2008 Bloody Elbow Reader Awards: Fight of the Year

FIGHT OF THE YEAR: Miguel Torres vs. Yoshiro Maeda at WEC 34
On a night built around Urijah Faber and Jens Pulver, it was Miguel Torres and Yoshiro Maeda who stole the show.
Pre-fight trash talk ignited fireworks at the start of round one. Torres especially came out with guns blazing, showing the fighting spirit of his Mexican heritage. The action spilled all around the cage with Maeda opening a cut on Torres's forehead in the process.
The skirmish continued when the fight hit the floor. In a sequence that represented a microcosm of the bout, Torres and Maeda each locked on tight toeholds. Frank Mir's commentary:
They both got toeholds on each other! This is symbolic of this fight! Both these guys are not gonna tap, they don't care, they're gonna give up both their own feet!
Torres mellowed out and began to find his rhythm as the fight wore on. He took advantage of his reach and utilized a healthy dose of jabs. Maeda's left eye started to swell giving Torres a visible bulls eye to target.
Watching live, most fans gave no thought to the fight being stopped. When the telecast returned from commercial, however, the cameras caught Maeda laying on the ground as Torres came over to console him. Maeda's eye had comletely swollen shut and the doctor was left with no choice but to stop the contest.
For Maeda, this fight will stand alone as the zenith of his career. With his quick submission loss to Rani Yahya, it's unlikely for him to return to a championship bout. Meanwhile, this fight jumpstarted Torres toward MMA stardom.
2nd PLACE: Forrest Griffin vs. Quinton Jackson at UFC 86
3rd PLACE: Eddie Alvarez vs. Joachim Hansen at DREAM 3
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69 comments
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Comments
“2nd PLACE: Forrest Griffin vs. Quinton Jackson at UFC 86
3rd PLACE: Eddie Alvarez vs. Joachim Hansen at DREAM 3”
Damn, I know this site attracts a lot of people that are solely UFC fans, but that is preposterageous.
by smoogy on Feb 6, 2009 10:25 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I had the same reaction
Ok with the winner, second place not so much.
Kuwabara Kuwabara
by J. B. Maddox on Feb 6, 2009 10:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Look at me, Look at me, Dana is the devil. ;)
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 6, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Or maybe
Alvarez vs Hansen was CLEARLY the fight of the year and Kawajiri vs Hansen was the next best fight. With the #1 as #3
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 6, 2009 10:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually I had the #1 as 4
I think I voted Condit vs Miura as #3
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 6, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Alvarez vs Hansen was CLEARLY the fight of the year
Obviously not? It was a great fight not the best.
by banter on Feb 7, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I had Griffin/Jackson as my top fight of the year in this article in July. I think I still have it as my top fight in January. Not sure what you’re hating on it for.
by Mike Fagan on Feb 6, 2009 10:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It was a decent fight, but not the 2nd best of the year by a long shot. I would not put it in the same category as Alvarez vs. Hansen, Alvarez vs. Kawajiri, Torres vs. Maeda or Condit vs. Miura. Hell, if we’re talking about the actual fight, Tokoro vs. Uyenoyama was far more entertaining and dramatic.
“All told, considering the stakes, the back-and-forth drama, the hype of the reality show, the controversey of the decision, and the story of reality show star to 205 champ, Griffin/Jackson is my early frontrunner for fight of the year.”
You’re obviously entitled to your opinion. But to me, fight of the year is not about reality show hype, controversial decsions or WWE-style storylines. Those peripheral things can enhance the drama for a certain audience, but they don’t supercede the actual details of the fight. Rampage vs. Griffin was a perfectly above-average 205lb title match. But it doesn’t compare to the excitement, in-ring drama, and skill displayed in the other four fights I mentioned. Those stand on their own merits as incredible, high-level fights, even if they weren’t for titles or reality show bragging rights.
by smoogy on Feb 6, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Since I didn't hit the reply button with my rec
Rec’d for the 5 best fights of the year. Tokoro vs Uyenoyama was awesome
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 6, 2009 11:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Tokoro vs. Uyenoyama
made my (hypothetical) Top 3 despite having no real ramifications or any kind of hype whatsoever. Now there’s a damn fight.
by Chris Nelson on Feb 6, 2009 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
AA/Sylvia III and Severn/Shamrock II also had great storylines and histories, but that alone wouldn’t merit them Fight of the Year. Rampage/Griffin was fun, but certainly not the best.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 6, 2009 11:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if you bore the people for 25 minutes, you definitely wont be fight of the year..
Your arguement is flawed.. He gave several reasons aside from the story line and history..
Its like me saying that angelina jolie is hot because she has big boobs, pretty face, has nice lips, nice butt, etc.. Then you say, This fat girl also has big boobs, she’s not hot..
Im not saying forrest vs rampage is number 1 (i voted torres maeda too i think), but your arguement is just flawed
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 6, 2009 11:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you think Jackson vs Griffen was anywhere in the top 5
You probably didn’t watch any of the other fights live. They were all way more action packed. A title fight does not fight of the year make. IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 6, 2009 11:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i wasnt disagreeing with any of your points..
i just said that his argument that compared severn/shamrock and AA/timmy3 to forest rashad is wrong.. its like comparing a fat girl to angelina jolie just because they both got big tits..
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
*forrest rampage i mean..
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If “Big Tits” are the most important criteria, than yes, that would be a valid comparison.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 12:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
What about the poor women who carry extra weight but don’t get the big breasts? Or the fat guys that do? I mean, seriously, there’s some dudes out there that could give Angelina Jolie a run (especially since she got all scary skinny and shit – looks like Tito’s “thing” these days).
Wait, what were we talking about again? Thinking about breasts always derails me.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Feb 7, 2009 11:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except the fight was action packed, it delivered on the hype, it had an excellent story, and it was on the world’s biggest stage. All those things matter. If you want to disregard all the peripherals and only look at fights in a vacuum, that’s your prerogative. That’s not the only criterion for voting, however.
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 1:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
UFC 86 was at Saitama Super Arena? It looked different.
by smoogy on Feb 7, 2009 1:53 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The stage being the UFC which is the clear #1 MMA promotion in the world right now.
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 2:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
UFC is just the promoter. As long as DREAM audiences are still bigger in terms of live and TV audience, Saitama will continue to be the mecca, and the biggest stage in MMA.
It sounds like you’re looking through everything with the UFC lens. Do we really need a ton of hype, a “story”, and a certain label for a fight to be great now? Obviously I’m not talking about looking at fights in a vacuum; I mentioned two WEC title fights, and both of the Alvarez fights were undoubtedly more exciting because they were big fights in the division in the middle of a world championship tournament. But putting one over the other in terms of importance doesn’t really mean much, DREAM and UFC are equally valid as far as this conversation goes. The hype and storylines take a back seat when the bell goes, and I’d say they make a very small percentage of the overall picture. Rampage vs. Forrest was a very good fight; Alvarez vs. Hansen was an extraordinary fight.
by smoogy on Feb 7, 2009 2:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
1) “Stage” does not exclusively refer to the literal setting of the fight.
2) I can’t believe someone would accuse me of all people of “looking through the UFC lens.”
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 10:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Positive representation of anything the UFC does – looking through the UFC lens.
by subo on Feb 7, 2009 12:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I appreciate the sarcasm, but that is generally the view of some of the people on this board. QJ v. FG probably is overrated at 2, but it was definitely in my top 10 for the year.
by The Shark on Feb 7, 2009 3:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't argue top 10
but it doesn’t belong in the top 5. I would put it around 8 or so. I know my top 6 and I’m sure I could think of another fight that was better than Griffen vs Jackson
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 3:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We voted on Best Fight, not Best Fight+Hype+Controversy+Storyline+Reality Show+Title. Evaluating the fight in a vacuum is the most objective, honest way
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 2:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except judging the quality a fight is completely subjective. What you like to see from a fight may be different from other people.
This isn’t like choosing the MVP in baseball where there are clear metrics designed to provide a player’s value to his team.
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 2:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Except judging the quality a fight is completely subjective.
Not entirely true. Consider the following propositions, which most people will agree on: “Swick/Burkman was a bad fight” and “Fedor/Cro Cop was a good fight.” If quality is subjective, these are indefensible propositions, and one could legitimately claim that “Swick/Burkman is better than Fedor/Cro Cop”. Since that’s clearly not the case, how can quality be subjective if people assert objective facts, thus implying an absolute value system?
Liking a fight is independent to its quality (cf "camp"). Starnes/Quarry has achieved a humorous notoriety for how inexplicably bizarre it was even though it was terrible. Same goes for anything needing a value judgment. Andrei Rublev is one of the most laborious movies I’ve seen, yet it was a masterwork of filmmaking (the casting of the bell was awe-inspiring)
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not you’re getting into semantics. If you really want, I’ll re-word my statement. “Judging the quality of a fight is mostly subjective.”
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 10:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why do people just dismiss semantic arguments out-of-hand? Steven Pinker demonstrated several times where semantics are critical (one example costing $3.5M)
Sorry if I’m so intense over this, it’s just how I think. I enjoy these sort of discussions. But I still say I’m right! [throws tantrum]
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I do know that there were other factors listed, but few, if any, had anything to do with the fight in and of itself. The back-and-forth action, and perhaps the decision (though that is obligatory for any fight without a finish, so it does not necessarily add value).
I have no idea what your logic is with the Angelina Jolie comparison. I said hype is irrelevant for determining quality of the fight. AA/Tim 3 was hyped but sucked, and no one would give it FOTY. I argue that the same criteria be applied to QJ/FG (granted, it was a fun fight, unlike AA/Tim3, but the principle applies). Can you map out your argument and analogies better for me?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
you guys have to understand that i wasnt saying that Forrest Rampage should be the top or that the dream fights shouldnt. All i disagreed with is you using AA/tim3 and Shamrock/severn to disprove his point..
If person1 says that i like thing1 because of reasonA, reasonB, and reasonC, you dont counter his argument by saying thing2 and thing3 has reasonA, but it sucked, therefore thing1 sucks too..
its just wrong logic to say that.. You may have the right reasons in saying the dream fights are better, and it may very well be, but all im saying is that the way you constructed your argument there is wrong.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 2:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We agree on the fights, I'm just defending my reasoning
If reason A is assumed to be bad, and thing 2 and thing 3 are bad because of A, and thing 1 has reason A, then thing 1 is bad. Logically speaking, it’s deductively valid, and it’s also deductively sound so long as “Reason A is Bad” is an acceptable premise. If there’s an error, let me know.
Thing 1 has properties A, B, & C
Things 2 & 3 have property A
Property A is bad
Things 2 & 3 are bad for having property A
Therefore, Thing 1 is bad,
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 2:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
how is thing A bad?
youre basing your argument that having hype automatically makes your fight bad.. Im not saying Hype will make the fight better, but having hype surely doesnt make it automatically bad.. That makes your premise wrong.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 3:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I never stipulated that A = hype, else, you’re right, it’s not rigorous logic.
My point is that people praise QJ/FG for the hype, yet other similarly-hyped fights that eventually disappointed are held in contempt. If hype was a positive factor, that would figure into people’s evaluations of those fights (DS/KS2 and AA/Tim3), but it hasn’t. Therefore, I contend that hype is irrelevant when evaluating fights.
Hype was the same. The fights were different. What accounts for the difference in historical standing? The similarities or the differences?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
regarless, A,B,C are reasons why he liked the fight..
so clearly, having A doesnt make anything automatically bad..
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 3:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A can make something automatically bad, depending on what A is. As it stands, it’s a variable, meaning nothing. If A=“Glorification of the rape and subjugation of women”, I think it would be pretty bad. If someone likes a fight for that reason, we’d have a bigger problem than poor logic.
More relevantly, I still stand by my follow-up post.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:29 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
youre really missing the point..
He gave several qualities that he liked about the fight.. You gave an example of another thing with ONE of those qualities (A), that totally sucked.. That doesn’t disprove his statement. Thats all. :)
Again, if i said i like angelina jolie because of A, B, and C.. You cant say angelina jolie isnt hot because i know a girl who has A, but is butt ugly.. Do you get what im saying? Its really not that hard to understand.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 3:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
the way you should counter it is by saying,
okay angelina jolie has A,B,C,
but this other girl, has D,E, (or maybe some of b,c).. she has D and E, therefore it is better, cause D and E tops A..
Or something like that. Just like what smoogy and the others was explaining
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 3:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Correct, I got that, but why do things the easy way?
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It doesn’t wholly disprove it, but demonstrating that one nonessential part of the fight is irrelevant weakens the claim that other nonessential parts of the fights are relevant.
I do finally get the Jolie analogy – adding the conjunction “but” regarding the ugly girl clears it up.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yay. finally haha.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 3:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It’s (relatively) settled – I can finally go to sleep!
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 3:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
hahaha. sorry bout that.. Its 5pm here so im wide awake haha.
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 7, 2009 4:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I logged off at 3am – but it was interesting – Angelina Jolie + logic = nerdgasm
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You’re really downplaying the fight by calling it a “perfectly above average 205lb title match.”
by Mike Fagan on Feb 7, 2009 1:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think so. It was about as good as Rampage vs. Hendo and Griffin vs. Evans were: high-level, grueling fights that illustrated where the division stood at the time, but not spine-tingling-awesome like an MMA fight has to be nowadays to be in the conversation.
by smoogy on Feb 7, 2009 2:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought Rampage vs Hendo
was really just about the same fight. Except Hendo beat Rampage with his fists and didn’t get the decision where as Forrest lost to Rampage in boxing game and got the decision
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 8:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You’re right – Cerrone-McCullough WAS robbed
by subo on Feb 7, 2009 1:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Probably the sixth best FotY
After the 5 mentioned by Smoogy earlier. Cerrone vs McCullough was definitely better than Griffen vs Jackson though. I would rank it higher for action but it was completely one dimensional. Very exciting but just wild and reckless kickboxing. The other fights were brawls on the feet and back and forth on the ground.
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 3:45 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Alvarez/Hansen and Alvarez/Crusher should have been one and two. That fact that only one was in the top three and that Rampage/Forrest was over one of them is a disgrace.
"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on." - Sir Winston Churchill
by FlyByKnight on Feb 7, 2009 12:12 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Alot of people that didn't watch any of the DREAM shows voted obviously
I kinda knew this would happen. Which is why in a post about a week ago I mentioned people will vote for what they’ve seen even if its not the best instead of taking the time to watch the fights. And in watching them later they lack the same drama also. Watching Alvarez vs Hansen live I remember thinking “WOW I’m watching a really special fight right now.” Alvarez and Hansen just trading and everytime Hansen gets drilled he goes down, but then in Hellboy fashion he gets back up and hits himself in the face telling Eddie to bring it on. Then rd 2 Hansen gets Eddie on the ground and nearly subs him 2 or 3 times. Helicopter armbar, traditional armbar… Fight all over the place, never slows down for 15 minutes, even at the very last second they are trading and eddie finishes it off with a headkick to end the match.
Kawajiri vs Alvarez was just a standup war with both guys getting dropped back and forth. That was most certainly the round of the year by a long ways. Then the crushing KO at the end.
Jackson vs Griffen – Big punch in the first… some excitement – round 2 some leg kicks and then some ground game and near submission… Round 3… some kickboxing… Round 4…. Some kickboxing… Round 5 repeat…
really there is NO comparison
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 12:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I watched Hansen/Alvarez on Youtube in my college’s computer lab in the Library; I saw Griffin/Jackson in a sports bar with the crowd equally divided, cheering on their fighter of choice. Despite that, I still enjoyed Hansen/Alvarez more – that was one helluva fight.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 12:53 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Negative rec
To Griffen vs Jackson being 2.
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 12:50 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I thought the WEC had the 3 best fights of the year, between Torres/Maeda, Condit/Miura and Cerrone/Razor it’s nice to see that other people recognize the quality of fights and fighters in that company.
by Raker on Feb 7, 2009 1:18 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Maybe BE needs the category “Most Underrated Fight of the Year” or “Most Underappreciated Fight of the Year.”
But I agree with some of the others here – Forest vs. Rampage definitely isn’t #2.
by MMAEruption on Feb 7, 2009 1:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Alverez/Hansen #1, Alverez/Kawajiri #2, and Tokoro/Uyenoyama #3.
What a coincidence…the most exciting fights were in DREAM…the most exciting organization…
by AnonymousA on Feb 7, 2009 1:47 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
To quote a famous television program
I think this myth has been busted.
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 3:47 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
God that program pisses my internal scientist off. They don’t prove or disprove anything on that show.
by iiowyn on Feb 7, 2009 10:45 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It has its moments. The burning tower of methane was sick. And Kari’s hot.
by subo on Feb 7, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The episode
Where they fire a fuckin minigun with incendiary rounds at the propane tank to make it blow up is badass
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 3:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try Again. Fail again. Fail better. -Samuel Beckett
by themachiavellian on Feb 7, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Awesome.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Feb 7, 2009 3:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
My vote is for Manhoef vs. Hunt. Freakshows FTW!
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Feb 7, 2009 11:21 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I had that as biggest upset
because before the fight I said it was possible that Melvin could be the guy to KO Hunt via combination punching and people thought I was insane. And honestly when it happened I couldn’t really believe it either for a minute.
Gimme 1 Round!
by skwirrl on Feb 7, 2009 3:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I can’t believe people are insisting on concrete number placement for something as subjective as FotY. To each his own, dudes. Your favorite fight might not be one that someone else even wants to watch twice. And give it up with the “this fight was not chosen just because [insert organizational nuthuggers here] don’t like this org!” That’s silly and pretty whiny.
by ilostmydog on Feb 7, 2009 4:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

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