Quote of the Day: "Ray Mercer Presents a Unique Threat to Tim Sylvia"
by Kid Nate on Feb 13, 2009 9:13 AM EST
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Despite Mercer’s MMA inexperience, he still poses a unique threat to Sylvia. While the heavy-handed Slice felt it was prudent to take Mercer off his feet, Sylvia is not known for taking fights to the ground and instead may attempt to trade punches with a professional boxer that was good enough to win a Gold medal at the 1988 Olympic Games in Seoul, South Korea.
Sam Caplan of Five Ounces of Pain commenting on an exclusive fed to him by Monte Cox, the man who is trying to book the fight.
Ray Mercer doesn't pose a unique threat to any healthy professional MMA fighter. Mercer's well past his prime as an athlete and has never trained MMA or even kickboxing.
This is pathetic on so many levels. Poor Tim Sylvia, Monte Cox has really painted him into a corner. First he convinced Tim to ask to be released from the UFC where he had had two title runs. Then he was going to headline Adrenaline shows that didn't happen. Then he got paid $800,000 to get demolished by Fedor....
Well, Monte hasn't been all bad to Tim, but let's face facts, when you make $800,000 to get destroyed in 0:36, you've basically taken a big one time cash payment in lieu of a future in MMA.
With his anti-charismatic persona and his long string of cautious, tentative and tedious performances as UFC champ, has to be the formidable athlete with the least brand equity of anyone in MMA.
The guy is still a threat to (almost) anyone in the division but is hated by fans and commands outrageous paydays.
But Ray Mercer? Mercer was last seen being crushed by Kimbo Slice -- a man who is the living symbol of promotional puffery. This is pure desperation on Cox's part.
I guess this is the fight you book your fighter when you try and fail to book Ken Shamrock but let's not pretend it has any relevance as a matchup unless you're as eager for exclusives as Tim Sylvia is for a fight.
UPDATE: BE regular szucconi points us to this must read article from the time of the announcement of Sylvia's decision to leave the UFC for Adrenaline:
"I'll be real active, fighting six or seven times a year," Sylvia said. "Adrenaline is a new company that's just starting up, but they're allowing fighters to fight outside of their organization. That's huge... Take for instance my last fight. Granted, I loss, but I came out of there unhurt and unscathed. I could have fought a week or two later.
"Being 32 years old, I have four or five good years ahead of me. I plan to make the most of it."
I wonder if Tim is beginning to realize that mistakes were made.
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Now, I don’t want to disparage Caplan for the sake of it (5oz was one of the first MMA blogs I got in to), but there’s reasons I don’t read it anymore. Silly opinions such as those are one of them. I just found myself disagreeing with him more and more and just stopped reading the site altogether.
Same
1) The site got much more complicated when it went away from blog format.
2) I realized that he doesn’t know what he’s talking about.
3) He deleted my posts when I questioned him with something he had no answer for.
He breaks news sometimes though, but I will hear about it when another site links to it. 5 oz is not worth the visit.
Totally agree
I stopped reading as soon as I got to the 800K to fight Fedor part.
It would have taken Sylvia 5-8 fights in the UFC to make that kind of money.
He hasn’t burned any bridges as far as I can see. At least not Publicly. If Sylvia wanted to go back to
the UFC. I am sure Dana would welcome him back.
In general it hate when writers give their “if guy A isn’t in the UFC. Then they are irrelevant” spiels.
Guys have to make a living. And lots of guys Barnett,Fedor,Sylvia,Babalu,Arlovsky,Lindland have done OK for themselves outside the UFC umbrella.
Report the news, not your personal agenda.
" Tell me something Steve, How does a guy from Puerto Rico loose a ball in the Sun? "
Me too. And the dude’s affiliation with WAMMA is problematic for me.
"I see him beating Anderson Silva. I see him picking him apart. Him at a 131 years old...(trails off)." - Tito on Belfort at Affliction:DOR
by Rundownloser on Feb 13, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
Wow Sam...
that is some mighty fine bullshit you’re shoveling today!
Facts:
A) Tim Sylvia is a former champion of the biggest company in the world and is (presumably) somewhere in or very near to his athletic prime. Someone who can say both of those things should not be fighting an OLD (47) boxer who is making his professional MMA debut.
B) This may be the stupidest line of thinking I’ve ever read:
While the heavy-handed Slice felt it was prudent to take Mercer off his feet, Sylvia is not known for taking fights to the ground and instead may attempt to trade punches with a professional boxer that was good enough to win a Gold medal at the 1988 Olympic Games in Seoul, South Korea.
Because yeah…Sylvia isn’t known for taking the fight to the ground…but Slice is?
C) Ray Mercer is a nice guy…but he’s also already getting to the point of being slightly punch drunk. I really don’t want to see the guy take any more fights of any kind. I love that Sylvia is jumping from trying to get Ken Shamrock to going for Ray Mercer.
Thanks for trying Sam. But you and Cox can take that shit you’re selling next door, because I don’t want any here.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 13, 2009 9:13 AM EST reply actions
that’s Luke’s boy, sup with him?
by The Bronzeville Bully on Feb 13, 2009 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
II just wanted point out WAMMA
That WAMMA always states that there are fighters that support WAMMA and want to test themselves against the best. Someone should ask Pat Militich, anytime he talks about that, how come this does not apply to anyone in his camp?
by The Bronzeville Bully on Feb 13, 2009 9:50 AM EST up reply actions
It's a legitimate question...
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 13, 2009 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
(i wanted to add more insults but i dont want to be banned haha.)
http://weoweoweo.deviantart.com/
by Anton Tabuena on Feb 13, 2009 9:15 AM EST up reply actions
For anyone who’s unfamiliar with Mercer, the short skinny is that he’s a 47-year old boxer whose last big win came over a fading Tim Witherspoon on December 14. … 1996.
In his day (which was a long damned time ago) he was a serious puncher and won the WBO heavyweight title in 1991 against Franceso Damiani when he knocked Damiani out in the 9th round. Mercer was losing on all three cards. His big career highlight came when he beat the crap out of Tommy Morrison in October ’91, another fight he was losing on all three cards, but only four rounds had been completed anyway.
Mercer would go on to fight and lose to Larry Holmes, Evander Holyfield, Lennox Lewis, Wladimir Klitschko and Shannon Briggs. And Derric Rossy and Jesse Ferguson, to be complete.
Ray’s a really nice dude, as Brent said, but he’s one of those guys that seriously appears to have no other practical means of making money besides fighting, which is why he fought Kimbo, why he tried to call out David Haye last year, and why he’ll fight Sylvia. I mean this in the nicest way possible: Mercer’s a prostitute, but he’s a call girl, not a street walker.
"I was trying to rob him. And he took my gun from me. And the gun was full of blanks. And he shot a blank into my eye. And now I cannot see from this eye ever again, the doctors say."
"Well to be honest it sounds like it's all your fault."
So yeah...
it has been a little over 12 years since he has even had a legitimate “big” win in boxing.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 13, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Has Mr. Caplan sold out or checked out or something? It seems more and more likely that he is trading on his good name alone. I think we have found our MMA blog paid shill of the week. I thought I could let WAMMA slide because he only heads up ranking, but really? They guy Slice submited poses a danger to Tim? This argument might be made before the Slice myth got popped, but really? Mercer didn’t even put up a fight and collected his nice paycheck.
I can't believe i'm doing this
But I doubt Craplan is getting paid, I think he’s just whoring 5oz so Monte Cox will keep feeding him exclusives.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
Well, in “journalism” and a site run by Caplan, he stands to profit directly from exclusive via hits and ads so it could be considered a form of compensation. I guess it is commen, but not often as hard to swallow.
You have to placate your sources somewhat to keep the stories coming, but there has to be a line somewhere.
Caplan is still putting his name on this so he loses some credibility because it’s so ridiculous. Especially because that site has lots of opinion pieces. Why would I bother reading one of his opinion pieces when something that’s supposed to be a news or feature story has such ridiculous statements?
my apologies for referring to Sam as Craplan here
won’t happen again.
I’m not deleting because the comments below have merit.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
by Kid Nate on Feb 13, 2009 10:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
money
He’d probably fight Bo Jackson if Bo wanted to go. Bo knows MMA.
"I was trying to rob him. And he took my gun from me. And the gun was full of blanks. And he shot a blank into my eye. And now I cannot see from this eye ever again, the doctors say."
"Well to be honest it sounds like it's all your fault."
by Scott Christ on Feb 13, 2009 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
I believe that,
but Sylvia is still young & it seems crazy that he would accept a fight this ridiculous while he is still trying to be considered a top contender.
I think..
he needs to be out there ringing the bell calling out anyone legitimate or even just that has a track record of some level of success in our sport and isn’t old as dirt. Shit…go after a Dave Herman. The thing that has made Sylvia seem like such a dork lately is that he is constantly attacking Arlovski in interviews for everything he can…but at the same time is seeking out fights with Shamrock and Mercer.
If Tim were serious about ever becoming a legitimate top shelf fighter again he’d laugh when this fight were put in front of him and tell them to GTFO.
Contributing Editor - BloodyElbow.com - SBNation's mixed martial arts headquarters.
by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 13, 2009 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
Right,
I mean you would expect any self respecting professional who truly considered themselves an “elite” fighter would not even take the notion of this fight seriously. But then again, maybe Timmeh has been pee pee tasting too much & his decision making ability has been compromised.
I wonder how much influence Cox has when looking at these types of fights. He must be thinking of that big money cut he gets for agent fees. I don’t what his track record is like lately but any real agent would tell their guy to run from this type of proposal.
His manager is the promoter in this case
Monte “No Written Contracts” Cox is also Adrenaline MMA.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
"Mercer doesn't pose a threat to anybody" is right.
Remember the Bonjasky fight? And how many years ago was that.
Although detractors decry (MMA) as a brutal, bloody form of human cockfighting, aficionados know it is a brutal, bloody, totally fucking awesome form of human cockfighting. -The Onion
by The Kittitas Kid on Feb 13, 2009 9:43 AM EST reply actions
Pathetic and Sad...
That’s what it would have been if Timmeh had taken a fight against Shamrock. This is a whole new level of scumminess we are entering here. Is Gary Shaw involved in this somehow? If not, it sure smells like his cup of tea.
by MyFistYourFace on Feb 13, 2009 10:07 AM EST reply actions
Hmm..
I have never been crazy about Tim Sylvia , but I always considered him one of the top heavyweights… But now…I mean WTF is he doing challenging Ken Shamrock and Ray Mercer to fights??? This isn’t boxing ,MMA fans don’t respect fighters who challenge tomato cans… = p
so did Timmy win in the end with his affliction deal?
he got 800,000… obviously a huge pay day. probably some sponsors I would presume… but his main sponsor would have been affliction. but it has ruined his career it seems. He hasn’t made a dime sense
in the ufc… how much did he make per fight? then you add on sponsorships… and his career wouldn’t be dead like it was now.
it was obviously worth the risk to take the 800K… but did it/will it pan out in the end?
More "Cluster F MMA"...
This fight sucks & is a mess… but dear God… just for a moment think how this will not only reflect on Tim but on MMA as a whole (especially the UFC) if somehow Mercer digs deep & catches Tim on the jaw & the big man goes down for the count? :P
No good can come of this fight.
Sigh…
Keep Swillin',
Bruz
when you make $800,000 to get destroyed in 0:36, you’ve basically taken a big one time cash payment in lieu of a future in MMA.
I hope Tim has been saving his money wisely.
Everyone in this thread should re-read this old article on MMAJunkie. Oh, how the large dude has fallen. He wanted to fight 7 or 8 times a year and has fought once in over a year.
great stuff!
thanks szucconi
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
dammit!
cut AND paste
luke keeps telling me!
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
That guy that won the gold medal in 88..
Wasn’t that the Korean guy that got destroyed by Roy Jones Jr. and yet got the decision win?
this fight is a joke as is...
but caplan doesnt have to make it worse by reaching for a justification that simply doesn’t exist. i generally like to think that sam is better than that, but i dont think he has any excuse for this. i agree with nate, ray mercer poses a threat to absolutely no one.
“Well, Monte hasn’t been all bad to Tim, but let’s face facts, when you make $800,000 to get destroyed in 0:36, you’ve basically taken a big one time cash payment in lieu of a future in MMA.”
Yeah, what kind of idiot takes a true world title fight for huge money?
Explain to me how he doesn’t have a future in MMA.
You're my toughest critic smoog
He’s too expensive.
He’s too unpopular.
He’s too badly managed.
I’m not saying that taking the chance on fighting Fedor wasn’t a gamble worth taking. The money was excellent and had he won, he’d have been better off than ever. But since he lost, badly, he’s in pretty sad shape.
His draw was never good to begin with but his last tenure as UFC champ really permanently damaged his brand - the Sylvia-Arlovski 3, Sylvia-Monson era (and the frequent replays of Sylvia Assuerio Silva — aka the dookie drawers fight) — no body likes watching those fights.
Now he’s stuck with this jacked up deal with Monte Cox, a ridiculously high asking price, a terrible reputation with the fans (as a fighter, not a human being), and no future.
Is any promotion clamouring to sign Sylvia?
No that’s why Monte is trying to set up this ridiculous roadshow.
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
ignore the random strike throughs
not sure what i did to trigger that
"the spirit of your average dumbass with more overblown rhetoric" OR "the self-appointed savior of MMA"
Hyphens.
Bolts from the Blue // "Game over." - Jamal Williams
Bloody Elbow // "Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." - H.L. Mencken
by Richard Wade on Feb 13, 2009 11:01 PM EST up reply actions
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