Should Phil Nurse Know Better?
Nurse, a 30-year veteran of martial arts and a well-respected Muay Thai trainer based out of New York, was tasked with two things: apply Vaseline to the brow, cheekbones, bridge of the nose and temples of the champion's chiseled face, and utilize a pressure-point holistic technique that apparently delivers an energy boost.
What the world saw was Nurse, the back of his left hand acting as a palate for a finger of Vaseline, massage grease into the champion's face, shoulders and back. NSAC inspectors, reacting to people at ringside who took the application as an attempt to give St. Pierre an unfair advantage, scolded Nurse between the first and second, and the second and third rounds.
"I was in the Octagon and they came in screaming: 'On his face! On his face!' I really didn't know what they were saying," Nurse said of NSAC inspectors. "I see it now. In the heat of the moment, I've got a minute to get in there, keep him calm, do my energy work on him, elevate his legs and then he listens to Greg. What they were screaming at me about, I didn't know. Had they said 'You're putting Vaseline on his back' it would have put two and two together."
The idea that Nurse should know better is absolutely true. His experience in fight sport plus common understanding of the Unified Rules of MMA should be more than enough to prevent something like this from happening. But even acknowledging that, whether or not Nurse should've known better doesn't answer the question of whether he actually did in this case. Ignorance of the rules or an innocuous act of not adhering to them doesn't absolve guilt, nor does it address whether whatever was applied to St. Pierre (and the amount is not really known) truly made a difference in the fight outcome.
I also find Nurse's argument that attempting to cheat out in the open seems awfully foolish. So while I find Nurse to be culpable, the truth that fans of either fighter must accept is that determing what Nurse's actions actually did to the outcome of the fight are virtually impossible to quantify. Punitive action by the athletic commission is necessary, but determing guilt based on the amount of problems Nurse's actions may have caused is going to prove exceptionally difficult.
0 recs |
45 comments
|
Comments
After 30 years of doing this
he needed them to actually verbalize to not put vaseline anywhere on the fighter except for his face? Ridiculous & completely unbelievable response.
by dnevil001 on Feb 2, 2009 12:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I’m sure he was confused as to how “on the face” had anything to do with his “energy work”.
Did you know we are in high demand, Laura?
by Eugene Schelfaut on Feb 2, 2009 12:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And I agree with that, in the middle of the biggest fight in UFC history when your guy is winning the fight…“on the face” dosen’t make much sense.
by kyfm621 on Feb 2, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
30 years of muay thai, he hasn’t cornered MMA fighters that long. I’d like to know how long he has been in an MMA fighters corner though. And putting vaseline on a boxer/kickboxer’s back and chest would be no problem. But I don’t think this is the case, it’s either he was trying to give GSP the edge, or he messed up for other reasons.
by kyfm621 on Feb 2, 2009 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am realy confused
and really skeptical about all of this. I do hope this was done completely unintentional and without anyones knowledge, but it just smells really bad.
by dnevil001 on Feb 2, 2009 12:57 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I don’t care if he knew or didn’t know what he was doing. Sorry officer I didn’t see any speed limit signs so I thought doing 90 would be fine, it just doesn’t work. And the fact that he didn’t get it when the inspectors were yelling at him is fine, but its not an excuse. He had already broke the rules.
Also, I don’t buy this witch doctor crap, but at least it is better then Melvin Guillard’s excuse, “I didn’t know I couldn’t do that”. And to say GSP should get no blame is a little rediculous. Its not like he just met these guys. They are under his employ and they are going on his instructions.
by szucconi on Feb 2, 2009 1:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
By your argument, an employer is responsibile for any misdeed or mistake an employee makes, which makes no sense.
I highly doubt GSP said, “When you’re doing the witch stuff, make sure you keep vasaline on your hands and rub it all over my back so I can beat BJ.”
by pud333 on Feb 2, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not at all,
but you cannot remove guilt automatically because the employer did not personally do it either.
by dnevil001 on Feb 2, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Of course not. Unfortunately, there is no way to know GSP’s intent or instructions unless GSP himself comes out and says it. He’s already spoken on it, and I doubt he’ll ever say he cheated. I am afraid this is just going to be one of those topics that fans argue over for years to come. For better or worse, a great showdown was marred by this. Sigh.
by pud333 on Feb 2, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It is diffrent when an accountant is cooking the books in the back and some guy is rubbing lube on your back. To say he takes all the heat is not the right way to go, but GSP is the one that wants the rub downs between rounds. Does that mean he gave the order to put stuff on his back, no. but its possible and we will never know. It taints a great win for him. He should be pissed, but his camp is saying they are sorry. That is fishy in it self. Also it adds more weight to any past greasing alligations.
by szucconi on Feb 2, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It taints a great win for him.
This we can agree on. A shame, really.
by pud333 on Feb 2, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
For sure. A true shame. I wonder if this witch doctor talk will bring back the subject of mental weakness.
by szucconi on Feb 2, 2009 1:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKuJSQJOiwM
25 seconds in.
Much ado about nothing at all. Just more BJ fans belly aching.
by mythbuster on Feb 2, 2009 1:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I believe the guy. I don’t think there was any vaseline left on his hands to make a difference. When I heard about this story I thought there was a guy putting monster gobs of vaseline on Georges back. Instead I see a guy put vaseline on Georges face with his left hand and then proceed to rub his shoulders and back with both hands. I don’t think that there was much vaseline at all and I think the saddest thing about this story is that this guy might lose his corner license over such a small error.
by Yasnian on Feb 2, 2009 1:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
just a little vaseline can go a long way...
We were 14 once, and we know how slippery just a little vaseline can get!
by adamdd on Feb 2, 2009 2:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Neither do the tears of BJ fans.
hahahaha
by mythbuster on Feb 2, 2009 2:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm so tired of this issue already.
"I'm AJB and I endorse this nut-puncher."
by AJB on Feb 2, 2009 1:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
100% agreed
It would be different if he were slathering Georges up with it, but the amount used is just a non issue to me. If he secretly had a whole palm full of it when he was rubbing Georges back and got caught that would be different, but just on the finger tips…. please.
I have fought in the cage and I do help train and corner fighters. I would have to say that I may have done the same type of thing at one point or another. I have never knowingly put vaseline in improper places on any fighters I have cornered, but I can’t say for certain that I haven’t done it inadvertantly when rushing in my cornering duties.
by gremlin1496 on Feb 2, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I just want to point out...
that my chiropractor does the same thing to me that Phil Nurse (via Steven Friend) was doing. Back when I was playing football in high school I was suffering a lot of pinched nerves..etc. So I was a regular in the office of my chiropractor who would do a little neck work and then sit me up and do the temple rub, chest tap, and rubbing a point on my back combo. Now obviously that isn’t to say that Nurse couldn’t have been doing this as an excuse to smear some Vaseline on GSP’s back. I’m just saying that it isn’t a technique that is completely unheard of for a guy like Friend to use.
Were I trying to pull a Vaseline scam I’d probably have it on my hands before the round ends and as Georges is walking to the stool I’d have my hand on his back “guiding” him while getting him to sit down. Then going about the normal routine with the face. But maybe I’m just a cheating mastermind.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 2, 2009 1:53 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
You may be a cheating mastermind
but GSP seems to have gotten away with this for a long time.
by dualdiagnosis on Feb 2, 2009 2:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again...
The gifs are misleading.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKuJSQJOiwM
go to 25 seconds in. BJ lost, that’s the end of the story.
by mythbuster on Feb 2, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Mayhem Miller is now saying that Georges did the same thing when he fought him
http://www.fightlinker.com/jason-miller-claims-gsp-greased-against-him-too.mma
What is it going to take for the St Pierre worshipers to say that cheating is wrong?
by dualdiagnosis on Feb 2, 2009 2:35 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Mayhem, Serra, and Sherk Acuse GSP Of Greasing As Well?
http://www.fightlinker.com/jason-miller-claims-gsp-greased-against-him-too.mma
Sean Sherk has also made a few comments in the past about Georges St Pierre greasing during their fight, and BJ Penn’s camp says Matt Serra also complained. I suppose now we need to wait and see what some of Georges’ other opponents do. Personally, I’m interested to hear what Matt Hughes, Jon Fitch and Josh Koscheck have to say.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Feb 2, 2009 2:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Was there a witch doctor involved with Miller?
by dualdiagnosis on Feb 2, 2009 2:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Mayhem:
Greasy bastard, I thought. Of course I yelled to the ref, "Hey! He is greased up!" but much like anyone else watching me get pounded, he didn’t give a damn, and replied with "He’s ok!" Followed by another smash to the face. Yeah, ok for HIM, but I’m taking a beating over here and can’t hold onto the bastard.
LOL
by MMASuPreMaCy on Feb 2, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Stunned silence from the GSP nuthuggers
by dualdiagnosis on Feb 2, 2009 2:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
More disgust with BJ Penns fans and their ever more ridiculous claims. You guys truly are pathetic.
by mythbuster on Feb 2, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I am a GSP fan, but putting links to things that relate to this story.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Feb 2, 2009 3:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You also only post negative things when the UFC is involved, and you paper the comments with quotes and links.
by iiowyn on Feb 2, 2009 3:08 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not true. I am a HUGE MMA fan.
I like all orgs.
by MMASuPreMaCy on Feb 2, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You’re being warned for this comment.
by Luke Thomas on Feb 3, 2009 9:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You’re being warned for this comment.
by Luke Thomas on Feb 3, 2009 9:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That’s great.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Feb 2, 2009 2:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not going crazy..
defending GSP. But I do think it’s a LITTLE funny that guys always pour out of the woodwork after these kind of things happen and suddenly it’s a “uh…me too!” situation. Supposedly people at cageside were picking up on things during this fight and freaking out…but not any of the other fights. Time will tell I suppose.
But Sherk bitching about someone “cheating” is a laugh and a half…
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 2, 2009 4:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
maybe it's just me...
…but this is pretty much a non-issue; I never had a moment’s doubt that GSP would take BJP — in fact, I’m a little surprised it took so long. And I’m not a big GSP fan, I just recognize the skills.
IF he’s guilty of greasing up, then it’s anothe Watergate — the clear and apparent winner cheating to solidify it. If not, it’s a clear Florida chad — loser going for “justice” on a baseless technicality. Since ‘it’ was ‘caught’ between 2 & 3, and the fight went to 4, well, I’d say it’s a NOT!
by bigpedaler on Feb 2, 2009 10:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

by 
























