but you’re confident someone else can dig up a link to what you are vaguely alluding to.
Jebus.
by smoogy on Mar 19, 2009 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ah, recognition.
I will play my game beneath the spin light.
Absurd Meridian
by Eugene Schelfaut on Mar 19, 2009 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
sadly
he didn’t spell your handle right.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well...
mmalogic’s not really into spelling. It works for him, though.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Mar 19, 2009 9:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or paragraphs.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 20, 2009 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
Big John left officiating and thought he was going to be the Joe Rogan of Elite XC. While Big John is a great ref, he’s a terrible color announcer. In any case though, he was doing some smack talking. Now that Elite is folded, he’s sorry and trying to take back the smack.
by pwdminotauro on Mar 20, 2009 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Keith Kizer was the one who is saying his comments at the Fight Network posed a conflict of interest not Dana.
Actually I don’t remember what Dana has said about Big John reffing again though. What is it exactly that Dana has said about that? Is there an article or an interview I can read to refresh my memory on Dana’s stance on Big John reffing now?
by mattman73 on Mar 19, 2009 6:25 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Employee A is a contractor for company X. Company X uses employee A’s services for something that company Y has requested company X provide.
Employee A proceeds to talk negatively about company Y and possibly company X once he is no longer under contract with them.
Employee A says “shrug, I guess a have a big mouth” to company X and offers his services to them again.
Company X says you’ve angered and embarrassed both us and company Y when we employed you in good faith. Basically. you’ve been gossiping about us like an 8 year old schoolgirl after you held a position of confidence and was privy to information you probably should have kept your mouth shut about. Shove off.
It’s a strange world you live in Kid Nate. Why should NSAC take him back? What do they care that he’s the “OMG BEST REF THAT EVAR LIVED”? They don’t, as I’m sure he’s proven himself to be unprofessional and untrustworthy in their eyes. What earth shattering, whistle blowing allegations did Big John make when he talked about the UFC? None, he was just trying to put himself in a position that made his opinion and views seem valuable to someone like the fight network. He made his bed, now it’s time for him to sleep in it.
by LiuLang on Mar 19, 2009 6:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
lol
We live in a world where those with unique skills can make unique rules.
Randy Couture did exactly what you describe above and worse. The UFC needed Randy so they patched it up.
The reality is that Big John has a very unique skill set. According to Dana White himself, there are only three other good refs in MMA. Big John is the best by any measure.
When someone dies in the ring because of bad reffing, that will be that for the UFC.
They need Big John more than he needs them.
Big John didn’t shit all over the UFC. He criticized them on a few key points.
And he was never their employee, he worked for the commission. The fact that Zuffa has veto control over who the NSAC hires is another thing that maybe shouldn’t be, but is.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe you should re-read huh? Guess I should have just wrote it out instead of using x,y and z’s. I never said BJM worked for Zuffa. Nor did I say he shit on them.
You think that anyone who works for NSAC as a ref gets a carte blanc to say whatever the fuck they want about a promotion? I highly doubt it was considered good form, professional, whatever, to “retire” and go straight into a journalistic/commentator role and start using his inside info to criticize people. Sure it happens in other sports all the time, but you don’t see them asking for their job back. And despite the pedestal you put him on, it’s still his opinion of things he observed and should be weighted accordingly.
The bottom line is that he was critical of people he worked for in some capacity, so it should be no surprise he’s getting the cold shoulder. Will he be welcomed back at some point? Who knows? But no one should be surprised that he’s having difficulties getting back in. And that was the point I was trying to make, that you took as some personal affront.
Hey, if I called someone a dipshit, would I get banned? Can you ban yourself? I think maybe in the future you should step back for a few minutes, grab a drink and sit back down. THEN, make responses. It just always amazes me. I love your articles like Judo Chop and the MMA history series and look forward to them, but I think your analysis of issues is pretty terrible. But hey, that’s just my opinion.
by LiuLang on Mar 19, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, for the record, I think BJM is a great ref and I wasn’t shitting on him or his reffing abilities. There’s just consequences for any actions one takes.
by LiuLang on Mar 19, 2009 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah if you called me a dipshit, you might be banned
probably not by me though.
But hey, I started the blog so I get special treatment.
Big John should get special treatment too. I have no problem with them making him eat shit. But I want him back in the Octagon.
I admit my analysis of issues isn’t always the best — I generally spout off to get discussion going and don’t always have a set opinion or think about these things a great deal.
Thanks for the nice remarks about my stuff, was just being an asshole kidding about you being a dipshit.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
" yeah if you called me a dipshit, you might be banned
probably not by me though.
But hey, I started the blog so I get special treatment.
Big John should get special treatment too. I have no problem with them making him eat shit. But I want him back in the Octagon. "
Haha, well played. I think what you said up further will end up being the case. He’ll have to sit in the wilderness for a bit, then the hatchet will be buried and we’ll see him back in the octagon. Which will be a very welcome sight.
by LiuLang on Mar 19, 2009 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and well played
on your part to flag the post!
keep me honest!
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha. I thought that was pretty great.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Mar 19, 2009 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
:D… wait, am I being made fun of again :(
by LiuLang on Mar 20, 2009 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No. I actually rather enjoyed it.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Mar 20, 2009 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Big John said alot of shit about the NSAC… your assuming even if Zuffa buries the hatchet NSAC will work with him.
You’re talking about 1 freaking referee… if the sport cant last because big john isnt a referee then it dosn’t deserve to last.
Being the best ref in the business is a far cry to being the best fighter in your weight class or a Randy Couture.
The refereeing training and licensing system needs to improve, sure…
by mmalogic on Mar 19, 2009 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Dana could name enough good refs to work a whole card
I’d agree with you. But since he can’t, we all need Big John.
Big John doesn’t make Zuffa short term money by being on a card, but if he prevents a ghastly on camera injury he’ll be priceless.
Big John is more than “one freaking referee” he’s the man who brought refereeing to American MMA. His contribution to the sport is equal to that of anyone living.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree about needing the best refs, no matter the personal/promotional beef (though I agree with Leland that BJM might be better utilized as a ref trainer, fostering the development of the next couple generations of refs).
But damn Nate, can you write an article sometime soon that doesn’t end with
before we all see someone die in the cage
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Mar 19, 2009 7:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’ll take that into consideration.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Otherwise the next Judo Chop is gonna have to be a real doozy. ;-)
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Mar 19, 2009 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'm hoping Sengoku will give me something to work with
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You might be able to do something about guard passing with Hioki…or ring entrances with Mo Lawal!
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Mar 19, 2009 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wanted to see a judo chop focused on footwork in the striking game; Rampage from his last fight maybe? Beyond that, I’d totally agree with the King Mo ring entrance judo chop!
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 19, 2009 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's a good idea
and one of the trickiest ones to try to do! I’ll go back and watch Jackson vs Jardine.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
re-watch
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Mar 19, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jackson-Jardine and Jackson-Silva 3 both gave me increased respect for Rampage’s footwork, and I’ve really come to believe that it’s one of the crucial factors in his his punching power. He always lands from the most advantageous angles, really rotates into his hooks, and even if he doesn’t get the KO, it forces his opponent to backpeddle (partially because his clinch game and takedowns from in close are so good).
Another is, of course, Anderson Silva. His footwork is incredible, especially considering how he works in kicks and knees.
I look forward to this one!
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 20, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Politics yet again rearing it’s ugly head in MMA.
by Benicio on Mar 19, 2009 7:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
'...and I haven't, so that's on me.'
Can dude actually apply for a license before we get up in arms about it?
by subo on Mar 19, 2009 7:14 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
That feels like a reasonable stance to take.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Mar 19, 2009 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Take it back! Reason has no place on the internet. :)
by pud333 on Mar 19, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is what happened to BJ Penn's face....
From that superman jab! :)
by adamdd on Mar 20, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I assume Big John knows not to bother for now.
by banter on Mar 19, 2009 7:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Best Update eva
VIVA LA Kid Nate !!!!!!!!
by banter on Mar 19, 2009 7:15 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Its pretty sad
when 1 single ref means this much to a sport. What a mess.
by banter on Mar 19, 2009 7:34 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, that’s what happens with a young, evolving sport.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 19, 2009 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
surely we should be beyond such importance of 1 ref…
by banter on Mar 19, 2009 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’d hope so, but it isn’t the case. A few years ago, the biggest lag in MMA was the ability of fighters to find a single place to train all their skills. Before that it was a shortage of venues in part due to lack of state regulation. Now it’s a shortage of skilled refs. I don’t find it surprising considering that neither the NFL or NBA, massive billion dollar organizations, can find enough quality refs to run their playoff systems. Reffing is one of the shittiest, most thankless, undervalued jobs out there. It’s not surprising that there’s very few people going into it, or that the people who know the sport best choose other ways to make a living.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 20, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, he needs to be there somewhere training refs. He should develop refresher courses and every ref needs to come to him every 6 months and go through it or something. He’s too good to be sitting on the sidelines.
by Dooda on Mar 19, 2009 7:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Big John should have forbidden Jimmerson from fighting royce with a boxing glove. The whole thing was screaming disaster, maybe his worst reffing ever…XD
Ahh big john, so much memories. I was still a kid when I saw the first UFC on tape. I was so traumatized back then. Pat Smith is the scariest fighter the ufc have ever known. I even made a paper on this very subject it in highschool, how UFC looked scary but was safe thanks to big john (based on old ufc, he was the only referee I knew) and how good reffing prevented things to get out of hands.
by spectaa on Mar 19, 2009 9:54 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Bring Big John back. He’s the best there is and ever was. Herb Dean and Yamasaki do a damn good job too, but Big John belongs in the UFC. Dana needs to swallow his pride and man-up. The crap he pulled with Fitch, Couture, and now Big John really make him look like a big baby.
by Josh H. on Mar 19, 2009 10:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The assumptions on this topic are pretty amazing.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 20, 2009 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Big John is a beast for sure but why is it so hard to get good refs. maybe i am just delusional but i think nearly any competent fan of MMA with a few months of actual training would make a respectable referee.
"King of NBA Live '09"
by #5mmafan on Mar 19, 2009 11:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Not at all true; it’s knowing exactly what to look for in determining when a fighter is or is not able to continue, such as facial expressions, body position, severity of cuts, potential for unseen injuries (like broken bones and torn ligaments) which show up in body control, etc. Then there’s knowing all the ins and outs of the rules: what do you do for an eye poke, a cage grab, grabbing the shorts; what do you do if a fighter does something stupid likes bite somebody, etc. There’s the pre-fight locker room discussions with the teams, there’s reports back to the commissions after the fights. To say nothing of the amount of prep work that goes into good refereeing, such as knowing exactly what you are looking at, all the time, in a dynamic and evolving sport. Most good refs will watch tape of all the fighters they are going to ref (and lots of it) before hand to learn tendencies, etc. And of course, ever single AC has somewhat different rules and regs, and you have to know all of those to get licensed in each district. It’s complicated!
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 20, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder if we will ever see any top level fighters making the jump to reffing after retirement. It seems like all the most cerebral guys end up as trainers and cornermen.
I dislike Matt Hughes.
by MonkeyCHops on Mar 20, 2009 12:41 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
A lot of fighters already ref, just not on the big shows.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 20, 2009 8:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
in the US you can’t be licensed as a fighter and a ref in the same state in the same licensing year. At least I know CSAC does it that way.
by szucconi on Mar 20, 2009 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would make sense, I just know quite a few name fighters have referee’d for smaller shows, like Shonie Carter being the ref for that double KO.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 20, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
TYSON!
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Mar 20, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was a pretty good ref at wrestlemania.
by Phildo on Mar 20, 2009 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are people going to act like BJM didn’t bring this on himself?, if he wants to ref again all he has to do is some ass kissing but running his mouth about the people that made him has consequences he off all people should know that.
by Raker on Mar 20, 2009 2:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
MMA is taking over basketball for fucks sake:
by mmalogic on Mar 20, 2009 2:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Big John is more valuable outside the ring than in.
The first commission to bring him on to oversee all judge and referee training and development is going to be years ahead of any other commissioning body in the country and possibly the world.
Big john is a man with some fantastic ideas for the sport and he is a strong enough personality to actually voice them. All we need is someone with big enough balls to start listening.
by Benicio on Mar 20, 2009 2:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Until they at least have enough competent refs to keep the fighters safe he is needed more in the ring.
I dislike Matt Hughes.
by MonkeyCHops on Mar 20, 2009 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he is training those refs you’re going to see a marked improvement across the board and maybe even a lot more consistent and less wacky judging to boot.
by Benicio on Mar 20, 2009 7:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two ideas that really bother me here
1. That Big John somehow deserves special treatment…no one does. Heading down that road is a really bad idea.
2. That somehow 1 ref, no matter how good he is will somehow make the difference for this sport. He can only ref so many fights and the chances are that those won’t be the fights in which something terrible happens.
3. That this is somehow Dana White’s fault. Unless you can prove that Dana is somehow controlling state athletic commissions, then this is largely out of Dana’s hands. If I remember correctly, the UFC has only had 1 event since BJM has returned to refing in a state in which he is licensed.
Frankly, he is the best…but that talent is wasted when applied to 2 or 3 fights a card. He really needs to be employeed in some fashion in which he can impact the overall quality of referees nation wide.
Open a school and get the top 5 comissions to require it as annual, bi-annual or quarterly training for their states refs and it would take off…and the sport would be better for it. Hell, get Dana behind the idea (which might be suprisingly easy considering his current outrage at the state of refs in the buisness) and it would likely give it some serious momentum.
by Razreshat on Mar 20, 2009 8:28 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Good post.
A man should never waste an opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
by iiowyn on Mar 20, 2009 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If I remember correctly, the UFC has only had 1 event since BJM has returned to refing in a state in which he is licensed.
TEhY MuSt haVe BeeN avOiDing hiM!!! ;-)
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Mar 20, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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