Welterweight Division Facing Stagnation
The UFC has a problem on it's hands. Division stagnation.
Everyone knows that this problem has occurred in the middleweight division with a dearth of challengers to fight Anderson Silva. The UFC was much ridiculed for putting an overmatched Patrick Cote in a title fight with Anderson Silva. They're facing the same problem with the upcoming Thales Leites fight.
Due to poor matchmaking in recent events, after Thiago Alves, the welterweight division will be facing a similar lack of challengers for GSP's welterweight title (I'm assuming that GSP beats Alves. No easy feat but after tonight's performance...).
The BE meta-rankings for WW are:
1. Georges St. Pierre
2. Thiago Alves
3. Jon Fitch
4. Josh Koscheck
5. Jake Shields
6. Diego Sanchez
7. Matt Hughes
8. Carlos Condit
9. Matt Serra
10. Karo Parisyan
11. Mike Swick
12. Nick Thompson
13. Marcus Davis
14. Dustin Hazelett
15. Brock Larson
16. Jay Hieron
17. Chris Wilson
18. Dan Hardy
19. Chris Lytle
20. Nick Diaz
21. Hayato Sakurai
22. Yoshiyuki Yoshida
23. Brad Blackburn
24. Anthony Johnson
25. Akihiro Gono
#3 Jon Fitch and #4 Josh Koscheck have already been beaten by GSP. A title shot for either of them wouldn’t be terrible but it also wouldn’t really excite the fans.
#5Jake Shields, #6Diego Sanchez #7Matt Hughes and #9 Matt Serra will also never challenge for the UFC WW title again (unless Jake Shields somehow sorts himself out of the EXC quagmire).
#10 Karo Parisyan is seems to be highly overrated following his fight today against unranked Dong Hyun Kim and doesn’t deserve his top ten ranking.
Therefore the only potential challengers to the crown at this point are #8 Carlos Condit and #22 Mike Swick. There’s also potential for unranked Martin Kampmann if he beats Carlos Condit. The only other person I feel is worth mentioning is #14 Dustin Hazelett who has shown great potential in his past few fights. Others might also mention that unranked Ben Saunders has looked impressive in his past few fights.
There are a few big problems:
1. This is the main problem. Jon Fitch and Josh Koscheck are too good. Basically both these guys have no chance of beating GSP but they would beat everyone else ranked below them.
2. The AKA fighters probably won’t fight each other. AKA possesses three world class welterweights and they can all beat most of the welterweights out there. And none of them can beat GSP.
3. Matt Serra and Matt Hughes are now largely irrelevant. After they fight each other they should both retire. With Matt Serra – I don’t see him beating any of the consensus top ten but Hughes is probably still good enough to beat second-tier fighters like Hazelett and Yoshida etc.
Therefore the matchmaking needs to go something like this:
1. Carlos Condit v Martin Kampman (already signed) – If Condit wins he should probably get an immediate title shot. It’s a sellable fight since Condit is the WEC Champion. The loser should fight Jon Fitch or Josh Koscheck. If Kampman wins he should fight the loser of Mike Swick – Karo Parisyan.
2. Mike Swick v Karo Parisyan – A fight I see Swick winning rather easily. I think ‘Quick’ is underrated at #11 and would beat Parisyan and Serra relatively easily. If Swick wins he should get a title shot because he would have won 4 in a row and the most recent against a top 10 guy.
3. Dustin Hazelett v Marcus Davis – Marcus Davis is a name fighter and also one I think that Hazelett can beat if he gets the fight to the ground. If he can beat Davis then he should move to contender status and fight the winner of Hughes-Serra. I don’t think he’d be able to beat Matt Hughes though.
4. Ben Saunders should not be fighting a UFC newcomer. The Hazelett match up was a good matchmaking. Now that it’s off Saunders should have been put in with another name fighter like Chris Lytle. A win there would put him one big win away from a title shot.
Overall – I think the welterweight division is headed towards stagnation. After GSP defeats Thiago Alves there will be a clear lack of legitimate challengers to the thrown, largely because nobody can break through the steel gates that are Koscheck and Fitch.
And we’ll be rewarded with an end of year Superfight. GSP vs Anderson Silva…
I can’t wait.
The FanPosts are solely the subjective opinions of Bloody Elbow readers and do not necessarily reflect the views of Bloody Elbow editors or staff.
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Don't think the superfight will happen that soon...
because Silva needs to fight the winner of Bisping/Hendo IMO more than GSP.
Yeh
Hopefully it will be the end of the year though. When does TUF air?
i could be wrong on this...
but I THINK July
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by Brent Brookhouse on Feb 1, 2009 3:31 AM EST up reply actions
Karo would toss Swick on his head and then gnp him into oblivion sorry but beating up Goulet and Davis doesn’t mean he would stand a chance against Parisyan. The idea that Karo isn’t a top ten WW is also incredibly stupid and shows nothing but ignorance cosidering the fact that Karo beat Serra and Diego is now a LW.
I'll probably have to admit that Karo is a top ten WW just because there's no one to fill the spots
But that doesn’t deny the fact that he has looked crap in recent fights. Based off his current record – is he top ten? Yes. Do I think he’ll remain top ten for a lot longer. No. I don’t think he’ll be top ten by mid 2010.
And Mike Swick will beat Karo relatively easily.
Karo isn't the same fighter
As when he fought Diego Sanchez or Nick Diaz. That Karo went hard for 3 rounds. Today’s Karo…looked awful.
i think if serra wins against hughes, they should match him up against mclovin.. It would be a big name and a chance for hazelett to rise up the rankings..
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by Anton Tabuena on Feb 1, 2009 3:58 AM EST up reply actions
Agreed
Hazelett should fight either Serra or Hughes after they fight. Preferably Serra because the chances of him winning are higher. Sorry – McLovin will get pounded on by Matt Hughes like the linebacker beats on the computer geek…
This obviously shows
That I think Hughes will beat Serra as well…
regardless of hghes/serra
i think hughes will retire. he knows hes never going to be a champ again and he’s even said himself hes only got a few fights left, and that was a couple fights ago.
im not impressed with your performance
I disagree on Koscheck. I think he is particularly popular right now.
Next is clearly Alves.
Condit and Koscheck are each two legitimate wins away from a shot. Condit is being handed his first fight and will be given a name fighter for his second and then they will promote the WEC v UFC fight. Koscheck will come in after that and then hopefully Shields.
By then it will be fall or winter 2010 and the division will be completely restructured and we can worry about that when it comes.
Koscheck is popular
I like him. But he’s not even got a punchers chance of beating GSP. Did you watch the GSP-Koscheck fight? I don’t particularly want to see a five round repeat of that…
It's been stagnant
I made comment 2 months ago that if Dana is complaining that the talent list is too short for a Women’s MMA division than what is going to do at WW. Also, where are the strikers? Marcus Davis?
weird huh
205 is almost entirely strikers. WW is mostly wrestlers.
Oddity…
Are you serious WW is the most stacked division in all of MMA, anyone can beat anyone in the top 10 it also has the most well rounded fighters in any division.
Uh - no
No one can beat GSP. No one aside from GSP can beat Jon Fitch or Josh Koscheck (and they won’t fight each other).
So after Alves who is a legit threat to the crown?
Agree
The only superfight I see out there for GSP is Anderson Silva at middle weight. But I have to wonder if the GSP v. BJ Penn fight results have soured the ufc on these type of match ups. That fight really didn’t do much for other guy. Ok, GSP hammered a light weight as expected. Penn now looks like shit. GSP v. Silva could produce similar results.
Anyone see how much bigger Alves looked when he was in the cage with GSP last night?
I think with alves’ power and size, he could be a big problem for GSP.
An easy way to solve this would be for GSP to move up to middle, BJ move up to Welter, put the title up for grabs in a 8 man tourney. That way we could conceivably see Fitch fight Kos which would be intriguing, we’d also see how BJ would do against these guys, and move Anderson up to LightHeavy for a couple of fights, hanging on for a potential superfight with GSP despite what happens in their divisions. I see GSP doing very well at middleweight, though slightly smaller, he has some really great large training partners.
That is a terrible idea
Please tell me you are all casual fans? Alves is the clear #1 challenger and assuming Gsp will completely dominate him is idiocy. I think it’s funny that everyone thought BJ had a serious chance at beating Gsp because of his hand speed and punching power but Alves has no shot even though he is a superior striker than BJ and has way more power. He also uses kicks unlike Gsp. Gsp will be the smaller fighter for the first time in his career against Alves and we will see how good of a p4p fighter he is when he doesn’t have a tremendous strength advantage.
Well, technically, people expected BJ had a serious chance at beating GSP. GSP promptly beat him down like a bitch. This caused people to reassess GSP’s skills, and therefore his chances against competitors.
Oh, and he’ll beat Alves like a bitch as well. Alves is great, but Hughes got him down, and Koscheck probably would have if he’d had more than a week’s notice.
by Michaelthebox on Feb 1, 2009 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
Gsp should not move up
There are plenty of challengers in the welterweight division. Whether it’s Rumble Johnson, Martin Kampmann, Carlos Condit, Dustin Hazelett or even Ben Saunders there are a ton of up and coming fighters to go along with the established veterans. How does moving Gsp up to a much weaker division help to get him better fights?
My thought process regarding GSP is simple: If he stays at 170, so what? Let him beat all comers. He’s been beaten before by a lesser man. He can be beaten again. If he ends up making 13-14 defenses, great. Nothing wrong with that.
A lot of the fantasy booking in this thread is hilarious. Dana would need to throw a lot of money at Hughes to make a fight with Hazelett happen given that honestly, no one cares about that fight. Hughes/Penn III is infinitely more likely than that ever taking place. I’m sorry, but Ben Saunders beating some nobodies doesn’t mean much to me. Feeding him to Hazelett in a “sink or swim” situation is fine with me, because if he can’t beat Hazelett, there’s no real reason to spend years and tens of thousands of dollars to promote the kid. Condit isn’t going to sell to anyone because absolutely no one cares about the WEC. Seriously, Jay Hieron has about as much cache with the fans.

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